Power and Mercy

Hello, everyone. Today is Monday, June the 26th. I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis. You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abbadon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can visit us online at ClearviewTodayShow.com, or if you have any questions for Dr. Shah or suggestions for new topics, send us a text at 252-582-5028, or you can email us at contact at ClearviewTodayShow.com. That's right. You guys can help us keep the conversation going by supporting the podcast, sharing it online, leaving us a good review on iTunes, Spotify, anywhere you get your podcasting content from.

We're going to leave a link in the description so you can do just that. The verse of the day is coming from Psalm 109, verses one and two. Do not keep silent, O God, of my praise, for the mouth of the wicked and the mouth of the deceitful have opened against me. They have spoken against me with a lying tongue. The Psalms are so raw at times. They don't shy away from the entirety of the human experience.

That's right. In this one, the psalmist is crying out for God to intervene because people are speaking against him. People are maligning him.

People are lying and running his name through the ground. It reminds us that we can call out to God. God is there for us to call on. Yes, certainly he's sovereign. He's working without us calling on him, but he delights in hearing from his children.

He wants us to ask him for things. The things you go through in life may seem petty and small in the grand scheme of things, but they're not to God. Granted, David was a king, so people lying against him would lead to kingdoms collapsing. That's true.

But at the same time, he was not afraid to ask for what he needed, despite what it sounds like. I read that, and it's like, okay, the mouth of the deceitful, they're talking bad about me, God. Well, that's not something I should really be praying for. Absolutely it is. Absolutely it is, because God wants you to rely on him in the big things and in the small things. Like you said, David shows through the Psalms how it is that we're to pray to God.

We rely on him for everything, not just the things that we deem necessary. Speaking of deeming things necessary, I hate to call you out on the air. This is not something that I wanted to do. This is not something that I wanted to put you on blast, especially on a Monday blast. You were eating a salad yesterday.

I know what this is about. You were eating a salad, and I saw you. This isn't something I heard through the grapevine. I saw it with my eyes.

That means it happened. You put mustard on a salad, and then you put mayonnaise on a salad. Here's where I really can't forgive. You ate the salad.

What would possess you to do something like that? Here's the deal. There was no salad dressing on hand that I liked. There were a couple options that I didn't really like any of them. You had your go-to salad dressings.

I didn't really like any of them. You got your ranch. You got your Thousand Island. You got your French dressing. I don't really do Thousand Island, either.

Thousand Island's pretty good. Anyway, a lot of times, salads, you'll have a bunch of different stuff in there. This was really just lettuce, tomato, and bacon.

That was it. Essentially, a BLT in a bowl. My thinking was, just make it like a sandwich without the bread.

It was jarring to see. It's not something that I would be anxious to repeat, but it didn't taste bad. It tasted like a BLT, just minus the bread.

Shen So, would you then make this an advice column? Would you say, hey, guys, put mustard and mayo on a salad? Gardner-Meadow Not as a general rule. Salads are very different. Salads are like pizza.

You can mix and match the toppings. But if you have a salad that is similar to the contents of a sandwich, such as I had yesterday, and you don't have a salad dressing on hand that you really like, mayonnaise and mustard is an alternative. Shen Hines Honey mustard can go on a salad. Gardner-Meadow Honey mustard can also go on a sandwich. Shen Hines But what sandwich would you put honey mustard on? Gardner-Meadow A chicken sandwich. Shen Hines Okay, fair enough.

But Hines yellow mustard and mayonnaise on a salad and a salad was not something. I saw it, and I was offended. But I was like, let me check myself. Let me consult the spirit. Gardner-Meadow Lord, do my eyes deceive me? Shen Hines Yeah. And I said, before I roast this guy in front of all his students in front of everybody, let me just calm down. I went home, I prayed on it.

I said, Lord, I've got to talk about it on the go. Gardner-Meadow I've got to do this. Shen Hines So, it wasn't terrible, is what you're saying? Gardner-Meadow No, it tasted fine.

It tasted exactly like what you think it would taste like. It's like a BLT minus the bread. Shen Hines So, why not just have the bread? Did you have any bread here? Gardner-Meadow No, I had a salad. Shen Hines You had a salad.

That's right. Gardner-Meadow I set out for salad dressing, but I didn't have any that I liked. So, I was like... Shen Hines Well, was there bacon? Gardner-Meadow Yeah, there was bacon in it. Shen Hines There was bacon in the salad.

Okay. Gardner-Meadow Yeah. I mean, it literally was just lettuce, tomato, and bacon. That's all that was in it. Shen Hines I got you.

I got you. Gardner-Meadow So, it was fine. Shen Hines Sounds like someone shorted you on your salad. Gardner-Meadow Well. Shen Hines That's what you want. Gardner-Meadow I'm the one who made it, so I guess I can only blame myself. Shen Hines I would say, then, let's put it out to the people, because I was thinking this was kind of salacious, kind of offensive to people, but maybe it's not. Maybe y'all listening would like a bacon, lettuce, tomato salad with mustard in it.

Do you put mayo on a BLT? Gardner-Meadow Yeah. Shen Hines Really?

Gardner-Meadow Yeah. Shen Hines I mean, I meant mustard. I meant mustard. I put mayo on a... Gardner-Meadow Not every time, but I like mustard. I really like yellow mustard. Shen Hines I put mayo on a BLT, as well, but I don't eat the LT.

I just have a B with mayo. Gardner-Meadow So, just sticks of bacon dunked in mayonnaise. Gardner-Meadow On bread. Gardner-Meadow Nice. Gardner-Meadow And I'll put some cheese on there. Gardner-Meadow Oh, OK. Gardner-Meadow Yeah. Gardner-Meadow So, this is a grilled cheese. Gardner-Meadow This is a grilled cheese with bacon. Gardner-Meadow OK. Sounds right.

We got there eventually. Gardner-Meadow But if you call it a BLT, it sounds a little bit more sophisticated. Gardner-Meadow It seems healthy. Sure. Absolutely. We're going to get Dr. Sean in just a second, but let us know what you guys think.

If you would put mayonnaise and mustard on a salad, if that was your option, if you didn't have the salad dressing you want, I'm saying that it's a fine option. Text us and let us know any new topics you have suggested for the episodes 2-5-2-5-8-2-5-0-2-8. Sit tight. We'll be right back. Well, good morning, afternoon, evening, Clearview Today listeners. My name is Jon. And I'm David.

And we just want to take a quick second and let you know about another way that you can keep in touch with Dr. Sean's work. And that is his weekly podcast series, Sermons, by Abbadan Shah, Ph.D. As a lot of you may know, or maybe some of you don't know. If you don't know, you do now. And if you don't know, then maybe just hop off the podcast. David, hop off the podcast. I'm just playing.

I'm just playing. Keep listening. Dr. Shah is actually the lead pastor of Clearview Church in North Carolina. Every single weekend, he preaches expository messages that challenge and inspire us to live God-honoring lives. One of the four core values of Clearview Church is that we're a Bible-believing church. So every sermon is coming directly from Scripture, which is great because that guarantees that there are timeless truths that are constantly applicable to our lives. This is a great resource because whether you're driving, whether you're cleaning the house, whether you're working out, you can always benefit from hearing the Word of God spoken into your life. And God's Word is always going to do something new for you every time you hear it.

Sometimes it's conviction and sometimes it's encouragement. But know that every time you listen to God's Word, you're inviting the Holy Spirit to move and work in your life. You guys can check out the Sermons by Abbadon Shah PhD podcast. First and foremost, check it out on our church app. That's the Clearview app. You can get that in the Google Play Store. You can get that on iTunes. But you can also find the podcast on the Apple Podcast app or on our website at ClearviewBC.org. And listen, if you've got a little extra time on your hands, you just want to do some further reading, you can also read the transcripts of those sermons.

Those are available on Dr. Shah's website, AbbadonShah.com. And we're going to leave you guys a little link in the description so you can follow it. Thanks, David. Let's hop back in.

All right. Welcome back to Clear View Today with Dr. Abbadon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can visit us online at ClearViewTodayShow.com. If you have any questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text at 252-582-5028.

That's right. If today's your first time ever joining us on the Clear View Today Show, we want to welcome you. Let you know who's talking to you today. Dr. Abbadon Shah is a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, professor at Carolina University, author, full-time pastor, and the host of today's show.

You can find all of his work on his website. That's AbbadonShah.com. And Dr. Shah, I wanted to ask you one question. That is this. If you were eating a salad and there were no dressings except for mustard and mayo, would you use mustard and mayo or would you eat the salad dry? Oh, wow. I would do mustard.

Yellow mustard on a salad? Ryan, I apologize. I apologize. Good. I apologize. I'll go with it.

I recant. Mayonnaise on salad, I can't do it. I saw Ryan yesterday put mayo and mustard on his salad and I didn't dream that that was ever done.

Here was the setup. Salad is a very wide term because you can put a lot of things in a salad, but this salad was really just lettuce, tomato, and bacon. That's all that was in the salad. So I was like, well, I don't really want any of these salad dressings, but this is kind of like a BLT just without the bread, so I'll do mayonnaise and mustard and just kind of mix it up a little bit and just kind of pretend that it's a BLT. So not even honey mustard. You would do Heinz yellow mustard on the salad?

I'll go with it if it has. I recant. I recant.

Not my favorite. Yeah. It's not ideal by any means, but... To be fair, you did have a sour look on your face as you were doing it. You were like, aw.

I walked in and you made that face at me. I was like, I know. I know. I know.

I'm going to be the fodder on the radio show. I know. I was like typing it into the banter topics as you were doing it.

I was like, this is gross. We're going to talk about this on the air. Okay.

I recant. On today's episode, we don't want to talk about salad dressing. We do want to talk about production. That's one of the things that we love to talk about here at Clearview. I know that's something that's on your heart, Dr. Shah's. Production is key because it leaves a legacy beyond us. That's true.

It leaves lasting impressions of us throughout history. That's right. And what God is doing.

That's right. We are a church, so we have services, we have ministries. We have programs for discipleship. We have programs for evangelism.

We do all these kinds of things, missions. But then God has given us a unique vision, which is to produce things. And what I mean by that is produce books, books dedicated to prayer, you know, the 30 days of praying through a crisis or 30 days to a new beginning. These are prayers or writing towards, you know, topics that lay people want to know.

And so we bring the academic topics and put it on a lower shelf that people can learn and understand. But also, God has given us a vision in media. That's right. And we have written many songs and produced songs through the years. And now we feel like we're on a whole different level. And there's another song coming out, which we truly believe God's got his hand on it.

That's right. I think we talked about it on the show when it was closer to happening. But it was a song that was birthed out of a kind of a tragic story, something that impacted us as a church and us as a community.

We do the show from North Carolina, and we have a very tight-knit community. And so this was something that kind of happened that really that God, I think, sort of circled for us. Like, okay, we can be sad about this, and we can move on and pretend like nothing happened.

Or we can say, God, what is it you're showing us through this? What is it that you want us to get from this tragedy, from this circumstance? Well, the tragedy, for the benefit of our radio audience or podcast listeners or even the YouTube audience, about a year, I would say a year and a half ago, one of our church members got diagnosed with cancer. And it was kind of like in the brain. So it was very tough. And he happened to also be the fire chief of our city. And so when this first happened, it really took a toll on him, everybody, all of us. He was very involved in our, you can already tell the tense I've just given that he's no longer with us. He's with the Lord. But he came to my office just really, just so afraid and just broken.

And he said, I know where I'm going. I'm not worried about that. I just don't want to go through this process because I know how it's going to be. It's not going to be fun. It's going to be painful. It's going to be embarrassing. It's going to hurt me, hurt a lot of people.

It's a lot. And so we got on our knees, we prayed in my office. And at the end of all that, he went and the treatments began. And by God's grace, he was able to come out of it saying he's free, cancer free. And it was amazing that all the firefighters showed up at the cancer clinic and they were there to ring the bell. It's just amazing. I mean, there's videos on that on social media.

And then this was last year, 2022, right before Thanksgiving, because we come together and we cook turkeys for a local organization and nonprofit that we feed the hungry and all that. And he was there, but you could tell he wasn't feeling well. He was just not himself. And so later on, come to find out cancer had returned, the doctors didn't give him a very hopeful prognosis. And so it quickly began to go downhill. In fact, I saw him, many of y'all remember that end of December, and it was like, I think he is okay.

Yeah, he is a little unstable in his walking, but I think it, well, wait, first week in January on, it's like it was a nosedive. He went very quickly to a bad place. And so it really impacted, of course, his family, his mom, his sisters, his girlfriend. It really impacted the firefighters, his brothers. I mean, this is a good firefighting company. I mean, they're amazing people. It impacted our city and it definitely impacted our church.

Yes, absolutely. And I think what you said at the very beginning, the thing was, he wasn't a symbol. He was a person that we connected to. So we can look at firefighters and the police and we can look at them as organizations.

They're symbols. It kind of takes the humanity away. But then you have a man come into your office and say, listen, I understand that when I die, I'm going to heaven, but I'm scared to go through this process. What a human reaction and what a way to relate to that. And to me, that resonates with me because now this is a person who's afraid of going through this process like I am, who understands that this is going to be difficult.

And I know I've got to go through it, but man, it just connects on a very personal and emotional level with me and I think with a lot of people. It did. It did. When I went to see him, I believe this was in the second week in January that I went by to see him, 2023. And he was quiet. When I would go see him, he was just quiet. He wouldn't say much. He wouldn't talk much. He would nod his head and maybe say a couple of things here and there if I were to ask questions.

And this one time that I went to see him, I would go several times a week. He was in his bed and you know, this thing was affecting his brain, his ability to reason, his cognition, and he would fidget with buttons on a remote. He would just mess with them. They took batteries out of that remote and gave it to him because he'd be turning TV on and off. He couldn't be on his phone, you know, just to help him. And he was over there messing with it. I mean, like really intently, like, I got to figure this out.

Why is this not doing what I wanted to do? But at the same time, he also knew that this was something involuntary going on. I mean, he was like living in two worlds. On one hand, he's doing things like this is me, but then he would turn and look or whatever he knew. I'm doing things that are out of my control. And so God prompted me to ask him, what is the Lord showing you? So I said, Chief, what is the Lord showing you? And he turned his head slowly and he said it as clearly as possible. His power and mercy.

Wow. And then he went back to fidgeting again. And when I thought about that, you know, that really impacted me because he didn't just say, well, you know, he is showing me where I'm going to be in heaven or he's showing me he's going to heal me.

I'm going to come out of this thing and I'm going to walk again and all that. Power and mercy. And I thought about that for a moment. I mean, if he had only said power, then the next question is, why doesn't God heal you? But what he's saying is he's showing me a different kind of power.

That's right. And if he had only said mercy, then the next question would be, do you think God is punishing you because he definitely is not merciful to you because what kind of a God can sit back and watch a man who until a month ago was cooking turkeys and doing this and that and going on fire calls and sitting in city council meetings and proposing budgets and this and that. He's over there, you know, but pressing buttons like a little kid. What kind of a God sees that and says, no, that's okay.

That's a good one. But see, he put those two things together. It was power and mercy, God's power to show him how small he was and how great and big and vast God is on so many levels.

And God's mercy to remind him that he doesn't deserve anything, nonetheless, God is with him. That's right. That's right.

So it's a different kind of power and mercy coming together. I mean, this is deep. Oh, it is.

It is. And that's why it took a while for the song to kind of come to fruition because the night that you came back and you told us that, cause we were here and then I think it was a Sunday night and then you went over there to speak with him and then came back and you told us, I think we stayed here till like 11, 12 o'clock just praying and just being up and just being together. And you came back and told us that I went home and I thought about it and I was like, power and mercy.

I was like, I don't get it. I know that God is powerful, God is merciful, but I don't see how they apply here. I don't see how they, and it wasn't, I had to listen to you tell me that same explanation a few times because it is so deep and it doesn't sound like it would be deep, but it really is when you apply it to this situation and you see this is true and this is true.

How are they true together? That's where that song was birthed out of and I think that's why that song is so powerful. That's right. Because just because he was facing a sickness that came back with a vengeance doesn't mean for a single iota of a minute that God is less powerful, right? And just because the sickness may end up in death, like Lazarus's sickness, you know, this sickness is not unto death.

This one is look like it was, does not mean for a single iota of a minute that God is not merciful. That's right. So he was affirming something even though everything around him was saying to the contrary or his feelings. We always talk about feelings here because to me, feelings are shallow and most of us try to live by our feelings. He was saying whether I feel it or not, God is powerful and God is merciful.

That's right. In spite of how I look, in spite of what may be happening over the next couple of weeks, God is powerful, God is merciful. If we can affirm that in our daily lives, as we face trials, as we face difficulties, as we go through unanswered prayers, if we can still affirm that Jesus Christ is all powerful and all merciful, we're somewhere. That's so profound and it reframes the way that we think about suffering, but really the way we think about everything. It reframes the way we think about God and our relationship to him. That's sort of what led to the birth of this song that's coming out that we want to talk about.

This song, Power and Mercy. Well, I think there's weight in final words. Those were his final words to you.

This is not just a member. He was a member of your church, but you two were friends. You were close. I watched you guys for years come together and work together and impact the community together. Those being his final words to you, we spent a couple of weeks just thinking on it and praying on it and being like, what is this? This is something. I remember, Dr. Shaw, we were sitting actually at this table and I think we were talking about it because it was fresh on our minds and we cut the mics off.

I think we just were like, could this be a song? Could Power and Mercy be a song that comes out that demonstrates this truth and that galvanizes men and women to start living, just like you said, live like God is powerful and merciful in your life? Even if your senses tell you otherwise, even if your circumstances tell you otherwise, even if the best of people tell you otherwise, or even if your heart tells you otherwise, God is still powerful. God is still merciful. He is still God, no matter what.

That's exactly right. This process of songwriting might be something that's unfamiliar to people, in thinking about songs coming from a church. A lot of times we think about big churches or big Christian media producing songs that we then take and sing in church, but producing original songs... Jon, I know that's something that you're passionate about and that's something that you work on with Dr. Shaw very closely.

Well, that's the key, I think, because I think the reason a lot of these big churches are doing it and they have a monopoly on it is because the smaller churches won't utilize the tools that God has given them. And I think the best tool that God has given me is Dr. Shaw, because number one, he's the pastor of our church. He's the man that God has anointed over our church as our shepherd. Number two, he's a scholar. He understands the word.

And number three, he's forging relationships with people like Chief Cordell. I mean, you think about the people in your congregation. We think that because we're writing Christian music, we're trapped in a box that we have to write about this specific thing. How many songs can I sing about God's grace or his goodness or his power or like these water metal fours like I'm drowning in the ocean?

Like, we've heard it. The people in your congregation have stories worth telling, and your pastor is the one who's... I mean, of course, worship pastors and youth pastors, and we are too, but your pastor is the one who's fostering those relationships. And if you don't utilize the shepherd that God has put over you, you'll always write subpar songs.

Because you're doing it on your own. We tend to think that the pastor is preaching and the worship pastor is doing the songwriting and never the twain shall meet. Right. He's on this level.

He's on a whole different level and somehow... And then there's contention because of that. Right. But if you look at the churches that are doing it right, their pastors are involved. They're the ones who are setting the vision of the church. They're setting the vision of the music ministry and us as worship pastors or worship leaders or whatever. And we come underneath and we say, how can I make that vision accessible through my talents? Not my vision, because I'm not, I mean, yes, we write songs and we're creative, but I'm not telling stories that I want to tell.

You know what I mean? Not through the songs. That's not the vision of Clearview's music ministry. And as a pastor, I have to be willing to go, you know, meaning to say, hey, the talents God has given him, the experiences, the generational group that he comes from and the people around him, like David is a vital part of what you're doing, that all those things are beautiful and wonderful and God ordained. But if I get up Sunday morning and say, you know what folks, I'll just go and tell you these old hymns right here, we're forgetting them. I mean, if you can, if you do that, then of course you have quickly alienated your team because if they're not, you know, him singing people, other than doing it Sunday morning for you and for the people so they can get a check, they're going to resent you for that. You know, they're going to go, well, I guess he doesn't like our music or he doesn't, he thinks this is subpar compared to the old anthems of faith. So I have to be willing to say, no, you know, Wesley and, you know, I'm talking about Charles Wesley and Isaac Watts and whoever else, you know, they didn't have a monopoly on godly music. God used them tremendously in their generation and beyond, but this generation needs a new song. Yes.

I will agree. There are times that I have listened to praise and worship music and gone, what in the world are these people talking about? What are they doing? It's just like, oh boy, this is terrible. And then when you put it up against, you know, Cambridge graduates like Charles Wesley, of course it looks like, you know, Scribble Scrabble. It looks like it's written in crayon.

It looks terrible. But through the years, you know, some of the contemporary music has gotten better. And I hear people making fun of it and calling this and calling, I'm like, all right, whatever. You're going to see your church empty. You're going to see young people not coming back because they have nothing to own. And then the ones who do come and say, I love the old hymns.

They're wonderful people. Don't get me wrong. I'm not talking down about them, but they just, they're different. There definitely was that shift between worship music being written by contemporary artists to then being produced by churches. There was, I think in like the mid like 2000s to 2010s.

And that's when it really took off. But again, I think it goes back to how involved their lead pastor was because he's the one casting the vision. And if your music doesn't have a vision, then it's aimless. You're writing whatever you feel like writing or whatever speaks to you right now. But the people in your congregation have stories that are worth telling.

And I'm glad that you went and had that conversation with Chief because it produced one of the greatest songs I think we've ever written. Really one of the most powerful for me. Right. Right. I mean, this, this applies across the board to our Christian walk. It applies in churches, you know, and the worship, but it also applies towards firefighters. It applies towards those facing cancer because, you know, or any of the sickness that, that may be, you know, fatal, it applies on so many levels. Amen. Absolutely. It does.

So profound. The single, the new single Power and Mercy by Clearview Worship will be available very soon. July the second. July the second. Be on iTunes, Spotify, Amazon, Rhapsody, anywhere, literally anywhere digital music is distributed.

Anywhere you can find digital music. And this is such a powerful story. It's a personal story for us, but a powerful story that we are praying impacts you and teaches you to see God and to see your life with fresh eyes. And it will. If you, if you allow it to, it will, because there have been people and especially men in your life who have, who have made the sacrifice for you, who have done the things that sort of paved the way to build your community, build your church and that you've partnered with. And they've, they've gone on their own emotional journeys without you, you know, he would not have been the mature Christian that he was. Yeah.

That's absolutely right. Well, and I'm grateful to you, Jon, for taking on such projects. You know, it would be great. It would be wonderful if I were the one talking about this and that, but how could it work? How could it work?

If you were not jumping on these opportunities and challenges and saying, yes, I want to do this. And I'll do it now. And we'll do it for July the second. And then for David as well, helping you along with this, these projects, he's an integral part of that for him to jump in and say, let's do it.

And this is how, Hey, how are we going to make music and how are we going to write songs and run it by me? I mean, it's the Holy Spirit has given us a spirit of unity. Amen. Amen.

Absolutely. If you have questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028, or you can visit us online at cleerviewtodayshow.com, and don't forget that you can partner with us financially on that same website. Every gift that you give goes not only to building up this radio show, but countless other ministries for the Kingdom of God. Don't forget Power and Mercy, the new single by Clearview Worship will be available anywhere digital music is sold starting July the second. We love you guys. See you next time on Clearview Today.