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So, thank you for that. Thank you to Mighty Muscadine for sponsoring this episode. Let's jump in. There's a real place called hell. It's a reality for all of those who don't accept Jesus Christ as their Lord and their Savior.
But would you believe it? A lot of churches won't even preach on it. Let's talk about why on today's episode of Clearview Today. You're listening to Clear View today with Dr. Abadon Shaw, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis. Welcome to the Clear View Today show. We're here in the studio with our host, Dr. Abadon Shaw.
And today we want to hear from you. You can text the word today T O D A Y to two five two four two nine six zero six nine to weigh in on today's topic, or maybe suggest a new topic for us to cover. Maybe some questions that you have for Dr. Shaw. You know, Dr.
Shaw, there's a real place out there called hell. And a lot of churches won't even preach on it. They won't even say a word about it because they want to make anybody feel bad. But when you look at the gospel and you look at Jesus's message, we would think it would be love, hope, forgiveness, grace, all this stuff. But really, what He talks about more than anything else is hell.
You know. Jesus talked more about hell than anybody else in the Bible. That's wild.
Now, just keep in mind, the Bible is the word of God. It is the word given through the Spirit of God by the Word of God, Jesus.
So let's let's just say everything in the Bible is Jesus's breath. Having said that, in his Three and a half years of ministry on the earth two thousand years ago, he talked a lot about this place called hell, and so for us as Christians to think this is sort of uncivilized, unsophisticated, not you know kosher to talk about it in civilized company—that's not. Good. That's right. Yeah, because we're we're taking we're minimizing a huge part of Jesus's message, which is what happens if I do forego this grace.
Yeah, and we we talked about that in our Getting to Know God series, but I think it's interesting that so many churches, like you said, Doctor Shaw, it's almost like we think we're above it. Yeah, it's messy. It's dirty. It's it's like uncomfortable. It's going to make people feel bad.
Spiritually dark. We're not here for that. We're here to do the real Christianity, doing life together. And Jesus is like, you are distracting from my message. Yeah.
So, I mean, we're going to talk about the wheat and the tears today in today's discussion on the parables of Jesus. But before we go there, let me sort of set the stage. Of what we are discussing, this is also in line with where I am preaching in the book of Ephesians. When it comes to salvation, what is salvation? What does it mean to be saved?
Now, if we have a misunderstanding of this truth, then we're going to have a lot of complications down the road. What does it mean to be saved?
Just when you think about that word, saved. What comes to your mind? Rescue. Yeah, like like somebody like somebody at sea, they're getting the lifeline. I'm saved.
Yeah, or or there's maybe like a something like a boulder rolling down the hill, and somebody's shoved out of the way in the nick of time. Absolutely, it says something that happens in that instant when when you are rescued, you're snapped up, you're saved.
Okay, that is the fundamental idea behind salvation. Salvation involves much more than that. But the bullseye idea behind salvation is rescue, and what are we being rescued from? Not from the devil or Satan. We are being rescued from God's wrath.
Wow! Once we get away from that, then what we will do is we will latch onto secondary. Benefits of salvation and treat them as if they are primary because we find them to be so much more appealing. I mean, who wants to live the rest of their life going about saying, "Man, you know what? The last minute I got rescued, went to college, earned a doctorate." I tell you what, the biggest thing about me is the last minute I got rescued.
Yeah.
I was in this really bad situation, man. Last minute, I got rescued. I was about to get have a head-on collision. Last minute, I got rescued. It's not a good story, and yeah, it's something though that I think we're clinging to.
You know, if someone is listening for the very first time today, Jesus could have very easily said, "Hey guys, here's the stakes. Here's the solution. Y'all need to get right, and you need to do it right now." But instead, he comes and he tells these stories. If today someone's first time, why did Jesus do this?
Well, stories, the parables that Jesus preached, were to reveal the truth to the ones who accepted him, and to obscure the truth from the ones who rejected him. That was what Jesus said: "To whom much is given, more will be given." To whom the the or the people who cannot understand him and are rejecting him, it's not just understanding, as in I don't understand. Clarify for me. No understanding in the sense of they keep rejecting it, hardening their hearts, even what they have. After a while, will become obscure.
I think it's an important distinction that people miss a lot of times because it's like, what? What do you mean Jesus is going to take things away? People don't don't understand. It's not that they are just like lacking comprehension. There's a willful rejection, absolutely willful rejection.
And so, parables were stories in which you find yourself, and they are either going to just Just smack you across the face to open your eyes and see what's really going on and how you are rejecting God, or you will continue going about your life as if everything is okay. I mean, a case in point is the parable that Nathan the prophet gave to David after David sinned with Bathsheba and had her husband killed. Nathan did not walk in and say, "Well, you know, you're wrong for what you've done, and you know what you did." None of that. He's told a story: the rich man and a and a poor man. Rich man had a great flock of lambs.
Poor man had this one ewe lamb. And the rich man took the poor man's lamb when he could have easily used one of his to provide a, you know, some shewas meal for his for his guest. And what should happen to that rich man? David's response: Oh, he should die, and he should repay fourfold, or something like that. And then you are the man.
That's what parables do. Same thing is happening here. But what I want us to understand is this: this whole idea of of hell, because that's what this parable is going to cover today—the parable of the wheat and the tares. We have the idea that salvation is really about, you know, being in love with God, or getting to know God, or being in this sweet communion with Jesus. People are trying everything possible to get away from this this wrath of God that is upon you.
That if you don't turn. You will go to a place called hell. This is a place prepared for the devil and his angels. But because you reject the grace of God through the sacrificial death of Jesus on the cross, you're sending yourself to hell. That is the fundamental aspect of salvation, and we're taking it away.
In doing so, we're sort of removing the stakes, right? And if you remove the stakes, then there's no urgency of salvation. Yeah, right. I'll get saved after I've had my fun. I'll get saved once I've lived my life to the fullest, and just to get my, you know, insurance, if just in case there's something on the other side.
But there's a right now. There's an immediacy to the gospel that we're missing.
Well, certainly, you know, there are positives to getting saved. There are positives to. Accepting Jesus and and the process of salvation, we would never argue with that. But I think you're 100 right, Doctor Shaw. When we when we ignore the fact that we were saved from something, we were saved from the wrath of God, we were saved from the punishment of of the eternal punishment of our sin.
It it it softens it, it dampens it, and definitely either does away with hell or at least minimizes the idea of hell. That's what's happening in the world today. Why are people reluctant? I'm talking about Christians. Not forget about the lost world.
Forget about other religions. Forget about those who are so called atheists, agnostics, and all all of that. I'm talking about Christians. Why are they reluctant to talk about hell? It's because the goal of salvation has become something other than our justification.
By grace through faith in Christ, we were under the wrath of God, but Jesus took God's wrath upon Himself so that we could go free. We call that technically it's called the penal substitutionary atonement of Jesus for us. Once we get away from that, then of course the alternative to. Having a communion with Jesus is not having a communion with Jesus, right? Right.
The alternative to living a life pleasing to God and obeying God is. Not living a life pleasing to God and obeying God, which is a lot softer than a place called hell, where there is fire and darkness and weeping. And you are already on the way there, yeah. Until Jesus comes and snatches you out of that fire, and He did, and He has done that by His death on the cross. Yeah, yeah.
I've heard a lot of times where people will try to soften it, where they're like, you know, the worst part, the worst part about not being saved is that you'll spend eternity separated from God. You're alone. Which I mean, yes, granted. That's that's a terrible thing, but do you see? Do you hear how soft?
Well, well, that's that's exactly the point. Yeah, they think salvation is becoming one with God. Not salvation means separated from God. That's it's all connected. this This entire discussion is connected, and that's the punishment.
That's as far as it goes. That's that's the real crux of the of the issue is that you know you are just gonna be separated from God forever, which is terrible. Yeah, I've never said that that's not terrible, but don't neglect the fact that there is real t here is a literal place suffering. Take on Matthew thirteen, verses twenty four to thirty. Certain verse twenty four says another parable he put forth to them saying the kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field but while men slept his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat and went his way but when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop then the tares also appeared so the servant of the owner came and said to him sir did you not sow good seed in your field how then does it have tares he said to him an enemy has done this the servant said to him do you want us To then go and gather them up, but he said, "No, lest while you gather up the tares, you also uproot the wheat with them.
Let both grow together until the harvest. And at the time of the harvest, I will say to the reapers, 'First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into my barn.'" So, this is a very important parable—the parable of the wheat and the tares. It is often misunderstood.
Okay, what happens here?
Well, Jesus actually tells us what this parable is about. In fact, there are only three parables where Jesus actually tells us in the Gospels. He actually tells us the true meaning of those parables, and this is one of them. Matthew thirteen verse thirty six. Then Jesus sent the multitude away and went into the house.
And his disciples came to him, saying, "Explain to us the parable of the tares of the field." So, what is it all about? Number one, some people assume that this parable is about the church. They think that the wheat and the tares represent the two categories of people in the church. The wheat represent the saved, and the tares represent the lost. Let's take a quick break.
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Now let's get into the show. That—that's—I think on the surface that's how most people would see it, right? Yeah, and that's not what happens because in verse thirty-seven, listen to what Jesus says. He answered and said to them, "He who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. The field is the the world.
Oh, it's not the church. Yes, it's the entire world. It's everybody, every all people. Yeah, yeah. Okay, it's not the church.
It's the world." Some people assume that this parable is to warn us about posers. You know what a poser is? Oh yeah, yeah. I was a poser in high school. Yeah, you go.
Wore a lot of wore a lot of skate stuff. Couldn't skate. What do you mean? Like like I wore skate apparel. I hung out with skaters.
I was always there. Anytime someone asked me to skate, I was like, Oh man, I I left my board at home. We I couldn't skate. I didn't know how. I had friends like that in high school who dressed the part.
I mean, just looking at you, like, Oh man, you must be skateboarding every day after school. Never. Nah, I never did it. Yeah, no. To like to look like.
I like to look like it. Yeah, yeah. I wore. You had a hoodie. Oh yeah.
Way too big. Way too big. Shorts down to my like, but like the big shorts, like Mark Hopkins, Blink One and Two shorts. Oh yeah. If people looked at me, chain, wallet chain.
If anybody looked at me, they'd be like, that dude skates, and I would tell them like, oh man, my board is broke. Yeah, I couldn't. You can use mine, dude. Hang, I take my phone. I messed my ankle the other day.
My mom's trying to get me home, man.
Well, some people think that this parable is about posers, false Christians hiding among true Christians. They think that the similarities between the wheat and the tares was given to illustrate how false Christians look just like true Christians, and they're hiding among the church people. And is that true or false?
Well, partly true, but partly false. Yes, it is true that the tear. Or the darnel is an annoying weed that looks very much like the wheat in the early stages, but when fully developed, the leaves of the wheat are actually six to twelve millimeters wide, but the leaves of the tears are about. Three millimeters, so the tears look smaller, skinnier than the wheat.
So they were very discernible. You could tell the difference between the wheat and the tears. Yeah, but you got to wait till it grows to fruition. That's right. In the early stages, they were indistinguishable.
I mean, you you would never know, but later on, you would know.
So the servants came to the landowner or or the farmer and said, "Man, what do we do?" Because I think there are some tears there. The enemy came and sowed tears in the early stages. It may be hard to distinguish a fake Christian from a true Christian, but the time will will make it clear. Yeah, you cannot hide forever because sooner or later, the true Christian will grow, the false Christian will not. Your fruits will expose expose your true identity.
I remember the first time that you and I started talking deeper about like what we're going to say between songs during worship. You said something that has always stuck with me: is that you have to make sure that you're actually in the Word and you're actually getting it in you, because you can fool people for a little while. Yeah.
Oh yeah. Like like like when you first start like I think all worship leaders remember this when you first start like speaking briefly between songs. You start out and you feel pretty good. But then, if you're recording yourself and watching yourself, you'll notice if you're not in the Word and you're not actually planning it out according to Scripture, you're just saying the same things over and over. And it's very surfacey.
Yeah, it's very surfacey, filled with cliches. And in some churches, it's not a big deal. They can do without you. They can do without the worship. They can do without the sermon.
They will still keep running. They got plenty of money in the bank account, and they have a cemetery next door. I mean, they're gonna run this place.
So they go along with it, which is the worst thing that happens. Yeah, I prefer where you have to work for your living, where you have to make sure you work hard, and you serve the Lord, and you walk in purity and holiness, and and you have to actually make things count. Right, I prefer that. That's right. So here, you know, people refer to this this as you know fake Christian, true Christian.
And and there is a point to that. In fact, in Matthew seven and verse fifteen, Jesus said, "Beware of false prophets who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits." Do men gather grapes from thorn bushes or figs from thistles? Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. Good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Therefore, by their fruits you will know them.
So the question: Are you a wheat or a tear?
Well, the question is: Do you see yourself in this story? You cannot hide forever, and you will sooner or later know, later know that something is not right. In fact, Nicole, my wife, got saved under the preaching of this parable. Wow, that's awesome! Yeah, it was evangelist Bailey Smith.
Some of you may remember him, but Bailey Smith was phenomenal evangelist. You know, an evangelist have a certain gift. They may not always be solid expositors of the word, but they have that that calling to be an evangelist. I think all of us are called to be evangelists. Don't wait for a gift of evangelism; just share the gospel.
But Bailey Smith was was very good at getting to the heart of a person. The Holy Spirit had had had anointed him to do that, and he would preach this. This was his famous message: "Wheat and the Tares," and he began to talk about the the wheat and the tares. Isn't this what you got saved under?
Sower, sower, sower. Yeah, and she was sitting with me in in the church. I think it was a Sunday night, I believe, and and and she began to cry, and I was like. Are you okay? She's like, I I need to get saved.
I'm like, I thought you were saved. She's like, No, I'm not. Huh? I said, Okay. Wow.
And so I went down with her and. She she accepted Christ. Wow! And then she was baptized. If I am not wrong, I didn't know.
I knew that she was saved. I remember you saying that she was saved on this, but I didn't know that you were with her. Yeah, oh yeah, I was sitting right next. Wow, wow, that's cool. And so, and then I had people, friends, and and some family members also said, "Are you sure?
Are you sure?" Because you know, Bailey Smith has a way of like making you question. I was like, I look at it this way: if she was already saved. Then this did not change anything. That's right. If anything, it sort of solidified and clarified salvation.
Amen. But if she wasn't saved and she got saved, that's right. You know, so so not nothing lost there. But posers are not the main purpose of this parable. That's what I want to understand.
That's why you said partly true. Yeah, so partly there. I mean, the point is there, but it's not the the main idea. That's right. So Nicole got saved, and I praise God for that.
But the main purpose of that parable was not just to expose so-called fake Christians.
So what was it?
Well, let's keep going here.
Some people assume that this parable is warning. Not to judge, but to tolerate false believers, and even. The evil around. I've heard that before. I've heard that.
Just look, it's not your place. At the end of time, all that's going to be sorted out. All you need to do is just keep going, keep being faithful. I have certainly heard that. I don't think I've heard it related to this parable, but but I have absolutely heard people say that.
Yeah, it's not your place to judge. Yeah, God will sort all that out. Yeah, they will say, you know, you know, we just have to just let God do His work. But that's not true. I don't think that's what Jesus meant.
In fact, in reality, many, many times he called the Pharisees and the religious leaders hypocrites. He called them out. Yeah.
So if this passage was about just let live and let live until God's timing. Jesus would have not said a word about those who were fakers, yeah, posers. Yeah, it's pretty inconsistent with everything we know about Jesus' ministry and preaching. Yeah, he would never, he wouldn't have a departure right here. No, I've never once heard him say "live and let live." Don't judge; only God can judge.
So, what was the real reason for the parable? The reason behind all three parables in Matthew 13 is the question that even John the Baptist had in Matthew 11.
Okay, Matthew eleven verse two, and when John had heard in prison about the works of Christ, he sent two of his disciples and said to him, "Are you the coming one, or do we look for another?" Are you the one, or are we waiting for someone else? Not someone else, as in some prophet or some teacher or something. No, Messiah or not, are you the Messiah? Are you God's anointed king? Are you the Christ?
Are you the Son of God? Are you the promised one? If not, thank you for all the good you're doing, but we gotta find that one. Yeah, we're looking for him. Yeah, you know, for starters, why is John still in the prison?
You know, why Romans still in charge? He is. He's. He's questioning. Like, what is happening?
Like, the Messiah is here, right? But I mean, this should. I mean. I saw him and I felt it. Yeah, and I saw the Spirit coming upon him, and I even told my disciples, "I'm done.
Go after him. You know, I'm not even worthy to loosen his sandals. You go after him. I baptize you with water. He's going to baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
This is Ezekiel happening right now. Go after him. I don't know what's going on. Why are many in Israel, the religious leaders, rejecting Jesus? I mean, isn't it true that when the Messiah comes, all the hearts of the people will be open?
Why has there been no separation between the righteous and the unrighteous? Isn't that what the Messiah is going to do when he comes—separate the sheep from the goats, kind of thing? Why hasn't judgment begun? That's what. But John the Baptizer was asking because I'm sitting here in prison.
I it's like you get this this high mountaintop moment. I baptized the Messiah. He's here. Let the work begin.
Now I'm sitting in a prison. The days are ticking by, and I'm not coming out. I was sure that he was the one. Yeah, I was sure, Jesus, that you were the one. But I was also sure you are—you were going to wrap all this up.
I was sure you were going to work all this. Judgment begins now. Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. The axe is already laid at the root of the tree.
Well, he hasn't even picked up the axe yet.
So this parable is in response to that. Yes, that makes so much more sense when you think about it. Yes, like, why are you not separating them? And what Jesus is saying to them now, listen to verse thirty-seven. This here's the explanation of the wheat and the tares.
He answered and said to them, "He who sows the good seed is the Son of Man. Who is the Son of Man? Jesus. Jesus Himself. The field is the world, not the church, not the group of disciples.
More than the twelve, you know, there was a big multitude that followed Him. That's not. The field is the world. Jesus says this: the good seeds are the sons of the kingdom, but the tares are the sons of the wicked one. The enemy who sowed them is the devil.
The harvest is the end of the age. The harvest is when the end of the age, and the reapers are the angels. Not even you, yeah. You're not gathering the harvest. You are the harvest.
Yeah.
Therefore, as the hairs are gathered and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. Means not at the end of my first coming. At the end of the age, that's when this is happening. We're talking about the second coming. What's happening here are two comings.
A lot of prophecies that were given in the Old Testament had the had this double fulfillment. That, but they, but they combine them as one.
So he is coming; he will sacrifice himself, but then he will judge. And that judgment is even today in twenty twenty six is still to come. Still to come. What we find now is that oh yes, both the prophecies are correct, except there is a gap. You know, they would talk about this as the the peaks.
The two peaks. When you're looking at these two mountain peaks, like in one one angle, it looks like they're just directly behind each other, but in reality, there's a deep valley between the two peaks, right? Yeah, so that's what's happening here. I see. And then it says here in verse 41, the Son of Man will send out his angels.
And they will gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and those who practice lawlessness, and will cast them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then the righteous will shine forth in the sun, as the sun in the kingdom of their father. He who has ears to hear, let him hear.
Nowadays, many Christians do not believe in a literal hell. As a place of burning, but of course, Daniel talks about it.
Okay, Mark, Jesus quotes from Isaiah sixty six. Luke talks about it. Jude verse seven talks about suffering the vengeance of eternal fire. And of course, Revelation twenty verse ten says the devil who deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophets are. And they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
So, all that to say, why hasn't the judgment not begun?
Well, that's going to be in the second coming towards the end of time.
Someone's listening to this right now, and maybe with the time that we have, we have very little time left. But they're convinced. You know what? I'm. If I was really honest with myself right now, if something were to happen, this car I'm driving were to crash, or I just my heart was just to stop, I'm not convinced that I'd be in the field with the wheat.
I'm not convinced that I'd go to heaven. What can they do right this moment? Give your life to Jesus. Come to Him right now. He He He gave His life on the cross for your sins, and He's waiting for you.
And the Holy Spirit is drawing you. This. This talk today. Is to bring you to Christ, receive Him right now. That's right, Amen.
You didn't find this episode by accident. The Lord brought you here. The Holy Spirit brought you here to, so that God could work in your heart and draw you to a saving knowledge of who He is. And I love that story that Doctor Shaw told about his own life. You know, even if you feel like, well, I feel like I did it at some point, there is nothing stopping you right now.
There's no penalty. There is no. There's no punishment or no shame. There's nothing stopping you from making that choice, even if you're not. Ninety-nine percent sure you can be a hundred percent sure right this very moment.
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