Jonathan Casillas, Super Bowl Winning Linebacker

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There's a lot to listen to, so get started and download the free Odyssey app today. Jonathan, how you been, my man? All is well, man. How you doing, Zach? Well, I'm doing fantastic.

So, I'll start you off. I know you're a part of the Giants Radio Network now. Giants at the Commanders this weekend, Sunday Night Football. Where's kind of the confidence at with Big Blue before their biggest game of the season?

Oh, it's very high. You know, my confidence was very high for almost every game besides last week against the Philadelphia Eagles. I think we all kind of knew how that was going to end up. But, yeah, this is a must-have game. This is definitely a must-win. If they ever had a must-win this season, I think this is it.

You know, I think the Commanders are basically in the same exact position as the Giants in terms of that wildcard race. And so this is basically what, you know, the whole season is built on for this game right here. And this is a huge opportunity for the Giants because if they win it, they have basically their playoff hopes in their hands, which is where you want to be at late December. They were sitting in a real pretty spot with seven wins after that Texans game. And then they lose to the Lions, they lose to the Cowboys, tie against the Commanders.

We talked about the blowout against the Philadelphia Eagles. There's not at all any fear because going into the year, it was, okay, the Giants don't have that much talent and then they impressed a lot of people and people are thinking playoffs. Is this more that this team's coming back down to earth or they're just in a funk right now?

I think the coming back down to earth is a good way to phrase it. You know, I think they were overachieving early in the season. You know, they won a lot of games late. This was a tough, gritty group, but this was a little bit more healthier group as well, especially the beginning of the season. And now I think attrition has hit them hard. Injuries has hit them hard, losing Xavier McKinney, losing to Dori Jackson. Stellan Shepherd's been gone for almost a whole year, you know, and it's been a rotating carousel on the offensive line due to injuries and they haven't really had continuity. So this is a team I feel like who was overachieving in the beginning of the season and now I think they're trending downward right now and they need to figure out a way to get back on the right track of winning because they haven't won in a long time. It's been a long time since the Giants have won a football game. What type of effort do you think you see from Saquon Barkley because that's another guy where he got off to that good start and he's already a thousand yard running back for this season once again, but the last few weeks you wonder how much is this the fact that he's not used to playing this late in the season with some of the injuries unfortunately the last few years?

Yeah, you know what, I'm definitely a little concerned. I feel like he's running a little bit different, Zach. I don't really like the way he's running now, especially when you compare it to the beginning of the season. I feel like if there were no yards there, he would just stick his foot in the ground and just put his head in the back of an old lineman or whoever and just go ahead and push the pile and I think he's more hesitant now and I think that has a lot to do with the offensive line not really getting the same push as they got early in the year. When they have more pieces healthy and it's been like I said, a revolving door at offensive line and you know, I don't really know who's good because there's so many guys playing and if you don't have, you know consistency along the offensive line, it's hard to really build that camaraderie and that continuity that, you know, everybody knows that the offensive line is always the tightest knit group.

That's because they play together, they eat together, they hang out together, you know, their families hang out together. So I don't really know how much of that is getting done on the field and off the field and I think that has a lot to do with not only Saquon running the ball, but also the protection of Daniel Jones. I felt like Daniel Jones has been on the ground a lot more in the last few weeks than he has earlier in the season. So look, I don't think Saquon's a different guy than he was when he got those 35 carries against the Houston Texans almost in the middle of the season.

I don't think he's any different. I just think maybe his confidence in his offensive linemen might be a little questioned right now, but look man, this is it. This is the biggest game of the year. If there's any playoff indication, if you want to see Daniel Jones playing in the playoff-like atmosphere, it's going to be this Sunday down in Washington for Sunday Night Football because whoever wins this game basically, I would say guarantees the playoff spot, but it definitely helps them. It definitely helps them put them in the right position to go ahead and finish the season, maybe only needing one more win to go ahead and secure that wildcard spot.

Yeah, I think whoever wins this game tonight is going to be coming up on Sunday is going to be going to the playoffs because of the fact that that tie, even though no one likes seeing a tie, that tie does become beneficial when you get into the nitty-gritty of the tiebreakers coming up later on at the end of the year. Talking to Jonathan Casillas, if you were in the commander's locker room and you were preparing for Daniel Jones this week, how would you view Daniel Jones as a quarterback? Well, number one, you know, and you got to look at him and see that he's not the turnover machine as he was in previous years. You know, he's a composed quarterback. I feel like he's more accurate than he's ever been throughout his career. Of course, the turnovers are down, and I think his decision-making has increased.

You know, I think he's done a better job. But my thing is, is on the outside, they don't really have that much talent on the outside. So I don't really see the Giants really trying to sit back and have a passing attack this game. I would think that they would try to run the ball, you know, me being on the commander's side. The Giants would try to run the ball, establish a run first, and then, of course, try to hit and pick and choose, you know, when you want to pass, you know, in opportunistic passing situations, of course. But my thing is, is don't let Daniel Jones sit in that pocket. You know, the Giants are not a traditional 100 percent dropback team.

They like to move the pocket around a little bit. So I would just allow those two big boys up front, Daron Payne and Jonathan Allen, to go ahead and get that push up front on a consistent basis on pass plays and have Daniel Jones go ahead and tuck that ball down. And you got a Montez Sweat and then Chase Young is also who's back in the lineup, you know, who's on the outside. Get those guys chasing around Daniel Jones. Possibly put a spy on him on certain plays, given that Daniel Jones has hurt teams this year with his legs, not only on design run plays, but also when he decides to pass it, he decides to go ahead and tuck that ball down. He's gotten a lot of great first yards, first downs, some touchdowns in some of them plays, some design nakeds and bootlegs they had. So I would think some of the time, maybe not the whole game, go ahead and put a spy on Daniel Jones to limit not only him in the passing game, but also when he decides to tuck that ball in and run it.

Jon, they can see us here with us. Do you believe Daniel Jones is back as a starting quarterback next year for the Giants? I hope so.

I hope so. And you asked me this in the beginning of the year, I don't think I would have had the same reaction, to be honest. I think he has improved throughout this year. Coming into the year, I think he's improved with his early play and I think with all the revolving doors at receiver and offensive line, he has been the only really steady point person on the Giants offense. You know, like I said, he's down on turnovers. He's up on completion percentage and I don't think they're throwing the ball as much, which I think Zach, I think they got to open it up this game. Maybe not sit back in the pocket and try to get five step drops against his front.

Maybe not that, but move the pocket. Definitely have the ball in Daniel Jones hands. Give him a lot of RPOs this game and let it be either him with the ball, Saquon Barkley with the ball, or he can run the ball and have that pass option off the run. If somebody actually steps up, I think that'll put the Giants in the best opportunity to win the game because you got your two best players on offense. Who's basically optioning the guys on the defensive line who is the strong, you know, the strong point of the Washington commanders defense is the offense of the defensive line. So put them in some thinking situations where they're not just, you know, going ahead and rushing the pass or going ahead and, you know, killing our tackles because they understand what's going on. But you lead them and you have them thinking and maybe they'd be a step slow or step off or just a little hesitation in one second. And then you got, boom, Saquon Barkley with Daniel Jones running up the field. Of course, Zach easier said than done, of course. And I'm sure the Giants have tried to do that throughout the year.

But I feel like this is the game where you need to pull out all stops, you know, because at the end of the day, you lose this game, your season is over. Let's talk about one of your other former teams, the New Orleans Saints. I saw that Ian Rappaport, Jonathan Casillas was saying if Sean Paden's coming back next year, it's either to the Chargers, the Rams, or going back to New Orleans. How would you react to that if Sean goes back to New Orleans? Man, I know the New Orleans faithful would be happy about that, especially in recent years. You know, when Sean was there, Sean had New Orleans as being not only a fair, blue place to play, but a powerhouse, especially in the NFC South and the NFC, you know, a frequent representative in the playoffs, you know, frequent division winner, you know, and then of course, they won a Super Bowl back in 2009. So just this, Sean Paden's a tremendous coach, he's a tremendous leader, probably a better storyteller than he is a coach, the guy, he's a fun guy to be around.

So look, whoever gets Sean Paden as a head coach, I think they're getting a tremendous guy. You know, my, you know, my roots are in New Orleans. You know, I played my first four years down there. I got a lot of love down there for a lot of people.

I got a lot of love for the state and the city of New Orleans. You know, they were always kind to me, and I would love for them to go ahead and get back on the winning side of things. But can you see Sean going back there? I don't know. I don't think he wants to go back. You know what I mean?

It's the point of going back. I don't think Sean wants to go back to New Orleans, you know. I think he wants something new, you know, possibly with a better, I guess, I don't want to say better quarterback, but more, I don't want to say dynamic. Maybe those words I want to use, Zach, maybe I just don't want to say them outright. Maybe, I think he wants to go to a situation where offensively, you know, they have a better, yeah, better quarterback. Yeah, that's what I'm going to say.

I think I didn't want to say that first, but I'm going to say it. I think he wants to go to a situation that he has a better quarterback, because at the end of the day, he was with Drew Brees, and him and Drew Brees, they broke a lot of records, a lot of offensive records. Drew Brees is topping all the top statistics. He's right behind Tom Brady in most of them, you know, so I think he needs to go to a place where he feels comfortable in the quarterback play, and I don't think he feels that way.

And I just, of course, outside looking in, I don't really report on the change too much, but of course I know what's going on. I just don't think he feels comfortable with who they have at quarterback right now. Well, that's why he left. Yeah, you don't want to deal with Andy Dalton, you don't want to deal with Jamis Winston as your starting quarterback, because you know that's not good enough to win, and he's now Judge Sean Payton if you're going to get to the playoffs and have a chance to win a Super Bowl. How about Brady? Could Brady and Sean, there's been rumors before, right, the whole Miami situation, if Sean goes back to the Saints, could you see your old teammate, TB12, who's a free agent, staying in that division but going to New Orleans?

Ooh, you know I've never thought about that. I know some of my guys wouldn't like that. I'm on a group chat with all Reggie Bush and Billman, all those guys from that 09 Saints Super Bowl team, and I don't think they'll be too happy about that.

But look, man, I love TB. You know, the other night they had a beat down by San Francisco. I had them winning, because not just a few days prior, I watched Tom Brady beat Tom Brady in the fourth quarter. And I was like, oh my gosh, Tom Brady's back.

They're going to be back. Mike Evans and him, they're going to get that connection going, because they haven't had it all year, and in years prior, they were a dynamic combo and quarterback wide receiver. You know, of course Gronk was there, I think that has a lot to do with it. But look, man, this is what I look when I think about Tom Brady. You done done enough for the sport. One of the greatest athletes, not just in this sport, but of all time in any sport. You know, one of the most winningest players in all sports, not just quarterbacks.

The guy is phenomenal. He literally, he engulfs, he invigorates a team. You know, he walked into that Tampa Bay team, and you know, of course, defensively they were good, but offensively, the Tampa Bay hasn't been good in a very long time. All of a sudden, he gets them to play some good football, and then they win the damn Super Bowl his first year. You know, he galvanized that city down there, and Tampa Bay right now is a whole different team. Even though right now they're not winning as much, but they still can win that division and sneak into the playoffs. And Tom Brady in the playoffs is very dangerous.

This is the whole point I was trying to make. I think Tom Brady should go ahead and be like, hey, look, I'm divorced. I'm single.

I'm, you know, he should just shut it down. You know, he got a new life. Go ahead and find you a new girl. Find you a new wife. You know what I'm saying?

Hang out with the kids. He's played enough football, bro. He's been playing for two decades, and I'm talking about only in the league.

More than two decades. He's played enough football. I think he can go ahead and hopefully make it to the playoffs. Maybe he wins a game in the playoffs, but then go ahead and shut it down, Tom.

Go ahead and shut it down. You know, keep going with TB12 and everything that they're doing on the sports medicine side of everything, and also write a book. Like, do all that good stuff.

Go on media. Do whatever you want. But I feel like this is a young man's league now, and I think these younger quarterbacks, the Joe Burrows of the world, Lamar Jackson's, all these guys, they're showing that this is a young man's league. And the older quarterbacks, the Aaron Rodgers, the Tom Brady, I think the league has kind of moved past them as of right now in 2022. If you would have asked me that last year, it would have been a whole different story because Aaron Rodgers won MVP last year and Tom Brady was still playing at a high level. I just don't see both of them really moving forward in years to come, and I'd just be like, hey, look, Tom, you done done enough.

You don't won enough. Go ahead and shut it down and have a good life. Yeah, you know this, though, and I know it. He's playing football next year. There's no doubt about it in my mind.

Yeah, I think so, too. Jonathan Casillas, before we let you run, how about Wisconsin hiring Luke Fickle? We were wondering who they were going to get. I thought it was going to be Jim Leonard, and then, boom, they get maybe the hire of the offseason. And Luke Fickle coming over from Cincinnati. I didn't really know his name, and I did my research on him.

He sounds like a very quality hire. Of course, look, I didn't play with Jimmy, but when I got to Wisconsin, Jimmy was all over the place. He was all over the walls. They talked about him, you know, walk on a starter to All-American. Like, he had the, you know, like the storied, you know, tale of walk on to, you know, oh my God, he's one of the best players in the country.

He did that. That's what Jimmy Leonard was. Then he had a formidable career in the NFL. Then he went back, and he had manned one of the toughest defenses the last five or six years in the NCAA that anybody has ever seen.

And then he took over, and they actually started winning some games this year. And it was, I think it was a disappointment to some Wisconsin faithful, especially some guys that understood who Jimmy Leonard is and what he's all about. And not only did he not get the head coaching job, but he's not even going to be on staff moving forward.

So I think that's a disappointment. I'm a little disappointed in that, but I'm happy if you can get somebody in Wisconsin that could actually be competitive. And I love Paul Chris. He was the offensive coordinator when I was down in Wisconsin back in 08. And, you know, I have nothing but love and respect for him.

He, you know, hit me up. And it's just tough not seeing your school win games when Wisconsin has always been a powerhouse, always been a top 25 top team, always make it to good bowl games. And it just sucks not seeing that. So hopefully Fickle is that answer. You know, they chose to go elsewhere instead of Jimmy Leonard.

And look, hopefully he is a quality hire. But just know the Big Ten is not getting any easier. I don't know when UCLA is coming in there.

And what is it? USC? Yeah.

Is it USC too? Are they coming in next year? 2024.

Okay. So two more years. So he'll still be there then. The Big Ten is going to get tougher. You know, in Ohio State and Michigan are always kind of, you know, those, those dogs in there. And then you got the Michigan States of the world that always like to upset people. So, so does Iowa, you know, submit the Big Ten is going to be a tough schedule, no matter how you look at it.

And I would like Wisconsin to be competitive in a very tough conference. Yeah, I think Fickle's, I understand what you're saying with Leonard. And I think a lot of fans are conflicted because Leonard was their guy, was the one they wanted to see. But all I got to say with Luke Fickle is he got Cincinnati to the college football playoffs. So I think it's a pretty damn good hire if you ask me.

Absolutely. And like I said, I didn't know too much about him. You know, I kind of looked, looked at him a little bit and did my research on him a little bit and I was like, all right, he sounds like he has, he's a quality hire, but you know, who knows? A lot of quality coaches don't mean you're going to win games.

You know what I mean? Like you got to recruit well. I don't know how well they have been recruiting in Wisconsin because I've heard things about not having a recruiting coach during the last two years, which blows my mind.

Which I think had something to do with why Chris, you know, had to get, you know, got the ax over there in Wisconsin and they have to do a good job. Wisconsin recruited my, my sorry ass over here in New Jersey, but I was only a three star recruit, you know, but that's what they did, man. They found myself, Anthony Davis, Ron Daines, we're all New Jersey guys. P.J. Hill from New Jersey, like they got guys from all over the country. They're not just focused in the Midwest and they were able to go on the floor to get some good players out of there, go in Texas and California, get some good players out of there.

So as long as they can keep up with, with the recruiting, especially these next, these first two years on the fickle, I think they can be okay and be competitive in the Big Ten. JC, Jonathan Casillas, appreciate the time as always. You be well, my friend. See you soon. Thank you. You too.

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