Good morning. Jane Pauley is off this weekend. I'm Seth Doan. And this is Sunday morning. The dog days of summer are here, a time when the pace slows, routines loosen, and we often find ourselves drawn back to familiar surroundings, places where people know your name and share rituals that help turn strangers into a community.
The community we'll be looking in on this morning is perhaps a little unlikely, a bowling alley in Maine, where, as Lee Cowan will show us, a young owner is keeping a lot more than a game alive. after which we hit the road, where Luke Burbank visits a truck stop, like none other. After a long haul in their big rig, there's one place on Highway 80 that's a trucker's oasis. It's got a barber shop. A dentist.
A chiropractor Yeah. And so much more. I mean, I love coming here. It's like a, it's a Disney rule for truckers. Take a ride with us to the world's largest truck stop.
Mm-hmm. ahead on Sunday morning. For more than 50 years, Tim Curry has captivated audiences with performances that are, let's just say, unique.
Now, in conversation with our Ben Mankiewicz, he's looking back on those roles, roles that made him a star and helped give him the resilience to keep going.
Well you got caught with a flat wheel. How about that? Tim Curry is famous and famously private. But then came the stroke that changed his life forever. I had to learn how to speak again.
That was very weird. I hated not being able to speak because I speak a lot. Have you ever taken an acting class? No, not really. A rare conversation with Tim Curry later on Sunday morning.
As one of the plant world's rare carnivores, the Venus flytrap has been a source of fascination for centuries. Even Charles Darwin was a fan. But despite being celebrated on stage and screen, this remarkable plant is facing an uncertain future. It has quite a reputation. It's a cool plant.
Darwin called it the most interesting plant in the world. To me, it's like the panda of the plant world. It's rare, it's interesting, it's charismatic. But despite the lore... Missimo.
Oh. It's the Venus flytrap that's under threat. Saving this panda of the plant world. Coming up. on Sunday morning.
Erin Moriarty this morning examines the consequences for mothers in some states when their newborns test positive for even trace amounts of marijuana. Kelefacene compares notes with 94-year-old writer Gay Tales, a legendary pioneer of what we once called the new journalism. plus a story from Steve Hartman and more on this Sunday morning for the 9th of August 2026. And we'll be back after this. This weekend, some among us celebrated National Bowling Day.
Yes, there really is such a thing. Bowling leagues may not be what they were in the 1970s, but our League Cowan found an alley and its young owner, offering people the chance to reconnect. Before streaming, smartphones, and social media, Bowling leagues used to bring people together. And in New England, It was candle pin Bolton. Alleys stretch from Massachusetts all the way into Canada's maritime provinces.
Still though, it never really caught on anywhere else. Have we all done candle pin bowling before? But in Ellsworth, Maine. I'll take a seven.
Alrighty. Autumn Mowry. You guys are all set on lane eleven. He's fighting to keep the candle pin flame. Flip to it.
So what's the difference between Candle pin and just regular bowling that most people know about. This one's better. Clearly. In short, it's thinner pins, smaller balls. And it's not easy.
Yes! Auden's been coming here since she was six years old. especially during Maine's winters. Ellsworth doesn't boast a lot to do when the days are long and the snow is deep. At 17, she started working at the alley, not in the front.
How's our channel finale? How can I help you? In the back. Where she became fascinated with the old world engineering of these pinsetting machines. I remember my first time going back there and I'm looking up at these machines and I'm like, whoa, like this is so cool.
And then this ball return I just redid. I saw that one.
Now that looks great. They are the beating heart of this place. A ballet of gears and conveyors. It would be the pride of any museum dedicated to analog genius. And something broke?
Autumn risked life and limb to fix it. She's gotten smacked in the eye with a ball, broken more than a few fingers. and the gears snarl her hair every time they get a chance. Yet she treats them. Like employees.
You talk to them? I do. When I'm having a really good day, I will come back here and go. Let's go, we got this. She came into this family of pins by way of defeat.
The previous owner had let the alley fall into the gutter. From 2020. He was said to be bulldozed. Until Autumn begged to give her just three months. If she couldn't keep the ball rolling, she said, the owner could take the wrecking ball to all of it.
She was just eighteen at the time. The obstacles this place is thrown at me, sometimes I think it doesn't want my hair. Shortly after taking over, a storm fried the alley's wiring. The roof started leaking, the pipe burst. It was literally raining in here.
Oh, and then COVID hit. Not to mention that she was working every single day just to keep the lights on. I mean, did you ever think about giving up? throwing in the bowling towel and saying. This is too much.
I would have if it wasn't for mom. She was like kind of like the angel during everything. Because of mom, I didn't give up. Her mom, Amanda. is her best friend.
If she taught her anything on him, says, it was to remain positive, even in the darkest of times. Growing up was just really tricky, just walking on eggshells a lot. We were feeding off of the environment that was around us. In that environment. was challenging both physically and mentally, Autumn says.
She still suffers from anxiety to this day. But it's in that suffering, she says, she's found a way. To help others, I wanted to become a clinical therapist. And so that was kind of always the goal: to help people. And with this place, I saw a lot of potential.
She remembers one day in the bowling alley she noticed a situation she could tell wasn't quite right. There was a couple sitting over at that furthest booth and she wouldn't leave the guy's side and I thought I definitely was like catching on to some red flags. When I brought out their food, I brought them out napkins and I handed her the napkins and I had wrote on there to do a thumbs up or a thumbs down if she was okay. And she put a thumbs down. She called the police.
In the ensuing months, she began opening the alley to those who needed a place to talk. Just like that stranger. Domestic violence victims have been able to come here. We've been able to put the tables and chairs all together and do therapy sessions. All right, go right ahead, kiddos.
Her outreach to both adults and kids has been noticed. It should go on so close. High five, high five. Bowler Jen Johnson had stopped coming here altogether. But she's back now with all of her friends.
For a girl her age. To bring this to life again, to reinvent it. It's a gift for all of us. That's why we want to give back to her because she brings people together. It's been six years now since Autumn first made that three month offer to keep the alley running.
She's now 24. making monthly payments. to buy the place. along with their business partner. Ryan Lounder.
There we go. He's also the pizza chef, the fry cook. And he owns the game shop next door. He's also Autumn's Fiance they planned to hold their wedding reception. right here in the alley.
Next year. Could you do this? Without each other? No. No, no, unlike some couples, they don't argue about money, they have a GoFundMe, but.
We haven't really told anybody about it. Instead, what little profit they do bring in, They've turned around for the community in food drives and pancake breakfasts. Can you guys afford to do that?
So really? Probably not. And should we? Also, probably not. Could we upgrade the machines more?
Yes, but we're not the only people in need of stuff. Yeah. The old machines still test her patience. But They're her babies. Along with their young son, Jackson.
Grab it. He can barely walk, but already gets the spirit of the sport. Oh no, it's gonna get you! I have joked with a lot of people that he's either gonna love bowling or hate it. Perfect.
Bowling a 300, a perfect candle pin game? It's almost impossible. As far as we can tell. No one has ever done it. But Ana Maori has nevertheless found this a perfect place to remind herself and others.
That real connections, well, maybe never perfect. My name is Autumn. in fact. Matter. For so long I've been searching of who I am.
And I feel like that the place really did save me and helped me find that. I feel like it really just brought out who Autumn really is. If that makes any sense. And it just feels good. I'm happy, you know?
And me being happy is also making others around me happy, so. It works out. Yeah. It is one of the world's most renowned and unusual plants, but it's not native to some far-off locale. The Venus flytrap is found in a small patch of these United States, a tiny habitat that's shrinking all too quickly.
Today, we are rescuing Venus Flytraps. This is actually our 10th rescuer in double-digit sal. My name is Tyler Gramley, for those of you who don't know me. It's a roadside rescue. This is a highly coveted plant, a rather unusual variety.
Do you have to dig deep and spread the grasses around and look? First time volunteer Stephanie Dupree was ready for the damp North Carolina morning. Can you see it? But was not expecting the size of the subject. In my head I always had like Seymour, you know from Little Shop of Horrors.
Missy Mao. Oh. Lead me all night long. That horror comedy rock musical added to the outsized lore of the Venus flytrap. You think eat flies, it's gonna be some big Giant predator, but it's just a little tiny, unassuming thing.
Flytrap is not the best name for them. The joke is they should be called beetle traps. Or spider traps. Flies too fast. Flies get away.
So weird looking. I don't mean it not in a bad way, but they're... They're flytraps. They're the coolest plant in the world. Botanist Julie Moore has spent a good part of her life studying and helping to save this carnivorous plant, which holds tight plenty of surprises.
What's your mission here? My mission here is to make people more aware of what they have. For one, it's native to this part of the Carolinas. While Boiling Springs Lake near Wilmington may not seem like the center of much, these babies have done just fine. It is for these plants.
Their natural habitat is a roughly 80 mile radius from here. You think of the Venus flytrap as an exotic plant. But it isn't. It's a a down-home plant for this part of the world. It's a southern plant.
but its native population is dwindling. Since the 1970s, more than half of flytrap plants have vanished. We really focus on where the plants will be disappearing very soon. Just simply place them in. Getting a little bit of pressure and leveling them with the current substrate.
They've dug up and replanted more than 5,000 so far. The plants are easier to spot in summer when they shoot up a flower to be pollinated by an insect.
Well, away from those snapping traps, it's an evolutionary assist, but nature's survival mechanisms have limits. It used to be the threat was people thought poaching, stealing fly traps, and shipping them all over the world. That was a big threat.
Well, no. Not anymore. It's housing developments, new roads. Just more people. How quickly is this area developing?
Rapidly. Runs up County is one of the fastest-growing counties in the country. Gordon Hargrove is city manager. Have you ever had to stop development because of the plants? Oh, yes, yes.
You know, developers want to move fast. Time is money.
So we will hold the permits to give us enough time to go out there and establish the timeframe that we need to relocate the plants. I mean, with this growth coming, if we don't preserve them, who's going to? Dartwin called it the most interesting plant in the world. To me, it's like the panda of the plant world. It's rare, it's interesting, it's charismatic.
Damon Waite is the director of the North Carolina Botanical Garden. He told us there are only two plant species in the world with an active trap that closes over prey. It almost looks like an animal. Yeah. Darwin thought it could be an animal.
He thought it might have been the transition between the plant and the animal world. Rather, Wade explained it's the plant's way of getting a sort of snack. They always grow in very nutrient-poor areas like bogs and savannas. And so they're compensating for the lack of nitrogen in the soil by getting it from the insects that they eat. You know, a typical plant has seven to eight traps.
It has to be touched more than once and within 20 seconds. Oh. There it goes. Wow. That's hermetic.
It's quick. It's a tenth of a second. It's hermetically sealing right now. and what it'll do will start to exude digestive enzymes inside that trap. That process takes about 10 days.
At the botanical garden, they've frozen 94,000 flytrap seeds to preserve them for genetic diversity. There's been a large reduction in the number of sites. It's gone from about 250 different sites where it occurs naturally down to about 65 sites today. This is natural habitat for these flytraps. They're here.
They're happy here. One of those sites now has a few hundred additional plants, thanks to these volunteers and Julie Moore, who admits worrying about these plants can keep her up at night. Once you can see loss happening before your eyes, it's easy to get involved. It's not in theory. is real here.
What made you want to dedicate so much of your life today? on this. Years ago, flytraps weren't a threatened species. They are now. What we saw happen today in the housing development, new roads, that's going to be the termination of this species.
And hell, I don't want to be the person who knew this was going to happen and didn't do a damn thing. Mm-hmm. We are off on a summer road trip with a pit stop that makes the journey all worthwhile. Luke Burbank is in the driver's seat. We could tell you the exact address of the world's largest truck stop halfway between Chicago and Des Moines, but honestly, you can't miss it.
It's the size of more than 150 football fields. 900 parking spots for trucks and a staff of almost 600 people, and a bunch of merch, calling it the world's largest.
So who are we to argue? Is there some sort of governmental body that verifies these things? Unfortunately not. And we have contacted Ripley's, believe it or not, a couple times, and they're like, oh, we don't know how to measure that. A really cool part about trucks versus Delia Moon Meyer is the president and CEO of the Iowa 80 truck stop, which her father, Bill Moon, took over in 1965, just as construction of Interstate 80 expanded.
Which meant lots more trucks that needed lots more fuel and other things from a growing truck stop. But always on her parents' mind, says Meyer, were the drivers themselves. My parents loved truck drivers. They thought it was cool. And for whatever reason, they just really got captured by the trucking culture.
And they loved taking care of people. Her father died in 1992. But as the truck stop grew, so too did the family belief that truckers, the humans, needed as much maintenance as their trucks did.
So next to the 24-hour gym They added a barber shop where Angie Clark spruces up long haulers and TV correspondents alike. You know, you can't pull a semi-truck just into any shopping center and jump out and get a haircut.
So you want to make them look good and feel good and You know, sometimes they don't get to talk to many people either. I'd never thought about that, but you're sort of part hairdresser, part therapist? We're a therapist. Yeah. And just down the hall, it's 99% emergency care.
They're looking for pain relief. Yes, this truck stop has a dentist, Dr. Thomas Romer. They must be really grateful. To roll in here with, because you know, when you're having tooth pain, it's the only thing you can think about.
These guys, when they can't sleep, they can't eat, they can't function, and then when they walk out of here pretty much pain-free, they're very, very appreciative. More than 70% of all U.S. freight is moved by truck, which means a lot of sitting.
Alright, here we go. Yeah. which is where Dr. Justin Seifert, in-house chiropractor, comes in. A little looser.
Nice, the general population. They Just don't believe that a chiropractor would be out here, but it makes perfect sense with truck drivers sitting all the time and low back pain and mid-back pain are their main problems just because they slouch from time to time. Maybe you need something for your rig.
So, what did you come here to get today? Love nut covers. Perhaps something in chrome? Who doesn't like a chrome shop? A store, you know, for your big rig?
It feels like a ball in comparison to like I don't know, like a convenience store. And like a mall, there's a food court, a restaurant too. Where Rick Denny has been working for 34 years, his grill is always hot 24 hours a day. We have drivers that are out constantly coming in, so they don't always have to follow a schedule from 9 to 5, so we got to be here for them. We never close, and holidays are very, very busy days for us.
These days, Denny is the general manager of the restaurant and can spot folks who might be craving something more than just lunch. I think when they sit at the counter, they're acknowledging that they want to kind of interact with somebody else and that.
So you see that all day long. Sure, a buffet can fill your belly, but for spiritual sustenance, there's also the Trucker's Ministry Office, faithfully run by Pastor Jerry Hull. What are the sort of spiritual needs? that the trucking life. kind of creates for people.
The biggest thing is I'm away from home. And I need someone to visit with. I need someone to talk to. Has anybody gotten saved in this office? Yes, sir.
Yes, sir, many, many times. Federal law mandates that for every 14-hour shift, a trucker needs to take a 10-hour break.
So, why not catch a flick in the Truck Stops movie theater? Or wash your dog. I mean, I love coming here. It's like a, it's a Disney rule for truckers. Yeah.
There's a lot more selection as far as the shopping, the restaurants, the truck wash, the museum. Wait, did she just say museum? Yes, across the parking lot sits the Iowa 80 Truck Museum. This is our 1919 International and this is the first truck that my dad bought. America's Trucking History Parked Side by Side, a collection started by Delia's father.
This was. The fanciest thing you could have gotten back in 1959. Yes. And you were supposed to drive your route, and then at night, When it was time to uh go to sleep, this was This is what you got? Yeah.
And you loved it because before that you would have brought a piece of wood and you would have put it over these seats and you would have slept on that piece of wood.
So to have a four inch foam mattress, you were living the high life. The museum is free for tourists and truckers alike. Mm-hmm. Yet another oversized addition. to this not-so-slight detour.
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Ollie, feed the obsession. It happened late last month. We learned of the death of Jean Gibson, a woman who embodied the spirit of Rosie the Riveter. After all, she was one of them. She died at age one hundred.
As men went overseas to fight during World War II, the federal government launched the Rosie the Riveter campaign, inspiring more than 6 million women to enter the workforce and power the war effort. All the day long where the rain has shined, she's a part of the assembly line. She's making history working for victory. Rosie the Riveter. Jean Gibson left her Minneapolis home at age 18 to become a welder at the Todd Pacific Shipyards in Washington State.
I was doing something that wasn't done by women before, getting equal pay for equal work when I was welding. changed my whole life because I wouldn't take less after that. After the war, Gibson went on to earn a Ph.D. and was an educator for more than 30 years. We were making destroyers.
She also continued to inspire future generations as a volunteer at the Rosie the Riveter World War II Homefront National Historical Park in Richmond, California. He said it. In 2024, Gene Gibson was one of many Rosies collectively awarded the Congressional Gold Medal. She leaves behind a legacy of enduring strength and a lifetime of public service. For months now, Sunday Morning has been working with our reporting partners at the Marshall Project, investigating how in some states, trace amounts of marijuana found in the system of a newborn can have life-altering legal and economic consequences for the baby's mother.
Aaron Moriarty has the story. Giving birth to her fourth child in January of 2021 was life-changing, says Nicole Hammond, but not in the way she ever imagined. I felt like all of a sudden I was a criminal. While still at the hospital, Hammond was informed that both she and her newborn tested positive for a trace amount of THC, the psychoactive chemical in marijuana. Through all of my pregnancies, I took very good care of myself and my body.
Now, all of a sudden, I have these people making me feel guilt and shame and fear. Hammond lives in Idaho, where marijuana is illegal. But a month before giving birth, Hammond, who has no criminal record, says she accidentally ate a potlace brownie at a relative's home in Oregon, where marijuana is legal. Were they interested in hearing the explanation why you might have THC in your system? Absolutely not.
Idaho's Child and Family Services began an investigation immediately because in Idaho and a number of other states, a single positive test result of THC in a newborn is considered presumptive evidence of child abuse. They knocked on my door. And there was an officer standing with them. A police officer. A police officer.
After inspecting her home and speaking with Hammond's other children, state social workers closed her case. I just thought, okay, just tell me what I have to do so that this can all go away. And little did I know. that it wasn't gonna go just go away. This was gonna haunt me for the next 10 years of my life.
Because although social workers found no evidence of drug use, Hammond's name was still placed on the agency's Child Protection Central Registry, a list of child abusers. That means she can't work in hospitals or daycare centers. Even volunteering at her children's school is out. And her name will remain on that list for at least 10 years. It hurts.
It hurts. It's heavy. It feels like somebody placed a big boulder on my shoulder and I have to carry it around for 10 years. And she is not alone. At least a thousand new mothers in Idaho have been placed on that same registry, many for using marijuana products to relieve pain and severe nausea.
because your stomach is so hungry, but you can't keep anything down, and it almost feels like the flu. Three years ago, when Ashley McGrath was 22 and pregnant with her son, Her morning sickness, she says, consumed the entire day. Every home remedy I can think of, every tea, everything I'm trying is just making me more miserable. And it was getting to the point. where My teeth were starting to be affected and my throat.
Her doctor prescribed the anti-nausea medication Zofran, but when that too failed to offer relief, She turned to marijuana games. The instant relief, I swear, about an hour in, just I was like, oh. I've I want to eat. McGrath, who was working in health care and hoped to become a nurse practitioner, was aware that some studies linked marijuana use during pregnancy to lower birth weight and premature births. My child was perfectly healthy.
Like Nicole Hammond, McGrath and her fiancé were investigated and then cleared by social workers. But McGrath says having her name on the child abuse registry has had devastating consequences. My career as a healthcare worker is not just at risk, it's it's completely thrown away. Instead, she says, she has been sentenced to a decade of scrounging for work that doesn't require a background check. She now eks out a living delivering food orders.
It makes me feel like I'm very s closely associated with a felon. Would be going through. You're not doing anything for them other than stopping their ability to support themselves and their children. Attorney Rick Hearn, who also has a medical degree, has filed a federal class action suit against the state of Idaho on behalf of these mothers, arguing that they've lost the ability to support their families without due process. Has the agency been able to show that any child has been harmed by any of these women who use marijuana during pregnancy?
They have not yet, but What is most relevant to your question is that it's not a requirement to go on the list. There's no requirement that the baby looks sick or had any problems whatsoever. We reached out to the state's Department of Health and Welfare. The response, we do not comment on pending litigation. But across the country, around 300,000 newborns are exposed prenatally to cannabis every year.
The legal risk to their mothers depends on where they live, and it can go beyond a child abuse registry. It can actually lead to criminal charges. Our joint investigation with the Marshall Project found that in a six-year period in these 21 states, new moms were referred more than 70,000 times to law enforcement for allegations of substance use during pregnancy, many for using THC. To be depicted as a bad parent and all I want and I've achieved to be is a great mom is horrible. I didn't do anything detrimental or neglectful to my child.
In 2021, when Ayana Harris Rashid was pregnant with her third child, she moved from California, where marijuana is legal, to South Carolina, where it is not. She says that within her Native American culture, it's very common to use CBD and hemp-based products, which legally can contain tiny levels of THC to relieve cramping and nausea. You had a South Carolina midwife, and she never mentioned that if, in fact, you had any THC in your system, you could run into a problem. No. I was completely blindsided because I didn't even know that they were going to drug test me.
And it's supposed to be with reasonable cause for suspicion. But in South Carolina, any newborn who tests positive for THC, even if the mother used legal CBD products, is supposed to be reported to the state's Department of Social Services and law enforcement. Harris Rashid was home with her four-week-old baby when she got the call. We're issuing a warrant for your arrest. You have three days to turn yourself in.
I just think and started crying. Harris Rashid was charged with unlawful conduct towards a child, a felony, and jailed. She had to wait until the following morning to bail out. I mean, I was like, this is not real. You're not taking me from my newborn baby and locking me in a jail cell.
It was the most horrific experience of my life. It is outrageous that these women are being charged with a criminal offense. Attorney Aaron Bailey agreed to defend Harris Rashid, facing 10 years in prison. And unable to pay a lawyer. I was outraged because I know that every pregnant woman.
is constantly having to weigh risks, educate herself, and make some hard decisions. You can say that THC is illegal here in South Carolina. You could. But does it rise to the level of being charged with a ten-year felony? For making the wrong risk calculus.
Yeah, I think it's enough for an arrest. Jimmy Richardson, the Horry County solicitor, runs the office that prosecuted Harris Rashid. The standard is very low. And that is More probable than not that this child may have been put at an unreasonable risk of harm. Yet a Marshall Project data analysis of these eight states found that moms of black newborns facing allegations of drug use are referred to law enforcement around two and a half times more often than mothers of white babies.
Does the background of the mother or her color of skin play a part in this? I'm sure it could, yeah. I would suspect. that, you know, if it was the doctor's wife, They may not even call. A year after her arrest, charges against Harris Rashid were dropped.
Richardson says that most of these cases involving just THC are either dismissed or end with probation. But Aaron Bailey says damage to the women has already been done. Number one, we're a cash bond state. And Iana didn't have that kind of money. No, which means that you use a bondsman.
So that's $1,000 down the drain for a brand new mother. Most times these women have to spend the night in jail for a brand new breastfeeding mother. That's enough to completely break your breastfeeding bond. Harris Rasheed's record has since been expunged, but for the women on the child abuse registry in Idaho, it's been much harder to move on. One test.
One test. I don't know. I get really frustrated because it took away everything from me. Three years after Nicole Hammond was placed on the registry. Her husband was seriously injured in a motorcycle accident and could no longer work.
When the accident happened and our world got flipped upside down. That's when I realized the weight. I felt like I couldn't provide for our family. because any little jobs that I could do wasn't going to be enough to make the kind of money that I needed to keep a roof over our head. Hammond hesitated to speak out.
She lives in a small town and fears she could be judged harshly. And yet, she faces five more years on the registry. She can no longer afford, she says, to be silent. I know this isn't right. And I know that this isn't fair.
And if there's anything that I can Say your do? to help make sure that this doesn't happen to anybody else. Then that is my obligation and my responsibility. To Steve Hartman now with the tale of Barley the Golden Retriever and Louie the Duck. Justin and Tori Canarelli almost have a typical American family.
Two kids and a dog. But then they've also got this Duck. I never thought I would own a duck. I never expected him to stay long term. Torrey brought Louie home after he hatched at an elementary school on Long Island, New York.
it was supposed to be a short little visit. but the duck quickly became indispensable. for one family member in particular. their golden retriever, Barley. Yeah, a couple years ago, Barley started to have seizures.
They put her on medication and it worked. The seizure stopped. but the family also observed some adverse side effects. She wasn't really hyperactive anymore. She just lost her spunk, she lost her goldenness.
And we thought. Oh man, this medication, we have to give her for the rest of the life, so this is how she's going to be. There's nothing you can do for them, there's no way to help them. but then they noticed a bond building.
Now we know there was a way. A friendship built Pack by pack. She started smiling again, she started wagging her tail, she started having personality again. Today, the two remain virtually inseparable. Louie pecks at Barley.
Barley chases Louie. We're back. They wrestle and relax together. And although Justin and Tori may never know exactly what shifted within Barley. Their sun camp.
as a theory. She wanted to be friends with Floyd. and hang out with him a lot, so she kinda stretched her joy and Help. and like fit in with him. Wait, what?
And that's how a duck helped a retriever. Stay golden. Actor Tim Curry has made a career of playing unforgettable villains and delightfully eccentric characters. This morning he's reflecting on more than five decades in the spotlight with our Ben Mankowitz. Dr.
Frankenferter loves to garden. He does. A stroke 13 years ago left Tim Curry partially paralyzed. Yeah. But it hasn't diminished his memorable laugh or the mystique about him.
In 50 years on the screen, he's played so many types. Can't be. Funny menacingly sinister. Yet his most inscrutable role is still Tim Curry. which is exactly how he wants it.
You're a bit of an enigma. I think it's important. I encourage it. Though Curry is out with a memoir, Vagabond, Some secrets he's keeping to himself. One of the keys is to not encourage an identity I think and I've tried to nurse that.
You've protected that. I have protected that. and continue to. Born a military brat in Hong Kong, Curry grew up moving from place to place. As a boy he worshipped his dad, a chaplain in the British Royal Navy.
Tell me about the last time you saw your father. He had a stroke. And As they were about to take him into the ambulance, he said, Look after your mother. You were ten years old? Yeah, I was ten.
After his father's death, there was no one to buffer the impact of his mother. Who'd be kind one minute? then cruel the next. I actually think now that she was probably bipolar. Because she could turn on a dime.
Acting offered Curry an escape. from his mother's moods and access. to so many different lives. Do you remember what Excited you about it? The freedom of being somebody else.
And I think that I was like everybody else, drawn to the idea of fame probably, although I Came to kind of rather despise it. His first nibble of fame came from his first paid gig in the 1968 London production of Hair. And that was a big deal. It was a big deal. Tram's best diatom!
Hair was nothing in comparison to what came next, the Rocky Horror Picture Show. First on stage. Then the movie. Oh yeah.
Well you got caught with a flat wheel. How about that? He joked that he got the part of Dr. Frankenfurter because of his legs. Such an outlet.
If you only knew all my It was a transformative performance. For Curry, and the audience. And what was specific about it to you that made it Uh He had a lot of power, Frank. He gave a lot of teenagers permission to be different and I'm Very happy that He did have that power. Rocky Horror earned Curry stardom.
it did not earn him praise or even respect. from his mother. Your mother lived well into your success. She did. Yeah.
although she didn't Make much of it. She never said, oh my God. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Well, she Said to me later that I thought your head was going to grow too big. She would have preferred me to. operate under the radar. You did not operate unsuccessful. Give a shit about the radar.
When Frank is committing his particularly most heinous act in the Rocky Horror Picture Show, is some of that directed at your mom, baby? is not directed at her, it's just channelling. Rocky Horror set up Curry to play some memorable screen villains. It told me. under a mountain of prosthetics and legend opposite Tom Cruise.
Aren't you gonna say hello? As Pennywise in it, Who's here? Seth. Uh You're supposed to be in jail. They let me out early.
And then Annie. as Carol Burnett's scheming and duplicitous brother. You loved working with her. I love touching bits. Mm-hmm.
Mr. McAllister. And don't forget the Hotel Concierge in Home Alone 2. This is an emergency! There's an insane guest with a gun!
Oh, you must be Mr. Green. Yes. STEAT! or the manipulative butler in Clue.
I'm merely a humble buttler. What exactly do you do? I buttle, sir. It's a great line. It's I enjoyed it.
But then came twenty twelve. and the moment that changed Tim Curry's life. Tell me what happened. It was So strange. I was actually having a massage.
Um The guy who was giving me a massage said I'm worried about you. I think we should Call a doctor. But you felt fine. I felt fine. I had no symptoms that I was aware of.
I wasn't in pain. When did you hear that it was a stroke? When I was in The hospital. You must have thought immediately of your father. I thought immediately of my dad.
Um So I was scared. And then you had surgery. I had brain surgery. You had invasive, serious brain surgery. Yeah, I did.
And I had a certain amount of rehabilitation. You had to learn how to speak again. I had to learn how to speak again. That was very weird. I hated not being able to speak.
You have paralysis on your left side, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. My face kind of went sideways. From reading the book and from talking to the people who care about you, there hasn't been a lot.
I'm sure there was some self-pity. But it doesn't sound like there was a lot. I don't think so. I hope not, because I don't admire self-pity much. Another legacy from my mother, I guess.
It's one that I'm thankful for. Why are you so important that we have to Pity you Right.
Now eighty, he's reached an age he didn't think he'd see in twenty twelve. 14 years later, an active Victim Curry is not remotely afraid of dying. Although exactly what he means remains fittingly A mystery. I don't fear death. I try to avoid it.
As I think we all do. But I suspect that In the end I will welcome it. What does that mean? I think it may be very comforting to go bye by. And I want to earn it.
Okay. Yeah. In the heyday of magazines, few writers were quite as influential as Gay Tales. He turned meticulous reporting and quiet observation into richly crafted stories that continue to inspire journalists to this day. Calafacene has the fine print.
I've always been a very slow writer. The kingdom and the power is agreed six years. The Kingdom and the Power, Gay Talese's 1969 book, recounted power plays and family feuds at The New York Times, where he rose from copyboy to reporter. Most journalists are restless voyeurs who see the warts on the world. The Imperfections in People and Places A work of nonfiction that read like a well-observed novel, it was his first bestseller.
The sane scene, that is much of life. the great portion of the planet unmarked by madness. does not lure them. like riots and raids, crumbling countries, and sinking ships. And I want the reader to have a picture in mind, as I have myself.
Gay Talese is a legend among writers and reporters. His career, both celebrated and at times controversial, spans some 70 years. Recently, the New York Public Library acquired his professional and personal archive. The first piece you ever wrote in the New York Times was about the New York Times. There used to be a sign, a headline sign.
millions of bulbs That formed five-foot-high letters. That sign revolved around the New York Times building, which was a fixture in Times Square during the early 20th century. Hardly anyone thought about who changed the light bulbs. There used to be a guy on the fourth floor of that building Would write in a machine that would put the bulbs around the building that made the headlines. James J.
Torpy got his name in the paper. Talese didn't. But he found his calling. I wanted to be the lamplighter. For those people who were in the dark.
That was my main ambition. I wanted to write about people. I make them known enough to have to have an obituary written about them, because they were known. He's the most curious person I've ever met. Robert Boynton is a professor at the Arthur L.
Carter Journalism Institute at New York University. He was on his way somewhere once and some guy was doing construction outside and he started interviewing him. By 1965, magazines were fat with advertising, hand populated by great storytellers. Esquire, under the editor Harold Hayes, was a beacon for writers like Norman Mailer, Tom Wolfe, and Gay Talese. I had a contract one year.
Hayes said you could write three pieces on your people that I have to write about Frank. Frank Sinatra has a cold, one of the most famous magazine stories ever, one of the most celebrated. What strikes me is you don't even seem all that impressed by Frank Sinatra. Samia had to be impressed with Sinatra. I'm not fawning on people.
I keep my reserves. But I was a respectable Sinatra. Sinatra with a cold is Picasso without paint. Ferrari without fuel. Only worse.
It affects not only his own psyche, but also seems to cause a kind of psychosomatic nasal drip within dozens of people who work for him. Drink with him? Love him? Depend on him. for their own welfare and stability.
Gay Talese was in trouble. Frank Sinatra wouldn't speak to him. To get himself out of trouble, Talese did something that's still talked about and still taught in journalism schools. It was the first time they were aware But I write around the story. That's what they call it now, a write around.
Talese says he spent thirty three days interviewing more than a hundred people who surrounded Sinatra. The result read more like a short story than a typical celebrity profile, and Talese became known as a leading practitioner of what was called new journalism. Tales really takes this sort of cinematic approach, which did not exist before in the very sort of flat corporate writing of, say, Time or Newsweek that really was dominant in that time. Did you know that this piece was resonating right away? Truthfully, no.
I didn't care about the Santa piece. I had written many good pieces. From Mr Bad News about Alden Whitman, the obituary writer of the New York Times his name was not in the paper, but he was writing with these famous dead people to profiles of aging sports figures like Joe DiMaggio, Floyd Patterson, and Joe Lewis. I think about your famous profile of Joe Lewis, the boxer, which starts with him not talking to you. Talking to his wife.
Yeah. Hi, sweetheart. Joe Lewis called to his wife, spotting her waiting for him at the Los Angeles airport. The art of hanging around is what I do. Joe, she said, Where's your tie?
Aw, sweetie, he said, shrugging. I stayed out all night in New York and didn't have time. All night? she cut in. I hope I win their confidence to allow me to accompany them.
Robert Poynton says he encourages his students to be the word he uses is Talesian. What does that adjective mean to you? That means going the extra mile and you're reporting, being creative about the kinds of things you're going to look into, taking extra time, showing up early, staying late, and dressing up. The appearances matter. I once wrote a whole book about the Verizzano bridge builders.
I went up with a scaffolding. wearing a hell or hat, but a suit and a tie. While researching his book about nudists and brothels, he sometimes chose to dress down. In 1972, I'm living in California. I'm living in a world of pornographers and nudists, fornicators.
And you weren't just chronicling that world. To some extent, you became part of that world. I became part of it. When I was with the mafia, I was hanging out with crooks and murderers and gangsters. To hang around with dudes, you can't be there with your press card on your...
You took the tie off. I couldn't hang around the press box and write that story. He has been married to Nan Talise, one of publishing's most admired editors, for 67 years. I had two children then and a wife that was in the public eye. She was embarrassed.
Sure. Likely, and she should have been embarrassed. And I was sort of embarrassed too, but I wanted the story. There's something about me and a lot of journalists. Yeah.
They care a lot about the story. Got to get the story. And they're willing to take the rap to do get the story. It turns out Nan has been the story all along. I have a long-standing relationship with a book called A Non-Fiction Marriage.
It's about my marriage. My marriage. to a woman of great achievements. We've heard about this for years. We're not done, we're not, our marriage is not done yet.
Day to lease won't be pushed. although, not long after we talked to him, he revealed that he is battling Parkinson's disease. He is now ninety-four. I should be at least as good as my last best work. Does that suggest that maybe?
Your best book is yet to come? We always hope that's true. For most of his career, he's worked in this office in the basement of his Brownstone on New York's Upper East Side. Here, there's no sunlight, no phone, no outside distractions. He's surrounded by photos, and every note he's ever taken on every story, meticulously saved memories of a job well done.
When I die, I want to have everything I wrote not embarrass me in my afterlife. I think I've done that. I would die with the satisfaction that I did my best at all times. I'm Seth Doan. Thanks for listening, and please join us once again next Sunday morning.
August 15th on Paramount Plus. Islam, I'm telling you now, you have a duty to defend that belt against the best and you're looking at them. If you want to dispel, come to the cage. Islam Mahashir. The best in the world.
Defense is Walter Wake Crown against Ian Mashado Giri. I'm coming for that belt. When you call your shot, you best not miss. I will make him never talk about me again. UFC 330, Saturday, August 15th.
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