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April 17, 2017 4:20 pm

The Resurrection of Jesus; the Persecuted Church; Kingdom Commentary; and Christians in Hollywood

The Line of Fire / Dr. Michael Brown

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April 17, 2017 4:20 pm

Dr. Michael Brown discusses the resurrection of Jesus, the persecuted church, and the importance of forgiveness, while also exploring the role of Hollywood in spreading the gospel and the challenges of being a Christian in a secular world.

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From the resurrection of Jesus to the persecuted church to North Korea, we've got you covered right here. Uh It's time for the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and president of Fire School of Ministry. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. There's only one thing that I really need to know. And if I know this, my heart is settled.

If I know this, I'm sure and confident. If I know this, there's no reason for fear. Did Jesus really rise from the dead? and then ascend to heaven as Lord of all? If so, That's all I need to know.

Ultimately. Ultimately, the kingdom of God will triumph. Ultimately the Light will conquer darkness. Good will conquer evil. Truth will conquer lives.

Ultimately, God's perfect ways will be established forever. And ultimately, we will be with him. We will be with him. forever. All based Of the resurrection and ascension of Jesus.

This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the line of fire. For all of you who celebrated yesterday as Resurrection Sunday, we join in the celebration. And again, this year it did work out the way it would have been biblically, right in the midst of the Passover season. To me, that's the ideal way to celebrate.

I've got a bunch of questions I'm going to put out for discussion today. A lot of things I want to share with you. Number to call, interact, 866-348-7884. I think I'm going to give away a few books as well. 866-34TRUT is the number to call.

Persecuted church. Boy, powerful testimonies from Egypt. Very, very powerful. I want to share some of that with you in the aftermath of the slaughter two Sundays ago on Palm Sunday in Egypt. I want to talk to you about some things happening around the world, North Korea, the Trump administration, a whole lot more.

In the second hour, we'll be speaking with Phil Cook. He is a noted Christian leader in Hollywood.

So a whole lot to cover today. Got some neat testimonies. I've had them on my desk for a few days.

Some Christians doing outreach, reaching out to Israelis working at malls with some great reports on God touching them.

So.

So The resurrection of Jesus. I asked this question on Twitter this morning. The resurrection of Jesus. Is it Based on solid historical evidence. In other words, We have strong historical evidence for the resurrection of Jesus, and that's sufficient.

Or is it solely a matter of faith without any evidence? Do we have confidence that Jesus rose from the dead solely? By faith? Or is there solid historical evidence that that's why we know he rose? Or is it kind of like 50-50?

Um What do you think?

Now I put out this question on Twitter. I also gave the option, I don't believe in it. For those that follow me on Twitter that are skeptics or agnostics or atheists or simply people of other religions who don't believe Jesus rose from the dead, so far. 0% have said they don't believe in the resurrection. And the others are divided between the first three choices: strong evidence, only faith, equally evidence and faith.

And I'll tell you where they weigh in in a moment. But this weekend, Friday night, this past weekend, I went to the movies with Our two granddaughters, Eliana. And Riley, Eliana is 16, Riley is 10. and I brought him to see the case for Christ. And by the way, you can enjoy the movies without eating popcorn and other snacks.

Yeah, there used to be part of it, but I don't eat that stuff, so I was very happy, enjoying the movies with my granddaughter. Granddaughters. And they gave me some good feedback on the movie, but I'll tell you what it made me think about. Lee Strobel is a friend and colleague. And the movie is about his life story, the case for Christ.

I'll tell you what got my attention. Aside from how unbelievably stubborn and hard-hearted he was, I tweeted him later. I said, man, I cannot believe how stubborn you were. And he liked that tweet. But something got my attention concerning the evidence for the resurrection.

I want to talk to you about that when we come back on the line of fire. 866-342. Be standing by your phones. We're going to give away some books when we come back. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr.

Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks for joining us on the line of fire 866-348-7. 884 is the number to call.

A first Let's give away a free book. I just found out that we had some copies of this book available for giveaway. It's the fire that never sleeps. wrote it together with John Kilpatrick. Pastor of the Brownsburg Revival, and Larry Sparks, editor at Destiny Image with a great heart for revival.

And it's a book on keys for sustaining personal revival. How to ignite personal revival in your own heart, what it looks like, what it means to really encounter God in a deeper way. And we were sent some advanced reader copies of the book. These are books that the publisher will print up in advance so you can send them out for someone to give an endorsement or something like that. But it turns out we've got these.

They're great books. They're absolutely normal, readable books. We just got some extra copies sent our way, and I was alerted to it the other day.

So just remember today, I want to give this away to caller number six, 866-348-7884. A great book to stir your heart for revival. A great book to get you hungry for God. A great book to help ignite a greater ongoing desire for God in your life. 866-348-7884.

Caller number 6.

Okay. Here's what struck me watching The case for Christ. based on the life of Lee Strobel. Our older daughter, Eliana, granddaughter, comment that it was a very well-done movie for a Christian movie, so I guess she saw some others that weren't as well done. I had a smile at that.

And I asked them, did you think it was too slow moving or anything like that? And they said, no, no.

So maybe if I've seen movies lately, they've been more. Extreme action or something like that. Maybe it's the boy in me. But anyway, no, didn't think it was slow-moving or anything. I thought it was well-acted.

And uh that was that was uh terrific. They thought it was a great movie. I was the only one among us who cried, though, when he had his moment of coming to faith. They didn't cry, but they heard me go. Sniffling a little bit.

And we do have a winner. Thank you. Thank you for your calls. We do have a winner. I'll give away some more books a little later in the show, so stay tuned.

But here's what struck me.

Okay, when I came to faith as a Jewish believer in Jesus... I heard the message, all right? I heard the message. And I believed and my life was radically transformed, right? I heard the message.

My life was radically transformed. And therefore I knew it was true. I knew that Jesus was alive. And then, as I began to study the scriptures more, the big debates I always had were with the rabbis, the counter-missionaries. Those were the debates.

The debates were not about the resurrection. The debates were about messianic prophecy. Did Jesus really fulfill messianic prophecy?

So that's where I had my great apologetics battles and my faith was challenged and I had to learn Hebrew and related languages and of course have written many volumes on these subjects and done many debates on these subjects and put out teaching series on these subjects. But I never personally wrestled with the resurrection issue. I knew that Jesus rose from the dead because I experienced him changing my life, and I saw by the scriptures that he was the promised one.

So when people debate the resurrection, someone like Chuck Coulson Who is a hitman for Richard Nixon and a sinister political figure in jail? He has a wonderful born-again experience. But what convinces him is the evidence for the resurrection. That's what convinces him. Evidence for the resurrection.

And then, and then Lee Strobel is an atheist, but an aggressive atheist, one who tells his wife, I don't. I don't like where this marriage is going. I'm not going to have this conversation in a few years if you're getting more and more in faith. I mean, he's in bad shape. He's hostile.

He's angry. He's drinking. He's trying to disprove this, and he runs into a wall of evidence, and when he's honest enough to open up, he recognizes that the evidence says Jesus died on the cross and rose. From the dead.

So this may surprise you. After following Jesus more than forty five years, But watching the movie and thinking about these issues Is about the most time that I've focused on proof of the resurrection. Oh, I could give you the arguments. Yeah, I could give you all the arguments for it. And the reliability of the historical accounts and the eyewitness accounts, and there's no such thing as mass hallucinations of everyone saying that they saw a person rise and so on and so forth.

In fact, they're willing to die for their faith subsequently. And the impossibility of the swoon theory that Jesus only appeared to die on the cross and did all these things. I give you all the arguments. I'm very familiar with all the arguments. I've looked at them over the years, but I never really.

Tried to put myself in the shoes of a skeptic. like Elise Strobel. And you might say, okay, well, Paul mentions 500 people, saying that they saw Jesus after he rose from the dead, and most of them were still alive at that time.

So, I mean, he's saying something that was easily verifiable or okay, where are these people if there's so many, if this is just some story that's out there. She's the only one that mentions that. But the Gospels all mentioning different ones seeing Jesus after he rose from the dead. You say, well, could it have been a mass hallucination? And Craig Keener has written about that in different places in his miracles book.

I believe he addresses this as well as two volumes, Miracle Studies. And you have to think of this for a minute. If we were going to have mass hallucinations of someone rising from the dead. If this was something that would happen through history, we would actually see it happening with some degree of frequency. Why do I say that?

Because the grief and agony of losing people is so great. The pain of losing them is so great. The wish and the desire that they were still alive. How many of you have had dreams about loved ones after they passed away? I remember after my dad died suddenly at the age of 63 in 1977.

That when that happened, I would have dreams on and off for years that I was talking to him again. And then I got to tell him once more how much I loved him. And we were doing things together. I thought he's not dead, he's alive, but it's just a dream. It's just a dream.

And you think of people who are believing, we're believing God. We're believing God. We're believing God. He's not going to die. She's not going to die.

Our child's not going to die. No, we're believing they're going to rise from the dead. And then they finally recognize: okay, it didn't happen. It didn't happen. Or maybe they're going to communicate with them in the world to come.

Whatever it is. There is such fervor, passion, desire, so much.

So much expectation.

So much wanting things to not be the way they are that if people were going to hallucinate that someone was actually alive, you'd think it would happen over and over again, especially a religious leader, a miracle worker. Yet you don't have that happening. You'll have people saying, oh, spiritually they rose. Oh, you go check in the tomb there, you'll see they're not really. It's just talk.

You know what I'm saying? They do not say, I actually encountered this person. I was in despair. I was hopeful. No, I encountered.

I also. I too. This is substantial. This is major. And you think of Oh, okay, you just well people made it up.

And then of course you're struck with that issue. Again, all these arguments I'm used to. I just never really put myself in the shoes of someone like Elise Strobel or Chuck Coulson, a skeptic who is being convinced by these things. And there were the manuscript evidence and the antiquity of the manuscript evidence and the overwhelming documentation and copies of the New Testament that we have and things like that. Again, I'm very much aware of these things.

I've written about these things in some of my apologetics work, but never stepped back and said, okay, let me try to put myself in those shoes, because I didn't go through that personally. That was not an issue. for me.

So it was fascinating to go through this.

Okay, he appeared to die. He didn't really die. If flogged, Look, the crucifixion of Jesus is one of the best attested ancient historical events. I mean, you have others talking about it in the ancient world, aside from numerous eyewitnesses. Who went on with their story, which is not denied, even later Jewish literature says he died, he was killed, he was put to death.

And then you have Roman writers talking about this one who was crucified under Pilate.

So this historical fact, you don't survive a flogging. and a crucifixion. And the idea of blood and water coming out of his side, if that was a proof of death a certain way, how did the ancients know that particular detail? advanced medical information got in there. Either way.

There's enough clear evidence that he died. There's enough clear evidence that his followers truly believed that he rose and were willing to die for him.

Now you say, well, that's a parallel with the man named Menachemendo Schneerson, called the Lubavatur Rebbe, the grand rabbi of the Lubavatur Hasidim, who died in 1994 at the age of 92. And many of his followers said that he was the Messiah, and they still believe he's the Messiah, and the movement has only grown after his death. Yeah, well, most have abandoned. The idea. That that he is the Messiah.

Maybe they secretly believe it. Let's just say publicly. They don't argue for it anymore because he died before he completed his mission. All right, so that's one thing. The second thing is this.

They never said he physically rose. They said, well, his death was just a test for our natural eyes. Or, well, if you'll go to that grave, you'll see he's not there. He rose spiritually, or his presence is with us. But they haven't said, I encountered him here.

And in another way, no, we encountered him here. No, several hundred of us saw him, even though they're there, people praying at his gravesite on a regular basis. It is not a parallel, in fact. You don't make up a story and then die for it subsequently. All right, we'll be right back.

Focus on the persecuted church. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. Thanks for joining us on the line of fire, 866-348-7884. The number two. Call. And We're going to give away another book, The Fire That Never Sleeps.

Some of my best writing on revival. John Kilpatrick writing on revival. Editor Larry Sparks writing on revival. Great, great quotes in the book. It'll stir your heart.

It'll give you a passion to believe God for revival in your own heart and life, as well as in your church community and the nation. And it's yours free. Caller number 8, 866-348-7884. 866-348-7884. Eight.

For is. the number to call. Uh persecuted church. There is Big news. reading about it on major outlets.

Christians are the most persecuted group in the world. In 2017 Why is that news Big news. Why Why is that major news? That that's been the case for a long time. That's been the case for many, many years.

the Christians around the world are the most persecuted single group. According to The Center for Studies on New Religions during the last calendar year, some 90,000 Christians were killed for their faith. across the globe. making Christians by far the most persecuted group in the world. Yeah, by far.

Why is that a surprise? It shouldn't be a surprise. at all. The center's findings corroborate those of other scholars and human rights groups. According to the 2016 World Watch List, for example, published by the Open Doors Organization, nine out of the top 10 countries where Christians suffer extreme persecutions had populations that are at least 50% Muslim.

And and which Which country is normally rated the worst country? for Christians to live in in the world. Sadly, North Korea. North Korea, this has been for years. It is government-enforced persecution, which is the worst of all.

Open doors. USA? Uh The Middle East accounts for a majority of countries ranked in the top 10 for extreme persecution of Christians. But here's the order. Number one.

Worst persecution for Christians anywhere in the world. Number one, North Korea. Number two.

Somalia. Number three. Afghanistan Number four. Pakistan. Number five, Sudan Number six, Syria.

Number seven. Iraq Number eight. Iran Number nine Yemen. Number ten. Eritrea.

Egypt ranks number twenty one. According to the Christian Advocacy Group Advocacy Group, one in twelve Christians today experiences high, very high, or extreme persecution for their faith. Oh, I should have told you we we We've had a winner for a little while. Thank you. We'll give away some more books later on.

Nearly 215 million Christians face high persecution. with 100 million of those living In Asia. In the years 2005 to 2015, according to the Center for the Study of Global Christianity, nine Hundred five. thousand Christians were martyred.

So average of 90,000 Christians each year. hundred thousand. brothers and sisters. Put to death. for their faith.

Ten years. Yeah. Staggering. Staggering. And yet.

the church continues to grow around the world.

Now notice this. North Korea. That's of course Asia. but totally different part of the world. Non-Muslim, this is an authoritarian.

emperor-based regime, which we'll talk about a little later in the show.

Somalia. So that's in Africa. Sudan is in Africa. Afghanistan and Pakistan. Of course, not part of the Middle East.

All right, but then Syria, Iraq, Iran and Yemen. All in the Middle East, and then Eritrea.

So you've got African countries with Muslim majorities. You've got Asian countries. You've got Pakistan immediately to the north of India. This is this is tragic But it is not surprising. Over the weekend, I saw an article on stream.org.

Posted by Liberty McCarter. I immediately shared it. And it is a response from A bishop In the Orthodox Church, the Coptic Church of Egypt. a bishop there, delivering a message to those who kill us. I watched this about 10-minute clip, Arabic with English captions.

Otherwise, I would have played clips for you, but it's in Arabic. And my spoken Arabic is not good, but I could pick up here and there, and then of course I'm reading the transcription.

So What will we say to those who kill us? Remember. Just a few days earlier forty seven Coptic Christians were killed in their churches. Forty seven, celebrating Palm Sunday. Blown up Ripped apart.

Mm-hmm. What is what does he say? What does this bishop say?

Now what will we say to those who kill us? I don't know. The first thing we will say is Thank you very, very, very much. What? Thank you very much.

Very, very much. That's what he says. To you who kill us And you won't believe us when we say thank you. You know why we say thank you? You won't get it, but please believe us.

Because you gave us to die the same death as Christ. And this is the biggest honor we could have. Christ was crucified. And this is our faith. He died and was slaughtered.

And this is our faith. We thank you because you shortened for us the journey. This is extraordinary stuff to read, friends. When someone is headed home to a particular city, he keeps looking at the time: when will I get home? Are we there yet?

Can you imagine if in an instant he finds himself on a rocket ship straight to his destination you shorten the journey? Thank you for shortening the journey. You're helping us, and you don't even know it. We need to thank you. Trust me.

And I'll tell you why. because there are people we visit in their homes one, two, three, four times to encourage them to come to church. Still they won't come. What you're doing here, you're bringing a church that people will never come, believe me. It is bringing to church the people who never come.

You are filling up our churches. Friends, this is how the spirit of martyrdom overcomes the world. This is how we live by dying. This is how the Church has multiplied through history. The one church growth secret we don't want to teach in America, multiplication by martyrdom.

And yet it's happening. Oh, it doesn't minimize the agony, the pain, the suffering, the grief, the anger. But it does make real that there is more than just this world. And that God's presence is so real in the midst of this agony that he can bring death into life. We'll be right back.

Shake. It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Here's an article by Ali Waqaid. It's on breakbart.com. April 14th.

From Tel Aviv, an Egyptian television channel aired an interview. with the widow of one of the victims of a deadly attack on a church in Alexandria, on Palm Sunday. Forty four people were killed in the twin suicide attacks, which struck Saint Mark's Cathedral, the main Coptic church in Alexandria, and a church in the Nile Delta city of Tanta, The Islamic State claimed responsibility via its Amak news agency. In the interview, The widow addressed the perpetrators of the attack.

Now, let's think for a second. All right. Today, as I'm broadcasting, it's Monday the 17th. All right. So this goes back three days.

This goes back to Friday. The man was killed the previous Sunday.

So, this is within four or five days. Don't know exactly when the interview took place. within four or five days. Ladies, think of this. Your husband brutally killed while in a church service.

Alright, the father. of your children. taken away from you. by Islamic terrorists. How to react?

How do you respond? The wound is gaping, the pain is deep. the shock palpable. In the interview, the widow addressed the perpetrators of the attack, saying, You took my husband. the father of my children But I forgive you.

I ask that God forgive you as well. My husband is gone. You put my husband in a place that I didn't want him to be in, and I very much want to be next to him. I'll just say one thing to you to those who did this. those who've been led astray.

Think about what you're doing. Think again. Think about your actions. We didn't do anything to you. When I say that I forgive you, believe me, I really Forgive you.

Wow, that's grace. That's the gospel. That is one of the greatest evidences. of the love of God that you can possibly find. Her comments were expanded upon by the program's founder-presenter, Amr Adib.

who said the cops of Egypt are made of steel. For hundreds of years they've suffered. The Egyptian Copts love their homeland immensely, and they suffer for their homeland such power, such great tolerance and forgiveness. If your enemies knew how tolerant and conciliatory you were, they wouldn't believe it. If my father had done this I wouldn't forgive him.

These people are made of something else, the cops. They have tolerance that is the product of very strong belief. After the show had, Egyptian Christians responded on social media. Riem Karsham said, It's true that we Christians live by the teachings of Jesus Christ, who commanded us to love our enemies. On Good Friday we ask our Father to forgive them.

We are the salt of the earth, spreading love wherever we are, our blessings to our Coptic brothers in Egypt. Another social media user, Maria Abuatia, commented. We aren't made of something else. We're simply following the teachings of our Lord Jesus Christ. Blessed is His name.

Jesus, who was crucified by no fault of his own, the crucifix that was the symbol of humiliation became the symbol of faith and the salvation after Jesus Christ. God forgive them, the attackers, for what they've done. Gladys Odish wrote, This is what Jesus Christ said 2,000 years ago. He said, you have heard. to love your loved ones and hate your enemies but i say love your enemies Do good to those who don't love you.

Pray for those who harm you and oppress you. And that's what every Christian says. Another commenter, Suhil Yusuf, wrote, We are not made of steel. It's written that God took from us our heart of stone and gave us the heart of man. It's also written, they were perfect as your Father in heaven, and they were merciful as your Father in heaven.

How great are you, God? Your instructions are indeed heavenly and not the instructions of the hand of man. May your name be blessed. And that reminds me. The great, great act in the salvation of Lee Strobel.

was not the evidence. The evidence pointed him in a direction. It was God. mercifully changing his heart and giving him A new heart, taking out the heart of stone. That's the gospel.

that enables us to love even Our enemies. We'll be right back. Shame. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome, welcome to the line of fire, 866-348-7. Eight. Eight.

four. I want to talk a little bit more about the persecuted church before we change subjects. And yeah, let's give away. Another book. We'll make it quick.

Caller number six, 866-348-7884-866-343. truth The fire that never sleeps, keys, for igniting and sustaining personal revival. Written by yours truly, along with John Kilpatrick and Larry Sparks. This book will stir your heart. It'll give you a picture of what real revival is.

Cause you to hunger after God. The Father that never sleeps, 866-348-7884. My gift to you today. All right. Let me just share a little bit more with you.

From This message from Egypt. Uh The second part of the message that this bishop sent to the murderers of these Christians. the second part of the message that he sent to those that kill them, these radical Muslims who persecute them and kill them. And the Coptic Christians have lived side by side with this. over the centuries.

and they have suffered much over the centuries. And And They have had to work jobs that were often the lowest of the jobs, and yet. They've held to their faith. The second part of the message we want to send you is that we love you. Friends, this is the power of the gospel.

To address people a few days after they've murdered your friends, your relatives, your co-workers. others maimed for life, others fighting for their lives in agony, for many months ahead. Second part of the message we want to send you is that we love you.

So, first, thank you. And second, We love you. And this, unfortunately, you won't understand at all. Why won't you understand it? Because this, too, is a teaching.

of our Christ. And in in Arabic, masif, messiah. If you see a Pakistani with the last name Masih, that almost always means that they are Christians. I can't imagine they would have that last name if they were not Christians.

So Hebrew Mashiach, Arabic Masih.

So these are people who are uh Christians and professing Christians and the way that you'd say Christ in Arabic, Masih. I long to talk to you about our Messikh, our Messiah, our Christ. and tell you about how wonderful he is. See what Christ said, if you love those who love you. You have no profit or reward with me.

Even thugs and thieves love those who love them. Any gang loves its members. Even the drug dealers all like each other and take care of each other, right? But I want to tell you that if you Love those who love you, what reward have you? But I say to you, Jesus says, love.

Your enemies. You can't love your enemy. And say, well, I really hate you, but I love you. I despise you, but I love you. No, it is a choice empowered by By God, helped by God, where you genuinely love the people.

Will you pity them? Will you grieve over them? Will you genuinely want them to know? the Lord. I'll give you an example of what this looks like.

I heard it firsthand sitting together with Pastor Richard Warnbraun. who is the most Well known Christian sufferer. Of the 20th century, suffering for the Messiah. His story was the best known, translated into more languages than any modern. Book, he told me, other than the novels of Agatha Christie.

This was years ago. He told me that with a smile. Went to be with the Lord in his early 90s. Miraculous that he even survived that long. 14 years excuse me.

in prison. two different imprisonments for preaching the gospel, severe torture. Uh just Just absolutely horrific suffering. Three years in solitary confinement is it's When you hear what he went through and the nature of the torture, it's Who can imagine it? One of the things that was done was they were put in what was called a carcer.

It was basically like a casket but standing upright. Except on all of the insides were razor sharp blades. and then they close it on you. and there was just enough room for you to stand there if you didn't move at all. You didn't move at all.

then you wouldn't be sliced.

Now first think of the terror. Think of the sheer terror I can't imagine that. And you think of buried alive kind of terror. Think of that terror. The sheer terror of being in there.

And then... your muscles start to cramp or you just move you start to move and then you move and you get cut now you move in another direction And they would have a a peephole through the side where they could watch you. And Warrenbron said normally when he would pass out from loss of blood, that's when they would take him out. that was just meant of one of many tortures he endured. His wife, Sabina, endured horrific hardship and torture in a slave labor camp.

Well, when he was out of prison, Now uh Germans were in Nazis were in his country. And he spoke German, he was multilingual. and they were they were based there for a time and away from home and lonely.

So he would he would go into a bar, where he knew he could find some Nazis. and he would begin to talk to the person, befriend them, And then he'd say, listen. I'll make you deal. I'm a pastor, but I'm a very good piano player. Why don't you come over to my home?

And I'll make a deal with you. Uh I'll I'll Give you a piano concert and then you indulge me, you let me preach to you. And they were so bored, like, yeah, sure, we'll do it.

Well, one night again, Pastor Wernbraun told me this face to face when we met years ago and spent a few hours together in New Jersey. while he was still here on this earth. back in the late 80s.

Okay. Uh late 80s, early 90s.

So He brings this Nazi to his home. His wife Sabina is ill.

So she can't get up and uh bring him stuff like she normally would and care for him. She's in bed, sick. And uh Pesterwormbrawn does what he you know, as promised and and so on and You know, the guy's pretty relaxed at this point. Pastor Ron's plays piano for him, and the guy's now starting to talk and just starting to boast. He has no clue that Pastor Ornbrand and his wife are are Jewish believers in Jesus.

No clue. Just knows he's a Christian pastor. He begins to uh to boast, Oh, yeah, yeah, we put the Jews to death in this place and yeah, I gave the order to exterminate the Jews and This village and Warnbrum realizes, wait a second, that's my wife's village. That's Sabina's village. And he says to him, He said, You ordered the execution.

of all of my wife's families. Reduce. And at this The man begins to shake. He is now smitten, maybe for the first time in his life, or the first time in many years, with conviction. and Pastor Wirnbrand leads that man to Jesus.

with tears. And brokenness. over the crimes he has committed. He leads him. To Jesus.

And at the foot of the cross, this man receives forgiveness. Yeah. Whatever society does with him is another issue. Pastor Wirnbaun then says. You're going to meet my wife now.

He goes, No, no, no, I can't. I can't. He said, You're going to meet my wife, and and I'm going to tell ye her. This man is responsible for the extermination of your entire family, but he is now A brother in Christ, and she will get out of bed. And I'll just say, No, no, I can't.

I can't meet with him. I can't. I can't do it. Pastor Romant said, no, no, you're going to do it now. And he brings him into the bedroom.

Sabina? This man? She knows he's a Nazi soldier who's dressed in his Nazi outfit, German. This man As responsible for the death of your entire family, you gave the order to execute them. He is now your brother in Christ.

And he did, she did just, and she was there, she was there, Sabina was there when I met with him. She got out of bed. and hugged him and they both began to weep. Friends, that's the power of the gospel. That's the power of the gospel.

Some of you are struggling with forgiving somebody because they hurt you a little bit, or they were mean to you, or they gossiped about you, or they let you down, or you've been carrying bitterness. Oh, come on, friends, learn. from the martyrs and learn from the saints. Forgive. And love And for those of you that are hearing this and saying, This is different.

Yes, this is the gospel, friends. This is the message of the cross. This is how the The gospel has spread. around the entire world. This is why it is so unstoppable.

because it overcomes evil with good, it overcomes hatred with love. and overcomes death with life. It overcomes murderous terrorists. with the message of one who willingly died That they could live. Going to take you back to Egypt on the other side of the break.

eight six six three four eight seven eight eight four. The number to call be encouraged, friends, be edified. God is moving around. the world. We will be right back, right here on the line of fire.

Around my new time, shake the new sign, change the world, change the world. God of light, hear our cry, send a fire. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. Just dawned on me that for all of you that said, man, I missed it trying to get free books, hey. We've got a wonderful free e-book. Seven Secrets of the Real Messiah. It's yours when you sign up for our weekly e-blast newsletter, resource information, newsletter, testimony.

Newsletter, great edifying stuff that'll come your way every week.

So just go to askdrbrown.org, A-S-K. Yeah. Excuse me, drbrown.org. And you'll see when you sign up for our email that you'll get a free e-book. This is for everybody without exception.

You'll be blessed by it. I think you'll find great spiritual insights there in the book.

So that's again signing up for our free newsletter. Askdrbrown.org, A-S-K-D-R-Brown.org. While you're there, check out our special resource offer. We've got some great teaching I did years back on spiritual warfare and angels, demons, and deliverance, the unseen realm, and how we interface with it according to scripture, thoroughly, scripturally-based teaching that will also challenge you and Edify you.

So that's there at a greatly reduced price. You can download those resources there. And make sure you check out my latest articles. Excuse me, latest videos. We are posting new material through the week that will bless you, that will be your voice.

that will help equip you.

So get these materials, share them with others on Facebook, Twitter, however you else you do it. Get the message out. All right, let's grab a phone call in Boston. Josh, welcome to the line of fire. All right.

How are you? Doing very well. Thank you. I had a question regarding How? When Your many times not aware of your lack of forgiveness.

Perhaps. or your anger over something. how the pain of that, if you and when you become aware of it, can drive you If you want to get rid of it, to God in prayer and ask for God's grace and forgiveness, because you can't. really Either fully become aware of it, or if you're stuck with anger and resentment, they're sadness, depression, they're all the above because of whatever it is that you're angry about. And um And how the pain of that and um being caught in the rut didn't drive you to God, to ask for help.

Yeah, and Josh, so there are two sides to it. The one is Our will And the other is God's supernatural help and grace, right?

So in terms of our will, We have to choose to forgive. We have to... Choose to give up our bitterness. We have to choose to look at that situation and say, in the sight of God, Lord, from the heart. I forgive that person.

You say, yeah, well, that's the problem.

Sometimes. or will fall short.

Sometimes we find ourselves unable to do it. And that's where we would go to God and say, God, I want to. I just don't know how. I I want to, but I I just feel trapped. I want to, but I I don't know how to love this person.

I can say the words I love them, but they seem empty. I can say the words, I forgive. But I still have this rage inside of me, or this sense of it's not fair, it's not right, they've got to suffer for this. And again, justice in the courts is one thing. In other words, you may forgive a criminal, but that criminal will still go to jail and do the time.

But from the heart, you've forgiven them and you reach out to them and you care for them. But sometimes, John, it's hard to do it. Did I call you Josh originally? If I did, sorry. But sometimes it's very difficult.

The wound is very deep. And we feel like if we forgive, that we give up our right to... to get justice or we give up our right to have the thing fixed and Really it's the opposite. in that sense we get out of the way and God moves more freely. to help and to restore.

And when we are bitter towards others, we're only hurting ourselves. That I'm not going to forgive.

Well, we're not hurting that person as much as we're hurting. ourselves.

So it can be very difficult. But this is where you see the supernatural. evidence of grace. And what I've seen, sir, is I've read accounts of people. who had a family member murdered?

and they forgave the murderer. And watching it from a distance, you're so outraged, you're so angry, you're so upset. You see. You see no possible way that you could ever Forgive. And yet.

You hear the story, and the people themselves are able. Why? Because God gives grace. to those in the midst of Of the difficulty. God gives that supernatural grace to those in the midst of the pain.

You look at it from the outside, you think, that's impossible. I could never forgive. And yet, God gives that supernatural grace. On the inside, and people are able.

So, if you can't, or if you're speaking for someone else, go to God. Lord, I want to forgive. I want to do what's right. I want to walk in the footsteps of Jesus. But I'm struggling.

Help me. Help me. And then meditate on his words and look at how Jesus responds to us. And Colossians 3, forgive one another as the Lord. forgave you.

Think of how he forgave us. Think of how undeserving we were. Think of how we've often let him down and yet he still forgave us. Hey, thank you, sir, for making this real with your call. Much appreciated.

866-34-TRUTH.

Okay, the end of the This message from the Christian bishop, again, just sharing excerpts from Liberty McCarter's. article on stream. The Christian doesn't make enemies. because we are commanded by God to love all of his creation. And so we love you because this is the teaching of our God.

that I'm to love you, no matter what you do to me. I love you very much. And I want to say one last thing to you. We're praying for you. Because the one who told us to love our enemies also told us to bless those who curse you.

and pray for those who spitefully use you.

So the command I have been given from my God was full of love. makes it my duty. you pray. for you. And then to the congregant, Sir what do you think?

How about we make a commitment to day to pray for them? Pray that they know the love of God. Pray that they experience the love of God. Because if they knew that God is love and experienced His love, they could not do these things. Never, never, never.

I don't know what the final death count is. They said 40-something, and of course many people in the hospitals will catch up to them. All of these are crowns. They are rejoicing with God and they will attend the resurrection up there. and they are praying for us the rest is on us.

O you lucky, lucky, lucky ones We cannot wait until it is our turn. To our God be the glory now and for ever. Amen. What a message, what a message may it speak to us in the West and listening around the world. Hey friends.

We've got a great new TV show on God TV. Check your local listings to see when it airs. The first broadcast aired this past Sunday night, so yesterday. And I aired it a couple more times today where I share my testimony. It's called Word on Fire.

So if you have direct TV, you can watch that. If you have the God TV app, you can watch that. But go to God.tv and check that out for weekly listings. Look for word on fire. It is yours truly.

Preaching. And then. Starting this Wednesday, 7 p.m. Eastern Standard Time, also on DirecTV. NRB TV, we're launching the line of fire.

Yes, our radio show. highlights excerpts from our radio show with Hebrew word for the day and other special features. all there coming your way. We'll send you an email blast. Sign up today.

Go to askdrbrown.org. Sign up for our e-newsletter. We'll be sending you the details of these shows and also a special free e-book when you sign up today. About to talk about Christians in Hollywood with a Christian leader in Hollywood. Um It's time for the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr.

Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and president of Fire School of Ministry. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. Is Hollywood destroying our culture? Was Hollywood reflecting art culture? Is Hollywood evil, dark, and Christians just flee from it? Or is that why Hollywood is evil and dark?

Because Christians have fled from it. Can it be redeemed? Is God working through Hollywood? Should believers be more involved so that this powerful medium can be used to advance the gospel? Or is this something we just need to walk away from and preach the gospel in other ways?

This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the line of fire, 866-348-7884. What about Christian movies? How real should they be if you want to appeal to the world? Do you have sex scenes in them?

Do you have profanity in them? Do you glorify drug use, the way it's used in certain cultures, to make it real to people? Or is this trying to win the world by being like the world? I am joined by Phil Cook. Delighted to get him on the line of fire today.

Phil is an internationally known filmmaker, writer, and media consultant. He's actually produced media programming in more than 60 countries around the world. He's created and produced many of the most influential and successful Christian inspirational TV programs in history. And his book, Unique, Telling Your Story in the Age of Brands and Social Media, is changing the way the church and ministry leaders engage today's culture with the gospel. He's been called one of the most innovative communicators of our generation.

You can connect with him at Phil Cook. That's with an E at the end, PhilCook.com. And Phil and I have been having some fun interaction via email and by phone. Finally, joining me on the line of fire today, Phil, welcome. Thanks for joining us.

How are you, Michael? I'm thrilled to be here.

Well, I'm doing great.

Now, are you actually in California as we speak? I am in Burbank, beautiful downtown Burbank, as we speak. All right. And the the state has not fallen off the map yet, correct? I'm waiting any minute.

You never know. All right. How long have you been involved in the Hollywood scene, sir? A very long time, actually. I went to college in Oklahoma and came out here after that.

That was in the late 70s. Went back to Oklahoma for a few years, but we've been living out here full-time since 91. And actually, for a number of years before that, I was out here producing projects.

So I've been doing this in the industry for about 40 years. It's been a long time. Really? And do you still have? Have hope.

For God, moving in Hollywood, working through Hollywood, are things better? Are they worse? What's your perspective after 40 years?

Well, my feeling is I don't walk away from any mission field, and I view Hollywood as a mission field. I think so many Christians, and I completely understand how people get frustrated and angry with what they see coming out of Hollywood many times. But the truth is, we don't walk away from mission fields in Africa or Asia or China or other places because it gets hard. And so I'm not ready to walk away from Hollywood, and I just view it as a mission field. These are good people that just don't know anything about the gospel.

They are fallen people, just like we all were at one point, or we still are fallen. But we've discovered the power of the gospel. And my mission is to really tell that story out here and try to reach as many people as possible.

So, no, to answer your question, I'm not ready to walk away. Got it. And you sound quite vibrant after 40 years. We've got a bunch of things to discuss, sir. This first segment is real quick, just by way of introduction, but we've got a bunch of things to talk about.

I did take my granddaughters, 16 and 10, to see The Case for Christ on Friday night, and they really liked it. Interestingly, my 16-year-old said for a Christian movie, it was very well done.

So that was an interesting observation. One of your latest articles on philcook.com, again, that's C-O-O-K-E, handles Messiah. and why it's never too late for your dream and another recent article should christian movies use Profanity. All right, I've got my questions for Phil Cook. We come back.

We talk Hollywood and the Gospel. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. I'm just looking at some of the clients, some of those that Phil Cook has worked with over the years. DreamWorks? Walt Disney Pictures. USA Network Biola University.

Yeah. U version the Bible app. Billy Graham, Evangelistic Association. For them this morning at their chapel service.

So, Phil, you've been in there with top-flight folks. Why is it so important to you to? to do things with quality if we're going to do them in the name of the Lord.

Well, quality opens the door. We live in an incredibly distracted culture. When I wrote my book, Unique, I discovered that the average person in America is hit we're bombarded with about five thousand media messages every day. The truth is, nobody's going to give you the time to read your book, or watch your movie, or listen to your sermon, if they're not first attracted by it.

So quality is a door that opens up to really open people up to your message. Yeah. It's funny that your daughter said that was a good movie when she saw the case for Christ. That was a good movie for a Christian movie. We have this perception out there that the things Christians do in the media is just poor quality, and that immediately is a turnoff for this generation.

So I think, number one, in the case of a movie, it has to be a great movie first. I don't care how great your message is. If it's not delivered in an entertaining and compelling and interesting way, people simply won't watch. And then we failed.

So no matter how great our intentions, I think quality is what opens the door to really get that audience that we're looking for. Got it. Yeah, and it was actually my granddaughter at 16 who so put that even further down the generations that this observation is there. All right, so we're not talking about compromising a message. But let's just say you're trying to listen to the show on the radio, right?

And you're getting a poor signal. You're going to turn it off, right? Absolutely. Or if you're watching something on the internet and the feed keeps cutting. Because you've got bad internet service, you're going to give it up.

Or if I'm on TV, right, you have to have makeup before you're on TV and they make sure your hair is right. It's not to be vain, it's to look normal. Because once the lights are on you, otherwise you're going to look like a ghost and no one's going to listen to what you have to say.

So we're not talking about changing the message, right? Yeah, absolutely. It's not about watering down the message. It's not compromising your principles. It's strictly about speaking a visual language and really a media language that this culture understands.

That's the key.

So, I can trust God for anointing. I can trust God to supernaturally get a message out. while still doing something with quality. It's not either or. Oh, not at all.

Not at all. It never has been. Although I think a lot of pastors and ministry leaders over the years have just assumed. In fact, I spoke at a conference, a pastor's conference years ago, and a pastor raised his hand in the back and says, You know, but Phil, because we're Christians, we don't have to do it as well as the world does it, right? And I thought, no, no, no, no, no.

We have to do it better than the world does it. I think if we're going to get people's attention, we have to be extraordinary. And the truth is, if you look back at Solomon's Temple, if you look back at the things that were created throughout the Bible, those were not shabby. They they hired the best artisans in the land. and they wanted quality work done.

And I think to do anything less for God is just d to be disobedient. All right, so let's flip it around. I'll play the devil's advocate or God's advocate. I'm good at that. I know.

You're setting me up. I have a feeling you're setting me up. No, no, no. No, I don't know whose advocate I'm playing here, but I'm just going to raise a counterpoint.

Okay, so that was the temple and David and Solomon and all that, and the Exodus, the tabernacle had to be exactly the way God showed them. But now you're talking about salvation comes by way of the cross. By way of someone dying the worst and lowliest death of all, and then these commoners, these apostles who are nobody special, taking the message, doesn't that kind of Is that the opposite of what you're advocating? No, I don't think so at all. I don't think so at all.

Erwin McManus calls it raw beauty. Look, you work with what you have. I mean, there's no question that you work with what you have. And by the way, these were raw, unlearned men to a certain degree, although Paul was brilliant. Paul was really quite brilliant.

So I think that, no, the calling is the most important thing. My feeling is: if God has called you to write a book or preach a sermon or launch a church or make a movie or whatever, you go do it with the resources that you have. But never forget. Always, always, always try to do try to do it at the best of your ability with the best resources you can get your hands on. Because I think in this culture today, it's simply a matter of no matter how great your intention, if nobody's listening, we failed.

And my job, I feel like, as a filmmaker, as a consultant to churches and ministries around the country, is help them find the biggest audience for the message that they're sharing. All right, so let's just step back and look at Hollywood for a moment. We had decades ago, you had the Hayes Code, the moral code over Hollywood. And for example, you couldn't have a bad guy come out winning. You couldn't celebrate, say, drug use or the criminal doesn't get justice.

And obviously, you couldn't have all kinds of sex scenes and things like that. And then that changes. Was there. Was that in your mind a good thing that was there? Or was it unhelpful because it was imposed from the outside?

I mean, how do these things work in terms of morality in a creative culture like that?

Well, obviously, when it's imposed very often, people are going to push back. What's really interesting about the history of film is that between 1898 and about 1914, the church actually made more movies than Hollywood did. The church was incredibly, incredibly active in the film business early on. In fact, I worked with a church in Montclair, New Jersey, right across the river from Manhattan. And it was an old church that was built at the turn of the last century.

And when they did a recent remodel in the sanctuary, they discovered a 35-millimeter film projector embedded in the wall. Back in the 40s, they had covered it up, but they learned that in the 20s and 30s, the church was doing movie nights on Saturday nights, and they would bring the community in and show movies.

So early on, the church was extremely involved in filmmaking, and there's some great films out there that were done early on. But then you're exactly right. The Hays Code came in because people were pushing the limits, as creative artists generally want to do. And the Hays Code covered a wide range of things. That's why Lucy and Desi never slept in the Same bed and the Lucy show on T V.

You know, they're all it di it had all kind of rules about what you could show and what you couldn't show. And, you know, in fact, if you if you look at Gone with a Win, the very, very last line that Rhett Butler gives about frankly, my dear, I don't give a, you know, that was that took special permission for the studio to actually let Rhett Butler say the D-word at the end of that movie.

So it was very tight. in those days. Of course, in the fifties, particularly in the sixties, Hollywood started walking away from the Hays Code. And at the same time, the church walked away from filmmaking. And of course, any time there's a vacuum, all kinds of forces are going to come in.

And so I think there were two mistakes made. I think that walking away from that code was tragic, but I also think the Christian community walking away from film as a medium was was tragic as well because there were decades where the church just not only wasn't involved in film making and T V, but they actually preached against it to a great extent. And I don't think that helped. Yeah, look, obviously, it's easy to understand why people would walk away when they just see something as sinful or evil. When I came to faith, we were, you know, it's.

not directly taught from the pulpit, but pretty much understood Christians don't go to movies. And one thing's going to lead to another, and there's a lot of bad stuff out there. And obviously, there's a lot of trash, and it pollutes, and it destroys, and it desensitizes us. I've got a book coming out in September called Saving a Sick America, and I start off with the story of a guy who's watching Leave It to Beaver with his family in 1962, and he falls asleep and wakes up today and Right, right.

So, I mean, it's very graphic, and I'm eager to see how the publisher puts out a video intro that goes along with it.

So, I could understand that. Flea come out from among them on the one hand, but on the other hand, as you say, it's a mission field. Behind and it's a tool with which people can be reached. And some of the greatest moral messages that impact a generation actually come through Hollywood. They do.

And Hollywood, there's no question that Hollywood is the most influential place on the planet. It's interesting that after 9/11, when the buildings fell in New York City and the Allies invaded Afghanistan, when that initial fighting was over, the devastating fighting that happened after 9-11, when that initial fighting was over, the Los Angeles Times reported that the first public buildings to reopen in Afghanistan weren't hospitals, they weren't government buildings, they weren't schools. The first public buildings to reopen after that invasion were movie theaters, mostly showing American movies.

So you see that kind of influence globally. And I've produced programming in about sixty countries around the world. And everywhere you go, you see the power of film and television and now digital media.

So there's no question that it's incredibly influential. And for Christians not to have a voice in those kind of media is just that's it's tragic, I think. And we've just got 45 seconds before the break. Is there a lot of outreach going on behind the scenes in Hollywood? Absolutely.

There's organizations like the Hollywood Prayer Network, the Act One program, the Greenhouse. There's a number of ministries. Master Media International is probably the highest level. ministry organization trying to reach high level influencers in the industry.

So there are absolutely a number of Christians at very high levels in the industry trying to make change happen from the inside.

So there's a lot to be encouraged by. All right, tell you what, we've got a few more minutes with Phil Cook. He's busy in the midst of many, many projects.

So glad we could get a few minutes with him on the line of fire. I want to ask when we come back, what are some of the positive trends he sees? within Hollywood. Maybe a free tip or two for those of us who are communicators, be it social media or other things, what he might tell us. Again, to connect with Phil, to get his newsletters and interact with him, go to philcook.com.

That's C-O-O-K-E. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 Truth. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. Thanks for joining us today. This is Michael Brown, your voice of moral sanity and spiritual clarity. I'm joined by Phil Cook, internationally known filmmaker, media, writer, and media consultant. Phil, as you've been at this 40 years working with Hollywood, ministering in Hollywood, what are some of the positive things in your view taking place now?

I think there's a lot of them actually. It's interesting. Remember the Bible TV series that came out, Mark Brunette produced a few years ago? It broke all the audience records. It shattered audience records, particularly on cable.

The day it broke those records, I got a call from NBC Nightly News, Associated Press and the Christian Science Monitor, all absolutely baffled at why anybody would be interested in watching a program about the Bible. And I explained to them, look, Hollywood has been over backwards for years to reach all kind of special interest groups like the gay community or environmentalists or other groups. I said, and Pew Research indicates there's about 95 million evangelical Christians in America, which kind of makes us the biggest special interest group there is. And all of them went, okay, I get it now. And what we're starting to see is Hollywood realizes it was really the passion of the Christ that launched this.

Hollywood sees that the Christian audience is big. And the truth is, the biggest agenda Hollywood has is to make money. I mean, they'd sell their grandmother to make a buck.

So, they understand suddenly that the Christian audience is bigger and bigger and bigger.

So, we're starting to see more and more films that are more sensitive to the Christian audience that at least don't make the Christian the pedophile or the crazy person. We're seeing Hidden Figures was a fantastic movie about the early days of NASA. And although it wasn't explicitly Christian, the characters went to church. They had scenes filmed at church and at the dinner afterwards. And it showed that that was just a normal part of life.

And we're starting to see that more and more in films.

So it's very encouraging that even though they may not get who we are, they may not understand Christianity, they're starting to realize that this is a substantial audience and we need to honor them if we're going to reach them at the box office.

So oddly enough, that's a great thing I believe to be excited about. All right, so obviously Hollywood wants to make money.

Some people are going to be driven by a certain ideology, so they're going to put out their Exodus movie almost from an atheistic perspective or Noah movie with some odd touches. But I had seen while traveling, I saw the Unbroken movie. I had read the book and was absolutely blown away by it. And I interacted with you just a little, very disappointed that the whole story, because he came back a totally broken man from Johnny Zamparini, a totally broken man from prison camp. Drunkard and losing his wife, and then Jesus saves him through a Billy Graham meeting, and that was the message of it.

And the movie portrayed something different.

So I was more grieved. You know, you suggested that there was more positive, you know, than I saw. And again, it may just be our callings. I'm the one shouting out the warnings, and you're the one, you know, infiltrating and doing it, which is perfectly fine. And you can believe that God is working in Hollywood while still not watching trashy movies and porn and all that.

So we understand that. But I don't. All right, long way around to get to this.

Sometimes I wonder. How much uh A Christian has to surrender or compromise to get ahead. In other words, I couldn't imagine someone with integrity doing certain scenes or some young Christian gal saying, Okay, I'll take my clothes off or can you really get ahead? Can you or do you have to water the thing down to get ahead?

Well, obviously, there are plenty of challenges that actors face every day in Hollywood, or directors, or writers, or producers. And I always encourage people: don't make that on the set. When you're on the set and the director comes up to you, if you're an actress and he says, Look, we really want to do this scene without your top on, for instance. When 30 or 40 people in the crew are standing around, the cash register is ringing, time's of the essence, that's not the time to make the decision. The time to make the decision is way ahead of time.

Draw your lines in the sand and where you feel like God wants you to go and doesn't want you to go.

So, but the truth is. There are plenty of Christians in Hollywood that have gone very, very far in the industry and have not crossed those lines. They've not compromised. And so I think it is absolutely possible. Certainly, my wife's an actress, and she's turned down projects because they expected her to do things that she was not willing to do.

And there are times when you have to walk away from those things. But you walk away from that in business. There are Christians who refuse to compromise in business because they won't cheat on their income tax or do something else or lie to the board of directors or something.

So I think we all face that to some degree in whatever career we're in. But there are believers in Hollywood that are standing firm and making a difference. And it does matter. Yeah, and as you say that, that's no different than choices I have to make on radio. Am I going to talk about this if it's unpopular?

Or a pastor from behind the pulpit, if I do this, will I lose this tithing member?

So right, it's yeah, exactly. The good thing is to know that you can. make an impact. Obviously, there are challenges and there are all kinds of temptations to face, but again, you have to be called to do it. All right, if you were going to give a nugget, we've got, oh, two and a half minutes.

If you were going to give a nugget to Christians involved in social media and we're trying to get a message out, just your average person that's online, if there's one thing you could leave them with, a helpful nugget about communication in this digital age, what would you tell them?

Well, I'm I'm a big believer that we should speak out. Whoever's listening to this program, there are more opportunities today for you to speak out than ever before. As you say, social media is a powerful, powerful tool. It doesn't cost a thing. I've got about 32,000 people following me on Twitter, which in a weird way makes me the pastor of one of the largest churches in America.

I've got 32,000 people that actually signed up to hear what I have to say.

So I take it responsibly. I'm not telling them I'm at Starbucks. I'm not showing them pictures of my lunch. I'm trying to inspire them and encourage them.

So A, take social media seriously. Stop just being sil. You can have fun with it. But if you take it seriously, you'd be amazed at the impact you can have in people's lives out there. And by the way, YouTube, video is a powerful, powerful thing.

Everybody's got a video camera and their phone nowadays. And YouTube is becoming one of the most influential things in Hollywood. We have what we call Q scores, which are an algorithm of the most influential celebrities and stars in the entertainment industry. This past year, for the first time, the top seven most influential stars in Hollywood weren't on movies, they weren't on TV, they were on YouTube. We're finding a generation that is being influenced by it.

And these are kids that produce programs in their parents' basement or in a spare bedroom.

So it doesn't don't wait for your big budget. Don't wait for big money to come in. You could start now sharing the gospel, sharing your life story, sharing a message you feel God's called you to share through a number of tools that are out there that are absolutely free.

So speak up. Get the message out there because that's how we're going to impact the culture. Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Friends, take that to heart.

And everyone listening to this and all the different formats in which you'll hear it, take it to heart. And last question, a couple seconds. If you were going to recommend any one movie for folks to see these days, what would it be? You know what? I saw Hacksaw Ridge and I was terribly moved.

It is violent, I will say. It is the war in the Pacific during World War II.

So obviously it's a military, it's violent, but what a powerful, powerful story of Desmond Doss and how he won the Congressional Medal of Honor, and he all did it. It's one of the most explicit biblical movies I've ever seen. I mean, it's his Bible that drives him for everything that he does. And I just thought that was a terrible thing. And of course, you mentioned the Case for Christ.

Goes, get people out there. And you know what? You're having trouble witnessing, sharing your faith with somebody, take them into a movie. Take them to a film like Case for Christ, and help it start that conversation that could end up changing somebody's life.

So I'd encourage you. Those two, both those movies are terrific. Hey, Phil, thank you so much. I know you're busy. Great having you on the air.

We'll do it again sometime. Thanks again.

Sounds great. Thanks, Michael. All right. Philcook.com. That is C-O-O-K-E.

It's the line of fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34TRUTH. Here again is Dr.

Michael Brown. The era of strategic patience is over. President Trump has made it clear. that the patience of the United States and our allies in this region has run out. What are we to make of what is happening in the world with our president, with the current administration, with bombing Syria now with potential conflict with North Korea?

What are we to make of this? This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the line of fire. I'm about to give away a book to all of our listeners, especially those just tuning in now. I'll be giving that away shortly.

And we'll be getting a kingdom perspective on what's happening in the world around us. Last half hour, I spoke with Phil Cook, an international media and media film consultant, film maker about Christians in Hollywood. First hour, talked about the resurrection of Jesus and talked about the strength of the persecuted church. You can catch all of that later on my radio website, thelineoffire.org. Thelineoffire.org.

Just click on listen later today. Any part you missed, you can listen to all of that, as well as subscribe to our podcast, as well as listen live to all the shows as they happen. And when you're on the website, be sure to check out our latest articles and videos that are there all free for you. And sign up for our newsletter. This way, as special things happen, we've got two TV shows that are launching this week.

Both, if you have direct TV at home, you can watch one on NRB TV, the other on God TV, but airing online, of course. And other stations around the world. We've got some great information for you, and it all comes your way through our weekly newsletter.

So, to sign up for it, go to thelineoffire.org. When you do, I want to send you a free e-book. Yep, got a free e-book for you to be a blessing to you. Seven secrets of the real Messiah. All when you sign up for our newsletter again, that's at thelineoffire.org.

Okay, clip number two: Mike Pence, Vice President Pence in North Korea. He visited the DMZ, the demilitarized zone. I was there last year for a special time of prayer for peace with North Korea and for the salvation of the people of North Korea. One of the saddest stories in world history, the story of North Korea. Let's listen to what Vice President Pence had to say.

If China is unable to deal with North Korea, the United States and our allies will. The world witnessed the strength and resolve of our new President in actions taken in Syria and Afghanistan. North Korea would do well not to test his resolve.

So here is the great problem. You are dealing with an irrational. And irrational leadership there. You are dealing with a demented, delusional leader. You're dealing with a people that has been brainwashed and cut off from the outside world for several generations.

You are dealing with people who believe the reports on their radio, which bear no resemblance to reality in many, many cases. Just like if you've read the 1984 novel, that's basically what North Korea is like. It is a police state with emperor worship. And it's it is the number one most persecuted nation for Christians in the world. This has been several straight years running.

Horrific suffering for believers there and a dark, dark place. In fact, Most of you have seen, or many of you have seen, the satellite image of North Korea. And you see South Korea immediately below it, and it's a nighttime image, and of course, all the lights on in North Korea, it's dark. It's dark. 'Cause the power goes out at night.

And that is a picture, the darkness of that nation, the deception of that nation. And would they do something crazy? Is it possible that they would? They put a lot of money into military. And military games as they've been run or military strategists have looked at North Korea attacking South Korea in recent years and said it doesn't look good for South Korea if that happened.

How do we respond? Do we respond? Do we get involved? I'll give you some perspective when we come back on the line of fire. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr.

Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34 Truth. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Again, my heart.

hurts for North Korea. I've been to Asia. close to fifty times ministering, and been to Korea, is it 13 times to South Korea? Let me check, but I I I think it's been around 13 times. 12 or 13 times that I've ministered there.

Let me just check my list here. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. Yep, 12 times thus far. And Prayed with the Koreans there for the salvation of their northern brethren. And some have had families separated for many decades now.

And I remember one trip there years back. I started going in 1990. And when the the emperor The deity of that country, the ones that the people worship as if God. When he had died, the people were hysterical, mourning and weeping in the streets. And I was talking to Korean Christians, and they said it's just so agonizing to watch that.

It's so agonizing to see the pain that they're in, the deception that they're in. And there have been some efforts to bring unification of the countries, and again, I mean. It's not not just a matter of one one country being democratic and open and the other country being a dictatorship. You're you're talking about people with completely skewed view of the world versus others know what's happening and I mean, barring divine intervention, I've seen no way there could be unification. Again, I'm no expert in it, but.

Would they do something crazy? They sought to launch a missile and showing off their look at all of our power and might, and the thing came crashing down immediately.

Now, of course, to the extent that was known to the people in Korea, if they knew the thing was even happening, it'll get turned around in some kind of momentous victory and some amazing thing that happened. And maybe if there's any report of a missile going down, it was a missile trying to attack North Korea and they took it down. I mean, who knows how they'll spin the thing? But But For sure. Uh they could do something crazy.

It could be. Maybe they think that's what's needed to rally their people, or I don't know. But you you're talking about many, many, many, many, many, many, many innocent people would perish. if there was a war that took place and already many die of starvation. Who knows what would happen in the midst of war?

So all of this must be evaluated carefully. True that America cyber-hacked that missile and we brought it down. There are reports that say so, but I have no inside information on it. All I can say is this It was one thing. Looking at the global issue.

for America to bomb Syria in response to the gas attacks, to send a message but not to go into Syria. And not to say, okay, we are right now sending in troops and we're going to try to take out Assad, etc. That's a big question, it's a big issue, and to just go do it opens up a massive can of many, many worms. and therefore it must be thought through very carefully with long term vision. And in conjunction with the nation of Israel, at other key allies.

But to bomb and then not go in Okay, fine, I could see that. To tell North Korea to send our ships there and say, don't do something stupid. And for China, upon which North Korea depends economically. For China to say don't do something stupid, yes.

sound the warning with the hope that they back down. If they did something crazy, South Korea is an ally, you have to respond, but Boy, you need to pray for North Korea. Maybe this would be a time when God topples the government supernaturally. where there is a coup. And the government is overthrown.

Yeah, if the guy got saved, the leader of Korea got born again and repented of his sin, that would be a dream scenario, beyond a dream scenario. But otherwise, otherwise, let there be a coup, let there be an overthrow of the government. Look, it happened with Stalin. It happened with Stalin. That he was about to carry out his murderous plot against Jewish doctors and inflict all kinds of pain.

destruction, and then he drops dead. And it was around the time of Purim, and many Jews look at that as something that God did in judgment on him. We know what happened in the book of Esther.

So let us pray for North Korea. All right, I want to give a book away. First, I'll give you the number 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. Call number 10. The book that I co-authored with Pastor John Kilpatrick and editor Larry Sparks, The Fire That Never Sleeps.

Keys for sustaining personal revival. This book will ignite a fire in your heart. This book will stir you. It'll give you a picture of what real revival and visitation are, not just some revival service, but God coming and visiting. It'll put a hunger in you to seek God for more in your own life or your church community.

I was thrilled by the endorsements for the book, thrilled to see how it's impacted readers who've read the book, crying, well, here I'm pitching the book to you, but we're going to give it away. All right. So here's a number to call: 866-348-7884. Caller number 10. Column number 10.

Free copy of The Fire That Never Sleeps.

Okay. One more larger comment about the administration. One more larger comment about the direction of the Trump administration. There are those who voted for Donald Trump, and when he said America first. what it it seemed to to mean was America only.

When he said, I'm going to be the president of America, not the president of the whole world, people rejoiced in that.

Now, when he said America first, When he said America first, what I took that to mean was, like he said in his inaugural speech, we have to put our own interests first. That makes sense. Uh the President of Italy, right? Mm What's he stand for? Italy.

The prime minister of Italy or Germany or Nigeria or Mexico, whatever the national leader is, prime minister of Canada. What's their first interest, their own country? Prime Minister Netanyahu in Israel, what's the first interest? Their own country. Of course.

Absolutely. Naturally. How could you not do that? When you work a job and you come home from your job, you get paid at the end of the week, you come home from your job. Whose bills do you pay first?

Your families? You pay your mortgage, you pay your rent, you pay groceries, you do what you do. You don't pay the mortgage of your neighbor a block away. You don't pay the groceries of someone living across the country because your first responsibility is to your family. That's not selfish, that's just being responsible, right?

So to me. I I'm I'm all for it. America first. Yes. We need to make sure our economy is healthy.

We need to make sure our infrastructure is healthy. We need to make sure that we're secure. We have secure borders. We we need to fight against crime in our own country. We we need to deal with drug trafficking and human trafficking in our country.

We we yeah, America first, right. Yeah, of course. And and we do have a winner. Thank you. Thank you for everyone calling.

We do have a winner. So yes, of course. But that's not America only. I never took that to mean America only. You have some folks who have been ardent Trump supporters and some who saw his potential way before I did, people like Ann Coulter.

And they're basically saying, hey, we want the President of the United States again. I don't understand why he can't be the President of the United States. But yet America is an international player. Isn't America needed in the world? Doesn't Israel, naturally speaking, Doesn't Israel need America as an ally?

Don't other countries need America as an ally? Isn't America's presence a deterrent? to some groups rising and growing. Don't we have that role and responsibility in the world? Yeah, I believe we do.

So I'm all for America first. I'm not for America only. I'm all for America first because a healthy America is in the best interest of the world. Here. I I I spot it this uh headline Earlier today And just sent to me again.

There were twenty eight people shot. In Chicago, in an 18-hour period. Period. Twenty Eight people shot. Only one, twenty three years old, was killed.

So one fatality, 27 wounded. Of those wounded, three were teenagers, 14, 15, and 17. We need to to look at that. and say what can we do as a nation? to help the city of Chicago.

And what must the city of Chicago do? I mean, how can the church be involved? To bring about positive change there, what's the real problem? Is it guns? Is is is it Is it lack of guns?

I mean, some would say there's so much gun control, there's no self-defense. Others say, you crazy? It's all guns. Is it. Not really guns, is it more breakdown of the family?

Is it the welfare state that's been put on people that have grown up in it? It's something else. It's an education system. These are things to look at. This is a sign of tremendous unhealth.

In our nation. What can we do as a nation? to see positive change come. Yeah, America first. Let's address the problems in Chicago and the problems in the inner city and the problems in our education system and problems of inequality and things like that.

Let's address them. but let's not forget the rest of the world. It's America first. Not America only. We'll be right back.

It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Be sure to check out my latest articles.

Tell you what, Howard. Let's take one more. Give folks one more opportunity to get a free book, The Fire That Never Sleeps. Great book: Keys to Igniting Personal Revival, Sustaining Personal Revival. John Kilpatrick, Larry Sparks, and yours truly.

Call number eight, 866-348-7884-866-34TRUTH. Call number eight, you get a free copy of this stirring book sent out to you. I've written a few articles in the last few days, one asking the question: why don't we care? about Christians' suffering. There's so many issues that Come to our attention.

There's a bombing at an airport overseas, and we talk about that day in, day out. We watch the footage, terrorist bombing overseas. But if it's a church, it doesn't seem to capture our attention.

So I wrote about that, and then I wrote about for progressives and liberals and leftists and LGBT allies. Is this what you mean by equality? Is this? What you mean by equality, there's a 15-year-old boy who now identifies as a girl. He hasn't done anything yet hormonally to alter who he is.

Obviously, he hasn't had sex change surgery. He just ran in a track meet with other girls and crushed them. He's way, way, way ahead of the other girls. And this is being celebrated.

So I wonder if this is what equality. means This fair to the other girls is one thing to say, hey, this boy now identifies as a girl. It's between him and God and his family and school. It's another thing to allow him to compete with girls.

So I wrote about that and then Uh I I I saw a disturbing image that someone sent me via Twitter. I saw a disturbing image. And it was uh it was an image of A alt-right. An alt-right. a Trump supporter.

So, more racist-oriented, hyper-nationalistic. And by the way, you get. You get extremists on all sides. You get extreme supporters of Hillary, extreme supporters of Trump. and they both find something in the message and the person they can identify with.

But to find out who the people are, you can't just look at the supporters. You have to look at the messages of the people themselves. But there has been this right-wing extremist, white supremacist type of follower of Trump. And it was an anti-Semitic picture. It was mocking Gentiles, and it had a picture of the cross as if somehow this had to do with the gospel.

Remember, the KKK claimed to be Christian, right?

So I wrote an article. on five reasons why I categorically reject the alt-right version of Jesus.

So let me let me share those with you, but again, read all my latest articles by going to thelineoffire.org. Number one. Jesus was a reconciler. Not a racist. Jesus was a reconciler not a racist.

No, he never crossed moral lines, but he certainly crossed traditional boundary lines. I mean, he associated with Samaritans, he included women in his larger team. When it came to racial divisions, while his mission began with Israel, He reached out to Gentiles and pointed to the day when they too would participate. in his kingdom. And he calls this very diverse worldwide body to unity.

Michael Knowles wrote in the Daily Wire, sorry, we do have a winner. I should have told you. We do have a winner. Thank you. Uh Ah.

You won't believe what this college is teaching on YouTube. Will be up on our digital library soon. All right, check back. Once a day at least. On our digital library on thelineofire.org for latest articles and videos.

And then sign up for our newsletter. Every Friday, we'll send you: here's a list of and a synopsis, all my articles for the week, all my videos. It can be sometimes five Eight different items in a week.

So, this way you won't miss anything. All right. And then other things we'll alert you to via newsletter.

So do that at thelineoffire.org. But Michael Knowles pointed out on the Daily Wire: racism is not a fringe element of the alt-right, it's the movement's central premise. Jesus. was a reconciler not a racist. Number two, he was a servant, not a supremacist.

Yes, it's true that He's Lord. Yes, it's true that all authority in heaven and earth belongs to Him. Yes, that's true. But how do they win the world? By serving.

He got low, he went the way of the cross. For him, conquest comes by way of the cross. He was a servant, not. A supremacist. Number three While not a racist, Jesus was king of the Jews, not part of the KKK.

Michael Knowles says the alt-right is, quote, explicitly anti-Semitic. And there's an interesting article in the foreword by Sam Kestenbaum. This is a liberal Jewish publication. He noted that alt-right leader Richard Spencer, quote, isn't the first white supremacist to hold seemingly contradictory views on the Jews. Earlier white supremacists, like the Ku Klux Klan, had a similar love-hate relationship.

Spencer and his cohort are building on these foundations.

So here's a track, 1926 track from the KKK. uh on religious and patriotic ideals. It praised Jews. This is a minister. wrote this as a wonderful people.

particularly the way in which they have maintained the purity of their racial blood, refusing to intermarry with other races. The minister of Texas named W.C. Wright called Jesus Christ a Klansman because he belonged to the oldest clan in existence, the Jewish theocracy. But then he said that that Jesus promoted the type of Jewish supremacy. Just as the KKK fought for white supremacy.

Jews have been clannish. Since the days of Abraham.

So we whites, we should be clannish also. Jesus was a Jewish supremacist. We should be white supremacists. I mean, this is the twisted logic of the KKK and some of the alt-right. Number four, while a devoted member of the people of Israel, Jesus was not...

A hypernationalist, so contrary to what the KKK said. His great emphasis was on the coming Messianic kingdom. which, as he stated, was not of or from this world. Accordingly, his followers who live in this world do so as foreigners and exiles. 1 Peter 2:11.

Praying for the well-being of our respective countries and serving as loyal citizens while also recognizing the imperfections and failings of our respective countries. And then five, Jesus did not equate military might with strength.

Now I don't believe that he is against armies. I don't believe it's against self-defense. But the gospel does not advance by intimidation. The gospel does not advance by might. The gospel does not advance by way of the cross.

So I'll get into that in my latest article. And um speaking of Jewish community. I was going to mention some of these testimonies, but this was sent to me. From Uh Victoria in Canada About 12 or 15 Jewish young people, some from Israel and Europe, have been working at various kiosks at the Mayfair Mall here in Victoria. frequently find Israelis working at kiosks.

Our healing team minister in the same mall. In other words, they go to people and ask if they'd like prayer for healing. Last Saturday, one of the team members and I approached one of the Jewish young men asking to bless him in the name of the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. He replied, Yes. Immediately the power of God overcame him.

He couldn't speak, and began weeping. For the next 30 minutes, he was wrecked, meaning weeping and overcome. He couldn't function. We couldn't communicate with him. He was so overwhelmed.

When he recovered somewhat, he was able to phone his boss and, amid sobs, told his boss, please, I'm not capable of working right now. Could someone come in and replace me? The boss asked him, What happened? He said, I don't know, but some Christians came and prayed for me, and I'm overwhelmed and I can't stop weeping. And it feels like electricity or something that's going through my limbs and torso.

I'm completely not functional. I can't stand up. And of course, they went back. reach out and follow up with the gospel. Hey.

God's touching lives. He is right now.
Whisper: parakeet / 2025-07-05 06:00:20 / 2025-07-05 06:02:40 / 2

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