You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abadan Shah, the daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis, and welcome to the Clearview Today Studio. We got a great day of conversation.
We've been going very, very strong. Episodes around it. But, ladies and gentlemen, we are here to introduce our host, Dr. Abadan Shah, the birthday boy himself, who's a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, professor at Carolina University, author, full-time pastor, and the host. Today's show.
Thank you. And they're blowing revelling for you, my friend. It's good to see you.
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So go ahead and get the app if you haven't already. That's right. Our verse of the day today is coming to us from Colossians chapter 2, verse 8. Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. Comes up, right?
And I would say that our nation is theologically confused or just theologically absent today, but it's usually because of these philosophical, uh, uh relative mindsets or world views that are completely divorced from the Judeo-Christian principles that founded this nation. And we've been talking about that a little bit, but I'm I'm interested to know kind of what your thoughts are on where we are as a nation theologically today. Everybody makes some kind of a truth claim. You know, I don't believe there's a God. But that is a truth claim.
Right. I believe there are many ways to God. That is a truth claim. Be careful when you say that. And then tell us.
You cannot say what you're saying, that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life. Which is also a truth claim. You're claiming that this is a truth. Right. Is there any difference between a personal belief And a truth claim?
Or are they pretty much synonymous? I mean, you can have beliefs that are just mythological. Beliefs that you know they're not true.
So that can definitely be the case. But truth claim goes a step. Much many steps further because it claims this is fact.
So I was playing out the conversation on my head that someone could say, well, you know, I'm not saying that it's the truth, I just believe it. But then begs the question: why do you believe it if you don't think it's the truth? Right. Yeah, there may be some sort of belief that somebody holds onto because it's comforting to them or because that it's maybe a tradition that they're a part of. But like you said, a truth claim is beyond the person.
They're saying this is absolute truth that applies to everyone. I could claim that unicorns are real. Right. And I don't know for a fact, but I believe it, and so they're real to me. That is not a truth claim.
That is not a truth claim. You're already saying. They're not real, but I believe it. But truth claims, by definition, just by that designation, truth you're claiming to be true. Right.
And you have to be careful because. Um when you attack someone else and say, No, you're not right. which often happens to Christians. When we claim that Jesus is the way, truth, and life, or Jesus is the Son of God, or Jesus died and rose again, they say, oh, that cannot happen.
Well you're making a truth claim, right? I was trying to think in my head: like, how can we keep it from people turning around on us as Christians and saying, well, you can't say that Jesus is the only way, truth, and life, because you're making a truth claim that applies to everyone else. But, The conversation is almost always, you can't say that because it offends me. Right. And the flip side of that is like, as Christians, you can believe something that is incorrect.
You have the freedom to be wrong. But we're going to, out of love, out of obligation to what God has called us to do, we're going to tell you that you're wrong. That's right. And that's the thing. If you're saying, my truth claim is false because it offends you.
Think about so many truth claims out there. A beauty pageant is a truth claim. Yeah, it's very true. These people are considered to be beautiful.
Now, somebody was sitting there saying, Well, my children are beautiful, or my daughter is. I mean, that's fine. That's a truth claim you're making. Um You know, our David just mentioned no absolute truth. There is no absolute truth.
Well, that's a truth. That's a truth claim. That's an absolute truth in and of itself.
So I People do these kind of things all the time.
So how can I then say My truth claim is accurate, or your truth claim is false. I have to give evidence. Right. What you're not saying is that truth claims are to be avoided. We can't make truth.
You're not saying that. Right. I'm saying now you have to give proof of why you believe what you believe. If you believe that there are many ways to God, then let's look at what is your way. Right.
Let's just take Islam, for example. Islam is not a way to God. It's a submission to God.
Now, does Islam have a concept of salvation? It doesn't. Islam will say you have to Say the Shahada. Mm-hmm. You have to be a good Muslim.
And on the day of judgment, God will decide whether or not to let you in.
So are you saved? We don't know. You don't know until you get there. Not until that day. Submission to God.
Submission to Allah could benefit you, but it might not. Yeah, it it that that that is not Going to factor in on whether or not you will be in heaven. Because it it will just, I guess, make you a good Muslim. a follower of Allah. But does it really mean that that adds In your account, or goes into your account.
On the day of judgment, that you were. No, it's completely up to the sovereign will of Allah on the day of judgment whether or not to let you in. That's a That is not the same way to say I receive Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior.
Sometimes people equate that with a Shahada, which is there is only one God and Uh Muhammad is his prophet. But That is not the same thing as inviting Jesus into your life. Right. They think because I said that, because I say I accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior, now, okay, now I'm a good Christian. And now I'm quote unquote in the club.
That's simply stating something. Right. Right. In Hinduism, there is no salvation. If you want to call salvation, it's simply escaping the cycle of life.
The cycle of being born, dying, reincarnation, and then. Coming back again and again until you finally find that freedom. I've never understood, I've never understood the desire to scale. Like, if you don't remember anything about your past life, You're not living these old centuries-long sufferings, then what is the why? Is it desirable to escape?
Is it just because they think life is inherently suffering? Yeah, and life is suffering. And B uh Buddha, we we call him Buddha, um He was the one who finally was sick of it. This holes. Life is suffering, and to escape life is the ultimate goal.
For them, though, what is that escape? It's not eternal existence somewhere, is it? No, it's just um just Just annihilation? Just complete, you're over. You just cease to exist.
Cease to exist. Just done. You're done. We like to think of these, especially here in the Bible Belt, we like to think of these as far-off foreign Eastern religions that don't really have much to do with us in America. But do you see these mindsets?
They're here. They're here. Because a lot of people will say, I have people I'm praying for, have been praying for for many years. How do they see eternity? They see it as I don't believe in anything.
And at the end of life, it's simply. Um, it is what it is. What happens to you? I don't know. There's nothing.
Nothing.
So, do you exist somewhere?
Well, in the memories of people. Oh, I hate that. Remember that time, you know, we were having a cup of coffee or when we went fishing or when he fell, or that's. All it comes down to. But even that's temporary because eventually someone will.
I mean, you'll die out. Your friends will die out. Then, then you just, that's just like that. Unless you accomplished something great or you did something horrible, you don't exist in anybody's memory. You're done.
You're gone. Yeah, I think that's true for a lot of people. Like the fear is that you will die and that it won't have made a difference that you lived. Yeah. And that's one thing we talk about often with our Clearview team right here, our staff, is that we are making an eternal difference.
Everything we do here, we do to build God's kingdom, which will last forever. What a hope. What a solid assurance that this life is not the end. There's a life coming. And how you live in this life impacts that life.
Mm-hmm. And A lot of people don't have that. Even among Christians, sometimes they don't have a good, proper understanding of what eternity is all about.
Well, so you mentioned that. You mentioned this survey that was sort of the brainchild between Ligodeer Ministries and Lifeway Research. And do you want to just kind of tell our listeners what this survey is? Because you sent it to us yesterday, and we had the chance to kind of look over it and talk about it a little bit off-mic. But what is this survey?
So, People were asked to about 3,000 some surveys were sent out, were asked. To to Give their Value like on a four-point scale. on what they believe about the Bible being the highest authority, Uh Or another question. It was very important for me personally to encourage non-Christians to trust Jesus Christ as their Savior. Jesus' death on the cross is the only sacrifice that could remove the penalty of my sin.
Right. And then only those who trust in Jesus Christ alone as their Savior receive God's free gift of eternal salvation.
So, this survey was based around these four. uh important questions And um So There were many questions, not just these four, but there were many questions, but these were The parameters around which these questions were based.
So here's a. Big statement, God is a perfect being and cannot make a mistake. Fifty-three percent strongly agreed with this. God is a perfect being and cannot make a mistake. 53% in 2025 in America, which is, in a sense, is not a good number.
I wish it was 100%. Right. But. Still 53%. Did not quite agree.
Right, right. We hear 53. I'm like, oh, cool. That's over half. But it's barely over half.
It's right at that half and half mark.
So that still accounts for 47 who fall somewhere else. Here's another question or statement: There is one true God in three persons: God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit. 55% strongly agreed with this.
Okay, wow. More more agreed that God is represented in three persons than agreed that he's perfect. Yeah. By a small margin, but still that that's That's surprising.
Now, here's where we go, huh? I don't know. God accepts the worship of all religions, including. Christianity, Judaism and Islam. Forty-four per cent.
Strongly agree with this. Yeah. That's not good. No, that's not good. Strongly agree too.
Like that's a definite answer. And only 16% strongly disagree, 7% somewhat disagree, and 20% somewhat agree. 12% are not sure. I mean, forget about that. Yeah, yeah, that's like, I don't know.
I don't know. I don't get into this. Yeah. So more highly weighted on the agreement. Interesting.
I wonder if they feel like, instead of leaning on doctrinal knowledge, I wonder if they feel like the questions lean into each other.
So what I mean by that is like, okay, I've already said that I think God is perfect. If he's perfect, then he must accept the worship of everyone, because that's what a perfect being would do. Rather than leaning on what the Bible actually says, I wonder what would make that number be what it is. But then they also agree with the Trinity. Yeah, that's crazy, too.
That is a little crazy. It seems like it's feelings-led. Like, I feel like God wouldn't. Chastise people if they were brought up in the tradition of Judaism or Islam. Yeah, like people often say, you know, where you grew up is how you worship and how you're raised.
Well, I think I can't believe in a God who would not accept that. Yeah. As long as you're sincere, right? I think also people they can want so desperately for everybody to be saved. I think even non-Christians, they'll say things like, you know, these three Abrahamic religions, they're all worshiping the same God.
And even a Christian who doesn't want to think too deeply about it will go, that sounds good to me. Yeah, sounds good. And so I think that starts influencing the way they look at God throughout their life. It was just so false. I mean, these three religions, and again, Judaism, you know, we are very pro-Israel, but Judaism is what's left over.
After Jesus is rejected, that's what Judaism is. But over the centuries, it is caked over with a lot of traditions and ideas and picking up from different cultures into what we know today as Judaism, albeit there still. Hold on to the Old Testament, but it's not like Moses was not a follower of Judaism. Right. David was not a follower of Judaism.
This was not the religion of the Old Testament. Right. Malachi was not a follower of Judaism. Nehemiah, Esther were not. Followers of Judah.
I was trying not to say this, but I watched. I watched on Disney Plus, I watched Obi-Wan last night. It was the final episode where he's fighting Darth Vader, and Darth Vader said, Eric and Skullwalker's gone. And he says, I am what remains. And I don't know why, but when you said that, when you said Judaism is what's left over, it just made me think of that.
It's what remains. I mean, I think that's there's some truth to that, too. And that's sad, too. Here's another statement. Biblical accounts of the physical, we're talking about the bodily resurrection of Jesus, are completely accurate.
This event. actually occurred. Forty five percent strongly agree with this.
Okay. You know, keep in mind, a few decades ago, the number would have been much higher. Yeah, I agree. I agree with you there. It's tragic.
I would be interested to see side by side the years and how the.
Now, here's a question that I have, and It said that 20% somewhat agree, but how can you somewhat agree that a historical event occurred? You know what I mean? I don't know. I don't know what someone I would love to talk to the 20% of these people. Yeah, what does that look like?
And see what, just, and not in a judgy way, but just what do you mean? Right. What, how do I? It's like, do you agree that the Hindenburg actually blew up and sank to the ground. I mean I I somewhat do, yeah, I kinda.
I don't think they would say that about the Hindenburg. They would say, well, I've seen the footage, but I haven't seen anything with Jesus. You know, some kind of a camera at the mouth of the grave, seeing this apparition moving out, and the guards falling to the side, and you can see the camera sort of lopsided, and people are running back and forth, and Peter coming and looking in and running away. I haven't seen that camera footage, so I can't totally say that. You think it's okay, what about the Titanic?
You think they say about the Titanic? They somewhat agree it's saying, Well, again, they will say there's so many pictures and eyewitnesses. Here's the thing: just because we are. 2,000 years removed from that incident does not mean that incident didn't happen. I agree.
Yeah, I agree with you. I mean, so what? We are now What, how many years aw uh removed from um from 9-11? 25, something like that.
So, does that mean 9-11 didn't happen, but every year is going to be less and less? Right. Yeah. No. It did happen.
That's right. Based on what they had at the time, the best media, the best Uh writing abilities they could come up with, they put together The documentation that if you examine it as you would examine any kind of evidence, you go, this really happened. I mean, that's what you do. That's why we say that you're a text critic. That's what you do.
You examine that evidence.
Well, my degree, text criticism, is more focused on manuscript evidence. Here I'm talking, and we can, we'll be talking about gospels and the differences between Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and all that over the next. couple of weeks. The resurrection account in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John You begin to see that They have a core. of uh information that they are maybe copying from each other.
Maybe Copying from another source? Again, depends on what view you take on the synoptic problem. But none the less these four different writers are writing about this account And when you apply any kind of um Scale to judge them, you realize they're not making this up. There's too much is in here. For example, The women coming to the Tomb of Jesus.
They were never used. women as There Eyewitnesses.
So to use women knowing that they are women, knowing that they might get discredited, is again a big Evidence that this account is not forged. five hundred witnesses. who are still living, who are talking about seeing Jesus. At the time when Paul is writing, In 1 Corinthians he talks about many of them are still alive. Those 500 witnesses, oh, they're all dead now.
If we could bring them back, I would believe. in in about another thirty, forty years, Maybe you li maybe 60 years. You may not have anybody surviving from 9-11. Does that mean it didn't happen? That's right.
No, it did happen.
Well, we have the videos. based on The best technology of the time, they recorded. All the evidence they could. And when you analyze that as objectively as possible, you see that this. Account of the resurrection of Jesus.
Has to be true. I'm with you. I think the whole thing we have video evidence now so we can be more sure. I think that's a cop-out. It is.
Take the Punic Wars. Like, I've been reading a lot about the Punic Wars lately. I've just been really interested in them. When we read that stuff, we don't ever question whether or not Hannibal actually crossed the Alps or whether or not Scipio actually took his men across the fields of Africa, even though it happened before the life of Jesus. It's older.
But we read those accounts and we say, yeah, I believe that happened because it's recorded. But we do the same thing with the Bible and say, ah, there was no one there.
Well, it's because of the implications of what it means that Jesus actually lived, died, and was resurrected. There's heavier spiritual implications to that than there are the Punic World. Right, but I guess what I'm saying is the whole, like, the whole, there was no, there's video evidence now, so that helps me. Right. I just don't buy it because even stuff with the Roman Empire, all this historical stuff we accept, except for the things of the Bible.
I will go ahead and say this. And again, I'm not the most educated person on this technology, the AI technology. But And I would say even video testimony now can be discredited. Again, I'm not the most, you know, I'm not an expert on this subject, I should say, because there may be ways to say, oh, this is AI generated and this is actual video footage. Maybe there is a technology that they're going to use to discern.
Oh, yeah, that has been altered. This hasn't been. I don't know. But I think That's going to cause a problem. Absolutely.
Just based on my naive understanding. It already is. Deep fakes exist. Yeah. Think about how much AI has changed and transformed and grown in the last five years.
And think about five years from now where we're going to be. Yeah. There's there. You can, one of the biggest things when AI first came out was the whole Will Smith eating spaghetti thing. They just, now it was, it was crude at the time, but now it became a meme that people were sharing where you could create a seamless video of Will Smith in 4K resolution eating spaghetti.
And I know that's a silly example, but what I'm saying is it has, like Ryan said, in five years, it has really, really. About tenfold expanded itself to where I could watch it and say that's 100% Will Smith. Yeah, and but we'll spend that time. Video.
So also now we can discredit 9/11. True. People are already doing that with the Holocaust. You know, they've done that for decades. They said it didn't happen.
Well, here are the pictures. It didn't happen. Here were the people, the soldiers who walked into those concentration camps and saw these Jewish people just completely. Imagine you know, hungry and and and bare bones and dying. Yeah, it didn't happen.
That was all made up. It's all conspiracy. Yeah. What do you do with that? Yeah, there's nothing you can.
You got to disengage. I've been in that, not in a that I was a Holocaust in our, but I've talked to people online who are just conspiracy heads and they will never be satisfied. No. Here's another one: God loves all people the same way. Sixty-nine percent strongly agree.
Only 14% somewhat agree, 3% somewhat disagree. I'd be interested to know. That's a broad what that statement means. That's too that's broad. What does that mean?
God loves all people the same way. I would love everybody the same way, I guess. I guess so, because I would imagine he wants all to come. He loves everyone. He wants everyone to come and be saved.
Sure. That's how I would take that. But are we saying love in the sense that God condones their behavior and lifestyle? Or God welcomes everyone into the kingdom of heaven. That's a broad question.
Here's another one. Jesus was a great teacher, but he was not God. Uh-oh. That one's strongly disagree. I'm glad that's there.
But he was more than a great, only 30%. Yeah, 30%. How many said not sure? He was God. Um If you eat 10%, if you want to somewhat disagree.
I guess they were disagreeing over the great teacher or the not God part. I don't know which one it is. Yeah, I don't know either.
Some of these shouldn't be on the spectrum, I think. 27% strongly agree that he was not God. Yeah. Yikes.
So there's a lot of, I don't know. Here's another one. God created marriage to be between one man and one woman. 51%. Hey.
Strongly agree. Yeah. I mean, a few decades ago, it would have been much higher. Yeah. But now, even that has dropped.
Holy Spirit is a force, but it's not a personal being. That one's also really strong. That's terrible. Yeah, that one's 30% strongly agree. That's a misunderstanding of the Holy Spirit.
Yeah, that's odd. The Holy Spirit gives a spiritual new birth, a new life, before a person has faith in. Jesus Christ. The Holy Spirit gives a spiritual new birth, a new life before a person has faith in Jesus Christ. 26% strongly agree.
So the Holy Spirit gives you new life before Jesus?
So they're saying Jesus is not as necessary to yourself? No, no, I think this is probably. Saying that regeneration happens before you place your faith in Christ.
So it's kind of a. Calvinism, Arminism issue happening. I've heard people in my life 100% really this. Yeah, absolutely. Because dead people don't make decisions.
So the Holy Spirit has to make you alive and prompt you to make the decision to follow Jesus. I've never made the decision. But you're born dead in trespasses and sins.
So He has to regenerate you so you're born again, and now you receive. By the faith that's given to you, Jesus as your Savior, and now repentance happens and. Life with Christianity. We've only got three minutes, but I I've never heard this. I've never heard this.
Is this something you do an episode on one day? Yeah, and I have talked about this.
Okay. That. Fate Comes first. And faith and repentance, if you want to say that. And repentance is not.
necessarily Sorrow for bad things. This is godly sorrow, where you recognize that you are a sinner, Christ is the only way, and That's true repentance, not just I'm sorry for what I've done.
So faith, repentance, two sides of the same coin. Regeneration happens at that moment. And at the same time, justification happens. positional sanctification happens. Adoption happens.
And Your life with Christ begins.
So how would you answer would you answer strongly disagree? I would say yeah, strongly disagree. I've never heard that. Wow. Yeah.
That makes it a slippery slope to. That question, if you agree with that previous question, is it a slippery slope to double predestination? Yeah. Yeah. Double predestination?
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, wow. We need to have some more episodes on these.
Well, Dr. Shaw, in light of, we've got just a few minutes, a few minutes left. In light of this research, and there's many more questions that we can go through. What should the church's response be? I would say You really need to study the Bible.
You really need to get. Um Ask your pastor to help you understand theology, biblical theology, systematic theology. This is a must. At ClearView, we Every message I preach, I try to bring in some theological truth that is very important for your. personal life.
For your witness. to your family and to the world.
So Theology is a must. Studying the Bible is a must. It's not an option to stay ignorant. It's not an option to be biblically and theologically illiterate. Right, that's right.
Guys, make sure you join us tomorrow, same time, same station. We're going to be diving into another great topic here on the Clearview Today show. Thanks again to our sponsors for making today's episode possible. And don't forget that you can support us by subscribing to the show on iTunes. And you can also support us financially at Abhidhanshah.com forward slash give.
John, anything you want to plug today? Yes, we are absolutely going to push pray radio hard all throughout the month of October, so make sure you're listening. If you're listening on pray radio right now, I just want to say thank you. Hope you have a great morning. Thank you for listening to the Cleavy Today Show.
Before you leave your house, go on over to Dr. Abadan Shah's page and click that follow button. We're really doing this to see how many people respond to pray radio.
So all throughout the month of October, think of this as a big experiment. We want you to let pray know that. you like this content, you want to hear more. That's right. We love you guys.
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