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Church Cash Reserves

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore
The Truth Network Radio
April 8, 2021 8:03 am

Church Cash Reserves

MoneyWise / Rob West and Steve Moore

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April 8, 2021 8:03 am

These days, churches receive regular reminders of the need to take stock of their financial health. While each church is different, many are finding cash reserves to be a common denominator when it comes to their overall financial health. On the next MoneyWise Live, hosts Rob West and Steve Moore discuss why it’s important for churches to have an emergency fund. Church cash reserves—how much is enough? That’s on MoneyWise Live at 4pm Eastern/3pm Central on Moody Radio.

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This is Doug Hastings, VP of Moody radio and were thankful for support from our listeners, and businesses like United faith mortgage.

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My migraines been in our family is so happy we are united states mortgage mortgage is a DBA of United mortgage Corp. 25 Millville Park Rd., Millville, NY license mortgage backer for licensing information, go to an MLS consumer access.org corporate MLS number 1330. Equal housing lender not licensed in Alaska, Hawaii, Georgia, Massachusetts, North Dakota, South Dakota and Utah. Today's version of moneywise. Live your phone lines are no emergency fund is a key part of wise money management. Only God sees the future, but that doesn't mean we can bear for the land by having a cash reserve.

No, that's also true for church members of the flock.

Churches also need money in the bank or on expenses. But what govern the management of those posts. Rob West tackles the topic today know we are accorded to please hold your calls but we have some great questions already lined up for church cash reserves. That's nice right here moneywise we have shout out to our the Evangelical Council for financial accountability.

They've spelled this out quite clearly in a great article church cash reserves.

How much is enough and will have a link to it in our show notes today@moneywise.org was live.org right exactly right Steve, but will hit some of the high points today. I think I'd like to start with just why it's so important to have a church emergency fund. Your cash reserve. Just like with your personal finances.

Churches need a cushion to ensure that routine expenses are paid on time. Without it, you run the risk of getting hit with late fees.

If there is a mortgage on the church property. You need at least a few months payment stored up to avoid foreclosure. In the event of an interruption in revenue. It's a sad fact the church is split and if half the members leave well. The church could quickly be in dire financial straits and no one wants to have to take a special offering to replace the worn out heating or cooling unit or have to start at zero at the church decides to launch a new ministry so there are plenty of reasons why a cash reserve is essential for the church as well as an individual in the same Scriptures that apply to individuals also apply to churches go absolutely. For example, Proverbs 6, you know it well, go to the you sluggard consider its ways and be wise, it has no commander, no overseer or ruler, yet it stores its provisions in summer and gathers its food at the harvest. Of course, Proverbs 21 will echo this idea the wise store of choice food in all of oil, but the pool go up stairs down by so let's say my church has a healthy cash reserve. They haven't done any gulping of late. I'll go out on a limb and say it's not all lollipops, and wrote rainbows now though I know it's not good planning and wise management of that fund are necessary because there will always be pressures within the church about how it should be used.

Should some of the go toward paying down debt early or to be more generous with the staff were to start new programs know this leads us back to the original question. How much is enough for your churches cash reserve and the folks that experts say it can vary greatly well and that leads to the next question.

How do you come up with that number. Well, consider the two extreme ends of the spectrum, Steve. One school of thought is that the church should have almost nothing in reserve. Trust in God. Instead, on the other end. Some say the church should have an entire year, or more worth of operating expenses in the bank.

I think the answer is probably somewhere in the middle and each church with its leadership has to decide what's right for them. Okay, so what should guide that process. Well first members need to understand that having a cash reserve is simply the faithful administration of God's resources. This honors God and the church has to make it a priority because it's key to giving the world the right impression of the Lord. Next, it's important to build up the reserve during the good times, especially when the church is growing can be a part of the budget process. I know it was when I was chairman of the finance committee and a large church we would build that in and fund our cash reserves each month up to a certain point that we predetermined you can do it in two ways you can budget next year's revenue at, for example, 90% of this year's or simply put a line in the budget for additions to cash reserves, I will.

Let's say I've done that in the church is reserve fund is growing so no, well, it's important to separate the reserve money from designated funds in the event of a revenue shortfall. It would be a disaster to pay the mortgage with money specifically mandated for something else. And speaking of the mortgage.

It's wise to keep mortgage reserves above what the lender might require okay anything else while a couple of things. It's also important to be specific with your cash reserve goals servicing debt capital replacement ministry example is a ministry expansion and finally for any of this to work. Leadership really needs to communicate the importance of having these cash reserves to the congregation.

It doesn't show a lack of faith, it's just simply good stewardship, but clearly communicating that with specific goals in the progress being made toward them is really a part of just faithful administration of the church. Great information will come back and put a bow on it right at if you thought you heard Steve Moore say goodbye. Last week you did, but we're giving you one more week of Steve in the form of encore presentations of moneywise live. Have you with us today on moneywise live were discussing church reserves in the fact that their Facebook question of the day. Why do you think it's important for church to have cash reserves.

Patrick says a church that maintains cash reserves is setting a good example in helping avoid the need to borrow.

If and when an emergency comes up. Bob said it's a model for our personal finances. Everyone should have 3 to 6 months reserve because unexpected expenses can pop up in Rob.

I presume you agree with both of those comments. Oh absolutely Steve you know this is really key for church to really have a process by which they decide what is the right amount of reserves for us and then develop a plan to get there. Again, this is really critical. Just to faithful administration of the church just smoothing out the ebbs and flows of the economy in the giving and all of the things that the church has to do, and it really reflects just prudent and wise stewardship for the church members that the church lives by the same principles that we see in God's word and and certainly would be taught from the pulpit. So I think this is really critical and to the extent it's not being done. I think it's a time to go back and say has the leadership and with the under shepherd the pastor giving ultimate leadership alongside the leadership team.

What is the right amount and how are we going to get there and I think that's just a carefully considered endeavor that we all need to will need to take on if you like to do a little reading about the subject. You might want to consult the article that we've been quoting from today produced by our friends at X for the Evangelical Council for financial accountability. You'll find it in our show notes at moneywise live.Orrick up to Rochester, New York hello Lynn. How may we help you think I really appreciate it. Should need guide pelvic time so that I have a lot get back that I made in the past, but money, student loan, auto loan, credit card debt and medical bill kind of thing from a lot of different direction. I get lost at where to begin and how to get that taken care of quickly as possible and a lot of that that I have unity in interest rate against unbelievable and it would be impossible to pay them off.

You know, in a timely manner. I'm just really looking to get myself out of debt and to our NL building my credit up and I just don't know what would be the best way to do that. Well I think it's it's got to start. First of all Lynn, then you may have Artie done this but with just a careful accounting of what you owe.

So I would look at the assets that you have and then I would look at the liabilities and really have a detailed list of exactly what you owe, to whom and what the interest rate and terms are including the minimum payment. Do you have that right now I don't have that right now. Okay which I'm going through that exercise. Have you gone through that exercise.

At some point.

Okay that's key and I think even if you don't have in front of you right this moment. It's really important that you know exactly what you owe. The next, of course, is to go back to the budget and say okay I realize you have limited resources and so what can you do to dial back expenses. Are there areas you can cut back on their discretionary spending items that need to be eliminated you.

What can you do to free up margin on a monthly basis over and above your taxes over and above your lifestyle over and above the minimum payments to the creditors. At that point we gotta then make a determination as to how is the best way to proceed. You know, we take these different debts and look at them differently because they have different options.

So for instance, you mentioned bankruptcy that would only be considered as a last resort in Alaska have a just a huge negative impact on your credit history and you know we don't view as believers, bankruptcy as a means to get out of paying our debts, even though at some point you may be forced into it and that just may be a reality now with student loan debt, private, or federal. It's very difficult to discharge in a bankruptcy unless you can really prove it in undue hardship like a mental or physical disability, or something like that. So that really wouldn't even temporarily solve the entire problem. So I think the key is to lean into the situation be communicating well with your creditors. Make sure that you even in some cases, provide an example or an illustration of your budget so they can see exactly what you're dealing with and see if they'll work with you with the credit card debt. Specifically, I would be looking toward a debt management program. Have you explored that option with credit counseling. Okay, I'd start there.

They can take a look at your overall debt picture will also help you find to that budget just to determine what's possible and I think if you were to get the credit cards and possibly the medical bill in a debt management program where you got the interest rates reduced and you have a payment every month.

That's not get a decline with the balances, but that fits well within the budget. You'll feel better because you can actually make some progress. You'll play pay these off 80% faster on average through credit counseling, so I'd start their visit with her friend friends of Christian credit counselors.org Christian credit counselors.org as a starting place and then if you have other questions, give us a call back I realize the weight of this is enormous, and I think if you can really get a plan where you can see that you're not just gonna be going sideways and just paying the interest but your actually could be making some meaningful progress. That's probably good to give you the incentive you need. Glinted to really you press on, and perhaps even dial back some of your spending to make progress on other debts like even the car loan so let's start there and then I will look forward to hearing back from you. If you have further questions, then God bless you, thank you so much.

Fargo, North Dakota hello Faye, how can we help you I Faye will check back with a Quad cities Illinois Austin what you question today for Rob talk about finally got through yeah I work six months out of the year and kinda wondering how how do you budget for it working here where you only work about maybe five month well Austin realize that I can create a challenge.

I think the starting place is to say okay with what I can count on in the best way to determine what that is is probably looking at prior years is an estimate it is to say okay what I can count on. During those working months.

I'm going to build a budget based on that and so obviously you would take the total of those six months worth of work and then divide that by 12 and see if you can build a budget that allows you to put all that in the savings and then basically pay yourself the consistent monthly amount out of that that it works with your budget and dial your spending back accordingly. So you're not running through it and then you wondering how you're going to pay the bills, but use those seasons of plenty to store up and then you know draw that consistent amount out almost as if you are getting a regular monthly payment for 12 months you're just accomplishing that through savings during those six months now. The next question would be what can you do during the off months to increase your income because I'm sure you know you could probably use some additional funds. If it's tight based on trying to allow the six months worth of pay the last 12 have you explored other options in the off months to bring in some additional household income. Now that my neck no top of paying yourself or whatnot, but you know the pay scale significantly different.

Tell you now what I did. I travel on pipeline work well.

Then when I got off of the great work you know and I mean it's quite a factor in there hate your and outsell like last year. I only worked in Fremont pipeline work and then I only did to Montgomery great so I let you before that I actually work five months. Great sure in the year before that I want even thick month yeah well you know hopefully you're getting rewarded well for the months you are working. It sounds like you do have some trade skills that would be marketable and so I think the key is to really take inventory of the skills that you have and see where that might apply in other industries. There you know locally where during those off months you could pick up some jobs. Perhaps you could check your local church. You certainly want to work through your local network, both online with things like LinkedIn as well as just friends and family to put the word out. Let them know what skills you have and see if you can make some connections with others. I think that the key is to really balance these two things recognizing you do have a variable income so you need to be particularly diligent with your budgeting to make sure you don't get ahead of yourself spending money you don't have an presuming upon the future. But then in those off months. Make it your full-time job Austin to take inventory of what the Lord has given you in the way of skills and abilities in finding and praying. Frankly, that he would provide some work that would allow you to bring in some additional income will certainly pray. To that end, and would love for you to check back in with us along the way and let us know what you find. Even though it sounds a bit counterintuitive. Rob having a budget when you have an income that they isn't.

Isn't that the same all the time is really vital for you so all you can really do is go back to last year or so, and if you see some sort of a pattern.

If you don't plan if you not expecting any major changes just budget on what's coming over the last couple of years and assume that you know. At least that's the starting point and then have your checks go right into savings so you can really create that monthly stream that's consistent and and then just operate off of that and you know I love Proverbs 22 were talking about a person who's good at what they do or do does something a little different outside the norm.

Proverbs 2229. Do you see a man skilled in his work. He will stand before kings, he will not stand before obscure men begin us and were glad you called us today. Thanks Fargo to try Faye one more time we come back hey you listening to moneywise live with Rob West.

Today's broadcast is recorded so we won't be taking any calls but we have some calls lined up in some great information coming your way, but I think you'll find usable at the very very least, this is moneywise live time Steve Moore will be right back. This is moneywise live your hostess around last times more mentioned today. Please ignore that phone number. Today's broadcast is a freeze addition of the program, but I think the upcoming information will help lessen my Fargo, North Dakota hi Faye you there. This time, my car is banks go right ahead. When I retire at age 66 hours crying I'm taking metal purity criminality. About 2000.

And I also would have a part-time job to supplement that and then I would be leaving my 401(k) along which is around 500 nocturne interests. Around three and half percent.

However, now I am looking at my Social Security and then at age 70 that amount would increase from 2000 to 2800, so they're saying that it's like an 8% increase. So, which one. What I take when I take the Social Security or should I draw from the 401(k) well if you can maintain sufficient lifestyle on your retirement income which clearly you have because you been a diligent saver you have assets to rely on it really usually is best to wait until age 70 to receive Social Security benefits.

Assuming your healthy as you point out, correctly, your benefit will increase Faye by 8% a year until age 70, at which point it will stop increasing but based on what you tell me about this 500,000 in the 401(k) which is in a fixed 3 1/2% obviously know the math works in your favor on the 8%. Now I realize you're giving it up for these roughly 4 years and so there will be a period of time where you're trying to catch up. Through this additional 800 a month for all the money you've quoted quote given up for these four years.

However, assuming the Lord to reason. Again, your health is good.

You will catch. You'll recoup the money you gave up and then you'll enjoy that higher amount for the remainder of your life. Even though you will have you know dipped into the half $1 million what would you need to pull out of the 401(k) Faye in order to be able to cover your living expenses, even while you're working part-time 2000 2500 a month okay so you know what I'm seeing is a mean typically, when we look at our retirement income stream off of retirement assets.

We use a 4% number just to say if it's invested properly and what I mean by that is you'd probably want an investment professional to help you somebody who can make sure you gotta some allocation to stocks, but the majority of it would be invested in fixed income probably bonds in CDs and some cash portion, but that would all be put together with the goal of generating around 4% a year, which would mean that you could pull 20,000 a year before tax and not touch any of the principal.

Obviously you go beyond that, depending upon how it's invested in what the market does and so forth.

You may be beginning to dip into the principal.

But again, you're still building this higher Social Security payment by 8% a year, and if it any point along the way you decide you want to just go ahead and start taking Social Security you can do that and you would still benefit from the higher amount each year that you wait even if you don't wait the full week for so I would say just from my perspective. I like the idea of you delaying the Social Security continuing to work and to draw some supplemental income from your 401(k). I think you be glad you did you get that higher check for the rest of your life in favor going to have to bid you a do we have had a break here, but I hope that information helps you. It sounds like you're in a pretty good space right where you are. Thanks so much, 800-525-7000.

Don't forget to check us out online moneywise live.org. Lots of great information free resources also available on their website moneywise live.org Seymour retired his cohost and Rob West vacation. So this weekend's encore presentation moneywise live in St. Louis mole and Gloria what you said about church about their year old heart with joy. The church died three years ago and I am a faithful provider that are charged $15,000 for repair, and with the church that tomorrow and in most of our members that are there are retired members by the like. Any idea that you can give me that we can you for repair to eliminate historical area, but the billing that beautiful and you can you can edit the charge at one time was beautiful but now I for sure know yeah I have certainly understand the question and in the challenge. Frankly, I mean IBC that is a very small church and was like a house church and it sounds like the perhaps you if you have a building for that number of people you're always going to be at a disadvantage because if God's people are the means by which we fund God's work through the local church.

The others just not enough people there to be able to do that.

How are you all paying the bills, let alone keeping the repairs done with that with that few church members and nonmember pioneer like every exit and I get a court would get to get a ticket ever. You said there's six church members is a well yeah I think the key here is you know just to really pray and ask the Lord for some direction. Obviously it sounds like I would imagine just thinking about you all having a building in trying to do ministry and you got a pastor who has needs and you know that's just one person, let alone any other church staff. I don't see how it's even possible to cover that and so certainly it's not beyond what the Lord can do but just given so few people I think really the next opportunity to say Lord what you have for us and really begin to think about contracting others, inviting them to join the congregation so that the body of Christ can expand for greater fellowship greater study of God's word but also so there's more folks so supporting the work of the church of the church can do its ministry there locally and beyond, which would include keeping the God's house provided for in making sure that the everything is functioning properly. The repairs are done so you clearly I don't have an answer for exactly how that can be done apart from just some real focus time of prayer asking the Lord to give wisdom as to how you can proceed and certainly I'd love to hear how this turns out it's not beyond the Lord to provide for everything that's needed, even just with those folks that are right there and yet perhaps other some others that will come along that will join the congregation that could be a part of God's people funding the work of the Lord, I realize it's probably a challenge and I'm really just fascinated to hear what the Lord been doing even to this point. With just those six church members know Rob. I've been involved earlier in my life in churches that small but as you mentioned, they were all house churches that ultimately moved to a larger facility of some sort. Sometimes it's a commercial facility. Sometimes special church building. Sometimes it might be the public library or some sort of public building but Gloria, the one thing I I'd urge you to be careful of just in case it comes up is don't go into debt.

Don't use your credit cards to fund the ministry that's going on there. We don't see anything like that in Scripture, and you certainly don't want to run the risk of hurting one another's credits and relationships as well, but will pray with you about this and please let us know how things work out. Thank you very much for calling you go from a church of six members to up to Chattanooga were married. Your church is considerably larger than that for you know, growing and expanding the American church is overall not church that Rick wrote where were also comfortable in our churches with sharing everything that we need with the needs of the world in several countries clean water and structure and things like that is really struggling. I know we plan to support local churches with our time between the world that are so hard in this country well. Mary certainly resonate with what you're talking about and you know I think the key is to first of all, wherever the Lord has you for that season where Commandant encouraged just again and support God's work. You know that the local church is God's plan and that's really where we should start with our giving, and I would encourage us to give on a systematic basis and I think using the principle of the tithe is a great way to do that as to how the church allocates those resources ultimately were under the leadership on the authority of the local church, but that doesn't mean that as a church member, you can ask a question so what may be the next appropriate thing. Mary is for you to schedule a visit with somebody on the church leadership just to get an understanding of the vision of the church and how do they plan to balance both the physical needs of the church, both today and expanding to accommodate more people that the Lord may bring in conjunction with the meeting the needs of those in the local community into your point even beyond because there is an unlimited number of needs out there and clearly part of the role the local church is to be about proclaiming the truth and sharing the gospel and even to the ends of the earth, and even meeting some physical needs there in the local community, but ultimately we have to trust that the pastor and the leadership team that's been put in places really spilled spending focus and diligent time in prayer hearing from the Lord as to what that looks like for that local congregation and to the extent it's not been made clear.

I wouldn't hesitate to ask questions, but I think at the end of the day. Once you understand the philosophy and the decisions that are being made, perhaps even a bit more understanding of the vision of where the church is headed both with the local facilities and the ministries beyond the four walls. Then at that point, the extent to which God has you there.

I think we need to trust the leadership of the church and really support the work unless the Lord ever calls you a way to somewhere else and you know even though that's perhaps difficult at times, especially of maybe a decisions made. We don't agree with. I do think that's really though, the role of the body to come under the leadership of the local church which is really God's plan. All right. We appreciate your call today. Thanks very much Rob, we have a quick email.

Here I think. I think it's quick anyway. It's from Morton and he says dear Rob can you tell me where to go. The best place to go to get a free credit report 20 think yeah couple places was some funny names that one is called credit Karma credit Karma.com and the other is called mirrored wallet.com. Those will give you your credit score which she was not free until very recently. If you're looking for just a credit report.

Go to annual credit report.com and you can get that free of charge okay and if you like to send Rob a brief email yourself. Keep it brief addresses questions at moneywise.Archie will be right back. This we hope you're enjoying this encore presentation of the program and the children is next week for the all new version of moneywise lie Rob West and have your lawn today I moneywise live on Steve Moore, your host is Rob West were chatting with people all across the country. Let's continue to do that by going South West Palm Beach Alan. We appreciate your patience, my friend. How can we help you. My question was related to the first collar I heard and it basically how your Social Security benefits are calculated. I was under the impression that if I were tired and my income fell off making contributions to purity of that Maya might benefit would be reduced because they look at your contribution. Yes that's right so you have to work a minimum of 40 quarters or 10 years to be eligible, and then once you retire Alan that whether it's 62 full retirement age or you wait until 70 and your benefits will not decrease.

At that point they may increase with the cost of living adjustment but that will go down now. The method, the Social Security administration uses is a bit complicated. Enter in determining your benefit amount, but they basically take your earnings over 35 years of your working life. Adjusting for inflation, divide them by 35 if you work that long to get the annual average and then divide that by 12 to get your monthly average earnings and then use that to determine your monthly benefit amount. One of the challenges in retiring early is that often you will drop some of those higher earning years that you know we would typically see pre-retirement because you're in the prime of your working life and your adding some of those higher earnings years. Two years that you when you were first starting out, perhaps, that were lower and so that's where you'd see a reduction as you're knocking to get the benefit of those higher years that would then be factored into the average you would still get benefits, but often times you wouldn't get as much if you work for a full 35 years and you know the last 10 years or more, you know, you were earning peak income.

It doesn't make sense. Well yes and the government sort of way but they don't stop averaging at age 62 eight they stop averaging based on when you stop contributing or when you like officially no health but your expires are not working anymore of that work.

Now that I'm 60. Results of the minor thing is that you will actually as you're continuing to pay in an urn that's going to still be factored into your overall calculation so you know there's not a cut off, at which point there are no longer factoring in that income. So if you continue to work. That's gonna be factored into this formula that's going to determine your average over this over your working life which would then affect your monthly average and then ultimately determine your benefit amount at the point at which you start taking Social Security so the extent to which again you're dropping some of those earning years that were on the higher end that would have been factored in alongside some of the earlier years were maybe want making as much. You know that would potentially pull you down a bit so something to consider. Doesn't mean it's not the right thing but it's just understanding that formula can really help is your thinking and planning about your work life appreciate your call. Thank you so much yes or thanks buddy appreciate that, but willing Illinois next Elaina you're on with Rob West and absolutely likely help you know, I know, but right now 60 pounds on its first have a college education. They won't go any farther within the same hotel but better opportunity going to this hotel and learning market to keep learning back to his Social Security flank pain cut yeah well you know it's not going to affect in the sense that he'll continue to earn in those earnings years will be factored into the formula.

Anytime you take a reduction in pay. That's going to be factored into the overall average but again, the average is going to come from 35 years of work so you know whether a minor reduction bill in the twilight of his working life is going to make a dramatic impact on the ultimate benefit amount. Probably not a mean certainly if he has five years that are factored in at a lower number than where he was previously then yes it will have some impact. The question is, is it enough for him not to switch jobs and follow what might be the leading of the Lord somewhere else where he either feels like you'll be you'll be able to serve better. It's a better environment for him or his skills would be better suited for that particular job. I wouldn't allow potential Social Security benefits to derail that but at the end of the day. The formula is is driven by his earnings over his 35 years of working life, and any time a year is going to come in lower than the previous year. That's can be a part of the calculation takes a slight use of topical optic and lots of great working law now and right doing more. I wouldn't let that hold me back if that was really where I felt like he was the place I should be moved thoughtfully and that knowing that the Lord will provide and the impact is probably to be somewhat minor regulator S thanks so much. Let's go down a little further south than we normally go down to Bermuda and Jamil. We know you been patient. We appreciate that what your question for Rob Lowe problem really enjoyed. I think my wife is time to get some advice but trying to figure out how to honor God with every penny that we have been very difficult second child and which on the artwork trying to navigate to buying a house number made about cost about here, and I also have $7000. All hail debt on that also track hot and difficult to become functional little while all the other things that made at that time… Wait.

Get the full 10% would you recommend for someone young like me trying to figure out how to navigate and and thought out about different called yeah well Jamil.

Obviously you got to some challenges and when I realize that especially when you're starting out. We've all been there, and it can be very difficult with competing priorities and limited resources, especially when you're living someplace that has a higher standard of living and things just cost more, as you point out during the a beautiful part of the world, but you're paying a premium for that as well so it's all got to come back to starting with Lord, what would you have me to do. You gotta pray that prayer you and your wife saying what you called us to water our values what's important to us. We realize the this is your money.

Lord, you've got us here right now and as long as you have us here working to live within her means and trust you for your provision. Now how do we allocate those resources.

Well, we've got to make sure that were not living beyond God's provision. We gotta be content with what we have. So that's going to dictate your lifestyle. Everything from when you might be able to buy a house to how you go about putting food on the table and providing for your family as well as how you over time. Get out of debt. So I would start with that spending plan of that budget to say okay what's coming in.

What we have to pay for toward taxes. Were we giving what we pay in toward minimum payments. And then what we have to live on in the goal would be to free up margin beyond that to do three things right now in priority order number one would be to build up an emergency fund of at least one month's expenses on your way to three and ultimately six months number two to be able to take that margin and and really focus on trying to get that student loan payment paid down. I'd really make that my priority right now even beyond and before buying a home, so you really can and can concentrate on eradicating that debt and then ultimately number three would be starting to save for that down payment. Figuring out how much you can afford. I probably use 25% your take-home pay for principal, interest, taxes and insurance as a guide, but remembering that you live in an expensive part of the country or the world. You may not be able to do that and you may need to come up in terms of overall percentage but then everything else is to come down with it. So I think you gotta pray through a don't try to get ahead of yourself, though, in terms of buying something too soon, especially given where you live. I'd really focus on dialing into that budget demonstrating. You can live within your means and trying to free up margin for both emergency savings, debt reduction, and then once you feel like you have a good handle on that debt, you're making some progress. You can see yourself being able to pay it off in 5 to 10 years and I think at that point we start working on saving for that down payment but I think the key is not to take on too much too soon because you have so much on you right now you're young you're just getting started. And so I'd really take those in priority order and really make it a matter of prayer as well start about everything God, yeah.

What about light I think that's right Jamil, I think yeah you give. Gotta start with what is your gross income. Gotta make sure your taxes are paid. We want to give systematically to the Lord. Gotta make sure your your debts are paid at a minimum the minimum payment and then we gotta live on the rest.

But we want to live in such a way that we have some access coming out so we can fund savings we can add additional money to dad and then ultimately begin saving for the longer-term Jamil. We appreciate your phone call today when we wish you guys the very best as you work through this best you can do it one step at a time. Be generous and watch works miracles in your life again would let you get through today. Thanks very much you've been listening to moneywise live with your host Rob West moneywise live is a partnership between Moody radio and moneywise media.

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