Has Revival Broken Out in America?

The following program is recorded content created by Truth Network. This is Michael Brown coming your way from Kona, Hawaii at the University of the Nation's YOM base where I will be teaching several days later this week.

Those watching on Facebook or YouTube, we are audio only. Those listening on radio and podcast, it is the same friendly voice as always. Here is the number to call 866-34-TRUTH.

866-348-7884. I will take calls on all different subjects today so anything you want to talk to me about a little later in the broadcast I will take calls but we are going to focus on the subject of revival. Is revival breaking out in America? What do we make of the reports from Asbury now over five days of continuous services in the chapel there? What do we make of it? Is this another sign that revival is near? If so, how do we work with God in the midst of revival?

What does it mean? How do you move from revival to reformation to awakening? We will talk about this. This is obviously something very near and dear to my heart so you can ask me questions about that and weigh in on that. Or, again, I will take some random questions on different subjects but that will be later in the broadcast.

Let me give some background here. Revival, which I define as a season of unusual divine visitation. Revival has been something near and dear to my heart for decades. The three Rs of our ministry, revival, revolution, and redemption, everything flows out of revival. As I journaled about 15 months ago, God's heart is sick because the church in America is sick. America is sick because the church in America is sick. As the church gets revived, that's where change has come. That's why God has so burdened me to help get the church healthy in America. And, consider this now, as the church gets revived, that leads to the second of our Rs, gospel-based moral and cultural revolution. A revived church then brings awakening to a nation. And a revived church provokes Israel to envy, hence the third R, redemption. So everything in our heart, in our life, in our ministry here flows out of revival. So on a daily basis we seek to keep the fire burning, on a daily basis we seek to be faithful to God, to be faithful disciples, to share the gospel, to do what's right. Whether we see great fruit or not, we honor God, we glorify Him in the mundane, day-to-day life, we pray, we seek His face, and we contend in the Spirit. We cry out, we fast, we pray, we preach, we call for repentance.

Why? Because we want to see an outpouring. We know that there must be a radical outpouring. We know that radical change must come.

We know that more of the same will only produce more of the same. So my own life dramatically marked by revival experiences. I got saved in the Jesus People movement in late 1971.

I didn't know it was part of a larger worldwide outpouring, but it turns out it was. In 1982, when I was finishing up my Ph.D. work or getting to work on my dissertation, I had left my first love. I was still a committed believer in many ways. My wife and I were laboring for the Lord and honoring the Lord in many ways, even sacrificially. I was known as a strong believer. My witness was strong at NYU.

But I had left my first love. I had become intellectually and spiritually proud. God brought me to deep repentance and showed me that he was going to send an outpouring to our church, which was barely charismatic.

He was going to send an outpouring to the church through me. God moved. I preached a message. On November 21, 1982, we saw God break out.

Deep repentance. People crying out, seeking God. Many wonderfully turned around in the Lord, filled with the Spirit.

That lasted a little over three months. Subsequent to that, God spoke to me. I was in prayer. I got this overwhelming sense that I would get to serve in a revival that would touch the whole world. I thought, you're crazy. You lost it, man. You're deceived.

You're crazy. The more I would seek God, the more I would confirm it. When I talked to other leaders, they confirmed what God was saying. Then, of course, 13 years after that, God called me to serve in the Brownsboro Revival. From there, people were touched. Over 130 nations visited the revival. Missionaries have been sent out as a result of that around the world. Many still on the field now, well over 20 years later.

I'm an eyewitness to what God did there. There may be critics and gains. You're going to have that with any revival. In fact, if you don't have critics, you'd question whether it's really revival. That's been a long-term dictum. I'm talking about a wonderful, glorious, holy thing that God did. In recent years, I've had a sense.

I began to get this stirring in late 2019 that something fresh was afoot. For those who say it's too late, America will never have another revival. Well, show me the chapter and verse for that.

Please do. Show me the chapter and verse. I'm sure there are people 50 years ago saying it's too late. People 100 years ago saying it's too late. People 200 years ago saying it's too late. Throughout church history, people saying it's over.

It's too late. I began to sense something fresh. I began to see more and more believers crying out. Now, bear in mind, there was not the level of desperation and agony of heart that you would expect, given that America is in such a spiritual and moral mess. You would have thought there would be much more crying out, much more desperation. But instead, we get carnal, compromised, distracted.

We put our trust in the political system or candidate, whatever it is. It's interesting that the Kansas City Chiefs won the Super Bowl February of 2020. There was a prophetic word that a brother had given that got repeated many, many times. When the Chiefs win the Super Bowl, you know revival is about to come. Revival is near. They win the Super Bowl.

I just heard it out of curiosity. I thought, okay, we shall see what happens. We shall see. So what follows? COVID and then humbling and so many in the church, scandals breaking out, the failed Trump prophecies, exposing of just nonsense in the charismatic movement and didn't seem to be exactly revival. Ah, but God often comes first as a refiner's fire, Malachi 3.

And what does a refiner's fire do? It brings to the surface everything that's wrong. It brings the junk to the surface. So a lot of the things that are embarrassing to the Church of America, a lot of our weakest spots, our divisions that we had, our politicizing, our carnality, our failures, our doctrinal errors. And it's across the board.

It's not just one group. It came up to the surface, which really humbles us and brings us to a place of even greater desperation. And I wrote an article in November of last year saying I see a thousand holy fires. I've been seeing this in my mind's eye and my spirit for quite some time, for several years. But instead of just one place where the fire of God falls, one place where God is moving, instead I saw thousands of places all over America where God was moving and young people were getting radically saved and there was fasting and prayer in the presence of God and believers were repenting and God was being glorified. I saw it plainly and it's been evident to me as I've traveled to place after place after place, something's happening here, something's happening here, something's happening here. And in each case marked by the same thing, this intense presence of God, prayer and fasting, crying out to God, young people flocking, radical salvations and Jesus being exalted through the preaching of the Word. So if you listen regularly, you've heard me say that the first waves of this move are here. You've heard me say it even within the last two weeks.

I have to find the exact footage, but saying the first waves are already here. And then the report a little over five days ago at Asbury. So Asbury College, then there's a seminary there in Kentucky. And chapel service begins, student confesses sins, some stay behind. Well, that has been going on now over five days straight with ongoing worship and encountering God and no famous speakers and no big names involved, just God moving among these young people. Within a day, it had jumped over to Ohio State Christian University or Ohio Christian University.

And I've talked to people involved in both of these places where they know their colleagues or brother or sister involved talking about what God is doing. And Asbury has been marked by revivals in the past that were nationally famous and teams of students went to college campuses and this helped spread things around America. So this gets attention, oh, and by the way, the Chiefs win the Super Bowl again. They won it the first time in 50 years in 2020.

And now they win it again three years later, the same week that revival breaks out at Asbury. So whether you put that prophetic word to the side or you think, wow, either way, either way, what's happened at Asbury has gotten national attention. And it's the right place for it to happen because it wasn't some hyped meeting somewhere. It wasn't a famous worship team. It wasn't a famous pastor or preacher or evangelist. It was God working among unknown people and students in an inauspicious way. But this is how God often begins something. Again, let me say this, God has been moving all over the country for years now in pockets. And now it's more and more and more and more places. And now this is the exclamation point that has suddenly gotten national attention for the very fact that it is taking place at Asbury. So all that being said, I am really excited because these are days we have been waiting for and we are only at the very, very beginning. We are only at the outset of what is happening here and it must be stewarded.

It must create greater hunger and thirst. We must go deeper with what God is doing. I don't mean specifically at Asbury, but I mean as this begins to break all over the nation. And it will, as surely as I'm sitting here, it will. It's the will of the Father. God is the one who moved on so many of us for so many years to be praying or fasting or crying out for revival. I've been part of gatherings, tens of thousands of young people, in one case over 300,000 young people for 12 hours of prayer and fasting and crying out going back to the year 2000 to September 2, 2000 to call D.C. And in every one of these meetings this passionate cry for revival.

And then other places like International House of Prayer. They've had over 20 straight years, well over 20 straight years of intercession and worship. And much of that has been, so there's been this continual cry going up to God for revival, for awakening. Why would God move on us to pray for outpouring? Why would God move on us to pray for revival? Why would God move on us to pray for a revival if he's not going to send it? But how can we see the revival go deeper across the country and turn into a bona fide national revival? How can we consolidate the results of that so that it leads to national awakening and reformation? What must happen with reaching out with evangelism, with discipling, with changing mindsets?

What must happen? We want to talk about that. 866-34-TRUTH. So I'll get to some of your calls in a little while. Friends, something is up and if you've been listening to this broadcast you shouldn't be surprised. Because we told you it was here and it was coming.

We'll be right back. It's the Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the Line of Fire by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks, friends, for joining us on the Line of Fire. Michael Brown coming your way live from Kona in Hawaii where a little later in the week I'll be spending three full days pouring into the entire student body here at YWAM for the Discipleship Training Center discussing the Bible and cultural issues, ministry and cultural issues in particular, LGBTQ+. How do we address these issues with love? How do we address these issues with truth? How do we reach out to the people with the heart of God and the mind of God?

These are big issues not just in America but around the world. Okay, a few thoughts for you regarding revival, awakening. In Leviticus 6, three times it tells the priests that the fire on the altar must be kept burning. This is where the Israelites would come and offer their sacrifices on the bronze altar. The fire on the altar must be kept burning.

If you read a few chapters later, the end of the ninth chapter when Aaron and his sons finished the ordination process that Aaron together with Moses offers sacrifices on the altar. It says fire came from the presence of the Lord and consumed the sacrifices. I used to think of it as fire coming down from heaven. It could well be fire came out of the holiest place of all where God would manifest himself. But either way, the fire consumes the sacrifices. Could it be that that was the first fire that ever burned on that altar? It struck me that that's probably the case. Then I found other ancient interpreters had the same thought which underscores why the fire must be kept burning. Because it's divine fire. Because God sparked it. When I moved down to Pensacola having lived the first 40 plus years of my life in the New York, Long Island area and then Maryland area.

It was my first time really living in the south. Everywhere you turn people would use the phrase we're holding a revival. Our church is holding a revival next month. Oh, we have a revival scheduled next week.

Because it just meant a series of special meetings. That was a quote, a revival. Oh yeah, I'll be holding a revival next month in this state or that state. So because it was a way of speech there, virtually every week in the Browns revival I would get up at one time or another in one of the meetings and say you can no more schedule a revival than you can schedule an earthquake. You can no more hold a revival than you can hold a hurricane. Revival is not something that man works up. Revival is something God sends down. You can't hype it.

You can't manufacture it. Look, even if you had the greatest PR team in history and you had the greatest musicians, the greatest singers, the greatest worship leaders, the greatest preachers, the most dynamic everything and you claimed God's moving in revival, well, it wouldn't take long for people to travel there from around America and around the world and think, yeah, that's another meeting. It's just another hyped up meeting. Leonard Ravenhill always used to tell me, because we were very close the last five years of his life, Leonard Ravenhill always used to say to me, Mike, you don't have to advertise a fire. He'd say a fire is the most attractive thing in the universe. So you see a fire on the side of the road, everybody stops to look.

I remember going for an eight-day prayer retreat in December of 2020 and staying in this little A-frame on a friend's farm and there's a little potdolly stove in there and because I was just praying day and night, you just have a lot of time and I'd put some wood in that stove and get it going and sometimes just pray for long periods of time just looking at the fire and praying for the fire to burn, the fire of passion for God and passion for holiness and passion for the lost and passion for purity, just to burn and burn and burn in me. So when God's really moving, you don't have to advertise it. There was not some PR team with, let's get word out about Asbury. Within hours, people were hearing about it because that's the era we live in now.

That's the cell phone instant information era that we live in. God will draw people, the testimonies will draw people, the reality of what he's doing will draw people and if you get there and nothing's going on, it's like, yeah. You go back home, people say, what happened?

It's like, ah, nothing really. You know, it's just like you can have a PR campaign for a new steak restaurant in a big city and the best of this and that and if the steaks are not better than other people's steaks or at least as good or there's not something that stands out, pretty soon that restaurant's going to close. So revival is its own advertisement. Revival is its own endorsement. But when the fire falls, when God breaks out, what do you do? The fire on the altar must be kept burning.

That means the prayer that births revival is the prayer that sustains revival. That means also that you have to keep giving something to the fire. You have to keep feeding the fire. And if you keep feeding the fire, then the fire will keep burning.

It's just a simple principle. So how do you feed the fires of revival? Well, as I said, the prayer that births revival is the prayer that sustains revival.

So all those that have been in prayer for revival need to continue to be in prayer. A second thing is that there must be spiritual hunger. We must be drawing in for God to work more deeply in our lives, for God to share his heart with us more deeply, for God to purify us more profoundly, for God to show us our blind spots and correct our errors more deeply. And then there must be the pouring out. It's just a biblical principle, given it will be given to you.

So you know how it works in so many other areas of life. You give sacrificially unto the Lord, and now you become a conduit of blessing to others. There's now a life flow that God continues to give to you. Many of you have seen it happen financially, that maybe you're in the business world and you've really got a heart to give more to the poor and give more to world missions. And you and your spouse agree, okay, let's do this. Let's make this sacrifice. And the next thing, your business starts to prosper, and you think, well, we can now give more.

And God trusts you with more. So the same way, the revival must give out. The revival must go to the lost. As soon as God called me to Brownsville, the very first thing we did was, along with starting day meetings for leaders in the general public on Friday and Saturday, we raised up the ministry school. Brownsville Revival School of Ministry, which became Fire School of Ministry, we raised that up to equip and send people out.

My very first week that I was in Pensacola, God dropped something in my heart as I was leaving and about to fly off from the airport, four Es. The first, the revival must go even deeper. So the first E was entrench. The second was expand. More laborers are needed, more buildings are needed. The third was equip, raise up laborers for the harvest.

The fourth was export, send the fire around the world. And the revival was fueled every night by Steve Hale's preaching, which was a strong repentance message, calling sinners to get saved, calling backsiders to come get right with God, calling believers to get sin out of their lives. So there was always an outreach, outreach, outreach. But then with that, the intentionality of, we've been touched, now we're going to send people out.

When God moved in Asbury in years past, teams of students went to other schools. So you give what you have. And then the big thing we have to think about, friends, the big thing we have to think about is lasting fruit. Lasting fruit. On a regular basis, Steve would say, in the midst of the Brownsville revival, he would say, the true test of an evangelist ministry is five or 10 years down the line. Lasting fruit. Yes, there was a lot of emotion, but we hate emotionalism. Yes, there are a lot of unusual things that happen and people overcome by the Spirit are shaking or falling.

I would tell them also on a regular basis, it doesn't matter if you shake or fall, the question is when you walk out of the building, how are you living? So that's what burned in us, lasting fruit. And right now, right now, when you look at the state of America, think of my recent book, Revival or We Die.

It is that urgent. But a revival in and of itself without divine wisdom, without divine strategy, without long-term thinking, a revival in and of itself will have wonderful, dramatic results in many lives, but will not necessarily bring lasting change to a culture, bring lasting change to a region, unless people are thinking about, okay, what do we do next? How do we restructure our families? What do we do in terms of involvement in society?

What does this mean in the wider sphere of things that God is doing? So these are some of the questions that I hope to be addressing in writing, on radio, in the days ahead. I do want to share a little later in the broadcast a message that I sent to the Church of England, really burdened, felt stirred to do it.

But I want to share one last thing with you before we take a break, then we'll get to some calls. My newest book, Why So Many Christians Have Left the Faith, we responded to the deconstructionist movement with unshakable, timeless truth. My latest book is due out early next month, but we have copies already. As soon as I get back from Hawaii, we'll have stacks of them that I will be signing, God willing, and sending right out to you. This is a great way to stand with the line of fire, to say, hey, Dr. Brown, I want to stand with you.

We want to help get your voice out to the nation. This is a great way to stand with us and to get kind of a collector's item. Each book is numbered, so number one, two, up to 100, 200, 500, whatever. Each of these pre-orders is numbered, and I will personally sign it to you with a scripture reference as well. So we want to get these to you.

It's a way that you can partner with us as well. So you can go to the website, askdr.brown.org, askdrbrown.org, and just click on Store to Order, or call this number specifically for this book, 800-538-5275. That's 800-5385-ASK.

800-538-5275. You can get multiple copies if you like. If you would like them signed to different people, let us know. Our joy to send these out. It's always a highlight for me when a new book comes out, to pray over them, and then to sign each one to you.

Sometimes I recognize the names. I'm always seeing, okay, who got the first few, and joyfully signing. So this is a way you can support our ministry and a way you can get a book that is super important because when I show it to people, like, oh, wow, you wrote it.

I'm so glad you wrote it because this is an issue that churches are facing across America, even in other countries as well. Why are so many that started? They were in the Lord for years. They've fallen over. They never really say, okay, well, why did they leave? Why are so many leaving? Why is it happening on this level?

This will answer the question of why, but also address what we do, how we can respond. So my joy to get this into your hands. You can't see it, but I'm holding it in my hands. I just shared it with a key leader here at YWAM. I showed him the book.

He was excited to see it. It's crucial we understand this because God's going to be bringing many people back. We need solid answers for them when they return. Okay, we'll get your calls on the other side of the break. Stay right here. It's the Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the Line of Fire by calling 866-344-9000 or text 3-4-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Joining us on the Line of Fire, Michael Brown, delighted to be with you. Yeah, much more to share.

I want to say one thing, then we go to the phones. People have been saying to me after watching a broadcast where I interacted with American Gospel 3, Dr. Brown, how can you defend the Physics of Heaven book that Bethel put out? I don't defend it. The little that I read of it I thought was wacky.

I thought, what in the world is this? I was not happy that they put it out or that leaders from Bethel endorsed it. Pastor Mike Winger came out, what, eight years ago, I think. Pastor Mike Winger recently did a very intense video about the book and that video is going viral. Hey, get it out.

Let people evaluate. Get it out by all means. But what I did report was when I mentioned it to a colleague who was one of the leaders at Bethel and who himself wrote an endorsement for the book or forward whatever, he said, wish it hadn't been written. When I told him it's still in the book store, he went and got it pulled that same day.

He said it would take a while, maybe a week before it shows up on the website. Sometimes you know somebody and you know an author. Look, I've written endorsements for books because I know the author and I want to support the author.

I understand what they're saying and the content and then it could be misunderstood by others. Anyway, there are times I've regretted doing it. It's like, never should have done that. That was a mistake. That was a mistake. I'm thinking of one from years ago where I said, look, the material is controversial because I couldn't endorse everything in the book. I said the material is controversial. So read it and evaluate for yourself. And then some other leaders said to me, how many people can rightly evaluate it? Because it got into some technical stuff and I said, you're right, I shouldn't have done it. I wanted to support the person because they had a great heart for the Lord but there were some areas that were controversial.

They weren't major doctrinal things but there were some that were controversial and uses of ancient sources that were controversial. In any case, I don't support the book. I don't endorse the book.

Very simple. I think it was the parts I read were wacky and I haven't watched Michael Winger's critique yet but it could be everything he says is 100% accurate. It could be. Nothing to me to defend the book whatsoever. However, I just wanted you to know the whole story because there's a lot that comes out of Bethel and the best thing to do is read Bill Johnson's books for yourself, read Chris Valentin's book for yourself, read other books for yourself and evaluate. Evaluate. And if you come to negative conclusions about Bethel or positive conclusions, just do it before the Lord but do it fairly.

Do it accurately. And then watch this Bethel rediscovered series where they've been answering lots of questions, clarifying what they do teach on various things because they've been falsely accused. They've been rightly accused.

They've been falsely accused. So sort that out. And that's all I'm seeking to do.

Right? That was my purpose was interacting with that video where I felt it was fair or not and then the physics of heaven thing came up as part of it and therefore I addressed it. So as I said on the show, I'm not Bethel's defender or accuser. If you've got questions about Bethel, I can tell you about knowing Chris Valentin personally. I can tell you about knowing Bill Johnson personally, not as closely.

I can tell you about people that have known that have been part of the ministry there for many, many years. And then if you've got specific questions, issues, go to them because I'm not their defender and I'm not their accuser. You've got issues with me, what I hold to, what I believe, what I teach, what I give active platform for, please, by all means, go ahead and raise it. Let's go over to Andrew in Gaithersburg, Maryland, welcome to the line of fire. Hello Dr. Brown, how are you? Doing just fine, thanks. Hello.

Yep, you're on. I don't know if you watch the Super Bowl or not, but there's this whole campaign about he gets us and it's a campaign about Jesus, but there is some caveat I have with it and I would like to hear your thoughts on it. Okay, so I was flying to Hawaii from Dallas yesterday and I was able to get here and there with spotty internet on the plane, parts of the game, but I didn't see that commercial. However, I read about it and I've seen it previously. So my impression of he gets us, number one, I'm thrilled that people with money want to get a message about Jesus out to the world and spend the multiplied tens of millions of dollars or a hundred million dollars, whatever the budget is, to get gospel advertising out to the world to people that are not going to hear it or see it otherwise.

I'm thrilled with that. The one that I saw where Jesus being a refugee or he gets us, I think that was the one in the Super Bowl, and one other, I think I've seen maybe two or three total. One of them I thought, okay, that contains somewhat of a gospel message, but others, it's like, what is that? I know people are trying to connect us and he understands, but saying that Jesus understands me is not necessarily going to get me any closer to repenting of my sin, turning to God, asking for mercy. Oh, he gets it, so he knows my addiction is not my fault. He knows that my adultery is not my fault.

I just got a bad marriage. He knows that I relate to God my own way. I'm glad he gets us. That to me is not the message. I'm not one to sit here and be hypercritical or anything like that. However, I wonder, okay, what's the actual message? Is it going to get you to a website that really brings you the rest of the message? If so, maybe there could be something more of substance too if you're going to spend that much money.

I don't mean to attack those that are pouring in millions of dollars to get a message to the world, but I would think you want to actually get a message to them that might help bring them to Jesus. Those are the concerns that I have, sir. Thank you, sir. Another issue is that they kind of emphasize his humanity rather than his divinity. I mean, that's just something I kind of realize, but a lot of that I kind of see your concerns as well. So I kind of see your concerns as well.

That's kind of what I've been feeling. Yeah, well, thank you, Andrew. Again, you know me. I'm not one here to just sit and throw stones. Oh, I know how to do that.

I did that a lot late 70s, early 80s during my cold years. I know how to do that. You give me any critic of the charismatic movement. You give me any major voice. I could tear down what they're saying from other angles. In other words, even if I agreed with their criticisms, I could point out fault.

I could go after everybody. A message is preached, and the Hebrew's not right. The Greek's not right. I'm not here to do that. I'm not God's policeman or critic-in-chief. But there are things that are concerning, and for decades I have said that a compromised gospel is at the root of so many of our problems in America. There's a whole chapter in my forthcoming book Why So Many Christians Have Left the Faith. There's a whole chapter. Let's see, it's chapter six, The Effects of a Compromised Gospel. So that's the concern that I would have there. Hey, thank you. It appears we're thinking similarly.

By the way, one other subject here. So of course I didn't see the halftime performance, and for years it's been a tradition. If I'm home and the family were watching Super Bowl together, just a fun family event, we'll always just turn it off during halftime because almost always or very frequently there's going to be lewdness or junk in the performance. So I'm reading today headlines and Rihanna, this and that. She doesn't know the Lord, so I'm not expecting her to get up and sing the gospel.

But some vulgar things, and how is it family friendly? What surprised me was not that people were grieved over, but that they were surprised. They were, what kind of show is this?

Well, this is what the Super Bowl has done for decades. So you can be grieved, just don't be surprised. All right, let us go over to Honig in Toledo, Ohio. Welcome to the Line of Fire. Hello.

Yes, you're on the air. Go ahead. Oh, okay.

Well, I've got one real quick thing. When I was reading Revelation, the horsemen have the power to kill over a quarter of the earth, and the whole way it was structured looked suspicious to me, so I looked it up, and the word that I found for earth was not anthropos, which is man-faced, and that particular text is used to teach you the quarter of the population will die, but rather it's G-E, gay, which is soil. No, no, anthropos means man, and gay means earth.

So gay is just another way of referring to the earth, the world earth. But remember, though, this is apocalyptic language. This is visionary language. It's not saying that this is history in advance and that there's literally going to be one quarter of the earth's population wiped out here and a third wiped out there, et cetera. Some interpret it like that, but it's apocalyptic language. It's visionary language. So you can't take it as specific history in advance, but it is rightly translated. In other words, earth means the world, this physical earth. Well, if I understand that correctly, in whatever way it means, these horsemen, their territory will be limited to a quarter of the earth's surface. No, no, no, you're reading too much into it.

You're reading too much into that, yeah. There you go. That's all we need, thank you. Okay, you're welcome. Okay, I thought that was a revival-related question, but apparently not a problem. All right, let us go over to Trevor in California. Thanks for calling the line of fire.

Hey, Dr. Brown. Thanks so much for your ministry. It's really helped me spiritually, and now that you're doing the healthy emphasis, it's helped me health-wise too. How so? My wife on track.

How so? Well, you just encourage us all the time to get healthy, and every time I hear it, I think, oh, gosh, I really got to do that. It's been probably two or three years now, me hearing that and slowly trying to work toward lifestyle change in the area of eating. Wonderful, that's where it all starts, man.

I love these supplements, but they're not substitutes, so that's where it starts. Great, well, thank you. Glad to hear that. So your question, sir? Well, sir, I have two questions now. One, have you heard of the recent controversy surrounding Andy Stanley and his seeming drift on the issue of homosexuality?

Yes, sir. And then the second question is, so I'm a Christian pastor, and I love doing Q&A, but I'd love some tips from you. You're kind of a vet at Q&A, so how do you do Q&A?

What are some tips to do it well? All right, so first, Andy Stanley, we have interacted very intensively on this. I have gone back and forth with him with endless texts and emails. He made himself fully accessible to me eight years ago when I wrote an article with some open questions for him, and he joked, and he said, why didn't you send it to me first?

Like, oh, I didn't know you were that accessible. He gave me his phone number and email. So we've been a regular contact, but for eight years, literally since 2015, he has not been willing to give me a simple answer on would you agree that according to the Bible, homosexual practice is always sinful, and no matter how loving, same-sex relationships are not blessed in his sight. For eight years, including me pressing him every way I knew how to press him recently, he has refused to answer that question. And I've told him, I've just got to believe all the bad reports then, all the bad stuff I'm hearing.

I've got to believe it's true. We'll be right back. It's the Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get on the Line of Fire by calling 866-344-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks, friends, for joining us today on the Line of Fire.

Michael Brown coming your way live from Kona. So, Trevor, I've been hearing things for years, things that deeply concern me. When I reach out to Andy, he would say, no, it's not that. No, you heard incorrectly.

No, I checked with my staff. They're not saying this. He'd follow through diligently. In 2016, I was speaking at a conference, and the conference leader said, Andy Stanley supports same-sex marriage. I texted him. He said, no, I don't.

Could you please correct that? So I did at the conference, and then I did nationally on the radio. But he simply has refused to answer me, and his specific quote is sometimes ministry preempts clarity, and I told him that's wrong, that's error, and have called him to repent. So he insists I don't know what he actually believes, and I told him that's on him. So if you look at, Trevor, my recent article, so on the AskDrBrown.org website or on the Ask Dr. Brown app, if you look at recent articles, you'll scroll through and see a plea for ministerial clarity. That gives you backdrop to my larger position on this, and Andy reaches a whole lot of people.

I know he's got a great heart for the lost, and let's just pray for God's best in his life and where there's serious error that it'll be exposed and that he'll repent, and if there's not serious error, that he will bring serious clarification. As for Q&A, you have to be at home with spontaneity. Otherwise, you want questions submitted in advance. When I'm going to be doing something and people say we want to send you all the questions in advance, I say that's fine, but I'm happy to hear them on the spot. So I personally love spontaneity, and obviously, if you're asking me questions within my frame of knowledge and experience, I'm very comfortable answering those.

I've got no problem whatsoever answering them. So you have to make sure that you're addressing things that are within your wheelhouse and that you feel comfortable and that you can say, you know, I don't have an answer, or that's a great question, and I'm going to need to do some digging. It's better to do that than to give a false impression or just to speak empty words or anything like that.

So yeah, that's what I would say. And then you also want to help the person asking the question. But then, just like on the radio, I'm speaking to you, but every word I'm saying, I'm conscious of the fact that I'm speaking to our entire listening audience.

So you may be answering the question but realize, okay, as a pastor, this touches on many parents here. They have the same question. Or many young people have the same question.

They don't have the same answer. So all those present are receiving and edified by it. And then, if you're doing a public Q&A, you have to have control of it. So if it's with a mic and people get up and speak and here's their question or they're calling in, then you have to make sure you have control of that. So you never give the mic to the person. Whoever the mic person is, they hold it because otherwise someone grabs it.

They may want to preach and say, hey, please ask a question as opposed to give us a sermon. Just ask a question. Or you can have more control. If it's helpful, you have them submitted in writing and then someone working with you pulls out the ones that are the most interest.

Sometimes with a large crowd, that's the only way to do it. That's the only alternative. So those are some of my thoughts. Hopefully those are helpful. Thank you so much. Have a great day. Yep, you too. God bless.

You say, Dr. Brown, how come you didn't write anything about Andy Stanley? I was about to, and my wife Nancy encouraged me just to pray and ask the Lord if I'm supposed to say something publicly or just address the issues generically. And I felt if anybody asks, as many leaders have privately, I'll respond. If I'm asked publicly, I'll respond publicly.

Otherwise, read my appeal for ministerial clarity and you'll see very clearly where I stand there. Okay, so once again, I am blown away by your support through TriVita, through this wellness with a purpose company that is helping sponsor the line of fire. Michael Ellison, who is the president of that, also leads Ellison Media. So right now, as I'm speaking, he has been spending hours, maybe not this very day, meeting with different radio network leaders, station managers, different things across the country to help us get the line of fire out on hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of new stations across America in a way that we could do. We were on some big stations years ago, but the people in those cities did not give us enough funds to pay for it. In other words, we're listener-sponsored. We're listener-sponsored.

That's how we do what we do. I don't have a contract with someone paying me to be on the radio. We pay for airtime like other Christian ministries do.

Because we didn't have adequate support, we had to go off some of those great stations. Now there has been such a phenomenal interest from you, our listeners in TriVita, and they come up with a plan where 100%, 100% of all first-time orders go straight to the line of fire fund. 100%, not after profits.

No, no, 100%. And then all return orders, if you enjoy the supplements for years to come, then over a tithe will be donated back to the ministry. So we're just blessed and we keep getting reports sent in of your interest. I'm frankly blown away, which also means these things must be working for you. I've been amazed with crazy travel schedule and in and out of this state, that state, hours and hours on the plane.

It's up late at night, up early in the morning. Yeah, the healthy eating, it all starts with that exercise. But these supplements have really helped make a difference. So if you haven't ordered yours yet, go to trivita.com, trivita.com, check out what's there, look at some of the different products available, and then if you order there, use the code BROWN, so capital B, BROWN25, and get a 25% discount off your orders, period. Or, better yet, call 800-771-5584. And talk with a specialist and say, hey, I'm looking for this or I'm curious about this, and they'll be able to help you out. Tell them Dr. Brown sent you, all right, and you'll get the best discount available.

800-771-5584. As soon as we launch on some new stations and make some other changes, you won't be hearing me during the show so much talking about Trivita because during the commercial time when you're listening on the radio, folks will hear the ads. So I'm a living witness, though, to these being really good supplements.

So yeah, make the lifestyle change, healthy diet, healthy living, but wherever you are, so these are not substitutes, wherever you are, you will find them to be beneficial supplements and then join them in with the whole package of healthy living, and you'll be like me going on 68 years old and challenging young people, hey, let's do a CrossFit workout and see who wins, and more importantly, having zeal and energy to serve you, to serve the body, to glorify the Lord. So let's do this together. Let's get healthy spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and physically. All right, I want to refer you to my article. It's on the website askdrbrown.org, askdrbrown.org, or you can, on your app, just look for latest articles or just click on Read on the Ask Dr. Brown app.

That's Ask Dr. Brown Ministries, A-S-K-D-R Brown Ministries. When you go there, I encourage you to read my article, A Message to the Church of England. I wrote it with real sobriety. I wrote it with real burden.

I did not write the words lightly. When I said, Lord, everyone's talking about this. They are now saying that they will bless, ask God's blessing on same-sex couples.

They have absolutely affirmed them in every way, while at the same time saying, no, but we do uphold traditional marriage, and that you cannot have a same-sex ceremony in one of our churches. I prayed, Lord, everyone's talking about this. Is there something you want me to say? Immediately, my heart was drawn to 1 Kings 18, and Elijah asking the people, how long are you going to waver between two opinions? It's literally limp, like hop. Over here, over here, over here, over here.

How long are you going to do that? If the Lord is God, if Yahweh is God, serve him. If Baal is God, serve him. It's as if the people answered him not a word. That's how cold they were.

That's how backslidden they were. I said to the Church of England, you can't do both. You cannot do both. You can treat it, gays and lesbians, and bi's and queer-identified people, trans, treated them with grace and kindness in the past, or made them feel like the worst of sinners, or whatever it is. You may want to reach out in compassion, but you can't say, we uphold marriage as taught in the Bible, traditional marriage, and no, we will not allow same-sex weddings in our church, at the same time asking God to bless the unions and fully affirming the legitimacy of the unions.

You can't do both. Either say we are changing our views, we are departing from the Bible and historic church tradition of 2,000 years, we are changing everything, and we're just doing it little by little so as not to totally scandalize the conservative members of the church, or we care about people, we want to be sensitive, but we cannot move from what scripture says, one way or the other. But as far as I can tell, barring a massive revival and awakening within the Church of England, barring that, what is going to happen is that the strongest, most vibrant churches, which will be the conservative, biblically-based churches, will drop out. They will join a larger Anglican work worldwide, just as many Episcopalians did in America. That's the American version of the Church of England, you could say. They can drop out, form a new network of their own, or join with other conservative Anglicans in other parts of the world and say that the Church of England no longer speaks for them. That's what's going to happen, and the Church of England will continue to wither, will continue to lose its influence, will continue to lose its impact. You cannot please God and please people at the same time.

And real love, real love with sensitivity, with compassion, saying to a gay couple, you probably love each other as much as a husband and wife. You probably care and you want to serve God, but you cannot serve Him together as a couple. It's not His will. It's not His plan. It's sin and His sight. That's what love does. When we walk in love, when we walk in compromise, Church of England, the decision is right before you now.