The Problem of Pain and Suffering

Best-selling author, speaker, and advocate for Christian apologetics, Dr. Alex McFarland.

Best-selling author and apologist, Dylan Burrows. Together bringing you truth. For a new generation, this is TNG Radio. In the book of Genesis, God looked around his creation, the Garden of Eden, and over and over it says, God saw all that he had created and it was good.

It was good. We look around the world today and clearly the news, the headlines, many events in the world are not good. In fact, they're pretty bad. And so what's the answer? Why, if God created everything good, and if God himself is righteous, why is the world so full of that which is unrighteous and not good?

Alex McFarland here with Dylan Burrows, and we welcome you to another edition of Truth for a New Generation Radio. Dylan, we get a lot of questions, a lot of correspondence from people, and within apologetics and biblical worldview there are a lot of questions, and fortunately there are good substantive answers, but I suppose one of the most oft-asked questions is if God is good, why is the world broken to the degree that it is? That's a question we hear a lot, isn't it? Yes, it is, and it's hard for people to understand that you could have a good God, a perfect God, but yet he could create a world in which such evil things happen, and certainly this is even more concerning for people who've experienced pain or hardship or disability or something difficult in their own lives, and to see that God could somehow be at work in this issue that they're facing, and also that he would have a plan in this. It's really hard for us as humans to understand, but there are answers from God's Word, and we want to talk a little bit about this.

So Alex, why don't you get us started? This idea that if God is real, why is there evil and suffering in the world? What does Scripture tell us about this important question?

Well, the Lord himself said in John 16, 33, that in this world you will have trouble. Peter Kreeft, he's an author that we've referenced quite a bit, K-R-E-E-F-T. I want you to know who that great thinker is, Peter Kreeft. He wrote many books, but one of my favorite is the Handbook of Christian Apologetics. It was published by InterVarsity Press, IVP. It's a great resource.

It's been our privilege over the last 20 years to give away, I don't know, 50 or 75 copies of it at least. But Kreeft says that really only Christianity has an answer to the problem of evil, a fully-orbed answer. And let me say this. When we're trying to reconcile the character of God, that God is all-wise, omniscient, we say. God is omni-benevolent.

God is all-good, and God is all-powerful. So we've got to craft an answer, a response to the problem of pain and suffering, that doesn't deny the reality of sin and fallenness in the world. It's not an illusion, as many Eastern religions would say.

It's not a fantasy or just something in our mind. There is real objective evil in this world. When a mother would drive an SUV off of a cliff, purposely killing her children, that is wrong on an objective, transcendent level. That is morally wrong.

When a shooter goes into a school and guns down innocent children and their teachers and the faculty and staff, that is wrong. But we've got to have an answer to the problem of evil that doesn't deny the reality of evil, but at the same time doesn't compromise the essential nature of God. Dylan, as you know, some have said, well, maybe God is evil, or maybe God is good and cares but is unable to do anything about it. And so we would submit that only Christianity – and by that I mean biblical Christianity – only Christianity really can give a sufficient answer, sufficient in the terms of what Scripture says, sufficient in what we know about God, sufficient in terms of reasonableness and logic, and I would say an answer to the problem of pain and suffering that is, for lack of a better term, existentially satisfying.

It really does give comfort and hope to the human heart. And I agree with Krafft, Dylan, that only Christianity sufficiently has a response to the problem of pain and suffering and evil. And as we talk about evil in our world today, we want to be clear there are different types of evil. There's, for instance, moral evil. When someone does sin of any kind, or whether it's murder or theft, you see war, and these moral evils that appear in our world. But there are also natural evils.

That's what we mentioned when we talk about natural disasters such as a hurricane or a tornado or a tsunami that causes destruction in our world. So we want to get into this discussion, why does God allow these things, and where did this begin? And I think the answer is really found as we go back to the book of Genesis, the first book of the Bible, and how sin entered the world and the impact that that has had from that point till now.

So tell us a little bit about this issue of evil, where it began in the book of Genesis chapter 3. Well, God created everything perfectly, but God gave Adam and Eve the ability to make moral choices, free will. One of the words that scholars use is the word volition, and that means choice. Adam and Eve were volitional creatures.

God didn't make robots or puppets. Adam and Eve were encouraged to do what was right. They were in the very presence of the Lord, and they had every reason to trust God and to follow God and to understand that God had their best interests at heart. They knew the right, but they chose the wrong, and we call that sin. The Bible calls it sin, and the Word of God says that all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. Now, I like what you said, God allows evil. We want to be very careful to understand that God doesn't cause sin. He has allowed sin, and by virtue of having created the universe and created the human race, I mean, yes, ultimately God is the cause of everything because he created reality. However, though, classical Christian orthodoxy, and by that I'm talking about Christian truth that squares up with the Bible and squares up with what we know about God, God is not the author of sin. God is not going to do that which is incompatible with his nature. And by the way, let's talk a moment about what sin is, Dylan, because the Bible says the wages of sin is death. In other words, the end result of sin, the payoff, the result of sin is death. So I would believe God could not, would not, did not initiate evil and sin because it's incompatible with his nature, which is eternal, and God is life. God is the foundation of life.

He's the creator. And sin, among other things, is that which brings death. So God would not have created sin and evil.

He said everything is good. However, he did give humans the ability to make moral choices. And sadly, our predecessors, Adam and Eve, made sinful choices. And that has reverberated down to us to this very present day, hasn't it?

It has. And we want to talk more about this as we come right back at Truth for a New Generation radio. Stick with us. 1 Peter 3.15 tells us to be ready always to give an answer for the hope we have. We're instructed to be prepared to defend our faith. This is Alex McFarland for the Life Answers Teams, students we train at North Greenville University, a leading Christian college in South Carolina. The Life Answers Teams are made up of students who will inspire and equip your congregation. These apologetics teams we train speak in churches to youth groups and train Christians of all ages to address key issues of our times from a biblical perspective, like is there a God? Is the Bible true? What about gender and moral issues? Call me at 864-977-2008 and we will arrange for the Life Answers Team to come to your church and give a presentation that will benefit your people for years to come.

864-977-2008 and always be ready. For centuries, the Bible has inspired humanity and shaped the very world we live in. But how do we know this book is the Word of God and not merely the words of men? What we believe about the Bible is based on what we believe about its source. The God Who Speaks explores the evidence of the Bible's inspiration and authority through some of the world's most respected biblical scholars. We have essentially a dual authorship, so it's true to say that Paul wrote Romans. It's equally true to say that God wrote Romans. He says, we saw this, and that sets the Bible apart from almost everything else in the ancient world and its religious pantheon of gods and goddesses. The God Who Speaks is a feature-length documentary from the American Family Association, available now at TheGodWhoSpeaks.org. Welcome back to TNG Radio.

Alex McFarland here with Dylan Burrows. We're discussing the problem of pain and suffering. Dylan, I'm always uncomfortable whenever people call in and they'll say, you know, some moral evil happened, whether it's a murder or violence or some type of thing that clearly is morally wrong. And they say, yes, but God willed it. I don't think the God of the Bible wills sin and evil to happen.

It may happen. He allows it, because this world is not heaven yet. It's a fallen world, and we have the ability to make moral choices, and we have accountability.

We will answer for the things we've done, the words we've said, the life we've lived. That's why it's so vitally important for people to turn to Christ and have their sins forgiven. But Dylan, I don't believe that God wills sin and evil and death to happen.

Do you? No, and it's very clear in the first passage where sin is introduced into our world, there's a pattern there. Sin enters our world through the evil one, the serpent, representing Satan, who continues to represent evil and to tempt people to evil today. But also, there is sin entering through humans making sinful choices. When we look at why evil happens in our world today, we see three different categories. One, we see things that happen just because we are in a fallen world, like the natural disasters you talked about. Second, we see evil in our world because of the moral choices people make. And we can talk a little bit later about how we define moral evil and what Scripture says about that, but there are times when people choose to do wrong.

But then there is that third category of evil. Sometimes God has a plan for suffering that takes place in our lives, and we may not understand it, we may not like it, it may not be enjoyable, but if you look at Scripture, even Jesus suffered and died on the cross, a painful death, in a way that had purpose, and it had meaning that has impacted lives far beyond the time that he spent on this earth. And the same is true in our own lives. There are times when we endure suffering, when we experience pain, but God has a purpose in it, and he calls us to endure faithfully, even though we don't always understand it. And I think it's also worth pointing out that we are in a spiritual universe, and there is spiritual darkness. Part of the suffering in this world, Satan and his demons tempt people to do evil. I think a lot of people are lured into doing evil, and they are morally culpable, but we've got to acknowledge the reality, and believe me, I'm keenly aware some would scoff at this, but there is a world of spiritual warfare, and some of the suffering and evil and the darkness, whether it's occult activity or whether it's heinous, terrible things humans do to each other, but it was initiated by the one that the Bible calls the tempter.

John 10, verse 10, Jesus said, the thief, and that's a reference to Satan, the thief comes to steal, to kill, and to destroy. We look around this world and we say things ought not be this way, and God says, agreed, things ought not be this way. That's why he sent his son, that's why this world, as wonderful as life is, there is pain in this world, but Revelation 21, verse 4 makes the promise that one day, quote, God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes, and there shall be no more death, no more sorrow, crying, neither shall there be any more pain. Dylan, aren't you glad that in Christ the suffering and the pain and the sin has been addressed and will one day be fully eradicated? Well, certainly, and Jesus has come to give us an opportunity to have eternal life and to be in a place someday where we are free from the pains and the inequalities and the imperfections of this world, but sometimes the imperfections of this world, as you mentioned, help point us to God and that future that we have to look forward to.

C.S. Lewis is one who mentioned that God whispers to us in our pleasures, he speaks to us in our conscience, but shouts in our pains. It is his megaphone to rouse a deaf world. And that has been so true in my life many times. You see someone go through pain or you go through pain yourself, you see your child sick, you lose a loved one, and in that you think, why, God, why did you allow this to happen? And then he quickly reminds you through the pages of scripture that this is not my home. Heaven is where we will spend eternity and all those imperfections will be taken away. And as you mentioned, there will be no more sorrow, no more tears, and no more pain.

So that's what we have to look forward to. There will be a day when this is all reconciled, but while we live on this earth, we are called to do something about the evil that we see in this world as believers. And that gets us to another topic, perhaps we can address a little bit, that as believers we see evil in this world, and what should our response be? What can we do to make a difference around us when we see different issues of evil in our world?

Well, great question. Dylan, I know that there are people, because we hear from them by the hundreds every year, and life has dealt them some heavy blows. There are children that walk away from the faith. There are marriages that break up and family issues and unemployment and money problems and health issues, and maybe you've gotten a diagnosis that has rocked your world. I've counseled with parents that had a child die, or you name it, there's one of 10,000 ways that pain and tears come into our lives.

And people invariably ask why. I want you to know this, folks, that we're not trying to just give some theological cold data here. Ultimately, for a lot of what we go through, I don't know that this side of heaven, Dylan, we always know why. We know why in the sense that it is a fallen world, and sin happens, and Jesus, as I said earlier in the program, Jesus said, in this world you will have tribulation, but be of good cheer.

I have overcome the world. But why do people suffer, and why do even godly, righteous people sometimes suffer? There are some things that I think are known only to the heart of God, but we know the answer, and that's Jesus. Do you remember, Dylan, I believe it's in John chapter 6, when Jesus asked his disciples, when many walked away, Jesus said, will you go away too?

And I wonder if there was maybe this moment, kind of an awkward silence, but Peter speaks up, and Peter says, Lord, where would we go? You have the words of eternal life. And when you're faced with the problem of pain and suffering, or it's personal pain and suffering, I mean, what are you going to do? Say, oh, there is no God, life has no meaning, just resign yourself to depression and implode, or as hard as it might be, as much strength as it requires, as much help as is needed from the Lord, which is immeasurable. We turn to God, and we say, Lord, I don't know why, but Lord, I'm going to trust you. That is the wisest thing we can do, isn't it? Well said, Alex, and I look forward to explaining more about God's purpose and our pain when we come back on Truth For New Generation Radio. Stick with us. I interviewed hundreds of children, ages 5 to 12, and we address actual questions from actual children, the spiritual issues that are on the minds of your kids.

Did Jesus ever sin? The book and video lessons are great for groups of any size and was produced with the goal of equipping kids to stand strong for Christ in any situation. The 21 toughest questions your kids will ask, the book, the guide and video series, you'll find it at AFASTORE.NET.

That's AFASTORE.NET. Truth For A New Generation is here to equip Christians with a biblical worldview through conferences and camps. And speaking about camps, registration is now underway for the TNG Summer Youth Apologetics Camp, happening July 22-26 at North Greenville University in South Carolina.

Alex McFarland will be there, along with Tony Beam. He's the Vice President for Student Services and Christian Worldview at NGU. They'll engage your youth on topics like, If God is so good, why is the world so bad? Understanding and applying what God's Word says about gender, and a whole lot more, 15 apologetic and worldview training sessions in all, along with a field trip to the Billy Graham Center. And of course, outdoor fun and games.

And don't forget about the food, great food, enough to fill them up and keep them going. Find out more about the 2018 TNG Summer Youth Apologetics Camp when you visit truthforanewgeneration.com. Alex, good to be back with you here on Truth For A New Generation radio. And as we continue, I want to remind our listeners that at truthforanewgeneration.com, we have many resources regarding the information you're hearing today, information about our conferences, as well as your own website at alexmcfarland.com, where they can get lots of information to help them grow spiritually.

Tell us a little bit more about what people can find. I think of a couple of books. One is The God You Thought You Knew, Exposing Ten Common Myths About Christianity. In the writing of that book, we talked to several hundred college students, and we got the questions that are on their mind. There's a book that's a great book for middle school and high schoolers called Stand Strong in College. You know, I've done a seminar for about 20 years around the country called What You'll Hear Your Freshman Year, Preparing for the Ways that College Will Challenge Your Faith. Now, the book based on that seminar is called Stand Strong in College, but we've got dozens of questions that high schoolers ask about God, about living the Christian life in the 21st century, and at any of the online bookstores or your own local bookstore, you can find these or you can go to my own website, alexmcfarland.com.

One last thing about the resources. We do a summer camp, and this year, the summer of 2018 in July, July 22nd through 26th, we're going to be at North Greenville University, and it's really summer camp for your soul. We're going to do fun stuff. We're going to play volleyball, hike in the mountains, visit the Billy Graham Museum. It's going to be great, but we're going to equip your teens to stand for their faith.

We don't want your young people to be a casualty of the war of world views and go away to college one day and come home an agnostic, so you might want to check that out to help the young people in your life or maybe your entire church youth group to know what they believe and the reasons why. And, you know, Dylan, back to the topic at hand, the problem of pain and suffering. Elmer Towns, the great co-founder of Liberty University, brilliant, brilliant scholar. Elmer Towns talks about how God is big enough to take that which was bad and turn it into something good, and even the stresses of life. Elmer Towns says that thing, that burden that you so desperately wish to be out from under, that may be the very vehicle God uses to take you where you want to be. And so he says we walk with God, we trust God, we trust him for our salvation, our forgiveness.

We can even trust him with our wounds, our pains, and our burdens, can't we? That's so well said, Alex, and a good example of this is found in the Old Testament, the story of Joseph. And if you're familiar with this story, you know that Joseph is one of twelve brothers.

His brothers are jealous of him because of a special coat he has and the favor his father has given to him over his brothers. They take him, they throw him into a well, first of all, and then later sell him as a slave to people going down to Egypt. The story continues with him going from a slave in a household to being falsely accused of a crime and then put into a prison where he stays for several years.

But then things change during this time in prison when he's faithful to God, serving day by day, not understanding the purpose of his pain. And what does God do? Alex, tell us a little bit about how God turned that around from a time where he was in the pit to a time where he had great influence over not only his family, but all the world of his time.

Well, he really did. And this is found, if you want to read it, it's one of the great portions of the Bible, and frankly, one of the greatest stories in history. It's Genesis 37 through 45, and the story of Joseph, where his brothers tried to do him harm. God providentially intervenes. Joseph is made kind of the vice regent of Egypt under Pharaoh.

He very wisely helped save the nation during a famine and ultimately the world. But in Genesis chapter 50, Joseph says to his brothers, You meant it for evil, but God meant it for good. Literally, what you devised against me as evil, God is big enough to overrule and cause good to come from it.

Dylan, that really reminds me of a New Testament verse that many people love. I love this verse, but it's Romans 8.28. And sometimes people misquote this verse, or only partially quote this verse, but Romans 8.28 says that we know that all things work together for the good to those who love God and are the called according to his purpose. It doesn't say all things are good, because there are some things in life that aren't good.

Some things in life that are objectively wrong, evil. Listen, you can be a born-again Christian who loves Jesus, and you still might get cancer. You can be a faithful church-going family, and bad things can happen. The rain falls on the just and the unjust. But here is the promise of Romans 8.28, and Joseph of old knew it and lived it.

We can cling to it. And God is big enough, if we give him our circumstance, he will do something with it that is for our good and his glory. We really can trust God, because our God is big enough.

He created the universe out of nothing, ex nihilo, from out of nothing. But he can take that which was intended for wrong and make it right. And friend, whatever your circumstance today, whatever you've done, he can forgive, whatever has been done to you, he can heal. But you can, honestly, you can trust God. It might be the hardest thing you've ever done.

You're going to need his help to muster the emotional strength to do it. But trust God with your circumstance, and he will bring something good from it, ultimately. And as we wrap up our final minute here, Alex, why don't we close with a brief prayer for those who may be struggling with something going on in their lives today. They need God's help to get them through this time of difficulty and to trust him that he will work it together for good. Father, in the name of Jesus, we lift up everyone listening to this program, and Lord, we thank you. We thank you that in the Bible, Joel 2, verse 25, it says that God restores the years the locust has eaten.

Even things we've squandered, sinful things we've done, grudges, anger, wounds, pain. Lord, I just pray for the Spirit of God to move and to heal people and to cause people to trust you. And Lord, we thank you that there is an answer to the problem of pain and suffering, and that answer is found in Jesus, and we lift people up to him now. In Christ's name, amen.

You know, Dylan, I think about what C.S. Lewis said, Lord, you yourself are the answer. Before your face, questions flee away. And that's true. Friend, turn to Jesus.

He suffered the punishment for sin on our behalf, and if you turn to Christ and turn your life and your situation to Christ, ultimately, in the long run, he will make something good and glorious come from it. Amen. Thanks for being with us. That's P.O. Box 485, Pleasant Garden, North Carolina, 27313. That's P.O. Box 485, Pleasant Garden, North Carolina, 27313. Or give online at alexmcfarland.com or truthforanewgeneration.com. Thanks for listening, and join us again next time as we bring you more truth for a new generation on TNG Radio.