Hello and welcome to Mr. Stillman's Opus. This week, I wanted to have a special guest or let you hear from a special guest who I had on the radio show. This was on, of course, our show, the Financial Symphony that airs on a couple of stations here in the Triangle. But I wanted to let you hear from Theresa Mize.
Theresa is the Director of Marketing at the Cedars of Chapel Hill. We get a lot of questions from people about moving into retirement communities. What kind of financial standing do you need to have? What's involved?
What kind of waiting lists are there? What's the lifestyle like there? So I thought it would be helpful for everybody if we just talk to Theresa about what life is like at the Cedars and what sort of financial ducks you need to have in a row to live in a place like that. So enjoy the conversation. Again, this is from our radio show, the Financial Symphony. As we promised earlier in the show, we'd be joined by a special guest and we are now joined by Theresa Mize, Director of Marketing at the Cedars of Chapel Hill. Theresa, good to see you. Thanks for stopping by. Thank you, John. Thanks for having me here today.
Good to see you. And I wanted to talk about specifically the Cedars of Chapel Hill, which if people don't know, is a retirement community. But more broadly, I wanted to talk about just retirement communities in general, too, because I get a tremendous number of questions from my clients wanting to know, all right, well, if we're wanting to move into a community like this, what are some of the things we need to be thinking about? What are some of the financial things we need to have in place?
What kind of waiting list can we expect? So we'll talk about some of the financial aspects, the mechanics later on in the show. But first, I just wanted to talk about lifestyle. So in general, I think a lot of people see moving to a retirement community. In some people's eyes, it's almost like there's a stigma of we're giving up. We're giving up on our independence if we move into a retirement community like the Cedars, which in no way is that the case. But maybe you can kind of describe why would somebody want to live in a community like that instead of just living in their own home? That's a great question, John. And one of the things that we find is that people who move into retirement communities, such as the Cedars, often have been looking or thinking about this decision for a period of anywhere from six months to six years.
So it's a process. Rarely do people just wake up in the morning and say, I think today's the day I'm going to move into a retirement community. I think as we all age, what becomes more and more important to us are things like physical security, financial security, putting a health care plan in place for the what ifs or I like to call it the things that go bump in the middle of the night. So the people that move to retirement communities are generally experiencing some things in their life that may make them feel perhaps a little insecure. Maybe their neighborhood is changing. Maybe they've become widowed.
Maybe the kids have moved away. Maybe the burdens of home maintenance have just become too much of a headache. And often when people come to visit us, they're just beginning to explore and they're very tentative because they're afraid they're going to be giving up their independence if they move from their home. But actually, what we like to point out is that the opposite is true. You're actually gaining independence because you're no longer dependent upon waiting for repairmen to take care of things around the house.
And sometimes contractors or subcontractors are notoriously unreliable about meeting appointments at specific times. These things can make people feel a little bit anxious and a little bit insecure and actually trapped by their own home. So a lot of that inconvenience is taken away when you're in a community like this. What about just the lifestyle in general? What do meals look like?
What do the physical activities look like, specifically at the Cedars of Chapel Hill? What does life look like? That's a really great question, too. You know, I would say the number one reason people move into retirement communities is for security. But once they get there, what they find that was really lacking in their lives was the aspect of socialization and community. Often people are living by themselves and they're a little bit more isolated. Perhaps they've given up driving at night.
They no longer go to the symphony or Playmakers or DPAC because they don't like to drive at night. Maybe some of their social ties have started to erode a little bit because friends have moved away or friends have moved to retirement communities. So folks come to a community like the Cedars and they have someone all of a sudden to have interesting conversation over coffee in the bistro with or someone to have lunch or dinner with. In fact, at the Cedars, we have something called an impromptu table. So if you don't have a dining companion, you can always sit at the impromptu table and get to know different types of folks. And it's correct me if I'm wrong. I would say for the most part, people at the Cedars are not originally from here.
Would that be accurate? So you're meeting a lot of people from a lot of different places. Forty percent of our membership come from out of state.
Sixty percent are locals. A lot of people have ties to Chapel Hill. They either went to UNC or their children live in Chapel Hill or the Triangle area and they want to retire to where we have a temperate climate to where we have access to great health care.
Certainly UNC and Duke provide a lot of educational and cultural opportunities for retirees who have lots of time on their hands and yet a keen interest in staying active and involved in things. And about what age would you be moving into a community like the Cedars? Obviously, I know it's going to depend on the specifics of your life, but in general, at what age are most people moving in? The average age is somewhere around 76, 77.
I think you'll find that universally true for a lot of communities. The average age of our members at the Cedars is 83. And that's because a lot of our members have moved in there and lived there for many, many years. In fact, we opened in 2004 and I would say probably one third of our membership are original members when we opened our doors. So if I want to move into a place when I'm 76, I need to get on a waiting list at what age?
I would say start doing your research in your late 60s, early 70s and start getting on list. And I always encourage people to visit communities several times because you learn something more each time you visit. OK, let's talk about meals, because that's going to be the most important piece to me. It is now when I'm 76, it will be too. On average, are most people cooking meals in their own home? Are they going to the dining hall? What's the average dining experience look like, would you say? At the Cedars of Chapel Hill, we have three different dining venues. We have a lounge area with a complete full bar. We have the garden room and we have the Magnolia Room.
The garden room is for more informal dining and the Magnolia Room is for formal dining. We also have home meal delivery. So if you live at the Cedars, you can just call the desk and place your meal order or you can go online. We have an intranet and you can select the food that you want delivered for lunch or dinner. A lot of our folks like to come over to the clubhouse for dinner, lunch or dinner, because, again, of the socialization aspect.
Sure. And we'll talk about the how the financial piece fits into the meal plan later. You know, what's covered, what's not covered. Physical activity. What kind of opportunities are there for staying in shape, keeping your body engaged? We have a programs department and the programs department oversees our wellness and fitness activities. They also oversee all of our social and cultural and educational activities.
So this is kind of what a typical day in the life may look like. You could get up, you could go over to our indoor swimming pool and take a swim, or perhaps you could use our fitness facility and do your workout routine with or without a personal trainer. Or maybe you like group exercise. We have yoga classes, Tai Chi. We have strength training and balance classes. We have Zumba. We have line dancing. We have ballroom dancing. We have lots of different types of group exercise activities that you could participate in. Then perhaps you could go up, after you've done a little exercise, you could go up to the lounge and enjoy a complimentary continental breakfast. After that, you may want to go back home and take care of some things around the house, then come back to the clubhouse later in the day to participate in either a bridge game or watching one of the movies that we have in our ballroom, which is where we project movies, or listening to an educational lecture or a classical concert. Then you can come back for cocktails and dinner, and then retire in the comfort of your own home. How does that sound?
Ready to move in? That was just one day? That's just one day.
I'm pretty exhausted. And I'm assuming pretty much all that stuff, all those activities are, I mean, it's not like you're paying for each of those things you go to, right? It's all just kind of included. At the Cedars, you pay a monthly service fee, and it's what I like to refer to as a bundled service fee that's all inclusive.
And all of the activities that I just mentioned to you are included. Now, let's say you want to go to DPAC one night to catch a show, or perhaps you've got NC Symphony season's tickets. You could jump on one of our transportation buses, and we would take you there.
Of course, you would pay a small transportation fee and the cost of your ticket, but it can all be coordinated through one phone call to our programs department. Very good. So that kind of gives you an idea of lifestyle at the Cedars of Chapel Hill. Again, this is the Financial Symphony. We're joined by Theresa Mize, Director of Marketing at the Cedars, talking about some of the things you need to be aware of if you're considering any sort of retirement community and then helping you get familiar with some of the opportunities that we have right here in our own community. Now I want to dive, Theresa, a little bit into the financial side of things, some of the mechanics of moving into a community like the Cedars, you know, just the sort of things you need to be thinking about ahead of time. So to begin with, what's involved in moving to a community like the Cedars, both, you know, the mechanics you would need to think about then also have sense that you need to have in place and things like that?
Great question, John. Well, the Cedars of Chapel Hill is a life plan community licensed as a continuing care retirement community. And currently there are over 2,000 life plan communities nationwide.
So obviously it's a very desirable product. And a lot of people have the misperception that it may be something that's beyond their reach financially. Or on the other side, they may be thinking, this is what I want to do when I retire. My parents move to a community or I know someone that moved to a community and they really began to thrive once they moved there, but gee, can I afford it? So as with all retirement communities, the Cedars is no different.
There are three qualifications, age, financial, and health. So right now let's talk a little bit about the financial. At the Cedars of Chapel Hill, we have an ownership model and we have a wide variety of floor plans. So the pricing can range anywhere from, say, $300,000 to $750,000 to purchase a home. And then there are monthly service fees commensurate with the size home. And those could range anywhere from, say, $2,800 to $5,800. We have a rough rule of thumb that we like to give people.
And certainly you would fill out an application, but if you just kind of want to, for your listeners at home, if they just want to pre-qualify themselves, if their assets are twice the purchase price of the home that they buy and their monthly income is two to two and a half times the monthly fee for the home that they buy, then they qualify. Certainly we look at things like age, whether or not folks have long-term care insurance. And with the monthly income, again, these are rough rules of thumb, but sometimes people may fall short on the monthly income side, but they have enough assets to generate that income should they choose.
Conversely, some folks fall short on the asset side, but perhaps they have fantastic pensions that make up for it. So again, these are just rough guidelines. Everyone's situation is different and we look at every application individually. So the home values, you said different floor plans ranging $300,000 to $750,000, I think you said? That's correct. Now, do I own that home? If I pass away, do my kids get it or does it go back to the Cedars? How does that work?
Yes, you're exactly right. The Cedars of Chapel Hill has a unique financial model. All communities typically have two sets of fees. They're the entrance fees or the buy-in fees.
And then they're the monthly fees that cover the monthly service package. At the Cedars of Chapel Hill, we're structured a little bit differently. We're an entirely debt-free community owned by the members and the members buy their own homes. They're all considered condos.
Whether it's a villa, veranda, or cottage, it's considered a condo. So they own the condo. They pay property taxes on it.
And then when they leave the Cedars, we resell it. It's inheritable. If the children meet the age, income, and health criteria, they can move in as well.
Well, let's say they don't. Then what happens? Kids inherit the house. They don't want to move in or don't qualify to move in.
What happens? Or most cases, they just want to go ahead and sell the house so they can settle the estate. All of the folks in the marketing office are licensed real estate agents and we represent all of the sellers as well. So it's not like the Cedars is buying it back. It's just that you're finding the next buyer basically. That's correct.
Help them facilitate the process. That's correct. Okay. But while you do own the home yourself, as you kind of referenced before, all the maintenance and everything, that's kind of all baked into the monthly fees, I'm assuming? That's exactly right. Again, we were talking about the bundled service fee package. So the interior maintenance, exterior maintenance, landscaping, those things that when we talked about earlier became burdens as we grow older, living independently in a large home, all those things are included in the monthly fee, as well as things like the dining plan. At the Cedars, it's 30 meals per month per person. The utilities are included. Transportation is included. Weekly housekeeping.
Really, all folks need to worry about paying, are there, again, property taxes and their phone bill? I hate to keep bringing it back to food, but this is my wheelhouse. So you said 30 meals a month per person.
That's correct. Yes, that's different from one meal a day because maybe one day I don't want to dine at the Cedars, but the next day perhaps I want lunch and dinner. As long as I'm within those 30 meals per month, it's not a problem. If I want to buy additional meals, I can do that. So is that residence only or can I bring guests and they eat my meals?
How does that all work? You can certainly bring guests. You can pay either the guest meal charge or use one of your meal credits to offset that. In fact, Sunday brunch is real popular. We see a lot of kids and grandkids.
They love to visit their parents on Sundays because the Cedars brunch is so fantastic. One last thing on the moving in. Again, you mentioned the financial things you need to have in place. Let's say I'm 65 and I want to go ahead and get on a waiting list. First of all, about how long realistically am I going to be on that waiting list? And two, do I need to have any kind of upfront deposit to get on the waiting list and or a deposit ready to go when you call me and say, hey, we have a slot open. Do I need to be ready to send you some kind of deposit at that point? At the Cedars, because our financial model is real estate ownership, we really can't put people on a traditional waiting list where you're, say, number two hundred and thirty two. And when we call you, you need to take that property. Rather, we've created something called a preferred future owners list. So if you're on that list and the cost is a thousand two hundred and fifty dollars, if you're on that list, we notify you every time we get a new listing, every time we get a new property for sale. And if you're ready, you can come in and look at that property and make an offer again, because it's real estate. The North Carolina real estate rules and regs say that, you know, offers are presented kind of first come, first serve. So we do have what I like to refer to as a ready list.
These are folks who've already investigated retirement communities, decided that the Cedars is probably where they want to move when the timing is right. They've already been financially pre-approved. And then all we have to do is approve them medically right before they move in.
All right. So let's get to the health care portion, because I know that's an important piece of all this. And for a lot of people, that's why they're moving to a community like this. So I know you said that's one of the qualifications up front. We have to assess the health care situation. And what would be some of the things that would on a health care basis might make you not qualify to live there? Well, first of all, you do have to be capable of independent living. And this is true with all retirement communities. And that's because the state of North Carolina regulates the skilled nursing beds.
And skilled nursing beds in retirement communities in this state are designated specifically for residents of that community. So if you're already experiencing serious health issues, such as the loss of ability to live independently, that could preclude you from coming to the Cedars, as well as most communities. A lot of the things that prevent people from being medically accepted are neurological. Things like Alzheimer's, cognitive impairment, dementia, Parkinson's, those types of things. So you move in, you're perfectly healthy. You live 5, 10, 12 years at the Cedars, the health starts to decline. You need either some kind of daily care or weekly care, or maybe it's like full blown nursing home type of care that you need.
How does that fit in to what you're already paying and what exactly is available there on site? The levels of care that we have are assisted living, memory support, and skilled nursing care. We also have our own home care agency. So many folks choose to stay in their own cottage, villa, or veranda, and have supportive services brought in on a daily basis.
And you're certainly free to do that. Those costs range around $21, $22 an hour. And we bill in 15 minute increments. If you compare that to staying in one's own home and using an outside home care agency, they typically charge three or four hour minimums just to come visit you.
So if you've got a short term illness or short term rehab or recuperation from, say, a knee replacement or hip replacement, that can be very costly. Again, 25% of our membership choose to use the home care services because we embrace the aging in place philosophy. Now if it becomes more prohibitive to have the round the clock care, a lot of people will choose to go to our DeBose Health Center and receive assisted living, memory support, or skilled nursing care. At the Cedars, when you're a member, you pay a 10% membership fee along with purchasing the unit. And again, that membership fee is equal to 10% of the purchase price of the home. That includes 90 free days in the DeBose Health Care Center. We're also a Medicare approved facility. So you could use your Medicare days, then your 90 free days. And then once you needed assisted living, memory support, or skilled care, you could receive that care at a 50% discounted rate. It's called a modified contract. Communities typically either have life care, modified, or fee for service contracts. The Cedars of Chapel Hill has a modified contract. And by the way, that pairs very nicely with long term care insurance. If folks have long term care insurance, they often have very little out of pocket expenses if they move into a modified healthcare contract such as the Cedars. So when you're, let's say you're moving into the medical center, are you then selling your home and using that money to go toward the care?
Or do you still maintain your residence? I guess that's going to depend on if one spouse is going into the medical center and another spouse is at home. Obviously, we're not selling the home out from under that one. But how does that all fit together?
Yes, there can be different scenarios depending upon if it's a couple or a single person. Some folks choose to sell the home so that they just incur the per diems or the daily rates in DuBose Health Care. Some folks like to hang on to it and they continue to pay the monthly fee and perhaps maybe visit it daily and then go back to the DuBose Health Center. Some folks sell it outright.
Some folks don't sell it until they actually pass away. It's the members choice at the Cedars. We could probably go on for hours about all the things you want to think about with moving to a retirement community like this and specific things about the Cedars too.
But obviously, if people want to find out more, best thing to do is what? Go to our website, cedarsofchapelhill.com, and there's contact information. You can request a brochure or an appointment or get phone numbers to call us and set up a time to come in and check out the Cedars. And John, I'd just like to say to your listeners that we have folks that visit us all the time that are planning five, 10 years down the road. They're really not sure which community they want to go to. They may be visiting from out of state.
They may be local, but it's never too soon to start researching and planning for your future. Yeah. And at the very least, grab that number like at the restaurant and at the deli and get your number and be waiting in line. If they call your number, you don't have to order a sandwich, right? But at least you hold your place in line. Exactly.
If it's something you want to think about down the road. Well, Teresa, I really appreciate you coming by. It's been a pleasure, John. Good talking with you again. That's Teresa Mize, Director of Marketing at the Cedars of Chapel Hill. You can find out more online at cedarsofchapelhill.com. Thanks for tuning in. We'll talk with you next week, same time, same place, right here on the Financial Symphony.
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