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Now let's jump in. How do we learn more about who God is and what that means for our lives?
Well, the Bible is the source of truth about who God is. And how do we dig into God's word and really figure out his nature? Let's talk about it today on the Clean Read Today Show. You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abadan Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ.
I'm Ryan Hill, and I am flying by myself on the couch today. But today, we have a great episode of the Clear Vee Today Show as we've been unpacking more about who God is and what that means for us, talking about what we believe, dealing with deep theological issues. And I want to welcome the show today, our host, Dr. Abadan Shah. Dr.
Shah, welcome to the show today. This is good to be here, and thank you so much for hosting the show. I've really spent some time in the past couple of days just thinking about this topic. How do we understand God? You know, of course, there is the inner sense we talked about yesterday that.
Deep within a human conscience we know that there is a God.
Now, we may not have all the details about who he is, and that he is one God in three persons, and the eternality of God, and God who comes near to us, especially in the incarnation of the second person of the Godhead. All these details are there. For that we have to go to scripture. But even without those details, the very existence of God. Is In every human heart, we know.
How do we know? We just know.
Now people Argue against that. They get angry about their life and they say there is no God or they. Are very intellectually minded, and I have reasoned God out of my life. But in reality, there is a God, and they know it. You brought that up last time, talking about the inner sense, and that's such an interesting concept because you mentioned, especially when you're having a conversation with someone who claims to be an atheist.
Someone who says definitively, there is no God. God does not exist. There is no room for him in my mental landscape or my understanding of the world. It's very. Quick, but very significant to move that person from atheism to agnosticism.
Do you want to talk a little bit about that, that leap, that move, and how that kind of facilitates the conversation? Oh, absolutely. Because when somebody says, I'm an atheist, Theist. Means not a believer in God. I don't believe that He exists.
That's a very different category from being an agnostic. Agnostic Gnosticism or Gnosis is knowledge, uh, adding that alpha privative is saying that. I I don't know. I don't know. Atheism agnosticism.
What I'd like to ask an atheist is: do you have all knowledge from all the worlds? that you have you're existing in.
Well, of course I do. No, you don't. No, of course not. Is there a tiny sliver somewhere? where there is true knowledge about God.
And that sliver Is Uh y y you haven't explored. Is there a tiny sliver of knowledge somewhere that you haven't explored? And I would say much more than a tiny sliver. In fact, you probably don't even have a sliver of knowledge that exists, of all knowledge.
So Is it possible that in that tiny sliver There is A Clear. and a real awareness of the presence of God. The existence of God in that sliver. And if you have to say, well, yeah, of course, hypothetically there could be. Then let's begin with that.
Right. In that sliver there is Accurate representation of the actual existence of God.
Now we can talk about Is that really true? Who is this God? Yeah. And because you've made that concession, you have to move then from atheism to agnosticism. A massive leap.
Yeah. And, you know, we talked about this young man that we encounter a few years ago, a few months ago, or last year, really. And this, it was funny because he started out as an atheist. And by the time the conversation was over, he was an agnostic. And we're like, wow, that's a huge leap.
Yeah. Now we can talk. That leap was pretty quick. I mean, that was, we just began the conversation and he kind of within like 30, 45 seconds, quickly moved from atheism to agnosticism. And then that opened the door for further conversation.
Yeah, yeah. You know what? You're right. I do believe in God. I just don't.
Think it's the biblical. idea of God and something like that he said. I was like, Okay, at least We're on the sort of the same trajectory now. Right, right, right.
So How do we know who this God is?
Well, To get into more details about this God, we have to go to scripture. What does the Bible say about this God? The Bible in fact, assumes, simply assumes that God exists. And why is our inner sense not enough? Why is that not enough to connect us with who God is?
Inner sense is simply the awareness.
Okay. Bible gives us the actual characteristics. O who this god is What is he like? What does he What what has he been doing? What does he expect from us?
Where is he headed? The Bible gives us all the information. Our innate sense or nature cannot help us there.
So is it fair to say that our inner sense or nature or awareness of God's creation is enough to tell us that there is a God, but the Bible tells us this is who God is? Exactly.
Okay. Exactly.
Now, I know people try to say, well, everybody's got their holy books, and the Muslims have the Quran, the Hindus have their Gitas, and the Buddhists have their stuff, the Pali Canon and all that. And by the way, the Buddhists don't believe in God. Right. So let's take them off that list. You said in yesterday's episode, don't go ask them to pray for you because they're not praying to anything.
They're not praying. They're chanting. They're chanting just stuff.
So Hindus, Muslims, maybe you can throw in the Mormons in there, right? Because they're not Christian. That's not a Christian group, neither is a Jehovah's Witness. They're not Christian. They don't believe in what we believe about the living, true, triune God.
So then We need Scripture because this is where we find out. who this God is. What does He want from us? Where is he taking his tree? And And what does he want us to do?
One of my favorite messages that you ever preached was, I think it was titled Canon. I might be wrong on that, but it's where you laid out those different holy books side by side and talked about, like, okay, you think every religion has their holy book? Let's really look at the content of the Bible versus the Quran versus the books of Hinduism and Buddhism and all those kind of teachings that are held up as sacred in those different religions. And there really is no comparison. I mean, nothing even comes close to what the Bible is and what it represents.
That's right. There's zero comparison.
Well, let's just back up for a moment. The Bible simply assumes the existence of God. And we find that in the very first verse in the Bible, Genesis 1.1. In the beginning God. Yes, created the heavens and the earth, but in the beginning, God.
There's no. Like, here's where God came from. Yeah. None of that. Let me describe to you about the origin of God.
No, no. No. It's in the beginning, God. It simply assumes that God exists. And I think that's that That tells a lot.
That says a lot. Absolutely. I remember when I was in, I think I was in seminary and I was taking, you know, various theology courses. I had a professor one time tell me, like, in the first four words of scripture, there's a lot of theology packed into just those first four in English, first four words. There's so much because there was a beginning at one point.
God pre-existed that beginning, and God has always been. That's right. There's so much wrapped up into that. And then the Bible also tells us to go look at nature and see that there is. Plenty of evidence for God.
I'll give you some references here. Here's Romans chapter 1, verse 20. for since the creation of the world his invisible attributes are clearly seen. Being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse.
So Nature Is not on the same level as scripture? But it does tell you. That yes, where did all this come from? Who made all this? You say, well, this is just a natural process of evolution of billions of years of just this.
You know, back in the day, they used to say the Big Bang, or now it's something else. Uh no, n nature. Scripture says go look at nature. He is there. He made everything.
Everything had a beginning. Acts chapter 4, 17. Nevertheless, He did not leave himself without witness in that he did good, gave us rain from heaven and fruitful seasons Filling our hearts with food and gladness. Did he not leave himself without witness? There is literally, creation is testifying to the existence of God, exactly.
How does this feed into the conversation? I'm sure you've heard this: of, you know, what about the person who is stranded on a deserted island and they've lived there their whole lives and they don't have any access to scripture and there's no Bible and no missionaries? How are they held accountable before God?
Well, it's very simple for me because that kind of is a it goes in a different direction, but let's cover that while we're at it. People often bring that up. How about those people in time past who never had the opportunity to hear about Jesus Christ? How about, say, people before the coming of Christ? Did they hear?
That Jesus was coming. How about people since he came? How about people in in the heart of India, some small village. Or in Africa, or A remote part of the world where the missionaries haven't gone. There are no churches.
Have they heard?
So, will God really hold them accountable? Is God really going to send them to hell for something they never had access to?
Okay, well let's stop for a moment. Because there are a lot of assumptions being made. Right. The first assumption that is being made is that people are out there seeking the living true God. And God is just.
You know, absent. Yeah. He turns his nose up at him. Yeah. That is not true.
Humanity does not seek God. God is the one who seeks humanity. He comes knocking on the door of every single heart ever since Adam and Eve. Every single heart. I don't care who that person is.
That person may be a rich. Tycoon? He may be Genghis Khan, he may be some dictator, he may be that homeless person on the streets of India. He may be somebody living up in Alaska, in Iceland. I don't know.
You name it. Every single person ever since time began. Ever since the Garden of Eden. God has come knocking on the door of their heart. And they have an option.
Which is to Say God, who are you? Most people say I don't care to know you. You're there, but I don't care to know you. He said, Well, that's That's kind of strange. to to swallow uh they don't they they don't receive God.
Most people don't. But now let's examine the reasons why they don't. That was going to be my question.
Some people don't receive God because. Generationally, generationally. their cultures. their traditions have so So engulf them and their thinking. that they would rather live in this tradition, these cultural maxims, rather than to say, no, this is not real.
There is God and I want to find out who He is so I can worship him and love him. No, they're so dull. And they've chosen to be.
So Then the question comes up, well then there is no No, there is. There are people. throughout history who have said Enough is enough. I want to know the living true God. And here's what God does.
Even before they choose to do that. His plan is already operating because he knows what's going to happen. He knows that there is that person in the 16th century who is going to look for the living true God. And he's already begun operating in the twelfth century to create a group of people who will be missionaries to send the gospel three hundred years down the road. to that person.
Gosh, that's incredible to think about. I think about my own dad. I was just, I think it makes you think about your dad. I mean, he grew up in a Muslim home. Yeah.
Very well off. Not a dysfunctional home. I mean, this was a loving home. This was not a home like you know, you sometimes people think of the fundamentalist Muslim homes, women are you know covered up and and all that kind of stuff. That's not true.
Th th this was a very educated, open-minded type home. But still Muslim. And they didn't have to be like hardcore Muslims. They just had to be just: you're a Muslim. You're born a Muslim, you grow up a Muslim, you marry a Muslim girl, you make tons of money.
Live a good life? And then That's it. That's just what we do. That's what we do. And that's okay.
Enjoy life. He had several experiences. One was watching his grandfather pray. And his grandfather was a very pious Muslim man, had been to Mecca on pilgrimage, all that kind of stuff. But When my grandfather or his grandfather, my great-grandfather, finished praying.
My father went to him and said. Grandpa. God's going to have a very special place for you in heaven. Allah is going to really bless you when you get to heaven. And His grandfather, my great-great-grandfather, began to weep.
I mean, the tears came down his face. He had a long beard. He said, Son, There is no guarantee that I will be in heaven. Is a What does that mean? It means that in Islam there is no assurance of salvation.
In fact, there is no salvation. There is no assurance of eternal life.
So, what happens on the day of judgment? There is a day of judgment. On this day of judgment, you have to walk across this very fine. Bridge, this bridge that is sharper than a sword, thinner than a human hair, you have to walk across that bridge and and From the judgment throne. To the end of the bridge on the other side is heaven, below is hell.
a lake of fire.
So, you obviously cannot make it across. You're gonna fall. Unless Allah In his Mercy chooses to let you come across. I mean, this is real Islam. There's a lot of caricatures out there.
Fables and stories about what you can kill and all that and go to heaven. I don't know where they get all that from.
Some of that is anecdotal. But. This is the real This is what they really believe. But there's no guarantee. There's no merit of saying, like, because I have done this, Allah will.
Yeah, you can observe the five pillars of Islam and still not be able to get on the other side. Unless. Allah Thinks you can. And he allows you to do it. What a hopeless existence.
Yeah, that's exactly what it is. And most Muslims. They don't know that. You know, they or they know that, but they go, Oh, I'm going to have mercy anyways. But in reality, there is no assurance of salvation because there is no salvation.
Golly.
So, your dad witnessed that conversation with your great-grandfather. Right. And that planted a seed of doubt in his heart. Like, If that is the case. Then, why are we doing all this?
What is the point? What is the point of all this? Because there is a God. You know, even the Greeks believed that. The whole idea of atheism was there even among the Greeks.
I'm not going back to the classical period. But those who didn't believe in God were looked upon as strange creatures. They were like You don't believe in God?
Now, Greeks. made a lot of different gods and goddesses. But there existed in their minds that there is a one God.
Now we have created this an entire pantheon of The gods of Olympus and the gods of Delphi and all that stuff. But in reality, There is something someone there. When someone would say there is no God, they would look at him and go, You're. You're dumb. Mm-hmm.
So even as a Muslim, he knew there was a God. Although Now his faith was shaken that Allah is not the one.
So I still believe that there is a God out there, but I now I don't think it's Allah. Allah is not the one. Wow. And then other things happened in his life, like he almost got struck by lightning and things of that nature. And that's when he began to search.
And he said, God, if you're there, Reveal yourself to me. and if you reveal yourself to me, then I will follow you.
Now, had your dad been exposed to scripture in any form at this point, the Bible at all? He was exposed to his cousin who had become a Christian.
Okay. His cousin had accepted Christianity, and he got ostracized by the family. And he would pray and he would read the Bible around my dad. And so they had this debate going on between them.
So there was that exposure, but it was not like, oh, okay, my cousin led me to the Lord. It was not like that. It was just an exposure. And then He began the search. He went into the mountains looking for the holy men, the sadhus to talk to him, the gurus to teach him.
How to find life, how to find the meaning of life. And he searched. Islam he was done with. He was like, this is not working. And those who really read the Quran and really understand the tenets, they know it doesn't work.
Hinduism It did not work. Buddhism, there's nothing to work.
So after trying all that, someone said you need to read the Bible. And so he purchased a copy of the Bible. I think it was a second-hand copy, I believe. but he purchased a copy of the Bible and he began to read. And in reading that Bible, he came to John 3.16, where he He Saw the gospel for the first time.
So, this perfectly encapsulates the trajectory that we've been on through yesterday's episode and today's episode. That inner sense was enough to sort of push him away from Islam and push him toward: like, there is a God out there. It's not the one that I've grown up believing in. It's not the one that my family worships or wants me to worship. There is a God out there, but I've got to figure out who this God is and what that means for me.
And through exploring all these different things, he lands on scripture and he's walking through God's word. And he's led to, I mean, the quintessential verse for the gospel of John 3:16. There's a reason that everybody knows John 3.16. There's a reason they hold it up at sports signs. Baseball players have it on their eye black.
There's a reason it's on all of that because it is. The gospel in germ form. Absolutely. And that's that's. What saved him?
He saw the plus sign. He was a student of mathematics. And he saw the plus sign in the cross where God was Attaching humanity to himself. That's what he felt like. He said the cross is where Fallen, sinful humanity or human beings are given the chance to.
come to know or attach themselves To the living, true, holy God. And it happens in the person of Jesus Christ. That's good. I'm going to use that with a math student if you're in the conversation. I'm going to tuck that away for a little bit.
That's right. You know?
So that's how it happened for him. But he was not an atheist. By the way, he even tried communism because back in the fifties communism was coming to India, socialism was coming to India. And so he even tried that, you know, he he j he's just talk about putting on the red bandana or or this red red red like a headman, they would tie and walk through the streets, you know. fighting for the the the poor working class And then he realized this is garbage.
He was a very smart man. My dad was very intelligent.
So he realized very quickly communism is just these fallen human beings doing to others what they think others have done to them. I mean, it's nothing, nothing good about it.
So, all those in our country today who are being maybe swept up in this Insurgents that's happening. Maybe that's a conversation for a different episode. No, I mean, it is so true because and by the way, who does most of these these socialist communist movements are usually the privileged, the educated, the ones who have it all. Because When you're sitting in your Nice. You know, classrooms with all your library at your hand, and then you go to the cafeteria and have all the meals cooked for you.
And then you have mom and daddy sending you money from home, and you have your fancy cars, and even if you don't have some of these extravagant things, but you feel like, oh yes, I can experiment with things, and I think I can make the world better if I go along with this hip professor who's telling us how we can make everybody equal. And then when everybody's equal, we can all live the utopian life. Yeah, that doesn't work like that. It does not work like that. It is absolutely the privilege to tend to be led down that road.
So, your dad encounters John 3:16, gives his life to the Lord. And we've talked about this on the show before, but it was not an easy road for him from there. But praise God for his faithfulness. And, you know, he's your dad is the reason that we're sitting where we are today. I mean, I've told you this before, but I can't wait to sit down with him in heaven and get to know him a little bit better.
For the person who's listening, we've got a little bit of time left on the show. We've talked about nature, we've talked about inner sense, but. I've seen this a lot, I feel like, on my social media and on my algorithms of people who are, they haven't been in church, or maybe they grew up in church but had walked away for a while. Like, I'm going to church for the first time, I'm picking up a Bible for the first time, I don't know where to start, give me some recommendations. If that person is listening to this broadcast and they're like, I know that there is something out there, and I'm holding a Bible in my hands, but I don't know anything about it, and I don't know where to start.
What should they do? You know, Paul says something very powerful in 2 Corinthians 4. And I want to read that for our listeners, our viewers, because it will help you understand why some people see it and some people don't. And the ones who are willing to say yes to God, it's like the veil is lifted. God is already working on sending that gospel to you.
Oh wait, there's a knock on the door? The gospel is there. Wow. God has already coordinated that.
So What does Paul say in 2 Corinthians 4 verse 3? But even if our gospel is veiled, It is veiled to those who are perishing. Yeah. whose minds the God of this age has blinded. Who do not believe?
Lest the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine on them.
So the gospel is veiled. But as well to those who are perishing, Whose mind the gods, minds the god of this age, has blinded. The god of this age. The world, the flesh, the devil, the God of this age, the culture, the God of this age, the humanity that shakes his fist towards heaven while using everything that comes down from heaven. That God Has blinded your eyes.
But when the knock comes on the door of your heart, You don't have to open your eyes. You simply have to acknowledge in your heart: yes, there is a knock on the door. And when you acknowledge that and say, God, I hear you knocking. God opens your eyes. That's it, that's as simple.
And that has what happened throughout history. I mean, you go back in time and you there you see. A Ruth Who says to her, to Naomi, you know, your people are my people, your God will be my God. She's a Moabite. Moabite, you know, I mean, these are people who were outside.
were kept outside and told, don't allow them to come in. She sees it. If you go for the back. You have uh Rahab. The prostitute who said, We've heard, we've heard what you are doing.
God is with you. Our strength has failed us. And then all of a sudden, there's a plan of salvation waiting for her. and for her family. down to the ages, you see again and again, you have a Cornelius.
who is praying, and then Peter is sent. To to speak to him. I mean, how much more can we say? And throughout the ages, anybody who says, yes, Lord, I mean, God says Yeah, there you go. The veil is lifted.
And God has already been working to bring you the gospel because He knew what you would do. That's a foreknowledge of God. But you have a choice. And just because The the God knows everything. And he has already worked out the plan of salvation for you.
People think, oh, he only chooses some and not the others. No, no, no. He already knew your choice. And because he knew your choice, just like he'd go to a restaurant, If you know what your wife loves or your husband loves, you pick out the if they step away and go to the restroom or something, you say, I don't know what he's gonna get, this right here. God already knows that.
and He has already planned everything for you. All you have to do is say yes, Lord. Yes, God. That's amazing. We hope that you enjoyed today's episode.
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