This episode is supported in part by the Christian Standard Bible, a translation designed to be faithful to the original text and clear for everyday readers. We're grateful for their partnership in helping bring gospel-centered content to families like yours. To learn more about the CSB, visit csbible.com. Hi. It's so easy to fall into the selfishness and worry about me and be self-consumed with, oh, I have it so hard.
But when we get in God's word and we let Him tell us the way we're supposed to treat our spouse and the way we're supposed to be. Then the Holy Spirit has a lot more to work with. Welcome to Family Life Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Ann Wilson. And I'm Dave Wilson, and you can find us at FamilyLifeToday.com.
This is Family Life Today.
Okay, this is going to be a great day.
Okay, why? It's going to be a relevant day because I'm the only guy in the studio. We have a new friend in the studio. She's really kind of an old friend, but Beth Runkel is with us and she's written this book. The title is Another Move God.
It's a question mark. Another Move God. But then you see Military Wife, and you're like, I think maybe she's moved a few times. 30 encouragements to embrace your life. Hi, Beth.
How many times have you moved? We moved 14 times while my husband was on active duty. And you moved how many times in your first year of marriage? We moved three times our first year of marriage. We showed up to that third base.
We unpacked boxes. Again. Yeah. And then he would deploy to the Middle East.
So I really found myself wondering: what in the world have I gotten myself into? I mean, at that time, honestly, I know we just started, but were you like happy or were you mad or were you sad or both? All the above. Yeah, to be honest, I wasn't happy at all. I wasn't a Christ follower.
I had been very into my career. And what were you doing? Give us a little taste of your background. I worked in the business world, and I had a lot of different clients. I worked for a large international company.
I had been traveling around the world doing training and projects for them.
So, yeah, I moved, unpacked boxes, and then I'm alone. And to my husband's defense, he did change careers. He went to pilot training while we were engaged. All of our dating was long distance.
So I had actually never seen him in his uniform prior to when we got married.
So he didn't tell me what to expect, but he really didn't quite know. And I'm thankful for that because I don't think I would have married him. Really? Yeah, and he's a great guy. We're happily married, but I liked control too much.
That first year of marriage I became bitter, reluctant, selfish, and often said. The military is m ruining my life. I mean, is that common for a lot of military wives? At some point for sure, I don't know. Most people don't move as drastically as I did that first year marriage.
It was unusual. But I think there is a lot of resentment. You know, you move frequently. Your spouse is deployed often. You often don't live near family.
And your career usually does have to make sacrifices because if the service member is deployed, Somebody needs to be around and be available. And then you're moving states. And if you have a license, you know, you've got to get relicensed. And sometimes people just get super frustrated. And I get it.
Thankfully, I think I saw that there were seasons for my life. And I'm very thankful for the years that. I supported my man, but that is not the way I went into it.
Well, let me ask this too. And let me say this right off the top. If you're listening to this and you're not someone in the military or a military wife, this is still for you. Yeah. As you're talking about all those things at the beginning, your frustrations, I'm like, yep, yep, yep.
Check, check, check. And even if. Yeah, and I didn't even move anywhere near that. You were traveling a lot. I still felt it.
We did move. And I think a lot of us are married to men, or maybe our jobs are moving us all over the place. We come to this realization, like, wait, did you trick me? I thought you were going to be home all the time, or I thought you were going to be super nice like when we first started dating.
So there's a lot of... I was super nice. You were super nice every once in a while. You were way nicer than I was. That's for sure.
Yeah, we both had our moments. But everybody does. And so I think this applies to all of us because we all get into marriages like, wait a minute, I didn't know that. That this was what it was gonna be. Why did you marry this guy?
Yeah, tell us how you met. We met at a wedding. I was a bridesmaid. He was a groomsman. Yes, it does happen.
That's how it happens. That was like a movie. Yeah. So we dated long distance for two years. I mean, he is.
He's an absolutely great guy. And I'm thankful that God didn't give me all the information up front.
So when he says, hey, I think I'm being called into the military, was he a believer at the time? No, neither one of us were believers. And he was already in the military. He just switched jobs. He got picked up to be a pilot, went to pilot training, and we got married after the first training.
And he went to several more trainings and then his permanent assignment in a fighter. Oh, he was a fighter pilot. Yes. How many times have you watched Top Gun? Too many times to count.
Too many times. Especially the new one. My husband really likes it. There was a period of time where every night he would watch 10 minutes of it before bed just to get his little adrenaline rush. Did he have a call sign?
Is that what they call it? He had a call sign. Yes. He went by spunk, runk. Spunk wrong, Gavig says.
You call him that when you get mad, or you call that when you're mad. I don't call him. No, never. No, that's his call sign. They don't mix.
They don't carry over. Yeah, that's like work and at home. Tell us what happened spiritually. How'd that journey go? I think part of the Lord softening me was taking my life completely out of my control.
You know, we moved 14 times, and I think that's because God was like, this is what she's going to need to realize that. I am the only thing that she can hold on to. But after those three moves, the deployments, he would actually deploy four times during that first assignment, and then we moved again. How long were his deployments? They were like three to four months at a time.
But we'd be home a few months and gone again, home a few months and gone again. Were you worried about him? Yeah, of course. I mean, he was over in the Middle East, in Warzone. Yeah.
And back then, You didn't get to communicate like you do now. It's a lot easier now with Skype and FaceTime and Marco Polo. But back then, we didn't get to communicate that much. We began emailing each other, and that's where some of the spiritual journey discussions began. But we also faced infertility.
And I had always been raised going to church, but I knew nothing about having my relationship with Jesus, really did not understand the significance of Christ's death on the cross. I started going to church when he was deployed, and then he would go to the tent where the chaplain was located and begin asking questions. But it wasn't until I got into my first Bible study, I went headfirst, not knowing that, into a precept ministries Bible study on Sarah and Abraham.
So here you are struggling with infertility. Yes. And that is where. I understood the plan of salvation revealed through the scriptures with Kay on the videos. Yes, yes.
She was on video. But yeah, I gave my life to Christ. And my husband also did the videos. And it was through that Bible study that we both surrendered our life to Christ.
So I really believe that God saved us on parallel paths, but brought us together at the end when we both surrendered our lives to Christ. And when we met Kay a couple of years later, she saw my husband with a short haircut and she came up to us and said, hey, are you guys in the military? And we said, yes, ma'am. She said, I just want you to know you are not just in the military. You are missionaries sent by God.
And you are to be about the kingdom and making believers wherever you go. And we were brand new believers and we were like, okay, yes, ma'am. And we literally, God used that prophetically in our life. And that's what we did begin. With marriage studies, which is partly because of you and Dave and your ministry with family life.
The good news of Jesus had saved our marriage, and we wanted to share it with others. And then I began leading Bible studies in my home because after that one Bible study, I was like, I got to get more of this. And this is what I need to survive the military life.
So I began opening my base home, women sitting on the floor of my base house, not very fancy, just opening the scriptures together and talking about how does this relate to the unique challenges, the chaos, and the uncertainty of our lives. And how do we know, because we're studying the word, that God is in control over all of that uncertainty. I mean, how soon after you came to Christ? Are you doing that? Leading women in your own home.
I began leading Bible study within a year. That wasn't the original plan. I had been. I had done these precept studies on my own with my husband. I worked through all of Genesis and Exodus, but I also joined a women's Bible study group.
And I was in that group. There were 12 women. And the group grew to 24. And the other woman said, hey, we're going to need another group. And you're very comfortable talking to people.
I'm going to separate this group. And I'd like for you to be a facilitator. And I said, okay, well, you know, I don't know a lot about the Bible. I'm just learning all this. I said, I'm comfortable speaking, though.
I'll be a facilitator. I said, but please give me a group of mature Christian women. And she said, okay, yeah, we can make that happen. That is not at all. That is not at all what happened.
In that Bible study, I ended up having the opportunity to lead two women to Christ. I had an older woman who was more mature who would often try to bring scripture if I didn't know. She said to me, You're leading this group. You're going to do it. And I brought up the second week that if anybody didn't have a relationship with Jesus and didn't know what that meant, that I had recently come to understand that.
And if anybody wanted to talk to me about it, let me know, expecting nothing to happen. But I really did feel the Lord tell me to say that.
Well, Two of the women. Came up to me. One of them happened to be my husband's commander's wife. And I actually used Campus Crusade material to disciple those women for 12 weeks after I was terrified to share the gospel with them. And to be honest, it was probably a terrible gospel presentation.
But, you know, the Lord can use anything. And kind of after that experience, I wasn't so scared to open the word with people because. I already had a pretty scary experience, and I thought it can't get worse. Are you a baby Christian? Yes.
Let me ask you this because what Kay Arthur said to you guys. It is a big deal. As women are listening to this right now, is their call any different than yours? What would you say to them? Would you say the same thing that Kay said to you?
I think at the time I thought, oh yeah, because we move a lot, you know, we're going to have opportunity to interact with more people. And we did. But it also can look exactly the same if you're not moving because you've got kids. and families on your kids' sports team. You have neighbors.
You have people in your kids' school. There are people around us everywhere we go, at the grocery store, the waiters at your restaurants. People desperately need to hear the hope and healing found in Jesus. And you can be the person right where you are. I did a lot of that as we moved, but also it just meant I opened my home and invited, sometimes it started with me and one other woman.
And this is the way I cultivated community in all the places I live. But you don't have to be moving to do that. You just have to be willing to say to at least one other person, hey, I'm going to do this Bible study. Do you want to come? And to be honest, I didn't even make it that way.
Fancy. I could run around, be crazy, and be mad with the people in my home trying to make it look perfect like I didn't live there. You know, really realized that hospitality is about connection, not perfection. And how'd you get involved with family life? How'd you connect?
I met my husband and I came to Christ, and about a year later, We were stationed at Columbus, Mississippi. We drove to Birmingham, Alabama, and we went to a weekend to remember. And at that conference, we heard for the first time the biblical blueprint for marriage: the drift towards isolation, communication, conflict management, intimacy. And at the conference, the closing session, you know, they stood up on the stage with these little small group guides and said, Hey, if you've gotten something out of this weekend, you can take these small group guides and you can go back and you can start these small groups. And my husband and I turned and looked at each other and we said, We're going to do that.
And so we did. My husband says that we know how to open our home and tell time and read. That's all we did because we didn't know the scriptures. And so we were investing usually in military marriages, making an impact because divorce is not good in the culture, but it's a little bit worse in military marriages. And especially when you get into the veteran years, that's usually when people tend to completely give up.
They've been shoving problems under the rug for a long time that they've really not been dealing with because they've either been moving or they've been on deployment. They haven't separated a lot. And so also they haven't really learned how to be a couple or forgot how to be a couple.
So in those veteran years, they're coming back home. They're in each other's space for the first time. And then all the issues that they've been shoving under the carpet, there's eventually this mountain they need to climb over and it needs to be dealt with. And then on top of that, unfortunately, a lot of our veterans have combat trauma. Or other invisible wounds of war.
And so, those problems have been shoved under the carpet, addictions, usually, substance abuse, and porn, unfortunately. Then they're not moving all the time. And they try to work on their marriage, but they end up giving up because, honestly, a lot of times they waited too long. But we wanted to invest in military marriages where we knew it was hard and we wanted to make an impact of those around us. And so we were pouring in.
Again, we just knew how to read and tell time. But what it was doing is we were giving them stuff, but making deposits in our own marriage because we all need to be reminded. It's so easy to fall into the selfishness and worry about me and be self-consumed with, oh, I have it so hard. But when we get in God's word and we let him tell us the way we're supposed to treat our spouse and the way we're supposed to be. Then the Holy Spirit has a lot more to work with.
We say that same thing. The thing that's changed our marriage so much, besides Jesus, is we've led together. Yes. And those truths, whether anybody else gets them or not, I don't know, but we get it. We keep saying it over and over.
Yeah, I mean, sometimes I'll be sitting there and go, oh, that was for me. Yes. Yeah. I mean, I think we all know Jesus said: if you want to find your life, lose it. And it's so paradoxical.
It's like, what? If I don't find my life, I got to go grab it. And a lot of people, that's what they try to do. And they're empty. And it's like, it doesn't make sense.
But when you empty yourself out, helping others, sharing with others, like you said, I think couples would leave our home and we'd be like, I have no idea if anything hit. But for us, you know, it transformed our marriage and our legacy and our kids.
So if you've heard nothing else so far, one, give your life to Jesus. Go to a marriage conference. If you've been thinking, should we go? The answer is yes. And then maybe you've been on the fence with this.
Huh, get the art of marriage, get vertical marriage, get a tool. We have a whole bunch of them for you here at Family Life. She's called FamilyLifetoday.com. Family Learning. We've used all of them.
Have you? Yes, we've used all of them.
So we would do small group center home. We used art of marriage, vertical marriage, all those things just to continue to invest in others. Also, when the Lord saved both my husband and I, early on, it was actually when we were stationed in Korea. I studied the tabernacle and the concept of worship. And in Romans 12, 1 and 2, it tells us to, in view of God's mercy, to present our bodies as a living sacrifice.
And that really grabbed me as I saw worship is not just what I do in church on Sunday. Worship is my life. It's a daily living for him. I began to want to live for him where God had ordained for me to be. And for me that meant on military bases all over the world.
And That caused me to really change my perspective on my husband's job.
So I mentioned in the beginning. You know, he had this job flying fighter airplanes. Very exciting. Gets go to a lot of cool places. I stay at home.
You don't sound very excited about that. Fire drive jets.
So I was, this is in your book. It's a 30-day. Devotional. Yes, yes. And I talk about Sarah and Abraham's story and explain the parallels between Sarah and Abraham's life, which is.
A lot of the reasons why I got saved in Genesis is because I saw How tender and caring God was. That the very first time that I would study the Bible, he put me in a story where the person had many parallels to my life.
So, when God called Sarah and Abraham to go to a land, I will show you, that's what we in the military call a permanent change of station or PCS. Abraham went off and fought in combat when he went to rescue his nephew Lot from the 318 men. And I also believe Sarah dealt with loneliness. Hagar dealt with solo parenting. I think that infertility.
Yes, infertility.
So all of that was my story. But also, understanding that my life was to be a living sacrifice, what I began to understand is that when a man or a woman serves in uniform, they have a calling. And it's not unlike a clergy calling. It is something that they have a special duty or obligation to perform.
So I began to understand this isn't just a job for my husband. This is a calling. And he's willing to sacrifice all. For his country. But.
If God had caused me to marry this man in uniform That I too had a calling on my life. No, I didn't pick up the weapons. No, I didn't wear the uniform. I didn't go off to war. But my calling was associated with his calling, which meant we were to reach the people in our midst.
And then my life began to have purpose. Hey friends, Ron Deal here, Director of Family Life Blended. Did you know Blended and Blessed? The only worldwide live stream designed for couples and blended families is free this year, Saturday, April 18th. We're going to be live in Oklahoma City.
If you show up there, we're going to charge you for lunch. But other than that, it is free. Free to live stream. Churches can bring a group of couples together and enjoy the day. Absolutely free.
Gayla Grace is going to be with us. Davey and Christy Blackburn. Cheryl Shoemake is going to be with us. Kathy Lipp and Brian Goens, our MC. It's going to be a wonderful day.
I hope you can join us. Learn more and get the link in the show notes at familylifetoday.com.
Okay, Beth, tell us what part. Prayer has played in your life. Because I'm assuming it's pretty big. Yeah, I think so. You know, Stormeyo Martin, who's written a lot of books on prayer, she says that she believes a wife's.
Prayers have more potent power than anyone else. I mentioned earlier that I think Sarah was a woman of prayer, and Psalm 91 is often known as the soldier's prayer. I didn't know that until I read that in your book. I've never heard that either. Yeah, a lot of people have used it.
And there's a lot of really cool stories about people having that prayer in their uniform and how it protected an entire group at a war in, I believe, World War II. But Psalm 91 speaks of God's faithfulness being a shield and bulkwort. A bulkwort is a military term that is a wall built for defense. And I believe prayer can serve to create that defense upon our service members.
Now, I mentioned earlier that my husband flew an F-117 stealth fighter.
Now, I think you would agree with me that the U.S. military force is.
Something to be reckoned with. We have incredible training and our weapons are just amazing. But all of our branches of our military now are now using laser-focused weapons. And these have just completely changed the trajectory of war.
So my husband flew F-117 Stealth Fighters. He would be up there and he would practice dropping the laser in a specific spot.
So for example, he flew his missions at 10,000 feet. From 10,000 feet, he would place the laser on a specific window on a third story building. Where that laser was, When he pressed to fire the weapon. it would hit from ten thousand feet. Every Single.
Time. Count the window, the pain from 10,000 people. And this is all over our military now. I believe prayer. Is that laser-guided weapon for that spouse who is at home?
We can pray the protection of God. but we actually have to use the weapon. We would never expect our military to go off to the battlefield and leave their weapon on the ground. They would be defenseless without it. But we try to do that.
to try to protect.
Someone who is off at war, or really anybody who has a spouse or children that you're praying for. We have to pick up that weapon, and we are calling down. The force of God to go to battle for us and protect our loved ones. But prayer is a gift. And it is a gift that has to be used, and the pleasure and joy of talking.
With the God of the universe, and Psalm tells us God is near to those who call on Him in prayer.
So pick up your weapon and go to war. I'm pumped up about that. I'm in. Yes, that's good. That's really a good one.
I love it. Uh Aunt Beth's Runkel is a soldier. She fires me up just listening to her. I'm excited. She's fierce and she's a leader.
This is good stuff. Yeah, you can get her book, Another Move, God. Just go to familylifetoday.com and click on the link in the show notes. And she's going to be back with us tomorrow. And let me tell you, tomorrow's going to be fire as well.
You don't want to miss it. Before we're done today, I just want to remind our listeners: we know life is full of challenges, and families today need biblical truth more than ever. And as a Family Life partner, your monthly gift helps bring the truth into homes every single day through podcasts, events, and resources.
So let's make a lasting difference together. Become a partner today. Just go to familylifetoday.com and click the donate button. Family Life Today is a donor-supported production of Family Life, a crew ministry celebrating 50 years of helping you pursue the relationships that matter most. Yeah.
