The Science Cartel, the College Scam, and the DOGE Defenders

Okay everybody, welcome back to the Bitcoin.com studio to The Charlie Kirk Show. We are here live in Phoenix, Arizona with Blake.

Also, my conversation with Antonio Gracias from the White House. Email me as always, freedom at charliekirk.com. That is freedom at charliekirk.com. Get involved with Turning Point USA, which is the most important organization in America, at tpusa.com.

That is tpusa.com. Email me as always, freedom at charliekirk.com. I love hearing from you. That is freedom at charliekirk.com. Buckle up everybody. Here we go. Charlie, what you've done is incredible here. Maybe Charlie Kirk is on the college campuses. I want you to know we are lucky to have Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk's running the White House folks. I want to thank Charlie. He's an incredible guy. His spirit, his love of this country. He's done an amazing job building one of the most powerful youth organizations ever created, Turning Point USA. We will not embrace the ideas that have destroyed countries, destroyed lives, and we are going to fight for freedom.

On campuses across the country. That's why we are here. We are here live in Phoenix, Arizona with Blake. Now, Blake, welcome. We have lots to talk about.

I do have to start this with difficult Roman trivia. Oh, dear. All right.

Just one. Okay. Hit me. All right. I think you're going to get this, though. All right.

I'd better. You're not allowed to get it wrong. What Roman general was awarded the Spoila Opima, the rarest military honor in Roman tradition?

You can't look it up, Blake. For killing an enemy king in a single combat was the only third man in Roman history to receive it. Ah, so the original one who did it, Romulus, supposedly does it. And then.

Ah, what's the second one? Think about it. You have all segment to think about it. Ah, crap.

We're all going to have a conversation. Blake is like jostling back. He killed a Celtic chieftain. And is it Regulus something? I don't fault you for getting it wrong because I can't even pronounce it. So I know what it is.

I know what he got it for. I can't remember the guy's name. The initials are MLC, MLC. There's not that many possible names like it's Crassus. Marcus Licinius Crassus. Marcus Licinius Crassus has it. Unless the chat must be wrong.

It must be OK. So it might be the grandfather or something of the famous one, because the famous Marcus Licinius Crassus is just a really rich guy. And he walks 10 feet over the border with Persia. The younger. It says the younger.

The younger. OK, so this is probably a different Crassus then. You have some homework to do. OK, I'll have to go. I'll have to go polish up on the spoiler. Just to be fair, I asked chat GBT for the hardest Ph.D. advanced level questions. Really?

Ah, so they have another fun, hard one. I will. You got to earn it.

All right. But speaking of which, so there's so Blake, I stumbled upon this about someone in D.C. I was just at D.C. recently. I was at the White House and they said, Charlie, we really think you should do a segment to look into this because it deals with the college scam, the college cartel. I never even heard about this. I thought this was a water company, Springer Nature.

I thought like this is like Dasani. And it's all about basically academic journals effectively funded by the taxpayer. This is a world that most people don't actually know about. So let's first just explain the medium. What is this whole like academic journal world? How does it exist and why does it matter? Okay.

Yeah. So since people might not really grasp this, the way science is conducted in the modern world is basically through the medium of journals. So if you are a researcher at MIT, you'll have a lab, you'll have a study you conduct on literally anything, whether this is medicine, chemistry, computer science, and you'll do a bunch of work and then you'll compile it into a paper. And it could be 10 pages long. It could be 500 pages long. You'll compile it into a paper.

And then the way you make it official is basically you will submit it to a journal. The most famous journals are Cell. That's a medicine journal.

Nature, Science. But there are literally thousands of these journals. So you'll have the, you know, the Journal of Applied Epidemiology.

I just made that up, but I assume it exists. And you'll have math journals and history journals and social science journals and they'll get really specific. I'm looking at a list, for example, that are offered by the company we're talking about today. And they have, you know, angiogenesis, JMST advances, Jewish history, mathematical programming, mathematical programming computation, mathematical sciences.

There are tons and tons and tons of these. And getting published in these papers is essentially, it's how you suggest your work is legitimate and it's how you get prestige. It's a lot more prestigious if you have a paper in Nature, one of the most famous journals, than to have it in a very obscure one. And some are more selective than others. So there are journals that are basically open access.

You can just publish with us and that's it. And it doesn't really accord it a lot of legitimacy. And there are some that, because they're more prestigious and allegedly they have more strict peer review, the research is presumed to be better. And so where the Doge taxpayer thing comes in is that there's this whole analysis about the Department of Education. Where's this money going? And so you have some of these numbers here. So Springer Nature, this company, which is one of the biggest incumbent actors, is effectively funded by the Department of Education because these colleges spend hundreds of millions of dollars on these journals. What are they even spending the money on? Exactly.

So let's lay this out. Springer Nature is a, I think it's a joint British-German company. It's European. And they recently went for profit. It's listed on a stock exchange somewhere. And what they do is they own hundreds, thousands of these journals, including Nature, as the name suggests. And the main way you get access to these, you can't just freely read them, which is a problem in its own right, because we'd probably have better science. It's all paywalled. Yeah, it's all paywalled. And they're huge paywalls. And if you think tuition goes up a lot, the expense to have access to these journals goes up even faster.

I haven't looked at it recently, but I've occasionally seen numbers like they'll hike at 30 percent in a year, the cost to get these journals. And they'll charge this to universities. So people might know this if they've been in a university recently. Like, oh, if you, I remember this actually at Dartmouth, since I was at Dartmouth, I could basically just read any article at any journal. That's actually pretty helpful.

And that's very helpful if you're, you know, trying to be an academic in anything. But normal people don't have this access. Schools pay for this.

And the way they pay for it is they pay millions of dollars for these things. I have Springer Nature's price list for 2025. This is individual journals. They're electronic only price. Don't need to get it in paper.

Let's see. Three biotech. One thousand one hundred and seventy one dollars to subscribe a year. Abdominal radiology. Four thousand nine hundred and twenty six dollars to subscribe per year.

I mean, this is acoustical physics. Six thousand one hundred and sixty one dollars. And what they get you with also is they'll get you to sign up for packages of one hundred, two hundred, five hundred journals. And you have to pay for all of them. And it's tens of thousands of dollars a year. And if you multiply that over a bunch of universities, thousands of universities in the U.S., they're all effectively taxpayer funded.

What a business to be in. And the U.S. government itself pays for these, too, because our government agencies will, like the Department of Agriculture, for example, will subscribe to every agricultural journal. And my understanding is they don't do that much negotiation for what the price on this should be. According to what I was sent, they charge researchers upwards of eleven thousand dollars per article.

Yes. So they also get it on the other end. So the justification for all of this is that these places at least, they do the peer review. They're the ones who are checking the research to make sure that it's not bogus. But infamously, peer review is an incredibly weak process.

It's not nearly as strong as it should be. A lot of these journals don't pay scholars for doing peer review. It's more like, oh, you pay your dues by doing the peer review on this. And they basically are.

And then you end up with these costs. It can cost you thousands of dollars to publish your own scientific paper. And there's even last year there was an antitrust suit brought against Springer Nature and some of the other big publishers where allegedly they just do cartel-like behavior. It sounds like a syndicate.

Yeah. Like they agree not to. They make it so you can't submit your paper to multiple places so they might compete over it. So like if there's a really high value paper, they could maybe bid, we want this published in our journal. But they prevent that through cartel-like behavior. And they collude to not pay peer reviewers.

Well, for example, one of the major reasons we have large language models that are advancing was the Google paper in 2017 by eight authors. You know about this where it was the famous, I can't remember the name of it. We'll find it out. But I think they released it to the world. There are people who will do that. And they didn't put it down behind some sort of a syndicate.

And so I want to dive more into this in the next segment because I owe you another Roman history question. But Springer Nature is an example also of like why college is so bad. I mean, it's like and some of these are very poorly managed publications as well. Yeah. I mean, some of these are the publications that get literally scammed where you write that fake paper. That's all like, you know, feminist biochemistry, blah, blah, blah. And you can just try and a lot of the COVID stuff like ran through some of the yes.

Yes. That's another issue with them. And also they're more ideological. You're getting nature running articles that are just screeching at Trump. And that's part of the journal.

And, you know, ideally that's not really related to scientific research, but they use their prestige, which we are paying for to do this. Did you prove chat GPT wrong? I think so. Yeah. You said Marcus Licinius Crassus. Totally not that guy. Yeah. This is Marcus Claudius Marcellus.

He killed a Gallic chieftain during the peanut. All right. I'm going to I'm going to scold chat GPT then. I'm going to say you're wrong about number five. Incorrect answer. Yeah, it's actually correcting it.

It's it's now says Marcus Claudius Marcellus. Yeah. Was that the answer you first gave? It wasn't the one I gave, but I looked it up because it didn't sound right. Got it. So it corrected itself.

Blake, correcting chat GPT is quite a sight to be seen. Email is freedom at Charlie Kirk dot com. Based on everything I'm seeing about the Springer nature thing, I think it's time for some sort of investigation. Why would the federal government be indirectly funding this basically this cartel, the syndicate from poorly managed publications and also all the covid nonsense that's there. Like I owe you another question. So stay right there.

But I think it's time for someone to look into Springer nature. Private student loan debt in the U.S. totals about three hundred billion dollars. Give Y refi a try at Y refi dot com y r e f y dot com may not be available in all 50 states. Just call 8 8 Y refi thirty four. Log on to Y refi dot com.

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So many Americans feel stuck and helpless and they've even lost hope. So you guys can get out at Y refi dot com. All right, Blake, what obscure Roman official often overlooked in modern discussions was tasked with investigating the moral conduct of senators and equestrians during the Republic and had the authority to expel them from their ranks? The censor? Yeah. Yeah. That's pretty easy. Yeah.

I think they only had the one censor. All right. Then I'll ask you a different one. What Roman law passed in 18 B.C.E. under Augustus was designed to increase birth rates among the Roman elite by rewarding marriage and penalizing celibacy?

I don't. It was an Augustan law. I don't know what the name of it was. It's Lex Julia de Mar.

It's it's Latin. Yeah. Julian Law.

OK. He famously passed it. And then, like, his daughter was kind of a immoral woman and no one would tell him about this.

And then it finally came out. If you ever watch I, Claudius, which you should sometime. I will.

I will. So what just like kind of finishing on this medical journal is not just academic journal thing. So do a lot of these universities pay money because they have to to these. I mean, you have to to be an academic institution. It really is a cartel.

If you secede from it, you are not. You're basically telling your guys that you can't take part in the world of scientific research. And it is true. There are informally what a lot of people do, especially if you just want to be a scientifically engaged normal person who's not working at a university or at the government. You just pirate these things. And there's a lot of that. There's a ton of academic piracy out there. But, yeah, it truly is a cartel. If you're going to be a major university, you they kind of have you over the barrel. And I mean, open source would make a lot of sense.

Open source stuff. But again, there is the real concern. You don't want fake science. And if anyone can publish anything, there will be fake. But ideally, like a company experience nature is supposed to check the science. They're supposed to do that. And one of the big attacks on them is they're clearly not doing that much of the time. A big scandal that just happened recently.

Nature. They published a very important paper on Alzheimer's about 20 years ago. And it recently came out that basically the research for this was falsified.

It was entirely falsified. And literally the last 20 years of research into Alzheimer's may have been a blind alley of completely, completely pointless. And we could have known this all along.

And hundreds of millions, if not billions of dollars of research from taxpayers was directed towards this blind alley that, you know, in theory, nature should have caught. Yeah. I mean, and there's this example after example here of like gauging in censorship. Yeah.

Yeah. They they censor stuff in China. Like, you know, we don't care for that.

I don't even necessarily want to fixate on. They were definitely involved in discouraging the lab leak hypothesis from COVID. I don't want to bash that because it's fine to hypothesize whether it was natural or from a lab leak. But if they were putting their finger on the scale, which there's evidence that they did it, they've done stuff for the Chinese government. Exactly. And so if they're censoring on the Chinese government, it may be very well that.

And they can also choose what journal, what articles they select. So if it's within the realm of possibility, how much power these institutions, enormous amounts. It's one of those hidden things. We see the high cost of tuition at universities. We see the degree cartel. And you even see things like people know how textbooks have gotten way more expensive, way faster than college itself has. Similarly, this is one of those background ways. There's like the college scam is even deeper than you yourself describe in the college.

I don't even talk about this in my book. They get scammed like the colleges themselves are getting scammed by like a super college scammer. Like a publicly traded scammer scamming. It's like there's like layers of the scam. Yes.

It's like a Russian doll of scamming. Incredible. All right.

Let's finish with one more Roman history question here. Let's see. I almost knew this one, to be honest. I can't I'm not going to do this one. I don't think that one. OK. Hit me with a heart.

All right. This this one, I think you'll get honestly which Roman emperor briefly reigned in one ninety three C during the year of five emperors and was killed by the Praetorian Guard after trying to buy their loyalty. Is that Didius Julianus? Yeah. That one I knew.

OK. What? Replaced by Septimius Severus. That I did not know. I didn't know either.

What you serve for emperor in the third century briefly ruled a breakaway Gallic empire and was later declared by a god by his troops, despite being assassinated by his own. Is this posthumous? Yes. So so is that where we get the word posthumous from?

Looking at things posthumously? I don't think so. I think that's usually spelled differently. Yeah, it is. But I mean, it would have some connective tissue there. So of all the history stuff is Roman the stuff you know the best?

Maybe overall, although if you think in like relative terms, like bizarre Russian, I know a lot about Russia, but maybe not as much as I know about Rome. Someone said to me recently that and correct me if I'm wrong. I heard this when I was in D.C. that trying to get Vladimir Putin to approve this peace deal would be like the fastest military decision for the Russian government in like 200 years. Yeah, they usually move incredibly bureaucratic. They're bureaucratic.

They're slow moving. They don't and they totally do have a history of sort of just being a bit evasive on these things. It's very real, but he might be rope a doping Trump a little bit. We will see. Blake, thank you so much. While we may have won this election, the fight to restore our great nation is only beginning. Now is the time to take a stand and Patriot Mobile is leading the charge. As America's only Christian conservative wireless provider, Patriot Mobile offers a way to vote with your wallet without compromising on quality or convenience. Patriot Mobile isn't just about providing exceptional cell phone service.

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Visit PatriotMobile.com slash Charlie or call 972-PATRIOT. I want to air for you an amazing conversation I had with Antonio Gracias. Antonio Gracias is a very smart man, dear friend of Elon. I had it while I was at the White House, actually.

We got this done. My conversation with Antonio Gracias from the White House. All right, everybody, Charlie Kirk here live from the White House with a very interesting man, Antonio Gracias. Antonio, great to meet you.

Thank you, Charlie. Good to meet you. And so I first became aware of you by reading Walter Isaacson's book on Elon Musk, which we won't spend too much time on all the inaccuracies. But I think it did paint a broader macro vision of quite honestly one of the most compelling people ever to live and the most compelling innovator of our time. You've known Elon for quite some time.

And right now he is villain and public enemy number one of the activist left. Tell us about your story and how you met Elon and what people should know about him. Well, so I met Elon because of PayPal. So I went to law school, David Sachs, and David Sachs was the chief broadcast for PayPal. And so we invest in PayPal. That's how I first met him and then invested. We're the first institutional investors in Tesla. And, you know, we're operating guys by training, right? Built a company in the 90s. So I got deep in operations at Tesla with him.

And that's really when I got to know him and developed a profound respect for his ability to go deep into the detail, to really operate, understand what's going on, and to his desire, truly genuine desire to make the world better. So I find that to be one of the more unique things about Elon is that he's a visionary, but also he's micro. Yes.

It is very difficult to find a macro and a micro combined. Yeah. With drive. I find the combination of those three things to be exceptional. Talk about that. His mind is very unique.

Okay. So to be able to go from the just to the least, right? To go from the very, very top macro strength. Go to Mars. And then zoom all the way down to the like engineering detail of, you know, what the door handle on the car, why it's got to be perfect. It's exceptionally unique. And, you know, what he does is he's able to galvanize terrific engineers, terrific people on a mission because he actually wants to make the world better. He wants to better humanity.

Those missions are huge. But then he zooms all the way to make them happen. Right. So that that combination is exceptionally unique.

Yes. What is his drive? Because a lot of people are trying to ascribe motivations to him. World's wealthiest man. What what keeps him going? Why is he only sleeping three hours a night and obviously putting some of his wealth, you know, not in jeopardy, but, you know, just saying I don't really care. What what is his why?

I think he has a really big heart and he's got these he's a really compassionate man. And I can just tell you one story, please. In during covid, we were reopening the factory at Tesla and I was there with him reopening the factory. And we had employees that were that code and they were some of the hospital ventilators. And he pulled me off the line one day to speak to a woman who only spoke Spanish because I speak Spanish for which and her husband was in a hospital ventilator. And he wanted to tell her that we were there for her and we're there for her family and we would do whatever we needed to to help her husband. And he had me literally in a conference room on a polycon and transit for him, you know, and that is just to see a CEO. And we're in that kind of crisis.

We don't get the factory launch or pickle bankrupt. That's right. The the local authorities of a county. They threatened to arrest him. Right.

Yeah. I mean, I got there because he called me. He's going to open the factory and they were trying to arrest him. I said, listen, come with you. They arrest me, too. He said, no, no, no.

Your job is to get me out if they arrest me. But so I went with him and I found myself in this moment of great compassion amongst all this chaos and tremendous desire where the guy stopped and said, hey, this lady's hurting. She needs some help.

Yes. Like, please come tell her. Help me tell her that we're there for her. And that compassion is what's driving it. That's what that's what this is all about. This is about it's about America. It's about saving America. That's just cutting costs, but saving the entitlement programs for our seniors and for all of our people. The idea that it would this has got anything to do with taking money or doing anything other than making sure people get their payments is totally absurd. Just look at the facts.

It's B.S. I completely agree with that. He has a huge heart for humanity, which I think really is his why. Talk about the last five to 10 years where it went from Elon, the innovator, to all of a sudden he got more and more involved in, you could say, politics, but just kind of some of the cultural issues. And I think his purchasing of Twitter now X will go down as one of the most monumental and courageous decisions for freedom of speech in the history of the species. Yes, I don't think President Trump would have had the movement. President Trump deserves all the credit, but I don't know if he would have the movement behind him. If X would not have existed, we would not have been able to expose the COVID lies or the lockdowns or the open border if it wasn't for a free and open portion of the Internet.

Did you see a moment where really a switch went on, where all of a sudden he saw a sequencing where like, if we don't win back the White House, then these other 100 things that I want to get done for humanity will not be able to happen. Yeah, I think it was a, I'd say a progression that began with a belief in free speech, a fundamental belief in free speech, and what Twitter had done was corrupted free speech. People believed it was free speech.

This is not true. They had no constitutional standard. I was there myself. I asked these guys my selfies questions. There was a long time I went to law school and I took kind of law.

They weren't at all worried about a constitutional standard. They were a private corporation and they could decide what was said and what they were suppressing and actually promoting on Twitter, and it began with that, seeing that this was sort of the center of the woke mind virus being pushed out in the world. That had to stop.

That's really why he did it. I think from that point forward, his mind went, you know, it kind of goes to the biggest problems, right? What are the biggest problems? And from there, it went to, wait a minute, the problem is deeper than just this one thing, Twitter.

It has now infected, the government's infected many of our children. It's, it's, it's, it's gone in native directions and that he believed that President Trump was the right leader. Yeah, right.

So now fast forwarding to today, one can make the argument, I would actually make the argument that going to Mars, having autonomous vehicles, it's going to be far easier than actually getting Congress to want to cut spend. Oh, Joe, I got to tell you, man, this is, I would just speak for myself. This is the hardest thing I've ever done. Okay.

But I want to just pause you. I mean, you have been involved in the hardest things an entrepreneur, an innovator can be involved in. I mean, just what Tesla was up against to get car, car output.

You guys had people short selling your stock. I mean, you've been up against the wall multiple times. Yes, but this is the hardest, hardest. I mean, I look, I started my career doing serious turnaround.

It's been auto factories with unions, all that stuff all the way to Tesla and then Ford, which you've seen in the book. And this is by far the hardest. It's the hardest because first, it's the biggest problem, right? You're talking about an enormous organization, US government and the the I'd say there are very good people. There are some very people are helping really great. And there are people that don't want help. Right. And so you've got the issue, proxy problem going on and the problems are deep, deep, and they're really hard to deal with. So let's talk about that.

I just want to go back a little bit. So Doge was born out of a spirit that our government is wildly inefficient. There's programs that should not exist. And if I were to kind of read into Elon, who I've had the pleasure to get to know and I have enormous respect for it, I think that a switch also went off in his head where he said, hey, if bankruptcy, then no civilization. Yes. Look, we're at 130 percent GP, maybe higher, depends on how you calculate numbers. And the reality is, you know, he's a pretty simple math calculation. We keep going. You know, at some point the currency gets devalued and we turn to Venezuela. That's what happens.

So we have to stop it. And it's, you know, the target here is over 15 percent of the cost. Right. You're an entrepreneur.

You built a great business. If I said to you, hey, try to look, we've got to squeeze 15 percent of the cost of your business. You'd be like, you know, I can do that. Right.

And we try to do that. But if I had to, I absolutely could. Of course you could.

Of course you could. And all my friends, I said the same question. It's 15 percent. It's not that big of a deal. OK. And the government's a big deal because some of the money we're squeezing back here is from people that are stealing it.

So it's, I think it's an important point. The people that are screaming the loudest are the fraudsters. So why are they burning dealerships? Why are they doing all this stuff?

Because we're taking money away from people that were committing a fraud. Such as? OK.

I can just use some IC. All right. At SSA, an example. The Social Security Administration.

Yeah. Social Security Administration as an example. The 40 percent of the fraud can be on the phone lines and do a direct deposit.

So you could get on the dark web, someone's social security number, answer six simple questions, and change the bank information from one place to another. This was 40 percent of the fraud. It was actually about a billion and a half dollars of fraud. Well over a billion dollars of fraud that we know of. That we know of.

OK. So what's the implication of this? If you're a senior like my dad, he's 84, he expects his check. It doesn't show up for a month.

Maybe he notices it, maybe he doesn't. Maybe it's two months. And it's all going to form formal syndicates for taking the money. That's the cash cost. What we can measure and should measure is the headache to the senior.

It was probably short as I'd like to expect. Yeah. I mean think about the stress, right? These people need the money and they've got to go into the office, they've got to fix the problem. They've been subject to identity theft because we didn't have basic two factor authentication. Every bank in America, you have two factor authentication, right?

Why do our seniors deserve less? They don't. We put this in, the fraud went down. This kind of thing is all over the place. And I can tell you, I don't think there's one sort of thread to pull on it, let's go save a trillion dollars.

It's like every business, right? It's a game of inches. It's a billion here and a billion there. But Elizabeth Warren or one of our friends on the other side would say, Antonio, that's just a billion dollars. Listen Charlie, it's a billion dollars in American people's money, OK? That's a lot of money.

I can tell you a crazy story. In 2024, $800 million, quote, fell off the balance sheet of the Social Security Administration. So what does that mean? Gravity applies? Gravity applies, exactly.

What do you mean fall off? That's a question I ask. Because who did it fall to whom?

Exactly, exactly. OK, so what happened was there's a $20 billion balance sheet of money owed to the Social Security Administration, right? Because during the Biden administration, they took, if we overpaid you in some way, it used to be, even going back to Obama, that the Treasury could recoup 100% of the money in, as an example, the retirement program, right? If we overpay you, it was taxed and OK, we take the money back. They reduced the payment plans from, it was three years, up until literally through Obama into President Trump's first term. They took it to five years, then took it down to $10 in repayment. So the payment plans went out past 2047, which is the end of the system day in the computer. What happened? When that $800 million went past the system date, the technicians in the field had to write notes in the computer to be able to collect that money.

Those ones aren't very good. When I met with the auditors myself and asked this question, what happened to the money? The auditor said, it fell off the balance sheet. I said, is that a GAAP term or non-GAAP term?

She was like, listen... So GAAP is Generalized Accounting Principles, right? Yes, of course it is.

Just for the audience. Yes, and they said, what the auditors told us was, you know, it's a $1.5 trillion program, it's not material. But how did they answer that question?

That's how they answered the question, it's not material. I said, it's $800 million. Just to make sure I'm clear, so when I file my taxes in two weeks, can I just say that the money fell off my tax return? No, you went to jail, you went to prison.

Is that an official Internal Revenue Service term? You're absolutely right. Fell off. And we asked this question, we're like, mind boggled.

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I'm a big believer in making sure I get magnesium in my daily regimen. Go to magbreakthrough.com slash Kirk. That is magbreakthrough.com slash Kirk. No, but so I mean, I want to just drill on this one micro example. I mean, don't we have like wire transfer information or like ACH? I mean, money must be sent somewhere, right?

If it's not an account. Yes. Do we have, can we reverse engineer? No. I mean, the money that this particular $100 million have asked this question, the notes that were taken that relate to these debts were so poor that the auditors included. It's not like- Sorry to interrupt, but are the auditors the US government? Are we hiring like McKinsey? No, it's outside auditors. You can go look it up. No, I know. I'm just like, but like they have to stake their entire reputation on this, right? They have. I mean, look, there are, if I remember correctly, about 100 weaknesses in the audit they've identified and they still give us a clean auditing.

So it's demonstration. I've never seen like, I have never in my career in 30 years seen like- So if you, you're an investor, if you came across a company like this, what would be the first thing that comes to mind? I would go home.

I'm only doing this because of the US government and because I believe in America. You would probably report that company to the Department of Justice. I mean, most likely, yes.

I would for sure go home and then maybe call the DOJ. So that's just the Social Security Administration in just one year of what you know of. Yes, yes.

But your critics will say Antonio wants to cut Social Security. Yeah. Categorically not true. Categorically not true.

This is a complete lie. We're trying to save it. And the reality is it's going to run out of money anyway in 2037 no matter what. We have to try to save it. And I can't tell you this is a high-probability event, but it's worth fighting for. You know, going to Mars was really hard.

It wasn't obvious 20 years ago or 15 years ago. It was worth fighting for. This is worth fighting for. I mean, people have paid into the system. They deserve their money. And if we've got to save it 100 million at a time or $10 a time, we're going to fight to save it $10 a time.

We have to. It's their money. That's a really important point. And I want to talk about that for a second because what I find when I talk to bureaucrats, which is not very often, they don't talk to me. But at least those that have, let's just say, bureaucrat worldview. Yes. There is a disconnect of whose money is it. If I did this still, the divide that runs this town. It's the patriots such as yourself and Elon look at you guys as stewards of somebody else's money that is sent into the system, whereas the permanent bureaucracy, they actually view it as the government's money. Yes.

And the people just loaned it and then like sent it back. We collected what was rightfully our. Yeah. Do you think that is a properly distilled analysis? I would break that that the bureaucratic into OK, we've found because everything we found is because people took us right.

We just mapped this. This is whistleblowing. Yeah. I mean, we do what we don't. So it's probably the worst.

It's I think it is probably worse than this. Yes, for sure. But the reason we had the advice we had is because people told us where to look. There are very good people in these in these agencies all over the place. They have been stifled and they are now telling us the truth. They're telling us their truth.

They're asking us where to look. And they're really helping us. I mean, it is is not the case that everyone is bad. This is not true.

I mean, it's like anything. Right. There's great people and there's not. There's some phenomenal civil service.

Yes, absolutely. And they're doing it for a reason. They're here to serve their fellow. They really are. Yeah, they are.

And I I want to honor them and I want to feel compassion for what they what they've gone through because they're frustrated. Look, we went to the border. I can just tell you that the border protection and border patrol, they had the highest suicide rates they've ever experienced during the surge.

This is a human tragedy. Yeah. So the so looking now, you're is it fair to say you're assigned task is the Social Security Administration?

Are there any others under your purview and under the kind of Doge umbrella? Yes. What happened was we mapped the entire system for Social Security from enumeration, how you get the number all the way to the end, how you get payment. We went all the way to the office. In that process, we found this this category called enumeration beyond entry. And it had ramped dramatically.

So it should be for like H1Bs, green cards, this kind of thing. And it was like, you know, call it two to 400,000 people a year every year. And then it goes up and up and up and it doubles every year. And during the Biden administration, it ends up about 2.1 million people.

So if you think about baseline 4,000 to the 2.1, that really caught our eye. You know, one of our engineers, Peyton, actually found this. And he showed it to us because we were like mapping through the whole system. And when we dug into it, we found that the asylum programs were the vast majority of the increase. And so we dug into that. That led us to Homeland Security. It led us all the way to the border to try and figure out what it was, because it's about a little over 5.4 million people or so in total that came in in those years. What we found in the data was that 1.2 million of them were marked as unknown. No one knew what the status was.

1.2 were marked as general parole. This was during Biden's presidency? This is all during Biden's presidency, yes. And by the way, it continued through the first fiscal quarter of the federal quarter of 25, right? So right before President Trump came in. And President Trump has now closed the border, so it's not happening now.

We were just trying to figure this out. We were following the number to complete our map. And I would say we accidentally came across this problem, which led us to the border.

And the people at the border reported, you know, I'd say some of the most disturbing behavior that I've ever heard, where we would, you know, they got so overwhelmed at times. They provide people with, you know, I think all the notice to appear or own recognizance release. They'd have, they'd get in the system with a court date. Once you're in the system with a court date, if you file for asylum when you're in, you can get a form. Just find the form that allows you, once that form is filed, to get automatically enumerated by the S.T. administration to get a number that acts as a benefit programs. We mapped that to the benefit programs. We found these people, some of these people on the benefit programs at scale across the board, and then, you know, just because we were curious, we looked at the voter rolls and we found in a handful of states, we just sampled a handful of states.

We found thousands of people on the voter rolls and many of them had voted. And this was just, I mean, it was, if I hadn't seen it in my own eyes, I'm not sure I'd believe it. First of all, phenomenal work. Just look at all the different layers you had to go through to get to that. I would say, yeah, the team is very tenacious.

You know, the team, the team we have is great. And by the way, again, I want to point out, we wouldn't be able to follow the breadcrumbs if people hadn't told us where to go. That's critical. So two thoughts on that.

Number one, someone had to be issuing the Social Security numbers. Yes. And so that was the Biden administration knowingly just giving them out like they're not like Frisbee space. Yes. I mean, to be clear, this was making illegal people legal, right? But without any act of Congress.

Without any act of Congress, yes. It's illegal what the government did. The programs were there. What they did was, I would say, abuse them. They opened the aperture dramatically in these programs and didn't do any due diligence, proper diligence on the people coming in. And so there is a requirement for diligence.

And I would say that requirement was not met. So the second part is something you mentioned, which I think is a great way to conclude, which is you talk about the team, which I've had the opportunity to meet some of these doge super geniuses. They're young, they're hungry, they're tenacious, they're relentless. They don't sleep. I mean, these are the high IQ patriots that we want in this building. They have been doxxed by the Washington Post and by Wired. They have been singled out and their names and their addresses have been shared. Talk about this group of mostly very young super geniuses that are dedicating their life to save this nation. Yeah.

I made the joke. I call them ninjas. These are engineering ninjas. But these guys could all go get jobs in Silicon Valley for a million bucks a year. Yeah. I mean, plus equity. They would all become very wealthy people.

Right? I mean, I met young people that one of them dropped out of college. He was a senior Harvard. I met him too. He's a rock star. And by the way, there's there's a number of these guys, right?

The guy with closely around. Yes. Guys are really geniuses. They're amazing.

Yeah. They're patriots. They believe in America and they believe in the future. And the future is for them and our children. And I am deeply grateful and very respectful of what they're doing. And they're really, really good. And look, they're also, you know, Joe Gabby is walking around here.

I'm here. There are other. And if you guys weren't standing came out, there are other people as well. Along with the young folks. Right. So we have the engineers. Yep.

And then we have kind of a call. The business people are helping on as well. We've been creating teams around this so that we can cover, I'd say, the entire spectrum of thinking. Yeah.

This is this is a great team. This is almost like the Avengers got assembled to try and come help the government. And I look at credit President Trump. I mean, really in any end. Exactly right.

President Trump. He had the courage for the first time ever. And foresight. OK. This is a really, really, really smart thing to do to sign an executive order that allowed us to go across databases. And otherwise, we could never figure this out.

Could never transcend these bureaucratic. Yeah. They're all silos.

So we had to go across. They do that essentially, obviously. I mean, look, I will say it might be an artifice of like the 1970s databases they have.

I, you know, I won't I won't impute intent, but I will say it's created massive holes for people to commit fraud. And that's what we're looking for. Right. And look, we're doing it with like 2010 technologies and single queries because we can't use AI. Not using AI to do this at all. Why? We can't. You're not allowed to?

Or, you know, it does. I'd say it's about it's above my about my policy grade. But, you know, I mean, I would love to learn the answer because, I mean, we use AI for sports ticket. Right. So I think it's a privacy issue. But I would say that I think that's my opinion. No, I'm not I'm not trying to be on the spot. I just I think that what could be more important. I mean, I think Grok could do some damage.

Yeah, I think I just put it that way. I would say we could use AI definitely would be faster and more efficient. And just imagine what it's like for an engineer who could use AI, to not use it, to use single queries, compare and compare data and try to look for it.

It's really hard, painstaking work. So you're saying that is this just Social Security Administration or all data they're not allowed to use? Anywhere that I know we're not using it.

I've not seen any I use. No. Zero. None.

I'd love to. Yeah. To learn. Yeah. I ask questions on my phone sometimes like, hey, what's the law on this? Because I keep being told it's against the law.

I look on my. Well, that's an important distinction that actually a lot of what they think is law is actually inherited presidential custom. Article two is that the president has the complete vested authority of this branch. So if the president says to use Grok, I mean, is there a law, congressional law that says you can't use AI? Very much doubtful.

Anyway, I don't put you on the spot. I just this is the type of stuff we run into. The final thing is this is all of this would just be will end up as a very well publicized Warren Commission. If you guys don't get Congress to act because there's only so much the president can do.

There's only so many rescissions, impoundment, act, all that stuff. If Congress does not then put forward the president's budget and act upon your discoveries, the audience is salivating to hear marching orders. Talk about how important it is that Article one internalizes all of your findings and then acts on it in this budget. Look, I I would say this. This is a bit a bit above my my thinking grade, right?

I'm very focused on the on the narrow task of fraud, waste and abuse. My opinion is this. The President States is elected by the other people and he has a mandate to make change. And if the bureaucracy is resisting that change, Congress should act to help him achieve the mandate of the American people.

And that's the reality. But it doesn't matter who the president is. The bureaucracy doesn't run this country. The president does. The president appoints the secretaries. The secretaries who dealt with that have been great across the board from V.A. to D.H.S. to social administration.

They really are aligned. And the bureaucracy does not run this government. The president states does along with along with the Congress.

And if we need Congress to act to enforce that, we should. Amen. Antonio, thank you so much for your time. God bless you from I speak on behalf of our listeners and our audience. The fact that people like you that have a ton of wealth, you guys could be in Monaco or you could be in Fiji, literally enjoying all of the blessings you guys have earned. Yeah. Instead, you are here in D.C. in these kind of like dimly lit office buildings going till 2 a.m. looking through spreadsheets without A.I.

to still be attacked by the media and be doxxed is the definition of a servant government. So thank you so much. Thank you. Thanks so much for listening, everybody. Email us as always. Freedom at Charlie Kirk dot com. Thanks so much for listening and God bless.