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The Bible gives us powerful examples of people who look successful by every measure, yet walked away empty. Today, Bob Schenck helps us see how Jesus challenges our definition of wealth and invites us into something far greater. And then we'll take your phone calls on anything financial at 800-525-7000. This is Faith and Finance: biblical wisdom for your financial journey.
Well, our guest today is my friend Bob Schenck, the founder of the Masters Program, a mentoring and leadership development initiative. Every now and then you get the chance to interview a GOAT, one of the greatest of all time, and I put Bob in that category. Bob, great to have you here, my friend. Honored to be with you, Rob. Bob, you have an incredible article in our Faithful Stewart magazine that begins with a simple insight.
Across political, cultural, and generational lines, most people still want to be rich. Why is that desire so universal? I think we've been wired with a desire for more, and that isn't a result of sin. It's a result of the way God made us. Uh he was From the beginning, committed to multiplication and directed Adam and Eve into a multiplying mindset.
And so, you can't be about multiplication without a desire for more, and so. The enemy knowing that directs us toward more of the wrong thing. God always wants us to be directed toward more of the best things. Yes. Wow, that's so well said.
And you note in the article that even when people pursue wealth seriously and responsibly, this sense of arrival often remains just out of reach. Bob, why do you think that even hitting a net worth goal rarely satisfies the way we expect it to?
Well, I think that part of our redemption is that God has put longings in our soul. that were not there before. And things that might have been more satisfying before our redemption became real. become less capable of satisfying the newfound uh longings that A redeemed soul brings to the table. And the Holy Spirit will not allow me to become.
Comfortable or satisfied with something less than what he intends to make possible by God's design in my life. That is very well said.
Now, we're going to begin to unpack this story of the rich young ruler, which is so profound, a man who seemed to have everything going for him wealth and youth and, of course, authority and responsibility. Bob, why do you think that account still resonates so deeply to day? The Gospels break into their four Gospels. John stands apart as thematic. Matthew, Mark, and Luke give us a timeline of Jesus, principally his ministry, three years.
But the rich young ruler shows up in all three of those synoptic gospels. The story is important enough that God repeats it over and over and over again. I think it resonates with us because we are uh among those who have The ability to get beyond accumulation for just survival purposes and getting to the place where we have abundance that is beyond our need for operating capital and for family sustenance. And putting us in a danger zone where my heart is going to be measured by what I. am intending to do with what I've got in what the Bible would call the treasure category.
And treasure exists as soon as I have more than I can justifiably explain in terms of need and responsibility. Mm. Yeah. Uh set the stage for this story and and what's about to happen. We're going to unpack it in detail after the break, but what's really going on here?
Well, there's a guy, and he's one of the last of the Old Covenant players. In the old covenant, keep the law with faith as the motivator. And you would satisfy God's expectations, requirements to go into his kingdom. And so this guy's met all those standards. Question is what's left to be done?
And there is something profound, and Jesus puts his finger on it. We'll unpack that just around the corner. We're talking about being rich in what really matters today. Our friend Bob Shank, the founder of the Masters Program, is here. Much more to come just around the corner.
You're not going to want to go anywhere. This is Faith and Finance. I'm Rob West, and we're just getting started. A lot of practical lessons for you today from the Rich Young Ruler. We'll be right back.
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Investing involves risks including possible loss of principal. The richest life is the one that keeps eternity in view and uses every resource in service of Christ. We're joined today by our friend Bob Schenck. He's the founder of the Masters program. He has an article in the latest issue of our Faithful Steward magazine where talking about the rich young ruler and being rich in what really matters.
And Bob, I want to dig deep into this story. The question the rich young ruler asked Jesus is striking. What must I do to inherit eternal life? And you suggest Jesus recognized something deeper beneath it. What do you think was really going on in his heart?
Well, I think there was a longing that he had, having met the minimums. This was a man who was never satisfied to do just enough. Uh, his professional success and the financial achievements that he had demonstrated that he was always swinging for the possible and not satisfied with the minimal. Jesus Um really went beyond the question of eternal life. In his follow-up question when he said, if you want to be perfect, And he then went on to give this multi-point counsel.
to satisfy that urge, that longing that was not satisfied with just meeting the minimums. And it's fascinating. I've just found, Rob, that for most people, when they come to this passage, it's almost like we put a uh fast forward on it because it's familiar enough that we don't need to read the details again. And I've Queried thousands of people in auditoriums around the country to ask, what did Jesus tell the rich young ruler? And I always find.
That the only thing they recount is, sell your possessions, give to the poor, and follow me. Yes. And to slow it down and to read exactly what Jesus said. adds a component that is most often raced past without consideration. uh all three accounts of the story uh give this narrative Where Jesus said, if you want to be perfect, and that was not sinless, perfect meaning fully mature, fully developed, here was his direction.
Sell your possessions, give to the poor. Then you will have treasure in heaven. And then come follow me. And we seem by the enemy's scrub of the details in our consciousness. To have dropped that treasure in heaven offer that Jesus built into his answer.
And I've just discovered that There's a longing to create treasure.
Now, that word treasure in the original text is the word thesaurus. It's the word from which we get the accumulation of words in abundance. Most of us have a few thousand words in our personal use. Thesaurus gives us the depth and breadth of the words of availability. Treasure is the abundance.
And Jesus never trounced treasure. What he encouraged was to move treasure from the uncertain environment of this world where it's vulnerable. Into the eternal sphere where it's secured, protected, guarded, and waiting for us on the other side. And so the the issue was the man in sin because he was rich. The issue was where did he want that richness, that abundance to be archived for him?
and he was counting on the earthly storehouse to be the place where it could be trusted, Jesus was offering him a better solution and he turned him down. Mm. I love this idea of the completeness or wholeness, not flawlessness. And it's this idea that Jesus puts his finger on the one attachment in the rich young ruler's life that was preventing wholehearted devotion. That is powerful.
You explained that Jesus was ultimately challenging who truly owned the rich young ruler's wealth. And this question of ownership is so central when it comes to money and faith, isn't it? Yeah, I think that uh if you really measured the way most of us go about life, There's a core belief that while we're here, it's ours. And when we get past this life into eternity, it's all God's. Yes.
And an honest evaluation of what Jesus described about his kingdom Is that while we're here, it's all God's. And what we do with God's resources while we're here will determine what we will have waiting for us on the other side, where private ownership will. finally be real. but it will not be universal. That private ownership will go toward the people who, through faithfulness as stewards of God's resources in this life, proved themselves worthy to be able to have money of their own, as Jesus described it in that amazing story of the unjust steward or unjust manager in Luke 16.
Yeah, that's well said. There's another parable, though, that has a direct application here, and it's the parable of the rich fool in Luke 12, who of course built bigger barns. How does that story connect here with the rich young ruler? I believe the rich young ruler was an example of the Luke 12 rich fool in action. Um there was nothing wrong with having barns suitable for one's agricultural needs.
And the typical Jewish barn was big enough to archive the Yield from last year's harvest that was necessary for next year's planting, as well as what the family would need in the intervening year between harvests. And the men in Luke twelve got crossways with God when he created bigger barns that were beyond his need for business capital and family maintenance. and k became a means by which he no longer had to work and maintain the partnership with the God of heaven, who would bring the rain and keep the the vermin at bay and partner with us in our ongoing income production. And so, this bigger Barnes business is the creation of a treasure. A storehouse in this world that God disallowed.
That God's plan was always: I'm going to provide all that you need for your family this year and for your capitalization next year. And then take the beyond blessing that I'm going to provide to you and distribute it. because undistributed assets are irrelevant. But this is a guy who said, you know what? I'm going to use those resources that go beyond need and capitalization.
And I'm going to use those to buy myself. A future that will not require any effort or faithfulness on my part. And God said, that's a fowl that will be. Uh the penalty will be the shortening of your life. because that's not the way I planned for the game to be played.
Mm. Bob, just 30 seconds left. Tie a bow on this. If someone wants to be rich in the right things and at the right time, what does it look like to start to shift our mindset? We know from our life as investors that the longer we're willing to lock up our resources, the more return we can expect to gain.
And the greatest long-term investment that God would see available to us is to invest in his kingdom. Wow. Powerful. Bob, amazing. We're so thankful for you, my friend, and grateful for your time today.
Thanks for being here. Thank you. That's Bob Schenck, the founder of the Masters Program. You can read more on this topic in Bob's article in the latest issue of our Faithful Stewart magazine. Become a partner and get every issue when you go to faithfy.com/slash partner.
We'll be back with your questions after this. The number 800-525-7000. Or if you'd prefer to email your question, send it to us at askrob at faithfield.com. I'm Rob West, and you're listening to Faith and Finance: biblical wisdom for your financial decisions. We'll be right back after this break.
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Great to have you with us today on Faith and Finance. We're taking your calls at 800-525-7000 to Georgia. David, go ahead. Yes, sir. Thank you, Rob, for taking my call.
Of course. I'm 59 years old, and I don't have any kind of retirement. savings at all. And I'm looking to the future. It's coming up quick retirement.
And basically, my question for you is. I already made a decision, talk it over with wife. I'm going to start putting $100 a week. away towards retirement. And I didn't know which would be the best retirement plan for me.
My work doesn't offer any kind of four hundred one K or any kind of retirement, and I've never had any. Got it.
Okay. Yeah, I love this. I mean, you've got to start somewhere, David, and just getting a systematic monthly contribution in place is you know, makes the most sense. How much do you think you'd be able to put in over a twelve month period? I think one hundred dollars a week, so what's that like five thousand a year?
Yeah, yeah.
So I would just use what's called a Roth IRA. Very easy to set up. I would probably go to the Schwab Intelligent Portfolios. Just put that in your search engine: Schwab Intelligent Portfolios. You'll answer a series of questions and it'll build what's called a RoboAdvisor.
You'd want to do that inside a Roth IRA, R-O-T-H. It's going to grow tax-free, and you can set it up to do $100 a week. I hope that's an encouragement to you. Thanks for your call. Pennsylvania is where we're going next.
Rebecca, go ahead. Thank you so much. It's great to talk with you. Just looking for some guidance on proper life insurance. My husband and I, we're in our early to mid forties, and we did a thirty year term when we were twenty and bought our first home.
And I know that that's not going to be nearly enough. It was like a three hundred thousand dollar policy for my husband. The house we purchased then was like $75,000. But we're in a new home and we have two children and I know we need to just get that all updated and it's just been bugging me that I know it's not taken care of, but I just feel overwhelmed and I'm not really sure where to even go or how much would be the right rule of thumb to have for coverage and all of that stuff. Yeah, yeah, well, it's a great question, Rebecca.
And I love that you have term policies in place. The 30-year policy was probably really cheap. I realize it's not a ton of coverage, and your situation has changed with your family and your assets and what it is you're trying to protect. But now is the time to go ahead and start looking at either layering another policy on top or just replacing it altogether. You're probably not going to want to do another 30-year policy.
It would probably be a 20-year policy, and it's probably going to be, you know, for quite a bit more in terms of the death benefit. I mean, the simple approach is to say: if one spouse died tomorrow, what income gap would exist and for how long? Because if either spouse is contributing to the family finances in terms of income and that income were to go away, what would it take in terms of a death benefit, if invested properly, that would generate or replace that amount of income and for what period of time? Because remember, you get to a point if you continue on the current track and assuming you're funding retirement in an appropriate way, maybe 10 to 15% of your income, and you're slowly eradicating all of your debt, including your home mortgage. The idea would be that you would get to retirement and the need for life insurance goes away.
Because you'd get to a place where you could answer that question: if one spouse died tomorrow, what income gap would exist? And the answer would be: there wouldn't be any gap. Because we have retirement assets, we have Social Security, you know, we've saved, we've paid down debt, and therefore there's no longer a need for life insurance. And then someone might say, well, but wasn't it all for not? And I would say, no, I mean, that's kind of the idea of insurance is we're offsetting the risk, even though we hope we never collect.
It's kind of like your homeowner's policy. You hope you never have to use it, but you're sure glad you've got it. And the same is true here for life insurance.
Now, some people try to mix their life insurance with their savings, and that's not my preferred approach. I'd rather you keep your savings separate, do it in a tax, you know, deferred environment, whether that's a Roth IRA or traditional or a 401k or 403B, save at the appropriate levels, but just buy pure insurance and keep the cost as affordable as you can and get enough coverage where it truly offsets the risk.
So you asked for a rule of thumb on how much life insurance.
Well, one approach would be to say, Let's just replace the income. And usually, we would say we would want 10 to 12 times the annual income while dependents rely on it.
So, if you're making $60,000 a year, you'd want somewhere between $600,000 and $750,000 in life insurance on that person. And if both of you are earning, you would want policies equal to that on each of you.
Some people add to that income replacement debt coverage.
So they say, let's add up the mortgage plus any other major debts plus future college costs. and add that to the 10 to 12 times the annual income. And then you could subtract any savings or investments or existing insurance if you want to. And ultimately, you'd come up with a goal for your death benefit. And then you'd say, okay, based on our age and our health status, you know, we're going to try to find a 20-year policy which would get you to your mid-60s in an affordable way, but making sure you have truly the amount of death benefit you need to offset that real risk that exists.
That if one of you were to pass away, you know, the family would be able to maintain its lifestyle. Does that make sense? Yes, it definitely does. Yes, it does. Thank you so much.
You're welcome. The only other question, then, Rebecca, is where do I go to get that? And you've got a couple of options. I mean, you could go online to Policy Genius or any one of the other online search vehicles and just look at which companies have the highest AM best rating combined with the lowest premium and just kind of shop it yourself. The other approach is to find an independent Insurance agent who works primarily in life insurance that could go out and shop this for you.
Because depending on your age and your health status, you know, one company might treat a certain health condition better than another.
Now, if both of you are relatively healthy, great. But if there's any kind of underlying health issues, you're going to want to shop it around because, again, not all companies treat each health issue the same.
So you may want to check in your church or maybe contact a certified kingdom advisor in Pennsylvania and ask for a referral to a life insurance agent who's independent. If you want to do that, go to findacka.com. But listen, glad you're asking the question. It's the right one to ask. You're not too late.
This is the perfect time for you to get that next policy that carries you into your 60s. God bless you.
Well, folks, thanks for tuning in today. We're so thankful for you inviting us into your story and asking your questions for your kind remarks about the program. I couldn't do this without the amazing team. We had Dan Anderson today, Amy Rios, Gabby T, and Jim Henry, plus the entire team here at Faith By that makes this happen every day. On behalf of them and so many more, I'm Rob West, and we'll see you next time.
Bye-bye. Faith in Finance is provided by FaithFi and listeners like you.
