Welcome to Family Policy Matters, a weekly podcast and radio show produced by the North Carolina Family Policy Council. Hi, I'm John Rust and president of NC Family, and each week on Family Policy Matters, we welcome experts and policy leaders to discuss topics that impact faith and family here in North Carolina. Our prayer is that this program will help encourage and equip you to be a voice of persuasion for family values in your community, state, and nation. Parents, please note that this episode touches on some mature content, so please be cautious if you're listening with young children. And now here's the host of Family Policy Matters, Tracy DeVett-Griggs.
Thanks for joining us this week for Family Policy Matters. When we hear about human trafficking, most of us think about it in the abstract and have little fear that our own children, grandchildren, or friends might become victims.
Well, unfortunately, even Even the safest communities have young people falling prey to traffickers.
So, what can parents do to be alert and to help protect their children? We're joined today by Tanya Baker Nelson, CEO and president of Hand of Hope Pregnancy Centers, to discuss their new recent efforts to educate parents about the real risks of human trafficking here in North Carolina. Tanya Baker Nelson, welcome to Family Policy Matters. Thank you, Tracy. I appreciate you having me.
All right, so you all have several locations in North Carolina. Tell us where they are and what is the overall mission of Hand of Hope. Hand of Hope Pregnancy Centers started almost 20 years ago in Fuqua, Verena, North Carolina. And then we opened another location in Raleigh. And then in 2020, we opened our Fayetteville location.
And the mission behind Hand of Hope is really and truly to come alongside that man and woman who are in the middle of making a pregnancy decision and empowering. Them to choose life for their baby. That's the crux of what we do.
So, connect the dots for us between this mission to provide these valuable, wonderful services to women who are contemplating what to do with a pregnancy and protecting people from human trafficking. A lot of the women that we see are sadly definitely being trafficked. And for that woman who is being trafficked, choosing life seems insurmountable. I mean, she's got a lot of things that she has to change and risks that she has to be willing to take in order to protect her baby that, you know, just a woman who's not being trafficked would have to overcome. It's a huge obstacle for her to do that.
Anybody that's been involved in a pregnancy center understands that is a huge undertaking.
So talk us through your thought process. Why did you think to yourself, oh, we need to go in that direction?
Well, it revealed itself.
So initially, we weren't really trending that way, right? We were in, you know, just crisis management, you know, relational management, emotional intervention, you know, spiritual discussions.
So it really revealed itself to us, especially.
So in the Raleigh Center, we kind of started seeing it, you know, a little bit. And then definitely once we opened our Fayetteville location, it really reared its ugly head.
So it really smacked us right in the face.
So we had no choice but to engage in it and figure out, okay, how do we do this? What are we doing? And how do we successfully intervene for her and also for her baby? We first started noticing is we became very popular among the employees in the adult. Entertainment industry, and we serve them just like we would serve anybody else.
And so then we also started seeing, you know, some, you know, sex workers, prostitutes, you know, name it what you want to call it these days, but it's prostitution, is what it is.
So that started revealing itself in Fayetteville quite a bit more than it does in our other two locations.
So we really got together with our staff and we brainstormed and we said, okay, this is what we're seeing. How do we serve her? In Fayetteville, especially, we're right across the street from Planned Parenthood. And so the information that we received is that Planned Parenthood has a vibrant relationship with some of the pimps for lack of terminology in the area. And so in that vein, the prostitutes and their pimp were reaching out to us to find out what kind of services we had, especially when they found out that all our services were free.
We weren't going to charge for anything.
So that's basically how it presented itself.
So what has your organization chosen to do about this then? We partner with the National Human Trafficking Hotline and then a couple other local rescue organizations. And so we have some internal policies and there's very confidential ways she can do certain things that will alert us to the fact that she is being trafficked. And then we're able to connect with her confidentially and find out how we can. Get her away from that situation as quickly and safely as possible.
How do you know if they are being trafficked or not? How difficult is that? There are some telltale signs. A lot of times, when she's not the one answering our questions, initially, if she's not the one to make her appointment, somebody else makes an appointment for her.
Sometimes she might have two telephones, sometimes she might not have a telephone at all or an email. She might have to communicate through somebody else. If her support person that's with her, and that person can be female, it doesn't necessarily mean that it's a male doing all the talking for her.
Sometimes it's another female.
So, if that person is answering all her questions for her, especially if they speak another language, but you can tell the woman that's being trafficked, she does understand what you're saying. There's like red flags that we kind of have a bit of experience in identifying those types of things. You just get a feel. And honestly, truly, Tracy, you always want to invite the Holy Spirit into the conversation and say, Lord, give me eyes to see. Like, let me.
Me know what's going on without her telling me, Hey, this is what's happening. And then we can, like I said, we can confidentially text with her in that she has to have a certain passcode in order to be able to read the message that we're sending to her. And short of her providing that passcode to somebody else, you know, once she leaves our offices, then you know, we can talk to her confidentially that kind of way, phone calls, those types of things. If she doesn't have social media, that's always a red flag to us because who in this day and age, besides like, you know, my mama is not super active on social media, right?
So a lot of times if she uses someone else's phone number for all forms of communication, because we will continually ask follow-up questions and we also might ask the same question three or four different ways. And then depending on how she answers, we're just able to kind of flag it, you know, sometimes. And sometimes she will admit it. And that kind of goes along with like research because research shows that women, especially in intimate partner violence situations, they make a plan to leave seven different times. And then on the seventh time, she finally follows through.
So it takes her six times to make and fail at a plan, but on the seventh time, she'll finally follow through on getting some help or getting out of that situation totally. And that's been our experience too.
So a lot of times when they come in and they've been trafficked, we're not the first time she's tried to tell somebody or reached out for help.
So it really just kind of depends. You're listening to Family Policy Matters, a weekly radio show and podcast produced by the North Carolina Family Policy Council. This is just one of the many ways NC Family works to educate and inform citizens about issues that impact faith and family here in North Carolina. Our vision is to create a state and nation where God is honored, religious freedom flourishes, families thrive, and life is cherished. For more information about NC Family and how you can partner with us in pursuit of this vision, visit our website at ncfamily.org and be sure to sign up to receive our email updates, action alerts, and Family North Carolina magazine.
You can also follow us on social media at NC Family Policy. That's at NC Family Policy.
So, how do you help them then? Are you just referring them to someone else that is more trained at this? Or what are the steps that you would take? Yes.
So, we network with a couple of, like I said, we do the National Hotline for Sex Trafficking. You know, local police departments have human trafficking departments. We work with some organizations connected with the Raleigh Police Department to get her out. It really depends on the level of need. You know, we had one girl who had gotten beaten up like two or three days before.
We had one girl that, you know, is just verbally abusive. And trafficking can look a lot different in a lot of different situations. Like, you think trafficking, you think little kids or, you know, 14-year-old girls.
Well, adults can be trafficked as well. You know, so money's a powerful sway. And then power and prestige also encourage women to stay because they're looking for identity and validation in all the wrong things. A lot of these things. Seem like the kinds of signs that anyone could look for.
I mean, certainly it's important for you and your staff to recognize them. But do you have some ways then of teaching those of us out here that don't work in pregnancy centers what to watch for? Right. Yeah.
So just the same kind of red flags that we're looking for, like, hey, what's your phone number? Oh, I don't, my phone is broken, or I don't have one, or I forgot my phone in the car. If they don't have an ID, one of the things that really is a big red flag for us is if he actually comes with her and refuses to give us his ID, that's always a, oh, okay, let's see what's going on with that. If their address does not match up to their address that they're providing for us, or she gives us two or three different addresses, if she says she's employed, but she doesn't really know, like, you know, and oh, I work at you know, Starbucks. Oh, really?
Which one? Oh, you know, you don't, mine's way far out. You know, just deflective answers in nature could be, you know, maybe. She doesn't really want to have a relationship with you, but also could be indications that something nefarious really truly is going on.
So, if we've seen some of these signs, then what do we do for somebody that maybe doesn't have connections with a lot of these organizations? The national human trafficking hotline is a hotline, anybody can call it.
So, some of the organizations that we work with are specific to our locale. But the national hotline is, hey, call and give them a tip. You never know. The FBI has a human trafficking office in Raleigh and in Charlotte. You can make a phone call.
You know, you never know. Get as much information as you can, especially in places of businesses. If you ever notice that she pays in cash for everything or she never pays for anything, it's always someone else paying for everything, and she doesn't seem to have any way to pay for anything on her own. If she doesn't have a driver's license, you know, it can run the game. There are a lot of ways that you.
I mean, I'm probably a little hypersensitive to it now. Actually, I was in West Palm a couple months ago and I called the local West Palm human trafficking hotline because there were some things I was seeing on the beach. I was like, no, no, no, no, no. I stayed right there with them till they showed up to like figure it out. Like, okay, well, let's investigate, right?
You know, Ronald Reagan said, trust but verify.
So let's. look into it. I'd love to continue our conversation, but we're just about out of time. If somebody just wants a lot more information about this, if they maybe suspect that they know someone or have been around someone who is being trafficked, what would you suggest that they do? Do you have some resources besides the 800 numbers?
And then how can they also learn more about your organization? I would say find out, you know, be proactive instead of reactive. Find out what's available in your local municipal law enforcement agency.
So you have that information under your belt. Like in Raleigh, Raleigh Police Department has Interact. Interact's a great resource. You know, a lot of these organizations are like most of us, you know, understaffed and overworked basically because it's a big problem because North Carolina ranks in, we're top 10 states in the country for human trafficking. And then the top three counties in North Carolina, of course, are going to be Wake, Cumberland, and Durham County.
And then Johnson County is going to come in a close fourth.
So it's very, you know, especially in those. Transient populations, it's very prevalent there. The NFL, you know, trafficking is huge during NFL football games, those types of things. I did want to tell you one thing, the universal sign for help, I'm being trafficked. And I think where it really is getting out on that is this one where it's like the tuck your thumb and then close your fingers over your thumb on the palm of your hand.
We have ways to like, hey, you do that. And most, most women do know what that is. um and just make yourself readily available for that that's something very simple you know because if she's looking for help then maybe she'll be able to like if you do this to her She can respond in kind, and that's without any words being spoken.
So, I would say to answer your question, find out what your local law enforcement has, if they have anything. And if not, then go to the next town, then go to the next town. But that national hotline, that national human trafficking hotline, that's probably a great place to start. Good.
Well, Tanya Baker-Nelson with Hand of Hope Pregnancy Centers, thank you so much for your good work on human trafficking and of course all the great stuff that you guys do over there at your pregnancy centers. And thanks for being with us today on Family Policy Matters. Thank you for listening to Family Policy Matters. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to the show and leave us a review. To learn more about NC Family and the work we do to promote and preserve faith and family in North Carolina, visit our website at ncfamily.org.
That's ncfamily.org. And check us out on social media at NC Family Policy. Thanks and may God bless you and your family.
