Preterists say that Zechariah 14 has already come to pass, that it speaks of the destruction of Jerusalem and the church age, whatever interpretation is put on it. Preterists say it is not future. With all respect. based on the word. I beg to differ.
Hey friends, this is Michael Brown. Welcome to this special broadcast where we dig into Zechariah. The 14th chapter. In my three-part debate with Steve Gregg, which was early in 2026, We got into Zechariah 14 some. But obviously, even with the eight hours we spent going back and forth, we couldn't go through every line of every passage.
And this to me is one of the strongest rebuttals to cessationism, excuse me, to preterism that exists. Full of partial preteris who said that Zechariah 14 has already come to pass, I would say that this is one of your weakest possible passages. I want to be completely candid. And for those who don't know me, I'm not a dispensationalist. I'm not attacking dispensationalists.
I'm not a dispensationalist. I came to faith in the dispensationalist pre-trib church. I've not held to a pre-trib rapture for close to 50 years now. I co-authored a book with Professor Craig Keener called Not Afraid of the Antichrist: Why We Don't Believe in a Pre-Trib Rapture.
So I am not. a dispensationalist. I would be called a historic premillennialist. And as best as I know and understand. all of the attestation we have until Augustine.
of church eschatology, all the major teachers we have, best I see and understand. they all held to a historic premillennial, what we would call historic premillennial. In other words, the disciples of the apostles and their disciples held to a view that there would be a literal return of Jesus after a period of Antichrist and persecution, and he would literally establish his kingdom on the earth, and that there would be a millennial rule. There would be a rule of the kingdom of God on earth before we went into the eternal age.
So what I hold to is ancient and church history. It is not some modern innovation called dispensationalism. More importantly, I hold to it because of scripture, and that's ultimately going to be the issue, right? Uh unless you're gonna exc say everything in church history has to be accurate and in church theology has to be accurate and we have to agree with them fully.
Well, even there, you're going to have differences between Greek Orthodox and Roman Catholic and others. But I am not beholden to church tradition. ultimately in terms of understanding scripture.
So I'm appealing to the earliest centuries and saying, yes, they held to. a premillennial view. But ultimately, I'm basing my views on scripture.
So if you say, well, yeah, I believe the early church got it wrong and Augustine got it right, etc. That's that's okay. I'm not arguing with that. I'm simply saying my view is an ancient view, but more importantly, What does the Bible say? Unless we are Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox, that's going to be our primary emphasis.
And for those who are Roman Catholic or Greek Orthodox or hold to another church tradition. I understand you're going to believe the traditions are inspired as well on a certain level and see everything through the lens of tradition. Fair enough, but can we agree ultimately If the Bible says A. And church theology says B, we go with the Bible with all respect to church theology. that if there's a contradiction between the two, a clear contradiction.
We go with the Bible.
So that's the emphasis. All right.
So There are passages when I was a Calvinist, which was from 77 to 82, When I was a a staunch Calvinist, There were some passages that were problem passages. And I remember book after book being written on these so-called problem passages, and then at a certain point you think, well. I'm not going to have problem passages. In other words, if they challenge my theology, I'm going to let them challenge my theology. rather than try to make everything fit into my theology.
The same way in my non-Calvinist days, you know, Romans 9 was a problem passage, and it seems to support Calvinism. You know what? I'm not going to let there be a problem passage. If it challenges my theology, I'm going to challenge it until I get clarity. The same thing with Jewish objections to messianic prophecy or other things.
If someone raises what seems to be a valid objection, Well think about it. And if I don't have an immediate answer, I'll say I don't. There are verses I've wrestled with. questions I've wrestled with. for months.
sometimes for years. And what I'll do is, if I have 100 verses that say this with absolute clarity, okay, that's my view. But now I have two verses that seem to say something else. You know what I do? I let him sit there.
And and I think about them. And then when I have clarity and I see how they all fit together. Wonderful. Or maybe there's a certain tension between them. Fine, I can live with that.
But what I'm not going to do... at least I'm going to do my best not to do this, is come up with some cheap... explanation to make these fit the other.
So what I want to say with all love and respect. to fellow students of the word and fellow lovers of Jesus, That If you believe I'm wrong on this passage, and I'm saying to those who are preterists, Be you partial preteris or full preteris, as long as you believe that Zechariah 14. has come to pass. It's not a future prophecy. I want to challenge you.
to do what I'm saying. and not try to make it fit. And maybe it'll rock your world Maybe it'll rock your theology. If so, Let it be rocked. All right, now I'm not going to cover.
Every predator's review of Zechariah 14. But I'm going to give some of the primary explanations. should basically be that Zechariah 14 speaks of Romans coming against Jerusalem. And that God ultimately appearing in the midst of it. Jesus coming in judgment on Jerusalem prophetically.
And that ultimately this now gives birth to what you'd say is the... the church age. or the messianic reign on the earth.
So the passage is about living water coming out from Jerusalem. the the passages about the the people of the nations coming to worship in Jerusalem on Sukkot, that these are all to be on tabernacles. These are all to be spiritually understood. and that all of this is already past.
So again, with all respect, I find that to be what I would call exegetical gymnastics or isegesis. And if we dared to read the New Testament like that, it would become meaningless in many, many ways.
So let's just start. Zachariah fourteen.
Now, of course. We have a context going back several chapters. And you have passages about the first coming of the Messiah there and things that happened in his lifetime. Betrayal. Things like that.
And then you have future prophecies as well, as is very common with messianic prophecy. You can speak of his first coming and his second coming. You even have like Isaiah 61. where Yeshua stops his reading. of the scroll of Isaiah before the day of vengeance of our God because it wasn't time for that yet.
As he was announcing the good news, preaching to his followers then in Luke the fourth chapter in the synagogue in Capernaum. It wasn't time to announce the coming wrath. Whether you think it's Second coming wrath or destruction of second temple. in the sev in year 70. Either way, it's the same passage, but he stops.
Because this is for now? And the rest is for later.
So you have prophecies about the first coming. Meek and Lowly Riding on a Donkey in the ninth chapter. betrayed for thirty pieces of silver in the eleventh chapter. And you have future prophecies like Zechariah 12 and Zechariah 14, which speak of all nations coming against Jerusalem. A day of the Lord is coming.
Jerusalem, when your possessions will be plundered and divided up within your very walls. Verse 2, and I'm reading from the NIV, but there's not a lot that's going to break down in translation differences from the Hebrew here. I, this is God speaking, I will gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against it. The city will be captured. The houses ransacked and the women raped.
You say, well, that's what happened. In in the year 70 or 67 to 70, the the the war uh the Jewish revolt. and the war against Jerusalem. And that's what happened because the Romans represented all nations in their armies. The first, that's a big stretch.
Look up all nations. Just go through all nations used. in Zechariah, the 12th chapter here, the 14th chapter, or other references. It's not just speaking about an army that has different parts of the world, and it didn't represent, it certainly didn't represent all nations.
So that's your first stretch there. First stretch.
Okay. that all the nations means the Roman army. And it's a pretty big stretch. But let let's just keep going. Let's keep going.
Half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be taken from the city. Then the Lord will go out and fight against those nations as he fights on a day of battles. He's not fighting against the Jewish people. He's not bringing judgment on the Jewish people here. He's fighting against those nations.
So if you want to say it was the Roman army representing all nations, this text says that the Lord will go and fight against them. Not against the Jewish people, but against the nations. Please please read it in context. It it it is exegetically impossible. to say that this applies To a spiritual coming of Yeshua in the clouds.
As allegedly prophesied, say in the Olivet Discourse in Matthew 24 in particular. that this refers to The Lord Jesus. Going out and bringing judgment on Jerusalem and the Jewish people in the year 70. You know, this is the Lord fighting for his people. It's the same in Zechariah 12.
This is the time of deliverance. In fact, let's just go back to Zechariah 12 for a moment. It's a parallel passage. I'm going to make Jerusalem a cup that sends all the surrounding peoples reeling. I'm reading verse 2.
Judah will be besieged as well as Jerusalem on that day. Verse 3, when all the nations of the earth are gathered against her, I will make Jerusalem a movable rock for all the nations. All who try to move it will injure themselves. On that day I will strike every horse with panic and its rider with madness. It goes on, I'll keep a watchful eye over Judah, blind all the horses of the nations.
Then the clans of Judah will say in their hearts, the people of Jerusalem are strong because the Lord Almighty is their God. On that day I'll make the clans of Judah like a firepot and a wood pile. They're going to consume the surrounding attackers, the peoples. Verse 7, the Lord will save the dwellings of Judah first and on and on. Verse 8, the Lord will shield those who live in Jerusalem.
It's the opposite of what happened. This is the opposite of what happened in the year 70. Right there, we're done. Honestly, we're done. We don't have to go any further.
Zechariah 12. In Zechariah 14 as written, Have not come to pass. And there is nothing that happened after Zechariah's day where God fought the surrounding nations or all the nations attacking. Jerusalem and the Jewish people. where God fought against them and destroyed them.
That did not happen. And then, even here, Zechariah 14: half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be taken from the city. That did not happen in the year 70 either.
So again, we're back in Zechariah 14, verse 3. Then the Lord will go out. And fight against those nations as he fights on a day of battle. On that day, when he's fighting against the nations attacking. Jerusalem.
Not fighting against Jerusalem, not bringing judgment on the Jewish people, but when he is fighting against the nations attacking Jerusalem, it's plain. It's clear. Don't put a spin on it. Step back and ask yourself if this was not some controversial text, if this did not mess with your eschatology. What do the scriptures say?
And then when you couple in the idea. that the early church never heard of anything like Preterism, never, ever, ever heard of anything like the Preterist interpretation of these passages or the Preterist view of the Second Coming. then that further undermines. and already impossible. exegerical argument.
On that day, verse 4, the day when he comes to fight against Israel's enemies, the enemies of the Jewish people. His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives This has not happened yet. It will literally happen. Acts 1 says it. The same way he came.
The same way he left, he will come. The same way he left the earth physically, literally for the Mount of Olives, he will come and his feet will touch. How could it be any more clear? You could try to symbolize it, but what language could God have used to make more clear? that there will be a physical descent of the Lord.
On the Mount of Olives. Yeah. On that day, his feet will stand in the mount of all east of Jerusalem, and the mount of alls will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley. with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south.
Well, we spiritually could be why are you spiritually interpreting it when it's literal language here? Where he's literally going to come. And how could it be more clear that he's talking about a physical event that's going to happen describing how it's going to be split? from east to west, and so on. And then you'll flee by my mountain valley, for it'll extend to Azel.
You'll flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah, king of Judah. Then the Lord my God will come, and all the holy ones with him. This is a final visitation that has not happened yet. Bringing about the lasting deliverance and salvation of the Jewish people. On that day there will be neither sunlight nor cold, frosty darkness.
It will be a unique day, a day known only to the Lord with no distinction between day and night. When evening comes, there will be light. What's the spiritual argument you're going to give for that? That there's no day or night, that's unique, there's between day and night. What does it even mean?
It means literally, physically, that's what's going to happen. It hasn't happened yet. Just step back. Again, I know it can be challenging. This is why I'm so glad.
That Although I was challenged I never studied academically with believers. In college and grad school, I studied all with people who did not believe as I did.
Some were religious Jews.
Some were very secular Jews, some were secular in other ways. But I never studied with a follower of Jesus who was a professor in college or grad school. And I read their books all the time. But the classes I was in, I was constantly challenged by people who didn't. believe what I believe.
And then I started meeting with rabbis from my earliest days as a believer and interact with them to this very day. As I'm talking to you now, it's a Wednesday. The last time I interacted with an ultra-Orthodox rabbi was Sunday, just four days ago, face-to-face.
So I'm constantly allowing my views to be challenged. constantly. And that puts you in an environment where you can say, okay. I'm not just in an echo chamber. Maybe my view needs to be challenged.
So to my preterse friends, your view needs to be challenged. specifically here on these passages. On that day, Living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half of it east to the Dead Sea, and half of it west to the Mediterranean Sea, and summer and winter. You say, well, that symbolizes the gospel. No, it doesn't.
What's it got to do with the Dead Sea and the Mediterranean Sea? This is a physical event. that's going to take place. In the future, when the Lord returns. The Lord will be king over the whole earth.
On that day, there will be one Lord and His name, the only name. We haven't gotten to that point yet. We haven't gotten to that point in Philippians 2 where every knee will bow and every tongue confess that Jesus the Messiah is Lord to the glory of God the Father. We haven't gotten to that point yet. We are moving towards it through the preaching of the gospel around the world and God's final judgment on the earth, but we haven't gotten there yet.
It hasn't happened yet. There are still many other names and many other claims. and many false gods. they will be ultimately dealt with. The whole land from Geva to Ramon, south of Jerusalem, will become like the Arabah.
But what is so what does that mean? What's the spiritual there is no spiritual meaning on that These are geographic places with geographic things that are going to happen. To try to spiritualize all of it is to completely miss the point of the text. And it's almost like reading a sheet of music and trying to make it into a mathematical formula. Or or reading a a mathematical a formula and trying to make it into a sheet of music.
It's not that these are geographical things that will happen. These regions will become like the Arabah, the dry wilderness. But Jerusalem will be raised up high from the Benjamin Gate to the side of the first gate to the corner gate and from the tower of Hananel to the royal wine presses and will remain in its place. It will be inhabited. It will be inhabited.
Never again will it be destroyed. Jerusalem will be secure.
So aside from all the specific, This gate, this gate, this gate, this tower. What does it actually mean?
Well, I could come up with a spiritual interpretation.
Well, then come up with a spiritual interpretation for the book of Acts, where every city Paul was or Peter was and make those. No, no, we don't read the Bible like this. This is history being laid out in advance. in these prophetic oracles with details. I ask you again.
If God's speaking through Zechariah wanted to make clear. There will be a literal return to the earth. We're the Lord. In the person of the Messiah. touches his feet on the Mount of Olives.
and that Manamolo splits and these various things happen on the earth. How could he have made himself any more clear than this? with the with the geographical details. and agricultural details. And the effects of these things in specific places and regions.
Not only that, Jerusalem will never again be destroyed Jerusalem will be secure.
Well well When did we get to that? Jerusalem's been run down by enemies for centuries. Centuries And to this day, it's not secure. It's beset. by by terror around it.
Okay. This hasn't happened yet. It has not happened yet. And there are quite a few other prophecies about the future of Jerusalem and Hasidam. Oh, well, this is spiritual Jerusalem.
No, it's a physical city it's talking about. with specific location Again, I asked you. How could it be any clearer? Verse 12, this is the plague with which the Lord will strike all the nations that fought against Jerusalem.
So God is judging the nations. He's not judging Jerusalem and the Jewish people here. It does not refer to 70. He's judging the nations. Their flesh will rot while they're still standing on their feet.
Their eyes will rot in their sockets, and their tongues will rot in their mouths. This hasn't happened yet. We're not talking about Raiders of the Lost Ark movie or something where it happens like this at the end of the movie. This hasn't happened yet. On that day, people will be stricken by the Lord with great panic.
They will seize each other by the hand and attack one another. Judah too will fight at Jerusalem. Has this not happened in the year 70 or since in this way? The wealth of all the surrounding nations will be collected, great quantities of gold and silver and clothing. A similar plague will strike the horses and mules and camels and donkeys and all the animals in those camps.
Then there's survivors from all the nations that have attacked Jerusalem, which again is telling you it's not the Roman army. These are surrounding nations or nations of the world attacking and now the survivors of those nations. They'll go up year to year to worship the king, the Lord Almighty, and to celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles. You say, well, that just symbolically speaks of the final ingathering. Who switched it to symbolic?
We have literal language, verse after verse after verse after verse.
Now we're talking about the survivors of those nations. If any of the peoples of the earth do not go up to Jerusalem to worship the king, the Lord Almighty, they'll have no rain. Are you saying that applies today? Will that apply spiritually? That if you don't spiritually celebrate tabernacles, that you get no rain?
Does any preterist actually believe that? That's not saying it all. It's saying this literally God, there's going to be a millennial kingdom. As the early church believed as well, but as the scriptures plainly teach. There'll be a millennial kingdom.
And when I say plainly teach, that's just what's stated in many, many passages, unless you try to spiritualize it away. And nations will come streaming to learn from the God of Israel. And that that we As I understand it, will have been raised up together with the Lord. and we'll be ruling and reigning with him and our resurrected bodies. The Lord will bring on them the plague he inflicts on the nations that do not go up to celebrate the festival of tabernacles.
This will be the punishment of Egypt and the punishment of all the nations that do not go up to celebrate the festival of tabernacles. This is only referring to something that could happen in the millennial kingdom and hasn't happened yet. We haven't had this world in gathering on this physical level, nor the penalties for those that don't come. On that day, holy to the Lord will be inscribed. And the belts of the horses, the bells of the horses and the cooking pots in the Lord's house will be like the sacred bowls in front of the altar.
We haven't seen this happen yet either. Every pot in Jerusalem, again, talking about physical, literal things. In Jerusalem and Judah will be holy to the Lord Almighty, and all who come to sacrifice will take some of the pots and cook in them. And in that day, there will no longer be a Canaanite in the house of the Lord Almighty. or a merchant in the house of the Lord Almighty.
You say, well what about sacrifice?
Well, there's a lot of speculation. It could be there'll be sacrifices that are offered simply for ritual cleansing, that have nothing to do with atonement.
Someone said there'll be sacrifices that are offered that point back to the Messiah's death on the cross. Others say sacrifice here is metaphorical language. Maybe there's Maybe some metaphorical language here and there in Zechariah 14. But even if so, Even if so, that is the complete exception to the rule.
So I know that some of you will just push buttons to react against me as if I'm dispensationalist, which I'm not. Or you'll just say, oh, he believes in future sacrifices, he doesn't believe in the blood of Jesus. There is no salvation or atonement for any human being, Jew or Gentile, without the blood of Jesus. There's no forgiveness of sins for any human being on the planet. without the blood of Jesus.
I have given much of my life to this day and hope to give many more years by His grace to sharing the good news of Jesus Yeshua with my Jewish people, without whom there is no salvation. And Jew and Gentile in Jesus are absolutely one. Equals in the Lord, no caste system, no class system. We are equal, brothers and sisters, sons and daughters. of Almighty God, equally saved, equally washed with the blood.
So please don't put in my mouth things that I don't hold to. But I want to challenge you. Put down your defenses. And I try to do this when I'm challenged as well. Put down your defences.
Step back. Read the chapters afresh. 12th chapter. Right up to the 14th chapter. And say okay.
Did these things happen? Has this come to pass? The answer is obviously. Absolutely. Not Okay, does it mess with your theology?
Well, good. Let it mess with your theology. And maybe there's things you hold to in preterism. That are false, especially fa full preterism, which goes very, very far into some very dangerous territory. But Yeah.
Maybe the thing for you, like, wow, I really thought preterism would open up so much of scripture in the book of Revelation. Maybe there's some things that are beautiful and true and real. But the idea that Zechariah 14 is already Has already taken place is absolutely false. And he says, that means then there's going to be a Jewish Jerusalem at the end of the age. Yep.
And could that mean that the land of Israel today, the Jewish people living there as part of biblical prophecy. Yeah. If that shakes you, my friend, Let it shake you.
