Time to Humanize the Abortion Debate?

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network Podcast today.

Welcome to the Line of Fire. If you'd like to weigh in on today's subject, not taking random Bible questions, if you'd like to weigh in on today's subject, which we'll unpack for you in a moment, the number to call 866-344-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. I would especially love to hear from women in particular who were involved in abortions in your past. I know this can be difficult to talk about, but often your experience is so life-giving for many and so important to hear.

866-344-TRUTH. We want to, as the week goes on, talk through some of the political landscape today, not to get politicized, but to get a kingdom perspective on what's happening in this world. I want to give you some cultural updates of great interest as well, some really interesting things going on in the Jewish world.

A whole lot coming your way. Thanks for starting the week together here on the Line of Fire. So look, friends, many of you were in church on Sunday or through the week, Bible study, things like that, and you're hearing good Bible teaching, good Bible teaching, which is wonderful. And they're probably on the stations where you're listening or on the podcast network. There are plenty of other good Bible teaching stations and shows. Wonderful!

Look all that in. It's part of my life. I pour into ministry school students and teach and work on commentaries.

These are things I do day and night. But I'm here on the radio, friends, not just as a Bible teacher, but I'm here on the radio to help equip you to stand in the world in which we live, to help you to sort through the difficult issues, whether you're a pastor preaching to 10,000 people, whether you're a homeschooling mom, whether you're a 16-year-old young person in school. Whoever you are, I'm here to stand with you and help equip you to stand strong, to be a voice bringing clarity into a very muddled, difficult situation in a world that is deeply confused and in a society that is deeply polarized. So, when it comes to the issue of abortion, do we need to humanize the issue? Should we keep demonizing the issue, as some would say it? And I'm going to give you some comments on both sides of this.

I solicited them on our Facebook page, so I'm going to give you comments on both sides of this shortly. But we want to talk this through in a practical and pragmatic way because human lives are at stake. Now, presidential candidate Nikki Haley was on an interview recently on Fox and Friends, reiterated her answer. This is what she had to say during the first GOP presidential debate in terms of her position on abortion.

I am unapologetically pro-life, not because the Republican Party tells me to be, but because my husband was adopted and I had trouble having both of my children, so I'm surrounded by blessings. Having said that, we need to stop demonizing this issue. This is talking about the fact that unelected justices didn't need to decide something this personal because it's personal for every woman and man. Now it's been put in the hands of the people.

That's great. When it comes to a federal ban, let's be honest with the American people and say it will take 60 Senate votes. It will take a majority of the House. So, in order to do that, let's find consensus. Can't we all agree that we should ban late-term abortions? Can't we all agree that we should encourage adoptions? Can't we all agree that doctors and nurses who don't believe in abortion shouldn't have to perform them? Can't we all agree that contraception should be available? And can't we all agree that we are not going to put a woman in jail or give her the death penalty if she gets an abortion? Let's treat this like the like a respectful issue that it is and humanize the situation and stop demonizing the situation. All right. So, how do you feel about that?

866-34-TRUTH. How do you react to her comments whether you're pro-life or not, especially if you have some experience in your own background, family member, yourself, someone close to having to do with abortion? On the one hand, what if we use the same argument, say, for the slave trade? Well, we need to humanize the slave trade. We need to realize that it's a complex issue, that many people's livelihoods depend on the slave trade, and that the slaves help our larger society, and so on. And so, we need to, we can't just demonize it. I mean, how would we react to that?

Well, we need to humanize Hitler and the Nazis and what they did to the Jews and to others. And, you know, there are different sides and aspects. We know it's wrong, but there are differences.

Well, none of us would put up with that for a split second if we're on our right minds. And many commenting on Facebook said the same thing. Here are just some quotes on our Facebook page where I solicited comments. Cindy, this is like asking if we should consider the feelings of the women who sacrificed their babies to Molech. Larry, no, we should humanize the unborn human rather than calling it a fetus or a blob of cells. This is the dehumanization that needs to stop. Kathy, we can only humanize the idea of someone killing their child if we categorize unborn children as somehow different. If we're talking about murdering toddlers, for example, no one would be discussing humanizing any aspect of the discussion. Teddy, we cannot compromise with evil. Killing a child is always wrong.

Be kind to those who do not know right from wrong, but never give them an inch. That's how we got where we are. Bart, it seems like a bit of an oxymoron to humanize something so inhumane. So, these comments would second what I was saying about you humanize what the Nazis did, you humanize what slave traders did, you humanize what other practitioners of genocide have done.

Obviously, not. On the other hand, not minimizing that reality, but on the other hand, there were different comments posted reflecting different sentiments. Christie said this, when it comes to the subject of abortion, I believe that we need to recognize the humanity of all involved. Humanity of the unborn baby, humanity of the mother making the choice, humanity of the medical practitioner who is prescribing the medication and performing the surgery. It's up to God to change hearts and minds, but it's our responsibility to show truth and love. I'm adamantly pro-life and will do everything in my power to save babies and help their parents, including those who choose adoption. Rick, we should see them as God's creation without the benefit of the Holy Spirit in their lives. If we don't humanize the debate, we will continue to lose the debate through two lives at least impacted by abortion, the baby and the mother, and we must love both in our stance for life. Sondra, I'm pro-life and adopted.

I think she had one of the best, Nikki Haley had one of the best responses that I've heard from a politician. If we stop demonizing each other for our differences, then minds and hearts can be changed. We also have to be real about what a president can actually do without the help of the House and Senate, campaign promises for banning this or any other voting issue normally come up empty, praying for God's mercy over our country and this upcoming election. Alright, so, so, here we go. Let's think this through. On the one hand, abortion itself is evil. Dr. Brown, you have to talk about this.

Yes, yes, of course I have to talk about this. Abortion in itself is evil. Abortion in itself is the slaughter of the unborn. For those of you, this thing, who've had abortions and you've been forgiven by God, but this brings up old wounds and brings pain, turn that pain into intercession for others.

Turn that pain, saying, Lord, I thank you, you've forgiven me, but I pray for others, and I pray for this next generation of babies to have the right to life, the privilege to life, and I pray for America for a change of heart, for a change of mind. But abortion in itself is evil. When you think about what's actually done, when we see what's actually done, when we realize that at the moment of conception, that baby in the womb has its entire DNA programmed into it. I mean, it's extraordinary.

It is such an act of God. And yes, you understand, I'm not a biologist, I'm not a scientist, but it is so completely mind-boggling to me that we could deny the reality of God and DNA implanted into that baby at the moment of conception. So, the slaughter of the unborn is evil, and it has destroyed so much in our society in so many ways. There are many ripple effects from it in terms of our consciousness and how we live. On the other hand, there is a distinction between abortion and murdering a child outside of the womb. We all understand that. For example, if you knew that next door to you, that kids were being pulled in off the block and they were being shot and killed and there was some serial killer, that would have to stop at that moment. In other words, immediately an island would be called and if you were one to take the law in your own hands, you'd go and try to stop it yourself. The fact that we're not doing that with abortion clinics should say something.

And think of this. Here's a woman in an abusive relationship. She's got three kids. Her living boyfriend is completely irresponsible and beats her. He comes home drunk one night, rapes her, has sex with her against her will. She finds out she's pregnant.

She's at her wits end and as soon as she finds out she's pregnant, she wants to terminate the pregnancy. That's very different than just marching millions of people into gas chambers and slaughtering them. That's very different than kidnapping someone in a foreign land and transporting them in the most brutal ways to be a lifelong slave of someone else. It's different. Oh, it's evil. It's still evil. It's still wrong.

But it's different. Most women that are having abortions, let's at least say many, are not shouting their abortions. Many have wrestled with this. Many have been in agony over it over the years. Many regret their decision and many really don't understand the humanity of the baby in the womb. They think, okay, at a certain point it's a child or if it has viability outside the womb, but until then it's really not.

In God's sight, yes, it is a child and this is why we are so strongly pro-life. But the question of humanizing has to be worked through. And then here's the other question.

Do we simply want to get a consensus and pass bills that will work or do we want to take a stand and not move from that position until hearts and lives are changed, lest we be guilty of compromising? 866-34-TRUTH. This is where you get to weigh in. And again, I know it's difficult for those who've had abortions to talk about it, but I can honestly say in 15 years of daily talk radio, some of the most memorable, moving, painful, helpful calls we ever received were from women who had had abortions in the past or in some cases men who had pushed their girlfriends to have them and even paid for them. Their words were life-giving for many. Their words hopefully saved other lives.

We're going to open this up. We've got a whole lot more to cover today This is Michael Ellison, founder of TriVita Wellness. I'm always thrilled to offer a new product from TriVita that is science-supported with equivalent doses per serving that follows the science.

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Get on the line of fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. All right, kind Chris, you got to remind me a little later in the show to give a TriVita testimony.

All right, so you'll remind me later in the show. You know, driving up to the office, to the studio today, praying for today's show, just some allergic reaction that happened some weeks back. Those that are watching noticed I was doing the broadcast with a tissue in my hand. I was touched by what I was talking about, but it wasn't because I was crying.

It was because of the allergic reaction. So something funny today as well. It's been kind of quirky weather, but strong, ready as always. But I was thinking of, you know, when we're not in health, it's a drain, right? No one prays, oh God, send sickness on this person as a blessing. Oh, this young married couple, oh Lord, send them all kinds of sickness and may their children be sick. It can be trying, difficult, challenging, and God can work through it and help us grow and grace in the midst of it. Some of the saintliest people on the earth are sick, but boy, we can run our race so much better when we're not fighting these other things off.

866-348-7884. So I want to give you a wellness testimony a little later in the broadcast. Also, I tell you what, let me encourage your heart here as we get back to the abortion discussion. I've told you that all over America God is moving. I've told you that the Holy Spirit is being poured out. I said earlier this year, before Asbury began, that the first wave of the next revival movement has already hit America, it's already begun, and more and more churches all across the land are experiencing outpouring, experiencing God moving. So it's not happening in my city, it's not happening in my denomination, it's not happening in my church. Well, be encouraged because God's not a respecter of persons or places.

He responds to hunger and thirst and desire. And just as He's pouring out water on the dry land in many parts of America, He can pour out water on the dry land of your soul, of your city, of your church. So, brother that's becoming a dear friend, Pastor Mike in Corpus Christi, Texas. In fact, I think the t-shirt I have on under my shirt here is one that I was given when I was at New Life last year or earlier this year. Anyway, be back there, God willing, in just a few weeks. But here's what He sent me yesterday, so from the Sunday service, powerful outpouring today.

A couple of baseball players from Texas A&M shared their testimonies from this past week. Holy Spirit fell, Spirit of repentance, salvations, altars flooded, 42 spontaneous water baptisms. They always have this big, you know, human-sized bucket, whatever you want to call it. You know, it's like this metal looking just on the platform and after any service there might be people getting baptized. Yesterday there were 42 spontaneous water baptisms. So, this was not, they were saying, okay, X number of people are going to be baptized today. This just happened as a result of God moving.

The Holy Spirit's being poured out. And I say that not as something separate. Oh, and as an aside, no, no. The way that America will be changed is not just changing laws. The way that America will be changed is not just by politicians being elected and doing a good job. It must happen by changing hearts as well as changing laws. It must happen with changing minds as well as getting the right people elected. If we don't do that, please hear me, we may have temporary success but we will have long-term failure. We may be able to push things through but there will just be more resentment, more anger, more hostility and the pendulum will swing back in another way that's even worse than things were before. That's why it is revival and reformation.

That's why it is outpouring and awakening. That's why it is evangelism and social and political action. It must be both and we must put first things first. I posted on Facebook yesterday, yes, we're in a war, we're in a battle but we fight differently. We fight differently. We overcome evil with good. We overcome hatred with love. We overcome lies with truth. We overcome the flesh with the power of the Spirit. Our weapons are eternal and cannot be defeated by any earthly powers. You may feel powerless, you may be in a state that is shifted so far in a destructive direction that you don't see any way for it to turn back, but you have the weapon of prayer which is the greatest weapon of all. You could be in a prison cell in solitary confinement and do more to change the world than someone speaking to millions. I genuinely believe that. I genuinely believe that.

So, it is not either or. We must continue to pray for a pro-life mentality. We must continue to pray for hearts and minds and lives to be changed.

So, I want to give you my three responses to Nikki Haley's suggestion. You can read it on our website, AskDrBrown.org. Just read it in the latest articles if you have the Ask Dr. Brown Ministries app. You can read it there. If you don't have either, if you don't get our emails, so you don't hear from us on the website, or you don't have the app, take a minute, whatever is easiest for you, download the app Ask Dr. Brown Ministries and then hit subscribe on that to get our emails or just go to the website, AskDrBrown.org and subscribe there, but we'd love to pour into you.

Just think of getting injected with truth, getting injected with faith, getting injected with courage multiple times a week. That's what we are here to do. So, here's my three-fold response to Nikki Haley's suggestion about humanizing the issue of abortion. And let me get my article up. Here we go. Number one, number one, we should distinguish between humanizing the issue of abortion and humanizing the people involved in the issue.

Let me say that again. We should distinguish between humanizing the issue of abortion and humanizing the people involved in the issue. Abortion itself is evil. It involves the shedding of innocent blood in the womb. It is culture destroying in many ways and it deserves the judgment of God. We can never move from that reality.

Number one. Number two, when it comes to the question of humanizing, let us focus more than anything on the humanity of the baby in the womb. This is how we change hearts and ultimately change laws. And this is why 4D ultrasounds have been so effective in preventing abortions. That's not a mass of tissues or a clump of cells.

That's your child. Third, there is a place for humanizing those on the quote pro-choice side of the aisle. That's because many, if not most women who have abortions, are not radical feminists marching down the streets and shouting their abortions.

Many agonize over their decisions, often regretting their choices for years to come. My friends who have ministered the gospel outside abortion clinics have shared many a heart-rending story with me. Other women who had abortions would make clear they are not pro-abortion even though they themselves made that choice. They should not be compared to an abortion doctor getting rich off of his despicable work. They are not in the same class as a Planned Parenthood executive pushing for higher quotas of baby killing. Many women to be sure, pure abortion is another method of birth control, allowing them to sleep around without lasting consequence. But in their cases, some have been deeply conditioned to think of the fetus as something rather than a someone.

They are responsible for their actions, but they're also the byproducts of decades of cultural programming. Here too, we need hearts of compassion and backbones of steel, and not just compassion for the babies in the womb. We can stand strong, immovable in our convictions, and not minimize the evil of abortion while ministering with grace to those on the other side, in particular to those who are hurting and conflicted. We should also solicit input from pro-life women who had abortions in the past, hearing their stories and learning from their experiences. By God's grace, may we turn the tide of the nation one baby and one heart at a time. May we become a pro-life people. Again, you can read that on the Ask Dr. Brown Ministries app with the latest articles or on the AskDrBrown.org website. 866-3-4-Truth.

Again, not taking random Bible questions today. We do that a lot, but we've got to keep our focus right here where it belongs. When we come back, we get to weigh in, but also what kind of strategy should we have politically? How should we move forward?

And when it comes to vote, what is the single most important characteristic or quality of the candidate you vote for? Hey, friends, Dr. Michael Brown here. Do you remember when people thought I was crazy when I said it's not too late for America, that God can still do something in our country, that there is going to be a pushback, a gospel-based moral and cultural revolution? And do you remember when people thought that you were crazy because you felt the same way, because you believe what I was saying and already felt it in your heart? Well, friends, that pushback is here. The gospel-based moral and cultural revolution we've been talking about for 25 years is unfolding, and we are right in the thick of it, and the line-of-fire broadcast is divinely positioned for such a time as this. Friends, you would be so gratified and blessed as I hear, if you could hear what I hear, testimony after testimony as leaders, young people, old people, moms, dads, students, people from all backgrounds come up to me and say, Dr. Brown, you're providing a template for us. You're providing a blueprint for us. You're showing us how to do this, how to have hearts of compassion, backbones of steel.

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You're hearing John Cooper's voice with Skillet there every day. We're in touch a whole lot, and he is burning, burning for Jesus, and I keep doing my best to throw more fuel on his fire. What a blessing to be in Holy Partnership. All right, 866-348-7884. I want to hear from you, and then got a bunch of other things to share with you as well.

Let us go over to Liz in Dallas, Texas. Welcome to the Line of Fire. Hi, thanks for having me.

You're very welcome. Yeah, and I was calling in response to, I'm on this left work, and I was listening, and funny enough that this is actually an issue that just popped up for me yesterday, because the gun run for your argument with my brother, and he threw it in my face that I had an abortion when I was young. You see, I became a believer, and God forgave me for that, and he gave me freedom to experience when I repented of that, and throughout the years, he worked my heart to change my mind on my view of abortion, exactly like you said, humanized to the point where now I speak on behalf of these unborn babies. Even as a believer, having had an abortion now and being forgiven of freedom that Christ gave me is something that a lot of other women can experience, and when I say he washed, when my brother threw that in my face, I said, glory to God, brother, that is a testimony of where I was and where I am.

Yeah. Liz, how old were you when you had that abortion? I was 18. And what was the decision-making process? Was it like, this is obvious, you just get rid of the fetus? I mean, you can talk about this for hours, but in short, what was the decision-making process that went into that? My thought process was I was going to college, and I wasn't going to be able to do it.

Right. And what did you think you were doing when you were having an abortion? What was the conscious activity? When I was having it, I thought, this is what's best for me, and that's how I looked at it. And now I look at it, and now I don't have any shame about it, but I look at it so much differently. It's a child, and I'll be reunited with that child in heaven, and I trust the Lord with that.

Yes. And Liz, the fact you can speak about this so clearly is a testimony to the power of forgiveness, because these are deep, deep issues that can leave deep, deep wounds, but you're telling other women that you don't have to live with the guilt and the pain, that Jesus really forgives and heals on the inside. Were you at all conscious that that's a baby in the womb? How did you think of that being that you were going to abort?

I didn't. At some point, I remember disassociating and just completely disconnecting from that, and that was before I became a Christian, before I let Jesus became Lord and Savior of my life. And so I remember my mom praying for it and had her pastor talk to me at the time. I just wasn't seeing it. But now that looking back, and I think, God had already been there, even in that time when I wasn't a believer.

He was there providing the support that I was going to need. Got it. All right, so Liz, how would you counsel us as we take stands on this? We are unashamed of the pro-life. As I said earlier in the broadcast and repeated it, abortion in and of itself is evil, but there are people involved. There are mothers choosing to have abortions that are not consciously committing an evil act, especially some that are in deep conflict or were abused or difficult circumstances like that, or they're told that the baby's going to be handicapped and they think, well, this is the most compassionate thing to do. Are we compromising when we try to bring in the humanity of the mother? Is it taking us away from the issue, or is this the way that we actually can turn hearts and lives?

What do you think? We can turn hearts. We can turn, because if God turned my heart from believing that that was an option that women had and women should have the right to exercise that option, I'll tell you another thing. Even throughout the years, after I gave my life to Jesus, I was offered a position to work at an abortion clinic, and God had been working for me throughout the years. I'd been saved, but I was on the fence about the issue, and I'd gotten a job at an abortion facility, and I felt so uncomfortable. I never actually showed up to the job, but I felt so uncomfortable. God just did not let me rest in that decision, and he told me, you can't take that job. And even though they were going to pay me what I needed, I had to decline the job, because God didn't let me rest in that decision.

And so no, absolutely, I'm unashamed, and now I can say it and use it as a testimony. We need to hear these women's stories. We need to hear about the forgiveness that God provides, about how he can change your heart, how he does it by story, because we all can relate to a narrative.

All of us can relate to a story. Well, yeah, absolutely, and thanks for being so bold and so full of life and sharing that. And I know right now that you're speaking to women who've had abortions, some as believers still beat themselves over the head with it and have not received the fullness of, that maybe they're forgiven, but they don't want to forgive themselves. And others live with this, this pain, and the pain will not go away until you come to Jesus.

So friends, hear Liz's story and run to the same place we've all run, to the cross where Jesus died for all of our sins and where we receive not just forgiveness, but release of guilt as well in the things, the mistakes that we made in the past, the wrong things we did in the past, the sins we committed in the past can now be a path of life for others. Hey, Liz, God bless you. Thanks for calling in. I really appreciate it. Thank you, brother.

All right. Hey, remember, everybody in the greater DFW area. Yeah, 100.7 FM K-word, our great station there.

Spread the word about K-words. So we're with you central time, two to three daily, five days a week. By the way, let's just see, a week from tomorrow night, so the first Tuesday in September, I'll be speaking at Christ for the Nations at their Tuesday night encounter service.

I teach once a month during the day, but I don't often do services for the general public. So if you're anywhere around there, a great time of worship, and I'll be preaching on something that will be edifying and life changing. So I invite you to join me there. All right, let's come back to, and others, feel free to weigh in if you like, 866-34-TRUTH. Let's come back to the public debate question. I was looking last night, trying to see about Democrats for life and things like that, because it's often been said that the Democratic Party today is not the Democratic Party of Bill Clinton. Remember, President Clinton said that he wanted abortions to be safe, legal, and rare. It was not to shout your abortion movement. Now, if President Clinton were in office today, he might be shouting abortions as well.

I'm just saying, back then, just a couple decades back, this was not the case. So I was looking online and found Democrats for life, pro-life Democrats, obviously a tiny, tiny minority. There's an article on Fox News about these pro-life Democrats. Pro-life Democrats sound off on Supreme Court leaks. This was last year, May, when the leak came out about the Roe v. Wade decision that Justice Alito had basically written. They distanced themselves from national party leaders. And in the article, one of their leaders says this, I think when Roe v. Wade was decided, it stopped an important discussion by our nation of how we treat the preborn and how we treat women who experience unplanned pregnancies.

So I think it's really important that it go back to the states, because we can't continue right now and what is happening. Now, on their website, Democrats for Life, here's their mission statement. Here's their mission statement. Democrats for Life of America. Our mission is to defend universal human rights within the Democratic Party and to elect whole life Democrats. We seek to end the influence of systems of pervasive injustice, particularly the mass lethal injustice of abortion and other human rights abuses, and to build a life-refirming culture within our party and our communities and in our nation. I mean, it would be wonderful to see them succeed in their mission, because right now the Democrats unashamedly are the pro-abortion party, and the Republicans unashamedly the pro-life party, although I put no trust in the political system to bring about the change that only the Gospel can bring. Politics is important, but it is down the list of ways for me that the Church is called to change the culture. And, as much as I voted Republican because of pro-life issues and other key issues to me, the Republican Party is not the party of God. And as much as I oppose many of the radical left policies of the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party is not all demons. And there's a whole lot more nuance there, but we won't go there right now.

Here's the big question. Do we say, okay, let's be realistic. Let's go as far as we can. And we know, and it's been seen already with some votes this year, that there's tremendous Democrat voting energy, especially with young people, to push back against pro-life laws, to push back against the overturning of Roe v. Wade, to take this anger, you've taken away a woman's right, you're imposing your values on her, et cetera. There is tremendous anger, and that is going to drive people, this is the concept, and we've seen it a little already happen in a vote in Ohio, is going to drive people out to the polls, this is going to drive them out to vote, it's going to get Democrats in, it's going to keep a Republican agenda out, in this case a pro-life agenda out, it's going to mean defeat for the pro-life movement. So it's best if we step back a little and are just more pragmatic and say, okay, look, can we agree? Let's just go for consensus.

This is what Haley was saying. Let's go for consensus and try to build around that, at least take some steps in the right direction to save as many lives as possible while we continue to change hearts and minds. So if we just fight for federal ban on abortion and that's it, then we lose everything, and then with new justices eventually in the Supreme Court, and they reinstate Roe v. Wade and make it even more ironclad, et cetera. And these are possibilities, the law is passed or pushing back against pro-life laws now.

I would suggest this, while I understand the calling to be pragmatic, why not do as Susan B. Anthony Group and others have advocated, fight fire with fire. In other words, let us point to the extreme policies that are being advocated by the Democratic Party. Let us point to the states that allow abortion on demand right up until childbirth. I mean, literally, you could be an hour before delivering a healthy child and say, I am completely unable to, I'm having a breakdown, I can't do this, I simply cannot do this, and you would have the right to abortion in a number of states in America.

I saw a list on Daily Wire from oh, maybe three years ago that had eight different states listed. You could do it right up to the time of conception. Why not highlight and point to the radical pro-abortion policies on the left? Why not say, that's what you're voting for?

You're voting out, that's what you're voting for. Rather than just think, well, we have to retreat and find little ground, why not fight fire with fire while we continue to make the case for life? All right, we'll be right back. Are you stressed and searching for a natural way to restore balance in your life?

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Get on the Line of Fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. We're going to go back to the phones momentarily, but first I want to share a neat little story with you and give you an opportunity to stand with us and partner with us.

I think you're going to like this idea. Alright, so one of my key armor-bearers, spiritual prayer warriors that supports our ministry, been working out bodybuilding for many, many years. In fact, we actually played a little clip of his testimony when we first started using Trivita Products Nitric Oxide and Myo Health. So he sends me a video the other day, right? He's what, 51 maybe? Sends me a video the other day on my cell phone, and there he is. He's got in each hand 100-pound weights.

We were going to play it on the air, but we couldn't get the video and audio to come up together or the audio to play properly. So he's got 100-pound dumbbells in each hand. That's a lot. The most I ever worked with was maybe 70 or 75 pounds. Yeah, so he's got 100 in each hand, and then he's going to do an incline bench press.

So for those who know, if you've got the bench angling up so you're a higher angle, it's actually harder to do it like that. And he said he hasn't used weights like this since he was in his mid-20s to early 30s, but he's used his Trivita supplements, Nitric Oxide, which helps with blood flow and oxygenation, and then Myo Health, which develops muscle and helps to get a little structure, etc. And I've been seeing just great benefits using these myself. So he wants to see how many of these he can pull. There's 100 pounds in each hand, and he pumps out 15, 15 of these. And he says, man, it really, really works. So I want to throw this out to everybody here that works out, everybody listening, watching that works out, whether you are CrossFit Fanatics, whether it's just hitting the treadmill every day, whether it's weightlifting, you work out.

You may be 16, you may be 76, but you work out some regularity. I want to encourage you to take this one month challenge. Call 800-771-5584.

800-771-5584. Get one month's supply of Nitric Oxide and Myo Health. You just put them in your water, stir it up, mix them together, and an hour before you work out. If it's a non-workout day, just take it the first thing in the morning, all right?

So do it for one month. If you see results and have the joy of ordering more and special discount you get through our ministry, if you saw results but not worth ordering, hey, you made a donation because here's the deal. 100% of your first order, 100%, every dime of it is donated to the line of fire by Trivita. And you get a special discount on top of it. When you continue to order, you get more discounts within the company. You get these bonus points they give you so you get more discounts and then more than a tithe of all your orders would go. So you'll be supporting us every month.

So check, see if it works. Worst case scenario, you've made a donation to our ministry, but I think you're going to see really good results. So 800-771-5584, order nitric oxide and mild health. And when you do, you're also going to get any order, a free digital mini book that Nancy and I wrote, A Healthy Church Starts with a Healthy You, that's going to really motivate you about healthy eating.

What does that mean? Oh, we're going to hit there because that's where everything starts and the health and vitality that you can enjoy so you can, why? Better run your race for the Lord and better live with vibrancy and fervency and do what we've been doing, reversing the aging process for some years.

Yeah, by God's grace. Oh, it's real and it's something that is a lived out experience, not just talk. So you'll get the free digital ebook, look for it in your emails after you order. And again, make sure you read it. Sitting there in the inbox will not help you. Read it. I think you'll benefit from it.

800-771-5584 or go to triveda.com and use the code BROWN25. So that's my challenge. It's one month and see what happens.

I think you will benefit. Okay. All right, so let's step back and ask a larger question. Many of you have the mentality that Jesus is coming quickly and things will only get worse before He returns. I don't want to talk so much about the return of the Messiah and prophecy and end-time schemes right now.

We've done that a lot, especially in recent months, in many of Lynch's prophecies that Jesus is going to return by the end of three and it's going to be raptured and all this. Forget about it. Just forget about it. Don't be distracted by it.

Don't be distracted. All right, so live in readiness to be with the Lord and go about your work with a multi-generational mentality. Here's what I do want to address. If you say, well we know things are only getting worse until Jesus returns, give me the chapter and verse for that. Well, it says things will keep getting worse.

Well, hang on, hang on. When the New Testament was written, what percentage of the world, what percentage of the people living on the planet were born again, were in God's family, knew the Lord, believed in Jesus, heard of Jesus? I've seen estimates that by the end of the first century, one in every 360 people in the world were followers of Jesus.

One in every 360. So a country like America where we have about 330 million, so let's say we had a little bit more, 360 million, it would mean one million people out of all, everyone in America was saved. I mean that's what it would mean. Well, today, worldwide, world population, those professing faith in Jesus, many are not true Christians, but those professing faith in Jesus, they're roughly one third of the people on the planet. Doesn't that mean that the gospel is increasing? Doesn't that mean that the gospel is growing? Doesn't that mean that more and more people are coming to faith?

Doesn't that mean that we should have a holy optimism in terms of what God is doing rather than just saying it's only getting worse? Okay, let's look at America. For African Americans, is America better today than it was in the year 1820? Is it better today than it was in the year 1950?

Well, in certain ways it's worse, but in other ways, in terms of rights and freedoms and equality, much better now. In other words, progress has been made. Roe v. Wade was overturned last year, as many expect it would happen, and we declared at the beginning of last year, it's the year of taking back ground.

We kept saying, watch what's going to happen, watch how things are going to turn, and then Roe v. Wade is overturned in the midst of it. So, the more realistic mentality to me as I read scripture is this, that we are going to have conflict and battle until Jesus returns, that darkness and light will be clashing, that there will be an outpouring of the Holy Spirit and great satanic activity right until Jesus returns and sets up his kingdom on the earth. I do not see that it will go totally bad.

I do not see that it will go totally good. Obviously, people have different end time schemes. What I see is parallel extremes as we get closer and closer to the end of the age. But this much I know. God is moving all around the earth.

Should we not focus on that rather than say, well, it's all getting worse or it's all over? Show me the chapter and verse that makes it clear that Jesus must come in our lifetime. And what does that even mean? I'm 68. A baby was just born seconds ago somewhere. If we say, in our lifetimes, do I mean in my lifetime? If I live to be 100, that's within 32 years Jesus would return. What about the lifetime of that baby? Maybe that baby will live to be 85.

Does that mean 85? So, even when we say in our lifetimes, what does that even mean? But show me the chapter and the verse that demonstrates clearly that Jesus must return within the next 30 years or the next 50 years or the next 100 years. We do not know. I want it to be soon.

I want it to be in my lifetime, my personal lifetime. Yes. But we don't know that. So, let's give ourselves to the Great Commission. Did not Jesus say, I'm with you always even to the ends of the age? So, we keep making disciples, we keep being disciples, we keep serving God, we keep shining light. And every life that's changed, that's positive. Every soul that's saved, that's positive. Every person that is set free, that's positive.

Every law that changes, that's positive. And we continue to stay on the front lines full of faith, hope, and courage because Jesus is Lord. All right. I asked, I'm totally changing subjects and we're going to go here, I believe, tomorrow barring something unusual. I'm not going to be talking a lot about politics between now and November of next year in terms of all the politics, politics, and obsessed with it. No. By God's grace, I will help us not to get election fever, not to get distracted with politics, but to keep it in its proper place. It's important place, but it's proper place. But I asked this question just, oh, four or five hours ago on Twitter on Dr. Michael L. Brown on Twitter, Dr. Michael L. Brown. So make sure you get the two L's in there.

Dr. Michael L. Brown on Twitter. As a voter, what is the single most important factor or quality you're looking for in a presidential candidate? As a voter, what is the single most important factor or quality you're looking for in a presidential candidate? And I gave four choices, integrity slash character, good policies, backbone, or unifier. Now, obviously, we don't want these qualities in isolation. You don't want some of those good policies, but no backbone and no character. Ideally, right? But that's what I said, a single most. If you had to just pick one, you're going to vote for somebody. What is the determining factor? Could they have integrity and character, but bad policies?

Is that possible? So we're going to talk about that tomorrow. We're going to have a fruitful, practical discussion on politics, and you get to weigh in and explain which candidate, be it Democrat, Republican, Independent, you would want to see as the next president of the United States. We're going to talk about that, and then I'm going to do my best to give us kingdom perspectives to help us keep on focus during the next year. How would you vote? What matters most to you? We'll be right back to take this up tomorrow.