After Hours with Amy Lawrence PODCAST: Hour 1

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This is After Hours with Amy Lawrence. I never thought I'd be asking this question on a Wednesday night. The final Wednesday in December, mind you. Didn't think this would be a question for this time of the year for this week in the football season. Especially not with the Denver Broncos still at least clinging to hopes for the playoffs. Even if a postseason berth is unlikely for Denver, the Broncos are still alive for a playoff spot.

And yet the question on this night, at least from my brain, is already thinking ahead about 2024. It seems pretty clear the Broncos plan to move on from Russell Wilson. And as much as Sean Payton will tell us this is about winning. As much as Sean Payton will tell us this is about sparking the offense. As much as Sean Payton will tell us that this is what's best for the team. There is maybe some truth to that, but it's obvious this is a financial move meant to preserve whatever few million dollars the Broncos can in what is an albatross of a contract that limits their flexibility moving forward. It seems pretty clear to me that if there is any way for the Broncos to get rid of Russell Wilson, they're going to.

I think back to, gosh, not even two years ago, we're talking about last summer. So summer of 2022 going into the first season of Russell Wilson as a Bronco. Brand new owners, the Walton Penner family, who are the heirs to Walmart. That's where they've made the money.

The family's made the money. And before Wilson ever takes a snap that counts for the Broncos, they give him an enormous contract extension. Now, even at the time, I wasn't on board with Russ as the savior that so many believed he was in Denver.

I was leery for a couple of reasons. Number one, there had to be. Something else going on, there had to be a reason, at least one, if not more, that Pete Carroll, who found Russell Wilson in the first place a decade ago and started him as a rookie in Seattle. The Pete Carroll, who had won a Super Bowl with Russ, had gone to another Super Bowl with him as the quarterback only to allow him to throw on the half yard line with the game on the line. But I digress that Pete Carroll, who had in large part, turn Russell Wilson into a star. That Pete Carroll didn't want him anymore. That Pete Carroll, along with John Schneider, the general manager in Seattle, wanted to move on from Russ.

There had to be a reason. So even before the Broncos gave him the huge contract extension, I wasn't completely 100% sold. Now, I remember last training camp before this summer, right? So again, going back to 2022, when they traded for Russell Wilson and the build up from the draft, so you may remember the timing of it, the Broncos desperately wanted Aaron Rodgers. The Packers and Rodgers decided that they would stick together for one more season. And so right away, once they got that news from Rodgers and his camp and the Packers, the Broncos pivoted.

Pivot! The Broncos pivoted to Russ. That was the backup plan. They traded away everything but the kitchen sink. Although honestly, I think they kind of traded the kitchen sink too. They threw everything they had at the Seahawks to get Russ. And the Seahawks played him like a fiddle.

Again, there had to be reasons why Seattle was willing to move on from Russ. And don't give me some line about how he was hard to deal with. He was hard to manage.

He had his own office. He's married to a superstar, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know what happens when a quarterback or a player is eccentric and popular and has some irrational demands, but he wins? Or they believe they can win with him?

Nothing. The team gives in to all of those demands. I can give you a laundry list of athletes around professional sports who are tough to deal with. For a variety of reasons. Do you want to know why the Golden State Warriors don't cut ties with Draymond Green? Because he makes the team much better. Because he's the centerpiece of that championship roster.

You can talk about the Splash Brothers and certainly they provide the sizzle and the dazzle. Draymond Green is the player around whom their system is built. And yeah, he's a pain in the ass a lot of the times, but he's worth it to the Warriors. Superstar, quarterback, superstar, anythings can ask for the sun, the moon, and the stars. And if the team believes they can win with that athlete, well, they'll give it to him. I have no idea whether or not the reports are true about Russell Wilson and his eccentricities needing an office, needing this, wanting that. For years, Tom Brady had his own personal trainer with the New England Patriots. And even though Bill Belichick was not that kind of guy and didn't want outsiders around the team, he allowed it. Because Brady was, is, was a winner on the football field. He'll be a winner at whatever he does. It doesn't matter what athletes ask for.

Crazy requests. As long as they're winning, and it's not criminal, maybe in some cases it is criminal, as long as they're winning, a team will go to extraordinary lengths to keep a superstar athlete happy. So none of those things are the reasons why Russ was allowed to leave Seattle. If the Seahawks thought that he could win another year, year after that, if they thought he was worthy of a huge contract extension, they would have given it to him.

But they didn't. They also knew the Broncos were desperate. You know who makes a great trade partner? Desperate teams. Think about the Carolina Panthers, desperate to jump up to number one in this past draft. And so they give up all kinds of capital to the Chicago Bears to be able to leapfrog a few teams and get to that number one spot and use it on Bryce Young. Yeah, the Seahawks played the Broncos like a fiddle because they knew Denver was desperate. Desperate to find a quarterback after years of revolving doors, post Peyton Manning, post Super Bowl 50. And with all of that, they go and they give up draft capital and really they give up whatever the Seahawks wanted to bring in Russ because they felt like he was their next best option. He was Plan B.

Or maybe he was Plan A2, right? In the minds of the Broncos. Aaron Rodgers, Plan A1. Russell Wilson, Plan A2. So they get Russ and the Broncos franchise celebrates.

They might as well throw in a victory parade before they ever won a game. The energy, the enthusiasm. It's all we heard about during the summer. How practices had changed. How training camp was different.

It was supercharged. A fresh perspective. A new lease on life as a Bronco. That's it.

This is the piece, the missing piece. Now we're going to get back to the playoffs. Forget those seasons of losing records.

Forget this streak of utility. We finally found the quarterback to succeed Peyton Manning as the franchise guy here in Denver. The Seahawks knew that's what they were looking for.

And I have no doubt that when the deal was finally done. Pete Carroll, John Schneider, others were dancing a jig because they fleece to the Broncos. They knew Russ was not the same guy.

And it became apparent very quickly. Do you guys remember how the 22 season kicked off? Russ in Seattle as a member of the Broncos. Seahawks win that game with Gino Smith as their quarterback. But it was it was mostly about the defense that game. Those offensive struggles for the Broncos became a reality all of last season. But the new owners of the Broncos who just spent billions and billions and billions of dollars to buy the team. Well, they didn't wait to see if Russ would fit to see if he and Nathaniel Hackett were on the same page or.

To see whether or not Russ still had the skill set to be the franchise savior. Now they went ahead and tacked on this extraordinary extension with all kinds of stipulations and guarantees built in. That hog ties the Broncos for years.

And now. A year later, even with that five game winning streak, even with the Broncos getting above 500 briefly. And still being alive for the playoffs, which is better than what it's been the last few years. Let's be fair, even with all of that, with the defense that has turned the corner under Sean Payton, with some young dynamic receivers. With some highlight, real run plays, though not still as steady as they'd like it to be. With a Russell Wilson who's in the top, what is it, six, seven in the NFL and touchdown passes.

So much better than he was a year before reality has set in. It's not good enough. The team is still not good enough to win in the AFC West. Not with the Chiefs. And this is a down year for the Chiefs. Just wait until Travis Kelsey tells you. They wanted to cut bait a month ago, more than a month ago, according to what I consider an explosive report by Jordan Schultz, a bleacher report. And we'll get to that coming up.

It's after hours with Amy Lawrence on CBS Sports Radio. From moving central, I got to be honest, I'm not exactly sure how it sounds tonight in the after hours super secret home base, because the room is now mostly empty. For the first time in my career, I'm doing a show on a card table.

It's true. The desk is gone. The bookshelf is gone.

The computer monitors are gone. It's me, my laptop, the piece of equipment that allows us to do the show remotely and some pillows stacked up against the wall in front of me so that the sound does not bounce back. And I don't sound like I'm in a bathroom. I'm not in a bathroom, but I am doing my show on a card table. I've got some coffee though, which means I'm raring to go.

Coffee, a banana, some trail mix, giddy up. I would love to connect with you on Twitter, A Law Radio. I've got mine open, already have our show question out there. On our Facebook page too, after hours with Amy Lawrence. Here's the question. I started the show this way and I will continue to ask you this question because I feel like we need to advance.

The topic, the storyline, the subject matter. To me, this is exactly like what the Raiders pulled last year with Derek Carr. Now, difference is Derek Carr didn't have this fat contract extension. But they were worried, the Raiders, about him getting hurt before they could trade him. Ultimately, they couldn't trade him because the rest of the NFL saw right through their sham. But the Broncos are doing something very similar. And what's crazy is that Jared Stidham, both times, ends up as the guy who steps into the starting lineup for the Raiders last year and for the Broncos come week 17 this season. Isn't that crazy?

From the category of you can't make this stuff up. Jared Stidham, former Patriots quarterback. From the Raiders to the Broncos, two high profile benchings in the final two weeks of the regular season, putting him in the starting lineup. Sometimes the NFL is beyond reality TV.

It is the best reality show on TV. And so on either Twitter or Facebook, what I'm asking you tonight is where would Russell Wilson be an upgrade at QB in the NFL right now? Because it appears pretty clear that the Broncos are cutting ties with him. And that they're looking for someone, anyone out there. They're willing to cut bait now.

Oh, it's a fishing analogy. My husband will be so happy. They're willing to move on, regardless of what it costs him. The problem is, and we'll get to this, there's so many facets of this because it's the devil you know or the devil you don't know. Right now, they're confident that Russell Wilson is not the guy for them moving forward. But what do you do next? Constant change equals constant losing in sports, and the Broncos are now settling uncomfortably into that cycle that has plagued the Panthers.

For what? All of the years under David Tepper, going back to when he hired Matt Ruhl. They're still making changes at quarterback and head coach. The Colts, though, I like what I've seen from them this season. They're maybe coming out of it. The Browns have been stuck in that cycle for years, though.

Look at them. Despite four different quarterbacks this season, they've got stability elsewhere, and they've stuck with Kevin Stefanski. I think the Arizona Cardinals fall into that mix right now. I know Kyler Murray was injured as opposed to them moving on, but they've changed head coaches multiple times. They're stuck. Constant change equals constant losing in sports, and the Broncos are right now stuck in that hamster wheel. So if they move on, they've got to find another quarterback. The problem is they don't have a lot of money to pay him.

So what are you going back to? Kind of a stopgap measure. So, say, Jared Stidham in 2024 hoping to find a guy in the draft. I mean, if you're a Broncos fan, which I've been a Broncos fan since age 13, what this feels like to me is admitting they were wrong about Russ. Swallowing their pride and all the money it cost them because they made such a poor decision.

And now putting themselves in a place where are they willing to give up on 24 if that's what it cost them? That's a tough place to be. So we'll start with this.

Where is Russell Wilson an upgrade at quarterback in the NFL right now? Already seeing a ton of your responses on both Twitter and Facebook. Thank you. If you want to call the phone numbers 855-212-4CBS.

That's 855-212-4227. I don't know if we'll get Jordan Portland to call back again. Our seventh grader who called last night is a big Seahawks fan. I can imagine there are a bunch of Seahawks out there. Seahawks fans out there who are not let's let's not say they're exulting. But once again feel very validated in the decision that Pete Carroll and John Schneider made to part ways with Russ. They knew they knew something the rest of the league maybe was clued into but didn't know for sure. And as I say they were dancing a jig when they found the Broncos to take Russell Wilson off their hands. It's not all Russ's fault. Let's be fair.

It isn't. Sean Payton will explain why the Broncos made this move now as if we don't already know but thank you coach. It's after hours with Amy Lawrence one last show from the super secret home base before we start the and by we.

I mean me the blended family two vehicles one trailer a partridge in a pear tree. But this time tomorrow night let's hope we are in Hattiesburg Mississippi taking our first rest up. Thanks so much for hanging out with us this week between Christmas and New Year's has been fun to hear from so many of you. It's after hours on CBS Sports Radio.

In part you'll get free delivery on your first three orders and delivery in as fast as one hour offer valid for a limited time $10 minimum per order additional term supply. The most unique NBA podcast is out on Odyssey heat check with Trista Crick NBA fans listen up. Trista Crick host of the heat check podcast and if you love this league the storylines and want a funny digestible way to get all the news from around the association and someone to break down what's really going on straight up no chaser and make you laugh at the same time. Follow the heat check on the free Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcast. We're desperately trying to win and sure in our in our game today their economics and all those other things but the number one push behind this and and it's a decision I'm making is to get a spark offensively.

You're listening to after hours with Amy Lawrence call Amy at 855-212-4CBS. Denver Broncos head coach Sean Payton I do believe that he desperately wants to win. I absolutely believe he is telling the truth in that respect. What I don't believe is that this move made at quarterback by the Broncos to bench Russell Wilson with two weeks left in the regular season is about winning solely. Could they potentially get a spark at quarterback with Jared Sittem?

Absolutely. Is Jared the better QB? Well, maybe at this point he's got a skill set that can allow him to get out there and throw a couple of touchdown passes. We've seen some crazy stuff happening in the NFL this season and Jared's a veteran, right? I mean Tyrod Taylor starting for the Giants.

That's another storyline going into week 17. We've got Gardner Minshew leading the Colts and they're on the cusp of a playoff spot. The Houston Texans are relying on a couple of different veterans now with CJ Stroud still out at least through last week. I mean crazier things have happened at quarterback for heaven sakes Joe Flacco rides again for the Browns. Mason Rudolph could be starting again for the Steelers this weekend. It's crazy to talk about all these different things and the ways that the quarterback position looks so different now than it did at the beginning of the year. But that is the NFL life comes at you fast. Derek Carr is now starting for the new the New Orleans Saints, but this same thing happened last year in Vegas before he was unceremoniously dumped by the Raiders. They tried to trade and they couldn't it seems to me eerily similar in that same division where the Broncos are willing to cut ties and because of that they don't want rust to get injured. And so yeah, maybe there's a spark with Jared Stidham.

Maybe there is but this is also about the future. It's after hours with Amy Lawrence on CBS Sports Radio. Please find me on Twitter a law radio asking you where in the NFL is Russell Wilson and upgrade right now. Where would he be an upgraded QB in the NFL right now our Facebook page our Twitter account blown up.

You can also find the show account on Twitter after hours CBS. We're going to get to some of your responses plus our phone number 8 5 5 2 1 2 4 2 2 7 that's 8 5 5 2 1 2 4 CBS a little more from Sean Payton. He obviously had to share this news or break the news to Russell Wilson on Wednesday. I spent time with Russ this morning and he's been a pro and obviously disappointed but you know all the work that goes into doing what he does or doing what they do at that position. It's difficult.

He is so good at speaking succinctly speaking football words that make us contemplate until you realize he tells you a whole lot of nothing. Okay, so let's try a different approach. What was rust not doing well coach Payton that has led to this football decision.

Rather than get into the specifics because I think that would be unfair today. It's more about what we're we weren't doing effectively enough offensively and you know when we were getting two or three turnovers. It's one thing but ultimately our job is to get the ball in the end zone and we've got to be more efficient doing that all of us. Alright, so a couple of numbers that jump off the page if you follow the Broncos or if you follow the NFL. It's a strange disparity because Russ's numbers are actually pretty impressive as an individual top 10 in the league in both TD passes and passer rating. But the Broncos struggle royally on third down and in the red zone. They're not great in first and goal second goal so right up close either. And as much as Russ has the touchdown passes that would if you all you did is look at the number of TVs he's thrown as much as it's a relatively impressive number at 26.

I'm real excited. He's got only one passing game over 300 yards. Is that in and of itself an indicator that the offense still isn't there?

No. They want to be a run first team. But queries crazy enough that 300 passing yard game came in that shellacking by the Dolphins in the first month of the season.

Remember when they lost by 50 the Dolphins put up 70 that was against Denver. That's not all Russ that was on the defense. As Sean Payton alludes to or mentions the defense in that reaction in his answer. He says hey it's one thing to have an anemic offense if your defense is producing takeaways because then a lot of times you have short fields.

You don't have to go nearly as far. And of course you're keeping the ball away from your opponent. He's thrown fewer interceptions. He's been more efficient. We've seen flashes of the Russ from the first decade in the NFL.

And again this is not all about him. But Sean Payton's not been thrilled with the offense. When the Broncos lost to the Lions.

Sean and Russ were having some words on the sidelines mostly Sean. With much higher expectations as you can imagine a Super Bowl winning head coach a guy who worked with Drew Brees for years. This kind of mediocre offense just getting by just doing enough to win. Oh I mean you can talk about the same thing with the Pittsburgh Steelers right. They're a winning team. They have a chance to make the playoffs but their offense is at times abysmal. And it's not quite that bad with Russell Wilson. But Payton looking for a spark. And it's I don't want to say it's easy.

That's actually the wrong word. It gives you the wrong impression. But he goes on to talk about how you really can't change all five offensive linemen. We can't get an entirely new receiving core.

So this is the quarterback change that we can make. But again this is not just about today. It's also about tomorrow. And that question was posed to Sean Payton as well.

He may need to play. You know this weekend next weekend. But and then regards to the future that we haven't had a sit down and I'm sure we will.

Greg and I and George we speak frequently. But this is about now. This is about trying to get our eighth win and we'll go from there. So Jared Stidham it is. Seriously how crazy is that. Last year he was stepping in for Derek Carr with the Raiders. Now he's stepping in for the Broncos. And Russell Wilson who's been banished with two games left in the regular season.

Even though I still believe he gives them a better chance to win than Stidham. Again turnovers are down for Russ and the Broncos this year. He still has the ability to throw the deep ball we've seen that.

He's obviously got a better rapport with the receivers because he's the guy who takes first team reps. That's just logic. But they're worried that he'll get hurt. With all the quarterbacks dropping like flies this year in the NFL.

That's a very real concern. Why does it matter. Well I'll explain it next. But we're asking you. Where would Russell Wilson be an upgraded quarterback in the NFL right now. We're obsessed with quarterbacks in the United States of America.

And you are obsessed with answering this question. At least currently. So on Twitter.

ALawRadio on our Facebook page too. I just want to say one more time thank you again for all of your kind words this week. It's been a pretty crazy couple of days. But supposed to take off on the journey back to New Jersey coming up sometime on Thursday. There's still a lot to pack.

Boy we spent eight hours though. I don't know if you agree with this. At some point we can talk about it. But I've always heard that the best friends in life are the ones who help you move.

Because it's not fun. And I know sometimes it's not possible. But my husband has a great friend who's been here the last two days to help him out. And my mom and her husband have been here for hours.

I think my mom and I have packed more boxes than anybody else in the house. Anyway we've had three dogs. We've had five people. We've had some great food from Texas Roadhouse tonight. We were famished and still a long way to go. But excited to get this move underway.

So find me on Twitter or Facebook. Where would Russell Wilson be an upgrade at QB in the NFL right now. If the Broncos in fact can find a trade partner. It's pretty clear they want to move on. I can just assure you one thing.

Honestly and I've said this to Greg and George a number of times. I'm just interested in winning. And it doesn't matter how.

When you do this for this long of a period of time. It's all you're interested in. Because there's nothing like it. And then the other side of it. There's nothing like that either. You're listening to After Hours with Amy Lawrence.

Call Amy at 855-212-4CBS. Two things can be true. Sean Payton can be very very sincere.

When it comes to his desire to win. Especially after the Broncos seemingly were on the right track with their defense. Primarily having turned a corner. It appeared as though the Broncos could be one of the upstart and surprising stories of the league. They beat the Packers. They topped the Chiefs. They won on the road in Buffalo. And then beat the Vikings and the Browns. Handily against Cleveland. Five wins in a row though four of them came in Denver. They lost on the road in Houston. Then they beat the Chargers. So they won six of seven. Five in a row. And they were firmly in the AFC wildcard race.

Had they continued. Maybe they'd even be right on the heels of the Chiefs in the AFC West. But they got blasted by the Lions in week 15. That was game that was in Detroit. And all of a sudden that defense looked inept. Jared Goff threw five touchdown passes. And the defense gave up 40 something points. Then they lose to the Patriots.

And that one takes place in Denver. So now with two games left in the AFC West. I understand Sean Payton is desperate to win. And the offense has not looked like what he wants.

There have been flashes but not consistent. And if you were listening to Peter Schwartz with the update. He used that Sean Payton cut where coach is talking about. Hey we can't change all five offensive linemen. We can't get an all new receiving group. This is the way that he's choosing to spark the offense.

But it doesn't also mean that this is a move about the future. I have no doubt that the owners of the Broncos. The new owners of the Broncos. And he mentions Greg who's one of the owners.

Greg Penner who married into the Walton family. No doubt they have buyer's remorse. No doubt they have buyer's remorse. Maybe caught up in the wave of enthusiasm and excitement. Energy feeling like they finally had the right fit at quarterback. It was late last summer. They gave Russell Wilson the massive contract extension.

That now is an albatross around the neck of the franchise. And here is the report. That first was presented by Jordan Schultz. A bleacher report. But has now been confirmed by those around the Broncos. Including our friend Troy Rank.

Who's with channel 4 in Denver and has been on the show many times. But this comes from Jordan Schultz initially. The Broncos actually threatened to bench Russell Wilson before Halloween. Oh my gosh it's the second night in a row that I'm giving you some historical perspective. That takes us back to before Halloween. So the Detroit Pistons who by the way will be on the court Thursday evening in Boston. Perfect. Try to end your losing skit against the best team in the NBA.

Great. They haven't won since before Halloween. Now we've got this report from Jordan Schultz. A bleacher report that the Broncos actually approached Russell Wilson before Halloween.

So late October. This is right after they beat the Chiefs. They told Russ they were planning to make him inactive for the rest of the season if he did not adjust his contract. One particular part of his contract. He's got an injury guarantee that kicks in if he cannot pass a physical at the end of the season. It guarantees Russell Wilson an extra 37 million dollars. So if he cannot pass a physical meaning he gets hurt after this regular season. These injury guarantees in his contract will pay him an extra 37 million dollars if somehow he got hurt. And regardless of whether or not he passes a physical once we get into March that money is guaranteed no matter what. And so the way the contract was structured the Broncos are trying to wiggle their way out from under it.

Trying to save themselves some money any way that they can. Now according to Jordan Schultz Russ because he threw three touchdowns in that win over the Chiefs. He was starting to feel good felt like he and Sean Payton had a connection. The offense was headed in the right direction after what was a hideous first year with Denver.

According to the report the Broncos coming to him at that point and threatening to bench him quote shocked him and the two sides got into a major dispute about what to do next. Now the Broncos end up sticking with Russ right because they've got these wins under the lights national TV over the Bills and Vikings then they beat the Browns one of the league's best defenses. Russ is playing so much better than he was a year ago over 3,000 yards passing 26 touchdowns only eight interceptions. He's completing better than 66% of his passes.

He started every game but we talked about some of the obvious and glaring inefficiencies of the offense. Apparently according to Jordan Schultz again of Bleacher Report the Broncos Russell Wilson's camp so his agents and the NFL Players Association. Have all been involved in trying to negotiate a change in Russ's contract and as you can imagine if I'm Russell Wilson's agent I'm like there's the door. There's the door take a walk they signed the contract they knew exactly what was in it you don't get to change it now just because you don't like it. If rust if rust doesn't want to change it well then he doesn't change it. How many times do we hear people say oh the athlete signed the contract well guess what the team signed this contract.

I wouldn't change it either. Especially since it's fairly apparent that the Broncos are unhappy and potentially looking for a different QB. If you're Russ in his camp you might as well get everything that they have put in that contract if they're not going to stick with you. So now Sean Payton and upper level management decide they are going to move forward and bench Russ. And so yeah it may be about the the desire to win and the fact that the offense has been it's been lackluster it's not doing enough. But how much does this threat to Russ undermine the offense. That's a good question right like how much did they undermine the offense in telling him that they really did want to bench him. Where is Russell Wilson an upgrade at quarterback right now in the NFL. This portion of the show brought to you by NHTSA whether you get pulled over or get into a crash drinking and driving will change your whole world.

Drive sober or get pulled over paid for by NHTSA. On Twitter a law radio also on our Facebook page. Thanks for hanging out with us after hours with Amy Lawrence on CBS Sports Radio.

Additional terms apply. I'm Kate Abdo the host of kicking it a new weekly show from the CBS Sports Galasso Network where Clint Dempsey Charlie Davies Moa do and I connect with the biggest personalities from global soccer and beyond to learn about their journeys and what makes them tick. This is the place for football fans to hear unfiltered conversations with the game's most familiar faces. So what are you waiting for. Follow and listen to kicking it on the Odyssey app or wherever you get your podcasts.