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So thanks for your support. Thank you to Mighty Muscadine for sponsoring today's show. Now let's get started. You're listening to Clearview Today with Dr. Abbadan Shah, a daily show that engages mind and heart for the gospel of Jesus Christ. I'm Ryan Hill. I'm John Galantis.
Welcome to the Clearview Today studio. We are so glad you're here. The week's coming to an end, but it doesn't mean God's word has to come to an end.
In fact, God's word cannot come to an end. That's right. Talking about that a little bit today, but before we do anything else, we want to welcome our host with the most, Dr. Abbadan Shah, who is a PhD in New Testament textual criticism, professor at Carolina University, author, full-time pastor, and the host of today's show, Dr. Shah. Well, happy Thursday, my friend. It's great to be here.
Happy Thursday to you guys as well. Absolutely. Absolutely. Dr. Shah, our verse of the day today is coming from Deuteronomy chapter five, verse 29. Deuteronomy. That's a good one, man. You don't really hear a whole lot from Deuteronomy.
People avoid it. Oh, that they had such a heart in them that they would fear me and always keep my commandments that it might be well with them and with their children forever. Wow. You know, we did a couple episodes a few weeks back on the law. You know, we've been talking about the law a whole lot as we're going through this series through the book of Romans about how Jesus and the law, you know, how Jesus didn't do away with the law, right? But how all these people, they were trying to keep God's commandments.
And I think you even said this in one of your messages. They were trying to make this homegrown style of salvation, but God's not saying, Oh, I wish that they'd kept the law so that they could be saved. It was the blessing for their lives. That's what the law was supposed to be. The law was simply to point them to the blessed life. Law was to show them God's character. Law was to sort of keep them hemmed in and not going off among their pagan neighbors and those Gentile nations. Law was to prepare them for the coming of Jesus Christ. But law in and of itself was never the way of salvation.
It could not save them. And the big question that has been in theology for a long time is where people saved by another way in the Old Testament, other than Jesus Christ. And now people do a lot of gymnastics to say, not really, but it was still Christ, but they didn't know it. And I disagree.
I disagree. I believe all those people who were truly saved among the people of Israel, the children of Israel, they knew, they knew that salvation was always through the coming one. Salvation was always going to be through God's son. Because they had the scriptures, right? They had the scriptures and everything that they were doing, all the rituals and the ceremonial laws were simply pointing towards the one who would one day give his life for them.
That's right. So I believe that they were aware of that. Now, of course, I'm sure there were people there who did not get it. I'm sure there were people there who were looking to the law as a means of salvation, but I don't think they really even understood salvation. Because if they were really studying the law, then they would have found that the law is helpless. The law is simply a measuring stick. A measuring stick cannot build a building. The measuring stick can only tell you how tall or how wide the building can be. Or if the walls are imbalanced, that's all the measuring stick can do.
It cannot build it. So even when we say like, well, maybe there were some people who were studying the law as if that would save them. I don't think so. Yeah.
Yeah. It's kind of funny because we talked about this a little bit, how people were looking to the law to save them and how we have this idea that like, oh, those silly Israelites, they were trying to keep the rules. They were just trying to follow the rules. But that's how the enemy still works with us today. We may not be following the law of Moses to the letter like they were, but we're always trying to do stuff.
We're always trying to contribute somehow. I just had this mental picture as we were talking of, we're seated in heaven one day and we get to talk to Moses and Noah and David and all these big names of the Old Testament, the coloring page level heroes of the Old Testament. And you sit down with them and you say, well, are you, would you consider yourself saved in your mortal life when you were living on earth?
And they're like, oh, absolutely. Yes. We would consider ourselves saved. Like, well, how, how did you get saved? Yeah.
I don't know. We kept some rules and hope for the best. Really violent shrug. Of course they knew what was going on. Of course they understood. Like it wasn't the law that saved us. We're looking ahead to the Messiah that's coming.
They wouldn't have been like, I don't know. Or even if they just say, like a lot of the people will say like Abraham, he was saved because he sacrificed the Ram. So he's like, yeah, I just killed a Ram. And that's, I think that's God worked his magic.
I trusted God when I took my son to be sacrificed. No, they knew that. I mean, think about what he was doing, right?
They knew that he was trying to sacrifice his son. Right. Isn't that what God did? And when he sent his son to down the cross for us, even the very thing we're saying that that's what, that's what he was thinking since I trusted God and was willing to give my son over.
Hey, can you even hear what you're saying? Yeah. Like I imagine like whole thing is a simple demonstration of what God would do one day with his son. Right? Like imagine like Noah getting on the boat.
Cause I've heard people say that too. Like Noah was saved by getting into the, into the arc. So it's like you asking Noah, like, so what was it that actually saved you before God? He's like, it was the boat. It was the God magic over the boat. The fact that we went into the boat instead of being out there with the ungodly.
Yeah, that saved us. No, if you really ask Noah, so did you know about Jesus? And I, of course, the arc is us in Jesus. That's right.
The arc is a representation of Jesus. When we're inside of him, that's when we are protected. That's when we were safe. So they all understood.
That's right. I do want to, I do want to introduce this. We've been doing this new segment called, in fact, I'm just going to give it to you right now. It's called hot take.
Oh my goodness. This has become one of, this is because one of our favorites on the show. I don't know if you guys know I'm kind of a griper. I like the gripe, but this ain't my week. This is Ryan's week. Ryan, this is your hot take.
Doesn't necessarily have to be a gripe, but oftentimes it comes across as a gripe. It's just a, it's just an unpopular opinion that you are willing to fight for. Let me hear it. Let me hear it.
Here's my unpopular opinion. Everybody's always talking about what to do for date night or what to do for like family night. You know, you want that time, that protected time with your loved ones set aside where you can build relationships.
And what does it turn into most of the time? A fight. Oh, I was, I was headed somewhere different, but it heads toward like, y'all never fought on date night before.
That's a different conversation. Let's watch a movie or let's watch a TV show or you know, the kids are like on their phones or on tablets or whatever and everybody's just kind of absorbed in their own screen, just existing in the space together. It's not really family time, right?
We're just kind of in our own little world. My hot take is replace on family night, not, not in every moment of your life, right? On family night, replace your phone, replace your tablet, replace your video games with a board game.
Oh, Ryan. Board games. Here's why. Here's why. Competitive. Everybody likes to win.
Right. Number two, it's, it helps your kids learn things like math. It helps your kids learn things like reading comprehension. And number three, you're all focused around the same thing. You're looking at each other, you're seated around a game table or card deck or whatever it is for you.
You're seated around together and it's kind of, it forces you to spend time and interact with one another. What do you not monopoly though? Because monopoly will end. What do you think?
I want to get your, I want to get your view on this. I'm not huge on board games. Right.
Right. But I do see Ryan's point. Can I tell you why I think you're not huge on board games and Ryan, I think this doesn't apply to you because you can vibe to whatever I'll vibe to whatever of board game. Nothing kills the vibe like a board game of board game.
Like disagree. Imagine you're at a party, right? Imagine you're at like a party and everybody's just vibing. We're talking, we're chatting and someone brings out a box that says, Hey, everyone gather round. If we're at a party with like 25, 30 people and you're like, Hey everybody, let's play parcheesi.
Like, no, that's not what I'm talking about. Like in a, in a group of 25 to 30, a game board game won't make sense. What do you think about Catan? Catan is, is kind of fun if you come together for game night, but I would not at a party, I would not add a party. Maybe I would.
Cause I really liked his game. That's a board game. Isn't it? Catan's a board game, but Catan is different though. Catan is in the upper echelon because it's the one you like.
It's the only one that I really liked, but I probably also wouldn't bust it out. So you're saying, you're saying do a, you have a game night at your house is what you're saying. I'm not saying at a party with 25 to 30 friends. I'm not, I'm not saying that games like that won't make sense. Fair enough.
Fair enough. But if you have a group of like, I don't know, six of you, what about mafia? Mafia is great. Mafia is okay.
Mafia is okay. It's, it's, it's a little more social, but you still have to, I think I'm opposed to, well, really we're just diametrically opposed. Cause what you're saying, like everybody's kind of zoned out doing their own thing.
That's where I thrive. I'm like, yeah, we're going to chill. We're going to talk. I'm going to talk to these guys. Then we'll go talk to these guys.
So, so maybe, maybe it's just a Jackbox TV is right out by the way. We got somebody said, but that falls under the game of like party video games. True. True.
That's not really a board game. I think I'm with you. I just, it's a good thing. How about this? We'll say it's kind of like eating your vegetables. This is why it's a hot day. It's a good thing.
I just, it wouldn't be for me. Ellie loves board games. Ellie tries to bust out board games at the house. And I'm like, Oh, Ellie, there are times when I want for date night, we'll put the kids to bed and Elizabeth and I'll have like some ice cream and we'll play a board game. You know, what's the two of us for real?
What board game do you play with two people? We have lots. Oh really? Yeah. Well let me say, say something about that while we're on that topic. The whole idea of quality time, you know, that was a big deal at one time. It's not the quantity is the quality of time.
And that's, I believe it's a misunderstanding. I don't think that's really correct because what we're saying is that it's not how much time you spend with a person. It's just the good quality of time is all that really matters. And I don't think that's how real life works. Real life has ups and downs. Real life has those high moments and then there are some low moments. And if you say, I'm just going to distill it down to the high moments, it's unrealistic.
Yeah. Cause imagine like you have an absent father, but you see him once every 10 years. It's a great visit. Yeah, but it's a great visit. But man, I never, I never see him.
He's never there. Quality time and quantity time. Both are needed.
You need both. And so if board games will help bring out some quality time, I'm all for it. True enough. True enough. You know, it's, what's frustrating is I can't get my kids.
I think it's good in the long run, but it's frustrating in the short term. I can't get my kids to work on screens. Like Gavin, Gavin will if he's at Nana's house, but like at home, no screens. I turn on TV for him. Not interested. Give him the tablet. He's not interested.
He just wants to hang out with us. So I'm like, I'm going to enjoy this now. I'm going to try to enjoy this now because I know I'll miss it. You have to fight for it later.
Yeah, that's true. There's my hot take. Well, I love it. I love it.
Thank you. And listen, for you guys who are listening, send in your hot takes. I know we've got a bunch of them.
Some of them I'm not putting on the radio, but some of them are actually kind of good. I'll read them later. Dr. Shaw, we have been talking a lot through the book of Romans lately. And we came to this really awesome illustration that we talked about yesterday where Paul compares us trying to keep the law and also be a Christian, also be following Christ to a woman who is married to a, I don't want to say a bad husband. An emotionally unavailable. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like the law is not a bad thing. It's not a bad husband, but it's not a particularly helpful husband. If that makes sense.
They are completely unsuited for each other. So going back to Romans chapter seven, starting in verse one, all the way to verse five, we've been talking about the role of the law in the life of an unbeliever. And then the role of the law in the life of the believer. Now, some people may say, I don't even get it.
I'm struggling with this sin and that sin. When you're talking about the role of the law, I don't know how that is even relevant. It is very relevant. That's right. When we talk about the law, we're not just talking about the law as in the 10 commandments. Of course we are, but we're also talking about the law of conscience because Paul talks about these two different kinds of laws in Romans. You know, he says that if I can find that passage very quickly, it's in Romans chapter two, I believe it is.
And if we can quickly find that, that there are law unto themselves. What is, what is that passage there? It's a great, great passage that helps us understand. Here's one in Romans chapter two, two 14. Is it okay?
Go for it. It says when Gentiles by who do not have the law by nature, do things in the law. These, although not having the law are a law unto themselves who show the work of the law written in their hearts.
So I hope you understand that the definition of laws, at least in the book of Romans is more than just the 10 commandments or the Pentateuch, the Torah. It also is referring to the conscience. And by the way, both the conscience and the law of God are wonderful things. The law of the conscience or the law of the 10 commandments, they are wonderful. They keep society sane. They keep us trying to pursue the good and the best life. They give us a sense of who God is, the character, the holiness of God.
It's all good. But when it comes to living a victorious life in the sense of our relationship with God, the law cannot help us prior to our Christian life. And the law cannot help us in the Christian life. I like what you said about like how people will make their conscience a law unto themselves and they don't even realize they're doing it because there's lots of things.
That's what is intended. I mean, it is, of course, Gentiles, it is the law of conscience. Because there's a lot of things that Jesus said, like, Hey, blessed are the meek. They're like, yeah, I can get behind that or help the downtrodden, feed the, you know, whatever you do to the least of these.
They're like, yeah, I love that. But then Jesus says stuff like you have to hate your father and your mother. You have to, you know, I didn't come to bring peace. I came to bring a sword and people, there are people who are like, I don't know about that. That doesn't sit right with me.
And what they're doing in that moment is they are, but they are kind of turning back to the law of their own conscience saying, look, I know what Jesus is saying. I get it. But man, I just can't go with that. But it doesn't work that way. It doesn't, you can't pick and choose and cherry pick kind of verses that apply to what you want Christianity to be. You've got to take everything that Jesus laid out in front of us.
And I think it's a great point that, you know, God created the law and it can't help us to salvation and it can't help us in the Christian life either. That doesn't make it a bad thing, but when it, we apply it wrongly, when we're, when we're pushed and tempted to apply it wrong, we're expecting something from it that it cannot deliver. Right. Exactly.
Yeah. Or even like when people agree with it, like when he says, love your enemy, but I say to you, love your enemy. And they're like, I know that's right, but yeah, I just can't. Going back to what you said earlier about Jesus said, I came to bring a sword, not peace. And he brought up the law of conscience. Just keep in mind, even in the law of conscience, there was a priority, a supremacy given to loving God. So even there, if the Gentiles would only simply follow the law of conscience, they would realize that God comes first, not family, not parents, not children, not loved ones is God. So when they say, well, I don't know if I can do that because man, I love my family and that's the right thing to do. Not if it means refusing to follow God or rejecting God.
Correct. So going back to this passage, Romans chapter seven, verses one through five, what Paul does here is that he helps us to understand that both before salvation and after salvation, the law is not a good husband. How is he before salvation? Well, he can only tell us what is right and what is wrong. So imagine a marriage between a woman and Mr. Law.
What would that look like? Very frustrating. Yeah.
So she comes in and says, Hey, so I baked you a pie. And his response is that was very correct of you. That's correct of you. That's the right thing to do.
I did the dishes. Correct. Correct. Good job. No, not even good job. Just correct.
There's no good job. Good job. Good job.
That's correct. I did not get a chance to take the trash out. It's been a busy morning. That was wrong of you.
That was wrong for you. Do you, you should have done that. You should take the trash out.
Oh, um, I need someone to help me. Can you help me take the trash out? No, the trash has to go out. You have to take the trash out.
Yeah. You have to take the trash out. You not taking the trash out is wrong.
Well, you, why don't you help me since you see that I'm in need. You have to take the trash out. Yeah. By the way, I made your favorite dish tonight. That is right. Correct.
That's correct. So, so we talked about completely flat, emotionless, like talking to a brick wall. We talked to a mannequin.
We talked about this on the, on the show yesterday and we were kind of, uh, this is kind of how we ended things. I went home and Ellie was like, Hey, uh, I didn't, I can't remember what she said. She said something like, Oh, she said, I didn't, I didn't cook this with chicken.
I cooked it with beef so you could, you could eat it with us. And I said, that was correct of you. She said, what? But I broke, I started smiling. I was like, yeah, that was correct of you.
She was like, what do you mean? That was correct of me. I was like, you know, cause I've sound engineer asked if, uh, if, if the law cannot praise can, can it condemn? Well, everything the law says negative is condemnation. Praise is, it's not condemning in the sense of like, he's just like talking down to you and just keeps beating you into the ground. No, just to say that you are wrong or you failed. That's condemnation.
So it wouldn't be like you failed and how pathetic you are, how, what a loser you are. Can the law do that? Maybe in some ways, I guess the law can say how, how far short you have come to pleasing God.
Maybe that's, I guess that's the condemnation. But nonetheless, the law keeps making demands and the demands are perfectly legitimate. Demands are perfectly legitimate and, and she cannot keep up with them and she can never do anything right. And every time she does something, it's not just that you did right.
It's almost as if there's more to do that you haven't done. I made a pie, but you didn't put whipped cream on it. Yeah. And it would have been correct.
If it had been have whipped cream on it, it would be correct. Right. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. It's not warm.
It's not cold. It's I mean, something will always be there. So the woman wishes that she could have married another or she could marry another, but she can't because as long as she's alive, she's married to this Mr. Law. The only way that she can be freed is if Mr. Law would die. Because then she wouldn't, because if she's not married, if he dies, they're no longer married.
She can remarry without being an adulteress. Right. Right. Right. So one thing we know about the law, as Jesus himself said in Matthew 5 18, he said, for surely I say to you till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. In other words, the law will not die. Right. Cause it's not, he's not saying until the law is fulfilled, he's saying until the end of time till all is fulfilled.
So what's going to happen, what needs to happen? Well, the only other option that is left is for the woman to die. And that's exactly what the gospel does for us. We not only die to sin. You remember, we talk about being, that we have died with Christ.
We were buried with him. We have risen to walk in the newness of life. So not only do we die to sin, but that imagery is also extended to the law. We also die to Mr. Law. So Romans chapter seven, verse four says, therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ. So in Jesus's death, we died, died to sin, but in Jesus's death, we died and we died also to law. Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ that you may be married to another.
Who is the other? To him who was raised from the dead, very particular that we should bear fruit to God. So we were married to Jesus so that we could bear fruit.
With Mr. Law, you can't. Such an elegant picture. We use the word like solution, like God was figuring out a problem.
God wasn't ever figuring out a problem. He already had the cross on his mind, but it's such an elegant picture on how like there's only one option for the woman to die. And that's exactly what happens because of the gospel so that we can be married to the one that we were created for, the one that we're destined to have a relationship with. So beautiful how it just all works together.
Yeah. It also goes along with how he said that the only way to even escape sin is through death. That's the only way you can get out of sin. So the master of sin cannot control us who were slaves of sin.
It's like it mirrors each other because the law is not sinful, but sin will use the law. That's kind of what we've been talking about these past few weeks. Yeah. It's beautiful because it's two imageries that were sort of negative. One was of a slavery. Another one was of this unhappy marriage. Paul uses these two negative imageries to convey a beautiful salvation truth. Yeah, absolutely.
Slavery, slavery to sin, unhappy marriage, marriage to law. And now both of them, we died to master sin and we died to Mr. Law. Yeah. How amazing is that? It's incredible. And so now this new marriage in Christ, everything seems so perfect, right?
Everything seems like you finally got what you wanted. Because it's no longer, she is trying to do things for Mr. Law. Now the new husband who is Christ is bearing fruit in her, right? Many Christians are trying to please God, trying to keep him happy, just like she was trying to do that with Mr. Law. All that does is brings death. It is living by the law.
The law says do this and do that. Christ says, make yourself available and I will do through you. Amen.
That's the Christian life. Just make yourself available to me. Submit to me. And that's easier said than done.
Yeah. Why do you think that is? Because it's the easier thing to do.
Because in some areas it's easier to do, but in other areas is very hard. So in areas like, submit yourself to me with regards to your finances. Yeah, that can be tough, but we can say, okay, my money belongs to you. Submit yourselves with regards to your time. Okay, Lord, my time belongs to you. Submit yourselves with regards to your sinful passions. You know, offer your instruments, your, your body unto God to be used for righteousness, unto holiness, your eyes, your ears, your mouth, your hands, your feet, every part of you offer it up to God to be used for his glory. Okay.
That is doable. But then there are other things that are very difficult to give over to your new husband. What are these other things? Other things come from a, from, from certain things that have been ingrained in our mind, in our, in our personality, whether through DNA or through our upbringing or through the experiences we have faced in life. We have a certain way of seeing the world. We have certain way of, of living in this world.
We have a certain way of reacting and responding to people in circumstances. That is the tough challenge because previously you did certain things certain way because it worked. It protected you. It allowed you to function in your sort of lack of better terms in your groove. You know, you, this is, this is my groove here. This is where I feel the most energized, fulfilled, accomplished, protected, happy, satisfied.
But now all of a sudden God is like, I'm going to work there. And it's like, Oh no, I don't know if I can give you that. Right. I can, I can give you my pornography. I can give you, uh, you know, my, my money.
I can give you my time. I can, I can release those things, but this is deep. Right. But God wants to do the deep work. When we, when we come up against an area like that, like I'm gonna, I'm imagining some listeners right now who are hearing this and identifying this is the area where I'm really having a hard time.
Let's take one. For example, hurts people hurt, right? Sometimes loved ones will hurt. We have a way of reacting to that hurt. Some people react with, um, well with, with over loving that other person, they will do everything they can to win that person back. Love that person.
Just go above and beyond. And it seems like the more you do though, the further that person gets away. There are other ways people react to hurts is by pulling away, pulling away because they feel like, Hey, if you're gonna hurt me, I'm going to pull away.
Right. And they feel like, well, that's just the only way I can go. Sometimes it is by outsmarting the other person. If you do that to me, then I'm going to do that to you.
None of those things always are ever good. What is good is for you to submit to God. So you have created a certain law, a system by which you react and respond to things in life. Now God says, I'm going to have to deal with that too. And you're like, I don't know how to do it.
Right. So think about that one place in your life where you find yourself struggling. Think about that one part of your life that has been there for a very long time, whether through your genetic makeup or whether through your upbringing or whether through circumstances and experiences of life. My suggestion would be to get along with God, take a piece of paper and write down what that is.
Write down what triggers it and what is your typical response. Write down how that response doesn't line up with the word of God, how the response doesn't line up with the Holy Spirit. And then you have to now say, okay, so here it is.
It's not comprehensive. It may not even be accurate, but I'm going to give it to you and I'm going to ask you God to help me find that better way to live. In fact, I want you to live the better way through me. And that's where Christian life really begins to work. So it's not on those big sins or those easily identifiable sins. It's those deeper ones where you find yourself going. Somehow Christianity doesn't reach deep enough.
This is that one place where it doesn't reach. So maybe you need to cover this topic again, hopefully, and talk a little more and bring out more specifics and then let's flesh it out, let's work it out, and maybe somebody or somebodies out there will go, that's for me. I think so, man. I feel like just here in the last five minutes, just hearing you say that, man, we're cracking open something really, really good.
Maybe it's not completely all the way open yet. Maybe we got to just dig a little bit deeper in the deep work, but I feel it. You know, I feel it.
I feel like that was something I was really, I hate that the time is up. I don't want to keep going. I know, but we can cover that on another episode. We can do it and dig into that deeper work of Christianity. Guys, make sure you join us tomorrow. Same time, same station. We're going to be diving into another great topic here on the Clear View Today Show. Thanks again to our sponsors for making today's episode possible. Don't forget that you can support us by subscribing to the show on iTunes, and you can always support us financially at ClearViewTodayShow.com.
John, what are we leaving the listeners with today? Definitely want to let you know that we are on Pray.com, Discerning Doctrine. We are posting new episodes every single week. We took a little bit of a hiatus as we were filming Discerning Doctrine. We were doing some batch recording, but it's back on every week, new episodes of Discerning Doctrine, exclusively on Pray.com. Also, I think we've just passed 5,000 subscribers, 5,000 followers, a few subscribers, followers, same nomenclature. We really appreciate you guys following Dr. Abadan Shah.
Make sure you continue to follow him. Thank you for everyone who's giving on Pray.com. It really, really helps support the ministry here at Clear View. That's right.
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