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May 22, 2023 9:00 am

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Clearview Today / Abidan Shah

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May 22, 2023 9:00 am

In this show, Dr. Shah talks about his most recent travels to Turkey!

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Welcome back, everyone. Today is Friday, May the 19th. I'm Ryan Hill.

John Galantis. And you're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abaddon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can visit us online at If you have any questions for Dr. Shah or suggestions for new topics, send us a text at 252-582-5028, or you can email us at contact at That's right. You guys can help us keep the conversation going by supporting the show, sharing it online, leaving us a good review on iTunes or Spotify and where you get your podcasting content from.

We're going to leave a link in the description so you can do just that. And today's verse of the day is coming to us from Deuteronomy 31.6. This is one of my favorites of all time. Be strong and of good courage. Do not fear or be afraid of them for the Lord your God. He is the one who goes with you.

He will not leave you nor forsake you. So many times the temptation is for us to trust in everything that we bring to the table. Our intellect, our strength, our ability to manage things, our ability to predict the future. But we are human and frail and we fall short. But the one who does not, that's why we don't fear. It's not that things don't make us fearful things.

We encounter those situations regardless. But when your trust is in God and in God alone, you know that you don't have to fear because of who is on your side. That's right. And he's the one who goes with you. He says he will never leave nor forsake you.

And it sort of mirrors that promise that we talked about yesterday when we were talking about this great commission. Behold, I'm with you always. He's not going to leave you. He's not going to forsake you. He's with you. And he doesn't lose. It's not like if you team up in a battle with the Lord, there's a chance you might lose.

It's never, ever going to happen. Didn't you guys have this verse on the illuminate wall you had as a decal? Or was that from Joshua? It was from Joshua. It was very similar.

But similar concept. Be strong and of good courage. Because you know who is with you and who's fighting your battles. And I said who's on your team. I should rephrase that. Whose team you are on.

That's exactly right. It's not that God is on your team. You are aligning yourself with him. Did you feel like lunch today was... We've got to address what happened. I was excited about lunch today because we did something we don't normally do. We had lunch from a food truck today. That was fun. That was a lot of fun.

I enjoyed that. We had lunch from a food truck. Melissa, who is our church secretary, Dr. Schell's assistant, her husband was like, I'm going by a food truck. I'm going to get you guys some burgers. Do you want anything off the food truck?

So I was like, yeah, this is going to be great. We got to address the chili. You had a very unfortunate lunch today.

Here's what happened. I'm not like a food snob, but I typically am like, hey, give me a burger with this taken off, this put on. I'm sort of complicated, but I don't do it complicated like I'm trying to like... You're not super complicated.

Yeah, yeah. It's mainly just I want it plain. I just want it plain, and if anything, I just want it on the side.

That's really it. I was like, just give me a burger with mustard and chili and that's it. The food comes and there's no chili. It's just mustard. I'm like, that's fine.

Whatever. I can't remember who... I can't remember how it came about, but somehow it got out that, oh, there was supposed to be chili, and so Chris, who's Melissa's husband, was like, I'll go back for it. I'm like, do not go back for a cup of chili. That's fine.

He's like, no, no. We ordered it. I'm going to go get it. I was like, okay.

Which, thank you. Yeah, great. I appreciated that, but I 100% was not wanting to be the guy who sends a grown man who's taking his lunch break back for a little cup of chili. I was like, it's totally fine. He went and got it. Then when he comes back, he's like, hey, they gave us the chili. They just forgot to hand it to me.

I was like, okay, no problem. He hands me... The burger's gone by this point, by the way, but I still have fries. I'm like, I'm not waiting to let this burger get cold just for some chili. The burger's gone. He hands me a sheet, a flattened sheet of aluminum.

I'm like, what's this? He's like, I guess it's the chili. In my head, I'm like, please tell me this food truck didn't do what I think they did. I peel open, and it's just loose chili on aluminum foil. I remember this, because I remember thinking, well, maybe they had those little cups or something, and they didn't have a lid on it, so they just wrapped it in aluminum foil so it didn't spill.

Nope. They slapped some chili into some aluminum foil, folded it up, and said here. Literally, if you can picture this, picture a sheet of aluminum foil, scoop some chili in the middle, and then wrap the aluminum foil around the chili.

Done. Flattened it out. They flattened it out, so it was like a sheet. I unwrapped it, and there was just loose chili on the aluminum foil.

I was like, this dude went back. I can't not eat it. My food is gone. I just took a spoon, and I just ate it.

Just enjoy some loose chili and aluminum foil, I guess. That's the exact... It was the weirdest thing. It was so odd. I was like, this has to be addressed.

We have to talk about it on the pod, but I feel like I'm in the clear, because I said, hey, it's completely fine. He was like, no, no, I'll go back and get it. Then he brings it back, and I'm laughing at it and complaining about it. I'm like, I have to eat it. I just took a fork and just ate loose chili off some aluminum foil. Was the chili at least good? It was sweet. It was okay.

It was okay. I'm not a big fan of sweet chili. It was sweet chili, but I feel like on the burger it would have been fine, because typically I'll do mustard and chili. If the chili is sweet, that mustard will kind of cancel out. Mustard and chili, I think, is the best combination for any hot dog or... A lot of people do ketchup and mustard. I think mustard and chili is a little better. Chili is superior. If the chili is savory, then it works great. If the chili is sweet, then the mustard kind of combats it and they make a good thing. But chili was fine. By itself, I wouldn't eat it loose off a sheet of aluminum foil, but I was like, at least it's a good podcast topic. I wonder if this has ever happened to them before, and that was their solution then, too, or if this is a one-time thing.

I don't know. I can't imagine that's how they give people chili, is just slapping on some aluminum foil and... Side of chili. Here we go. It's like eating rice out of a loose paper bag. You go to a Chinese restaurant to order rice, and instead of putting it in the carton, they just put it in the grocery bag and just like, here. You order a drink, but they give it to you in a hot dog tray for some reason. Nothing is in the right container. It doesn't make any sense. It's just sopping all over the sides. Oh, no. What is this? I don't know.

I don't get it. On today's episode, other than chili, we're celebrating Armed Forces Day. How do we transition from loose chili and aluminum foil to Armed Forces Day? Our rights to serve condiments in various containers have been protected. There you go.

They are protected for those who are serving in our armed forces. We're going to get Dr. Sean in just a minute and discuss this, but if you have any questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text at 252-582-5028, or visit us online at We'll be back after this. Well, good morning, afternoon, evening, Clearview Today listeners. My name is Jon. And I'm David. And we just want to take a quick second and let you know about another way that you can keep in touch with Dr. Sean's work.

And that is his weekly podcast series, Sermons by Abaddon Shah, PhD. As a lot of you may know, or maybe some of you don't know. If you don't know, you do now. And if you don't know, then maybe just pop off the podcast. David, pop off the podcast.

I'm just playing. Keep listening. Dr. Shah is actually the lead pastor of Clearview Church in North Carolina. Every single weekend, he preaches expository messages that challenge and inspire us to live God-honoring lives. One of the four core values of Clearview Church is that we're a Bible-believing church. So every sermon is coming directly from scripture, which is great because that guarantees that there are timeless truths that are constantly applicable to our lives. This is a great resource because whether you're driving, whether you're cleaning the house, whether you're working out, you can always benefit from hearing the Word of God spoken into your life. And God's Word is always going to do something new for you every time you hear it.

Sometimes it's conviction and sometimes it's encouragement. But know that every time you listen to God's Word, you're inviting the Holy Spirit to move and work in your life. You guys can check out the Sermons by Abaddon Shah PhD podcast. First and foremost, check it out on our church app. That's the Clearview app. You can get that in the Google Play Store. You can get that on iTunes, but you can also find the podcast on the Apple Podcast app or on our website at And listen, if you've got a little extra time on your hands, you just want to do some further reading, you can also read the transcripts of those sermons.

Those are available on Dr. Shah's website, And we're going to leave you guys a little link in the description so you can follow it. But for right now, David, let's hop back in.

All right. Welcome back to Clearview Today with Dr. Abaddon Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. You can visit us online at

If you have any questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028. That's right. If today's your first time ever tuning in... Excuse me one second. Let me just fix that right now. Let me hydrate. Stall them for a second.

Hydration is important. Don't have any global noise in the microphone. If today's your first time ever tuning into the Clearview Today Show, we want to welcome you. Let you know who's talking to you today. Dr. Abaddon Shah is a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, professor at Carolina University, author, full-time pastor, and the host of today's show.

You can find all of his work on his website. That's And most importantly, Dr. Shah is back with us in the studio today. Welcome back, Dr. Shah. Yay! Now, here's my question. How did he go to Turkey for one day?

Like, literally, just one day? Well, yeah, because we did the Friday show, you were in Turkey. Next time we record on Monday, he's back.

Well, it's because you guys are so good. You kept things going. You planned ahead and got things recorded.

And we did do a show from Turkey. That was kind of... That was incredible. That was one of the craziest things. I was listening back. David was editing it earlier.

And it was insane, because I was like, think about what we did. We not only talked to each other on the other side of the planet, but produced a show on the other side of the planet. From two points on opposite sides of the globe. In real time. In real time. In real time. Of course, David had to work some magic, and so did Nicholas, you know, to do whatever they had to do behind the scenes to get things lined in. But overall, it was in real time.

Oh, it was fantastic. We were talking while I was sitting on the turquoise coast of Turkey. And you guys were sitting here in this studio. Right. North Carolina.

In North Carolina. Yep. Yeah. And we were talking. Having just a full-on conversation.

In real time. Incredible. That's amazing. I mean, we live in some privileged times where we've got technology, and God has given us some amazing tools to be able to spread the gospel, and just to be able to communicate and fellowship on opposite sides of the planet.

Every time I say it, it sort of is new to me. Yeah. Well, Dr. Shaw, share with us about your trip. I know when we spoke in Friday's episode, that was the midpoint of yours and Nicola's trip through Turkey. Tell us about what happened the rest of the time for our listening audience.

What made Turkey magical? Ooh. Wow. I mean, how much time do we have? This is your show. It's your show, so we have the most time that you want.

We've got 30 minutes, but we can always talk tomorrow, too. I mean, it was just incredible, because Turkey was unlike any other country that I've ever been to. Of course, I grew up in India, so I already have that experience. But then I've been to Israel. I've been to Jordan. I've been to Greece.

I've been to Egypt. Turkey was in a class by itself. It was different, because some places, it was very modernized. It seemed like, man, this is just like home.

There's nothing different here. But then there were places like when we did the show, we were sitting on the coast of Patara. Patara, this is located on the Mediterranean coast, an ancient city.

According to the Book of Acts, Paul, Luke, and others probably came here at the end of their third missionary journey. This is the place. It is beautiful. It has some of the first century AD lighthouse that is there. And they're trying to renovate that. I have pictures of it.

It's just beautiful. It is also the place where it was the home of the Lycian League. Now, I know y'all want to hear about the Lycian League.

In fact, I want us to do a show on that, because it is mentioned, get ready for this, in the Federalist Papers. Really? Yeah. I love the way y'all do it.

Because it kind of hits you. That was not what I was expecting. I was expecting some Greek manuscript or some ancient thing. The Federalist Papers. It became the model for the US House of Representatives. Wow.

Alexander Hamilton, James Madison, talked about the Lycian League. And I was able to go into the place, which it has been reconstructed, because you're talking about 3,000 years ago. So this place has fallen apart, but they rebuilt it using the same materials that was there, that they found. And I was able to film on the site where the Lycian League used to meet. That's incredible.

That's amazing. And so we were with a group, and I told Nicole, I said, let them go. Let them keep going, because I want to stay here. She's like, why? We need to be with them.

I'm like, I know that, but this is the Lycian League. She's like, OK. All right. So they left, and I was like, OK, guys, where I'm standing here. So 4th of July Sunday at Clearview is going to be special. That's awesome. The 4th of July weekend, because we have Saturday night services as well. This is going to be very special, because we're going to actually have the video where I'm reading from the Federalist Papers when they talk about the Lycian League, and then I'm going to go, that's where I'm standing.

Does that impact sort of hit you as you're filming it, or do you take a moment after you film and be like, wow, like let it soak all in? Well, you've been with me on these kind of tours. Ryan's going to be going with me soon. David has been with me.

Nicholas has. When I'm doing things, I'm getting the job done, because we have a very limited time. There's two minutes here, and we need 45 seconds to film this.

Let's film it. So I keep all those emotions aside. Now, I will be emotional when I speak, because I know what I'm saying, and I'm trying to portray that.

Having said that, I put all that aside. I get the pictures. I get the videos.

I do the speaking part. And then later on, we come back and go, wow, we were standing there. You were talking about Paul's missionary journey, but you were also talking about these seven letters that John wrote to these churches. And that's obviously found in Revelation. And I know Revelation is one that you have preached on in the past. And then how long ago was it that you preached on Revelation? Because I know there was a pretty big gap between that service or that series and now. Well, I always find it funny, because people come and say, you never preach from Revelation.

You don't preach prophecy. And I'm like, I did that for two and a half years. A two and a half year series. Nonstop.

Like, I wouldn't stop for anything. We went through Daniel. We went through Matthew 24. We went through all the points and places like Thessalonians, whatever, where Paul talks about the end times, the coming back of Jesus, and the book of Revelation.

I went through that. So I was like, for a while, I'm not going to be preaching from this. I'll come back to it because we were kind of Revelationized.

But I am going to go back and talk about that. But, you know, the seven churches in the book of Revelation, that series is coming up. It's called Church Autopsy. And we're looking at those seven churches to whom John, through the Holy Spirit, through Christ himself, said those words of commendation and condemnation, that if they don't change, he's coming to remove their lampstand. He's talking to the seven stars or the seven angels of the churches. So there's a message there for the present day church.

Always has been. See, the amazing thing about the book of Revelation, I'm kind of deviating from our topic here. The amazing thing with the book of Revelation is how do you interpret it? On one hand, it is apocalyptic literature.

On the other hand, it's prophetic, but it's also a letter. So so many elements are coming together. I believe in some ways, the book of Revelation applies to every generation. God has given us a kind of a genre, which is kind of rare. You don't have all these genres coming together in one piece of writing, like the book of Revelation, because you have the apocalyptic based on the imageries and all the destruction and the heavenly fight and the earthly fight kind of thing happening. And then there's a future, a future idealistic stage where everything is headed. So that part is there in Revelation. But then there's also a sense of it applies in every generation. So it has that that genre there, too. And then, of course, there's it's futuristic. It's not like something that's happened in the past or is happening right now, but it's headed towards something towards the end. So Revelation is very unique in that sense. And so a lot of times people preach and study and get all hype about it. And I, after having done those messages, you know, I walk with a little bit of trepidation. Yeah. And I think there's a deep rooted desire that people have to understand Revelation because it's the it's the answer key for what's coming. Like, well, I'm so scared of the unknown. Oh, don't worry. It's known. It's right here. But it's almost like it's coded.

It's encrypted and I need an expert to tell me what it means. Yeah. Yeah. And that is partly it's true. You know, sometimes it gets sensationalized.

But I'm not totally against the sensationalism. Sometimes people say it's like all these end time things. Well, could it be that God gave us that literature in such a way that every generation should say, hey, it may be happening right now?

Yes. Why not? That's not against good exegesis. In fact, that's the brilliance of the word of God. That's a great point.

Maybe maybe it is meant to be as compelling as we've made it out to be. That's right. Maybe. I'm not saying every Tom, Dick and Harry who got up there and start talking about, you know, the the the big, you know, spider looking things or whatever they are like the Apache helicopters, you know, maybe that's not that's taking you too far. But could it be that every generation was supposed to apply it to their time? Yeah.

Could it be that the word of God is, I don't know, compelling? Yeah. Could it be that it's actually exciting and might mean something special? Yeah.

It's applicable to every period. Right. Right. You know, one of the things that I was thinking of, we were actually talking about this earlier because, because you did go to Turkey and it was for a number of reasons.

It was for to film and to follow Paul's missionary journey and then to follow these revelation, these churches in revelation. But we were talking earlier and you said something that I think is, has been on your heart for a while. And this is something that people don't really take priority of because they think traveling is a luxury. But for you traveling is a priority. Yes, of course. Of course. And I think that's a very different way that people, especially leaders in the church might look at it. And do you want to just kind of talk about that?

Just, just kind of share your heart with people who might be listening who want to travel, but feel like, well, that's a luxury I can't afford to. Yeah. Especially nowadays where people are not just doubting the word of God, but they outrightly say that it is not the word of God. It is false. It doesn't match science.

It doesn't match history. So it becomes even more imperative that we travel and for ourselves, I don't know, not everybody can do that. So I'm saying this a little carefully. Somebody cannot, some people cannot do it because of health reasons.

Some can do it because of finances. I understand. I get it. Safety. But having said that, I think it's imperative that more and more Christians do travel and go to these places, the biblical lands, and look for themselves and see the places that are mentioned in the Bible, the events that are mentioned in the Bible, the people that are mentioned in the Bible and see for themselves they are real.

Okay. We can talk a lot about the prophecy and Daniel about Alexander the Great, but when you walk into say the museum in Istanbul, okay, and you walk in and you stand in front of the colossal statue of Alexander the Great in one of the museums that we went into and you go, Oh my word, look at this thing. This is about 200 BC statue. That's when you go, Oh, this person was real. And this person was dynamic. I mean, look at him.

Okay. This he's been gone for a hundred years when they made that statue. Maybe they made it in his lifetime. I believe maybe they did.

We don't know for sure. Maybe a hundred years later. But to stand there and go, wow, these people actually existed. These are not just made up people.

And here we are. This is that kingdom of bronze that Nebuchadnezzar dreamed about. Oh, that's a good point. This is that kingdom of bronze. And this kingdom doesn't know that another kingdom is coming, which will be the kingdom of iron, the Roman empire, which is going to destroy this one. So when you stand in those places and see those places, that's when you go, yeah, I don't know why people doubt the word of God.

I think we lose that a lot of times. I know that's a temptation for me sometimes is that you forget that these were actual people, not just characters in a story, not just concepts. These were real people who had real desires and real ups and downs in their lives like we do, albeit culture was different, but people are the same. And, and when you, when you travel to these places and especially Dr. Shaw, when you've brought stuff back and I've been able to see, you know, even just second hand, the places that you've been, it's deep in my faith and it's, it's deep in my trust and my confidence in the word of God.

Right. I mean, there are places we went to, uh, just give you one example, Laodicea. Laodicea, you know, is mentioned in several books in the new Testament, but especially in the book of Revelation, this is a church that was lukewarm.

All right. Now in the archeological ruins of Laodicea, there are three churches in the archeological site. Really in Laodicea?

In Laodicea. There are three churches, three basilicas. Okay. I went through three, all three of them. I wanted to, I wanted to walk through them and I walked and I filmed and y'all have the videos and we can be showing them soon. We can drop some pictures in this episode if you want. Yeah.

We're going to be showing them at Clearview, um, very soon. So I hope you can see them, but it was tragic for me to walk through them, see the place, which in my opinion was the baptistry, see the place where, in my opinion, where, where the pulpit sat. And then to know that at one time these places were filled with people, these places were filled with families and children, that these, this baptistry was full of water and someone was standing there baptizing people.

All right. These places were, were filled with people who gave money, their tithes, their offerings to support the ministry of the church, to support the missionaries, to support the poor, the hungry. This, this place was vibrant at one time and not just one.

I went through all three of them. They're not, they're not very far from each other in the, in the archeological site. You know, you go past these theaters and then there's the first one and then the second one and then there's a big one and the big one is like in pretty good shape. What is tragic is to think about that these places that were full at one time now, they're not only empty, but they are in ruins. Yeah. There's a soberness that sort of comes over you that you understand that this is not so uncommon as I think.

You know what I mean? This passage of time and this, this what am I trying to say? It's not so far removed from us. I mean, you know, this isn't some myth that happened hundreds of thousands of years ago. This is the church that John wrote to and just not that long ago. And these, this vibrant community of believers is now a memory.

It's the passage in the Bible. What are those people? Who knows who built this church? Don't know. What are the people disappear to?

Don't know. And it's like you said, Ryan, they're people, you know what I mean? Like it's, it's so tempting to look at them as characters on a script or characters on a story, but they were people just like us with children like us. And just like the churches we see, whether it's in the countryside or in the, in the suburb or in the, in the heart and the downtown area that are now sitting there empty. What's going to happen to them? Will they be demolished? Will they sit as ruins? Will they become theaters or bars or something else?

Some business will come in there. I don't know. So walking through them and then hearing the letter to the Laodiceans, I wish you were either hot or cold, but since you're neither, I'm going to spew you out of my mouth. And imagine, imagine like the visceral reaction the church would have if Jesus said that to us today. And, but we think like, no, that can't happen, but he did it. He said it to them. And imagine being in that church when you're reading that letter. My topic today is what the apostle John wrote about 50 years ago. So we're going to talk about that today because we don't want to be the ones spewed out.

And I don't believe we will be. Hard cut to like spew that out 23 years later. Where you are rubble and ruins. Yeah. This pastor, the New Testament professor is walking through with his 360 GoPro camera and my wife is behind me with a gimbal filming me as I'm walking through. Folks look at this.

This place is empty. This is like, this is so sad. Somebody sitting there just has a glimpse of the future. Like, oh no.

Yeah. Cause imagine your church right now. Like if you're listening to this radio show, imagine your church a hundred, maybe, maybe a thousand years from now and some future archeologist or some future anthropologist walking through and being like filming over your life stuff. The rubble that used to be your pastor's pulpit.

If someone's walking over it and filming it. This is where you used to baptize people. And this, this used to be the fellowship hall and this used to be the children's wing. Oh man.

And they don't see all the activities that you did and all the hard work they put in. They just see ruins and rubble. Yeah. It was kind of sad. Yeah. I can imagine. Pretty sad.

Pretty sad. The other thing is, you know, when you go through these places, the timeline, I don't know how archeologists or historians keep talking about millions of years and hundreds of thousands of years or 10,000 years ago, when you walk around there, you, you, and you look at the timeline, okay. Of how long back this place was inhabited or when this civilization was here or culture was here or a city or village was here 2000, 4,000 maximum 4,500 years ago. I'm like, that fits a young earth that doesn't match the rhetoric of millions and billions of years. It is like, I don't know why you people keep talking about a very long history, but actually this is only... Oh, we've been told to. Yeah. We just, we were told to say that.

That's the cue cards that we were handed. So anyways, for me, the earth becomes young. Yeah. Right. I love that. I love that perspective. And you told me a while ago, Dr. Shah, and it's, I mean, it's certainly proven true and continues to prove true that you, you are as capable and as good of a leader as the people you meet, the books you read and the places that you go.

Absolutely. I encourage you go with us. We're going to Greece this fall.

Time is very short. Let me know if you're able to go. We're going to Egypt. We're going to Israel. I'm going to Turkey in, in, in a couple of years. So a lot of great things are coming up.

That's right, man. Awesome. Lots of opportunities. If you guys enjoyed today's episode, you have questions or suggestions for new topics, send us a text to 252-582-5028, or you can visit us online at You can partner with us financially on that same website. Just click that donate button there and join with us as we seek to impact the nations with the gospel of Jesus Christ. We love you guys. We'll see you tomorrow on Clearview Today.
Whisper: medium.en / 2023-05-22 10:09:33 / 2023-05-22 10:22:55 / 13

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