Out of the Line of Fire Archives: A Debate About Charles Finney

I say Charles Finney was a powerful evangelist used by God.

My guess says Charles Finney was a false prophet used by the devil whose right stage for the line of fire with your host activist father international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown is the director of the coalition of conscience and president of fire school of ministry get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I'm holding my hands a brand-new DVD that was sent to me nicely by the Nicene Council.com a beware of false prophets, the case against Charles G. Finney, and it is produced and hosted by Jerry Johnson was the founder, president of Nicene Council.com. The apologetics group Inc. Jerry has consented to come on and be my guest today and I imagine that if we talked for hours. We would find hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of things in common that we can rejoice in but today we are debate this issue were you lay our different views on the table and hopefully learn from each other. Michael Brown thank you for joining us today on the line of fire number to call 866-34-TRUTH.

I'm not sure how many calls will be able to get to today because I want to give maximum time to interaction with our guest 866-34-TRUTH 87884 but by all means weigh-in on Facebook asked Dr. Brown asked DR Brown on Facebook. Jerry Johnson is the founder and president of Nicene Council.com. The apologetics group Inc. apologetics treat media.

He is earned a Master of arts in Christian studies and a master of philosophy and theology and apologetics would feel theological seminary currently working on a doctorate from Knox theological seminary in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. Jerry was the senior writer and researcher for the best-selling documentary's amazing grace history and theology of Calvinism in the marks of occult or biblical analysis. He was also the author of corresponding study guides for both films. Jerry is a member of the Board of Regents for which feel theological seminary and serves as an adjunct professor at Knox theological seminary and Veritas theological seminary since 2005 Jerry has been a chaplain for baseball chapel serving the Seattle Mariners minor league team.

The Polasky Mariners hate Jerry, thanks so much for taking time out your busy schedule to join us on the broadcast today, like it is my pleasure and I'm sitting here at my desk and I have my bulletproof vest on so go ahead and shoot well.

What wonderful you let everything fly with the with the DVD and while I'm not out to defend every point of Charles Finney's theology. We definitely see things differently so I'm quite sure that we can learn from each other, sharpen each other so I got my bulletproof vest on also. So feel free to fire back okay all right terrific okay question for you.

First I want to lay out things as clearly as I can and then go through the DVD .5 point and and have some interaction on it since Finney died in 1875, who lived from 1917 92 to 1875.

Why do you feel it's so important to address his teaching theology ministry today so many years later. I believe that much of the evangelical church and what were saying as an erosion of biblical Christianity.

Though not solely responsible. I believe that he was a catalyst for it in the 19th century belief that he approached the whole idea of Christianity and revivalism from a purely Newtonian methodology and I think as Newtonian ideals of the universe have of virtually dissipated that the ideas of continued to stick around and today we are reaping the harvest of Lily of pragmatic approach to Christianity that the Bible does not promote or use intent to be totally clear to read some of these codes we come back just a few minutes of intro here and then look into the heart of the self. But you plainly say that Finney was a false prophet heretic. So in, in your view, according to Galatians 1 is is Finney, one of those that Paul placed a curse on absolutely. I believe that it came with another gospel. I do not I do not believe the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ. I don't believe that he was a pure hell. Right now he's burning in hell with correct I believe the theology you articulated Maddox wars is not your Christian and please I thought all right will take enough stay with us folks in the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown joining us today.

I have Graham Jerry Johnson who is the president and founder of the Nicene counselor, and apologetics group and we are debating a new DVD that they have produced. Beware of false prophets, the case against Charles Finney 866-34-TRUTH are not sure they'll be getting to calls today give maximum time to our guest. Okay, Jerry. Let let's lay things out. I want to read some quotes from the back of the DVD and from the DVD itself.

A quote Charles T. Finney was clearly and undeniably a heretic. He did not preach or teach the true gospel set forth in the Scriptures.

In fact, it is not an exaggeration to say he was one of the greatest heretics of church history you refer to Montevideo as an archer arc heretic you say Charles G.

Finney was not a friend of the gospel.

In fact, he despised it, according to the apostle Paul Finney's gospel is no gospel at all.

You speak of and of the NAB operatives infiltrators in our ranks and" from Jesus in Matthew seven.

Beware of false prophets" from second Corinthians 11, which speaks of Satan himself, turned himself into an angel of light. So I think you've made your views quite clearly Jerry, I appreciate you pulling no punches okay at first I had a real problem with your exegesis of of Matthew seven.

I don't want to park there for long because I do agree that false doctrine is terribly dangerous. But when Jesus says you can judge by the fruit of my study, my Comintern, the book of Jeremiah would verify this in Jeremiah 23 almost all the major Matthew commentaries I can find agree that it's talking primarily about conduct. Not about doctrine here, but since we both agree false doctrines dangerous, but many race of that I thought was a low blow and kind of like Michael before you. I've written numerous comment. Also, I can only say that in the past, probably 100 years because if you go back to the old Puritan commentaries, they can argue that it was Concha or conduct the context of Matthew Southerners beware of false prophets advantage � what are the first of a false prophet and the consumer. It false prophecy or pool false teaching titles and with the fruits of the spirit.

There are innocent condos in Matthew Poole Matthew Emery reading all your reading all from the same little pool of extreme communist commentaries is Archie France said in Jeremiah 23 1915 and elsewhere there is the ethical tests their ungodly behavior gives them away this last seems to be the closest what is intended here. I suggest you start this agreement and look at look at the actual data, those were not proper actions, and yet David was a man after God's own heart in the final analysis will teach his primary and I'm sure I can go to Lawton on Calvinist commentaries back under 200 300 years ago and I would say the same thing that the Jerry did justice and fairness. I want to major on that. Okay I want to major in something that you did that I thought was a miserable low blow in the veneer and and and demeaning to your cause, which is this you say that anyone can mimic the fruit of the spirit. Anyone can appear to look like they're really living in the fruit of the spirit, matriarch, Finney okay and then you show a clip of Adolf Hitler play with children. I mean what what in the world was that doing in your video search time with children is that that that people thought he was walking the fruit of the spirit. People thought that he was a godly man and that you gonna compare Finney to Hitler subtly haven't come up with there and I will I will say I will say if you look at the beginning of where that starts were strictly trying to demonstrate an evil person like Hitler can appear to be kind or nice at times and I was the only thing that we take an isolated event or even multiple ones. I'm sure that there were displayed great love for friends but family and for country doesn't change the fact that he was wicked Bell since it's so you're actually saying that that Adolf Hitler mimic the fruit of the spirit, and that people really looked at him as a godly man.

I heard I heard what you just said but hasn't to do. Charles Finney, as of the do with your phone so I had argument efforts of the spirit and and and the idea that a person can mimic what we would consider to be outwardly those parts. Adolf Hitler mimicked Adolf Hitler mimicked outwardly what we recall the fruit of the spirit. Are you serious you not say that adult Hitler to show love, kindness, nice things while doing constant moral, hateful things, which has nothing to do with what you're saying.

Your clarity next summer will be predominantly nice while having the evil intentions know I was doing constantly. The man was doing evil constantly and here and there had a nice fa�ade, but diligently I'm saying is that completely. 11 workers, Corinthians 11 is explicitly starting second Corinthians 11 guys I print out 1111 guided himself as an angel of light and his ministers appear as ministers of righteousness going back American seven. Isn't that what Christ is arguing when those who come before him are saying, Lord, Lord, we got all these wonderful works in your name in the conduct and the conduct, Jerry, what is it said in Matthew seven, the conduct does not line up on the Jesus only learns not everyone who says to me Lord, Lord going to the kingdom and only those below the fog. Okay I was just I just want to mention it.

Let let's go a little further you talk about Finney's conversion story. Next, and here's what you say his salvation. Testimony should be question, and here's restore on page 16 of his memoirs he uses first-person pronouns 34 times but only speaks of God twice 34 references to himself on the next page, but none to God, not by the way, and then use it.

Finney credits himself of his salvation to read Finney directly his own conversion account in a moment, but just a curiosity, I checked Luther's introduction to the bondage of the will and the more than 20 first-person problem references before the first reference to God, which is then followed by more person first-person pronouns in Calvin's epistle to the reader to begin Ava's institutes there. 29 first-person pronouns and a total of four references to God. Lord and no mention of Jesus. I have to tell you is I'm watching this I thought unique hippies can't be serious that I'm supposed to question Finney's conversion account as he talks about what's happening in his own life and what's going on his own soul was most requested that maybe I should question bondage of the will and institutes because Luther and Calvin you somebody first-person pronouns of drilling that seriously Jerry what I think your you're not looking at the whole you're looking at a particular instance, and were we get a view of justification of regeneration of Original Sin and his belief that the actual twirling or change in regeneration is the center's own act, are actually changes of the airport himself in the most popular since the offer of a changed heart and that is a direct quote from Finney sermons better than writing your sample organic whole school is going German notes Jerry, I just made notes as I was going through were I've got all the notes about Original Sin.

All these things will I'm just going through the video in the order was presented. You made a point and you made the outrageous claim that Finney credits himself with his salvation. Limp me, which Finney says in his conversion account as he's coming under conviction just at this point. The whole question of gospel salvation open to my mind in a matter most marvelous to me at the time. I think I then saw as clearly as ever have in my life. The reality and fullness of the atonement of Christ. I saw his work was a finished work that instead of having or needing any righteousness to my own to recommend you to God.

I had to submit myself to the righteousness of God through Christ gospel salvation seem to me to be an offer of something to be accepted that it was full and complete and that all that was necessary on my part was to get my own consent to give up my sins and accept Christ salvation.

It seemed to me, instead of being a thing to be wrought out by my own works was a thing to be found entirely in the Lord Jesus Christ, who presented himself before me is my God and my Savior, which then Finney receives as a gift and as he says in his other quotes. It was grace from beginning to end. You completely mischaracterizes conversion account on your videos or know I get that fit he said what he said in this quote would be very damning to your position I would do that.

I will challenge your readers or your listeners to go in and read Finney's memoirs. Now I will.

I've read it completely restored text three times and I went over creation, a car conversion account.

In fact, I went to outside sources that related the story to even took me six months to track down George Washington Gale's autobiography and read it from cover to cover, as well as H. L.

Nettleton and leaving Beecher and others, including my and I wanted to compare and contrast all of the different accounts of his conversion experience.

And when I look at the totality of his theology and this is why brother Mike that if you look at what I really believe was John MacArthur who, when he was going through his own work at made the comment that if you look at any and how he really reasoned and how he learned she will learn theology. He wrote this cannot hang onto the MacArthur quote we got a break. Most will start there. I still say two things. Number one, folks have no idea of the conversion account the weight really happened based on a read watch your video number two was really silly to say the thing about first-person pronouns and again made me wonder how seriously he was got more serious. Started out very shake my opinion you can rebut me when we come back and it's the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown and I'm I'm having debating a brother in the Lord with whom I probably have far more in common than a different with Jerry Johnson found the president of Nicene counsel.com. The apologetics group, Inc. and the producer and host of a new video beware of false prophets, the case against Charles G. Finney, Jerry.

We both got our vests on it for about where you live. By the way what state. Now I'm just getting a little Virginia.

Virginia rights were not that not that far when I'm in North Carolina so will have to sit down and have a meal together without our bulletproof vest on and find out why there is a brother I got actually say if I may plug one of your books. I ordered your book on the oh good night forget the title of a queer thing happened to America really looking forward to getting into it. I've heard great things about it so I do believe you're right.

You and I again agree more than we do strictly Michael, if I may have your mission charge. I say something here real quick. Go for it.

Okay. And I thought about that long and hard since Marcus contacted me about being on the broadcast and I'm guessing that when it comes to orthodoxy, since you and I are brothers in the Lord Jesus, that we both by the grace of God maintain biblical and historical orthodoxy, and I want to give you some examples. I'm sure both of us believe that the Bible alone is the word of God.

I inserted both of us believe that the fall is recorded in Genesis chapter 1 was a real devastating event on mankind. We both believe that as a result of the fall, Adam and Eve spell understand every aspect simple nature on all of their posterity. We both believe, therefore, that man's nature is sinful. What you admire and what scholars call Original Sin. I would further contend that you and I both believe that man does not become a center when he but extends because he is born without sinful nature writing inherited from Adam. Any and I know that both of us believe that the only remedy for both original and actual spam is the blood of the Lamb of God, the Lord Jesus, and it is by faith in him and his substitutionary death on the cross along that we are straight. Would you agree with all of their okay are different. Lena is over what Finney talk.

I believe Finney not only denied Original Sin and railed against it, but he also denied double imputation and substitutionary atonement. Now, I'm guessing here if you and I went through.

Here are some of Angela's speak and this guy was saying there is no Original Sin, there is no imputation of art the Christ and his righteousness to ask and Christ was not a substitute for our our sins on the cross.

I'm sure you would turn to me and say a jury there something wrong with this guy when you think you better get in and and think that's where we are. The question really comes down to what did Finney believe last night I read a book by a guy who was appropriately like believers like you do that, I have it all wrong.

I don't believe I have it wrong.

Nothing would give me greater joy go to find out that I was wrong. I want baby to be in heaven. I want to be in heaven. You know I don't want anybody to be your help. But because of my convictions to the Bible and historical orthodoxy. I believe that's pretty denied the things that I just mentioned what you and I agree. So the issue comes down what he believed.

And you would write letter quote on Finney's conversion. I think that's a great quote. Let me just leave business with John MacArthur's assessment after his studies of study, wrote this quote Finney's legal training had conditioned him with a wall of long presuppositions. Finney's notions of justice, guilt, righteousness, transgression, forgiveness, sovereignty, and a host of other terms were drawn from his legal studies, not the Scriptures just displayed it again. The real question is what did Finney believe exactly each how important the doctrine of Original Sin and its effects it has on other doctrinal convictions so that the let me jump in minutes.

If you think so obviously that's that's the issue to us.

What did Finney actually believe in which case this is a secondary debate because we to both of us agree on the fundamental things that you both mentioned and we are not Finney's judge ultimately, I was powerfully impacted by Finney's writings by his conversion by the piercing nature of his preaching by the hunger for God that it produced by that the deep lasting repentance that I saw it bring by that the deep hatred of sin that I sought produce but my salvation is not dependent upon him being right, nor is your salvation dependent upon him being wrong.

So in that sense it's it's secondary. But here's here's the problem I have with MacArthur and any other fine men who were attacking Finney.

I look at lots and lots of other things. Finney said just last night I was reading verse after verse in his his book sermons on gospel things we preaches the gospel.

Page after page after page and receiving everything Jesus did by faith in the power of his death and the power of his blood and and and are universal guilt before God, etc. and I just say that he was now explaining those things through. As a lawyer that he was combating a lot of the dead theology that he found in his day. II think of the place. We have our most agreement is that he had a strange way of coming to the concept of the universal guilt of the human race, but he did. He said this, that, by nature were organist sent of Ephesians the second chapter and he said, subsequent to the commencement of moral agency. Previous to regeneration the moral depravity of mankind is universal without any mixture of moral goodness or virtue. He also said we can also predict without the gift of prophecy that with the Constitution physically to pray. That was probably the strangest thing just the Constitution physically to pray as rent with objects to waken appetite with all the circumstances in which human beings first form their moral character they will seek universally to gratify themselves. This is the fact that Christ died in the stead and behalf of sinners proves that God regarded them not as unfortunate but is criminal and altogether without excuse if I have a few more quotes to that same effect, and I have quotes from encoding you even John Newton amazing hymns about the atoning work of Jesus.

So let's do this.

Let's take got a break coming up. Let's take the second half of the show. Let's go through Original Sin. Justification by faith atonement.

Let's lay out what you understand. Finney said that I felt was the better part of your video I took Maurice Schubert for the first half introduction of and in the will go through point for point and I read you some other quotes from Freddie since you started it so much and you can react so will spend the next half hour doing that I got a break though, so the fair enough Jerry. All right, great.

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All that for $30 postage paid to solicit half price so order today at 1-800-278-9978, 1-800-278-9978 or online. Ask Dr. Brown's working number to call 1-800-278-9970 it's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution get into the line of fire now by calling 6634 through here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I'm so glad to have on the program today.

Johnson, who is founder, president of Nicene counsel.com in the apologetics, Inc. their newest video.

Beware of false prophets, the case against Charles G. Finney, Jerry, thanks again for joining me today appreciated okay. We got just in the segment about four minutes so but let me throw out a question for you, and then I'll give you most of the time to respond, of Finney, again, speaking of moral depravity said the carnal mind reveals itself in a whole life of rebellion against God. That unconverted manner, in a state of rebellion against the authority of God is one of the plainest facts that line the face of society.

So in Finney's view.

Deuteronomy 139, verses like that which about little children didn't understand good and evil is a seven would be a similar passage that based on that human beings are born with a a fallen nature that will always lead to sin, but that they choose to sin as a result of that nature.

And then are universally guilty before God, so that the conclusion is every human being is inevitably going to sin once they they come into adulthood, or that the timer they can think and understand from cells in choose to act freely, universally, will send you universally guilty before God utterly condemned, with no possible hope of salvation in themselves. So the question would be, even in this area that some might say, we would be the that the quickest affinities with his physical depravity statement of is that the exact same conclusion that that were all universally guilty that we all have sinned that were fully responsible for us and that we can blame no one but ourselves and that we have to plead with God for mercy through the crosses at the conclusion exactly the same and to me that's why Finney preached against sin with such passion and exposed its ugliness with such passion so your takes her like you know where and when I read the work last night by a fellow who was defending Charles Finney. What I noticed and what I believe he did it when I entered the study of the subject.

I gotta confess I didn't know much about Finney. I come from it like you any costal charismatic background I was saved in the costal church and that he was touted as being the great evangelist and I really had no reason to doubt it but it was probably about five years ago I started a nominal study MMF picked up about two years later when I started reading a lot more now let me let me do the best you. This quote allows you to tell you I'm sorry I will track this got her dream last night. I think what he wanted, and this is what I believe a lot of good men want is baked cake. Finney's words and a read some kind of evangelicalism into those words and assuring that Finney's meaning the same thing that we me and I don't believe he does in fact I have left a lot of quotes that I could've added but let me just give you one from your systematic theology, page 179, by the way, this is the bicentennial edition is an abridged edition.

He says that Original Sin is a monstrous and blasphemous dogma that a holy angry God.

I'm sorry got a holy God is angry with any creature for possessing the nature with which he was sent into being without his knowledge or consent, then he goes on says original or constitutional sinfulness. Physical regeneration and all their kindred and resulting dogmas are like some person about the gospel and repulsive to the human intelligence. Now that's page 179 of this book and it goes on. It is a diatribe and I will say this there are men there. Not all Calvinists and not all Christian Hardeman who wrote the book of modern Reformation of the Bible. He made this comment he's not even a Christian. He said Nettleton's insistence on preaching the doctrine of Original Sin put in increasingly out of touch with Charles Finney and these are having a hard God. Numerous quotes from Charles BB Warfield RC scroll and is seriously lazy is periodically during the discussion here will come back to that.

My question is still a you end up saying all human beings will sin inevitably and will be hundred percent guilty before God is not the same and results of talk that through the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the minor fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH dear again is Dr. Michael Brown. I am not a lot of take every minute myself have discussion fruitful discussion. I hope with my guess Jerry Johnson found the present of Nicene counsel.com. The apologetics group Inc. and the producer and host of the new video beware of false prophets, the case against Charles G.

Finney so Jerry is as I've read Finney II have seen him as in the mainstream of evangelicalism, which is why a great Calvinistic theologian like JI Packer would would endorse Nate.

You see Packer probably didn't actually read what he had to say but trying to restrain a great sound right right right upper or perhaps Packer saw something that you did not. I think again it's the grid of of how we understand him, in which quotes or are the the the most important. I see that Finney's issue with quote Original Sin was that it took away human responsibility. Where is his thing was to argue for the full guilt and full human responsibility of of our sin that we are 100% guilty before God by our deeds and that we can't blame anyone for it. That's why take the greater argument to be and hence is constant pushing to to salvation through Jesus alone. All Christians and sinners are to understand the whole plan is complete but the whole of Christ. His character has worked his atoning death of his ever living intercession belong to each and every man in need only to be accepted. There's a full ocean of it. He said you do not need to have in yourselves the attributes of Jesus Christ for his attributes become practically yours for a possible youth use as saith the Scripture. He is of God made unto us wisdom, righteousness, sanctification, and redemption.

What you need wisdom. Here it is righteousness there is sanctification here you have it all is in Christ, can you possibly think of any one thing needful for your moral purity, or usefulness, which is not hearing Christ nothing all is provided here so I I look at those statements and hundreds and hundreds and hundreds others just like that to say I now put everything else in the context of that's the normative reading to me and I'll understand everything else in that context, and high-fiving. Surely you found hundreds of statements to this effect in his preaching and teaching and I'm not saying that I agree with everything.

The problem is, I believe the core of his doctrine is heresy and I mean that all historical sense of the word quote. You probably saw on the video and it comes right out from is not completely restored. He writes that Gail talking about George Washington Gail pulpit men work faster than regeneration. In short, he held all those doctrine that logically flows from the fact of the nature; it felt these doctrines I could not receive.

Now I start out that section quoting the great Armenian preacher John Wesley and John Wesley said that all tinnitus: Original Sin or by any other title or, but even still in the fundamental point which differences heathenism from Christianity. They may indeed allow that men have many vices of something that Finney did that some are born with us that something Finney. But here is the shibboleth is manned by nature filled with all manner of evil is devoid of all Google good if he only fallen his soul totally corrupt or to come back to the text of every imagination of the fault of his heart, only evil continually allow this.

John Wesley and you are so far Christian I and you are but even still, when I make this pronouncement rather, this pronouncement was not just Jerry Johnson conjuring up something in his own mind. I believe Finney is a play GML buyback. I don't think he went as far as Pelagianism some things and other things. I think it's pelagius, but we have what seven church councils more of them ecumenical in nature that say that if you deny the doctrine of original sin that children before they are born before they have done good or evil inherit a sinful nature, from all of us that if you deny that you are anathema and this was the decision of the Council of Carthage in 412.

This was a decision of reaffirmation and for 16 of the Council of North African churches in 418 B ecumenical Council of Ephesus in 431:529 even though a lot of those councils have a lot of anti-Semitic stuff and reject a lot of scriptural authority and a lot of weird doctrines are for so Strattera got $20 loans.

The discount is not an example that it's not just my judgment don't know I didn't hear is, the argument I still have a firearm.

Just just hang up. I haven't gotten an answer to my question since Finney says in into me. This is why I have the least agreement with me okay but if since Finney says, "the carnal mind reveals itself in a whole life of rebellion against God. That unconverted manner, in a state of rebellion against the authority of God is one of the plainest facts that line the face of society so he believed that every human being was born physically depraved and that every human being by nature: Ephesians 2 would sin and with only and inevitably send that it was guaranteed and absolutely sure and that every human being.

Then we become universally guilty before God needing atonement that can only come to the blood of Jesus up. I'm still I still don't get your your preaching a message right nobody knows your theology okay in your preaching to people and you're telling them they are sinners in the sight of a holy God that there is no possible way that they can say themselves that they are utterly damned by their sin and that given a thousand lifetimes to do it again. They would always do the same thing and they need to flee to the cross for salvation isn't the end result the same in terms of that conviction is it when I got saved. I had no clue about Original Sin only was I was guilty I had sent when you look at the preaching of the book of acts.

Show me where where it emphasizes Original Sin what it emphasizes is the guilt of that generation before God for their own deeds.

That's what Finney was doing so II still don't understand.

We could argue theology all day long, but if you be so Strattera let's look at the preaching pattern at the book of acts and elsewhere in the New Testament and it's always calling people to be responsible for their sin against God. There guilt not to say that Adam sin that we are all born sinners to say I have sin I am guilty I need to repent.

I need to turn and asked for mercy and forgiveness that's that's I'm still missing with you Jerry your work quickly. The difference between a reason and an excuse when I was a kid and I would do something wrong and my dad would ask me why and I were going to excuse Modi would stop me and IaskedyouforareasonI'mnotaskingyouforanexcusebecausethereisnoexcuseforyourbehavior.IwanttomakethatpointsimplybecauseIdobelievethatFinneyconfusedthetwosecond,IhavequotesfromFinneywhereIbelieveindefyingitsterms.Forexample,moraldepravity,asheusedthetermquotecannotconsistofanyattributesofnatureorConstitution,noranylapsedorfallenstateofnaturemoraldepravity.AsIusethetermdoesnotconsistinnorimplyasinfulnatureinthesensethatthehumansoul.IknowIwillcloseonthat.I'mnotarguingI'msorryhasjustyouwouldsaythattheyouknowthatwedon'tgouptopeopleandsayGodhasawonderfulplanforyourlife.WhereisthatpreachinginthebookofactswhileI'mjustaskingwhereisthatyou,I'mjustaskingthatyourpattern.Rewriteitwiththewrongtarget.IbelievethathewasanArminianIbelieveArminiansaremybrothersandsistersinChrist.I'mnotknowingaboutArminianism.AswedoourArminianpoliceprayertimeaBible.JerryI'maskinghimwhereintheBible.OkayIlikethatstatementandsendthevideobutI'maskingyouandII'mI'mI'mgone.SoStratteraokayI'maJew,followingJesuschurchcannonshaveinteresttome,butultimatelyit'sit'sScripturelet'smakeabreakfromIagreeFinney'spreachingokayFinney'spreachinghismessageiswherehewhereoverthisandthisisthefruitofhisadvancesinthemessagesthathepreachescallpeopletorepentance,holdthemuniversallyresponsibleanduniversallyguiltybeforeGodwithnopossiblehopeofreformationinthemselvesbecauseoftheirsinsointhe.Isn'tthatthegospelmessage.WheredoesthegospelmessagerequireanevangelisttosaythatyousinbecauseofOriginalSin.Idon'tseethatanywhereintheNewTestamentpreaching.Isortofresponseoriginalno.I'msimplygoingtoargueabouttheministryofIvanovichbecauseheworeashirtrollingaguyaheretic.Yourdamninghimtohelpyoursalesareincreased.AnothergospelI'mlookingathisgospelmessageandit'satypicalmessagetorepent,youareGod.Ireally,reallybrotherMikethoughtIhadexplainedthatthatIbelieveFinneyisusingtermslikethemorningchurchstartsusingtermslikeGodheavenlyfatherTrinitysalvationjustificationbutisgiventotallydifferentmeaningstoI'mtryingtogivehimthat'swhatItriedtodo.Specifically,Ijustfoldedinthedefinitionofmoraldepravityisreadandunreadmessagesonthatthismorningandandagainhopingyouwereone6167bridgelecturesonsystematictheologyandtellmewhatlittlehemeansbythatbecauseIthoughtitwouldJerrytellitwhereyouarenotreallyfolks,wegotonelastsegmentlet'sfocusonatonementgetsherdifferences.Wecomebackandit'sthelineoffirewithyourhostDr.MichaelBrown.Yourvoiceismoreculturalandspiritualrevolution.HereagainisDr.MichaelBrown.IamhavingajoyfuldebatewithmybrotherintheLord.JerryJohnsonCountypresidentofNicenecounsel.comapologeticsgroup,Inc.andhostandproducerofnewvideowhichItakestrongexceptionbewareoffalseprophets,thecaseagainstCharlesG.FinneytakeJerry.Iwillputourspot,butwouldyoueverconsenttohaveapublicdebateonsensationalism.YouknowwhatbrotherI'vegottoletyouknowIreadtheargumentsonitandI'mnotthoroughlyconvinced.Okay.IfindIfindit.Five.IfI'massumingthatyou'retalkingabouttheendofthegiftsofthespirit,yesoryeahbecauseIamstillcharismaticandyousaidyouwere.I'mjustokayyoustrongly.IcouldonlyargueagainstitpragmaticallyatthispointIneedtheirartofScripturewhereIthinkthatitdefinitelyappearstobemyonlyproblemis,I'llletyouknow.*I'vegotgoodfriendsofmineandwhatItellthem.Ifyouhaveaprayerlanguageyoubelievethatit'sdrawingyouclosertoGod.ImarketeddenyyouthelightofthatokayandIbelievethatyouNOAA.Tomethat'snotanissue.I'mgonnareallystandardizeon,butIwouldlovetodiscussitontheradioprogramwithyouonetime.IjusttrytogiveyoubothsidesthatthefrustrationofyouandthenthecontinuationyoubecauseIsometimeswonderifthere'snotahappymediumtobeuniquetobemet.Butbyallmeansweshouldprobablytakeourbestofferthatsale,butnobulletproofvests,butokayyouknowit'sfunny.IwilltellyouIreadJackDeere'sbookisfirstoneafewyearsagoandarticulatedwithoutscribblingonGodDouglasaltarowesyousureImade.Ilivedtherestoppedandgotsomeprettygoodworksoutthereinthefinalanalysis,thoughIandalsotheScripture,butletbutagainIwouldhavetoqualifythatandIknowwedon'thavetimerightyougotit.Wegotaboutsixminutestojusttosaythisverybriefly.Idon'tfrustrateyoubejustverybrieflyabouttheOriginalSinissue.IIdeaflydonotseeitthesamewaythatFinneydoesthereokaybuttomebecauseeverythingthathepreachedhadthesameendresultofuniversalguilt,noexcuse.Wearesinnersandwewillalwayssinandtheonlywaytobechangedisbythenewbirth,andbythepoweroftheSpiritbythebloodofJesus.ThattomewithisisnotlikeaMormonwayofreadingatthattomeissayinghemayhavehadsomeobjectionstosomethingsinaweirdwayofcomingoutsomestuff,butultimatelycametothesameconclusionsaboutwhatwedo.Humanbeingsareneedforsalvationbutputthataside,IwillletyoureadmuchofPelagianismselectorsandyoujustalittleandIknow.IknowFinneyiscommonlycalledthePalladianIIunderstandthatbutokayjustjustquicklyotherflightunitslastyearofyourtimeveryevangelicalterminologyattimeyou'realmostsittingthereblinkingrightthingtheseguysyellingthatit'sallinsertit'sallthegridwithwhichweseeinfor.Forexample,I'msurethatthatyouwouldpraiseoneoftheworksofLutherandCalvin,Icanappreciationforthem,butLuthersaidsomeoftheworst,mosthorrific,ugliest,bizarrestatementsofanyleaderininchurchhistory.IgotarecordingofthebookontheJewsontheirlotwillknowthatnonotjustthatsomeofhissinfreelystuffandsinboldlyarejustpullingoutquotesandthoughtmannerfollowedtohatchetjobonLutherorCalvinisdoingfromthewoundstuffforthebidovertheatrocitiesattributedtomoney.Tomeit'samatterofovercomingitsympatheticallyrunsympatheticallyandthequestioniswheredoesthetruth.Barbarajustjustveryquickly.ThelastliterallyforminutesthatwehavetakenacoupleofminutesthatthenI'llrespondyourissueswithaffinitiesdoctrineofatonement,sogiveityourbestshotfortwominutesthenI'llinterruptyouandgiveyoumyresponseinandthenwillwillfigureIhadtositdownandhavesomefellowshiptogetherokaygooddeal.Ratherbasically,theatonementisnotasubstitutionaryatonementandIbelievethatistheprimaryevangelicaldoctrinewhenitcomestotheideathatChristdiedasasacrificeforsinmightemphasizethatwouldFinneysaidonpage206ofthesystematictheology,thesubstitutionaryviewoftheatonementassumesthattheatonementwasaliteraldeath,whichwethinkisnotlookingnatureoftheatonement.Itistruethattheatonementofitselfdoesnotsecurethesalvationofanyone.AnyhelpyouknownofthegovernmentaltheoryoftheatonementinthegovernmentaltheoryoftheatonementholdsthatChristbyactuallypaidthepenaltyfornomanspendswhatthatbidwastodemonstratethattheirsinsdeservewhattheydeservedattheendofthejustgovernmentjudgeoftheuniversethatGodjusttoforgivethem.Ifonothergrounds,suchoftheirfaith.TheonceandtheperseverancetheyneedisdemandsbywayI'mquotinghere,butthisisjusttoevisceratethestablesworkofalloftheintrinsicstatingworktoreplacethecentricvisionofScripturewiththe.AlthoughsecuredvisionofPelagianismafterquotefromDr.RobertLanganinhisnewsystematictheologyoftheChristianfaith.OneIechoDr.writingonasuspectofthegovernmentaltheoryoftheatonementandtoIbelievethisisexactlywhatFinneyL2andIcanquotehundredsofpassagesfromhismemoirs,andasystematictheologyandhisrevivallecturesregulatesunlightmuch.IthankthankyouforbeingconciseandclearonthatJerryandandthatthosepartsarelaidoutclearlyonthevideointermsofthedifferencesIguessthequestionisinawhichiscaninfluencewhichinourunderstanding.IseethatthatFinneyobjectedtotheideathatJesustooktheexactliteralpunishmentthatwould'vebeenrequiredforeveryhumanbeingwhoeverlivedinsinandrathertorepresentativepunishment.IseestatementslikethisGodsolovedtheworldthathegavehissontodieforandletmejustgrabthesereallyquickifsomeveryintensequotesfromfromFinneyaboutatonement.Thesetalksabouttheoriginalwords,atonementisthegovernmentalsubstitutionofthesufferingsofChrist,forthepunishmentofsinners.Itisacoveringoftheirsinsbyhissufferings,justastheupliftedactswouldotherwisehavefallenonyourneck.Hecaughttheballonhisown.Youcouldhavenolife.Ifhehadnotdiedtosaveit.TheBibleespeciallyalmosteverywhererepresentshisdeaththroughthesheddingofhisbloodisavicariousofferingforoursins.Thetextwhichprovethis,ortonumerousnumeroustobequotedintheskeletonthatChrist'ssufferingsandespeciallyhisdeathwerevicarioushasbeenabundantlyshownintreatingthesubjectofatonement,hispointwasthatunlessit'sjoinedbyfaith.Itdoesn'tavailandthetruefaithwillproduceatransformationhatesJerryweareoutoftimeasIthinkthisisbeenenlighteningforourlistenersandit'sagoodintroductionforustogettoknoweachother.WehaveamutualfriendofDr.JamesWhiteunderstatedareaofinterestoccurswithamargin.Wearecurrentlyactuallyworkingonanarmwrestlingmatchreleasedbychallengingtheonejustjustcan'ttellhimtodon'tchallengeuntilbikeridingmanagementheyJerry,thanksforbeingwithuswereoutoftimehereandfriendslistenback.IencourageyoutogetonlinecheckforsomeofusFinneysermonslikeGod'sloveforsendingworldofsermonsongospelthemesorsermononatonement.Letmegiveyoumybottomlineonthis.MyguestandIagree.SalvationisfoundinthebloodofJesusalone.WeareuniversallyguiltybeforeGod.Wehavenopossiblehopeofsavingourselvesredeemingourselvesorimprovingourselves,ouronlyhopeistocastherselfonGodpleaformercy.AskedtowashhisclaimbythebloodofJesusandgiveusanewlifeinanewlife.Hewillgiveusinlinebehindtoday'sshallowChristianityisanepidemicofshallowconversionsinlinebehindtheshallowconversionsisanepidemicofshallowconviction.It'stimeforthelineoffirewithyourhostactivistandauthor,internationalspeakerandtheologianDr.MichaelBrownyourvoiceofmoreculturalhands.MichaelBrownisthedirectorofthecoalitionofconscienceandpresidentoffireschoolofministrygetintothelineoffirenowbycalling866-34-TRUTH.That's866-34-TRUTHhereagainisDr.MichaelBrown.IjusthadthejoyofhavingonehourbewithTerryJohnsonfromNiceneCouncilapologeticsgroupputoutanewvideobewareoffalseprophets,thecaseagainstCharlestoFinneyandwhileIdon'tsupportifheweretofinishtheologyforsure.Ilookedit.FinneyisagreatevangelistismightilyusedbyGodandmyguestviewCharlesFinneyasafalseprophetisbeenusedbySatan.Threehadagreatconversation.YoucanlistentoitlaterbygoingonlinetoaskDr.Brown.org.Clickonthelineoffireandyoucanlistentothefirsthour,today'sprogramming,butthediscussionaboutFinney.That'smeonthesubjectofconvictionofsingetsmeonthesubjectoftheworkoftheHolySpirittoconvictofsin,andifwetalkaboutmoralandculturalrevolution.Oldfriends.Thisisbig.Thisisimportant.ThisisMaj.MichaelBrownthankyousomuchforjoiningustodayonthelineoffire,andagainhecallsthelasthourwhichmeansI'mreadytotakecallsthishour.Here'snumbertocall866-34-TRUTH866-34-TRUTH784onlineFacebookaskedDr.BrownSDRBrownoraskDr.Brown.orgforawebsiteokaylet'swriteaquestionforyou.Doyouseegenerallyenterchurchculturetoday.Alotofsuperficialityofalackofmoralconvictioneffectontheaddresstomorrowlittlebitmore.Thequestionofthemoralapathyinourcultureandwhatwecandoaboutitbutdoyouseejustalotofsuperficialityinthechurchhaveevensavedanumberofyears,likeIhave.It'samust.Fornow,andcertainlyisawholelotmoresuperficiallyspecialitynowinmostcirclesthantherewaswhenIfirstgotsavedtalkaboutinAmericaandthechurchofAmerica.ThankGodforthegoodcommitteddeeperhungrylifethat'sthereamongmanybelievers.But,youseealotofsuperficiality.Doyouseealotofconvictionofsin,onlyalittlefurtherDCpeoplecomingunderrealconvictionwhentheycometofaithwhentheygetsavedwhentheyarebornagainordoyouprimarilyseepeoplelikejoiningthechurchlikejoiningtheclubwerefollowingJesusbecauseofthebenefitsyourlotofgospelpreachingtodaythatweretheprimaryemphasiswouldbeonallthewonderfulthingsJesuscandoforyouhowwecanmakeyouabiggerandbetteryouifyoujustputyourtrustinhim.Howgetridoftheguiltandcleanupyourlifeandgiveyoueternallifeandblessingandprosperityinthisworld.Notallofwhichisfalsebythework,butthat'stheprimarymessageandthennotalotofconviction.Notalotofpeoplebeingundonebytheirsin.OneofthethingsthatstruckmeaboutFinney'sownconversion.Finney'sownministryisthedepthtowhichhewasconvictedbeforeGod.ThedepthtowhichhewasundonebeforeGod.Thedepthtowhichhegotsavedittothetothebone.AsI'veoftensaidwhenhepreachedittoothers.Theywouldgetsavedtothebone.TherewouldbethesamekindsofradicalconvictionsdidyouseealotofthathappeningradicalconversionsIshouldsaidyouseealotofthathappeningtodaywouldyouseemoresuperficialconversionsunmaskingnamenamesofpreachersaretojudgeindividuals.I'mjusttalkingsymptomaticallywhatyouseeasyoulookoutinthebody.Letmethrowthisoutfromanotherangle.Doyouthinkperhapsthat'sold-fashionednegativepreachingtothinkperhapsitthat'sanoldwineskin.NotsomethingGodisdoingthiswholeconvictionandyouweigheddownwiththeguiltandburdenofsinandohGodI'masinnergoalGodhavemercyonthee,OGodsaveme.That'stheoldwaythatthatwe'veimprovedonthatwe'vecomeintosomethingbetter.We'vecomeintoamorewonderful,heyhere'slifeisblessinghisallthegoodstuffnowenjoyJesusandandthat'sabetterwhatyoudon'tneedtogobythewayofconvictswilltalkaboutthatworkwillfocusonconvictiontoreviewsomestirringaccountsofGodworkingatandIwanttoremindyousomethingJohnXVIchapteriswhentheHolySpiritcomesintotheworld,hewillconvicttheworldofsinisaministryoftheHolySpirit.Imyselfdonotbelievethisisanoldwineskinthatisbeendisplacedwilltakeyourcallswilltalkaboutit.866342yougetsaveconvictiononthelineoffirewithyourhostDr.MichaelBrowngetintothelineoffirenowbycalling866-34-TRUTHhereagainisDr.MichaelBrownconvictionofsin.TheHolySpiritpiercingintothedepthsofourbeing,showingusherguiltbeforedawnthatwecryoutforsalvationmercy.Boy,thatthat'sathemeinScripture.Andit'ssomethingthat'shappeningrevivalmovementsinchurchhistoryhavebeeneyewitnesstoitup.I'velivedthroughit.ImyselfwassavedaftertheHolySpiritputmethroughdeepconviction.I'vehadmajorchangesinmylifeasabelieverwiththeHolySpiritworkedonmewithdeepconvictionwanttocrawloutofmyskin.Ifeltsomiserablewithinmercywasfoundatthecrossemployeechangecamecouldbethatabigprobleminthechurchtodayissuperficialconversionsbecauseofsuperficialorevennoconviction.Thankyouforjoiningusonthelineoffire.866-34-TRUTH866-34-TRUTH7884onlineaskDr.Brown.orgthisweekwehaveaspecialresourcepackagereallymeanttostiryourheartstobereadingfromsomeofthematerial.Soifyou'reinterestedingettingthesewilltellyoulaterintheprogramhadhadagetholdofthese,butinmybookatimeforholyfire,preparingthewayfordivinevisitation.ThereisawholechapteronconvictionImentionedbeforethatwhenIwaswritingthischapterandenteringsomeofthequotesinit.AtonepointIgotsochargedandsoblessedthatthatIIIjumpedupandIputputwindinapan.Iwasreadymycomputer.Isteppedawayfromitandjumped.Istartedjumpingupanddown.Iwasstayingataguestroomatafriend'shomeandIjumpedupanddownwithjoyatthepowerofthesequotesandgoalfromDuncanCampbellandtheHebrides.Anothermainfeatureofthe1949Hebridesrevivalisbeendeepconvictionofsin.Attimes,leadingalmosttodespair.I'veknownoccasionswhenitwasnecessarytostoppreachingbecauseofthedistressmanifestedbytheanxious.Manywouldfindexpressionforthefeelingintheirhearts,andtheburdenoftheirguiltyconscience.InthewordsofJohnNewton.Myconsciencefeltandowneditsguiltandplungemeindespair.Isawmysenses,buthadspiltandhelpedtonailintheirtheparishofWignertrytopronounceyouIGalllorriesandvansavailablewereputintoservicetoconveythepeopletotheplaceofworship.Yetmanywereforcedforcedwalkmilesbutdistancedidnotmatterinanyratetheyknewthatthemeetingswouldcontinueiftheywerenotintimeforthefirstthere'dbesureofgettingthesecondofthethirdbecausethebromidessotheycameacrosstheMorrisonoverthehills,youngmenandmaidens,theirtorchesflashinginthedarkness,intentupononethingtogetpeacefromaguiltyconscienceandrefugefromthestormandtheirbosomintheshelteroftherockofagesW.GrahamScrogginssaidtherehasneverbeenaspiritualrevivalwhichdidnotbeginwithanacutesenseofsin,BrianEdwards.Theserole"intheconvictionchapterinmybookatimeforholyfirerevivalsoasrevivalofholinessbeginswithaterribleconvictionofsinisoftentheformthatthisconvictionofsintakesthetroublesthosewhoreadofrevivalsometimesexperiencescrushingpeopleweepinguncontrollably.Andworse,butthereisnosuchthingasrevivalwithouttearsofconvictionandsorrowrevivalinChina1906wasmarkedbyawhollyunusualconvictionofsin.1921andtherevivalthatbeganintheEastAngliaandfishingportsoflawstarvedinGreatYarmouth,strongfishermenwereliterallythrowntothefloortheconvictionuntiloneeyewitnessreportedthegroundaroundmewaslikeabattlefieldwithsoulscryingtoGodformercy.Boyboyboyconvictionof,doesn'titmakesensethatwhenwerealizeourguiltbeforeGodandthenwerealizethegreatloveheshowstowardsusinJesusdyingtopayforoursins.Doesn'titmakesensethatwewouldbeundone.Doesn'titmakesensethatthatwewouldcomeunglued.I'mjustjustthinkof.Ifyouhavetheirresponsibilityofoursinfortheagesof14to16Isendboldlyandwithoutguilt.I'mashamedofit.IstolemoneyformyownfatherIIshotheroin.Ibrokeintohousesinthedoctor'sofficejustforfunandtoseewhatwecouldget.Iwascrueltomybestfriends.IdeceivedeveryoneIknewhowtodeceiveandIwassofullofprideandIdidwhatIdidwithoutanysenseofguiltwasoffallenlosthumancenter.WhenpeopleinthislittleItalianPentecostalchurchinQueensNewYorkbegantoprayforme.Ididknowwashappening,butIlayinbedatnight.Ifeelmiserable.Usedtobe.Ilayinbed,IgethighondrugsandfollowthesleepIslept.IfIwanttostayup.IstayupandIlayinbedthinking.Irememberdistinctlylookatalltheschools.ThestuffIdidbetrayedbybestfriendstolemoneyforthemisthatGodtoldthiswasonestoryanotheranotherstorytherefiguredoutthattheandandnowthenextnight.I'mlayingtherethinkingtheexactsamethoughtsinsteadofpattingmyselfontheback.I'mon.what'sthematteruglyfoulsinner.What'sthematterwithyou,andthatitnecessarilyusethewordcenterbutIfeltguilty.Ifeltterrible.What'sthematterwithwhatwhenIgetsavedalloftheRevelationoftheloveofGodandthegoodnessofGod,therevelationthatJesusdiedforme,therevelationofhowmuchlovehehadformetocleanmeupwhenIwasinmysinandtogivemeabrand-newlifeandandhereIwasjustgoingoutandplayinginthemudwiththesnowbeautifulwhitenewgarments.I'mgoingbackoutthemudafterherevealedhislovetomethat'sitonthereportandpneumonic.ImeantheconvictioncoupledwiththerevelationoftheloveofGodwasabsolutelytransformingfromanendtotellyouthetruthIdon'tseealotofpreachingthatbringsconvictiononsinners.IseealotofinvitationsthatinvitepeopletohaveabetterlifeinJesusatandtellthemallthewonderfulthingsGodwilldoforthem,whileleavingouttheessentialpartofthestoryareguiltbefore.That'swhyhehangsanddiesonthecross.It'ssuchacitizenexamplelookatourlovingGodisasondiesofthecross,thoughhediestopayforoursins,hediesbecauseofoursins,hediesforoursins,hetakestheweightoftheguiltofoursinsonhisownshoulders,andhediesthatwecanlivewell.TalkaboutamessagethatshouldgiveuscostingtherestofourlivestoJesus.That'sthegospelthat'sthepowerofthegospelandicywaywaywaytoolittlepreachingthatbringsconvictionandwaytoolittleministryofthespiritthatbringsconvictionandrevivalmovementshavebeeninoneforperiodofmonths,oneforperiodofyearshavebeenmarkedbydeepconvictionofsin.Peoplechokingontheirtears,peoplecryingfordaysandwhentheycomethroughtheirchangedtheirchangedandandhencethegreatgreatbulkdon'tgobacktowhotheywere.BecausetheconversionhasbeendeepandrealtalkaboutconvictionofsinrighthereonthelineoffireofTommyinOrlandoFlorida.ThanksforcallingthelineoffiretodayyeshelloTommyareontheirwhatareyourthoughtsaboutconvictionalotlisteningtoyou.Ameneverythingyoujustsaid,it'ssoinspirationalandthetopicthatyou'retalkingaboutaboutconviction.You'reright,itnevergetsbroughtup.It'salwaysaboutyouandJesuscandothisforyouandJesuscandothatforyouthanyourGodhelpustoexamineourselvesandwhenweexamineourselvesandthenyourJesusdiedonthecrossandhegaveustheHolySpirit.TheHolySpiritistoconvictustoteachustohelpustounderstandtheBibleandIthinkthatthesubjectyou'retalkingaboutissoimportant,sopowerful,IwastalkingtothescreenerandIwantedtosaythatIwillreferyoufirsttotalkaboutthewineskin.hasneverchanged.Godisalwaysthesame.Weashumanschangeandwewetrytochangethingstomakethingsbetterforus.ButGodisneverchangedandthisconvictionthatyoufeltlikeitwasn'tyouryourtestimonyaboutthethingsthattheofyourpastandcanceledmypasseslikethatbuttheconvictionthatIfeelaboutsininmylifethatIhavenowthepedimenthaveittomethatevidenceofmysalvation,thattheHolySpiritabletoconvictmeisnotapsychologistsayingnotedon'tspitonthegroundorwhateverbutit'sactuallywhenJesussaysmysheephearmyvoiceandIreallytrulybelievethatitistheHolySpiritconvictedmeofmysinsandAAAdon'tdothisisnotrightyouknow,andintheuseoftheScripture.Sothankyousomuchforbringingupthistopicthatyou'rebringingupbecausealotofpeopleneedtohearthisandyousaideverythingthatIwantedtosaythankyoufortheprogressyou,thankyouforsharingthat,youknow,Tommybringsuponeofthethingthat'simportant.Thereistheroleofconvictionofsinforusasbelievers,notguilt.Theguiltofcondemnation.IfGod'schildren.Wedon'texperiencetheguiltofcondonation,butwedoexperiencetheconvictionoflove.Letmegiveyoutheshortversionofthedifferencebetweenconvictionandcondemnation,butwhenIgetintothisatlengthinmyclassonholiness.Youcanstudywithmeonline.IhaveclassesonholinessJewishrootsandprinciplesofrevivalallonlineyoucanstudyonit'sveryinexpensivegotoaskDr.Brown.organdjustlookintheonlinebookstoreforonlinecoursesovermostlytorchbearersbytheway,getafreeaccesstoofferonlineclasses,butmyprinciplesofholinessclassItalkedaboutthedifferencebetweenconvictionandcondemnation.Condemnationsaysyouareguiltygetawayfrommeawaywithyou.Yourguiltyandcondemnedandlostfatesealeddoingsealedjudge'sgavelcomesdownsentencedtodeath.Yourguiltyawayfromme.Convictionsaysyou'reguiltycomeneartomeyou'reguiltyofsincomeneartome.Iwanttoblessyou.Iwanttohelpyou.Iwanttohealyou.IwilldeliveryouwithTommyjustsaidisimportantasbelieversbeingconvictedofsinshowsusthatwerewalkingcloselywiththeLordthatwelovehimandthathe'sworkinginourlives.It'sillegitimatechildrenwhowerenotdisciplinedbythefather.Thisreallychildrendisciplineanddisciplineoflove,notdestroyusbuttohelpustobringusintoholiness.866-34-TRUTHgotsomefabulousquotesandaccountsaboutconvictioncomebackinthelineoffirewithyourhostDr.MichaelBrownvoiceofmoralculturallenshereagainisDr.MichaelBrownaretalkingaboutactionofsinonthebroadcastdate.Myfirsthourwithpeersindifferentpartsofthecountry.IhadaspiriteddebatewithJerryJohnson,adearbrotherintheLord,theministryofCharlesFinney.YoucanlistentothatlaterbygoingtoawebsiteaskedDr.Brown.org.Clickonthelineoffire,andbyearlyevening.That'salwaysavailablebothhoursforfulllistening.Anythingyoumissinthishour,youcancatchalineaswellnumbertocalltoweighinwithyourthoughtsonconviction.Thisalsojustold-fashionedCaltrainbadgecenterterriblesittingonahellionofbrandburnedBrianfeelguiltyandnownowjusthangyourheaddownallthewayallthedaysofyourlife.Thatisourtalkaboutretirementsomethinglife-givingthattheHolySpiritdoestopiercetothedepthsofourbeingtoexposetheguiltofoursinsothatwecanturnformercyandbesaved.866-34-TRUTHmypremiseissimple.Muchofthesuperficialityinthechurchtodayisduetosuperficialpreaching.Superficialconviction.Therefore,superficialconversion,I'mjustlookingthroughmybookatimeforholyfireinthechapteronconvictionlist.ListentowhatSpurgeonsaidaspiritualexperiencewhichisthoroughlyflavoredwithadeepandbittersenseofsinisofgreatvaluetohimthathathit.Itisterribleandthedrinking.Butitismostwholesomeinthebowelsandthewholeoftheafterlife,possiblymuchoftheflimsypietyofthepresent-dayarisesfromtheeasewithwhichmenattendtopeaceandjoy.TheseevangelisticdayswewouldnotjudgeMartinconvertsthatwecertainlypreferthatformofspiritualexercise,whichleavesthesoulbythewayoftheweepingcrossandmakesitseeitsblacknessbeforeassuringatthescreeneverywhit.Toomanythinklightlyofsin.Spurgeonsaid,andthereforethinklightlyoftheSavior.HewhoisstoodbeforehisGod,convictedandcondemned,andwiththeropearoundhisneckisthemantoweepforjoywhenheispardonedtohatetheevilwhichisbeenforgivenhim,andtolivetothehonoroftheRedeemerbywhosebloodhehasbeencleansedonemorequoteRobertMurrayMcShane.Theseareallfoundinmybook.Timeforaholyfire,preparingthewayherelatestheseaccountsfromthe1839revivalinDundee,Scotland.Ihavealso,insomeinstancesheardindividualscryaloudasiftheyhadbeenpiercedthroughthedark.Thesolemnsceneswerewitnessedunderthepreachingofdifferentministersandsometimesoccurredunderthemosttendergospelinvitations.Ononeoccasion,forinstance,whentheministerwasspeakingtenderlyonthewordsheisaltogetherlovelyalmosteverysentencewasrespondedtobycriesofthebitterestagonyatsuchtimesI'veseenpersonsoovercomewithacouldnotwalkorstandalonesoheretalkabouthowbeautifulandlovelyJesusis.Peopleareconvictedbecausethegototheirsin,weeping,breakingandgettingradicallysaynoyoudon'thavetoweepingbreaktogetradicallysay,butI'lltellyoudeepconvictionpavesthewayforradicallastingconversionDavidinhomeworthOhio.Thanksforcallingthelightafire.Dr.Brownreallyappreciate."IreallybelieveweneeddeepconvictionoftheHolyGhosthavebeenpreachingforover23yearsandIstillcryonaconsistentbasisofGod'smercy,toreachdownandsavemeandcallingtopreachhisgospel,andIthinkthere'sfartoomanyStreetpreachersandministersthatarepreachingthetruemessagebutbecausearenotpreachingitwiththeheartofGodandthecompassionofGod.TheirhardeningtheheartsofthepeopleIcanwalktoWalmarttimeandjustreadytogointhecornerandweepseeingthelossofhumanity,andIthinkweneedtobepreparedbytheHolyGhosttobebroken.Ibelievehottearsnotonlymounthardheartsofthepeoplewepreachto,butalsoaboutourweneedtoletGodshowuswherehe'stakenafirmandwherehe'stakingustoandIthinkI'veseenittimeandtimeagainasIpreachedonthestreet.IwouldgoupandhugahomosexualandIpreachedatOhioStateforsevenoreightyearsandtellthemthetruthofGod'sword,itwouldmarkotherpreachersbutwhenIwouldgoouttopreachyouwithmonthlybecauseheknewthatIlovedhimbecausetheChristinmereachingouttothem.Weneedtopreachthetruth.Godloveconvictionratjudgment,butmercyandloveandcompassion.AtthesametimeandonlyGodcangiveusthegracetodoit.Weneedtorealizeweneedhimmorethanweneedanythingelseinthisworldwillcome.Yeah,David.Whatyoureallyemphasizingit'ssomethingI'veoftensaidwecan'tgive,wedon'thave.Sowhenourheartsarebroken,wecanministerinawaythatbreakstheheartsofothersfromthefromthedepthsofofourpainforlosthumanrace.Theywillfeelthepainofthelossthisandfindsalvation.JesushadDavidkeepitup.ThankyousirforthegreatexampleareShirleyandAtlanta.Thanksforcallingthelineoffire.Dr.Marinoyesyou'reontheair.Surelythankyou.Iwanttosavethemat88.TheministryiscertainlyimportantandIthinkthatthereisastandardizedministrythatyouhappeneverySundayandthatheisthecreakingofthebitofdeath,burialandresurrectionofJesusChrist.Becauseifit'snotaconsistentpreachingthingpeoplelosetheirlight.WhenIgotbornagaininahotelroomdowntightlykindofTimetogetthiswomanoffmybackThingyoucannotgowithme.SoIwentwiththescreenerwinninginonewayIhavebecauseIwasdesperatefor,andIwasalsotellingthefinger.Ilivecontactwhenyou're15yearsWSbecamethefirstworkingrelic15yearsoutandintome.HewasmyeverythingandsoGodisnowleftthemback.Youknoweverythingabouthewants.IfyouwanttobeguestsbutforhimfeltIwasdancedgreat.Ididn'tknowIwasgaspinguntilIheardthewheremydarling,IwasgoingnoblysoIwasdancebutforGodandhejustwheeledmeoutwithhisHolySpiritthatDansurelythat'sthatisthathisconversionthat'sthat'snewbirth,noteveryonewillexperienceatthesameabitlikeyousaywhenyouleftyouwonderingwhoisityouleftbehindtheirgettheoldpersoninthenewpersonandthat'stheworkthattheHolySpiritdoestoprepare,especiallythankyouforthetestimonythat'stheworkthattheHolySpiritdoestobringustotheendofourselves.OnethingthathasreallyhelpedmethroughtheyearsistoreadaccountsoftheHolySpiritmovingyesI'vebeeninsomeamazingmeetingsinceandagainsomelastingformonthsandlastingforyearsinterestwithjobsdoingwithintensityinmyownlifehasbeenradicallyimpactedbytheworkofthespirit,butit'shelpmethroughtheyearstoreadaccountsthatthatthathavestirredmetoreadaccountsthatcallmedeepertoreadaccountstogivemeavisionofwhatGodcandobecausethere'ssomuchmorethanwhatwe'veexperiencedindividually.God'sdonethroughhistorywasdoingaroundtheworldsosotheresourcesthatweputtogetherthisweek.Ithinkwillreallyhelpyoustir,youencourageitandandwe'vereducedthepricequiteradicallytogetthemintoyourhandsasbestaspossiblesopleasetakeamoment.It'smybooktimeforholybeenreadingquotesfromthatfortheconvictionchapterpreparingthewayskewsmefordivinevisitationrevivalanswerbookwhichtellsthedifferencebetweentrueandfalserevivalofmyMP3series.It'stimetorocktheboat.SixhoursonMP3andafreeCDIreligiousleadersofthefireoffer$30postagepaidcallusat1-800-278-99781-800-278-9978it'sthelineoffirewithyourhostactivist,author,internationalspeakerandtheologianDr.MichaelBrownvoiceofmoreculturallensgetintothelineoffirenowbycalling86634throughhereagainisDr.MichaelBrown.WearefocusingonovarianministryoftheHolySpirit,afoundationalministryoftheHolySpiritbytheministryoftheHolySpiritthatweoftendon'thearabouttodayorweoftendon'tseeanaction,namelytheministryofconviction.TheHolySpiritconvictingpeopleoftheirsin.TheHolySpiritshowingusourguiltbeforeandthendrawingustohimforsalvation,notpushingusawaybutdrawingustohimsothatwecanbebornagainbypremise.Verysimply,thisthatthesuperficialityofmuchofourChristiancultureisduetosuperficialconversionsandthattiesinwithsuperficialandornoconviction.InsteadwejustrespondoftentoamessageofhowtohaveabiggerandbetterlifeinJesus.JesuscamesoIcouldbeabiggerandbetterme.It'sallaboutmeandhecamefrommysuccess,sothatmygoalsanddreamscouldberealizedsupposedtocamebecauseoftheguiltofmysininyoursinthatwouldcondemnusforeverfromhissiteandheoffersusmercyandabrand-newlifesothatwecanfulfillhisplanandhispurpose.866-34-TRUTHMichaelBrownthankyouforus866-34-TRUTH784onlineaskDr.Brown.org.Clickonthelineoffireforlotsofresourcesrelevanttotheprogramtoday.OneofthebooksthatwerefeaturingthisweekisthemostimportantbookI'vewrittenonrevivalcallthetimeforholyrepairingthewayfordivinevisitationspartofaresourcepackagethisweek.Letmereadsomequotesfromthis.Thisisactuallyquotingfrommehavereadoffensivequotesofthefirsthalfhourfromsomeotherleadersinthepastwesharesomethingsarerosier.Bytheway,thefirsthourbroadcastingwithtearsindifferentpartsofthecountry.SowhattodothreeEasternstandardTime.IhadawonderfulspiriteddebatewithadearbrotherJerryJohnsononhisnewDVD.Bewareoffalseprophets,thecaseagainstCharlestofinishrightcategoricallydifferentwithhimonhistakeonFinneywillnotagreewithallthefinishtheology.YoucanlistentothatlaterontodaybygoingtoaskDr.Browndouble-clickonthelineoffire.Ithinkit'saprogramyoudon'twanttomiss.Okay,here'ssomeofwhatIwroteintheholyfirebook.Ifanythingindicatestheshallownessofourmodernmessageinthesuperficialityofmanyofourconversions.Itisthispainfullyobviouslackofconvictionpartsofgrownsohardandpreachinghasbecomesosofttoyoungmenmurdertheirparentsandgooutforicecreampedophilesfromorganizationstopromoteadultsexispedophilesformorganizationstorebutpromoteadultsexwithchildren.Abortiondoctorsputalonggruelingdaystogeneratebigbucksbyslaughteringtheunbornlittlekidswatchgorymutilationmoviesandgetboredandallthewhile,inthedeepestmoralcrisisournationiseverknown.Somanyofourpreachersentertainwhocanimaginewhatwillhappenwhenthespiritpuncturesthisarmorofinsensitivityandstepsthroughtheshieldofcallousnesswhocanfathomthedepthofanguish.ManyoftheunstableexperiencewhentheirmodelconsciencesarefinallyrousedbutwillhappenwhentheyfaceGodandtheirsenseofthisworldwillbeanunforgettablescenewitharadicalchangethatwillbebroughtintheirliveswillnotbequicklyforgotten.Eitherallforrevivalconviction,thenIsaythisafterthecountaboutpeoplecomingunderconviction.HearingaboutthebeautyofJesus.BeautifulJesusconvictingpowerthereisintheloveofGodwasarevelationofhisgoodness,andmybadnessthatsetmefreefromshootingdrugsin1971,andI'vebeenfreeindeed.Thereisgraceavailableaboutmeasureevangelistsgoingproclaimlibertytothecaptives,profitsdeclaretheshatteringwordoftheLord.Pastorsgettotheheartofyourpeopleconvictconvertconsoleexpose,exhort,equip,reveal,revive,refresh,don'tdrawbackfromthetruth.Makethesaintsfirmthecentersquirmbuildthefoundationofthemeekandteardownthestrongholdoftheproudcomforttheafflictedandafflictthecomfortableminister.ThemessageofGodinamannerworthyofhisname,preachthegospel,myfriend.Itisanawesomeandglorioustask.OnceagainIhearheaven'scallwantedpropheticvoicesfordeafgenerationwantedsoberwatchmanforblindpeoplewantedpreacherswhoconvicthearingthecallherethecall.Takethemessagethatitbeginswithgettingdeeperinmylife.Yourlife,theconvictionbytheSpiritforlosttimewillbackwithyourcalls.ThelineoffirewithyourhostDr.MichaelBrown,thevoiceofmoreculturalevents.HereagainisDr.MichaelBrownconvictionoftheholies.Theholies.Gettingunderneathitall,underneatheveryexcuseunderneathallofthesuperficialstuffweputoftentiedtothecoreharpingonyoucancomeawayforyoucan'trunfromit.Theonlythingyoucandoisruntothecrossandaskedformercyandrepentancethatcomesoutofthatisextraordinary.86634truth866-34-TRUTH7884onlineaskDr.Brown.org,youknow,aswetalkaboutconvictiontodayhereonthelineoffire.Ihavehadthingsinmylife.ThroughtheyearsprobablyarguethatEEsmaybeaminorthingorjustalittlehabitusofthedoesn'tseemthatseriousandwestartLord.Sorryitended,likehappensalot,shouldknowthatourchartguybemorecareful.SorryLorditanditseemstostaythere.It'salmostlikealittleflyswatofthewaythatitcomesbackthentheyaretherethingswerereallynailsandbrotherarenotexcusingthelittletosaythatsometimesit'slikethatandthenGodnailsyouwithsomethingallyouroverwhelmedandit'slikeanarrowpiercedyourheart.Yourecognizethatyou'vesinnedagainstGod,andyouseethesheerwickednessofyouractions.Otherpeoplemaynotseethemasthatwicked,butyoudoandyouagonizebeforeGod.Therepentancethat'scomeoutofthatthedifferentseasons.ThefewtimesI'vehadadeepdeepworkingofGodthatintense.Mylifehasbroughtpicklerepentsthatlikeburnthethingoutofmylifeformonthsoryearsorforgood.That'sthepowerofthegospel.That'sthefruitoftheconvictingministryoftheholyspiritandit'ssomethingthatisreallylackinginourday,aCharlesinitAtlanta.ThanksforcallingonifIoryouyouaren'tDr.Brownmomlikethatoncrime,avictimofsomethingtoreferencetothechurchinallmattersinarchaeologicalknowledgeaboutasubject.It'slikeaneducationcourseknowledgeaboutthetruth.DonotmemorizeScripture�HundredthingslikethatandandallI'mtryingtosayisouryearthegospelpreachedaverydifferentchurches,alotofthemout.Rememberchurchforlongtime,butthere'snorealabidingsenseofconviction.WhenyouhearthewordyouknowandandIstartedtheBiblestudygroup.GodalsostudiedalotaboutandInotedone.YouknowthedisciplespreachPeterwantedpreacherCorneliustoknowyoupreachthegospelandthenyougotochurch.ThespiritfellontheHolySpiritfellonthosethatwereurineandIknowthattheBiblealsosaysthatyouknowit'snotbythewillofman,youknowthatthatpeoplearesavedbythewillofGod.Soithastobewiththecombinationoftwothings.ThetruthplustheHolySpiritcallingonpeoplewhenthetruthispreached,andiftheypervertthetruthintothegospelofself-serving.That'swhatyou'retalkingaboutbecausethepreacherswanttolooklikechurchesinyouknowthey'rethere.Sospeakerfriendlytoday.Youknowtheymaybeafraidofspendingpeoplewithbutthereisanoffensetothecost,buttheBibleteachesisfuntomakeanendrunaroundthatoffenseofthecrosssotheywon'tgetmorepeopletocomeinonandmakeaprofessionoffaithbasedonknowledgeaboutthesubjectandtheHolySpiritislikeleftoutofitcompletelybecausetheywon'tpreachamessagethattheHolySpiritcanrespondtoandandactuallycommonyouknowandnotdowhathedoeswithpeople.It'snotthere.Truththespiritinherrelationshiptothat.WhatIwanttoaskyouwhereisnothappeningwhenyougotofindamanthatwhenhepreachestheHolyGhostcalledonpeople.Thankfully,GodismovingallovertheworldandpeoplearegettingwonderfullybornagainandsavedandandIdon'tIdon'tknowthemotivationofeveryonepreachingwhytheypreachwhattheydoortheyjusttrytofillpewsitatryandavoidtheoffenseofthecrossororisitmaybetheyhaveadifferentunderstandingorthetheymayseesomethingIdon'tbelackinginotherareasrightIhavestrengthbutbutthismuchIknowCharlesthatit'shappeningveryveryinfrequently.It'sit'shappening.Forthemostparthereandthereasopposedtobeingthenormandandasyou'resayingitititshoulddriveustoourkneesinGod.Whereistheconvictingpowerofyourspirit,andyesitisjoinedtogetherwithpreachingthetruth.WehavearesponsetomakebutmustbejoinedtogetherwithpreachingthetruthwhatwhatI'dsayisifyoudon'tseeithappeninginyourownchurchownfellowship.Theplacesweattend.Justpray.Godanointmybrothernotmysister,notthosewhopreachabouttheminister,fillthemwithyourspiritgripholdoftheminsuchawaythattheirwordscarryweightandpeopleorchangeinstandardsyourministrytotheflockministeringtobelieversthatthatthat'snotthegoalwastoeveryweektobringeveryoneagreedtenseconviction,butinparticulartothelost.Inparticular,tothebacksliddenparticulartothecompromisethatthatmessagemustcomewhenitdoescome,itwillbringchangeandhopefullyCharlesuswouldbesomethinghappeningsofrequentlyalloverAmericathatwewillhavetoaskwhereitisbecausewillbebumpingintoiteverywherebutagainstagreatneed.It'sgreatneedthebodytheyoneofthegreatestindicationsthatweneedafreshmoveofrevivalthatweneedawakeningaKirbyinCharlotte.Thanksforcallingonafireyet�Thankyoufortakingmycallthisprogramtodayissoonpoint.ImeanevenwhenyouarecaringatthebeginningIcouldfeeltheHolySpiritdealingwithmyheartlikeunion.IwasraisedinNewYork,IgotsavedFebruary1993andIremembermypanelontheHolySpiritconvictingmesohard.ItwasaFridaynightandIjustfellonmykneesandwet)youhaveabadIhadamattressonthefloorandweptandendedapricotatUnitedbutwasn'tbornandraisedinthechurchandIjustaskedoutofthe.ifyoucomeintomyheartyouknowhowchangemylifearoundandI'llnowliveinCharlotte,pastorofthenewchurchwejuststartedtoplantachurch,andinJanuaryofthisyear.ThingsaregoinggreatandIjustwanttoletyouknowoneofthethingsI'venoticedforyearsIwasanassistantpastorVirginiaBeachforalongtimebeeninministryforyouforyearsnowandtwothings.OneisIhearalotofpreaching.Iheardalotofpreachingwherethere'ssomuchpreachingongraceandyouknowIwanttosaythiscorrectly.Idon'twantto.Idon'twanttosayitwrong.WecertainlyneedgraceIneedgrace,butI'veheardpastorsinthepastyear.SomuchonthegraceofGodandthereisnobalancethingwilltakegreatgivesyoutheabilitytodowhat'sright.Crazygivesyoutheabilitytoturnfromthinbutit'ssomuchallit'sgreatallifyou'restrugglingwiththisallofyouinthislifestyleGodforgivesyouall.Godlovesyouall.It'llbeokayandthereisnot.Butnotallcreatures,andcertainlynotallpastorsmaybenotevenmostgraduateI'vehearditenoughtowearlikeIsaidthereissuchthatthereissomuchofthisgreatmessagewherewhere'sthebalanceyouknowpeopleJesus.Jesusdidn'tjustlockpeopleintheBible.Imeanononeentity:individualgoingtoknowmoreorlesssomethingworsehappenedtoyou.Sothereneedstobeabalanceandalsoofthelatestrealquickly.IknowthatsomeyearsagoIreadabookbyourjobherewascaughtdrawingnearoneofthethingsinthebookthatreallychangemylifeandandandallowingtheHolySpirittheministryoftheHolySpirittodealwithmeattheconvictmewashereadascriptureinProverbs.Icanrememberexactlywhereit'sat.Butifthatisthesatisfiedsoulloathesthehoneycomb,hebrokedowninScriptureabouthowthatinearliertimesintheinthebeliever'slifewherewomenweresosatisfiedwithsomanyotherthings.Infantsmayfillourliveswithsomanyotherthings,theInternet,theTVthatpeopleworkwhateverthatwedon'tgivetheHolySpiritwon'tconvicthimwhenIreadthatbookIwasbackonthe21dayfastandSirwhenImeanitwaslikeitwashim.Itwasanewanewlife,newlifeintomyheart.TheHolySpiritIwasseeingthingsthewaythatIwastreatingmywife,mykidslikeIhadn'tseeninalongtimeandIwassobrokenandandIthinkoneofthedirectresultisbecauseIdidturnoffthetelevision.IdidjustyouknowI'mnottalkingdroppingalegalisticbutunderstand,giventheHolySpirithome.SometimesweneedtojusttunethingsoutsothatoursoulissosatisfiedandwhentheHolySpiritdoesyounoministertolookforconvictiswilllookhere.ThankyouforyourshowminutesisbeensuchablessingandwerestandingwithEucerinandandandeverythingisgoingtoKirbytotellyouwhat'sintolocalinCharlotte.TheresourcepackagethatwereweremakingavailabletousbecauseIjustwanttosendthistosointoyourministryworkthere.Thenletusknowwhereyouare,sowecanworktogetherforthecityhere,butthestayonhold.GivefolkshercontactinfoandIwanttomailthisoutbookingCDandsomeotherthingstoyou.Keepholdingthebannerhigh.Mybrother,thankyouallright,stayonholdorwrite.Iwillbebackwithyourcalls.LukeNelsonMarisehangonandtogettoasmanyasIcaninmybook.It'stimetorocktheboatwegotasixCD,excuseme,asixhourclassonCDrightteachinatheme.It'stimetorocktheboatpartoftheresourcepackagethisweekisachapter:theHolySpiritcomesIknowwhenPeterfilledwiththespiritseparatedtoGodpreachedhismessageofrepentanceandjudgment.Thepeoplecriedoutbrothers,whatshallwedoX23780.RobertsonexplainsthattherareGreekverbusedinacts237forcuttotheheartneedstopiercedistinguishsharplytostunthismightjustasahorsewoulddentandscrapethegroundwithitshooves.Thesermonwenthome.TheyfeltthestingofPeter'swordscompunctionallneededfriends.IlookwhenyoureallyloveJesusshutofftheoutsidethingstospendtimeonesothatit'sthelineoffirewithyourhostDr.MichaelBrown,thelineoffirenowbycalling866-34-TRUTHhereagainisDr.MichaelBrownpuzzlechangeversusthischeckintensesensitivenessoftheHolySpiritinyouwhenheiseducatingyoudowntothescrupleandneverdiscardaconviction.ItisimportantenoughfortheHolySpirittohavebroughtyourmind.ThatisthethingheisdetectingAndrewFullersaidofthecauseberemoved.Theeffectswillcease.Ifthespringbepurified.Thewaterswillbehealedinthebarrengroundbecomeproductive.That'swhathappens.TheHolySpiritdoesadeepworkinourlivesagain.IhavesaidmypremiseforthishourforthisbroadcastformuchofwhatIpreachedandtaughtfordecadesisthatmuchofthesuperficialityofthechurchtodayisduetosuperficialconversionswhichareduetosuperficialpreaching.Superficialworkofconvictionoftenlittleornoconviction.I'mnotsayingthatpeoplearen'tsaved.I'maskingthequestionhowsaved,howdeepisthesalvationandinmanycasesourpeopleevensaythatallifthere'snoevidenceofachangeinlife.866-34-TRUTHaLukeinthemind.IowaDesMoinesIowasaidaboutthat.Thanksforholdingwelcometothelineoffire.Dr.Brownappreciatetopic.Here.Today.PointfirstinRomanschapter8ScriptureisclearthattheworkoftheHolySpiritistoloseincourtmyheadrightnowwouldtellthathethatwhentheHolySpiritbearsofourspiritthatwiththatwearethechildrenofGod,thattheworkofGodinwoundingourconsciencehasapurposeandwouldbringustoasenseofhelplessnesshasapurposeandthatpurposethatwhenhehaswoundedareconsciencethroughtherightdegreethathewillthencomeandhewillbringcomfortandIthinkwhathappenedis,especiallyasAmericanswhoareuncomfortablewatchingotherpeopleinpain.WewanttocommonshortcutthatprofitsthatweretobringtoalleviatethatandwhatwedoisweendupshortcuttingtheworkoftheHolySpiritandpeopleareprematurelyencouragedencouragementandtheloveoftheirfellowbrothersandsistersinChristtocomealongsidethembuttherealsohastobethattimeandplacetoallowthatconvictiontodevelopfullyorwecomeinandinthesecondthingisIthinkwhathashappenedinthechurchisgoodthinghavebeenusedfishtoshortcutthearm,SouthernBaptistpastorandwereknownforaltarcallsinthesinnersprayerandunfortunatelythosegoodthingusedasthemeanstoshortcutconviction.YetIcannotwriteifIcanjustgetsomeonetowalkdowntheaisleinacertainwayincertaintime,thenbasicallyit'sit'sdoneandIIIhavenoissuewithaltarcallsomeCindyCindystartedthemandtheyblamehim.IthinktheygobeforeFreddie,butIlookatactstwoiskindofanaltarcall,repent,andbeimmersedinawrittenresponseJesusandfollowmeandandyetiftheheartisnotpreparedproperly.Wecangivesomeonetheimpressioncomeforward.Praythislittleprayerandthenwemaketheterriblemistakeoftellingthemit'sdone,youknowhowtheyprayed.TheythenIwouldseriousmedicallookattheirwatchwonderingwhendoIgetouthere.Wetellnowyou'resafenow,youhaveeternallifeandthematterwhathappensyouknowyouryessoit'sIagreewithyouLuca.Whatwouldhappen.TheprofitswerealotI'mdullmyfellowbrothersthroughgovernmentconventionalwomanwhenitcomesforanyonetosaytheypraytheprayerthatI'mdownhavingPhilipBullockHartman.Immediatelyafterthatthepastorgetsupandsaidwegotanewfellowbelieverrightandeveryonesayhallelujahbecauseanotherinthekingdom.Butthere'sbeennotimetoallowthatpersonandthentheLordtodealwithyouevenbewillingtogetbaptizedrightthenandthere.Youknowandthenandthentheotheristhefruitofthechangelifeandthenofcoursemeanttoputthestatsupnextweek.Wehad14peoplesay,butthenyoucometotheservicenextweek,andit'sthesamenumberhitalookatthisandI'mshortontime,butI'mwithyouman.WearepreachingtooneanotherSquireshere.MaytheLordhelpustogodeeperbringothersdeeperamenandamenNelsonandConcordewerelittleshortontimesopleasediverightinBrownverywellthankyouNelsongood"or"pleaseconvictionthatwedon'tproclaimingrightandthatthe"thesymbolofthatthemaninRomantimeswiththecourtandstarteddowntheroadhadalreadyfiguredbythreeFrenchhewasnotcomingbacktoisnotgoingtohaveitendedthecourtgoingtohaveitended,thecourtmaynocompromiseofcoolandheartandonehadfinishedthework.Themanwithnomore.Ithinkthatalotofbelievewedon'thaverealconvictionwithtryingtoimprovepeople'slifethatherealizedthatthe.onlytopreachthegospelwithpeople