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Now let's jump in. Everything we experience or perceive in this world is temporary, and yet we serve a God who is eternal and outside of time. How do we handle that? That's today's conversation on the PV Today Show. You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr.
Abadan Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis. Welcome to the show. Welcome to our studio.
We're so glad you're joining us on the Clearview Today show, especially if today's your first day. We want to hear from you. You can text today, T-O-D-A-Y-252-429-6069. That's T-O-D-A-Y-252-429-6069. We're here today with our host, Dr.
Abaddon Shah. Dr. Shah, finishing VBS week out strong. Absolutely. Absolutely.
You know what time it is? What time is it? The time for us to talk about God's time listen. There you go. You know, we did a series not long ago about entering the Christ time.
And I don't know if that's a topic we'll cover today, but you definitely, definitely want to put that in the search bar of this podcast and listen to it because it opens so many people's eyes to how God and time work together. Man, it was so good because we try to reduce this to a simplistic discussion about God and his relationship to time. God is simply outside of time.
Well, it's not quite. Quite that simple. And that series talking about Christ time and how there's this whole other time experience that we talk about when we're Christians. It was so incredible.
So, so. Mind-stretching to think about. When we try to understand time, we're going to turn to people like Doctor Strange. We're going to turn to Marty McFly. We're going to turn to Stephen Hawking.
We're going to turn to pretty much everybody, even if they're fictional, before we turn to the Bible. Yeah. And the Bible teaches us that we are time-bound individuals, beings, and eternity is not where time shall be no more. No time shall still be there because we are finite beings, albeit we're going to live with God in eternity. As saved, but those who are lost will also live forever in hell.
But God Has a whole different time scale.
Okay. And so it's much more than just he's outside of time. There's so much more to that. That's right. And it's not just that one day we're going to see God outside of time.
He's already outside of time. He's operating right now outside of time. That's right. And we need to step into that realm and see life from his perspective. That's right.
It was so, it was so wonderful. It was such an incredible way to think about time and way to think about God's relationship to us. And, you know, it's difficult for us to wrap our minds as time-bound beings around the concept of the eternal, around the concept of God's timelessness. But that's, that's our discussion tonight. If you're listening, yeah, and if you're listening to this show for the very first time, you're dropping in in the middle of a series where we are getting to know God better.
You know, there's lots of podcasts and lots of shows that will just teach you doctrine, but we want to teach you doctrine that's actually going to help you day to day in your Christian life. All of us want to get to know God. And so who is God? We've talked about his holiness. We've talked about his invisible nature.
But also, God is timeless. We're going to talk about what that means. Yes, God is eternal.
Some people call it. God's omnitemporality. I I'm okay with that because it has some issues there. But when we say that God is eternal, what we're saying is that God has no beginning. He has no end or succession of moments in his own being, and he sees all time equally vividly.
Yet, God sees events in time and acts in time.
So it's. Almost seems like it's contradictory, but it's not.
So he is In a sense, outside of time, and yet he acts in time.
So we're going to see what that means. Yeah, I think about like God, like I always see it like God is up there and he's got like the film strip of all of history. And like he's just as present in George Washington's day as he is with me right now. He doesn't see George Washington's day as like, all right, that's in the past. That's over.
He's present in it right this moment. Yeah, absolutely. And yet also with us. Yeah, which makes sense when you think about things like God interacting with people and prophets and God giving them visions of what's to come. Think about the Apostle John and the revelation that God gave him.
You know, God is present here, he's present in the past, he's present in the future. And so he will temporarily give people a glimpse as to what he is already, where he already is. And that's the thing that like every single philosophy 101 student always wants to bring about.
Okay, so like everything has a cause, everything has a beginning.
So who created God? Where's where's his beginning? Like they think that's the biggest gotcha. Anybody, any 18, 19-year-old who takes one philosophy class. they think they've disproved Christianity.
Yeah, but so much, so much more to that. When we discuss God's eternality, The place to begin is to understand that God is timeless in a sense that means no beginning or end. And all that is coming straight from Scripture. Here's one, Psalm ninety, verse two. Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever you had formed the earth and the world, Even from everlasting to everlasting, you are God.
in a sense from vanishing point to the vanishing point. You are God. What does that mean, the vanishing point to the mainstream? beyond which you cannot see.
Okay, both Front and back. You cannot see beyond that point. It's like your vision becomes blurry. Your mind cannot comprehend. You know, sometimes people have told me that it's like when I think about uh eternal life or everlasting and what that means, it's like my brain begins to hurt.
Yeah. You know, I just cannot seem to comprehend like what is that And and personally, I don't even try to think like that. Yeah. Because Some of those things are just beyond our Our human ability to comprehend.
So, I'm not even going to try to comprehend, let alone explain. Let alone explain. Yeah. And why is that? Because the study of physics tells us that matter, space, and time must all occur together.
Before God created the heavens and the earth, There was no time. Moment by moment is what we're talking about. God does not have a moment by moment life. He is there, just there. That is a time on a whole different level.
Yeah, that's completely different from how you and I experience time. We exist in a series of moments. Right. And our existence is dependent on time. But he is existence.
Does that make sense? I don't know if that's even the right way to think about it, but he's completely existentists. Yeah, that's a good way to say that. Yeah, he just is existence. He's not.
Dependent on a clock. Yeah. Yeah. Like a series of click. Click Click no.
And time to time, God's people were able to enter into that time. and see things from his perspective. They were able to enter in and see how God could Called Abraham and how Abraham saw something way out there in the distance. And it was not like, oh, I hope that happens. It was like already accomplished.
I mean, you know, it talks about that. If you read the faith chapter in the book of Hebrews, chapter 11. How is that? Because these people were able to enter into the Christ time and were able to see things that were not as if they were.
So, when we hear something like the lamb slayed from the foundation of the world, it means like, is that what it's saying? Like, once before the world was set or even before the world was set, Christ was already crucified. He was already done. Yes, it was done. You know, our salvation has been accomplished.
So entering into that, what does that do? Is this just some kind of a theological gymnastics just to kind of dazzle your mind? No, it is to give us assurance. Mm-hmm. That we are not just an accident of nature.
We're not just you know, happenstance or a chance, there's something very preordained in this. The God's sovereign plan has been has been there sense beyond. And and stepping into that time We begin to see wow, God is amazing. God is all-powerful. He's much, much, much bigger than I ever imagined.
And And his if he was all this and is all this, Then imagine what more is coming. Yeah. So, in the moment, if you think of your problems, whether they are financial problems, whether they are relationship struggles, whether they are Just fear about the future. or health problems or whatever you're struggling with and wondering, is this going to ever get fixed? Is this ever going to resolve itself?
What's going to happen next? When you enter into the Christ time, when you enter into that realm that belongs to God, from God's perspective, you are seated. In the heavenly places in Christ Jesus. That's true. Yeah.
You're already there. You've already made it through. You're already on the other side. Yeah. Ephesians chapter 1.
That's what. Paul is talking about. That we are seated in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus. What, how, when? Yeah, not you will be sat in those places.
You are there. You know, one of the tricks that I learned a long time ago was like, if something's ever bothering me, just add time to the equation and it won't bother you. Like, man, my wife said something to me that really hurt me. But I probably won't care much about that tomorrow. I definitely won't care about it next week.
Absolutely not next year. But that's a solution just by adding time. Imagine removing time completely, like you said, like in the light of heaven, in the light of who God is, all these things that bother me that I spend my time worrying about and thinking about, they really don't amount to much. Hail in comparison. Yeah.
Yeah. That's crazy. And that's, you know, Ann Jarvis wrote that book called Paul and Time. And again, I don't agree with every single tenet of that book, but overall, it opened my eyes to how. Paul uh saw time how The other saints of God, men and women, saw time.
And when they were able to step into that realm. And see life from God's perspective. It was like, All of a sudden they saw Moses right there. You know, at the burning bush a Moses uh standing before Pharaoh. Or or they saw David standing before Goliath.
Oh they saw Nehemiah coming to rebuild the walls with incredible opposition from every direction, or they saw Paul. And Silas in that Philippine jail, you know, I mean, you just go down the list. And it's like, okay, I see if he's faithful there, and I see him being faithful here and here and here. He's going to be faithful to us. Patrick Chau, what would your response be to someone who listens to all this and they say, Well, God sees everything.
God is already there. God's already in the future. And He's sovereign over all things. Then it doesn't really matter what I do because God's in control of everything. He's already worked it out anyway.
So what's the point of living a life of obedience to God? We are. At times, God allows us to get a glimpse of that Christ time to step into that realm and see that, but we're still finite beings. We still have to learn and grow. We don't stay there in that realm, we do come down.
And we do have to make that doctor's appointment. We do have to go and make that payment. We do have to, you know, face that person.
So, all those things don't go away.
So, we are still time-bound, we still have a past. we still have to learn and grow and mature. And so Because of that Because if all God did was like allow us to get into the Christ time, we would never Mature and grow. We will live in someone else's world. and never be part of it.
So, allowing us to live, and I know this may be a little too deep for some people, allowing us to live. In time. God has It's by his grace he's allowed us to learn and grow, fall, and stand up and trust God more, be humbled. And rely upon his grace more. I mean, all these things are what we need.
So, does all this matter? Yes, it matters. Let's say that someone's listening to this and they're saying, Yeah, this is a little deep for me. I'm a good old country boy. I've got, you know, country boy problems and whatever else.
I've got, you know, how does this help me, Dr. Shah? How can I be time-bound and still worship a timeless God? How do I reconcile who He is with who I am? Oh, absolutely.
So, when you're going through difficult times or when you are. unsure about the future or when you have Ask God to open your eyes to what He is doing. And that In a sense, is what Christ's time is. He will allow you to step into that realm and see others who have gone before you. Who fell?
But God lifted them up, who struggled, and God Met their needs. And then see what the word has said about what God has prepared for you. You know, Jesus did that with his disciples. He said, I go to prepare a place for you so that where I am, there you may be also. And what was Jesus doing there?
He said, Oh, he was prophesying or he was telling them about the future. No, he was telling someone like Thomas Thomas you're concerned about this life and you're afraid about what's happening. A steppin' with me to another place. I may be going away for a little while and you may not see me because he says all that to me. But just know.
That there is a life beyond that. What's about to happen in this week, where I will be taken, betrayed, beaten. And mocked and then crucified. All that's gonna happen is gonna shake you. But don't lose heart.
Because I am going to prepare a place for you. You see that? There's a there's a place coming. And We're gonna live there forever.
So Temporarily I'll be separated from you. But we're going to come back together. I know there are many people who are listening that wish they were on the receiving end of that conversation with Jesus. There are people who are struggling with doubt, people who are struggling with insecurity, or people who are struggling with, man, I have so many unanswered questions or feel like my prayers are going unanswered. Dr.
Shaw, what encouragement would you give to that person who's sitting and listening, wishing they could step into that Christ time? I mean, just pray, look to God, daily trust Him. And he will come through for you. Yeah. Understand more about him.
I mean, that's what we're doing here. That's right. That's right. I think, you know, when you said that, Ryan, that kind of got me to thinking. And maybe, Dr.
Sha, you can expand on this, but I feel like if you're listening to this show, you're on the receiving end of that conversation right now. Yeah. Maybe the Holy Spirit has brought you here to this show, this episode on today, a point in time. To help you to take that next step if you haven't done so already. Or maybe you don't fully know what it means.
Dr. Sha, how does Jesus change everything, right? Like, how does Jesus come into our lives at a point in time? And prepare us for eternity.
Well, Jesus talked a lot about this. You know, he talked about this. to the disciples he talked about His Relationship With Abraham.
So Again. Read the scriptures. See what Jesus did.
So, one of the things that it tells us in John 8, verse 56. Jesus said to those who did not believe in him, He said, Your Father Abraham rejoiced to see my day. Again, folks, to those who are listening or watching us. This is that Christ time. This is God's time.
Abraham saw his day. He said, Well, maybe he saw him in the future. Yes, that's what we're talking about. Abraham was able to step into God's time and see. down the generation There was the Son of God.
And how did his response? How did he respond? It said he saw it and was glad. Then the Jews said to him, You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham? And Jesus said to them, Most assuredly, I say to you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Best mic drop in the whole Bible. I've always loved this passage. And then they took up stones to throw at him. And then Jesus sort of went away from there.
So. All that to say, God is timeless, no beginning, no end. God sees all time equally vividly.
So when we step into his world, you know, By faith. We're also able to see All times vividly. We will never be God. Even in Heaven, we will never get to a place where Amen. There's no time to me.
I'm an eternal being. No, no, no. You will always be time-bound. The reason you're eternal is because God has allowed you to keep living. Right.
So it's interesting that you say that. I think some people are confused on that, like the concept of time in heaven. Because if we're going to be in God's presence in heaven and God Himself is, we talk about Him being outside of time, will we then not be outside of time in heaven? Will we just be floating ethereally on clouds and plucking harps and singing the chorus of holy, holy, holy? I don't know if this is sing a million times on repeat.
I don't know if this is an accurate way to think about it, but even definitionally, like God is infinite because He is outside of time, but He also has no beginning. Even if I live forever with God, I still had a beginning. You know what I'm saying? Like for something to be infinite. I think it has to go both ways infinitely, like on a line, on the number line.
And even when we die and are in heaven, we won't be infinite. We can't be infinite. Because I'm a gang. Right. Yeah.
We are dependent beings. Yes. God is the only independent being. The Angels are not independent. We are not independent.
Only God is completely independent. We will always be dependent on God. The reason we will live forever in heaven or hell is because God is allowing us to live. Of course, heaven is where you want to be because that's life of joy, peace with our Savior. Hell is not where you want to be, but He will allow your life to continue in judgment in hell forever.
But we will always be dependent. That's right. You know?
So. Events in time and he acts in time.
Okay, these are some of the things we're learning about the eternality of God.
So Galatians chapter 4. Verse four and five says When the fullness of time had come, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who are. Who were under the law that we might receive the adoption of the Son.
So even though God is eternal, He lives in a different time, that's His time. Yet for our sakes he appeared in time. That's very unique. Yeah. How would you respond to someone?
I want to go back to something you said just a second ago. God will allow, God allows our lives to continue in eternity, whether that's in heaven or in hell. He is the reason that our lives continue to move forward. How would you respond to the person who says that? unjust or unmerciful of God to allow a person to continue in eternal torment?
Like, why does why does the punishment need to be eternal?
Well, we can come to that in a different lesson where we talk about God's justice. But here I would say You know, God is just? And he has made every opportunity for you to receive him. Salvation is a free gift. every person who has ever been born.
Has been given the opportunity to receive God's free gift of salvation before Jesus came, it was given. as a promise that one day his son was coming. He was going to come to the line of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
So as long as you are trusting in that coming one. you can have eternal life. Once Jesus came, Now it's more looking back. Trusting in what has already happened.
Now what has the world done?
Sometimes individually, sometimes collectively, we have rejected the truth of God. That's what Romans 1 is all about.
So why doesn't the gospel come to this one person living in this small, forgotten village in the mountains somewhere in India, or in Africa, or in because for generations they have so closed their eyes to the things of God So the gospel doesn't come. It's not God's fault, it is their rejection.
So Either way, Whether you actively say, No, I don't want to hear about Jesus. Or Because you're so blind. Because of generations of rejection. Either way. You are rejecting every single moment God's hand of friendship.
So, to say that, oh, it's not fair for me to be in hell forever and ever, no, you have all your life rejected God's. Hand of friendship. Why shouldn't God send you to hell? You also said this at the very beginning of this series: is that for us to go forward and really getting to know God, we have to do it on his terms. Right?
We can't come to a place where we're trying to understand God and say, but well, but that's not fair, though, that's not just, that doesn't sound right to me.
Well, now we've completely missed the point of the exercise because we're getting to know God. You know what I'm saying? We're coming to Him on His terms. And so, Dr. Shum, maybe as we're wrapping up the show, we got about maybe 10 minutes left.
Talk to us a little bit about the reality of eternity. Because I think, as time-bound beings, you're right, we don't really understand. Eternity, which means we don't really understand the stakes of what we're doing.
Well, I would say two or three things here very quickly. First is, You are limited by time. Do not procrastinate. If you're listening to this broadcast. And Or this episode, or this podcast, and you know that you need to give your heart to Jesus, do it today.
Don't wait till tomorrow, don't wait till next month.
Next year, when things settle down, you may not have that opportunity. You said, what do you mean?
Something bad can happen to you. or you may get to a point where you cannot hear the voice of God. Yeah. That can also happen. You can so close yourself off, your thoughts are so overwhelmingly anti-God that you cannot hear the voice of God anymore.
So Amos chapter six verse three says woe to you who put far off The day of doom, who caused the seat of violence to come near. That is the God's judgment to come near them.
So If you're the kind who are putting far off the day of doom, the day of judgment, the day of reckoning, Today's the day. That's right. Give your life to Christ. Secondly, You exist in only one time at a time. You exist in only one time at a time.
which means don't try to change the past. Don't try to live in the past. and do not presume about the future. I think we just talked about that in James. Yeah.
Yeah. Means this, the present is all you really have. That's right. And Jesus said the same thing. You know, he talked about them.
Sufficient for the day is his own trouble. Yeah. James talks about that in James four. Come now you who say, to day, to morrow we shall go to such and such a city, spend a year there, buy, sell, make profit, whereas you do not know what will happen to morrow. But what is your life?
For if it's even a vapor that appears for a little time and then vanishes away, why do you. Presuming on the future. Old Testament talks about it as well in Proverbs 27, verse 1. Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth. Isaiah fifty-six verse twelve come one says I will bring wine And we will fill ourselves with intoxicating drink tomorrow.
Will be as today. And much more abundant. No, you don't have tomorrow. That's right. That's not a guarantee.
Yeah, so. Don't presume on the future, but don't try to live in the past or try to change the past. That's another lesson for people. Who are You know, just just obsessing over something from the past. They almost feel like if I could only reset time, if I could only go back in time, I would.
You can do that. That's right. The only thing that you have is the present. That's right. So, talk to us a little bit about that.
In the five minutes that we've got left, somebody is in desperate need of repentance. Maybe somebody is listening on the radio and they turned here by accident, but they're invested. This is the moment where they're like, okay, I think I need to give my life to Jesus. Do it now. It's very simple, said Jesus save me.
You don't have to know all the theology. about God. You don't have to fix your past. None of that. All you can do is write now, ask Jesus to save you.
And just know that when he saves you. God forgives your past, present, and future. It is all done.
So. So make that choice right now and start living for him today. God has given you a gift of life. Use it for God's kingdom. What you do for Jesus Christ will last forever.
So repent today. Psalm 90, verse 8 says, You have set our iniquities before you, our secret sins in the light of your presence, means God knows everything about you. Jeremiah 16, 17, for my eyes are on all their ways they are not hidden from me, nor is their iniquity concealed from my eyes. Again, Hebrews 4.13 And no creature is hidden from his sight. but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of Him to whom we must give account.
But if you pray and ask him to save you, What is the promise here? Isaiah 43, 25. I, I am he who blots out your transgressions for my own sake, and I will not remember your sins. Jeremiah thirty one thirty four, I will forgive their iniquity and I will remember their sin no more. Hebrews eight twelve for I will be merciful toward their iniquities and I will remember their sins no more.
Hebrews ten seventeen then he adds I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more. Seems like God just want wants to just forget your sins. But he can't do that unless you come to Jesus. That's right. That's right.
And this is where the timelessness of God, this is where the rubber meets the road, so to speak. This is where it becomes, you know, a doctrine that God is timeless. And here's the manner in which he exists versus how it's going to benefit you and your Christian life. In fact, how it could save your eternal soul. That's right.
It's so, so impactful for us to think about the God who is so powerful and so infinite and so timeless, and yet who loves us and has provided a means of forgiveness and a means of salvation for us. Man, more so than we could ever ask or deserve. God is so gracious to us and so loving and so kind. That's right. And for the person who is listening to this, if you even are that one person out of the millions of people listening to this broadcast right now, if you accepted Christ, you can text us and let us know.
We're going to get connected with you. It's not going to go in some inbox. It's going to come straight to us, the three of us sitting here on this couch.
So make sure you text us today, T-O-D-A-Y-252-429-6069. We're going to reach out to you personally and we're going to help you take those next steps. Again, that's T-O-D-A-Y. You're going to text it at 2522. 352-429-6069.
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We'll see you next time on Clearview Today. Mm-hmm.
