Big Questions About Faith-Based Investing

Welcome back to Truth Network.

I'm Steve Moore. Big questions about faith-based investing. That's next on MoneyWise Live. Rob Eventide is an investment company that specializes in faith-based investing and a financial underwriter of this program. Our guest Jason Meyer spends his time helping audiences understand the importance of faith and values when we invest.

Well, and nobody explains it better, Jason. A real delight to have you back on the program with us. Thanks so much, Rob and Steve. Great to be here.

Thank you. Jason, some listeners may not be familiar with faith-based investing despite a growing discourse in this country, in the investing world. So why don't you begin today with a definition?

Sure. So if you take a step back and you just think about investing for a moment, what is investing? Well, investing is simply company ownership. So when we invest, our money will go to purchase small ownership stakes in real businesses and any of the financial return that we receive will come from the activities of the businesses that we own.

Hopefully this makes sense. Now, if we think about that, I think that we can understand that biblical stewardship and investing can be thought of as a two-sided coin. One side of the coin is about getting a good return. The other side of the coin is about how that return is being earned, the kinds of companies we own, the products and the services and the business activities that are generating the profit. And both are important, right?

Good stewardship affirms both without sacrificing one or the other. Good returns are important and so are the kinds of companies that we own. And so faith-based investing is a way to seek a good return by investing in companies that are a good reflection of our faith convictions, our beliefs, our values, and our ethical commitments in life.

Yeah, that's really helpful, Jason. But really the key question is why does faith-based investing matter? What makes it so different from traditional investing? Yeah, the problem that traditional investing has today is that it's become all about the numbers, that it's focused just on the returns and that we've lost sight of this connection to businesses and the activities of business.

Let me give you a story that I think illustrates this. So a few years ago, I was attending a large investing conference and I was listening to a famous portfolio manager talk about his investing process and I'll never forget it. He said, I pride myself on not knowing what's in our portfolios.

I want you to think about this for a moment. The portfolio manager said his job is to pick the companies or his portfolios that his clients will then own. And he's saying that he considers it a point of pride to not even know the names of the companies that he's choosing.

Now, why would this be? Well, you might've guessed he's a numbers guy. He's a quantitative investor. And so when he's looking at a stock and evaluating it, if it's got the right combination of numbers and metrics, well, hey, good.

And it makes it into the portfolio. And he's so disciplined about this. He actually removes the names of the companies from his view so he can just focus on the numbers.

And I think that we can appreciate the level of discipline that he has here, but we're missing something, right? We're missing that other side of the coin. We've kept the returns, but lost sight of the importance of the kinds of companies that we're investing in. And so if we think about investing as just the numbers, the charts and the facts and the figures, I think face-based investing isn't going to make a lot of sense to us. But if we just get behind the numbers and remember that investing is company ownership, I think face-based investing makes all the sense in the world, right? It's just to ask, well, what are the companies that we own here? Where's the money coming from?

What are the products and the services and the business activities that are generating the profits that are funding my future? And from a faith perspective, how do we feel about all of it? And we have to remember that the wide world of business has a lot of products, services, and activities on offer. And not all of them are a good reflection of our faith, right? So you can think about tobacco or abortion or pornography, things like that. And many of us can sort of unknowingly and unwittingly end up profiting from these things through traditional investing when the focus is just on the financial returns themselves. Well, Jason Meyer of Eventide is with us today.

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Yep, she did. Cool. Can I have it? No, we need to bring it back.

Why? They made the mistake. Yeah, but it's not ours. What if someone saw you drop a dollar bill, but they decided to keep it? Well, that wouldn't be right. They'd know it was mine.

And that's exactly what we did. Come on. Okay. Uh, ma'am. What?

Excuse me, but I think you gave me too much change here. Uh, okay, whatever. She didn't say thanks. She didn't even know it was missing. It doesn't matter.

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That's ChristianCreditCounselors.org, or call 800-557-1985. Good to have you with us today. It's MoneyWise Live with Rob West. I'm Steve Moore, and we're joined today by phone with Jason Meyer of Eventide when it comes to faith-based investing. He's our go-to guy. He can help us understand it and explain it, and that's exactly where we are right now.

Rob? Well, I'm excited that we get to explore this topic periodically, because frankly, so many of our listeners are unaware that their values can be reflected in the companies they own, and the word own is key, because as you said before the break, Jason, stock investing is ownership. It's ownership in real companies, albeit in small percentages. So, summarize for us again as we continue to unpack this, why that matters.

Yeah. One of the things that's been helpful for me is to see that every dollar that flows into my wallet or into my bank account, into my IRA, into my 401k, it's not just a dollar. It's a dollar with a story associated with it, a story about how that dollar was earned. And I think that God cares about the dollar, but I think that he also cares about the story, the story about how that dollar was earned.

And I think that he wants it to be a good story, right? A story about business activities that helped my neighbor, that improves the lives of others, that blessed others, that brought about a measure of rejoicing in the world. And faith-based investing is a way for me and for you to pursue good stories behind the dollars that we're earning in our investment accounts. It's to not just pay attention to the dollars themselves. Yeah.

That's helpful. We've talked today about the impact that it can make in our lives, knowing that we're involved in these companies and we can have alignment with our values. But what about the impact in the world? Does faith-based investing actually make a difference in the world?

Yeah. I think a lot of people are skeptical about this. And the reason for this, we think, oh man, my tiny IRA, my tiny 401k, I just have this small amount of money.

And what difference could it possibly make? The thing we forget about is this, all the other people who are bringing their tiny IRAs and tiny 401ks. If you're investing in a mutual fund, there's an asset manager who's taking our tiny IRA and tiny 401k and pooling it with hundreds of thousands of other investors. And at my company, we manage more than 6 billion. So we're often a top 10 shareholder in the companies that we invest in.

And we have to remember, it's not just me. Through faith-based investing, you are joining a vast coalition of other investors who are strategically allocating their capital alongside of you to see the world rejoice. And I think that this has a tremendous impact on reshaping the world.

Dr. Henry Cloud, who I think spent on your program before, offers a helpful illustration. He says, look at an ant. An ant is carrying this one tiny grain of sand. But then you look, and there are all these other ants who are bringing their grains of sand. And together, they build this large anthill with remarkable sophistication and complexity. And it's like that with investing.

My amount of money, it might amount to a grain of sand. But then we look, and there are all of these other investors. And collectively, we're building something remarkable, and I think changing the world in the process.

I love that illustration. You know, working together, our investments can in fact change the world. There's another aspect to this, though. We've talked about it recently on the program.

I want to get your take on it. And that is the idea of shareholder engagement, engaging companies directly and using your position as an owner in the company to affect change. Talk about your view on shareholder engagement and what's happening in this space.

Yeah, yeah. So investing is company ownership. We've talked about this. And this ownership comes with a governance power at companies. As an owner, you have a voice at that company. And as an owner, you know, you can change the board, you can change the CEO, you can change the mission statement. And Christians have used this governance power to affect major world change in history.

Let me give you an amazing example of this. So if we go back to the early 1970s, Christians were very concerned about apartheid. For those of you that may be fuzzy on this history, apartheid is a word from a South African language that means separation, you can translate it literally as a parenthood, or to keep separate. And it's a word that describes an institutionalized racial segregation of the black population from the white population in South Africa in that day. And besides being separate, the black population was treated as inferior. So Christians were very concerned about this. And government pressure wasn't working.

So the South African government had already ignored multiple United Nations sanctions and embargo. So what do you do? You're a Christian, you care about this issue? Well, a group of Christians decided to take up the power of investing to change the world using this shareholder engagement. So a group of episcopal investors decided to file what's called a shareholder resolution with General Motors, the automotive company. General Motors had operations in South Africa. And so these investors said, hey, we're owners of GM, let's ask GM to change their way. And they enlisted the help of a person named Leon Sullivan, who was a black Baptist minister, and someone who was also passionate about this cause. And they came up with what are called the Sullivan principles, a set of specific proposals for General Motors that would satisfy the investor concerns with things like equal pay for equal work, same working conditions for blacks and whites, integrating restrooms and water fountains, those were separate at the time, things like that. And General Motors said, we'll do it. In fact, this is amazing. They bring Leon Sullivan, this Baptist minister, onto the board of General Motors to oversee the whole thing.

And then guess what happened? Ford and Goodyear, two other automotive companies that had operations in South Africa, they said, we'll do it too. And one by one, like Domino's, the culture begins to change. And history remembers that one of the key instruments in the fall of apartheid, if not the key instrument, was actually this investor pressure. And by the way, these investors, they had a 0.004% interest in General Motors and yet they changed the world.

They changed the lives of millions of the black population in South Africa for the better. That's an incredible story. But I think we have time maybe for one last question. And I think it's a big one if you don't mind, but can we still pursue a competitive return through faith-based investing? Yeah.

You know, I believe the answer to that question is yes. So in the early pioneering days of faith-based investing, I will admit that it was much harder. There were a lot fewer choices. The costs were higher. But in the last two decades in particular, faith-based investing has evolved now into a global movement where there are now hundreds of billions of dollars flowing toward this approach. And the landscape has changed.

We've got dozens of options now. The costs have come down. Through market competition, performance has gotten better. Faith-based investing funds have oftentimes won awards and recognition from secular Wall Street on the basis of performance alone. Now, I got to say, of course, past performance is no guarantee of future return.

All investing involves risk, including the possible loss of our money. But I think that faith-based investing has matured to such an extent that we can now pursue our faith convictions in the way that we invest while at the same time pursuing an attractive and competitive rate of return. Well, it's an exciting time to be alive, Jason, because you're right, we can reflect our values and our decisions related to our financial planning, but also in our investments. And you've given us examples today about how not only we can make a difference in the world, but how we can change corporate America through even our fractional ownership. Jason, always a joy to have you with us, my friend.

We always learn a lot. Thanks for being here. My pleasure. Thanks for having me. And to learn more about faith-based investing and Jason Meyer and their organization, visit their website, investeventide.com. Your calls next at 800-525-7000, 800-525-7000. I'm Steve Moore. We'll be right back after this. Have you ever taken a wrong turn when it comes to money?

We all have. And while you can't undo past mistakes, you can steer clear of the financial potholes ahead. This month's issue of the MoneyWise e-magazine is all about helping you make MoneyWise decisions with exclusive podcasts and articles to steer you in the right direction.

Your free e-magazine subscription is waiting for you right now at moneywise.org slash sign up. And they claimed the land that God had given them. When they divided up the land and they were given their divisions, they took their banner in, whack, they set the thing down because it said, this is our possession. We are laying claim to this land.

It is our. So it was also possession. And usually it was not just laying claim to a space or a property.

It was laying claim to a space or a property that you had fought for. And you had known the thrill or the work or the participation of still having the sweat wet on your brow. You know, I've thought so many times about the championship rings that these professional teams get when, when they've been proved the best in the nation. I've always thought to myself, how different would it be for the ones that sat on the bench that never played, as opposed to the ones that were out there that had no telling what kind of scars and bruises, beaten half to death, but they knew the thrill of putting on the championship ring with the sweat still wet on their brow. There's something incredibly wonderful about that.

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Again, that's BethMoore.org. God cares a great deal more about our money than most of us imagine. In fact, Jesus says more about our use of money and possessions than about anything else, including both heaven and hell. In managing God's money, author Randy Alcorn breaks it all down in a simple, easy to follow format that makes it the perfect reference tool if you're interested in gaining a solid biblical understanding of money, possessions, and eternity.

Managing God's money is available when you click the store button at MoneyWiseLive.org. Hello and welcome. It's a fabulous Friday here on MoneyWise Live.

So good to have you out there today. Now, if we can help you with anything financial after all, the name of this program is MoneyWise. If we apply some wisdom to your money, that would come from God and his word.

But whether your question involves saving or giving or investing or what God wants you to do or to build or buy or sell, let's chat about those things. 800-525-7000. Rob West here taking your calls and questions on any topic.

800-525-7000. And Rob, how you doing today, son? Anything different? Anything new, unique, and fun going on in your life, sir? Let's see.

Yeah, all kinds of things. Basketball season is upon us, so I've got both of my boys playing games tonight. And we're headed out of town tomorrow, headed to Boone, North Carolina. Really?

In preparation for Thanksgiving. It's going to be beautiful up there, so yeah, lots going on. That's very cool. Now, Boone, is that named after Daniel Boone?

Would you know that? I wouldn't know that, but I know there's a Daniel Boone Inn that we love to eat at while we're there, so I'm going to go out on a limb and say yes. I will say, though, in the shoebox season, because you know it's Operation Christmas Child season, I actually believe this is collection week if I'm not mistaken, Boone is the home of Samaritan's Purse. I've actually toured the shoebox factory where they put everything together and assemble everything and the distribution point. It's amazing doing great work. Really? Yeah, well yeah, and it was just a few weeks ago that we had a representative from that organization, and my wife and I have been well in the earlier years.

We filled shoeboxes. We haven't done that ourselves in a while, but we certainly have helped support them financially, and it's a wonderful ministry. And I'm not sure if there's still time to get involved, but you could check them out online. SamaritansPurse, I'm sure it's easy to find.

SamaritansPurse.org is the place to go, and actually you can assemble your box online this year, socially distanced. So yeah, check that out. I will say also Jim Henry, our incredible researcher today, did in fact, Steve, confirm that Boone is named after Daniel Boone. He actually camped in the area a number of times and maybe even carved his name in a tree.

Well, knowing Jim, he probably hung out with Dan, and they're both about the same age. Wow. All right, there you go.

He doesn't have a mic. 800-525, or a bat, 800-525-7000. Patricia in Chicago, what's your question?

How can we help? Yes, hi. So it's a blessing to speak with you. I have a question about my mortgage, and I want to refinance, and I've heard you several times saying that it's not worth anything less than one point, but I want to refinance from 30 years to 15 years. My mortgage lender is giving me only like a 3.75, only to refinance, but I don't know if it's worth it because I'm going to 15 to 30 years, and my mortgage will be going up $200 a month. So it's less than a point, but the concern that I have is my mortgage loan amount is going to go up $6,000 more. Yeah, he's working out where I guess it's the closing fees and everything, though I do have to come with $2,000 cash for closing costs, but there is a $6,000 where it's going to be added to the loan, but I will go from FHA to conventional. So I will get rid of that mortgage insurance, which is about $73. So I know it's less than 1.0, so that's where my question is.

Yeah, well it's a great question, and I have a few questions for you. So I like the fact that you're going from FHA to conventional because, yeah, you will drop that PMI, which does nothing for you other than provide a monthly expense that's for the benefit entirely of the lender. Beyond that, though, what is your current rate, and what rate is he quoting you for this new 15 year?

Okay, I am currently at 3.50, and he's quoting me, he's giving me a 2.75. Okay, and what's the total amount of the mortgage? Right now I'm at $214,500, and it would be going up at the end of the loan at $220,300. Okay, and what did you say the total costs are going to be, the closing costs? Well, he said I would come in with $2,000, but he said I will be getting back about $900, and then I wouldn't pay the month of, I think it's December, January, so that's a free mortgage. So those $2,000 I would initially be getting back. Okay, and where's the $6,000 or so that's being added to the mortgage?

Where is that coming from? That's where I'm not quite sure, but he says there are fees, and instead of coming with a lump sum of closing costs, he's working it in the mortgage. Yeah, well here's the thing, I mean you really need to understand exactly what's going into that. Perhaps some of it could be prepaid escrows in anticipation of the mortgage company paying your tax bill for property taxes when that comes due next year, if it's already been paid for this year, homeowners insurance, of course the appraisal in there and some taxes, but you want to understand exactly what's in there. It's not just a matter of how much am I going to have to come with and how much gets rolled in. You want to make sure that the numbers work and they're ordinary, because I wouldn't expect you to spend more than 1% on the cost of the refinance. So 1% on a $220,000 loan is $2,200 all in. Perhaps beyond that, even 2%, maybe $4,000, but certainly not more than that. And if you're bringing $2,000 to the table and we're increasing the mortgage by $6,000, there's $8,000 worth of something that's going into that that I really want to understand what that is. I'd also like for you to get a few more estimates. Bottom line is you can turn a 30-year mortgage into a 15-year mortgage without refinancing just by sending more every month.

So it needs to make sense in terms of the actual amount you've saved in interest every month over the life of the loan. So I want you to do a bit more analysis. Hang on the line. We'll talk about how you do that off the air as we head into this break, and we appreciate your call. Thank you, Pat. This is MoneyWise Live.

Don't go away. We call this investing that makes the world rejoice. More is available at investeventide.com.

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Call 800-791-6225 or visit chministries.org. Hi, my name is Ryan Koch, a youth ministry major at the Moody Bible Institute. The Moody Radio Verse of the Week is found in Galatians 2-20. I have been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. In the life I now live in the flesh, I live my faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.

That's Galatians 2-20, the Moody Radio Verse of the Week. Do you know if you have enough? Enough money? Enough house? Do you know how much is enough? If not, Ron Blue can help with his book, Master Your Money, a step-by-step plan for experiencing financial contentment. Learn how to save, invest, and give wisely, how to create a long-term financial plan and how to get out of debt.

You'll find it all in Master Your Money by Ron Blue, available when you click the store button at MoneyWise Live. With SRN News, I'm Bob Agnew in Washington. President Trump has issued regulations that could lower the prices Americans pay for many prescription drugs.

The administration's rule to tie what Medicare pays for prescription medications to the lowest price paid globally by advanced countries is termed the most favored nation's approach. It's been two and a half weeks since election day. President Trump has yet to concede the election to former Vice President Joe Biden. White House Press Secretary Kayleigh McEnany says there's a legitimate reason for the absence of the concession, namely a lot of question marks about the way some of the ballots have been counted in various states.

The White House Coronavirus Task Force member and CDC Director Dr. Robert Redfield said today he thinks the decision to close some schools has been based more on motion and not on the data, noting that high schools are simply not a source of the problem when it comes to COVID-19. This is SRN News. It's MoneyWise Live, where we start by remembering that God owns it all, and if we can help you as you manage it all, call right now, toll free 800-525-7000 to speak with Rob West. 800-525-7000, Chicago, and B, what's your situation with your credit cards? Hi, I heard you say not too long ago that it's not good to have a lot of credit cards, maybe just two, and it helps with your credit score, so that's what I'm calling for, but I would like to say two, thank you both. You all are so knowledgeable and just so filled with the understanding to put the word with what you do, and I just celebrate you for that. Thank you for always helping us.

You're so sweet, B. I appreciate that. You know, it's really not a function of the number of cards that you have outstanding as to whether or not you're going to see a real impact on your credit score. It has more to do with, number one, what types of lenders are you working with?

Are you working with top-tier lenders or are you working with finance companies? Number two, it has to do with your debt-to-limit ratio, so the total amount by card in terms of what balance are you carrying versus what's available to you, so there's a $10,000 limit. You wouldn't want to carry more than $3,000. Now, I'd like for that number to be zero, right? Pay it off in full every month, but in terms of your credit score, anything above that 30% threshold is going to impact you negatively, and that holds true for the full amount as well, the total of all of your accounts in terms of available limit versus the balances that are owed in the aggregate.

That's also going to impact you. The main reason, B, that we encourage folks to limit the number of cards that they have is any open accounts have the ability to be compromised fraudulently, so if somebody gets a hold of your account number and your information and they're able to use that online fraudulently. Because that's so prevalent these days, we need, with all of our accounts, checking, savings, but certainly those credit cards, we need to be checking those accounts every month at a minimum to make sure there's not any erroneous transactions on there because that would be a great red flag that somebody's compromised our account is using it to charge things without our permission. And so, I think given that it's in our best interest to limit the number of active accounts that we have so there's less chance for accounts to be compromised, but number two, it's just less incentive to go out and charge something on a credit card that perhaps is beyond what's in your spending plan because, remember, we only want to use credit cards for budgeted items. So what I'd recommend, and this is what I do, is I have a debit card. I have one credit card that I use and my wife uses for our budgeted items every month, and we've selected that card carefully and it does change periodically based on who has the best cash back offers, and then I have a business card that I use for business expenses, and that's it.

And it keeps it really simple. Those are the only three I have to track every month, and if you have an additional card, maybe store cards you open to get a discount or something that you've had in the past that you're no longer using, I would encourage you to close those over time. Maybe not, you know, three or four at once, but maybe one or two now and one or two six months from now so you can simplify your financial life and pare it back to something more manageable. Does that make sense to you though? Oh yeah, thank you, but I'd like to say to God be the glory.

They all have a zero balance. Great, that's right. So I want to, yes, so but I wanted to close them and I wanted to make sure that that was the right thing to do. So now you're saying close maybe two now and then six months I can close two again like that. I think that would be a good approach. Yeah, I mean there's not an exact science to that, but the idea that you stagger that does have some merit in terms of how the algorithms are created, and so I think if you took that approach that would work very well for you.

B, thank you very much. Rob, have you ever heard of anyone who decided what cards to keep based on color? You know, the rainbow in their wallet.

Does anybody ever do that? I suspect, Steve, if we put that out there, there would be somebody that calls in. I will say the Apple credit card is made, it's cut out of some sort of metal, and I saw one the other day. I don't have one.

I saw one the other day. It is very cool. I mean if you get one, would you share that with us if you get one? Not the number, but maybe just the cards.

Just let you hold it. Yeah, I'll do that. 800. You know what, you shouldn't call us. With advice like that, you probably shouldn't call us, but if you have to, here's the number 800-525-7000. We'd love to hear from you.

Fort Payne, Alabama. Hey Jessica, what's your story? What's your situation?

How can we help you? Yes, sir. So me and my husband and two children have sold our 15-acre farm, and we sold it, and we are currently living in a camper. We bought an acre of land to eventually build on. My question is, is there a specific type of savings account that we could be putting our money into that will maybe gain a little interest and help us out in that way? Yeah.

Well, first of all, Jessica, I love this. You know, I've heard of more and more people doing it. In fact, somebody that I work with here at Kingdom Advisors and MoneyWise Media did the exact same thing. Their kids are grown out of the house. They sold their home. They bought a camper. They've downsized, gotten rid of a lot of stuff, drastically simplified their lives, and they love it. Now they may not do it forever, and as you and your husband have already said, this is a temporary move for you, but I think there's a real trend in not only smaller homes, these tiny homes that we're hearing a lot about, but just trying to simplify things, and there's something to be said about that. Now, as you all prepare, perhaps save and get ready for building on this property, which sounds fabulous as well, I love the idea that you're thinking about maximizing that savings.

So here's what I would say. I would use an online savings account because you're going to get a higher interest rate, but it's still going to be an FDIC insured bank. You could go to bankrate.com and look at several options to compare them. I'll tell you, the three that I like the most right now are Ally, Capital One 360, and Marcus. All three of those have been around a long time. They're major institutions known for their customer service. Marcus is backed by Goldman Sachs. It's their retail arm. Capital One's one of the biggest financial institutions in the world, and Ally is an online bank, newer to this space, but very strong and known for their customer service.

With all three of those, you're going to get about 0.6%, so a little more than a half a percent, so not a ton, but it's something, right? And there's no fees or expenses on a monthly basis to maintain a savings account. You can link it right up to your checking and move money electronically, and it's FDIC insured, so you have the full faith and credit of the United States government backing it, so that would be the kind of the holding place for that money, Jessica, and the money you'll add to it between now and when you start construction. Does that make sense? Yes, sir, and can can that be like set up like through my like the plan is is to take just my income from my work and just have it direct deposited into that account every two weeks? Oh, absolutely. That way?

It sure can, yep, and I actually love that approach, Jessica, because then it's kind of out of sight, out of mind, it's automatic, it happens every month, there's not the temptation with a checking account that's a little inflated to go out and spend it, you know, you don't even see it and it just goes right in there. I think that's exactly the way to go. Jessica, I have to ask you, if you don't mind, how big is the camper you guys moved into? Um, I think it's a 34 inch, or 34 foot, not inch, 34 foot long.

Okay, it feels like 34 inches at times. Now, how many is it? Is it you and your husband?

Yes, me and my husband, a 13 year old, a nine year old, and a toy mossy poo puppy. Jessica, we love what you guys are doing, stay on the line if you wouldn't mind, we just want to get a little information from you. This is MoneyWise Live.

Many of us in campers. We'll be right back. The financial wealth you leave behind could be the best thing that ever happened to your loved ones, or the worst. In splitting heirs, giving your money and things to your children without ruining their lives, Ron Blue explains why it's important to make these decisions now, instead of forcing your heirs to do it later. Splitting heirs will foster a real appreciation for the precious resources that God has entrusted to you.

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He's Rob West. I'm Steve Moore. Here's our phone number. Jot it down. Put it up there in the fridge. What did we do in the old, it seems like in the old days, and I was around for part of the old days, people didn't put stuff up in the fridge, and now they do. So I'm not sure what happened. At some point in time, something changed. I'll have my crack information guy, Jim Henry, look into that for us. When did the refrigerator become more of a major part of the family-friendly approach to living? Jim, check on that for us. Greenfield, Indiana, WGNR, and Jean, we know you've been holding. Thanks so much.

How can we help? Oh, thank you very, very much. It's a question about my home mortgage, which I took in 2016, and it's a 20-year loan at 3.89, and I am to have it paid off in 2036. I asked them if I could, and there is no escrow balance. I pay the taxes and insurance separate, and I asked if I paid one extra month at $363.12, it is. At the end of the year, what I would still, if that would help with the reduction, and all it does is take minus the $363.12. But I was wondering, does it affect the payoff date of 2036? Will it only be paid off in 2035, or does it escalate a little bit? Yeah, it certainly does, Jean, and I appreciate all that background.

I love what you're trying to do here. So you're saying one extra full payment per year, is that right? Yes, sir, and applied only to the principal. Yes, ma'am. Very good. You know, typically what we would see, and it does vary just based on a number of factors, the balance, the interest rate, and so forth.

But typically, if you're making an extra full payment a year, and you do that for the life of the mortgage, that'll take a 30-year mortgage and cut about four years off of it, depending upon the interest rate. That alone, and it does obviously have a greater impact as you go. So I think the key here, are you comfortable using the internet? No, sir. I'm 87 years old. Okay, no problem. That's fine. You could do a couple of things.

Number one is, you could call your mortgage company. Are you looking for a certain period of time that you want it paid off by? Like, are you trying to figure out how much do I need to send to have it paid off by this year? Or are you just asking more generally?

I'm asking generally. Okay, because they'd be happy to help you with that. You could call your mortgage servicer, whoever you send your monthly check to, and you could say, it's called an amortization schedule. Run me an amortization schedule based on me sending one extra payment a year, so I can see exactly when it'll be paid off. And then maybe as a second option, you could ask them to say, send me a schedule showing it paid off by this year, by December of this year. And they'll say, okay, in order to pay it off by December of this year, you need to send this much extra per year or per month. And they can run those schedules for you. The other option, Gene, would be to connect with one of our MoneyWise coaches. And if you wanted to do that, I could have my producer take your information and we could have somebody call you. These are trained volunteers, godly men and women who just this is their ministry to help folks with their budgets and their spending and debt repayment plans. But in this case, they'd be happy to help you get what's called a mortgage calculator on their computer and put in your information and help you run some scenarios so you'd know exactly what you're looking at. Either of those options, calling your mortgage servicer or connecting with one of our coaches to work with you over the phone would be available to you.

Which would you prefer? It would be nice to talk to one of your coaches. Great, okay. So let's do this, Gene.

You hang on the line. My producer, Deb, is going to capture your information. We're going to get in touch with you. Somebody will reach out to you tomorrow by phone and connect you with one of our coaches.

It may take a week or two before somebody's available, but they'll walk with you through this process and get you the information that you're looking for, okay? Oh, thank you so very much. All right, you're welcome.

You're so sweet to call and think of us, and we'll look forward to talking to you again real soon. God bless, Gene. God bless you. Thank you very much.

All right, quickly, Fort Lauderdale. Lucy, what's your question for Rob West? I want to know the difference between the third annuity and sixth annuity and which one is best to invent.

Yeah, Lucy, be happy to help. I want to clarify what I'm hearing. I heard annuity. Did you mention a specific type of annuity? Deferred. Okay, I'm not following that. Deferred annuity.

Okay, I think that's what I'm hearing, yeah. And then what was the alternative? What else are you looking at? And the fixed annuity. Oh, fixed annuity and deferred annuity.

Okay, very good. Yeah, the key here that you need to understand is that with a deferred, you know, all annuities are deferred. The question is just how does the accumulation happen? So you put in a lump sum of money with an insurance company. They give you an insurance contract.

There's some sort of death benefit attached to that. And in addition to that, there's some sort of savings component as a part of this. And with an annuity, you either have what's called a fixed annuity that's growing at a stated interest rate over time, equivalent to how long you're going to leave it in there and what the prevailing rates are at the time. Or you have a variable annuity, which is where there's an investment component typically inside of it. Think of mutual funds like a 401k. And you capture some or all of the upside of those mutual funds. And in some cases, and this gets a little complicated, there's even a floor in terms of they say, you're guaranteed not to lose anything, and we'll give you a portion of the upside.

So you get a little bit of growth, and you don't have any of the losses. That's the difference between the variable annuity and the fixed annuity. And then after it accumulates during what's called the accumulation phase, then you have a choice as to how you're going to take that money out. Are you going to take it out as a lump sum after it's grown down the road? Or are you going to take it as a monthly income stream like a pension or social security, something that comes every month throughout your life or your life plus your spouse's life, something like that. And that's called the annuitization phase. So hopefully that gives you some help.

If you use a computer, Lucy, Investopedia, NerdWallet would be two great options for you to do some reading about annuities to get some more information. Lucy, thank you very much. We hope that helps you today. And let's quickly go to Cleveland, Ohio. Katie, you're our final caller today. We'll have to make it quick. So what's on your mind?

Hi there. I was just wondering if you could talk a little bit about credit cards and debit cards. And you had mentioned earlier that you use a debit card for expenses and then budget expenses with your other credit cards. Could you talk a little bit about how you decide that? I'm having a hard time like reconciling at the end of the month when I'm using credit cards.

Yeah, no problem, Katie. Well, I love this question. And here's the reality. You know, there'd be a lot of folks that would say you just need to stay away from credit cards altogether. We had our friend Dave Ramsey on the program actually earlier this week, and Dave would be one of those that would say, never use a credit card.

Steve and I don't take that approach. But what we do say is only use credit cards for budgeted items. And you have to know whether you're disciplined enough to even use them at all, because some people having access to unsecured debt, meaning the ability to live beyond God's provision, is a recipe for disaster.

And if that's you and you know that's you, then you should stay away. You know, perhaps the first month you can't pay it off in full, or if it happens two months in a row, you cut it up and go to only debit or cash. But if you have the discipline to say, I'm going to use a credit card for budgeted items, and I'm going to use the convenience that comes with being able to shop online or, you know, store it in my smartphone, I'm going to make sure that with a credit card, I'm, you know, choosing one that has no fees, no annual fee, and I'm getting maybe 2% cash back. So there's a benefit there's a benefit to that. I think there are some upsides to credit cards. But I think the key is to you got to have that spending plan at the foundation of everything.

So you've got it. If you don't have a spending plan today, I would recommend you track your money for at least 60 days to see where it's going. What what recurring expenses do you have where you get a bill in the mail? What discretionary spending like eating out or, you know, clothes shopping things that, you know, you don't get a bill for?

And then what non-recurring expenses do you have like quarterly insurance payments or a semi-annual, you know, homeowners association, something like that? Once you get it all in there, and you massage the numbers and make sure that it balances, then you ask yourself the hard questions. Does this reflect my values and my priorities? If it's important to me to be a systematic giver? Am I doing that?

Or do I need to make some changes? Am I saving for my short-term and long-term goals? But then at the end of the day, the budget is set. And then how you administer that budget, meaning the control of the flow of money in and out, plus the way in which you actually pay for things, credit card, debit card, cash.

I think that really is a non-issue because it's all in line with a budget that's been established in advance. The last thing I'll say, because we're about out of time here, Katie, is our MoneyWise app could be a great help for you here. It's our brand new app. It's based on a digital envelope system.

You can not only build your spending plan, but you could connect your debit cards, credit cards, savings, checking, and use that to download all the transactions to make sure you stay on budget. And if you stay online, our producer will get your information. We'll give you six months free as a pro user so you can get all that worked out just as our way of saying thanks for calling today. We will indeed. Katie, God bless you.

Stay on the line. We'll get your contact information. Thank you very, very much. And Rob, thank you. Hope you and your family have a great weekend, sir. We'll come back and talk on Monday, all right? All right, Steve, great. MoneyWise Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and MoneyWise Media, and you're in there as well. Thank you for your prayers and your generous financial support that helps us come to you each day on this radio station and radio network. If you'd like to send an email to Rob, it's questions at moneywise.org. Have a great weekend. Join us again on Monday.