Kingdom Pursuits, where you hear from ordinary people instilled with an extraordinary passion. Together we explore the stories of men and women who take what they love and let God turn their passion into Kingdom Pursuits.
Now, live from the Truth Booth, your host, Robbie Dilmore.
Well, happy 5th of July/slash 4th of July weekend to all of you as you're out there enjoying. Hopefully plans for a neat picnic or celebration of independence, whatever that may look like for you this weekend. I know I'm looking forward to getting out on the lake and those kind of things with my family as well. And so I appreciate you tuning in for us today because we are really got a special guest with us. We have Dawn Saunders.
She's the author of When Your World Ends and God's Creative Process for Rebuilding Life Begins.
So Dawn, welcome to Kingdom Pursuits. Thank you. It is a joy to be here this morning. Yes. Just based on the title.
I'm guessing um There was a test to get your testimony. Yes, sir, there most certainly was a testimony. It is. The book was born out of my own personal earthquake. The sudden loss of my husband.
Mm-hmm. And apparently that this yesterday was like the tenth anniversary of your blog, did you say? Yes, yesterday, July 4th, was the 10th anniversary. of me first writing on the blog. And so how did the blog figure into the equation?
Wow, that's a good question.
So, as I was on my healing journey, Um I felt God asking me to write, which He had told me I was going to write earlier. before I even met my husband.
Well let's go let's go back there a minute since we have time.
So tell us how that came about that you felt God saying you're going to write. Didn't I? Oh, wow.
Well, that came about watching Joyce Meyer. Preach one day. Yeah, I was listening to Joyce Meyer as I got dressed to go to work one day. I'm a trained software test engineer and data scientist. And I was getting ready to go to my IT job, but as a good Christian listening, you know.
to some Christian uh speak and that and I was and it was Joyce Meyer and I just sensed in my spirit You can do this. You can write and speak and not only can you You will. Wow. Yeah. And And You noted it.
You didn't just hear it. You know, you noted it. Yeah, oh, I love it. I love it because it was something you remembered, which is often, you know, how that voice not only it speaks and we hear it, but we hear a lot of things through a day. Yeah.
So many, I wouldn't begin to tell you, but that one came through loud and clear. And did you write that in some type of journal that day, or how did you note it? No, it was just this mental thing and it kept repeating. and not just with her. Um Priscilla Schreier came to my church and she preached and Um Her style of preaching in particular resonated with me.
She's a deep expository preacher. Um and I have an expository bent in me, and I didn't know it until I hurt her. And when I heard her, it was, yeah, you're going to do this. And I didn't even know. A lot about myself when it came to my gifts.
Like, I didn't know my spiritual gift was teaching. Uh but that later came and and that's where m The expository side of me comes from is a desire to Um Teach, to share.
Well, you know, it's really, really amazing, and maybe you know this, but I just delight in it so that in Hebrew, the letter Lamed or Lamed, some people would pronounce it, but that letter. Uh it begins the word both teach and learn. And it's also one of the main letters in the word heart. And so when you when you think about it, You had a heart. To learn.
Well, when you learn something, and I know I'm this way myself, you're so excited about what you learned, you can't help but teach it. Yes, that's exactly how I am. And I learn most things with the premise that I might teach it. Right. Right, right, right.
And interestingly, God allows that understanding to my You know, so that it can light that spirit in you so that you can't help but just go, oh man, you know what I found out? And it's so cool. And Robbie, the other is the opposite is true too. When I find out that somebody knew something for a long time and didn't share it. I'm like What?
Why why did you say something? Yeah. Yeah, that my wife's like that. She brings those kind of things to my attention all the time. But anyway, so getting back to our story, which is just fascinating to me, is that that Mm-hmm.
So you knew this ahead of time, but now all of a sudden, here comes this moment. Where your life Just And God says To start this blog, which is definitely a whole different thing, isn't it? Yeah. Picture a blog. That was many years ago when I saw Joyce Meyer Speaking.
In fact, I'm not even sure if blogs were a thing. I'm dating myself. By the way, do you know what year you heard Joyce Minor speaking? I want to say it was in the late nineties. And I heard this.
Yeah. And um And so I tucked it away in my heart and just went on about my business going, okay, at some point. Because I was loving what I was doing at that time. And so I didn't have this. desire to shift.
But as I learned more about my gifts and more about what God was calling me to do as a Christian and just me personally with my specific purpose. Then it became more of a, okay, I need to do these things. And It started with teaching in my church. I would teach classes in my church and No. skills grow and everything and still not writing.
Okay. communicating through speaking and teaching classes. Um but not writing. And then when my husband died, It really was. Um My whole world turned upside down.
And so when I came back to it, I didn't come back immediately. to teaching. In a classroom, let's go there for a minute about your husband. How long were you all married? We were only married two years.
And we met late in life, so we knew what we had. We had had a few what I call unproductive relationships prior to meeting it, but then when we met and And just knew that this was what it should. Right, right. It was a real deep connection, the love your life kind of thing. Mm-hmm.
And that's beautiful. Mm-hmm. Even though you'd only been married a couple of years, how long did you know each other before you got married?
Well Um we knew each other I want to say maybe about four years, but The first couple of years we I was seeing someone else. And as the story goes, and when I say as the story goes, as my husband told the story. He saw me one day walk into church. And I crossed the lobby in front of him and God spoke to him and told him that I was going to be his wife. And so my husband, being the kind of guy he was, instead of approaching me, he did a little investigation.
And found out that I was seeing someone else and went back to God and said, Yeah, I don't. You sure her she's with someone else? And he waited. Because he said, you know, Lord, either you're going to separate her from this other gentleman.
so that, you know, my husband could pursue me or he was going to show him someone else. And so he waited to see what God did. And when God separated me from this other guy, He approached me and I wasn't ready yet because I was like, wait a minute, I just came out of this. It actually led to an engagement. Um so I just had this broken engagement and I'm not looking for anything right now.
And my husband had been taught to. Yeah. Tell people, you know. Right, what his intentions were.
Well, hey, that music that you might hear in the background means we got to go to a break, Dawn. And so we're going to be back in a minute. Of course, I've got to play shenanigans, which you're not that familiar with. We're going to play that as soon as we get back on the 4th of July idea and a lot more. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com.
Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion and uses it to build the kingdom.
So fun today we have with us Dawn Saunders, she's the author of When Your World Ends in God's Creative Process, or I shouldn't say When, because it's not in there, it's just When Your World Ends in God's Creative Process for Rebuilding a Life. And of course you can get that from Amazon when your world ends, God's created process for rebuilding a life. Or Dawn has her own website and blog, as we talked about. What's the website address for that, Dawn? It's Dawn Mann Sanders, D-A-W-N, M-A-N-N-S-A-N-D-E-R-S dot com.
All right, and that also helps me not mispronounce your name. It's Sanders.
Okay. Anyway, it is the 4th of July, and I told you we were gonna have to Play some shenanigans. We just love to do it, by the way. And so, speaking of the fourth. Yeah.
I'm a fun thing. Yes, it is. Science plays shenanigans.
Alright. Yes, it's time. And so we have some 4th of July humor for you. And again, we'll get a chance if you want Dawn to jump in here. If you think you know any of the answers, just jump on in, okay?
Except the last one, which is for the listeners.
Okay. So with that said... Why aren't there any Independence Day knock knock jokes? What do you think, Nick, Randy, those my producers, Dawn? Anybody know why there aren't any Independence Day knock knock jokes?
Uh Ooh. This will warm you up. Yeah. I don't know. You got it, Randy?
You do not have this.
Okay, it's because freedom rings. Yeah. There you go. And how about this one? What's the most.
Popular dance, what was the most impopular dance in 1776? The most popular dance in 1776. Especially on the 4th of July. It was very, very popular that day. I like you to think of as Dance, Dance, Revolution.
It's like that. Independ dance. Independence. There you go. This happens to be my personal favorite of the jokes.
Well, and I'm dying if anybody can get this, if you've got a little artistic bent to you.
So, what do you call an American who is drawing? What do you call an American Drying. Yeah. Ah mm mm. What do you think?
Dawn, you got any ideas? This American drawing?
Well, when you actually see the drawing, it's referred to as an Yankee doodle. But if, you know, it's a Yankee doodler if it's the person doing it. As a northerner, that's really funny. And of course, one for the little guys out there. We have one last one for the little guys.
What do you get when you cross a dinosaur with fireworks? I'm kind of spark. Oh, it does. It does that. That's involved.
It's a piggyback off Donna Sparkosaurus Rex. A Sparkosaurus Rex. I like that. And I'm trying to remember. I think it was called Good Times, where he would say Dino Might.
Right? I think that was it. There's Dyno Might. There you go. So, yeah, okay.
You knew at the end of those shenanigans we would actually have a riddle you can call in and win today. And you might guess it's along these same lines.
So here you go. You can call in and win. If you can tell us, where did freedom ring in the tabernacle? Or? In the temple.
Both places it rang. Where did freedom ring in the tabernacle or the temple? And I'll give you a hint. I don't often do this with my riddles. But again, don't jump in on this one, Dawn, because people got to call in when.
Here's your hint. There were bells involved.
So, where did freedom ring in the temple or the tabernacle? There were bells involved.
If you know that, Nick, tell them what they're win. Absolutely, yes, you'll be winning a prize from our Kingdom Pursuits Prize Valley, where we have so much truth merch and so many truth merches, truth shirts, and books. And oh yeah, the official Kingdom Pursuits. Gospel Backscratcher is still available. We just got a new supply.
Awesome. Right. They're sitting on my dining room table. I got to bring them in. But anyway, whether it's a book, we have lots of books.
We have amazing books. And maybe Dawn will send us one of her books that we can send you. Again, you just got to tell us where did freedom ring in the Tabor slack, the Tabernacle or the Temple, 866-348-7884. 866-348-7884. Maybe you got a question for Dawn.
And by the way, there were bells involved in this. I will say that's how come you could hear it ringing in the temple or the tabernacle. How fun. I'll look forward to who can answer that.
So getting back to Dawn and your story, as we're talking about her book, When Your World Ends. Right, and God's creative process for rebuilding your life, so clearly. to a great extent, your husband became your world. He did. We really became one.
And I like to tell people that, you know, after two years, it's kind of like raising a kid, right? The the hard part, we were starting to Not so much go into the terrible twos, but we're starting to kind of smooth it all out. I've never heard that, but that's second-year America, the terrible twos. I love it. Go ahead.
I just had to point out that's a really great observation. Yeah, I remember the first argument. And we didn't really have arguments, right? When we were courting, and so we had, I guess, what my husband considered an argument. And I was like, no, baby, this is not an argument because we were because we settled it, right?
To me. Arguments go on and on and on. This was just, you know, as my pastor says, intense fellowship. That's what that was. Really, not an argument.
I like that. Intense fellowship. I'll have to use that on one of my wife. We're having intense fellowship right now.
Okay. That's Yeah. Yeah, and so You're in this season. And what happened?
Well, he was out jogging, which he had at this point in time been doing for over a year. But it happened to be lunchtime on the hottest day of the year up until that point. And, um, He had a massive heart attack and the doctors told me that it was very likely he was gone before he hit the ground.
So it wasn't a long time. period of time for you to get the idea that this was coming. It happened that day like a lightning strike. Yeah, and when you say not a long time. My husband called me, as he would do most days, right before he went out for lunch.
And during this conversation, He said to me, till death do us part.
So I fully believe that my husband had no intention of leaving. I actually see it as a gift God gave me to let me know that it was 100% his decision. And not my husband's. Wow. You know, I heard a story this week which seems appropriately timed to tell this.
I was interviewing a Jewish rabbi in Jerusalem a new podcast we're doing called the Reverend and the Rabbi. Uh-huh. And We we were talking about of the providence of God. Similar to what you're describing. And he said, Well, there's this story.
He said, This is a true story. And he named the rabbi that that that the guy enlisted in, but uh we'll get to that in a second.
So there was a man, a Jewish man, he was riding the mountain roads in Colorado.
Okay. And As you imagine, you could go pretty fast down those hills. And it was a very narrow road, and there was a wall face on the left side, and a cliff on the right, and as he came round a corner, all of a sudden bearing down on him in way too short a time to do anything as an eighteen wheel truck. And he prays. Like, God, if you'll save me from this, I'm going to, my life is yours.
And miraculously, somehow or another, he slides the bike up underneath the truck, and he's injured, but not. horribly, but he's out of the hospital in a few days. And he flies to Israel and enlists in the like most prestigious Jewish academy he can find under the most prestigious uh rabbi and This rabbi meets with him, he tells the rabbi the story. And the rabbi says, Well, to be fair to you before you just, you know. Go a whole hog into this thing, which I think you should, and I'm really glad and honored that you want to.
He said, but you need to know. That the god Who saved your life? It's the same God who sent the eight whe eighteen wheeler. Wow. Yeah, and that's um actually speaks to something I feel.
I believe that um Brokenness. Is it the opposite of purpose? It's the starting point. for your next assignment. Beautiful.
Yeah, isn't it? Because Obviously, as we take up our cross, it it it requires death. Yeah, and not just death. Same. It requires ache.
confusion. Silence.
Well well said. Very well said. I agree. And clearly I can't even imagine being on the other end of the phone call you got. shortly after your husband's jog, right?
Yeah, um It was the kind of loss that splits your soul. He said we were soulmates, so yeah, it split my soul. Wow. Wow, I hate that music's playing again, but... It means we get to go to another break and you can collect your thoughts, and we'll all collect ours again.
The book, which I'm sure you want to know how God's created a process for rebuilding your life, I do. And so it is When Your Life Ends by Dawn. Sanders, Don Sanders, and uh We're going to do a lot more with her. Repeat the blog site. We'll be right back.
You're listening to The Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion. and use this to build the kingdom to Today we're so blessed to have somebody with all kinds of passions. Dawn Sanders. She's the author of When Your World Ends.
God's creative process for building a life. And as we talk about it, she had a passion for teaching, a passion for learning, a passion for writing. And what an opportunity we have to share with her today. Dawn, go ahead and repeat the name of your blog again for people. Oh, my website is Don Mann Sanders, Don D-A-W-N, Mann, M-A-N-N, Sanders, S-A-N, D-E-R-S.
and they can access the blog from there. Yes, and you Tell Joni, my friend, and your publicist, not to put a U in your name. I didn't realize she was doing that. I will. I wrote it out.
I'm like, I usually pronounce that Saunders, but it's Sanders. But I'm I think it's so wonderful. She is a great friend and I am shocked if you're listening. I'm shocked that no one has called in. I thought this was a pretty easy riddle.
But I would love for you to call and tell us, where did freedom ring in the, since we're talking about the 4th of July, always. When, where did freedom ring in the tabernacle or the temple? I even gave you a hint there were bells involved. 866-348-7884 is the number to call in and share. 8663487884.
Again, getting back to Dawn's story. Here comes the phone call. And you had not started your blog prior to that, but now, how long after? Um The loss of your husband, did you begin to write? Yeah.
about a month over four years. Wow, so it sat there for four years. Um Well, it's sat inside of me, I guess. Right. Or four more years, yeah.
You know I said it, it split my soul. And Our souls, our spirits, that's how we connect with God. And so I had to rebuild. My relationship with God. before I could write.
about it. Or at least I think people should. Yeah. And I felt like I needed to before I could write about it. Uh You know, the Bible says, work out your faith with fear and trembling.
And I before this happened read that passage and was like, yeah, okay. I really understood what that meant. after my husband died because I was working it out with fear. and trembling. I was so angry.
at God that I was afraid I had lost my faith or maybe I hadn't even had it. But I was angry with the God I still believed in. That was the thing. I never stopped believing. I would guess.
I just felt betrayed. I felt teased because we were together for such a short time. Like I said, we had these unproductive relationships.
Now we had this thing that we knew was a gift. In fact, my husband introduced me to people as his gift from God. Wow. And so we valued our relationship. and for it to be ripped from me.
with no warning. And it followed a series of miscarriages. Oh, wow.
And so when my husband died, I didn't just feel like I. lost him. I lost, I felt like I lost my family. I was A couple of months shy of 43 years old. And so I felt as though.
I was betrayed on many levels because I had actually, before I met my husband, given up on the thought of possibly having a family of my own body. And had come to terms with that. But then I met this man who. Minister to the youth. and very much wanted to have t children.
And I wanted to have children. I was just I had just blind myself to the fact that God might not give them to me. And it started to pause you right there, but you're doing so wonderful that It's just a great Place to segue.
So we're going to leave that there because you can see the obviously this came from a place of great pain. Yeah. Okay. And like you had pointed out, God does some great work in that.
So we're going to find out about that in a minute. But in the meantime, we're going to find out about these ringing. But so we have two callers.
So if I got William. And Angela.
Okay. But I would ask that both of you stay on the line, even if one of them has the right answer, because I want to talk to you both, please. And so we're going to go with the first one to call in, which was Angelo Enrichment.
So I is it Angelo or Angela? It's Angelo. All right. I apologize that my producer got it right, and I'm. Missed it.
So, Angelo, I'm so glad you called today. Are you having a great weekend? Have a wonderful weekend. Blessed in the Lord. Had a great independence day.
Really enjoying your guests here today. I'm just Alright, um celebrate. I'm just yeah, there's a lot going on right now in my car.
Okay, good.
So where did freedom ring in the tabernacle?
So freedom rang in the tabernacle of the temple at the bottom of the road. Uh the house week. Ha ha ha ha. Isn't that cool? Ha ha ha.
I love it. I love it. You are exactly right. And so we want to send stuff out. But how does that speak to your.
Patriotism.
Well, I'll tell you the the thing that I will say that the the bells on the on the bottom of the Cabernacle it was a pomegranate and a bell. You know, the pomegranate represented the fruit of the spirit, and the bell represents The the gift of the series.
So I'm really, what's been ringing in my spirit, you know, is really where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. And it speaks really to what the Holy Spirit. That's giving me freedom and giving me liberty and giving me deliverance today.
So that's how I celebrate Independence Day. I think about that, but really just thinking about all that the Holy Spirit that God has given me through Jesus Christ, through the sacrifice that He made for us at Calvary. and the Holy Spirit being gifted to us. And now we have both the gifts and the fruit of the spirit. He rings in my soul each and every single day when he just means it.
That's how Angelo, you should be a preacher, man. I mean, that's. That's really, really good. I would add one other little detail since you mentioned the pomegranates, which I do dearly love. And my assistant over here, Randy Everson, will tell you that Robbie tries to eat.
Pomegranate every day because it's one of the seven foods of the promised land. But there's also a neat thing about pomegranates, you know, they have 613 seeds. Did you know that? Really? Yeah.
I just oh, that's that's the number of the law. That's number of the number of laws. You're exactly right. It's the number of the mitzvahs. It's the number of what the Jews write out is the law, but it definitely is representative of The law or the giving of God's word, right?
And so, in its own little way down there, the Bible is ringing. The Old Testament and the New Testament is ringing as well. You know, it's kind of like, oh. Wow. That's so cool, Angela.
That's a great piece right there. I'll take that. I'll put that in my toolbox. Oh, me too. Me too.
I'm so grateful for your call today, Angela. You have an amazing weekend, okay? God bless. You do and God bless you, darling. Bye-bye.
Thank you. Okay, we got William. Thomas is in Ohio. You still with me, William? I am, yes, sir.
So, William, what say you? What was the ringing in the temple from your perspective? See, I hope I was gonna say the Holy of Holies. Um You know, I was under the impression that there was a time where each once each year, you know, when the high priest would go into the Holy of Holies, that they would have a rope and maybe some sort of bell attached to them. As in just in case they were struck down, and maybe I got stories mixed up, but I don't know.
You're exactly right. There there was a rope. And those bells, if they didn't hear jing-a-ling-a-ling, it was crispy critter time. And it sounded like it was like, you know, whoever went in there shouldn't have gone. As some of the stories in the Old Testament, I don't mean to make light of that in way, shape, or form, but you're exactly right, William.
There was a rope involved.
Okay. I thought so. I thought so, but I wasn't sure. Yeah, and I can't imagine how many people they had out there listening for the bells. But, you know, that.
That was how reverent that time was. And so you speak very well to the fact that freedom comes at a very, very high cost. Right. Indeed. As Angela is, excuse me, as Dawn is pointing out.
Well, we got to go to a break. William, thank you so much for your calling. You're a winner, too.
So we're going to get you out the prize of your choice, and they'll get that from you in just a second. You're listening to the Truth Network and TruthNetwork.com. Welcome back to Kingdom Pursuits, where we hear how God takes your passion. and uses it to build the kingdom.
So wonderfully today we have Don Sanders with us. She is the author of When Your World. ends. God's creative process for rebuilding your life. And what an amazing story she has.
And if we're. Experience the pain through three sigmas. We're hopefully going to get in this last one to. A little bit of how the light started to come on for you through your blog and at some point in time you're commissioning to write the book. Yeah, so I was wondering, is that a question for me?
Yes, it is. Excuse me. And so, yeah. I started writing the blog. And Right around COVID.
I got the idea for the book. I was studying and I thought it was just for me. I was studying Genesis 1. And I had some time on my hands. Y'all might remember that.
I had some time to really dig deep into the passage. And for those who um don't know off the top of their heads. The first two verses of the Bible begin In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth, and the earth was without form, it was void, and darkness was over the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. And that description of the Earth's Freeform state. resonated with me.
and how I felt in the days following my miscarriages and the death of my husband. And I immediately made the connection between the creation story in Genesis 1 and our stories as more than God creating our environments. I saw that at the end of that chapter That God had created the first two lives, male and female, and He had blessed them to be fruitful, He had given them dominion, and He had placed them in. Mm. a position of rest.
And I was like, God, how can I get more of the end of this story? Than the beginning of this story. And he told me to dig deeper. And when I dug deeper, I found a seven-step process. that we can follow for rebuilding our lives.
Wow. And that secret's in the book. Yeah. It's a blueprint, a strategy that we can follow. And that's one of the reasons why I felt led to write the book.
When I was going through my journey, I found several really good books on grief. and grieving. And one in particular was written by Carol Kent. called a new kind of normal. But the last step was to have an action plan.
And I thought, that's really great. How do I do that? And so that's why I wrote my book. that I felt like the first Steps in Carol's book. In fact, even that last step was a great step, but I felt a loss at how to create.
that action plan. And mind books. I believe bridges that by giving you the seven-step process for creating an action plan.
Well, unfortunately, we just have a couple of minutes left. And so I know for sure you need to tell people once again how to get your book, but also to kind of have your final word there. Yeah, they can find my book at DonMansanders.com. Actually, that's my website. They can find my book anywhere books are sold.
They can find it at Amazon, but if that's not their shopping place of choice. It's also at Walmart.com, Target.com, Barnes and Noble.com, all of the places that books are usually sold. Right. And it's it's Dawn Sanders S-A-N-D-E-R-S. And it's When Your World Ends, God creatives a process for rebuilding your life.
And so now your last word.
Well then that's your story isn't over. Like I said, the brokenness isn't the opposite of purpose. It's the starting point for your next assignment.
So the ache, the confusion, the silence. They're not signs of failure or the end. They're invitations. invitations into a deeper partnership with God. where he doesn't just restore you.
He reimagines you. And as he s it says It's greater than we can ever imagine or think. Yeah, it's absolutely beautiful. And aligns beautifully with the scripture.
So I would imagine the seven steps are going to align beautifully as well. And it's so exciting how God's working in your life. of you know, beginning that process. That now obviously you're speaking and you're writing. And so he's he's reimagining as as he often does.
With the Meek. And sometimes in order for us to be meek. Yeah. We have to go through some tumbling and some turning and falling of the seed, as John would say. It's got to fall as John as Jesus as John quoted Jesus that the seed's got to fall into the earth and then it starts to take root and grow again, right?
And Yeah, that's it. it it's it's it's a marvelous thing and and it's really, really But what you say is God's creative process for build Not our creative process for rebuilding your life, but God's creative process for rebuilding your life. Dawn, it's been so much fun to have you on today. God bless you. Thank you.
It's been fun to be here. Oh, really, really? And so now we got to thank you for staying with us here on the 4th of July and invite you to stay tuned because, oh my goodness, Encouraging Prayer with James Banks is coming up. And he's got a wonderful process that he wants to describe in prayer for you in the next segment. It's going to happen in just a moment.
Followed by the Mike's Wake Show, which they're going to be excited by. And then Nikita Koloff with its time to man up the Russian nightmare. It's all coming to you. The truth on the Truth Network. Stay tuned.
God bless.
