The Money Issue, Jerry Seinfeld, LIna Khan - FTC Chair

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That's ov.coop. Good morning. I'm Jane Pauley and this is a special edition of Sunday Morning. It's the money issue, our annual look at the many ways money impacts how we work, play, and spend our lives. To begin, way back in 1928, a young animator named Walt Disney dreamed up a mouse that changed the world. Mickey Mouse became one of the most beloved, profitable, and protected characters in pop culture. But in January, he joined the likes of Frankenstein, Sherlock Holmes, and other classic books, songs, and artworks when the copyright expired, leaving Mickey free and clear in the public domain.

What does that mean and why does it happen? Lee Cowan reads the fine print. Walt Disney is both a copyright holder and also a copyright user. In fact, we all are. From Mickey to monsters, many famous works are now owned by all of us.

If copyright lasted forever, it would be very difficult for a lot of creators to make the works they want to make. The balance between protecting creators and promoting culture, coming up on Sunday morning. A Love of Pop-Tarts is the inspiration behind the new movie Unfrosted. Mo Rocca gets a taste of life on the set with, who else, actor and director Jerry Seinfeld. Jerry Seinfeld remembers the first time he met a Pop-Tart. And that Pop-Tart box, putting your hand on that, you're going, you're going, I don't know what this is, but I'm in on this. I want to be part of this. Well now, Seinfeld's made a movie about them. I believe we have split the atom of breakfast. This is one of my favorite scenes in the movie.

Later on Sunday morning, Jerry Seinfeld's childhood obsession hits the big screen. You've no doubt heard the name. Perhaps you even own a piece or two. This morning, Connor Knighton heads to Ireland and the home of Waterford Crystal. Waterford, Ireland, a former Viking settlement, is the country's oldest city. It's also home to one of Ireland's oldest brands. Waterford Crystal was founded here in 1783.

How do you survive from 1783 to 2024? You constantly innovate and you constantly find new ways to do things and just improve as you go. The past and present of Timeless Crystal, ahead on Sunday morning.

We like to think all that plastic we place in the recycle container actually gets recycled. But this morning, Ben Tracy tells us that isn't always the case. David Poe takes a look at the very real costs of Bitcoin mining. Calafasane profiles a family-owned sneaker company, making a run for the money.

Tracy Smith channels noted Hollywood psychic Tyler Henry. Martha Teichner on Houston's winning approach to homelessness. And more in our Sunday morning money issue.

We'll be right back. It's a concept framers of the Constitution deemed so important, it's in the fine print. The idea that all artwork at some point becomes public property. Lee Cowan delves into the universe of public domain. For nearly four decades, United Airlines licensed George Gershwin's Rhapsody in Blue to be its musical identity. In 2020, however, Gershwin's jazzy classical classic fell out of the friendly skies and landed in the public domain.

What does that mean? What it means is that the copyright expires. Anyone is free to use and build upon that work. With no fees, no licensing.

No fees, no licenses, no tracking down. The person who owns it, no permission. Jennifer Jenkins, director of the Center for the Study of the Public Domain at Duke University Law School, says there are a lot of famous works that don't belong to their creators anymore. Peter Pan. Characters like Peter Pan.

Over there, Jake. Dracula. Indeed.

And Frankenstein. It's alive! It's alive!

It's alive! They're all now owned by us, the public. Free for anyone to use to create something fresh. The public domain doesn't represent the death of copyright. It's just the second part of copyright's life cycle. The concept of putting an expiration date on intellectual property was something the founding fathers actually put in the US Constitution to promote the progress of science and the useful arts. They left it to Congress, however, to decide just how long the copyright term should last.

If copyright lasted forever, it would be very difficult for a lot of creators to make the works they want to make without worrying about being in the crosshairs of a copyright lawsuit. F. Scott Fitzgerald's The Great Gatsby was published in 1925. Anyone who wanted to use elements from the novel, whether it be Robert Redford... How do you do, old sport? I'm Gatsby.

...or Leonardo DiCaprio... I'm Gatsby. ...had to get permission from the Fitzgerald estate, which held the copyright for 95 years. That's a really long time. It is a long time, yeah. Do you think it's too long?

I don't think it's too long, and then that's my personal opinion, and I'm obviously biased. Blake Hazard is F. Scott Fitzgerald's great-granddaughter, and she's a trustee of his estate. When Gatsby finally entered the public domain back in 2021, she watched as a slew of Gatsby-esque projects were waiting at the starting line. I always hope there'll be some faithfulness, but we don't have any control over it. You have nothing now, right?

Exactly, so we just have to kind of embrace that. Only we know what we've both been through. She's just been invited to a new post-copyright adaptation of her great-grandfather's work, a Gatsby musical, which opens on Broadway this month. I hope it's good. She comes in first, and then he comes in, and then like... Do you want to try that? Should we try it? Any group of artists is going to distill down a story through their own lens.

Bigger as in more pointed, or bigger as in louder? The musical's director, Mark Bruni, and writer, Kate Kerrigan. We didn't want to do something that was wildly different from the novel.

We wanted to add perspective and layers to the novel. The truth is, most works aren't lucky enough to be economically viable for as long as F. Scott Fitzgerald's, or Ernest Hemingway's, or even Walt Disney's. This year, Steamboat Willie entered the public domain. It unleashed two of the most lucrative rodents in history. To be clear, though, don't go using this Mickey, or that Minnie, because they're still under copyright.

It's only the big-eared couple as they first appeared that's fair game. Still, as soon as those first copyrights expired, we got this. A Mickey slasher film. The same thing happened when A.A. Milne's Winnie the Pooh entered the public domain. It's that kind of reimagination that many estates fear. What do you mean, Holmes? Don't you see, my dear Watson? Sherlock Holmes is one of the most recognized literary characters from the 19th century, but Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's estate began to see its copyrights expire in the 1980s. Mr. Holmes, apologies for summoning you like this. Nevertheless, the Conan Doyle estate kept seeking licensing fees, arguing that since some of the later Sherlock Holmes stories were still under copyright, they should own the rights to all the characters still.

At some point, enough is enough. In 2013, author Les Klinger, one of the leading scholars on Sherlock Holmes, was about to publish this adaptation of the supposedly copyright-free detective when this happened. The estate contacted that publisher and said, you need a license. And we said to the publisher, no, you don't. We just thought it was wrong, absolutely wrong, and it made us very angry. So Klinger filed a civil suit in federal court, and he won.

They didn't give up easily. They were trying to squeeze all the juice out of these lemons that they could right up until they've run out of copyright. Copyright gives rights to creators and their descendants that provide incentives to create, but the public domain really is the soil for future creativity. There are surely more copyright clashes ahead, though. So we've got a long way, huh?

A little bit of a way, yeah. Characters like Bugs Bunny, Watch out, Doc. Superman, And I'm Batman. All find themselves out of copyright protection soon enough. Even Luke Skywalker will eventually find himself in the public domain, too.

Sometime around 2073, that sure seems like a galaxy far, far away. If you're shopping while working, eating, or even listening to this podcast, then you know and love the thrill of the hunt. But are you getting the thrill of the best deals? Rakuten shoppers do. They get the brands they love with the most savings and cash back, and you can get it, too. Start getting cash back at your favorite stores, like Urban Outfitters, Fenty Beauty, and Expedia, and even stack sales on top of cash back. It's easy to use, and you get your cash back through PayPal or Check.

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Absolutely, positively, FedEx. The name speaks for itself. Glassware whose quality is crystal clear. Connor Knighton takes us to Ireland for a visit to Waterford. Every glistening piece of Waterford crystal that ends up on a table begins in a fire. What starts as a molten mixture soon takes on any number of shapes, transformed into glasses and vases, buckets, bowls, one-of-a-kind sculptures and championship trophies. It's a painstaking process refined over centuries, which the company claims makes its crystal a cut above the rest. If there's even the slightest flaw in Waterford, it's smashed. We never do seconds, so there's no room for error in Waterford.

We're luxury, so with luxury, expect the finest crystal in the world. Emily Brophy is the marketing manager for Waterford. Founded in 1783 in Waterford, Ireland, the country's oldest city. I think a lot of people know Waterford the name. I'm not sure if they realize it's a place.

Absolutely, and it's really interesting. I had some visitors here a couple of weeks ago and they said, wow, it's kind of cool that the city named itself after the crystal. So we can't claim that because it dates back to 914 and our brand dates back to 1783. Many of Waterford's employees, like master glassblower Edgar Evans, have their own long histories with the company.

My dad was here, I had four uncles here, two brothers. It's a family thing, really. It's also a royal family thing.

Charles and Camilla toured the factory in 2022. The chandeliers hanging in Westminster Abbey are made of Waterford crystal. As is the ball that drops in Times Square. For the last 20 years we've actually had the Times Square ball in New York, so it's made up of many crystal panels and each year those panels change to a new theme. So it's a very special moment for a very small harbour town like Waterford to be putting the map in such a way.

Today, the bulk of Waterford's products are actually manufactured in Slovenia. In the mid 1800s, financial troubles shut down production altogether. The company actually closed.

That was 1851. It wasn't until 1947 that we reopened. Closed for a century. Closed for almost a century.

There's hope for everybody, right? Waterford was resurrected after World War II. A new era of creativity led to a number of designs still in use today, including the best-selling Lismore pattern inspired by the architecture of nearby Lismore Castle. Waterford found great success in selling its products to America. My dad used to work in one side of the factory. I was working on the opposite side of the factory. But then they decided to put us over into America and they were father and son.

So we used to go to most department stores over there and independent stores, selling in the crystal. David Boyce is a master wedge cutter, a title that requires eight years of training to earn. He now teaches his craft to others, including yours truly. This is where it gets tricky now, Con.

This is where it gets tricky since we started. Let's just say I did not make the cut. Hey, not terrible, but I would not get hired with that.

If Paul Cody spots even the smallest flaw, he tosses the piece into the recycling bin, so it could be melted down and reused. See, there's an indentation right on the rail over there. Oh gosh, that's subtle? Yeah.

Wow. Historically, glass has been mixed with lead to create cuttable, eye-catching crystal with its signature look and sound. But times are changing. Waterford has started transitioning to a more sustainable lead substitute.

Some cutting is now automated. The company's trying to attract a younger demographic, emphasizing that crystal can be an everyday indulgence, not just something that sits on your grandmother's shelves. There are certainly cheaper ways to get liquid to your mouth.

Absolutely. Why is someone buying Waterford? I think sometimes when you drink from Waterford, you sit up straighter. When you hold it, it's very tactile. It's about the sensorial indulgence of Waterford. So to your point, you could drink out of a $2 sippy cup, but actually it doesn't elevate the experience.

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Seven years ago, Gladys Anderson bought her dream home in Bono, Arkansas. We moved out here to get away from the busyness of town, the noise, you know, just peace and quiet, country living. But last May, the quiet ended when this noise began. It's like torture, like a form of military-grade torture. It's the sound of 17,000 computer fans in a bitcoin facility next door.

This caused problems for me with my hearing, my blood pressure, with the sweetheart, which she gets migraine headaches. Neighbor Shane Marcuson takes frequent decibel readings. 82 was the highest number. 82?

90 is a hair dryer. The residents can't even move away. I don't know, who would want to buy my house or buy my place?

You know, with this kind of noise, would you want to live next to it? I have spoke to the county judge's office, the county administrator. I have called the governor's office several times, and I know hundreds of other people have called about it.

What do you think is their reason for not doing something? It's money. It's money. It is money. Bitcoin is... Make it stop!

Thank you. Bitcoin is a digital currency with no centralized bank. Instead, transactions are confirmed by huge banks of computers run by people called miners. As an incentive to set up these facilities, the system periodically rewards the miners with freshly minted bitcoin worth hundreds of thousands of dollars.

But all those computers burn staggering amounts of power and make a lot of noise. Last year, Arkansas passed what's become known as the Right to Mine Bill. It prevents local communities from regulating these operations. We've got a business-friendly state, we've got inexpensive land, we've got affordable power, and that is the perfect combination to be a cheap date for this industry.

Republican State Senator Joshua Bryant was the bill's chief sponsor. He figured that bitcoin mining would be good for the state, but there were some unintended consequences. What we found is that operators started operating in a manner that was not giving quiet enjoyment to the neighbors. He points out that not all bitcoin plants are noisy. So I would say roughly half the sites in Arkansas are owned by the per se bad actors. Arkansas bitcoin miner Ben Smith says that mining plants can be very quiet, cooled by water instead of fans, built far from residential areas, and fully enclosed rather than open air like this one.

So it's all about design and honestly how much money you're going to put in to be a good neighbor or a good actor. So who's building all the cheap, noisy plants? Senator Bryant says it's a web of Chinese companies with ties all the way to the Chinese government. The New York Times reports that Chinese bitcoin mines are now running in at least 14 states.

But the Chinese government isn't the only invisible hand here. The right to mine bill itself was drafted by a bitcoin advocacy group that's pushing similar bills in at least 12 other states. In Arkansas, at least 50 bitcoin mining plants are planned and even Senator Bryant concedes that his bill needs fixing.

We are looking at a law, state law, that will ultimately require these crypto operations to not generate noise. Meanwhile, Gladys Anderson and her neighbors are suing. We've set up a GoFundMe. We've done some raffles.

We most recently sold smoked pork butts. The Bono plants lawyers say that the volume is within local limits and said in a statement that, Our client is currently developing design plans to fully enclose the site within a matter of months. Well good, because Gladys Anderson won't be giving up. I'm a very stubborn woman and I'm a very scornful woman. I will become just as big of a headache for them because they're setting up everywhere. Okay, it's time to commit.

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That's amazon.com slash ad-free true crime to catch up on the latest episodes without the ads. Do you believe it's possible to communicate with the dead? Each year, Americans spend billions trying to do just that. This morning, Tracy Smith is talking with one very happy medium. As psychics go, 28-year-old Tyler Henry is a pretty big medium. His specialty, as seen on his e-network TV show, is helping folks connect with their departed relatives, like Bobby Brown here. He's having me just acknowledge this feeling of, like, I need my son to know how much I love him because I wish I would have said that more in life. It's so good to see you.

How's everyone doing? He also has a road show that regularly sells out. She's completely at peace. She's completely fine.

With tickets ranging from $50 to $300 a seat. Do you know who Johnny is? It's okay. John is my brother. Oh, John.

And Henry says he has a 600,000-plus waiting list. Gosh, it's like you're in my body. Of people who want one-on-one readings like these. You're dealing with something that exists in a gray area, and gray areas make people very uncomfortable. Oh my gosh, Jim. It's so good to meet you.

True enough, but it also gives some people a sense of peace. I'm excited today to see whatever comes in and what happens to come through. Me too. Like Jim Parsons, whom Tyler helped find closure with his late grandmother. Connected to your father. He's having me go to the grandparent level, generationally. For some reason they're having me reference to a name. And it sounds something in the lines of like May, or there's some M, I'm saying M-A, and then like... May's my grandmother. Oh, perfect. Okay, awesome. Tyler mentioned my grandmother's was May, which he nailed like that.

She was apologizing and saying, I'm sorry for being such a pain in the ass towards the end. When did this all start? When did you discover you had this ability?

It started for me when I was 10 years old. My first kind of identifiable premonition happened in April of 2006. I woke up one night and just knew that my grandmother was going to die. And it was a case where it felt like it had already happened. And I rolled out of bed and I went to go try to explain this to my mom. And as I was sharing this with her, her phone rang. And when she picked it up, it was literally the news from my dad that he had just watched my grandmother die. So that really kicked it off, but I didn't recognize that as a talent. In fact, it was quite painful. Henry studied to be a hospice nurse, but quit to start reading people full time.

Though he says that now, in some ways, he's doing the same kind of work. How do you think this helps people deal with grief? I think it helps people process emotions that they don't generally feel comfortable processing.

So it's really a beautiful opportunity, one I don't take lightly, and one that I think of as a responsibility. Somebody over here, does anybody lose a niece? And for those who are grieving, it can all get pretty real. For instance, in a live show in New York last year, Henry sensed that someone in the crowd had lost a niece. Okay, I know that I'm in the front section in the way this is coming through, somewhere in this department.

And then he found a man who'd recently lost his niece. I have to highlight a reference to the month of July. We're in August currently.

July was important, all right? This is a... I'm so sorry. What do you say to people who say, oh, come on? I think that it's important to embrace skepticism, to never lose sight of our critical thinking, and to, more than anything, use common sense. But I also think that when it comes to grief, it's something we're all going to face. And if I'm able to deliver one thing, one unknowable detail, one piece of information that validates to a person that there is more to life than what we see, then that is worth any skepticism I face, any backlash, because I know that I've left someone better than I found them. Of course, not everyone in the psychic services industry leaves people better off. Tyler Henry says about half the people in his business aren't what they say they are. I know nothing.

Everything that I have, everything that comes out of here, comes from the man upstairs. In the 90s, a woman named Yuri Del Harris posed as a Jamaican psychic named Miss Cleo. You know the one I am talking about, don't you? And became the face of a popular call-in psychic advice service.

Call me now for your free reading. Turns out, it was all an act. Miss Cleo was actually from Los Angeles. But whenever anyone asked her about it, as I did in 2003, she was less than forthcoming.

Where were you born? You know what? I will tell you the same thing that I told the Attorney General. I took a number five with him.

That's the Fifth Amendment. And I will take it with you at this time. How about birthday? Will you tell me that if you want to tell me where you're born? I'll take a number five. I'm taking that as a no. Tell me your sign. I'll take a number five. This is a beautiful spot.

Thank you. Tyler Henry knows there will always be frauds and skeptics. But he sees a future in his business and says we shouldn't knock things we can't explain. Consciousness is clearly very complicated, multifaceted. There's an element to it that we clearly don't understand.

But to be able to sit with a stranger and get an insight into their life as though it is one's own life speaks to the fact that I think we are much more connected than we realize. Okay, picture this. It's Friday afternoon when a thought hits you. I can spend another weekend doing the same old whatever or I can hop into my all-new Hyundai Santa Fe and hit the road. With available H-Track all-wheel drive and three-row seating, my whole family can head deep into the wild. Conquer the weekend in the all-new Hyundai Santa Fe. Visit HyundaiUSA.com or call 562-314-4603 for more details.

Hyundai, there's joy in every journey. The word sneaker dates back to the late 1800s. Rubber soles made it possible to sneak quietly to your destination. Well over a century later, California tells us, there's a lot of noise about sneakers, one brand in particular. When you visit New Balance, you will be judged. I can walk in a room and pretty much know what people are wearing very quickly.

And when you talk to the company's CEO, Joe Preston, some things are better left unsaid. I feel a slight chill breeze come over this whole area any time I even say Nike or Adidas. And certainly when you look around, no one's wearing anything except New Balance. Is it tribal? Is it competitive in that way?

I think the industry is competitive and we're competitive. You don't even like to say their names, do you? I have.

I have said them. Nike brings in more than $50 billion a year. Adidas exceeds $20 billion. New Balance is smaller but growing fast.

Revenue last year was $6.5 billion, a 23% increase from the year before. A brand once associated with Steve Jobs is now linked to athletes and pop stars. We are trying to make the best product for athletes. And then we're also making product that people can wear to express their personality, to wear on the weekends.

I love them. New Balance is older than its larger competitors. It was founded in 1906 in Massachusetts where it's still based. In those days it just made inserts for shoes. It was all based on a chicken's foot. A chicken's foot?

That's right, yeah. If you notice the way a chicken walks, it's never really off balance. Its first sneaker was a 1961 running shoe called the Trackster. Run like a chicken.

Run like a chicken. Chris Davis is chief marketing officer. I grew up wearing New Balance every single day. I consider New Balance to be more of like a brother or sister.

Perhaps because Chris' dad, Jim Davis, bought the 66-year-old company in 1972. And what is he buying at that point? He's buying a running shoe with six employees making 20 pairs of shoe a day. By the 1980s, running was a fitness craze and New Balance introduced a shoe called the 990. It was the first shoe that broke the $100 barrier.

But it was also the first shoe that was designed for runners specifically running in the city. You have a cutting department, you have a pre-fit department, you have a computer stitch, stitching, and assembly. And it kind of goes around. Ray Wentworth oversees production.

You're building a shoe piece by piece. We are. We are. 990s have been made here in Lawrence, Massachusetts since 1982. The factory helped revive the old industrial city's economy. So many of the people who work at Lawrence are from Lawrence. It's a sense of pride for the community of Lawrence, but it's also a sense of pride for New Balance. New Balance has a second factory in Massachusetts, three in Maine, and a new one being built in New Hampshire. We want to be the best, most premium sneaker brand in the world. And the only way that we can do that is by making shoes in the United States.

At least some of them. Most New Balance shoes are made overseas. This is where the labs are. This is where the science is.

It's where the magic happens. Recently, New Balance opened an athletic facility across the street from their headquarters in Boston. At their research lab, they don't test athletes, just their shoes. This is flex testing. So it's basically mimicking steps.

A lot of steps at a very rapid rate. In 2019, Chris Davis also began a partnership with the American fashion label Amy Leon Door, first creating versions of the 990, then a year later reissuing a lesser-known basketball shoe from 1989. The 550 blew up. The 550 absolutely blew up. At the height of the 550, we were selling 80,000 pairs in a minute. The 550 not only took the industry by storm, but it took us by storm.

We knew it was going to be successful, but we didn't realize how successful it could be. Last year, Teddy Santis, Amy Leon Door's founder, signed on as New Balance's creative director in charge of its Made in the USA line. I'm wearing New Balance 650s right now. Made in China. Will these ever be made in the US? We stick to our high-end premium retro running shoes in the United States. Are you calling my sneakers low-end?

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But are we really making a difference? As Ben Tracy learned, the truth is complicated. So many people, they see the recyclable label and they put it in the recycle bin. Jan Dell is a former chemical engineer who has spent years telling an inconvenient truth. For those of us who are constantly putting our plastic into the blue recycling bin and assuming it's going to the recycling place, what do we not know? You're being lied to. The vast majority of plastics are not recycled.

They're just not. About 48 million tons of plastic waste is generated in the U.S. each year. Only five to six percent of it is actually recycled.

The rest ends up in landfills or is burned. All these plastic pouches that you get in e-commerce. Dell founded a non-profit to fight plastic pollution. Inside her garage in Southern California are all sorts of plastic with those little arrows on it that make us think they can be recycled.

It means you're being fooled. Those so-called chasing arrows started showing up on plastic products in 1988, part of a push to convince the public that plastic waste wasn't a problem because it can be recycled. They didn't really need it to work, right? They needed people to believe that it was working.

Davis Allen is an investigative researcher with the Center for Climate Integrity. In a new report called The Fraud of Plastic Recycling, it accuses the plastics industry of a decades-long campaign to mislead the public about the viability of plastic recycling, despite knowing the technical and economic limitations that make plastics unrecyclable at a large scale. They couldn't ever lie about the existence of plastic waste, but they created a lie about how we could solve it, and that was recycling. So if plastic recycling is technically difficult, if it doesn't make a whole lot of economic sense, why has the plastics industry pushed it? The plastics industry understands that selling recycling sells plastic, and they'll say pretty much whatever they need to say to continue doing that.

That's how they make money. Plastic is made from oil and gas and comes in thousands of varieties, most of which cannot be recycled together. The possibilities of plastics! But in the 1980s, when some municipalities moved to ban plastic products, the industry began promoting the idea of recycling as a solution. What we see in here is a widespread knowledge that plastics recycling was not working.

Allen showed us documents and meeting notes they obtained from public archives and from a former staff member of the American Plastics Council. At a trade conference in Florida in 1989, an industry leader told attendees, recycling cannot go on indefinitely and does not solve the solid waste problem. In 1994, an Exxon executive told the staff of the Plastics Council that when it comes to recycling, we are committed to the activities, but not committed to the results. They always kind of viewed recycling not as a real technical problem that they needed to solve, but as a public relations problem. The industry just launched a new ad campaign called Recycling is Real. Recycling is very real. And says it's investing in what it calls advanced recycling technology. An industry trade group responded to Sunday Morning in a statement calling the Center for Climate Integrity's report flawed and outdated, and says plastic makers are working hard to change the way that plastics are made and recycled. It's the same process they were trying it 30 years ago.

And my response to that is it's science fiction. Jan Dell doesn't believe plastic will ever be truly recyclable. Plastic production is set to triple by 2050. And with so much plastic waste piling up on land and sea, more than 170 countries are working on a United Nations treaty to end plastic pollution. In a letter to President Biden about the negotiations, the plastics industry says it opposes any bans on plastic production, but supports more recycling.

The only thing the plastics industry has actually recycled is their lies over and over again. The Angie's List you know and trust is now Angie, and we're so much more than just a list. We still connect you with top local pros and show you ratings and reviews. But now we also let you compare upfront prices on hundreds of projects and book a service instantly. We can even handle the rest of your project from start to finish. So remember, Angie's List is now Angie, and we're here to get your job done right.

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That's R-A-K-U-T-E-N. The Federal Trade Commission might sound like just another faceless government bureaucracy, but the work they do can impact prices from your local grocery store to Amazon. Robert Costa is in conversation with FTC chair Lina Khan. Monopoly. It's the game where you bankrupt competitors, buying up the board and charging sky high prices. But from her Washington office, there's a real battle for our country. Lina Khan is playing a different game.

Anti-monopoly. You're playing that game in real life. We are. The experience is not quite akin to playing a board game, but there are challenges and unpredictable swerves. And sometimes you roll the dice.

That's right. Khan is chair of the Federal Trade Commission. She's rolled the dice with one buzzy lawsuit after another, Big Tech. The FTC suing Microsoft to officially block its plan deal with Activision. Big Pharma.

Suing to block Amgen's deal to acquire Horizon Therapeutics. Even Big Grocery. The government is trying to block the largest grocery store merger in American history. The FTC is an independent watchdog and warden of competition in business. When you have companies that are not disciplined by competition, oftentimes they can get away with abusing their customers. Firms can become too big to care. There can be this basic indignity of being a consumer in America today. And that's what the FTC is trying to fix. Khan finds inspiration in the golden age of trust busting when government broke up Standard Oil and the railroads.

Two to four to take and two trains to go to Gateway. And views recent decades as easy street for big business. We're going to turn the bull loose. There was a clear policy decision back in the 80s that it was better for the government to be hands off. I think several decades on we're really living with the cost of those decisions.

One of those costly decisions, she says, was consolidation of the U.S. aerospace industry. I mean, over the last few months, we've seen firsthand how Boeing not being checked by competition in the marketplace has led to all sorts of issues. Khan's biggest case so far, Amazon, arguing the retailer's tactics punish sellers over prices. It can delist them from the buy box, make them disappear from the search results page effectively. Amazon knows that a lot of small businesses live in constant terror.

Constant terror? Constant terror of Amazon because they know that with the press of a single button, a business can see its sales drop by 80 percent or 90 percent. Overnight, a business can be looking at bankruptcy or liquidation if it gets on the wrong side of Amazon.

Amazon is fighting back and says its practices provide good deals for customers. Khan's scrutiny of the online mega store began as a star law school student. And that stardom has only grown for the 35-year-old.

Boy, would you stay forever? Even earning praise from so-called conservatives. I look at Lena Khan as one of the few people in the Biden administration that I actually think is doing a pretty good job. Her critics are just as fervent. Khan's been a one-woman wrecking crew for your stock portfolio. Casting her as an overreaching anti-business crusader.

My problem here today is that you're a bully. Is there a risk for the FTC taking an aggressive approach with these big companies? Our focus is on making sure that we are enforcing the rule of law. And I see an enormous amount at risk if you instead sit on your hands and don't address the problems that people face in their day-to-day lives. Khan's next move, investigating pharmacy benefit managers. Hello.

Nice to see you all. In Philadelphia this month, she met with independent pharmacists. Over 300 pharmacies have already closed in the country. Who say these prescription drug middlemen are hurting their bottom lines. We're losing money.

And their patients. My voice is asking you. It's pleading you and it's begging you. Something has to be done. Whether it's on the road or in court, Lina Khan wants corporate America on alert.

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Because I couldn't hear her. It's the money issue on Sunday morning. Here again is Jane Pauley. With memorable bits like the puffy shirt, he turned a show about nothing into ratings gold. Now he's made a movie about, of all things, pop tarts. Mo Rocca speaks to Jerry Seinfeld about Unfrosted. When I was a kid, it started with a stand-up bit. When they invented the pop tart, the back of my head blew right off.

And like any good comedy, it was based in truth. In 1964, when the pop tart was introduced, 10-year-old Jerry Seinfeld fell hard. Did you have a favorite flavor right from the start? Brown sugar cinnamon, obviously. I'm surprised that it took them that long to add frosting.

It was two or three years. Why? You think that's obvious, frosting? Well, they look a little drab to me when they're not frosted.

You're a tough audience. I thought they were absolutely sensational instantly. But I did not know, and my parents did not know, these things are not food. And they can't go stale?

Because they were never fresh. It should come as little surprise that the man who headlined a sitcom about nothing has managed to build a whole movie out of that routine. In the early 1960s, the American morning was defined by milk and cereal, and the two undisputed giants of the cereal world were Kellogg's and Post. Major news from the breakfast world. The Post cereal company has reportedly invented a shelf-stable fruit pastry breakfast product. No.

Yeah. His new film, Unfrosted, is a mostly made-up ode to the processed food favorite. The real story that we started with, and I think it's the only real thing in the movie, is that Post came up with this idea, Kellogg's heard about it very late, and decided to try and catch up.

They got a fruit-filled pastry. Dingus. Dingus? Who is a dingus?

Post. They did it. Our own Sunday morning contributor, Jim Gaffigan, plays Edsel Kellogg. When Seinfeld asked him to sign on, he was there. I would never bet against Jerry Seinfeld.

Sometimes comedians can be funny for a decade or maybe a decade or two, but Jerry seems to have transcended four or five decades now. Ready and action. In addition to writing and acting... Reset.

Let's go again. Seinfeld stepped behind the camera for the first time. Did you know you were going to direct it from the beginning?

No, but I thought, what would be the least work? The least work is for me to just tell the actor how to say it, instead of me telling the director and then the director telling the actor. It must have been fun casting this.

It was so much fun, and Hugh Grant was the guy who made the movie. Hello, everyone. Playing a certain tiger. And look who's here. Good morning, Thurl. Is it good, Bob?

Is it? Have you seen today's copy? Oh, we'll get it, Thurl. We've got the best serial writers in the business.

We do indeed. We are so blessed. They're great. Just great.

That's it. That's the line we've been looking for. Seinfeld called on a bunch of his comedian pals, from Amy Schumer and Melissa McCarthy... Stan, my friend, I believe we have split the atom of breakfast. ...to Sara Cooper. Excuse me.

Mr. Kellogg needs you. A meeting of the five serial families has been called. By who? What was he like as a director?

What surprised you? He was very specific with what he wanted. There was a moment where Tom Lennon had to do this line, where he had to do this.

Voila! And he did a take, and then Jerry came over and adjusted his hands just slightly like this. And everybody's like, how's that making it better? Behold, life!

But then he did it, and it actually was better. I'm precise, but for my thing and what I do, I have to be that way. This is one of my favorite scenes in the movie.

Director Jerry Seinfeld walked us through a Kellogg's-style funeral for a taste pilot who blew up during the creation of the Pop-Tart. And yes, that part is made up. You always want to be in very serious places in comedy because it makes it easier to be funny. Why do you think that is?

The more you're supposed to act right when you act wrong, it's funny. When a man gives the last full serving suggestion of himself, only then is he truly deserving to be buried with full serial honors. This is where we lay in our premise. The premise is full serial honors.

This is not something that you have heard of before, so you have the characters repeat it three times. Full serial honors, Mrs. Schwinn. That's quite an honor.

It's a great honor. What is happening? Snap! Crack out!

Pop! If you look at my face there, this is what's hard about acting and directing at the same time. I'm directing here. I'm just watching.

Are they doing this right? I have completely dropped my character. Luckily, I don't take my work as an actor at all, seriously. But he did make sure the other actors felt taken care of.

There was actually a moment on set that I think it was the only moment I saw somebody get a little bit tense. And Jerry was just like, guys, we're making a movie about a Pop-Tart. He put it all in perspective so quickly.

That's good, Kyle. He would give a speech every now and then, and it would be pretty inspiring. What kind of things would he say? He would just say, I really appreciate you guys, your contribution.

This is a really exciting thing for me. And he would speak from his heart. Jim Gaffigan and Sarah Cooper, when they were talking about you on the set, they described you as a real leader, that you'd give speeches.

Sure, yeah. I'm a comedian, so I'm used to talking to people in an uncomfortable situation. That's what stand-up is. This is a very uncomfortable situation. We're expecting to laugh. You're expecting to be funny. That's not that different from a movie set. This is all awkward, and everyone's nervous.

These things are the greatest two rectangles since the Ten Commandments. Yes, we have the trusted, so, okay. Since this is Sunday morning's money issue, we had to ask whether Kellogg's was in on the action. Kellogg's did not have anything to do with this movie. Right.

When you see the movie, you will understand, no company would want a movie made about their product like this. Right, it becomes abundantly clear. Yes. Homelessness is one of our nation's most intractable challenges. But increasingly, politicians have their eyes on a Texas city that seems to have found a winning formula. With Martha Teichner, we head to Houston. Good morning.

How are you doing? An apartment. And brand-new furniture donated by a local retailer. What? And a TV. Oh, my gosh, it's baseball season. You don't know how much that means to me. A lot of bad luck.

It's perfect. Led 62-year-old Army veteran Julie Blow to homelessness. Serious kidney issues, a fire, a fall that cost her the sight in one eye, two surgeries.

She couldn't work and ran out of money. I feel like a teenager. I'm that happy, you know, before all this stuff happens to you in life and you get jaded.

I feel like a teenager. A 320-square-foot studio. Ah, yes.

Nothing fancy. But for Julie, luxury after the tent where she had been living. And for Houston, one more piece of evidence that its strategy for solving its homelessness problem works. Is Houston the model that the rest of the nation should look at and follow?

Yes. Kelly Young heads Houston's Coalition for the Homeless. We were one of the worst in the nation to begin with in 2011, 2012, and now we're considered one of the best.

What happened? In 2012, the city went all in on a concept called Housing First. Since then, homelessness is down 63% in the Greater Houston area, and more than 30,000 people have been housed. Oh, wow.

Oh, so-so. Housing First means spend money on getting the unhoused into their own apartments, subsidize their rent, then provide the services needed to stabilize their lives, not fix the person first, not just add more shelter beds. I think our natural instinct when we see homelessness increasing is to hire more outreach workers and to build more shelter beds. Mandy Chapman Semple was the architect of Houston's success story. And what's exciting is we've been able to move on to families. And now advises other cities on how to replicate it, among them Dallas, New Orleans, Oklahoma City.

The idea that if you have no permanent place to live, that you're also going to be able to transform and tackle complex mental health issues, addiction issues, complex financial issues, it's just unrealistic. In Houston, Step 1 was convincing dozens of unconnected agencies, all trying to do everything, to join forces under a single umbrella organization, The Way Home, run by the Houston Coalition for the Homeless. Good morning. Good morning. So, for example, when outreach coordinators visited this homeless encampment, How you doing? I'm doing okay.

How you doing today? Jessalyn Damano was able to plug everything she learned into a system-wide database. And it actually logs in real time where people are staying, so individuals as well as encampments. Houston has dismantled 127 homeless encampments, but only after housing had been found for all of the occupants. So far this year, The Way Home has already housed more than 750 people. It helps that this city, unlike many, has a supply of relatively affordable apartments, and that it was able to use roughly $100 million in COVID aid to help pay for rentals, on top of its other homeless relief dollars.

I'm going to frame them and put them right here so that when I'm cooking... But Houston's message is this. This is a part of my life, that I made it. What's really essential to success is committing to homes, not just managing homelessness. What Houston has done for this country is it's established a playbook that now allows any city to do the same because we've proven that it can be done. Houston Strong. Yes, sir.

Houston Strong. That's me. Good luck. Thank you so much. Congratulations. Thank you, sir. What came first, the chicken or the egg?

Spoiler alert, it's neither. At Happy Egg, we believe happiness of the hens is what actually came first because without happy hens, there would be no such thing as happy eggs, you know, eggs with delicious orange yolks. Those come from hens who are raised the happy way on eight-plus acres of family-owned farms.

Choose happy at happyegg.com and look for the yellow carton at a store near you. Happy Egg. Stephen Colbert here to tell you about the Late Show Pod Show, which is our podcast. I'm here with my producer, Becca. Becca, what can people expect on the podcast?

The extended moments, for sure. Where can people get that? On the Late Show Pod Show with Stephen Colbert, wherever you get your podcasts. I use the internet. Thank you for listening. Please join us when our trumpet sounds again next Sunday morning.