Have you ever wished someone could take the stress and guesswork out of budgeting? That's exactly what the FaithFi app was built for. FaithFi uses your real spending history to build a personalized plan from day one. And as you categorize transactions, it learns your patterns, automatically simplifying future budgeting so you spend less time managing and more time living. But the FaithFi app doesn't stop with the numbers.
Each daily, weekly, and monthly rhythm invites you to engage scripture, reflect on God's provision, and connect your financial decisions with your faith. And it's because FaithFi integrates articles, studies, devotionals, podcasts, and community support, you're never walking this journey alone. Try FaithFy Pro Free for 30 days, and for a limited time, get 25% off a pro subscription at faithfy.com/slash app. The late Larry Briquette once said: money is either the best or the worst area of communication in our marriages. Hi, I'm Rob West.
Few things reveal the strength of a couple's unity, quite like money. But what if your finances were rooted in oneness and kingdom impact? Today I'll talk with Dr. Art Rayner about how to become a truly rich couple. And then it's onto your calls at 800-525-7000.
That's 800-525-7000. This is Faith in Finance, biblical wisdom for your financial journey.
Well, it's always a pleasure to have my friend Art Rayner in the studio. Art is the founder of the Institute for Christian Financial Health and Christian Money Solutions. He's also the author of several books on biblical finance, including The Rich Couple: 30 Days of Following God's Design for a Financially Healthy Marriage. Art, great to have you back. Rob, it is always an honor, so thank you so much for having me.
Well, it's my privilege. Art, let's dive in. I love this book, and you use an interesting phrase in it. You say a financially rich couple. I've already referred to it at least once here in the open.
Explain that for us. What do you mean? Yeah, great question. And I'm very clear in the book about this.
So a rich couple isn't necessarily one with the biggest bank account. It is a couple that is rich in contentment and purpose. They recognize that everything they have belongs to God and they find joy in faithfully stewarding his resources rather than constantly chasing after more.
So they're united around a shared mission. They are generous with what they have been given and they are free from the endless comparison and discontent that money can create. You know, financial wealth can disappear, but contentment in Christ and purpose rooted in God's kingdom creates a richness that lasts. And that is the kind of wealth every couple should pursue. Absolutely.
I love that. What a beautiful picture.
Now, you encourage couples to decide to be one.
So practically speaking, what does it look like to move from mine and yours to this mindset that reflects the picture of marriage that God designed for us that's really about ours and not mine and yours? Oh, I love that question. Yeah, moving from mine and yours to ours. Begins with recognizing that marriage is a covenant, not a contract.
So, in Genesis 2:24, we're told that a husband and a wife become one flesh, and that includes every part of their lives, including their finances.
So, practically, that means combining accounts, sharing passwords, and embracing complete financial transparency.
So, my encouragement to couples is to schedule a brief monthly meeting huddle to review your financial goals and to make decisions together. Establish a no-surprises spending threshold.
So, if a purchase exceeds that amount, then you need to send a quick text to your spouse first. And then, finally, change your language. You know, start with saying our income or our debt. And our generosity. You know, unity grows through intentional habits.
And so I encourage couples to chase after that. Yeah, unity is so key and it's so foreign to so many couples, especially in this area of money. But this idea of a team sport with regard to marriage is so key. And that's the number one mindset shift that you share in the book. Describe that a bit further.
Yeah, so marriage is a team sport. My family, we're all about sports. And so I like that analogy. And your spouse is supposed to be your number one teammate.
So that means your loyalty begins to belong to one another, not to your parents, not to your children. We love them. Yes. Not to your friends. We love them.
But that's not where your loyalty lies. You can disagree with your spouse behind closed doors, but when you step outside, you present a united front. And that builds trust because each spouse knows the decisions won't be reversed in the parking lot or undermined by outside voices. For example, If your in-laws encourage an expensive purchase, a healthy response would be: you know what, thanks for the suggestion. We'll talk it over and we'll let you know.
So that is what team number one looks like: protecting unity before everything else. Oh, I love that. Having a unified front and really being of one mind and heart doesn't mean we won't have disagreements. It also doesn't mean that as we talk about our values and our priorities, they're always going to align, but we need to be committed to finding oneness at the end of the day and driving toward unity. And that needs to include in our financial lives as well.
Well, when we come back with Dr. Art Raynor today, we're going to continue to unpack this. What about that nod in your stomach when the conversation turns to money? We're going to give you some ideas, some practical ways to ease that tension. We'll also talk about some of the marriage dividers and how you get past those as well.
Art Raynor's here today. We're talking a financially healthy marriage. Much more after this. Stick around. Have you ever started a budget only to watch it fall apart a few weeks later?
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That's certainly God's heart in marriage. We're talking about that today: a financially healthy marriage. With us is my friend Art Raynor. Art is the founder of the Institute for Christian Financial Health and Christian Money Solutions. He's also the author of the book, The Rich Couple: 30 Days of Following God's Design for a Financially Healthy Marriage.
You can buy it wherever you buy books. Art, we've been describing these mindset shifts that are so key. And, you know, as folks are listening to this topic, I'm sure there's some listeners that are remembering that knot in their stomach that they sense every time the conversation turns to money. And in your book, you offer a practical way to ease that tension. Explain that to our listeners.
Yeah, Rob, and that is so very common. And one of the best ways to reduce financial tension is to share your money stories.
So, our past experiences with money shape our present fears, our habits, and impulses.
So, as couples, You want to talk through those stories. Help your spouse understand your money personality, whether you're naturally a spender, a saver, an investor, or ignorer. That understanding creates empathy instead of frustration. Suddenly, it's not, why are you like this?
Now I understand why that purchase makes you so anxious. It also helps couples divide financial responsibilities according to their strengths.
So instead of allowing childhood baggage to create hidden conflict, money stories transform it into a shared strategy for moving forward.
So share your money stories. That's big. Yeah, that is so key. And Art, you know, so much of the way we handle money was shaped by how it was modeled for us growing up, by how God has wired us, including our temperament. How is getting that out on the table with your spouse and talking about some of those early memories of money and coming to an understanding of what drives our money decisions individually?
How is that important to drive toward unity as a couple?
Well, it helps you to understand where your spouse is coming from. It provides a sense of empathy.
So, as your spouse is coming to the table with the desire maybe to save a little bit more, to have a little bit more in the emergency fund, and maybe that's not your natural bent. Maybe you're more of a spender or an investor, or maybe you're an ignorer. You understand where they are coming from. And so, it's not this, oh, I can't believe you're saying this. It's actually a, oh, I understand why you are saying this.
And it helps create empathy. And hopefully, it creates a better line of communication for you and your spouse. Yeah, I think that's right on. If you haven't done this, maybe the next time you're on a money date or talking about money, just answer the question, each of you: what was your earliest memory of money and see how what comes to mind isn't still playing out in how you each handle money today? All right, Art, let's turn to generosity.
You list it among your first money milestones. Why is that the best place to begin? I have an idea, but I'm curious. I think you do.
So I begin with generosity because. That's where the Bible starts, okay? This is not an Art Rainer idea.
So, throughout scripture, God calls His people to recognize that He owns everything and that we are the managers of what He has entrusted to us.
So, that's why Money Milestone One is to start giving. It redirects the heart before it redirects the budget. It gives couples a shared purpose that they can celebrate together while protecting them from lifestyle creep as their income continues to grow.
So, financial health begins with faithful stewardship, and faithful stewardship begins with generosity, not bigger bank accounts. Yeah, that's well said. Speaking of those milestones, I think it might be helpful to just unpack those quickly. What are the eight money milestones couples can use to track their progress? Yeah, so the eight money milestones that we use is just a guide.
It helps us answer that question: what financial step is next?
So, money milestone one is to start giving, money milestone two is to save fifteen hundred dollars for a minor emergency, money milestone three is to max out your 401k or 403b match, money milestone four is to pay off all of your debt except for your mortgage, money milestone five is to save three to six months' worth of living expenses for a job loss level emergency.
So, that's your traditional emergency fund. Money milestone six is to put 15% of your gross income toward retirement. Money milestone seven is either to save for your kids' college or pay off for your mortgage, and then money milestone eight is to live and give more generously.
So, it starts with generosity and it ends with generosity. And there's actually a book on all of them, right? Correct. Yeah, that can be found in The Money Challenge, or it's also found in The Rich Couple.
So either of those two books provide you with the eight money milestones.
Okay, excellent. That's so helpful. Which of the money milestones tends to trip couples up the most? And what have you found this helps to get unstuck?
So the the very First, one that tends to trip couples up is actually money milestone one. Because oftentimes I'll meet with couples, I do financial counseling, I'll meet with couples, and they're not on the same page with the biblical foundation for financial health. And that is generosity. They have not discussed what to give, how much to give, when to give. And so, if we can establish that baseline, Then it goes a long way toward building everything else in their financial life.
So it starts with generosity. Yeah, that's helpful. You warn couples about what you call the four marriage dividers. And I want to unpack those for a moment. I think these are really helpful.
Yeah.
So the four biggest marriage dividers around money are poor communication. Selfishness, distrust, and unrealistic expectations.
So poor communication is addressed by having a simple, weekly, ten minute money conversation before you ever open a spreadsheet. Selfishness. Phase when couples stop thinking in terms of my money and start celebrating each other's wins. Distrust is overcome through complete transparency. We're talking about shared accounts, shared passwords, and agreed-upon spending guidelines.
Unrealistic expectations are replaced with a realistic shared financial plan that's reviewed regularly.
So, ultimately, one principle that ties this all together is to bring everything into the light. You know, talk early and pray often. That's so good. If someone's listening today, Art, and they say, I know I love what you're talking about, but that just doesn't even seem possible in my marriage. We're miles apart.
What would you say to begin turning that around?
Well, don't start with the budget. Start with your hearts.
So pray together.
So in the rich couple, I encourage couples to begin with this simple prayer: Lord, help us to be one. Help us experience the contentment and purpose that you desire for us. Thank you for allowing us to be a part of your mission. Please help us steward your possessions well, leveraging them for the advancement of your kingdom. And then, I encourage couples to spend 15 minutes sharing their money stories without interrupting or judging each other.
And then finally, You know, take one small step together, such as opening a joint savings account with $50. The small acts of unity can create lasting momentum. Yeah, that is so good.
Well, Art, I really appreciate your insights. This is such an important topic. And, folks, I would love for you to pick up a copy of this book. It's called The Rich Couple: 30 Days of Following God's Design for a Financially Healthy Marriage. You can buy it where you buy books.
You can also head over to ChristianMoneySolutions.com. That's ChristianMoneySolutions.com. Art, thanks for your time today. Thanks for having me. That's Art Rayner, founder of the Institute for Christian Financial Health and Christian Money Solutions.
Again, the title of this book: The Rich Couple: 30 Days of Following God's Design for a Financially Healthy Marriage. All right, a quick break and then back with your questions: 800-525-7,000. That's 800-525-7,000. Or if you'd prefer to email your question, send it to us at askrob at faithfy.com. Stick around.
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We're taking your calls and questions. If you've got a question, we'd love to hear from you. Call right now, 800-525-7000. Again, that's 800-525-7000. Whether you're thinking about paying down some debt, you want to give wisely, perhaps it's preparing the next steward or choosing whether a will or a trust is a better option for you.
Any of those questions and more, 800-525-7000. Let's go to Chattanooga Rod. Thanks for calling, sir. Go ahead. Thanks for taking my call.
I appreciate it. I'm just curious about something. I'm retired. And I don't have very much in a IRA. got a limited savings on the schwab.
And I have a family member that's older than me. When I pass away, I inherit all they have. Is there any advantage for me to keep the IRA? Yeah.
Yes, there could absolutely be an advantage to keeping the IRA, even if you don't currently need the money to live on. First of all, you get the continued tax deferred growth.
So as long as the money stays in the IRA, It can continue to grow tax deferred. Uh or tax-free if it's a Roth. You'll have required minimum distribution.
So at age 77, if it's a traditional, You know, you've got to continue making your annual RMD. You can't simply leave it there, which I'm sure you've been along the way. But you don't have to spend the distribution if you don't need it. And you could do a qualified charitable distribution straight to a charity, and then you wouldn't have to pay tax on it as it comes out. With regard to future needs, you know, while Social Security covers your expenses today, the IRA is going to provide some cushion for unexpected health care costs if you needed long-term care, certainly inflation, any unforeseen expenses.
And then finally, legacy planning. If you don't need the IRA during your lifetime, it can become part of the inheritance you leave to your beneficiaries, including ministries, if there's not heirs there. In terms of the older family member naming you as a beneficiary, you know, you don't need to change your own IRA strategy simply because you may inherit another retirement account. If you do inherit it, the distribution rules will depend on your relationship to the deceased and what type of account it is.
So I would just evaluate that when it's received. But let me stop there and just get your thoughts on all that.
So you're saying really I should go ahead and just keep the IRA even though I don't won't need it for the Live on. That's right, because we don't know what the future is going to hold.
Now, if you define enough and you have defined your financial finish line, both with what you have today as well as what you're expecting in the future, then one of the other benefits you have is to accelerate your giving. Because one of the things I think we don't want to do, and I think too often we can get into this trap, is many folks will over-accumulate during their lifetime. And they'll sit on far more than they need, planning to give it away at death. when they could get some of it into God's economy right now. And so you have the opportunity to do a qualified charitable distribution to the extent you, in fact, have gone beyond your lifetime finish line, meaning you know what you need in total assets and you've accumulated beyond that.
Well, for 2026, you could do up to $111,000, and that's per individual. Yeah, through a qualified charitable distribution.
So that money would come out of the IRA and go straight to a ministry, and you don't add $1 to your taxable income, which means you're just getting far more into God's kingdom to advance the gospel. And that's just one example. But that could be a wonderful opportunity for you. Oh, okay. Hadn't realized all that.
Thank you. I appreciate it. Absolutely, Rod. Listen, thanks for your call. If we can help you further along the way, don't hesitate to reach out.
800-525-7000 is the number to call. Let's go to Miami and let's see. Kalia, go ahead. Hi, Rob. Thank you so much for taking my call.
I had a quick question. I'm struggling with credit card debt. The debt that I have is exactly $80,900, and the APR is twenty three point four nine.
So I'm kind of in a pickle here because I can't pay that debt right now in a situation.
So I was wondering what the best options would be because I've already communicated with my credit card company to see if they have any extra hardship programs to lower their interest. I've read about consolidation, personal loan, hearing negative things about consolidation, personal loan.
So I just was trying to see if what would be the best route to go with this debt that I can't seem to get down, obviously. For the hardship I'm dealing with. Yeah, well, there's another option here, Kalia, that's actually my preferred option for how you pay down this debt, and it's what's called debt management. Or you may hear it referred to as credit counseling.
So, within the creditors, each credit card company has what's called a credit counseling department. And in the credit counseling department, they offer lower interest rates, dramatically lower than the prevailing rate.
So, you're at 23.49, the typical interest rate, and it varies by creditor, so it would depend on which one you have, but it should be somewhere between 0 and 11%. But you can only access that program through a non-profit credit counseling agency.
So, we have worked here at Faith5 for many years, more than a decade, with Christian Credit Counselors, and they're wonderful. They've worked with literally thousands of our listeners. You'll go to ChristianCreditCounselors.org. They will evaluate the card that you're with, the creditor. They'll tell you what the new interest rate would be.
You'd make one monthly payment to them, probably somewhere around between 2% and 3% of the balance.
So, at $8,900, if it's, you know, 2% is $178 a month, 3%, 267, somewhere in between there. The nice thing is, though, that they'll pass it on to the creditor, but now it'll be at a dramatically lower interest rate.
So, now you get more going to principal. You keep the one-level payment, you're not taking out a new loan, and you're going to pay it back on average 80% faster. How does that sound though? That sounds awesome. Thank you so much, Rob.
I really appreciate it. You're welcome. And it's a small card. Hopefully, that's not a problem. Yeah, no, it won't be.
So just head to Christiancreditcounselors.org, or if it's easier, just go to faithfi.com/slash CCC, faithfi.com/slash CCC. And listen, you're going to love them. They love Jesus. They're all about helping God's people get out of debt. This program is the way to do it.
If you have about more than roughly 4,000 in credit card debt, this is the way I recommend folks go. Hey, Kalia, God bless you. Thanks for calling today.
Well, folks, that's going to do it for us. We covered a lot of ground today. I'm so thankful for the opportunity to come alongside you to talk about our role as stewards, to look to God's word, to encourage one another and realize that as we see God as our ultimate and true treasure, well, money changes its entire focus. It becomes a means to an end to accomplish God's purposes. And that's what we want to encourage.
You in as we gather together on this program each day. Hey, check out the Faith Buy app. You can download it today and set up your spending plan. Faithbuy.com. Just click app.
On behalf of my team, Jim Henry, Devin Patrick, Robert Youngblood, I'm Rob West. This has been Faith and Finance. We'll see you next time. Bye-bye. Faith in Finance is provided by Faith By and listeners like you.
