You'd be amazed where the era of hypergrace can lead. Oh, and there's a big case before the Supreme Court. It's time for The Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and President of Fire School of Ministry.
Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Let's think about the words of Jesus.
Jesus said that we, the disciples, the believers, we are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, what good is it? Only good is to be trampled underfoot by people. In other words, it's of no use whatsoever. The question is, we, the believers in America, have we lost our saltiness?
What good are we doing? Is it any surprise that the world has so ignored and mocked us? One great reason is we have compromised our message. This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the line of fire, 866-34TRUTH.
That's 866-348-7884. Anything you want to question me on, anything you want to weigh in on, anything you want to challenge me on, the phone lines are now open. 866-345. Four. truth.
If you need clarification, by all means give me A call. You know If you've listened to the show for any length of time. that I believe That the greatest problem in America today is not so much The presence of darkness It's the absence of light. Yes, the darkness is dark. Yes, the world is worldly, and Yes, sinners sin.
That's to be expected. The problem is the light is not shining adequately. The night light is not shining brightly. The light is not shining publicly. The salt is not being salty.
So I personally believe That one of the greatest reasons America is so messed up and confused today. is because so much of the church is messed up and confused. And the reason so much of the church is messed up and confused is because so many of the leaders are messed up and confused. That means when we get our acts together as leaders, thank God for the many godly leaders throughout America. But when we get our act together much better corporately as leaders through the body.
The church will be healthier. As the church is healthier, the nation will be healthier. Not because we take over and impose our values on others, but because God's ways are good, and God's ways are ways of life, and God's ways are ways of truth. And when we rightly point people in that direction and live it out before them, it brings blessing. With it.
So I bring that up today. because uh I've seen yet another example of how doctrinal error leads to further doctrinal error. and then even to apostasy. And God is the judge when someone crosses the line into actual apostasy. or when they cross the line into bona fide heresy.
or when their own soul and life is endangered. before God. That is something that God explicitly can tell us, and we don't know at certain points where mercy ends and judgment begins. and how those things fully interface. when Jesus Speaks in Revelation 2 to a woman called Jezebel, either her actual name or the way she was derogatorily referred to.
It says, I've given her time to repent.
Well, how much time? Where is the clock as it's ticking? Only God knows that. But I'm talking about the nature of what's being taught, the nature of what's being taught. Believed.
And that is the real, real issue. And when I see compromise behind the pulpit, More and more and more. I know that It's going to have a negative effect on parts of the church. That in turn, like a nebula, have a negative effect on parts of the society. We'll give you a case in point when we come back right here on the line of fire.
Change the world. Change the world. Send it along. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown.
Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. By the way, I've got some audio clips I'm going to be playing in the second hour, some things happening on campuses, high school, college campuses that will Get your attention. Later this hour, going to be speaking with Attorney Matthew Farris about a very important case before the Supreme Court.
In the second hour, be speaking with James Robison. Who's scheduled tomorrow to be at a dinner with President Trump and other members of the Faith Advisory Council? And this is right around the time of the National Day of Prayer.
So this could be a significant meeting. We'll hear from James Robinson himself about. What he is hoping to accomplish, what he's looking for at this meeting.
So that's all coming your way today. But first, The era of hypergrace. Where it leads further compromise further. confusion. When I say hypergrace, I'm talking about An exaggerated grace message.
You say, well, you can't exaggerate grace. Actually, you can exaggerate everything. You can exaggerate anything. You can exaggerate God's love. Uh until you get to the point where there's no judgment or wrath.
You could exaggerate God's justice until you get to the point where there's no mercy. Paul writing to the Roman believers in Romans 11 urged them to look at both the kindness and severity of God.
So, you could teach kindness in an exaggerated way, you could teach severity in an exaggerated way. And as Paul is teaching about grace, he anticipates misunderstandings and addresses them. No, I'm not saying this, and I'm not saying this. If Paul found it important to give caveats, how much more should we find it important to say, now to be clear, I'm not saying this, I'm not saying this, I am saying this. Paul went out of his way to do that.
Hypergrace takes the glorious biblical message of grace and goes beyond. what scripture says. If you're looking to study this more, to get in-depth theological interaction. and serious in-depth study of key passages. Get my book, Hyper Grace.
If you want to read things on a more popular level, a little simpler level, get my book, The Grace Controversy, that answers 12 of the most common questions about grace that's shorter and written in a more popular form. Hyper Grace is more in-depth with more documentation backing up every word that we say in the book. Hypergrace has extreme positions that it holds to.
Some are not that dangerous.
Some really are dangerous. But the core of the hypergrace message is that when Jesus died on the cross. He paid for your sins past, present, future. I affirm that and agree with that. But Hypergrace goes on to say the moment you are born again.
God not only forgives every sin you've ever committed, but at that moment, forgives all sins you will ever commit in the future. Meaning. That forgiveness is already appropriated for your entire life the moment you're saved. Because of which, you don't need to confess your sins to God and ask Him to forgive you, because you're already forgiven. meaning the Holy Spirit will not convict you of sin.
Because you're already forgiven. Meaning, there's nothing you could possibly do to mess up your relationship with God because you're already forgiven.
Now, this is taught to varying degrees, and some take it to further and further extremes. But you have to realize that even when hyper-grace teachers say, now look, grace is not a license to sin. Amen. Even when they say grace empowers you not to sin, amen. The problem is because they teach these other parts of the message.
Because they teach that the moment you're born again, all your sins, past, present, future, are pronounced forgiven the moment you're saved. Because they say that, it's very easy to compromise. It's very easy in times of temptation to think, well, I'm already forgiven. It's very easy to dismiss the conviction of the Holy Spirit because you say, well, the Holy Spirit doesn't convict of sin because he only convicts the world. He doesn't convict me.
I'm a believer. I'm already forgiven. You see that, you understand that, how that can happen. And If the argument is, well, you can't add anything to it. If you add anything to it, then that's works and it's works-based and it's no longer grace.
But what about believing? Do I have to add my faith to what Jesus did on the cross?
Well, yeah, well, now I'm adding something. Extreme hypergrace teachers emphasize when Jesus said on the cross in John 19:30, it is finished.
Well, if it's finished, then there's nothing to add to it.
Well, if that's the case. If Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, and there's nothing to add to it, then doesn't that mean the whole world is automatically saved? One Hypergrace teacher who came against my book, Hypergrace. I haven't written a refutation to his stuff yet. I I still hope to one day set the record straight and correct the many errors in his response to me.
and then affirm our points of agreement. He says it's true. That his teaching could lead to universalism. In other words, That because Jesus died for the sins of the whole world, and there's nothing to add to what He did, therefore, the whole world is automatically saved. or will ultimately be saved.
He said it's true that what he teaches could lead to universalism, but he personally doesn't believe it. and and teachers against it. Oh. It could lead in that direction. How interesting.
How enlightening. And it often does. lead in that direction. Oh, I don't think the majority. of hypergrace preachers right now are going that way.
But a growing minority Or So, I'm not going to mention names because I have not tried to reach out to this brother yet personally.
So, I'm not going to mention any names or speak in a way where you could try to figure out who I'm talking about. And my guess. as most of you would not have heard of of this brother of whom I'm speaking. A friend on Facebook sends me a note yesterday. about this brother because he's known him over the years as a pastor.
He had a church. and wrote about The goodness of God. And was a strong advocate of hypergrace. I challenged his views in my book. Uh we interacted a little bit.
That was the extent of it.
So This friend on Facebook says he has he now teaches that there's no hell. He doesn't have a church anymore. And he went on with More information.
Some family stuff, some other things that would be very sad. I said, Well, this is sad if true. Again, someone sent it to me, but I don't know that it's accurate or true. I I just decided to check. And sure enough, I went to his Facebook page, And he's teaching not just that there is no eternal punishment.
But basically the idea of hell fire. Or or a god Putting anyone in the flames or that kind of judgment is not possible and had some clear statements. That because Jesus died for all, then all are in Him and all are seated in heavenly places. As far as I could tell, He was explicitly saying that everyone is saved. that everyone will go to heaven.
That everyone is already redeemed because Jesus already died for them. Friends, that is heresy. That is a dangerous doctrine Is it a doctrine of demons? Sure it is. The idea That because Jesus died for the sins of the world, therefore the whole world is automatically saved?
And everyone is guaranteed eternal life in heaven. You better believe that is false doctrine, doctrine of demons.
So I I read down another post on the Facebook page. And it was attacking the sacrificial system. Based on a gross misinterpretation of Jeremiah 7, a passage I had to wrestle with a lot in my Jeremiah commentary, a controversial passage. But basically throwing out the entire testimony of the Torah, and other related books, and based on a misunderstanding of Jeremiah seven, alleging that God Did not institute the sacrificial system. He wanted just an intimate love relationship with his people.
And that they instead wanted blood sacrifices, and that's why God instituted it. It makes me wonder what he'll ultimately say about the cross. I mean, why did Jesus have to die if blood sacrifices are unnecessary? Why did Jesus have to die? unless to take our place.
And I have no idea what kind of following this man has. But I do know. That it's one of the reasons that I wrote Hyper Grace and then the Grace controversy to sound the alarm. And thankfully, when I met with Pastor Joseph Prince early this year. He would be the best known grace or hypergrace teacher in the world today.
We agreed to speak against counterfeit grace. and to clearly renounce that. Pastor Prince does believe that people are lost without Jesus. He does believe there is hell punishment in the future. He does believe that we are to grow in holiness, that we are made perfectly righteous the moment we're saved.
In other words, pronounced not guilty in God's sight, but we are to grow in holiness. Holiness is progressive. That's something that other hyper-grace teachers vehemently Denounce And then we had areas of difference. And there's areas of difference. I'm hoping over time that he'll see differently.
And I guess he is hoping I'll see my side differently. But the point is we agree to raise our voices in warning. And My hope. is that those in the hypergrace camp will either Modify their message. and swing closer to the truth while bringing a glorious revelation of grace that we need to hear.
That's my hope. Otherwise, you're going to keep swinging out into apostasy like this gentleman did. God have mercy. This is serious. Angel World.
Give us strict to always do what's right. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Thanks friends for joining us on the line of fire. This is Michael Brown. You said, what was that clip that you were just playing? That was from May Day rally in Philadelphia.
So this was yesterday. This was folks who were Uh At this rally for workers, May Day celebrating workers and things like that. And I said on the radio yesterday when a caller brought this up. I I don't I don't know exactly What's going to happen at these marches, but Trust me. They're going to turn hostile.
To the Trump administration.
Somehow, this is going to be another excuse to bash Trump.
So, what were they chanting? In that clip we just played, kill Trump, kill Pence. Yeah, kill Trump, kill Pence. That's what they were chanting. And Dennis Prager has an article.
Uh Respected Jewish thinker Dennis Prager, of course, national radio host. Will the Second Civil War turn violent? You know, he doesn't write these things lightly. In a recent column, I made the case that Americans are fighting the Second Civil War, the deep chasm that has opened up between the left, not liberals, the left, and the rest of the country. is so wide and so unbridgeable that there is no other way to describe what is happening.
But I noted that, at least thus far, unlike the first Civil War, this war is not violent. Unfortunately, there's not reason to believe that violence is coming. In fact, it's already here. But as of now, it's only coming from one direction. Left-wing thugs engage in violence and threats of violence with utter impunity.
They shut down speakers at colleges, block highways, bridges, and airport terminals, take over college buildings and offices, occupy state capitals, and terrorize individuals at their Holmes And on and on it goes. No, I don't believe that we're supposed to be fighting back violence with violence. I believe we are to address the violence, expose the violence, set a better example ourselves. Call on law enforcement to do what is right regarding opposing this violence. And Let let the ugliness of the so-called progressives be exposed.
I'm going to come back to Hyper Grace in a moment and tie this all together in fact. 866-348-7. Eight, eight, four. But yesterday I spoke on the radio about a humanist writer on writing on Huffington Post. And explaining why it was wrong for the United Methodist Church.
to use the Bible as a moral guide. Yeah, pretty outrageous.
Now I did tweet him. And I asked him, would he like to come on the air and interact about his article and my response? I talked about it on the air and I wrote an article in response as I said I would. You can read it. A Huffington Post humanist urges the church to stop using the Bible as a moral guide.
You can read it by going to Ask Drbrown.org. Askdrbrown.org. Just click in the digital library and you can read this article. I think you'll find it important and very helpful. But this is the spirit of the left, not just saying you're wrong, but saying you don't have a right to believe what you believe.
This is a spirit of the radical left that says our views are so superior to yours that yours. don't even have the right to be held to. Or you hold them in private, but not in anything that affects public life in any way. It is the height of intolerance, it is the height of. Uh exclusivity.
It is the opposite of diversity.
Now just clarification, the crowd chanting, they were using the F word against Trump and Pence, and someone was chanting, one guy was chanting, kill Trump, kill pence. This is type of madness that is out there. This over-the-top, violent, oppressive response. You say, okay, what in the world does that have to do with hyper-grades? Let me come back.
to a central point here. In an interest in the interest of somehow Pleasing the world, appeasing the world, winning the world, avoiding conflict with the world. Many pastors and leaders have modified their message, mollified their message, softened their message, compromised their message. They avoid the offense of the cross. They avoid the conflict.
and many sincerely think this is the way to win the world.
So rather than confronting the world with sin rather than preaching holiness, Rather than declaring the justice of God, rather than speaking of future judgment, we basically don't touch those themes. And just want to talk about love, love, love.
Now, I believe we need to ground people in the love of God. My whole life is grounded in a deep sense of love, being loved by the Father. If you can't relate to that, boy, my heart goes out to you because that's the foundation of my whole life that I'm loved by a good father. And that my life has meaning and value in his sight, and I live to do his will. But I also fear and reverence my father because he's a holy God.
Finney, Charles Finney, said this In 1873. Brethren, our preaching will bear its legitimate fruits. If immorality prevails in the land, the fault is ours in a great degree. If there is a decay of conscience, the pulpit is responsible for it. If the public press lacks moral discrimination, the pulpit is responsible for it.
If the church is degenerate and worldly, the pulpit is responsible for it. If the world loses its interest in religion, the pulpit is responsible for it. If Satan rules in our halls of legislation, the pulpit is responsible for it. If our politics become so corrupt that the very foundations of our government are ready to fall away, the pulpit is responsible for it. Let us not ignore this fact, my dear brethren, but let us lay it to heart and be thoroughly awake to our responsibility in respect to the morals of this nation.
Now, this quote I use. In my forthcoming book, Saving a Sick America. I believe this book will deeply stir you and inspire you. It comes out in September. And this is a chapter called Restoring Thunder to Our Pulpits.
Obviously, in Finney's Day. The pulpit had even more influence in America than it does today. But the pulpit still has influence, first over those who listen to the message, the teaching, the preaching that comes from our pulpits in person and through TV, radio. Intranet, etc. books and other other ways.
So the pulpit still is greatly influential, and there is a degree that the pulpit is influential speaking to the world as well. Our society is in chaos. And one great reason is the church is not holding the banner high. One great reason is the Church is not speaking with moral clarity. One great reason is when we do speak with moral clarity we we normally do it hitched to one particular political party.
which which then lessens our impact and our ability to to to do the work of God and the power of God because everything becomes politicized. And then often we are in a retreat mode or in a mode of defeatism, everything's going down. Friends, this is why we need awakening in the church before there can be awakening in the society. This is why our great emphases have to be revival in the church and evangelism in the world. And this is how change is going to come.
Otherwise. Things things could get bad in Charles Finney. Friends Charles Finney. Warned. before the Civil War.
that if Christians put abolition first, and revival second. that there would be a bloody civil war. Boy, was he terribly right. If we had put revival first and abolition second, he believed that change could have come through the gospel and could have spared us so much suffering and pain. is the result of our sin.
In America. We go back, we come back, we're going straight to the Supreme Court. Major news. Stay here. It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr.
Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Thanks, friends, for joining us today on the line of fire, 866-348-7. Eight, eight, five. Yeah. Major case before the Supreme Court. And Michael Ferris, President, CEO, and General Counsel for the Alliance Defending Freedom, is joining us now to explain exactly what is going on.
Mike, thanks so much for coming on the line of fire today. Dr. Brown, it's great to be with you. Thank you so much. All right, uh explain to us what's happening with the Supreme Court and why this particular case is so important regarding religious liberty.
The case involving Trinity Lutheran Preschool really explores the issue of whether or not religious people and religious organizations can be treated as second class citizens in this country. The factual background is that Missouri has a playground safety program. Uh whereby um Nonprofit preschools of any sort can apply for a reimbursement. For a re use of recycled tires to put down a rubberized surface on playground. Uh play areas so that when the kids fall they don't break their arms and legs and heads and so on.
Um and the um Um They have a competitive bidding process that's all Neutral safety, recycling-oriented criteria. And this Lutheran church applied for the program, was rated fourth in the state on the particular year in question. and would have been funded. The top fifteen were funded that year. Um but because they were a church, they were told, no, you can't be uh funded.
Uh and so the sole question before the court is If the state starts a general program that's available to everybody, can you keep the religious people and religious organizations out merely because they're religious? It's a very important principle.
Alright, so where do things stand right now? We had an oral argument just a couple of weeks ago. in the Supreme Court. I was there as David Cortman from Alliance Defending Freedom argued the case on behalf of the school.
So we are the law firm representing the church. Um And it went really well. I I expected it to be uh much closer than it appears to be and you know judging how a case is going to come out from listening to an oral argument. Is an an exact science or a an art form of some sort, but uh the Um Reporters that do this routinely, including Nina Totenberg from NPR and Supreme Court blogs that are Considered insider kind of information, basically said, it really does look like the church is aimed for a victory here. And it might be as high as 7 to 2.
The questions asked by Justice Kagan and even Justice Breyer. seem to be very favorable toward the church and Um surprisingly so to me at least and and um So I'm very, very hopeful for a good outcome. And was Justice Gorsuch involved in this already? He was. It was the uh I believe the second day of of him hearing cases.
And he didn't ask any questions of our attorney, but toward the end of the of the hour hearing, he asked a couple of questions of the attorney representing the state of Missouri. And um they were basically to the effect of I don't think you've answered the questions that Justice Kagan put to you. And the questions that Justice Kagan put forward were. you know, very strong uh Okay. pro-religious freedom kind of questions.
And so uh he was basically picking up that point and hammering it hard.
So it was a It was in a favorable light, and this is how I interpreted his questions. Got it. All right. We've got to take a quick break, and then I want to find out the larger implications of this. What is the rationale behind saying no, this church-based facility cannot get government funding?
Where is this potentially going? And Can the Supreme Court set a precedent that it's going to stick? We'll be right back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I'm speaking with Michael Farris. He is President, CEO, and General Counsel of the Alliance Defending Freedom. If you don't know the ADF, For years now, they have been on the front lines of standing for religious liberties.
Standing for freedom of speech and conscience in America. And uh in the midst of key cases all around the country, state after state, and here cases right before the Supreme Court.
So Mike, the question of the logic of the state of Missouri Saying, no, you're not going to get funding because of separation of church and state. For many Christians, it's very difficult to wrap their minds around it.
So, what are these people thinking? Are they just anti-Christian? Do they have some legitimate constitutional argument? What's your take?
Well, this is an interplay between the federal establishment clause and state establishment clauses. And there are some differences between them. I argued the case before the Supreme Court that probably is the strongest precedent on the Federal Establishment Clause. And it was many years ago now when the state of Washington prohibited a blind student from using his vocational program for bind reel rehabilitation Go to Bible college to become a pastor. And they said that that violated the federal establishment clause to let him do that.
And I argued the case, and the Supreme Court ruled 9-0: no, it does not violate the establishment clause.
So if you think of the GI Bill as a good example of the GI bill, people Take their GI benefits, and they can go to Bible college, they can go to seminary, they can go to anything. You know, they're not limited by subject matter. And so that's the context that we're in: is when there's a broad government program and it's accepted, and the state of Missouri did not contend otherwise, that the federal establishment clause permits this kind of thing. Thing?
Well, Missouri has a more stringent version of the establishment clause that was a part of a number of states that wrote these very strict Uh provisions in an era of anti-Catholic fervor.
So it was really an effort to to crush Catholic schools, Catholic uh colleges and and other things that that uh that's the historical uh backdrop uh uh of These provisions are called Blaine amendments.
Now, this particular blain amendment from Missouri has already been ruled unconstitutional. As applied in a in a somewhat similar context. There was this the Missouri University of Missouri at Kansas City prohibited a Christian student group from using the facilities under this same Blaine amendment. Uh state constitutional provision. The Supreme Court rules.
And with Marr versus Vincent, that the Missouri Constitution when you apply it in this fashion. violates equal protection and freedom of speech. And that's what we're basically arguing here, is that there's an equal protection provision That is honored in the free exercise clause, and then there's a straight up equal protection clause itself. Is when you open this program to everybody. Um then you can't discriminate against religious people and religious organizations.
That's the issue. You know, if the state of Missouri didn't want to fund private anything, then that's its business. It could nobody could sue and say, you've got to fund me. Because there's no right to be funded. But Once they start funding people, The question is, who can you kick out?
you know, could you kick people out because of their race? Of course not. Could you people? people out because of their gender? Of course not.
Why can you kick people out because they're religion? Religion is not some kind of special you know, a mark on your forehead. that get you kicked out of jail? General broad programs like training blind people, like the GI Bill, like playground safety for kids. Got it.
So it seems, if we look back at the Hobby Lobby case, that there have been a number of significant rulings from the Supreme Court in favor of religious liberty. At the same time that the court has gone the other way on redefining marriage and things like that. Is that simply because religious liberty is so deeply entrenched in our Constitution and in our history? Because it's tough to read the direction of the court as a whole.
Well uh Hobby Lobby is an interesting case to point out. Hobby Lobby won their case not on the free exercise of religion from the Constitution, but on the Religious Freedom Restoration Act. And that act was necessary because of a bad decision of the Supreme Court on the free exercise of religion in 2000. And um I mean I Very familiar with it because I'm the guy who named the act. I was the now that sounds fancier than it was.
We had the first meeting about it, and somebody said, What do we call this thing? And I said, Well, why don't we call it the Religious Freedom Restoration Act? And they said, Anybody else have any ideas? Nobody had any ideas, so I named it. But I was also the chairman of the group of lawyers who drafted it, the co-chairman, along with Mark Stern from the American Jewish Committee.
And and so um That was necessary because of a very bad decision by the Supreme Court.
So, partly it's been a change of personnel in the Supreme Court.
So the Hobby Lobby case was closely divided. It shouldn't have been closely divided. It shouldn't have had to be using this act that we wrote. It should have been able to use the First Amendment. But there's a lot of bad decisions that lower courts are making on uh religious liberty that are being um thwarted uh this week Um Supreme Court refused to hear a case from California where the therapy on, you know, you want to take your kids to a counselor because they're.
wondering about whether they're homosexual, you can't do it in California. And so that's a religious liberty and a parents' rights kind of case. And so there's just a lot of. cases that they duck. Um And um They're very important.
And so I wouldn't think that this is a great era for religious liberty. It it's a very, very difficult area still. there's a lot of coercion that the left is willing to do, and the lower courts are willing to get away with. Right, so the case in California, for our listeners that might not be familiar, it's illegal, the state of California, for a minor to To get counseling. Let's say you've got a 17-year-old boy.
He has unwanted same-sex attractions. Let's say he was sexually abused when he was 10 and he's been in some confusion about his sexuality since then. And he does not affirm his same-sex attraction. He wants to marry a woman and have children. He wants to get to the root of his issues and see if there can be help sitting with a professional psychologist or psychiatrist or professional counselor.
It's illegal in California, a couple of other states as well now, for minor to do that. On the flip side, if an eight-year-old identifies as a boy in a girl's body and wants to start to get treatments for hormone blockers, the parents affirm that at the age of 10 and then get prepped for sex change surgery as they get older and all that. That's all perfectly legal.
So it's really cultural madness. But the Supreme Court, when this was challenged in California, they refused to hear the case. How much can we read into that? Because that is a very serious blow.
Well, I I think we can read a lot into it. And and and uh Say that Parents' rights have not been going in the right direction on the whole, freedom of association and anything to do with homosexuality. is been going not very well for us for Number of years. And it's just the logic of it. You can you know, gender is fluid unless you want to try to be normal.
Yep. In that case, no. You can't change. You can't get any help to, you know. move in the direction of normalcy.
That's forbidden. Um and so, you know, what craziness creates rules like that? Yeah, i is it possible I know you have a background with with home school and legal defense. Is it possible that the government could want to crack down on what's taught in Christian schools or even in home schools regarding these areas? It it's it's Very possible.
There are law review articles Published on that very topic. A professor at Emory University, Martha Albertson Finneman, professor at George Washington Law School, named Catherine Ross, professor at Northwestern University in Chicago, whose name is escaping me right now. All three have written major law review articles arguing that that the philosophical Um direction that Christian home schoolers are going in is so Dangerous to the pluralism that they're trying to force on everybody that they should be either philosophically regulated or outright banned. And so, um And what appears in law reviews today is what's going to appear in the courts in ten years. Those are just you know, like clockwork.
You can you can you can be guaranteed that because that's what's happened in so many other areas. And a school that you helped found, St. Patrick Henry College. That could get challenged with accreditation issues and other things like that as well, correct? Absolutely.
You know, lawyers are going to start losing their licenses to practice if you don't affirm. you know, that you know, we're going to worship at the at the altar of same sex marriage and and you know, say this is all equal. Um you know, what about our right to dissent and say, you know what, we still think this is a moral sin. And we don't want to be a part of it. Uh you know They they have won for the time being at least.
the right to do their own thing.
Well, yeah, they're not content with that. They want to force us to join in their celebration. And a lot of this is a matter of moral conscience. We'll not do so. Yeah.
Well, sir, we deeply appreciate what you're doing on the front lines. Friends, go to ADF Legal, adflegal.org. To find out more. By God's grace, people will hear the wake-up call and stand up. Thank you so much for your service.
We deeply appreciate it. Thank you very much. Gain to the world O God of burning, cleansing flames. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown.
Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. You might say to me, that's. That's scary.
What this attorney Michael Ferris. President, CEO, General Counsel of Alliance Defending Freedom. What he just said is scary. Uh-huh. That's why we've been sounding the alarm for so many years.
That's why we've been issuing the wake up call for so many years. That's why we've been urging people to stand and speak and act while they have the ability to do it. Remember, Dietrich Bonhoeff first said the ultimate test of a moral society is the kind of world. that it leaves to its children The big question is, what kind of world are we leaving to our Children. or grandchildren, or great grandchildren.
You say, well, that's it. I mean, that's Jesus coming any minute. It's all going downhill. Listen, listen. I've heard that for over 45 years.
If we had stood up and spoken out, if we had been more engaged, if we had been more alert, 45 years ago. If we didn't have the defeatist mentality 45 years ago, we'd be in much better shape. Today. By all means, pray with expectation for the return of the Lord. By all means, live in readiness for his return.
Please, friends. If we can't stop the cultural slide. At least let's slow it down. See how? What do we do?
First, seek out earnestly in your own life. For personal awakening, so that you can be rightly related to him and rightly passionate about what matters to him. And living right And raising your family, raise your kids right, and devoted to your spouse right as a single, setting a good example.
So we first get our own house in order. Secondly, we get involved, we make a difference. When we go to win the lost, we prioritize evangelism. We we stand up for what's right. We we shine as lights in dark places.
We care for those in need. We we don't just think about ourselves. We do these things and and We recognize the major issues of the day. With the church. is under ever increasing pressure.
and we stand up for what's right. Listen, friends, there are a million things. I'd rather talk about than some of the cultural issues. I there are a million things I'd rather give my attention and energy to. The years that I spent researching and writing A Queer Thing Happened to America, those were pages.
painful and difficult hours. I'm not painting myself as some martyr. I'm just saying it's not the kind of thing you get excited about. Like, hey, I'm going to write a commentary on the book of Isaiah. Hey, I'm going to write a book on effective prayer.
Hey, I'm going to write a book of great testimonies of Jewish people who come to Jesus. No, we're talking about. Writing on subjects that are difficult subjects and painful subjects and subjects that are going to uh upset people on every side. And subjects that are dark to research. I wouldn't read anything that was overtly sexual, pornographic, or anything like that, and researching these things, but just so much of the activism was so ugly, and where it was going was so ugly, and attacks on the Bible and rewriting of Scripture so perverse.
It's painful. This is not the kind of stuff you say, hey, I think I'm just going to devote years to studying this. No, it's 'cause you want to help people and 'cause you care about what's right. But I clearly saw over a decade ago and you didn't have to be prophetic to see it. I clearly saw over a decade ago, and in certain ways many years before that, That LGBT activism, or then especially gay and lesbian activism.
Had become the principal threat to freedom of religion, speech, and conscience in America. You can go on mocking it if you want.
Some think, oh yeah, I don't believe that for a second. Fine. Go on, mock it, say what you want to say, feel free. I'm just speaking reality to you. And here you have a leading attorney confirming these very things.
So we've got to wake up, get equipped. Get equipped. Get a queer thing happen to America or get outlasting a gay revolution and for ministry to those struggling. Can you be gay and Christian? Get on the website, get on askdrbrown.org, and start searching through the digital library.
It's there for you, friends. It's there for you. You don't have to pay to watch the videos. You don't have to pay to read the articles. You don't have to pay to listen to the radio show.
It's there for you. So get equipped. Get equipped. Find out what the issues are. Find out how to stand.
Find out what's happening in your kids' school. Interact with people on social media. Stand up. When someone's taking a stand, stand with them. We have an important interview scheduled for tomorrow from an ex-gay leader.
who's really challenging the system in in terms of their discrimination. When it comes to helping people with unwanted same-sex attraction, it's important. But you've got to understand it, it's like David about one inch tall taking on a thousand-foot-tall Goliath. That's how it feels in the natural. We need God's backing and God's grace.
And here's a great way to get equipped. and to stand with us because you know by God's grace we're on the front lines here. And we're speaking with compassion and we're speaking with truth. We care about people. And we're standing up for righteousness and what is right in the society.
Here's a great way for you to get equipped. and then to stand with us at the same time. We have a wonderful series of six lectures. About owed seven, eight hours in each presentation. Six different key leaders Our school of cultural engagement that we did over a six-week period at Fire School of Ministry a few years back.
Joe Dallas, one of the number one teachers in the country, taught on sexual purity. John Rankin. a brilliant thinker and theologian. Gave us answers for the questions of this world from the book of Genesis. Joanne Franco with the Alliance Defending Freedom.
You just heard Michael Farris from the ADF. Joanne Franco. talking about separation of church and state issues and what Bill of Rights and Constitution actually had to say about these things. Pat Mahoney with a great call for cultural involvement. Frank Turek on cultural apologetics.
And then yours truly on a call to preach a confrontational gospel. I believe it's over 40 hours of lectures, normally $120 on audio CD, but we're sending that to you as our gift to equip you and strengthen you and help you when you become a torchbearer this month. When you become a monthly supporter, that means you put aside a dollar a day or more. Per month, so $30 or more per month. We want to send you the entire School of Cultural Engagement as our way of saying, Here, we want to sew into you and equip you and help you understand the issues and be on the front lines and make a difference.
And then every month, I'm going to send you a new message to build you up and encourage you. Every month, you can get on our website, and we have online classes that have been taught on revival, holiness, and Jewish roots, and other things like that.
Some audio, some video. You can enjoy those for free. You also get a 15% discount in our online bookstore.
So be as generous as you can. Stand with us. Every month, I also send out an insider prayer letter. To let you know what's happening in ministry, key testimonies, prayer needs, what's coming next.
So let's stand together and make a difference. Will you join us today? If you've been blessed by the radio broadcast over the years, we are supported by you. When we put all these materials for free on the website, it is to minister to you, and it's through the help. of our support team.
So join our support team today. Go to askdrbrown.org. You'll see right on the homepage how you can join us, askdrbrown.org. Or click on donate to become a monthly supporter. Together, we're making a difference.
The gospel is the power of God to save and transform. The latest example of campus insanity, wild, and an important meeting with faith leaders and the president. It's time for The Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and President of Fire School of Ministry.
Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Do you use an alarm in the morning to get up?
Do you? I I do. Sit on my cellphone. Uh Why do you use an alarm?
Well, because without the alarm you might sleep too late, right? Correct. And what does the alarm do? It wakes us up. This is Michael Brown.
One of the reasons I'm on the radio is to be an alarm. to sound the alarm. To sound the wake-up call, because many of us are slumbering. Many of us get so caught up in the things of this world, or so busy, or so tired, or so distracted, We're so discouraged or whatever it is that Oh can't slumbering, not really alert and awake. You have many warnings in Scripture to be alert and to be awake, especially those who are leaders in the body and leaders in society.
All the more are we set as watchmen on the wall to be alert and to be awake.
So, I want to do my best to be a holy wake-up call today. Welcome, welcome to the broadcast. If you have a question you'd like to ask me, if you'd like to weigh in with the subject, or if you differ with me, 866-34TRUTH-866-348-7877. Eight. Eight.
Four. There are some Who sank that we are completely delusional. when we talk about The Assault on Religious Freedoms in America Today. There are some who think we are completely delusional. When we talk about the extraordinary liberalism on our campus is when I say liberalism, I I mean left leftist extremism.
And how there is an outright suppression of Religious ideas and biblical faith on campus. People say, just crazy. You're making this up. You guys just have all the control and power. Actually,.
There is an ongoing war against freedom of religion, speech, and conscience in America. It is absolutely undeniable. It is well documented. In my book, A Queer Thing Happened to America, I had a lengthy chapter called Big Brother. watching and he really is gay.
Talking about the direct assault on freedom of religion, speech, and conscience from gay and lesbian activists and their allies. It was a long chapter. It was a long chapter. The book itself, 700 pages with 1,500 endnotes. And I said, the problem is I could have made this chapter the length of the whole book, and that still wouldn't have been enough.
And since they came out in 2011, I could have probably written a book a year. with with more examples. And a book that length every year just with examples. Of the attacks on our freedoms. What about campuses?
What's happening on our campuses?
Well, I did a talk last week at a community college in North Carolina. Afterwards, the professor there a professor of ethics and religion. took us out to lunch, took me and my assistant Dylan out to lunch.
Now here he is in a conservative area of North Carolina, He is at a community college teaching ethics and religion. He said in his class He could not say Jesus opposed homosexual practice. He would not be allowed to say that as a professor of ethics and religion in his class. I asked him, Would you be able to say if you had believed it? Jesus affirmed homosexual practice.
He said, Oh, yeah, that I could say. That I could say. but I couldn't say what's true. That he he opposed it. Yeah, friends, I'm not making this stuff up.
A professor from Virginia called me years back on the radio. And she said, because she does not teach religion or religion-related subjects, she can't talk about God in any way in her class. Can't mention him, bring him up. because it's not her. Oh, but if she was an atheist wanted to attack God in other class, no problem.
It's fire we want, for fire we please. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr.
Michael Brown. Let me give you some examples of what is happening on college campuses.
Now look. I speak with college students all the time. I read what's happening on campuses all the time. And I'm a professor myself. Although primarily in seminary, university, Bible school settings.
But I'm quite aware of what's happening on campuses and interacting with many on campus all the time.
So, Todd Starren's reports: here is a school. In where is the school? Northern Arizona University. And Mark Holden, 22-year-old history major. is sitting in front row of a lecture hall.
and his professor, Heather Mortell, Tells him it's like six minutes before class time, put your Bible away. Sitting there reading the Bible, she tells him to put the Bible away.
So Pragma tells us that she doesn't want you sitting in front of her because you've got you know a Bible out, right?
So um I don't know what the dynamics is going on in the classroom. Um I mean the real key is to make sure that you know the class is able to go on and that you are in the classroom. I think that's really sort of my prerogative here right now.
So she doesn't want me in the front because I have my Bible out? No, I think she I mean Why why do you have your Bible on anymore? I'm just reading before class.
Okay. I mean class hasn't even started yet. I'm reading my Bible. Right.
So class is gonna stop soon? Yeah, I mean not gonna f another five minutes.
Okay. So Yeah. Will you will you will you put your Bible? I always do every day. I mean I read the Bible before class and I put it before class starts.
Okay. Well let me get out and then let's see what we can do about it, okay? Sure.
Okay, that. That was the department chairman. who was then summoned by Professor Mortel, That's Derek Heng speaking with the student, Mark Holvin. Yeah. What what'd you what'd you have your Bible out?
Wh wh what were you reading the Bible? Uh yeah. I mean this this is Remarkable. It's yet another Example Yet another example of leftist extremists. According to Professor Martel's biography, She's a noted scholar who is working on an essay titled, quote, The Gender Amazon.
indigenous female masculinity in the early modern European representations of contact. She also teaches classes on global queer history and feminist theory. Yeah. Okay, I I'm an educator myself. I'm all for research.
I'm all for exploring interesting topics. But you gotta be kidding me. The gender Amazon Indigenous female masculinity in early modern European representations of contact, Hi. Could this be? why she didn't like him having a Bible out in the front row.
So this happened back in February, but came to light only recently after campus reform reported on it and the information was turned over to congressional candidate Kevin Kavanaugh. And then he provided Todd Storrens with the interview. And uh an anyway they he ended up being moved to a different seat All right, for the remainder of the class, I will ask you to move to one of the desks along the wall by the door. The role sheet will be passed to you. You will make sure that students who come in late Sunday, and I'll also require that you respect me and the other students in the class by acting.
in a civil manner. In a separate email to the entire class, she vowed to reinstate civility in the classroom. Quote, I want this to be clear. Hate speech does not meet the definition of respectful discussion and will not be tolerated. In law, hate speech is any speech, gesture, or conduct, writing or display, which is forbidden because it may incite violence or presidential action or by protected individual or group or because it disparages or intimidates a protected individual or group.
Wow. Perhaps, sitting in the front row reading the Bible, that is some form of hate speech, because the Bible is filled with hate speech. This is happening on our campuses. Friends. If you have kids that are on their way to college, young people, if you're on your way to college, If you're going to a secular school, especially if you're going to be leaving home and staying there, you better know what you're getting in for.
You better expect hostility to what you believe. I had a guest on a few weeks ago who wrote a whole book on the issue of going to college. In fact, oh, hang on. It is. Yeah, I had to reach way down to get it.
Sorry about that. Welcome to College by Jonathan Morrow, a Christ Follower's Guide for the Journey. Know what's going to come your way. And unless you're really called there, consider going to a Christian school instead. You don't have to get that degree for that prestigious university to fulfill the calling of God in your life.
And and you're going to be bombarded by the world in a way you never have been before, because there's going to be all kinds of promiscuity and drugs and alcohol. Maybe you haven't been around that because you've been separated from it the way you've been raised.
Now it could be your roommate that's that's like that. And you're going to have a philosophy class or a history class or a math class. It'll just be: you've got a hostile atheist or agnostic professor. And next thing, they're coming after you, even though it's unrelated to the class material. This is what is to be expected, and this has gone on for many, many years.
In my book, Saving a Sick America, I have strategies for what we can do with schools. And how we should be living. But, friends, this is serious, serious business.
So, Um Here is a high school. All right. Uh a high school In Downington, Pennsylvania. All right, now it turns out that this. assistant principal has been put on administrative leave.
but there were pro life activists in front of his school quite legally. And uh this was April 21st. And he got very upset with their presence, started screaming and cursing at them. He's also openly gay, which adds into the picture here. And they had every right legally to be where they were.
But listen to some of what he has to say. Let's start with clip number one. We're actually just exposing the Holocaust that's happening in America. There's no Holocaust happening in America. There actually is.
Talk about a Holocaust happening in America. Go into an inner city and talk to the po the poor and other friends. These are image bearers of God. You can go to hell where they are too. Don't talk to my students.
Do you not understand what I say? Do not talk to my students. Yeah. A free world, free speech. Of course they can talk to the students.
They're not going on property where they didn't belong. They were standing where they could legally. And students come out, they could speak about these things. Oh, yeah. Go to the inner cities too and look at the underprivileged there, but also go to the inner cities and look at the high percentage of abortion of African Americans.
Is that right? Is that good? Is that healthy? Is that not part of a black genocide?
So it it goes on. Clip number two.
So, you need to turn to Jesus Christ. He can set you free from your sin. Listen here, son. All right. I'm as gay as the day is long and twice as sunny.
I don't give a f what you think Jesus tells me and what I should and should not be doing. And then he goes on with further berating of these young people. And Tucker Carlson interviewed students Lauren and Connor Haynes about what took place. I'm not like a pro-lifer or anything like that. I want to totally abolish human abortion.
It's actually a group called Abolish Human Abortion, and we seek not to regulate abortion, but to call it murder and what it is, and to completely abolish it in the United States of America. And just in doing that, bringing the gospel into conflict with child sacrifice.
So that's what, you know, why I call myself an abolitionist, just because I'm not a pro-lifer trying to regulate abortion. It needs to be completely abolished. Yeah, and for holding that position, he got berated by this assistant principal at a high school. And told to stay away and That gentleman's put on administrative leave. It's always.
Fascinating to see. And if you're involved in pro-life work, you'll see it all the time. you will see a A clear Coalition. A clear Unified front. when it comes to being radical pro-abortion.
and radical pro-LGBT. You think, why? Yeah. Gays and lesbians, their big issue is not abortion. Because they're they're not producing kids naturally.
It's not like accidentally two lesbians or two gay guys are going to have a baby. It doesn't happen like that. They're going to get pregnant.
So why would they be aligned? I mean, I've I've seen this for decades. But there's obviously a joint union. Against certain principles of God's foundations of life and family, and hence the resistance. But in any case, there you have an assistant principle.
Trust me. There are plenty of educators. There are plenty of school librarians, there are plenty of administrators, there are plenty of faculty members who are quite hostile to the things that we believe and are doing their best to undermine what we believe and undermine our rights to believe these things. The alarm is sounding. Are we waking up?
We'll be right back going to the phones on the other side of the brake. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.
Thanks friends for joining us on the line of fire 866-348-7. Eight, eight, four. There are so many people of faith in America, so many people who love the Lord. If we would stand up and do what's right on a wider level, If we quit worrying about human opinion, if we quit worrying about human repercussions and would honor the Lord and speak the truth in love, America would be dramatically shaken. 866-34-TRUTH.
Let's go to Charlotte, North Carolina. Cheryl, welcome to the line of fire. Hi, Doctor Brown. It's good to talk with you today. Thank you.
I wanted to thank you so much for encouraging believers to. and exhorting people us believers to Speak up in our communities and in our relationships about these topics. But I wanted to let you know also that there are those of us who are speaking out, and I think it's Excellent that you're telling people to expect Um pushback. because there is a lot of pushback even in the church community. Um because there's such a atmosphere of The grace message beyond uh and excluding truth.
That people really need to be prepared for persecution, even within the body today. But I agree with you that it's worth it. that we should be doing this. But I wanted to ask you a question. Um how do you uh address the proverb that says Um when the days are evil, the prudent man is silent.
And how do you discern when Is that going to be an age that we are just not going to be able to speak up anymore? Yeah, first I appreciate the kind words. And as for the Uh as for the question of When people are silent, again, what does it mean? Silent in what ways? Proverbs are meant to be very pithy.
Proverbs are meant to be making general statements. And since we know throughout Scripture that were called to be light. that we're culture shine. Since we know that we are salt and light in this world, since we see the prophets continually warning Israel in the darkest times, and Noah living in the days he lived, the scripture tells us he was a preacher of righteousness.
So it certainly would mean that there are times that we speak and times we don't speak, and what we address and what we don't address. But I can't think for a moment. that what it means is the the worst things are around us the less we speak up. the more human trafficking is flourishing, the more abortion is flourishing, the more racism is flourishing, the the more uh drug abuse is fl flourishing, the more slavery is flourishing, the more sexual immorality is flourishing, the less we say. You know, throughout scripture, the prophets were told to sound the alarm.
The only thing I would say is that we just have to use greater wisdom. We have to use greater wisdom when we speak and when we don't speak. God told Ezekiel that he was going to be around people. who were so sinful. That he would only be able to speak when God told him to speak.
And what you realize is that he obviously would be tempted every day to rebuke everything he saw, because there's so much evil out there. And yet, that was not the case.
So It's just a matter of wisdom. It's a matter of knowing when to speak. But what holds most of our tongues is not wisdom, it's cowardice. It's compromise. It's fear of man.
Or it's not knowing what to say.
So let's get equipped, let's get God's heart. And let's say, Lord, every day, here I am, use me. Here I am, social media, sitting next to someone on a bus. Talking at school.
Someone I'm working with, neighbor. Radio to how do you want me to speak? How do you want me to get involved? How do you want me to act? And trust me, and I'm sure you do.
He'll keep us busy. Amen. I do. And thank you so much for the encouragement and for the answers. Thank you.
Well, thank you. Appreciate the call. 866-34TRUTH. Let's go to Jerichea in South Central Texas. Hello, are you there?
Yes, can you hear me? I can. Go ahead. Yes, sir. Hey, uh, Dr.
Michael Brown. I I I actually called about a couple of weeks back and I just wanted to thank you personally for your books, Volume three and four. of um the objections of Jesus. And I read them and I really, really enjoyed them. And you are a great apology.
Of the messianic faith. And I would commend you for that because I don't think I've ever listened to an apologist more apologetic than you when it comes to defending the Torah, And bringing out Jesus in the law of God. But I also, I wanted to thank you for that, and I wanted to ask you a question as well. that was uh that had a lot to do with with what you're talking about. Yeah.
Um Yeah. I I I uh I came from basically more of an anti-nominism. Into this, you know, believing this false doctrine of once saved, always saved. And that you're not under the moral laws of God and all this stuff. And then, you know, I just started studying the Torah.
More and more aggressively, you know, I read stuff in like you know, Leviticus 18, 22, Leviticus 20, 13, and where it's confirmed in Romans chapter 1, where Paul's addressing, you know, homosexuality. And see, well, see, what I don't understand is the fact that people say stuff like, well, that's under the law. I'm like, but did you not read what Paul told Timothy in 2 Timothy 3:16 that all scripture is inspired by God and profitable? Right, so here's the question then, and this is what has to be addressed. Yes, Paul said in 2 Timothy 3.16, all Scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for doctrine, reproof, etc., that the the man of God may be thoroughly equipped, speaking there in particular of the ministry leader.
But the issue is this. There are certainly laws that God gave Israel that were for Israel. That were not to be enforced the same way. For example, we're not supposed to stone adulterers. or burn witches.
So there were things, or it killed someone, put someone to death, I should say, for not keeping the Sabbath.
So there was an application for Israel. And now we learn from that. Paul takes those same principles in 1 Corinthians 5, excuse me. And rather than putting the people to death, If they claim to be believers and are living in open and outright sin, then they are, and they refuse to repent, they are excommunicated, not put to death.
So there's spiritual application. There are laws that God specifically gave Israel, for example, where polygamy was legal. And certainly that was not God's desire or intent or highest goal.
So what we have to do is see why God gave certain laws to Israel, what his purpose was for them, and now see, under the new and better covenant, what God has reinforced, and that will be reinforced through the writings of the New Testament and by the work of the Holy Spirit in our hearts.
So it's important that we just deal with scriptures holistically. It's important that as we deal with scriptures, that we say, okay, here's my grid. Here's how I say, okay. This applies for all people for all ages. And my simple thing is: if the Bible tells us it's for all people, or it's repeated in both Old and New Testament.
Well that settles it then. It wasn't just for ancient Israel, it's for all people or all followers of God for all time. Hey, gotta go, gotta break, but thank you for your call. It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr. Michael Brown.
Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. In a few minutes, I'm going to speak with my friend and colleague, Reverend James Robison.
He is scheduled to be meeting with President Trump tomorrow, along with other leaders of the Faith Advisory Council. I want to talk to him about that, the role of prayer right now in America and shaping America's destiny. But before I do that, Have you noticed that churches that go liberal. that depart from the authority of Scripture, and that lurch left, that invariably They changed their views on Israel. and become sometimes so militantly pro-Palestinian that they're anti-Israel.
They changed their views on abortion. and they become strongly quote pro-choice. And they change their views on LGBT issues. You see it almost invariably. Look at any of the denominations that have split and any that have gone further left, and you'll see on these three they almost all have harmony.
And to me, it's a clear departing from God's word and God's truth in each of these cases. and I've seen in friends of mine who are regularly involved in pro-life work. constantly find that that that you have atheists Satanists LGBT activists and others working together on the side of abortion. The question is, why? To me it's self evident spiritually.
But I want to talk with a caller with a different perspective. We go to Raleigh, North Carolina. David, welcome to the line of fire. Do you want to take issue with anything that I've said? Oh, I just want I am a K-Christian, and I just want to say that I am.
Pro-life. And I think the problem is a lot of the pro life people um will not be friendly. when working with a gay a gay person. And I think put that aside, Um And you can hold your own beliefs about that, but not wanting to work with someone like me. um or to look down your nose or to judge me.
when I'm on the same side. And I just don't it's it's just it's not fair to say all liberals are I mean, there are some liberals who are conservative on this one issue, and there's some gay people, a lot of gay people, who are still Christian or they're Jewish and go to a a a reformed temple and have a relationship with God and are pro-life. David, what what kind of church do you go to? I get a um a Catholic church actually that is is um you know Definitely, the Catholic Church basically says it's okay to be gay, but I should be. Yeah.
I I shouldn't uh be celebrating. And how do you feel about that? I don't think I should be celibate as long as I'm in a monogamous relationship. Um, but Um It's not just the, you know, the Catholic Church um usually, um, Very conservative, but there is definitely Presbyterian USA. Right, right.
And those churches also. Have a difference there on pro-life issues. Hey, David, listen, I would love to talk with you further. I've got a guest coming on, but do you have my book, Can You Be Gay and Christian? Yes, you sent it to me, and I haven't completed it.
Tell you what, let's do this. If you could give me a call. Later this week or in the next week or two. All right? I'd just like to talk with you about these issues a little further.
All right. I wanted to get to your call. I've got a guest about to come on. And I don't know that I'll be able to get to the call later this show.
So call me when you're able. All right, I'll remember now, David from Raleigh. Uh and and I just want to talk about these issues with you in a little more depth. You know the differences I have with you. You also know that I'm gonna be civil with you as you are with me.
Fair enough.
So call back as you have the opportunity. And if you're able to finish, can you begin Christian first? That's great. But otherwise, let's talk further. All right?
Thank you, sir. Gotta run. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH.
Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. My latest article is up on the stream, stream.org, a Huffington Post humanist. urges the church to stop using the Bible as a moral guide. I tweeted my article to the author of the article I'm responding to.
have not yet heard from him. Fascinating article on the stream by Paul Kanger, a future pope and a future president, take up the fight against communism, and important articles about Planned Parenthood, President Trump's first 100 days, and more.
So if you haven't been to thestream.org, I encourage you to go there. I'm joined now by the publisher of the stream and host of Life Today TV broadcast, James Robison. James, you've got a pretty big week this week. What's coming up, sir?
Well, thank you for the nice things you said about the stream. I marvel at all the articles that you put on, but also the others that are there. I just feel so fortunate To work with just truly gifted, brilliant people. Who knows that there are biblical absolutes that are basically irrefutable for thinking people. And to see this flow of wisdom coming, it could just lead us out of this wilderness, this despair, and this ditch that we're in as a nation.
And so thank you for being a part of it and always talking about it. Yes, we've got a busy week. I'll be leaving. in the morning early, headed to
