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Discounts and coverage selections not available in all states or situations. Good morning. I'm Jane Pauley, and this is Sunday Morning. We'll begin this morning with a matter of interest. Those tens of thousands of college loans adding up to millions and millions of dollars in debt, stymieing generations of college graduates.
Lillia Luciano looks into how things got so bad and what, if anything, we should do about it. Then on to people making their mark in their 70s, 80s, 90s and beyond. Earlier this year, the CDC reported an increase in life expectancy for Americans after two years of declines, primarily due to covid. The average person born in 2022 can expect to live seventy seven point five years, more than a year longer than the last projection.
Of course, many will live even longer than that. And as Mo Rocca will tell us, some familiar and not so familiar names have made remarkable contributions well into their so-called golden years. He calls them rocktogenarians. What do Colonel Sanders, Diana Nyad and Rita Moreno have in common? They all peaked when they could have been puttering to what do you attribute this explosion of work in your 80s and now into your 90s? I have no idea. I think it's astonishing.
The astonishing late in life triumphs of rocktogenarians ahead on Sunday morning. There's more to Julia Louis-Dreyfus than her award winning comedy roles on shows like Seinfeld and Veep. A lot more this morning. She's in conversation with Natalie Morales. Comedian Julia Louis-Dreyfus is best known for her roles on Seinfeld and Veep.
I don't get put on hold. OK. But in her new film Tuesday, she's showing off a different side. I love you so much more than me. Your instincts have been right most of the time. Was there ever a time where it wasn't?
The only mistakes I've made is when I haven't really trust my instincts, to tell you the truth. Julia Louis-Dreyfus, not just for laughs, coming up on Sunday morning. As a singer, songwriter and producer, Lionel Richie has pretty much done it all. But as he tells Tracy Smith, no accomplishment has had as big an impact as the song he co-wrote and helped produce back in 1985. Imagine 46 of the biggest names in music recording a song most had never heard before with only one night to do it. Superstar Lionel Richie was feeling the heat. And yet when we see you in the footage, you look cool as a cucumber.
That's called youth naivete and you don't know you can die at that exact moment. That's the real story behind We Are The World later on Sunday morning. Also this morning, David Martin takes us on a very different sort of journey back to the eve of the D-Day invasion in Normandy.
Actor and director Griffin Dunne discusses family and fame with Kellefisane and more. This is Sunday morning for the 9th of June, 2024. And we'll be back in a moment.
200 or 2 million Atlassian software is built to help keep you connected and moving together as one. For the past month, college graduations have been in full swing across America. Cause for excitement, celebration, and for some grads, sticker shock because of student loan debt.
Lilia Luciano has a crash course in a trillion dollar dilemma. Freddie Lee Williams Jr. from Lowdy. Back in 2019, Freddie Williams Jr. had a lot on his mind at his college graduation. That's when, you know, it started really kicking in like, hey, this is how much you owe. You're going to have to start paying this back.
Growing up on the south side of Chicago, he dreamed of going to Morehouse, the historically black college in Atlanta that counts Martin Luther King Jr. among its distinguished alumni. Once I got accepted and saw that, hey, the money is being offered, but didn't have an idea of, you know, what I was really getting myself into. And then at commencement.
We're going to put a little fuel in your bus. Freddie Williams got the surprise of a lifetime. My family is making a grant to eliminate their student loans. When billionaire businessman Robert F. Smith pledged to pay the student loans for the entire class, clearing some $34 million in student and parent debt. It was crazy, you know, to look back and see my parents in the stands crying and celebrating. Like that's when I knew like, okay, this is big. How big was your debt?
In total, it was around $125K. Wow. That is a huge weight to be lifted.
Tremendous. Total student loan debt in the U.S. is now nearly $1.8 trillion. And experts say many young people are delaying buying homes and starting families because of it. But the Morehouse class of 2019 is something of an experiment.
We love Morehouse. What could lives look like when students graduate debt-free? I think only now as we get five years out, people realize the implication of what having no loans is. Like you can buy a house right after graduation, which people we've interviewed, they did. We do need a parent that took out loans. Filmmakers Joshua Reed and Imani Rashad Soushe are also part of the class of 2019.
Take one. They're making a documentary about how their classmates are faring thanks to that generous gift. Someone started a nonprofit to get black and brown students into tech. Someone became a family man. They have a daughter now.
Hey, this is what happened at Morehouse. They got the debt cleared and they were able to have this exponential effect. What happens when we clear the debt for millions of Americans? Last year, the Supreme Court struck down President Biden's ambitious $430 billion student debt relief plan. The Supreme Court blocked me from relieving student debt, but they didn't stop me. Since then, the administration has expanded existing programs to cancel $167 billion in debt, with most relief going to people working in the public sector and for nonprofits.
They're sort of doing these piecemeal fixes, but they're not doing anything to stop the underlying problem. Josh Mitchell is the author of The Debt Trap. He says Congress created the federal student loan program to expand college access, but by allowing students and their parents to borrow virtually any amount to study virtually anything, the government has enabled colleges to raise tuition without consequence. There is a cycle of students take out loans, schools raise their tuition, students take out more loans.
That's essentially what's happened over the past 40 years. That's why tuition up until recent years has grown at sometimes triple the rate of inflation. More than half of all college students now graduate with student loan debt, with the average owing nearly $30,000. Now with all of this debt, how much is it impacting the economy negatively? The U.S. economy is the world's biggest, most dynamic, in large part because of higher education. But you also have a lot of students who are not in default on their loans, but are devoting more and more of their paychecks to paying off debt. That's money that they could have been using to save for retirement or to buy a house or to even start a business. For the average student, there is a payoff for going to college. But I think that the problem is they're overpaying. The cost of tuition has increased to a degree far greater than inflation.
Why did that happen? Colleges and universities obviously have to be good stewards, and we have to constantly look at our business model. But I will say this, we're in the business of human capital, and human capital is expensive. So when you think about investing in teaching, research, scholarship, those things are investments we have to make. Nicole Hurd is the president of Lafayette College, a private four-year school in Easton, Pennsylvania. We're really known for liberal arts and engineering. She worries that fear of student debt is discouraging the lower- and middle-income students who benefit most from attending college. We're so fixed on the price, and we're thinking about the sticker shock of the price, we're not thinking about the long-term investment as individuals, as families, and as a country. If somebody goes to college, their children will go to college, their grandchildren will go to college.
It changes everything. Tuition and room and board at Lafayette is more than $87,000 a year, though in recent years the school has made efforts to offer more grants and fewer loans as part of its financial aid packages. So we met their demonstrated need with $39,531 of grant assistance. Some debt is okay. A little skin in the game is not the end of the world. What we can't have is people have tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars of student debt.
That's not okay. But the nonprofit sector in higher education is getting much better about being transparent about what debt is and then making sure students and families make good choices. Still, more than 40 million Americans have student loan debt, with 3.5 million owing more than $100,000. The average interest on that debt is nearly 7 percent, the average length of repayment more than 20 years. It's why filmmaker Joshua Reed believes the story of the Morehouse class of 2019 First call for the class of 2019!
needs to be told. People are being crushed by the immense weight of this debt, but once it's relieved they can go on to do all sorts of things. How often do you think about what you don't have to pay in student loans?
Almost every day. Freddie Williams Jr. was back on campus last month for the five-year reunion of that lucky class. The 26-year-old software engineer says instead of paying back a mountain of debt, he gets to pay the gift forward. It was bigger than just having my debt paid off. Because of that gift, I was able to buy a house, and with me buying a house, that allowed for my brother to move in while he's finishing his degree.
And I know it, you know, in my soul that I have to continue to give back and pass it forward. If you've ever been in the market for a new home, you know home shopping can be a lot. There's so much you don't know and so much you need to know. What are the neighborhoods like?
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Homes.com. We've done your homework. MassMutual knows that finances can lead to uncomfortable conversations. What about that guy who's always trying to get you to invest in his business? His last idea was generating power with electric eels.
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Go to MassMutual.com today. Feel comfortable about tomorrow. Actor and director Griffin Dunn has quite a tale to tell. A life story featuring an illustrious family, exhilarating highs, and some terrible lows.
This morning, he shares his inspiration with our California. I would, uh, find myself telling stories. And these stories were kind of incredible. I had people riveted. And a lot of the stories involved people that people had heard of.
Yes, but not... I didn't want it to be like a name-dropping sort of thing. There were a lot of names to drop. Griffin Dunn grew up in California, surrounded by the stories of his well-known literary family. His dad, Dominic Dunn, his uncle, John Gregory Dunn, and his aunt, Joan Didion, were all famous writers. The fortune came from his mom, Ellen Griffin Dunn. My great-great-great-grandfather, not sure how many greats are in there, founded a company called the Griffin Wheel Company. It was an empire.
Every train in America had a Griffin Wheel. I just thought these free-spirited kids... Griffin Dunn is an actor, producer, and director, but his new book is about his family. It chronicles the good, the bad, and the excessive. This is all from the anniversary, their 10th anniversary.
His father kept meticulous scrapbooks. 10th wedding anniversary. 10th wedding anniversary.
There would be no 11th. Even though the hosts were on the brink of divorce, seemingly all of Hollywood turned out. Billy Wilder. Billy Wilder. Angelo Lansbury. Angelo Lansbury.
This is Dennis Hopper. David Niven. David Niven and Angie Dickinson.
Angie Dickinson. Still looks amazing. This is at your house. At our house. Put a hardwood floor over the pool for dancing, but it was a very extravagant ball. Too extravagant for Griffin and his younger siblings, Alex and Dominique. They put my brother, sister, and I in our PJs and checked us into a hotel. What? For the night. Yeah. That's how they rolled.
Not for long. When my parents got divorced, there were no more parties. My mother didn't care about that stuff. By then, his father's brother, John Gregory Dunn, and his wife, Joan Didion, were just up the coast in Malibu. John and Joan were right at the epicenter of filmmaking in the 70s. They hosted Hollywood's new generation, Steven Spielberg, Martin Scorsese, Warren Beatty. I was precocious enough to be invited to John and Joan's parties. And you're hanging out with rock stars all of a sudden. I mean, that party where... Hanging out near rock stars.
Yeah, yeah. Griffin dropped out of high school and headed east. When I moved to New York, I was very, I don't know, I guess embarrassed that I grew up in Beverly Hills. I wanted to invent myself. I wanted to be a theater actor.
I wanted to live downtown. He was a working actor, in a sense. I was working at Radio City Music Hall as a popcorn concessionaire. There really is such a title. With a paper hat and everything?
I had a paper hat, a little cadet paper hat. Soon, his best friend, Carrie Fisher, came from California with her mother, Debbie Reynolds, who was starring in a musical on Broadway. Debbie summoned me and said, my daughter wants to move to New York, but I'm not going to let her live alone. You have to be her roommate.
And so we became roommates. And you kind of have a front row seat when she makes the possibly strange decision to take a part in this movie about outer space? She got this part in this movie, and she goes, it's ridiculous, but I got to take it.
Into the garbage chute, fly boy. In 1977, Star Wars broke box office records. I mean, it was like the Beatles came back to life or something. The film turned Carrie Fisher into a household name. It's a very particular thing when you have a best friend who becomes suddenly, overnight, unbelievably famous.
It's also very tough when you are that person who becomes unbelievably famous. Did you hear that? In 1981, Griffin Dunn appeared in An American Werewolf in London. His world was about to change too, but in a very different way. My last phone call with her was, you know, I was on my way to a movie. Actress Dominique Dunn died Thursday at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center. Griffin's little sister, Dominique Dunn, also an actor, was strangled by her ex-boyfriend in 1982. She was 22 years old. And nothing was ever the same. We'd never known violence to come into our home like that. We'd never known loss and grief, that immediate. Dominique's killer was sentenced to six and a half years in prison.
Throughout the trial, Griffin was in the courtroom during the day and on set at night, filming the mob comedy Johnny Dangerously. I'm going to dedicate my life to fighting crime. Isn't that great? Was it helpful for you to have a project like that to distract you a little bit during those months? I was so grateful for it. You and I are stuck together like glue. Like Munt and Jeff, Amos and Annie.
He continued making movies starring in Who's That Girl with Madonna and After Hours, directed by Martin Scorsese. It reminds me of that Edward Munch painting. Was it the shriek? Scream. Scream. Right.
You write in the book, I was too young to understand gratitude for living the dream. You kind of think, oh, this is going to happen again. Right.
Let the offers come in. Some people just forget the hunger that got them there in the first place. Right. And I think I had a touch of that. Starting in the 90s, he directed a series of movies including Practical Magic.
I don't care what he comes back as, as long as he comes back. More recently, he directed a documentary about his aunt, Joan Didion. I myself have always found that if I examine something, it's less scary. How did you think about nepotism?
It's hard out there. If you're good and you're related to somebody famous, that does get you in the door. But do you understand why some people are kind of bothered by that? I understand why people would be, but I think it's like, who wouldn't want to see Robert Downey? What if he felt like, oh, I don't want to cash in on my dad.
We'd never get to see Robert Downey. This party went till five in the morning. At 69, Griffin Dunn, who once wanted to escape his family legacy, is now proud to be part of it. Do you still love show business? Very much. Very much. I never, ever tired of show business. Why? I love show folk.
I'm always down for a good story. We've had word of a sad passing. Apollo astronaut William Anders has died. As Lee Cowan tells us, he left us with a gift that was truly out of this world. The engines are on.
Four, three, two, one, zero. It was the crew of Apollo 8 that achieved a dream that explorers have had since the beginning of time. Man is farther away from home than he's ever been before.
In 1968, astronauts Frank Borman, Jim Lovell, and William Anders became the first humans to ever orbit another world. Anders broadcast his initial impressions to the whole world. Well, I said that it looked like dirty beach sand.
A very whitish gray, like dirty beach sand. That's how I describe it, thus gaining the wrath of poets worldwide. Could he have done better?
Probably. Anders made up for his pedestrian description of the moon by taking this photo. Oh my God, look at that picture over there. Wow, isn't that pretty?
Out of the small window of the command module. Hand me a roll of color quick, will you? Oh man, that's great. It forever changed how we think of ourselves. It was ironic that we'd done all this work to come and explore the moon and what we really discovered was the Earth. Earthrise became one of the most reproduced images ever. It moves almost everyone who's seen it, including former Vice President Al Gore.
It pointed the way toward a new understanding of who we are as human beings. Anders was still flying high when we met him back in 2018. I'm Bill. I'm Lee.
So nice to meet you. Sadly, this past Friday, his vintage single-engine plane crashed into the waters near the San Juan Islands off Washington state with only him aboard. He was 90 years old. He could say a lot of things, like he died doing what he loved, that if he had to go, it would be better this way.
But the result is the same. We lost the man who gave us our first heavenly view of our home. It's a perspective we so often forget. Thank goodness William Anders left us something to remind us how big and yet how small we truly are. Oh my God, look at that picture over there.
Wow, that's pretty. We all belong outside. We're drawn to nature. Whether it's the recorded sounds of the ocean we doze off to or the succulents that adorn our homes, nature makes all of our lives, well, better.
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Additional terms and fees apply. Turns out you really are never too old. This week, our own Mo Rocca has a new book out. It's called Rocktogenarians. And here with a preview. How's that? I've done hundreds of segments for this show over the last 17 years. I'm an adrenaline junkie, and without adrenaline I'd die. And I'll admit it, I prefer more seasoned interview subjects. Did anyone ever accuse you of being a puck hog?
Should we go one more? Sure, yeah. Older people just have better stories.
I didn't want him to ask me to marry him because I didn't want to say no to Frank Sinatra. I see the Oscar. Yeah. So 11 years ago, I jumped at the chance to interview screen legend Rita Moreno. We first met in 2013 when you were just 81 at that point.
Just 81, imagine that. Do you remember any of the moves from America? Oh sure. And then before I knew it, you were teaching me dance steps. As it turned out, Rita was embarking on yet another chapter of her already storied career. Still to come, starring in a reboot of the sitcom One Day at a Time. Oh, there's Tom.
Hit movies like 80 for Brady. Me taking this one. He's cute. Mara. And fittingly enough. Hold us in your heart.
Joining the Fast and Furious franchise. And you will never lose your way. Here I am, 92.
I want to say 92 so I will. You can cut that out, of course. Alright, that's great.
I love that. We've been conditioned to think of the last third of life as a time to wrap things up. But more and more we see people like Moreno reaching new peaks instead of packing it in. I call these people rocktogenarians.
And they're not new. Retirement's just not for me. I believe that a man will rust out quicker than the world. Take Harland Sanders, who was 66 and living off Social Security when he hit the road to peddle his secret recipe of 11 herbs and spices to restaurant owners. By the time Colonel Sanders was 74, Kentucky Fried Chicken had 900 locations worldwide.
How are you? Writer Frank McCourt was also 66 when he broke out and, in a sense, broke free. For years, this high school English teacher had wondered if his story was even worth telling. Worse than the ordinary miserable childhood is the miserable Irish childhood.
And worse yet is the miserable Irish Catholic childhood. His memoir, Angela's Ashes, became a literary sensation. I had to get it out of my system.
I would have died howling if I hadn't written this book. For some rocktogenarians, dying without regrets means taking care of unfinished business. Queen guitarist Brian May went back to school to finish his Ph.D. in astrophysics at age 60.
It's all about intuition and passion and determination. Diana Nyad first attempted to swim from Cuba to Florida when she was 28. Three decades later, she tried again and again and again until finally completing the journey at 64. You're never too old to chase your dreams.
One second. Rocktogenarians don't rest on their laurels. They're too in it to spend their days looking backward. Think 75-year-old celebrated architect I.M. Pei breathing new life into Paris' Louvre Museum by placing a glass pyramid right at the center.
The pyramid is a necessity and not an architectural gesture. Nothing retiring about that move. Mary Church Terrell came out of retirement after a lifetime battling for civil rights. At age 86, she rejoined the bite, leading sit-ins at segregated lunch counters in Washington, D.C. Then there was Norman Lear in his third, or was it his fourth or fifth act, leading me in exercises at 93. I get applause doing this.
Just one year older than Rita Moreno is now. Do you get tired of people pointing out your age? No. Why? Not at all. I think it's good.
I think it's important that they be aware that there are old people who are energetic. I feel so fortunate to be in the place where I am right now. So fortunate.
I mean, I really sometimes wake up singing. All night long. All night. All night. All night. All night.
All night. He's one of the best-selling music artists of all time, with millions of fans worldwide. But as Tracy Smith explains, Lionel Richie may be best known for one song in particular, recorded on a fateful night nearly 40 years ago. In the universe of pop music from the 1980s, there's one song that's especially hard to shake. We are the world, we are the children. We are the ones who make a brighter day, so let's not give in. In 1985, We Are the World was made to raise money for food aid to Africa.
The song and the saga of recording it are a Netflix documentary, The Greatest Night in Pop. We got B camera and C camera. Take one. We got a lot of cameras, guys. We're gonna cover this thing. What do we have? Lionel Richie co-wrote the song, and he's the man who helped 46 of the biggest music stars on earth record it in one crazy all-night session in January 1985.
How did you do it? Naivety. Was it? Naivety, number one, and number two, we didn't have any distractions.
There was no internet, there was no cell phone, there was nothing but purity of a thought, an idea, and how to get it done. It all started with Do They Know It's Christmas, the British charity single meant to raise awareness and open wallets for food aid to famine-ravaged Africa. Singer and philanthropist Harry Belafonte thought American artists could do the same, so he called super agent Ken Kragen to help round up talent, and Kragen got Lionel Richie and Michael Jackson to write a song. Tell me about that. What was the process like writing the song with Michael Jackson?
At the beginning, it was no terror at all because we had no deadline. So that meant? Whenever you can write it, we can write it, it's no problem. They wrote at Michael Jackson's house with all of his pets, including a large snake. And you're trying to write a song. I'm trying to write the lyrics to the song, and I'm screaming, and he's going, he wants to play with you, Lionel. Anyway, so to make a long story show, we actually, okay, we finished the lyrics. Meanwhile, Ken Kragen kept calling more big names to join in, and the project started to snowball. And next thing I know, Kragen calls on the phone and says, ah, Bruce is in, Dylan's in. Dylan, you mean Bob Dylan?
What are you talking about? Well, Ray's coming. Ray Charles. Ray is coming. So all of a sudden, we went from just la la la to Panic. Finally, with the song written, they made a plan to record it the night of the American Music Awards in January 1985, when all the big names in music were in Los Angeles. And the key word for tonight is outrageous.
Nothing. Outrageous is right. Richie hosted the three-hour show that night. But his main event started afterward, when the megastars started arriving for a recording session for the ages.
Diana Ross, Bruce Springsteen, Stevie Wonder, Ray Charles, and so many more. And I mean, it was just a room full of five-year-olds, and we're all amazed that we're there with each other and getting used to each other. I call it the first day of first grade. So you're all in the room without your parents, and we don't know exactly what we're doing, and Quincy's the parent. We are the world. And we pulled it off. We are the children. So how did Quincy Jones keep the big talent and all of those big egos in line?
You might call it peer pressure. I kept saying to Quincy, is everyone going to go in a booth and sing their part? He said, no, we're going to put them in a circle, and they'll be perfect every time we sing.
Why? Because you're standing and looking into the rest of the class. You're going to be perfect every time.
You know, and it was true. A little intimidating. In fact, did I say a little intimidating?
Intimidating. Was it intimidating for you? I mean, now that I talk about it now, it was terrifying. It was terrifying?
It was terrifying. What am I saying? I'm trying to be Emma so calm about this. There's a choice we're making But the best moments of the night, it seems, were when the immortals in the room let their guard down a bit, like when Diana Ross asked Daryl Hall for an autograph. It's true, we make a better day I mean, it got me, Diana Ross asking for autographs. And of course, you just couldn't get enough of that.
Just to sit around and, hey man, I just want to tell you, I'm a big fan. And then we just melted into this family. We're saving our own lives It's true, we make a better day Just you and me The session lasted well into the next morning. The greatest gift of all And for those in the room, it was trying. I think we had a lot of bracelets.
Oh, is that all my earrings? And triumphant. We are the world We are the children We are the children Was there a moment that night when you thought, we're not going to be able to pull this off? Several times.
It was just fatigue at one point. Once you get to four o'clock in the morning, and we're now putting on individual parts. It's true, we make a better day Springsteen left the building on the last thing we put on this record at eight o'clock. Eight o'clock in the morning.
So around 7.38 was his last lala. Well, send him your heart The single was released in March 1985. It went straight to number one and raised tens of millions of dollars. For one brief moment in time, the world seemed to unite just a little. It's true, we make a better day Just you and me We actually thought we were going to wipe out hunger around the world. All we needed to do was just tell a few people and the rest of the world would take over and the whole world would run next door and save their next door neighbors and their cities and their communities.
And then about three years later, the world went back to sleep. But since the documentary premiered in January, there's been a renewed interest. The song We Are the World was back on the billboard charts and donations started flowing again. In the past six months, more than $600,000 and counting.
There comes a time when we heed a certain note For Lionel Richie, it's not so much a song, but a gift and one that keeps on giving. You raised, I think it was $80 million at the time, and now it's double that. Yeah, no, we raised a lot of money, yes.
Did you get a chance to see that in action? Oh, yeah. We kept thinking, okay, we're going to give away $5 billion. Okay, hopefully we'll raise $10.
Once you get to $40 and $50, whoa, what the heck just happened? But I remember calling Quincy on the phone and said, did we say we're giving away half the money or all the money? He said, don't try it. Lionel, don't try it.
Don't try it. We're committing all the money. Because once you get past $50, $60 million, but then you realize we kept trying to stop We Are the World. In other words, okay, we're winding it down. And the next thing we know, $2 billion comes in. It's still breathing.
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On the eve of battle, General Dwight Eisenhower spent the remaining hours of daylight with the paratroopers who were about to jump behind German lines into occupied France. A single moment captured by an Army photographer became the most enduring image of America's greatest military operation. It's one of those images that just causes you to pause. There's clearly something going on. There's conversation.
But we don't know what it is, and it invites us in. James Ginther is the archivist of the Eisenhower Library in Abilene, Kansas, where a cutout of the famous photo has been turned into a selfie station. What makes this picture so iconic is that it perfectly captures all that was at stake on D-Day. The burden of command, the lives, and the balance.
And the more you learn about this picture, the more perfect it becomes. Why did he think it was important to visit the troops? Because wars aren't won by armies.
They're won by individual soldiers. And he knew the value of that. I was very young. It was my 22nd birthday.
Wallace Strobel, the soldier in the helmet, has since passed away, but he recalled his brief encounter with Eisenhower in a 1994 interview with CBS News. We were really ready to go. We were all set. We had everything loaded, and someone came running down the street and said, Eisenhower is here. Well, everybody kind of said, you know, so what? We have more important things.
Nobody snapped to attention or fell into formation. You could hear the excitement as he came closer, and he turned and kind of looked out, and then he came over. And at that point, he stopped in front of me. He's got two million people he's sending into battle. Why do you think he chooses the paratroopers?
Because they're the key to the whole operation. The Germans had flooded the areas behind the beaches, and the paratroopers were to jump in ahead of the main landing force to seize the causeways leading inland. Strobel's mission was to knock out the German guns that could turn those causeways into shooting galleries. They emphasized the fact, now, if you don't get those guns out by HR, the whole damn invasion is going to fail. What Strobel didn't know was that this letter stamped bigot had landed on Eisenhower's desk.
It stands for British Invasion of German Occupied Territory, and it was higher than a top-secret classification. Air Marshal Trafford Lee Mallory, the officer in charge of the airdrops, wrote, I am very unhappy about the U.S. airborne operations as now planned, and warned half the 13,000 paratroopers could be lost. In a 1964 interview with Walter Cronkite, Eisenhower recalled what Lee Mallory told him. He was so sure we were making a bad error that about a day or two before the attack he came to see me, down in my camp down here. And he just, he was really earnest in his recommendations.
We must not do it. It was a call only Eisenhower could make. This is General Eisenhower's response on the following day. Delivered by hand, it said, A strong airborne attack is essential to the whole operation, and it must go on. It was, in Eisenhower's words, a soul-wracking decision.
But he gave no hint of that as he mingled with the paratroopers an hour before they were to board their planes. So what exactly did the General say to Lieutenant Strobel? Where are you from, Lieutenant? And I said, Michigan. He said, ah, Michigan. Oh, yeah, I used to fish there. Great fishing in Michigan. So in that famous photo, they're talking about fishing? That's what Wally Strobel says. They were talking about fishing.
Fishing. That kind of changes my preconceptions of that photo. You look at it and you think he's going, give him hell.
Yes, absolutely. Maybe he's just going like he's casting. It was as though he was trying to calm everyone down. Eisenhower later told Cronkite the paratroopers had tried to put him at ease as well. They were getting ready and all camouflaged and their faces blackened and all this. And they saw me and, of course, they'd recognize me. They'd say, now, quit worrying, General.
We'll take care of this thing for you and that kind of thing. It was a good feeling. A better feeling the next morning when the main landing force went ashore on the beaches of Normandy. All preliminary reports are satisfactory, Eisenhower cabled in his first dispatch. The airborne formations apparently landed in good order.
It was too early to predict success, so Eisenhower closed by saying he had visited the paratroopers the night before and the light of battle was in their eyes. If you're looking for plump lips that last, you need to know about Juvederm lip fillers. With Juvederm Volbella XC and Juvederm Ultra XC, your lip look, whether it's subtle or bold, can last up to one full year with optimal treatment and no additional maintenance. Find a licensed specialist and see if it's right for you at Juvederm.com today.
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I never heard from him again. You had it over the best part. No, I mentioned the bisque. That's Julia Louis-Dreyfus playing Elaine in the legendary sitcom Seinfeld. There's no disputing. She's a comedy icon. But it turns out Julia Louis-Dreyfus wears many hats.
She's in conversation with contributor Natalie Morales. I have this great opportunity to receive the star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. Would you believe that they misspelled my name? Which part of your name? Louis. They wrote Louis. L-U-I-S. For Julia Louis-Dreyfus, real life can be just as humorous as the comedian herself.
And I have the misspelled part. It's framed in my office, just as a reminder. Just when you thought it was perfect and you'd landed it, no. Don't let her modesty fool you. The 63-year-old actor has more than landed it. She made her debut on Saturday Night Live in 1982 before going on to play some of TV's most iconic women, including Elaine Benes, the sarcastic best friend on Seinfeld. That whole thing, the whole production, it was all an act.
Not bad, huh? What about the breathing, the panting, the moaning, the screaming? Fake, fake, fake, fake. And Selina Meyer, the narcissistic vice president on Veep. People won't equate you with a natural disaster, ma'am. Really, Amy? Because I've met some people, real people. And I've got to tell you, a lot of them are f***ing idiots. Along the way, she's earned a record-setting 11 Emmys, the Mark Twain Prize for American Humor, and the National Medal of Arts.
Her career has spanned now four decades. Jesus, God. Well, sorry. That's crazy. That's sorry, but that's great. You all amped up, Matthew? Known for her impeccable comedic timing. Oh, flinch.
That'll cost you. Ow! The star hasn't been afraid to dabble in drama.
Albert, I still really wanted us to keep seeing each other. Her new film Tuesday is a reflection of that. But where, honey?
Louis Dreyfuss plays Zora, a mother struggling to cope with the fate of her dying daughter, Tuesday. I don't know what I am without you. Who I am without you.
I don't know what the world is without you in it. What drew you to that role? I was immediately intrigued because it was so out there.
It's really sort of a magical, fiction-y, adult fairy tale. And I thought, okay, I'm going to take this leap. I'm going to do it. Mom, it's going to be all right.
The film's fantasy comes in the form of a talking parrot who is the embodiment of death. You need to say goodbye to your daughter. When he visits Tuesday, Zora's maternal instincts are put to the test. You're trying to have him spare your daughter's life. Yeah, going there to that place, to your worst fear and nightmare as a parent, it was crushingly difficult, to tell you the truth.
I had to call home a lot. Breathe. She felt the story was a chance to get people thinking. It's an opportunity to have conversations about grief and death and dying. I think it's a taboo subject. Do you think about how to have those conversations? Yeah, I think about it a lot. I think endings in a weird way can be similar to beginnings.
There's something sacred that needs to be honored and recognized. Having survived breast cancer in 2018, living her life with meaning and joy, is what Julia Louis-Dreyfus is striving for these days. I'm Julia Louis-Dreyfus. This is Wiser Than Me, a show where each week I get schooled by women who are wiser than me. Her passion project is her podcast, Wiser Than Me, where she speaks with older women she admires and absorbs their life lessons. I feel as if older women sort of disappear from our culture and our society, and there's a lot of wisdom to be gained from these ladies. They're on the front lines of life, and I want to hear from them.
The conversations go deep and get personal on topics like aging, sexism, and self-acceptance. I'm a binge-eater. Every morning I wake up, I tell myself, I have an eating disorder. I still go to therapy.
I still think about it. Maybe it's because of my age, and maybe it's because I had this really bad cancer scare, and it sort of brought certain things into sharp focus for me in a way. It's been a great gift to have the opportunity to talk to these women and to explore these subjects. Last month, Wiser Than Me took home a Webby, one of the most prestigious awards in podcasting for Podcast of the Year. Listen to old women motherf***er. Family is never far for the podcaster. She calls her 90-year-old mother, Judith Bowles, at the end of each episode. Mama. Oh, hi, honey. Hi.
The actress has been married to her college sweetheart, actor Brad Hall, for 37 years. Their two sons, Henry and Charlie, seem to be following in their parents' footsteps into the family business. You know, it's so funny because I did not see this coming. You're somewhat of a momager, I hear, to your two sons, right? Well, I don't know if I'm a momager, but I do have them with auditions.
You do? Oh, sure. How do you help them prepare? I read with them. You know, everybody does these self-tapes now, so I'm very frequently the actor on the other side.
You know, I help them tweak scenes. How do they take your advice? They take it.
They're good? They take it. As they embark on their careers, their mom is reflecting on hers. Was there a point when you realized you made it? I don't think of my life and my world like that.
Really, I don't. This is the thing about being an actor. You're like part of a traveling circus.
You're going to the next town. You're looking for the next gig. Are you ever just comfortable in the quiet, though, of maybe not having a next gig? Am I giving off crazy vibes?
No, no. I'm just wondering because I know if I'm not getting emails or if my phone's not ringing, it's uncomfortable. Yeah, I know what you mean. I'm a bit of a workhorse. I absolutely like my downtime, but I don't like too much downtime. I like to work. And she's willing to take risks. After all, Julia Louis-Dreyfus says she has nothing to lose and everything to gain.
I'm just trying to get as much juiciness out of life as I can, and I'm still looking for adventure and to try new things. I'm having a good time. Thank you for listening.
Please join us when our trumpet sounds again next Sunday morning. It was the biggest scandal in pop music. The stars of Milli Vanilli, the Grammy-winning multi-platinum R&B phenomenon, were exposed as frauds. But none of this was their idea.
So whose idea was it? Enter German music producer Frank Varien. He saw the success of acts like Michael Jackson and Prince, and he wanted in, no matter the cost. So he devised the perfect pop heist. Two once-in-a-lifetime talents who were charismatic, full of sex appeal, and phenomenal dancers.
The only problem? They couldn't sing. But Frank knew just how to fix that. Wondery's new podcast, Blame It On The Fame, dives into one of pop music's greatest controversies and takes a never-before-heard look at the exploitation of two young Black artists. Milli Vanilli set the world on fire, but when the truth came out, Rob and Fab were the only ones who got burned. Looking back now, it's hard not to wonder, why did everyone blame them and not the man pulling the strings? Follow Blame It On The Fame, Milli Vanilli, on the Wondery app or wherever you get your podcasts.
You can binge all episodes of Blame It On The Fame early and ad-free right now by joining Wondery+. For more than two centuries, the White House has been the stage for some of the most dramatic scenes in American history. Inspired by the hit podcast American History Tellers, Wondery and William Morrow present the new book, The Hidden History of the White House. Each chapter will bring you inside the fierce power struggles, the world-altering decisions, and shocking scandals that have shaped our nation. You'll be there when the very foundations of the White House are laid in 1792, and you'll watch as the British burn it down in 1814. Then you'll hear the intimate conversations between FDR and Winston Churchill as they make plans to defeat Nazi forces in 1941. And you'll be in the Situation Room when President Barack Obama approves the raid to bring down the most infamous terrorist in American history. Order The Hidden History of the White House now in hardcover or digital edition wherever you get your books.
