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Carolina Journal Radio No. 706: Trump’s potential impact on Obamacare

Carolina Journal Radio / Donna Martinez and Mitch Kokai
The Truth Network Radio
November 28, 2016 12:00 am

Carolina Journal Radio No. 706: Trump’s potential impact on Obamacare

Carolina Journal Radio / Donna Martinez and Mitch Kokai

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November 28, 2016 12:00 am

The election of Donald Trump as U.S. president is likely to lead to major changes in the Affordable Care Act, otherwise known as Obamacare. Katherine Restrepo, the John Locke Foundation’s director of health care policy, assesses the potential impact of a Trump administration on the future of American health care policy. Free speech on N.C. public university campuses has had no more vocal advocate in recent years than Mike Adams, professor of criminology at the University of North Carolina at Wilmington. During a recent speech in Raleigh, Adams explained why his latest free-speech cause involves the orientation sessions first-year students face at campuses across the state. Adams wants to see First Amendment training replace “microaggression” training during those orientation meetings. Before voters headed to the polls on Election Day to select North Carolina’s next governor, Republican incumbent Pat McCrory announced plans for dealing with Hurricane Matthew recovery efforts. Those plans include a special legislative session to deal with recommendations from an appointed hurricane relief committee. Much of that work is expected to take place before the end of the calendar year and the next gubernatorial inauguration. The N.C. General Assembly continues to examine the future of occupational licensing in the state. The legislature’s Program Evaluation Division has recommended several changes to the licensing process. That includes a new commission to look into consolidation and termination of some licensing groups. Some lawmakers recently noted their interest in moving forward with a legislative review of commissions without the new bureaucracy of a licensing commission. You’ll hear highlights from their debate. North Carolina voters booted longtime State Superintendent of Public Instruction June Atkinson from office and replaced her with Winston-Salem/Forsyth County school board member Mark Johnson. That could lead to major changes in the way the state Department of Public Instruction operates. Terry Stoops, John Locke Foundation director of research and education studies, explores Johnson’s potential impact on state education policy.

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From Cherokee to current and the largest city in the state house into the schoolhouse Carolina Journal radio your weekly news magazine discussing North Carolina's most public policy events and issues welcome to Carolina Journal radio I'm Ashoka during the next hour, Donna Martinez and I will explore some major issues affecting our state. One of North Carolina's most vocal advocates of free speech on college campuses is a criminology professor at UNC Wilmington. He believes schools should add new First Amendment training to campus orientation. The Y state government is working on plans for recovery from hurricane Matthew learn details North Carolina lawmakers continue to look for ways to cut or consolidate the states occupational licenses Joe here why some members of the general assembly art that interested in setting up a new state commission to handle that work plus will profile North Carolina's newly elected state public school superintendent. Those topics are just ahead. First, Donna Martinez joins us with the Carolina Journal headline, President-elect Donald Trump has promised to repeal and replace the affordable care act, and he says his goal total is to lower costs and improve care by getting rid of what we commonly call Obama care.

So what exactly should the President-elect and his team do and how long might it take John Locke foundation's director of healthcare policy Catherine Restrepo joins me now with a look at the future of Obama care under a Trump administration Catherine welcome back thinking what you make of what the President-elect has said on the campaign trail and also in the in the first few days in his transition several others. There's lot of unpredictability going on. I mean during the campaign during Republican debate Donald Trump was talking about favoring single-payer systems and looking at sort of Medicare for all systems that are have been in place for a while in European countries, and then he has gone on to say this thought is a disaster owner counter playset and within the first couple of days after the election in interviews with the Wall Street Journal and 60 minutes on he sang well more than amend Obama care about repeal certain provisions. Maybe keep intact the pre-existing condition clause for insurance companies have to cover every body on regardless of whether their health what their health statuses along with allowing on plans to include dependent family plans to include dependence up to the age of 26 so that's really what's going on right now based on those comments.

If there are some who said well that sounds reasonable now will be part of a replacement plan. If you were to rain repeal Obama care.

Others have said he wait a second, he starting to head to what your view on how I think first of all, if we look at the political feasibility of repealing and replacing Obama care on. I think you know people are are staying on my gosh like this loss can be dismantled within the first 100 days of office, and that's simply not true. What it's really gonna take a couple of years I think and what that looks like is that in 2017 and there will be some type of a budget reconciliation bill and that what that really means is a partial repeal of Obama care. So, would repeal the Medicaid expansion will repeal the taxing and spending under the law. The Cadillac tax on the insurance subsidies and then so there be a transition phase for two years and during that two year transition phase, lawmakers would have to come together in Congress and devise new proposal for what that replacement plan will look like, and then that would hopefully transition into on 2019 will not let it take affect.

If they follow the outline that you've just discussed right, people would be losing their insurance is that happen with a well, I don't. I mean, I don't know.

I think there would be immune even in the transition phase. I think some people may have to switch policies, whether or not they like it, but overall I think the idea is to not make it as disruptive as it was under Obama care when the exchanges first opened up in 2014. If you were advising the Trump team on what they should be doing ends at what would you tell them are the guiding principles that they should be using his shares together. Yes, I think first of all, the exchange structure. There's exchanges. It's it's not a bad thing to have exchanges in an individual market actually for a free market reform completely free market. It would be ideal for everyone to not be on their employer-sponsored plan and by individual and by health insurance on their own. In this large nationwide individual market there be so much more competition that way and people would actually be consumers who are the patients in charge of their individual policies would actually be exposed to other healthcare plans, cost, and insurance companies would have no choice but to cater more towards their demands and they would have more of an incentive to make health insurance more affordable and that way you wouldn't need the subsidies that we have now so because there's just so much of the cost that is masked in healthcare and healthcare system. Now, even before the affordable care act passed in 2010 and causing a problem so it sounds as if you think that rather than most people. This is pretty traditional and have some sort of a a.m., a medical plan of perhaps dental insurance as well through their employer, but don't really know what anything costs because it's part of the benefit package that you would like to just have a separated completely yet have everybody go out and choose what they want to choose and know exactly what, yes, now that is a very idealistic radical changes. A lot of it will not be happy 1 to 100 really right but that is my opinion yeah so what about competition why is it that competition is something that needs to be infused into the system of change. While it if you think about just the healthcare system in general compared to other industries. It's just so backwards because there's so much innovation healthcare, but prices keep going up and that Congress back to what I was saying earlier that the consumer the patient really is in the true customer in healthcare insurance companies are because they're the ones buying products and services on behalf of their policyholders or hospitals are so until consumer can be more consumer control in the healthcare system.

I think that will that will only incentivize producers of healthcare services to be more competitive and more transparent with their prices and how much things cost. If it goes that way.

Would we be looking at a situation where it's one of those deals reset. I want one from column a one come from column BI like to have this covered maybe hospitalization, but I if I get a cold.

I want to just pay for it out of my pocket share I mean that's that's ultimately what I would hope the healthcare sector and health insurance industry gets to at some point I think the more consumer choice you have, whether you want to have things that are preventative that normally one would want to pay out-of-pocket for one have covered fine, but if they want to have more of a catastrophic policy on catastrophic policy where they want to pay for preventative services like annual comprehensive physicals out-of-pocket and have hospitalization services covered the nuts and know that it's up to the consumer decision and it should be for them to make those decisions themselves. And right now the federal government is making those decisions to the mandate that are required to be in any islands or health insurance is ages look at the preventative. The essential health benefits and preventative services that have to be covered.

I mean, on average, is like 55 different preventative services that insurance companies have to cover in all of these insurance plans. These policies that are being sold and it's so it it totally counter it so backwards from what insurance policy ought to look like you really want to flip this thing on its head. Yes, government is controlling things you want consumers to absolutely yes we for the President-elect talk about tell having people be able to buy policies across state lines.

Ones that all about share. So if you have a national company.

United healthcare and you want to purchase the policy or product that there selling another state compared to the state you're living in. You can do that. I mean, I know. Actually, some states are doing that is just it's not. It's really not prevalent across the nation. For example, right now in North Carolina there's only one or two providers that did that you can actually buy insurance from right right yes there is a Blue Cross solution in the individual market. So the Blue Cross and Blue Shield and on state now which is only participating about five or six counties in the research Triangle region. So for the most part policyholders who don't have insurance through her job have one choice for an insurance carrier to choose a policy from now we know that test several high-profile elected officials have put together potential replacement plans. One of them is our own Sen. Richard Burr put together a plan. I believe a couple of years ago as we wind down here.

Catherine is there any red that you're seeing throughout all of these proposals that you think will probably survive.

Yes, a lot of you know a lot of these provoked proposals do sort of keep intact kind of what Donald Trump is saying that he would like to keep intact is the pre-existing insurance clause on having insurance company and these Republicans are in favor of replacing Obama care, repealing it, but still keeping intact. Some of those popular provisions on now. I may disagree with how that would be implemented but that is a common thread and also tax credit Catherine restrict Restrepo is the director of healthcare policy for the John Locke foundation. Thank you think you say with as much more Carolina journal radio to come in just a moment, North Carolina is changing not just day-to-day but outward to our minute to minute and 2nd to 2nd, how can you keep up with the changes, especially the ones that affect you, your family, your home, your job, make the John Locke foundation and Carolina journal part of your social media diet on Facebook like the John Locke foundation like Carolina. Journal follow us on Twitter at John Locke in the sea and at Carolina journal news, insights and analysis you'll find nowhere else.

Thanks to the experts at the John Locke foundation and thanks to the first-class investigative reporting of Carolina journal. Don't wait for the morning newspaper. Don't wait for the evening news if it's happening now it's happening here the John Locke foundation and Carolina journal.

Have you covered with up to the second information like us on Facebook the John Locke foundation and Carolina journal follow us on Twitter at John Locke in the sea and at Carolina journal will go back Carolina journal radio why Michiko Gipe. Criminology professor Mike Adams of UNC Wilmington has been one of the most vocal proponents of recent years of free speech on college campuses during a recent speech in Raleigh. Adams unveiled his latest idea. I believe there still is a system and we need a more aggressive treatment.

We need to go in the next legislative session and we need to have comprehensive legislation and that comprehensive legislation really needs to go and try and wipe out speech codes altogether, but there's something else that needs to be addressed. If you take a look at the history of the number 23 years, and I know the first 20 years. The problem was campuses were dumping all these policies on the heads of the students and the students didn't know what was going on or didn't care what something has changed over the course of the last few years. What I've noticed is that increasingly the students are demanding that their first rights be taken away. They are actually beginning to demand safe spaces. This is what happens when that is quote around regeneration.

They book, normalized in the University is there always willing to accommodate a dangerous thing that was her course of the last few years has actually been micro-aggression training. The very first day on college campuses, a freshman at the age of 18, goes and warns how to imagine being offended by new things they never thought of before and were uttered by people who had no intention whatsoever. What I think we need to do a new comprehensive legislation is, I think we need to put an end micro-aggression training. I think we need to be demanding of our public university system that they no longer teach 18-year-old college students things that are true about the First Amendment and I think that the micro-aggression training needs to be replaced with First Amendment sensitivity training during orientation. Teaching students what is true about the First Amendment and what is true about First Amendment is that we don't have a constitutional right to be on. We have a constitutional right to be and to be offended with regularity because that is the price of live in a free society UNC Wilmington professor Mike Adams assessed the potential impact of Donald Trump's election as United States Pres. I think the one on the back without trying to write all that there is a one thing I think the happens were sold to help us out a lot change in personnel, the Department of Education that's extremely important to me. For example, I actually fueled title IX. I realized that something happened.

While this experience of interpretation of title IX.

It has everything to do with the bureaucrats were currently patient in the world and change things will be better in the eternal present I absolutely did that. Just as things were better when Bush was president before.

That's one thing that was better. I went shortly with the Bush ministration but matters with the patient certainly better than what ministration so I do see question says there already has been some good news when it comes to speech codes on college campuses in years and you ask people where what you think about free speech on college as we think about what you think about censorship. I think that there would be some people would call and those people would assume it was a problem with Northeastern. The fact of the matter is that if you go back about 15 years. There was a point where the vast majority even before the fire came up with the green light, red light system, it is clear that there was a vast majority of calls and red lights were certainly moving in the right direction. I think the last numbers that I've seen from the fire website is that the percentage of redlined schools in the United States. America is down about 45 but the answer is that it is very widespread is not just private schools, is not just by region, state schools and even community colleges that have suffered from the systematic correctness and that's the bad news is that it is very deeply entrenched in our educational system uses numbers show that at least moving in the right direction. That's UNC Wilmington criminology professor Mike Adams speaking recently, Raleigh explains why good diversity leaders are likely to support restrictions on speech.

The matter is useful for number of years to get tenure get promoted, hopefully without a seven-year-old.

Actually, college administrators, modifying their worldview. I mean, if you really believe there's no such thing as objective truth and you think that what we defined his truth scarecrow quotes around you simply of a powerful essentially where the powerful people in our society due to the following was in the things really don't really is an objective truth, then why would come along and create a policy that would empower people who don't have in the marketplace of ideas that unity, politics, and correctness comes from this idea rights don't belong to individuals. Adams returned to his theme of tackling First Amendment training incoming college students.

Most important is that we need to not just put out fires that are in front of us think we need to take the long view. And I think we need to have longer vision, and I think that involves being very proactive and actually going in and teaching students about the First Amendment on the first day they arrived on campus and from the most important issue right now is replacing Michael with actual First Amendment training and also this is something we need to be very careful about.

I am concerned about the mom in totality that exist on a college resume and it was disturbing that was actually in mass communications said basically you know this is our safe space and if you got a camera new quarter and exerciser is a professor saying this crazy idea but thinks the way to enforce the violence and she says we need strong armies multiple well, something that really tells you that we have a very deep cultural problem campus and it shows just how proactive that would gotta be involved in training, but I think there's a consequence of the kind of behavior because that kind of thing. I actually see students doing this all the time.

They do it in relation to their professors. They do it in relation to other students.

It might be a comment that's made during lecture. It might be a flyer on the bulletin board. Students will I think quite knowingly file false harassment and hostile environment charges against other members of the University community with the express intention of shutting down their ideas and you know something I think we need something like little anti-clans, all and intentionally go to mob rule actually trying to suppress the civil rights of others. There has to be a consequence of that listening to Mike Adams, Prof. of criminology UNC Wilmington one of North Carolina's most outspoken defenders of free speech on college campuses for Carolina journal radio at the John Locke foundation where leading the effort to clean up the mess left behind by big government liberals for decades. The powerful left in our state had piled on rule after rule, regulation after regulation never really caring about the people whose lives are caught in the nightmare of complying.

In other words, you their handiwork had made it tougher to get a job even increase the legal risk of operating a business. We say enough is enough that it's just not fair to you.

That's why reform minded lawmakers have turned to the Locke foundation for answers and acted to lighten your burden were proud that our intellectual firepower has improved lives.

You can count on the John Locke foundation to watch out for your interest. The special interests. We would be honored to have your help in this fight. John Locke.org and make a tax-deductible donation. Right now the John Locke foundation were fighting for you were fighting for freedom government plays a key role in your life affecting your paycheck the way you educate your kids the way you do business. How can you tell if government is doing a good job making the right choices. Spending tax dollars wisely. Carolina journal.com tackles those questions every day. The John Locke foundation publishes Carolina journal imprint each month and on the web each day@carolinajournal.com you'll find exclusive investigative reports on topics.

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Carolina journal radio imprint on the air and on the web. You can find the information you need@carolinajournal.com did you know you can now advance freedom and free markets just by shopping with Amazon it's true online shopping is now a great way to support the John Locke foundation just shot using the Amazon smile program and designate us the work foundation to receive a portion of your purchase amount that's right you shop and Amazon donates money to us. The John Locke foundation. So here's how it works.

Log on to smile.amazon.com Amazon smile.

It's the same Amazon you know same products same prices. Here's what's better. Amazon donates .5% of the price of your eligible purchases to the John Locke foundation to try it. Be sure to designate the Locke foundation is a nonprofit, you want to support. It's that easy. So now not only will you enjoy what you buy. You'll also support freedom. Don't forget log on to smile.amazon.com today by something nice and help defend freedom. Support the John Locke foundation. Welcome back to Carolina journal radio why Michiko got a week before voters decide the outcome of North Carolina's gubernatorial race, Republican incumbent Pat McCrory announced plans for dealing with the aftermath of hurricane Matthew regardless of the election work starts with the special appointed committee week of December for the committee will develop recommendations to address remaining unmet needs with state and private funds by early December.

We do expect Congress to appropriate appropriate supplement disaster assistance for North Carolina. Following that appropriation, I will submit a supplemental state disaster assistance package recommendations for general assembly and call for special session were asking for special session most likely in early December. Although if there is activity earlier by the federal government. I will move forward earlier late November with the state legislature, but most likely I do anticipate a special session date for early December based upon some of the federal information will have weeks before I expect to sign legislation from that special session that will fund recovery efforts modify the school calendar laws and make other changes the law as necessary to implement recovery as recommended by or or committee throughout this process the hurricane Matthew recovery committee will be instrumental in engaging the private sector fundraising for housing and small business recovery needs and more important. Developing long-term plans for sustainable recovery and resilient recovery recess hurricane recovery is going to involve some tough decisions.

I'm confident that we will recover and rebuild even stronger than what we had before.

Many of these areas impacted but we do have some very difficult choices to make when and how to rebuild and type of rebuilding that will occur. I am confident that will continue to see the best of North Carolina and Morgan asked for all of North Carolina to assist those areas impacted North Carolina has a rainy day fund with more than 1,000,000,000 1/2 dollars. Why call the Gen. assembly back to Raleigh for a special session. The reason I want to go ahead and do a special session us so we can go in and implement the plans to spend additional money and we know were going to need additional money and just because you can't wait until the monies in hand to begin the process of those expenditures. Based on my experience as a mariner governor leeway time and needed guarantees that money will be available. I want to wait till the end of January to get confirmation of those individuals that order plans are.

That's North Carolina Gov. Pat McCrory discussing work that will take place before the end of the year to address recovery from hurricane. Matthew will return with more Carolina journal radio in a moment.

If you love freedom we got great news to share with you now. You can find the latest news, views, and research from conservative groups all across the state. All in one place North Carolina conservative.com one-stop shopping for North Carolina St. movement North Carolina conservative.com. You'll find links to John Locke foundation blogs on the days news Carolina journal.com reporting and quick takes Carolina radio interviews TV interviews featuring CJ reporters and Locke foundation analyst plus opinion pieces and reports on higher education. All of that from the Pope Center for higher education policy commentary and polling data from the subtask Institute and news and views from the North Carolina family policy Council. That's right, all of that, all in one place North Carolina conservative.com that's North Carolina spelled out conservative.com North Carolina conservative.com. Log on today. Welcome back to Carolina journal radio why Michiko got North Carolina lawmakers continue to look for ways to eliminate or at least consolidate towards the issue work-related licenses is an idea of the states program evaluation division has endorsed evaluator Chuck Heffron recently reminded lawmakers about some of the problems linked to licensing. First there are the increased costs associated with mandatory entry requirements. Studies have shown that occupational licensing increases the cost for the associated goods and services. For example, a study conducted by the National Bureau of economic research concluded that establishment of a licensing requirement resulted in an increase of approximately 15% in hourly earnings.

Secondly, occupational licensing reduces and restricts the ability of individuals to obtain gainful employment in the occupation third occupational life can restrict public access to services. The tasks that a licensee can perform are statutorily defined. If these task descriptions are not regularly updated to reflect advances in technology and practitioner competencies public access to services will be restricted. Finally, occupational licensing limits the mobility of licensed professionals because licensing requirements often vary among states. Heffron and his colleagues have identified a number of state licensing boards that ought to be consolidated or at least reviewed. We also recommend the creation of a new occupational licensing commission to oversee that process to help ensure the occupational licensing commission has the necessary expertise to perform these functions while representing the public interest.

The commission should consist of both licensed individuals and members from the general public the general assembly may also wish to consider limp, eliminating the commission upon completion of its assigned duties. Lawmakers still have questions Republican representative Jeff Collins of Nash County wants to know how this process would affect the separate licenses he has now to sell insurance under either one of those scenarios that mean were doing away with licensing and even one of these or just doing away with the licensee when other words, if we do away with these two entities 11, 12, that I still have to have a license for help African artists set up shop and sell it with no credentials, I guess my I would have the same question about the last thing we looked at. Can I just call myself a recreational therapist and set up shop. If we don't have the board or or there still some requirements to call yourself wherever any of these things are, whether we have a licensing board or not beyond specific questions. Lawmakers wonder whether they really need a special occupational licensing commission Republican Sarah Stevens. The question is do we establish a commission in and get somebody to pay for it or is it something that we can do by breaking down these recommendations so far and saying we think these can be consolidated.

I might and ripped into Jordan keep saying, what, what's the criteria we want to look at is there hard and fast and and I don't think a hard and fast 1500 members is a good rule. I don't know about the money. I think that's something we have to ask each of these individual boards are you able to effectively run. Can you get your own lawn complaint process can be and what what can be done to help in the more people who have that technology already up and running. I think the more cost-effective and easier it will be for people to get so I agree we we probably want to talk about what we have accomplished and I think we all want to eliminate or consolidate the boards that we can Republican representative Jonathan Jordan also questions the need to set up a new state commission on the was saying we need more information before we can decide on these these things but I'm also averse to setting up a whole new bureaucracy a whole new commission that when we have in our sales taken a shy shot at.

I think that we could take a shot at it and come up with some good things if we find out that we can't we get bogged down or whatever. We can always consider that as a is a possibility but I would like to suggest we go with these objectives pick what we all think would be the appropriate objectives of occupational regulation, and then let's start looking at the specific commissions and boards that PD is started with. We could always add to that or subtract that based on the other. The other two methodologies that we been given, but at least they'll be of start we can start asking her questions about federal regulations and can you prove this board needs to make presentation that the protecting the public from harm that the regulated individuals confident that it considers the impact of state economic competitiveness so they can help us respond with the details of their situations as to whether they should or should not be consolidated, eliminated, certified whatever the recommendation may be Sen. Randy Wells hopes North Carolina could do for occupational licensing what it already has done for tax policy.

Some of the last four years we sing the considerable move in tax policy and or the like. There philosophy and their their methodology is one thing but the tax foundation in four years has moved from his memory serves 44th in the country to 11 that is we've gone from being noncompetitive to competitive. I think we might find ourselves in a similar situation.

Licensing we got more licensees, more licensing boards than the states were competing with. So adding a financial burden to their citizens. With all so I think one of the criteria I would look like to look at. Just as we did in tax reform is how do we get competitive with the southeastern states with the country as a whole had would limit our license sure I licensing boards in such a way by moving about consolidation by moving toward certification where some of these boards have robust national certifications and, in fact, virtually every licensee in some cases, every licensee also has certification so we got a double layer there that could be unnecessary. That's what I like to move toward and in the case of the alarms it keeps coming up.

Those can be license without a licensing board that is effectively turning it into what would be considered a registration in a competitive sense. So there are a number like the tax foundation.

There are a number of national groups that are looking at us in evaluating this state on a regular basis and were not looking very good. Wells even offered some specifics.

I would suggest that North Carolina does not extend licensure into areas where at least 50% of the states are licensing and at least two of the surrounding air, touching for sites or that is without us that only be two states that there would be a My suggestion other lawmakers didn't address that suggestion but they were ready to adopt some general objectives to guide future debate about licensing representative Jonathan Jordan outlined those objectives.

Why do we even get into this issue. Welcome to ensure the public is protected from harm's health and welfare and safety of citizens provide assurances of the regulated individual is competent that you know what they're doing have some kind of credit the credentials of some sort. Educators of the provide a means to enforce the standards so there's got to be you complaints in a way to deal with that and not having a license as a very good way to deal with with with potential bad actors and then the sooner Wells made a very good point that at that high level were also looking at the impact of all of this on our state economic you been listening to highlights from a recent debate about the future of occupational licensing in North Carolina, will return with North Carolina journal radio and about at the John Locke foundation where leading the effort to clean up the mess left behind by big government liberals for decades. The powerful left in our state had piled on rule after rule, regulation after regulation never really caring about the people whose lives are caught in the nightmare of complying.

In other words, you their handiwork had made it tougher to get a job even increase the legal risk of operating a business. We say enough is enough that it's just not fair to you. That's why reform minded lawmakers have turned to the Locke foundation for answers and acted to lighten your burden were proud that our intellectual firepower has improved lives. You can count on the John Locke foundation to watch out for your interests.

The special interests. We would be honored to have your help in this fight. John Locke.org and make a tax-deductible donation. Right now the John Locke foundation were fighting for you were fighting for freedom, welcome back to Carolina journal radio and Donna Martinez come January, the state agency charged with running K-12 education in North Carolina have a new leader, Mark Johnson of Republican defeated multi-term incumbent June Atkinson to be state superintendent of public instruction Johnson inherence eight massive responsibility and a system that increasingly faces competition from a surging school choice movement joined me to talk about the new leadership is Dr. Terry stoops. He is director of research and education studies at the John Locke foundation. Welcome back. Thank you. Tell us about Mark Johnson. Well, he's an attorney.

At least he will be until he starts the superintendent of public instruction, but he is an attorney for soft work. Company needs a sitting member of the Forsyth County Board of Education is a former teacher in what Charlotte's very difficult place to teach, admittedly, but to you talk for teach for America for two years before he went to law school, so we have classroom experience experience on the district level and that I think he's gonna bring a very good skill set to the position he might need all of that experience for all the things that he is going to be taking on what you think is his biggest challenge. He takes the oath well I think one of his challenges is the department of public instruction itself.

How is he going to manage it. Is he going to give school districts more flexibility and less oversight. So how exactly is he going to run the department because that's one of his big responsibilities and several hot several hundred people. They do lots of different things.

Everything from IT to testing so that will be one of his biggest challenges is reshaping the department of public instruction.

He also has to think about how to use the soapbox of the superintendent of public instruction has a soapbox and he's got a forum by which he can advance certain views, policy recommendations, etc. he has to figure out am I going to use the soapbox to advance things that the state Board of Education supports, or is it going to be more trying to make sure that the general assembly in the state Board of Education get along. Is there anything that really stands out to you about his philosophy or his views based on what you have read about him or heard him say during his time of service, particularly on school board wheeze and advocate for school choice and one thing to note about Mark is he's young, he's a millennial refund of the lot of millennial's really like the idea of school choice, they like choice and everything so this is going to bring interesting dynamics to the state education system with someone that's very young, with a very different philosophy and outlook on life is going to be looking at ways to make our school systems less 19th-century and more 21st-century that is so interesting that she would say that because his job is with the traditional public school system, and yet he is an advocate of choice and choices really competition for the traditional classroom.

So how does he balance that well. I think he sees those two different sectors as potentially working together. I mean, the idea of charter schools. For example, was that they would be laboratories to experiment with different ways of doing things and that that would in turn translate into changes in the traditional system. So I think he sees that there can be harmony between those two systems. In particular he was. With teach for America. I think he sees that alternative certification for teachers is also something that charter schools have fewer requirements for teachers. I think he would like to see that sort of thing in the district so there are things that I think especially when you look at the charter sector that he's going to look at taking some of those reforms and incorporating them into his work with the traditional public schools and some folks have really criticized charter schools, which by the way our public schools, but they criticize the charter model because they say they were supposed to be innovative but will that there really haven't been those innovations really taken into the traditional classroom.

That's an important point because there are plenty of innovations out there and there are plenty charter school just doing outstanding work, especially with low income students.

None of those reforms are making their way into the traditional system. Now there are some regulatory barriers to some of the reforms that charter schools have, to offer, but for the most part, there is very little acceptance of charter school reforms among the traditional public school population fair to say that he would also be an advocate for unleashing some of the regulatory range that are on some of those innovative models. Absolutely that's gonna require the general assembly to pass laws that allow some of that flexibility. The other aspect of this is a Donald Trump presidency right before Trump was elected the Department of Education was finalizing regulations for the every student succeeds act Essa which is the new federal education plan with Donald Trump in the White House.

It's possible that Beckett scraps were that the Republicans decide to revise it significantly to decrease the number of regulations that Essa is providing for states and insubstantial, especially when it comes to testing and reporting.

I would love to see Donald Trump take on Essa and find a way to make it less onerous on states. I don't know if that's going to happen is probably not going to be one of his major priorities.

But this is going to influence what we can do as a states once we figure out. So what kind of flexibility can be had using our own general statutes, you're describing a completely new dynamic in your smiling as a teller listener or talking you're smiling here, you think that there's some good things that could be happening here. Yes, I actually really do you know we have looked at the no Child left behind and serve several other different types of programs the federal government is trying to force upon states and they haven't been all that successful. They've done some good things no child left behind's got every state to look at ways of reporting of required states report for students based on their socioeconomic status based on race and I think that was very good but for the most part, states are laboratories of innovation should be allowed to be that the federal government should have less of a role in what we do in education.

North Carolina and I think than the election of Donald Trump who had not direction now, and Mark Johnson does become the superintendent of public instruction in January. He also will face competition from people who are not enrolling their kids in the traditional public system that he will be overseeing that growth in homeschools, growth in private schools.

How do you think he will respond to that. Will he encourage people to come back to a traditional system or just choose what they want, they have to have a system to come back to that is comparable in quality and provides the types of things that the private or homeschool provides Weatherby individualized instruction etc. etc. so I think you can see his challenge as making the traditional system so good that parents are going to want to choose it over homeschools her private schools were far from there.

I think that if he's going to approach that that's the correct way to approach it.

You want to improve the quality of the product not just expect the parents are going to take up that product because it's the biggest one or that's the one that they're expected to go to. I think though probably be one of his biggest challenges.

While his name is Mark Johnson and he will be the new head of the state department of education. What's the official state agency name, armor, Republicans really know and he will be the superintendent of that state agency come January. A big change in leadership we been talking with Dr. Terry stoops. He is the director of research and education studies at the John Locke foundation.

You can read all of his work@johnlocke.org and Carolina Journal.com Terry thinking thank you and that's all the time we have for the show this week on behalf of Mitch Toback and Donna Martinez join us again next week for another edition of Carolina Journal radio Carolina Journal radio is a program of the John Locke learn more about the John Locke foundation donations that support programs like Carolina Journal radio sending email to development John.call 66J 11 166554636 Carolina Journal radio airline is running this program. Nearly 4 other nation airline sponsored radio


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