Is the Biden Vaccine Mandate Constitutionally Legal?

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Welcome, welcome friends to the Line of Fire. This is Michael Brown and we have a very important broadcast today. We welcome your calls. I'm going to be talking with a top Christian attorney to get wisdom on the question, are the vaccine mandates legal?

Are they constitutionally legal? Did President Biden have the right to make this decision and how should we respond? Later in the week, I'm going to have on a very strong committed follower of Jesus, a strong Bible believer who is pro-vaccine.

He's a PhD in chemistry. He'll explain why he agrees with the vaccines, although he differs with the government mandate. We'll be speaking with him about the vaccines themselves, God willing, on Wednesday. Today we're going to focus on the question of the mandate, the legality of the mandate.

If you have any questions on the legal issues, any questions on what happens to you as an individual and you are told you must be vaccinated, here's the number to call 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. Before I get into any of that and even play some clips from President Biden in the recent past and now in the present, before we do that, I've got a big announcement, an exciting announcement. I have been really looking forward to this day. I am charged and excited about this announcement. Okay, we have been on daily live talk radio more than 13 years now, more than 13 years, and we broadcast in different stations all over America. We have never once had a sponsor, a company, an organization that we worked with on a regular basis and that we promoted what they do and who they are and their product and they in turn poured into our ministry.

We've never had that until today. Friends, go to vitaminmission.com, vitaminmission.com. My personal physician and a good friend, Dr. Mark Stengler, has been called Doctor of the Decade. Yeah, I was amazed when he was called Doctor of the Year.

Doctor of the Decade, known as America's doctor, may have seen him on TV, on a show, his radio broadcast, maybe you get his daily health newsletter. He is a leading naturopathic doctor. When I was in his office in California a couple years back, I was looking on a shelf and I saw this big book and it was an encyclopedia of natural remedies, natural cures, one of the famous books that he's written, and it was translated into Hebrew.

It's been translated into many languages. So, I took out the Hebrew and was just looking at the introduction to it from some famous doctor in Israel and the doctor called it the Bible of natural remedies. Well, Dr. Stengler's health supplements are as fine as you can buy. The way they're produced, the ingredients, everything about them, the highest health qualities you can ask for. So, Dr. Stengler and I were talking not that long ago and came up with this idea that we would let you know about these health supplements. And if we're just taking a look, scrolling around, I mean, it's everything from immune wellness supplements, to zinc supplements, to energy supplements, to every type of vitamin, to you name it, they've got it. And as a friend of our ministry, when you use the Dr. Brown code and it's all there at vitaminmission.com, you get a 10% discount on all orders. And that's for life.

If you subscribe to something and get it month in, month out, that is for life. 10% off every order and then Dr. Stengler in turn will take 10% of the profits and donate them back to our ministry. So, what I really love about this is I get a call the other day, out of the blue, it's Dr. Stengler, he's witnessing to a Muslim. Why is he witnessing to Muslim? Because every Friday, he goes out to a park in California to share the gospel. He's got a table, he sets up with these charts, science issues, apologetic issues, Islam, the Bible, different things, Isaiah 53. So, instead of being in his practice on that day, he's out doing outreach. That's the kind of guy that he is.

And he called, just wanted me to talk to this Muslim briefly and set him right on a Hebrew question. So, check this out. Like I said, I have been waiting for this day and I've been taking Dr. Stengler's supplements for years.

Now, please understand this. This is a supplement to my healthy eating, my healthy lifestyle. Nancy was just watching a video by Dr. Joel Fuhrman and we follow his eating guidelines, his nutritarian eating guidelines. And he was saying that eating a healthy, nutritarian diet and being at your ideal weight is a thousand times more effective than any vaccine. And those who are at their proper weight and eating a proper diet don't have to fear COVID. He wasn't saying get vaccinated or not. He was just talking about the best things you can do. So, what I've done in my own life is join together super healthy eating by God's grace, exercise. But I was exercising when I was fat and when I was eating unhealthily too.

But kept exercise and the super healthy eating and then the supplements on top of it. Now, tomorrow I'm going to see a hand doctor to get x-rays to check a comparison from three years ago. I had noticed and Nancy noticed my fingers over a period of time started to get really kind of raunchy looking and started twisting some and getting arthritic. It's like, what? I just felt, no, it's not the right time for this. This is not supposed to be happening right now. Not that I'll never get sick or never have an issue.

It just didn't feel right. So, I talked to Dr. Stangler about potential supplements or things that could be taken. He said first just get checked to see if it's actually arthritis. There was one other thing I had to get checked in my hands.

So, God checked the whole bit, got x-rayed. And then the doctor gave me some medicine to put on the worst of the fingers or all of them at night and then cover them up and it would help. And that actually dealt with some of the inflammation initially. But I said, I'm only putting medicine on each finger for years. So, I started taking these joint supplements on a daily basis and I've been taking them now for a few years.

And I mean, the results have been dramatic, really. I mean, everything, if it was a 10, it's going down to one in terms of inflammation and issues. So, anyway, I cannot give you health recommendations as a medical doctor. I can just tell you these are some of the finest health supplements you can get. And so, that's what excites me the most to tell you about these because you could really benefit from them. And then secondly, to tell you that we've arranged for a special discount for you. And then thirdly, to tell you that it goes right back into our ministry work. So, there you go, vitaminmission.com. Tell everybody.

Tell everybody you know. Now, you don't get a commission for it, but spread the word. It's a good way to spread health.

It's a good way to supplement other things you're doing in your life or to make up for certain lacks or weaknesses or problems that are there. And then know with every order that you're also blessing our ministry. Isn't that cool? So, you can see why I've been looking forward to that.

And we'll share things time to time and then have Dr. Stengler on and talk about a lot of the things and talk about a lot of health issues and which supplements are for which, etc. Okay. Before we get to attorney Joe and Franco, before we get to your calls, let us listen to President Biden announcing last week the mandate. Let's listen to his announcement.

This is not about freedom or personal choice. I'm announcing that the Department of Labor is developing an emergency rule to require all employers with 100 or more employees that together employ over 80 million workers to ensure their workforces are fully vaccinated or show a negative test at least once a week. Alright, so there are many questions about the vaccine. I have a Twitter poll going right now.

In fact, let me just call it up and look at this. I have a Twitter poll going right now. And again, this is not to determine truth. I'm asking what you think. That's why I do a poll.

What do you think? What's your view? But I said if you've not yet been vaccinated against COVID, what's the single biggest thing that is stopping you? Is it concerns about the long-term safety of the vaccines? Or are you resisting government overreach?

Or do you not feel the need for vaccine because of your overall health? So 17% said, I don't think it's safe. 13.5% said government overreach. 19.5% said I don't think I need it. And then 50% said all of the above equally.

So factor that in to those other answers. So there are many questions about the vaccine. We'll talk about the vaccine itself or the vaccines themselves on Wednesday with Dr. Jonathan Sarfati, Young Earth creationist, PhD in chemistry against the mandates but pro-vaccine. So we'll talk vaccine questions. And if you have issues, if you have concerns about the vaccine itself or it's not really vaccine or long-term health issues or other things, then Wednesday is the day to call.

And he is welcoming your questions. So if you've done research or if you have serious concerns, that's the day to call. And today is the day to call in on legal issues or mandates or what an employer says you have to do. But one of the biggest issues that people are having beyond the vaccines, because remember, they started under President Trump and he hailed this as one of the great things this administration did.

And even at a big rally recently in Alabama, he said, hey, I've been vaccinated myself. I encourage you to. You've got some booze over and he goes, hey, it's your personal choice. You have your freedoms. Got to keep your freedoms. But hey, I got the vaccine. I think you should.

But and he gets you got some booze over that. But the issue is not the vaccine itself. The issue is the mandate.

Just just listen to this little clip with a few different quotes. President Biden, press secretary, Jen Psaki and others. No, I don't think it should be mandatory. I wouldn't demand to be mandatory. There will be no nationwide mandate. I was referring to mandates by private institutions and portions of the federal government.

There will be no federal mandate, one that's not the role of the federal government. I don't think you'll ever see a mandating of vaccine, particularly for the general public. But you would never mandate.

At least I do not think you would. I'd be pretty surprised if you mandated it for any element of the general. Yeah, so pretty surprised if you mandated it for any element of the general public, Dr. Anthony Fauci. So many are saying, wait, wait, President Biden, you said it would not be mandated. And this was emphasized by those in your administration. This is not the role of the federal government. On the other hand, what if what if Ebola was ravaging the nation and people were dropping and dying like flies? Does the government have the right to mandate a vaccine? And it was certain.

There was 100 percent certainty that this vaccine is as safe as any that we have and it's been tested for decades, et cetera. Could the government mandate that? Does it have that role? Is it constitutional?

So rather than weigh in with my extremely limited legal knowledge, we're going to talk with someone who is really well versed in Constitution and related legal issues. Joe and Franco will do that. We come back and we'll take your calls. Eight, six, six, three, four. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

All right. I want you all to say out loud with me, legal. Legal, not medical. That's our focus today. Wednesday, our focus will be medical, not legal.

Today, legal, not medical. I reached out to my old friend going back to the 1980s on Long Island, Joe and Franco. We have been colleagues all these decades. For years, he was the lead attorney with the Alliance Defending Freedom and we'd bring him on with key social legal issues taking place. I remember when he gave a talk at our congregation years back, years back, and talked about a major court case that was going to come to the Supreme Court and it was going to decide whether marriage would be redefined and it was going to be a 5-4 vote and Justice Kennedy would be the deciding one.

Which way would he go? This was years before it happened, years before Obergefell changed so many things. Joe and Franco has been in the know and I asked him to join us today to talk about the government mandate. Hey, Joe, thanks for taking time out of your schedule to join us today. Hey, thanks.

My pleasure to be with you as always. All right. So broadly speaking, Joe, how do we evaluate whether the president has the constitutional slash legal authority to make a decision like this?

So I'll give a spoiler alert up front. I think he does not and there's naturally a split of opinion, but sometimes the split of opinion is on whether he has the authority or whether he has the authority through that means. But I think we have to understand there's three parts to his order and the answer may not be the same for all the parts. Essentially, I mean, firstly, he requires all federal employees to be vaccinated. That's where he has his greatest authority, speaking to federal employees. The part that's getting the most attention is where he reaches out into private employers of 100 or more and regardless of their connection with the federal government, he just requires that they either be vaccinated or undergo weekly COVID tests.

That's the part that's the most in jeopardy where he has least authority. And then lastly, and this part's not been discussed much, but this is significant, it requires any entity that receives payments for Medicare or Medicaid. So in other words, federal funding is flowing somehow. There's a kind of a condition put on this now, like, hey, if you want the federal dollars, you have to require your health care workers to be vaccinated as well. And that's most likely unconstitutional as well. All right, so let's break these down then.

And let me first back up and ask this. Is there a scenario where you can envision the government having the authority, especially in that second category, just for the general public and companies of certain sizes? Is there any scenario where there are some kind of plague is going through the nation? There is a proven antidote to it, a proven vaccine, something like that, where the government could order something, order quarantine, order vaccination, or is the principle the same regardless of the threat?

Under extraordinary conditions, there's some authority that it can happen. There was a case called Jacobson in the Supreme Court that goes way back, you know, it goes back to like 1907, 1905. And Jacobson, the state of Massachusetts ordered vaccinations in the middle of a smallpox epidemic. And that was upheld by the Supreme Court. But now again, that was the state ordering the vaccination. And the state had painted a really dire picture.

And the consequences of smallpox were very severe and all that. I'll just say that that's the case that keeps getting thrown out and put before the court like, see, you've upheld this. There's a couple responses to that. Number one, that was a state which has state police power. The states ultimately have that kind of police power. The federal government actually does not have powers unless they're specifically given in the Constitution. The federal government actually has a limited set of powers.

So states can do more in that way. But even that decision and the line of cases that accompanied it is very much in question now, because that kind of thinking got abused. Probably the height of the abuse is a case. This is a sort of an infamous case. And lawyers know it well. In 1927, there was a case called Buck v. Bell, where Oliver Wendell Holmes, the Supreme Court justice, upheld, essentially forced sterilization of mental incompetence. I'm using the language that they used back then in the case. So it's something like it's better for the world instead of, you know, waiting to execute degenerates, you know, to watch their imbecility, it's better to just take care of the snail and sterilize incompetence so that they cannot, you know, produce more children. So that was kind of the height of that line of reasoning, that the state can compel you to get those treatments. I would say since then, there's been a rebound in the opposite direction. And the Supreme Court has consistently been moving away from that, saying, no, that you states do not have the power to compel people to do certain things with their bodies.

And if you think of it, it doesn't take a lot of analysis to kind of see this coming. It reaches its apex in Roe v. Wade, where the Supreme Court, you know, decides that the state does not have the power to limit what you what a woman does with her body and the choice of having an abortion. So anything the case authority has repudiated, that kind of Oliver Wendell Holmes sort of thinking is just now looked at with great disdain.

And Joe, what's the main line of argumentation that's being brought by the 20-something states that are contesting this already? Right. So and bear in mind, it's not an official contest until OSHA actually passes a regulation. So let me just say this. Right now, what we have is a Biden executive order.

There's not really details to it. What he did is he ordered OSHA, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, to enact rules, which they're allowed to do. And this is going to be one big source of litigation. What is OSHA allowed to do? Is OSHA ever ordered vaccinations?

The answer is no, never. It's highly unlikely they have that authority. If something like that, if there was authority for that, it would have to come from, say, Congress. But this is OSHA's authority. I have their rule right in front of me. They can make a rule if, here's the quote, if workers are in grave danger due to exposure to toxic substances, or agents determined to be toxic, or physically harmful to new hazards. That's the rule.

So typically, they'll work with toxins in the worksite, you know, chemicals that are poisonous or something like that. To get from that rule to compel vaccination is more than a stretch. The experts, the legal commentators who are saying, oh, that's sufficient, tend to be hardcore partisans who have to espouse the party line. If you look at the more independent commentators, even people on the left who are more fair-minded, like Alan Dershowitz, former professor at Harvard Law School, they say, no, there's not the authority in these kind of rules to do that. So I think OSHA's authority will be struck down when they conceive of such a rule. And by the way, there may be other details in the rule that are kind of dicey, like, well, if the alternative is you get tested every week, who pays for that? How do you administer that?

Well, you know, what's that look like? They would have to flesh that out as well and come up with some specifics. And by the way, the penalties are very severe. And they get increasingly severe. So, you know, you can be fined up to nearly $14,000 per violation. And there's an accretion of the penalties kind of as you go along, you're a scofflaw and you don't comply. So that's the main litigation point. One, OSHA doesn't have the authority to do that. Number two, they're going to say, even the president does not have the authority to do that. Number three, they'll argue the federal courts, pardon me, the federal government does not have the authority to do that. And even if they do and the off chance we're wrong and you think the federal government does, then it's got to be done by Congress.

It cannot be done by executive order. So those would be kind of the crux of the arguments with some other technical ones tucked in and I'm not addressing it. All right. So in a minute and a half or less, if you can, how just on the ground for your average person, how does this play out? You just, if you have issues with it and you feel this is overreach from the government, is it safe to say, okay, this is going to be played out in the courts over a period of time. There's no immediate concern I should have, or is there an immediate concern? Yeah, you know, it's probably going to be played out pretty quickly. OSHA will take three to four weeks, it's thought, to get the regulation. Then once it's enforced, there may be a period before it's active. But once the regulation is passed, the lawsuits begin. And probably this will be expedited, would not surprise me if this gets to the Supreme Court within four to six weeks from the time the first lawsuit is filed, and kind of injunctions being rushed up on an accelerated basis.

The average person, I hate to put it this way, it depends. Depends who you work for. Remember, if you work for a private employer, United Airlines, and they compel you to do this, even before there's a regulation, you've got kind of limited rights.

This is more like a stick and a carrot kind of strategy for the administration. They're trying to use the stick now to beat employers who are not doing that. Because if employees, more than 100 employees, probably covers two thirds of the American workforce. So if you're in one of those companies now, and they're not compelling you to do it, don't worry. If your company's not inclined that way, don't worry. I think this is likely to me to be struck down or there'll be action on it before it actually hits your company.

But even if that happens, the Biden administration has acknowledged that there has to be room for religious exemptions and health exemptions. So there may be recourse for people here. All right. We're going to jump back in, find out what recourse there might be, and we're going to take your calls for attorney Joe and Franco. Stay right here. It's The Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks for joining us today on The Line of Fire as we talk about the legality of the vaccine mandate, the COVID vaccine mandate by President Joe Biden. My guest, Joe and Franco, long time attorney until recently with the Alliance Defending Freedom, now helping so many other ministries, organizations with key legal questions, friends back since 1983. Joe, I want to grab some calls, 866-344-TRUTH for those who want to get through. But right before we do that, briefly, can you share what recourse someone might have, even if their own company, aside from the government, says you must get vaccinated to work here?

Sure. So it depends whether you work for government or a private employer. If you have government action in some form, that could involve constitutional protection. It might even be somebody's state constitution. A number of states, for example, have what are called religious freedom restoration acts. About two-thirds of the states, roughly, have either extra protection in their law of constitutions or something like that.

And if you've got that, it's going to protect religious protections from government action. But most people, that's not the case. Most people work for a private employer. If that happens, it's going to be a more routine. I say routine for lawyers. It's not routine for the person and the situation, obviously. But the more routine process of going to your employer and saying, hey, I'd like a religious exemption from this thing that you're requiring. This happens in a lot of cases. People who are told, you know, you have to work on your Sabbath. They ask for a religious exemption. And the employment laws in just about every state typically say something like, the employer must give a reasonable accommodation. So then it becomes a standard of, okay, what are you asking for? What does it require me to do?

Are there alternatives? So there's a lot of kind of weighing and sifting that happens. But what people could do is, one, look to see if you believe you should have a religious exemption. And number two, look to see if you have a health exemption. Some people don't do well with vaccinations. You would want a note from your doctor.

You've had adverse reactions. And for people who are in those situations, you've got to check state by state. You can either contact an attorney in your state or, you know, contact my former place of employment, Alliance Defending Freedom. We have a large network of allied attorneys.

We tend to make referrals on these to try to get you pro bono assistance for things like religious exemptions. So there are options. You're not without options. Got it. All right, let's go to some calls. David in Dallas, you're on with Joe and Franco and yours truly. Go ahead, please. David, are you there? Yeah, go ahead.

Thanks, Dr. Brown. Yeah, can you hear me? Yep. Okay.

So I guess that's good news on the census. There might be some options for me. I work for a large employer.

I'm remote, so I work from my home. And, you know, I saw that they fast tracked it. And even they have rules for efficacy, you know, had to be above 70%. And but, you know, as far as safety and effectiveness, I think it's proven to be neither. That you take a risk short term, they got no clue long term what the risks are. And many people don't have much of an adverse reaction.

But I know a few people personally that did. Yes. So David, just just just for Yeah, I'm sorry, just for time's sake, though, did you have a specific question that we could help you with? We'd love to do that. So I guess I guess if I get faced with you either have to take the vaccine, or you have to quit, or you have to get testing, you're saying there's another option to to request some kind of an exemption?

Is that what I heard? Well, David, good to speak with you. Let me put it this way. You're in Texas, which is a very friendly state for religious protections, by the way. What it comes down to is this if your employer mandates to get the vaccination with no other choices, then you can ask for a religious exemption if it violates your faith.

This is a tricky question. It has to legitimately be an active faith for you. And not just something like gee, I don't trust the science. If you're asked you have a religiously informed objection to get a religious exemption, you have to say yes. And there are reasons for that.

There were aborted baby cells used in the process to develop some of the vaccines and all these various things I won't go into. But if you have a religious objection, you can say to your employer, hey, I'd like to take advantage of that. The employer will sometimes offer you options, okay, instead of the vaccination, get a COVID test once a week. Well, that might be an okay compromise for you. It depends. And some of it's going to depend too on what you do and how many people there are.

The courts engage in balancing tests. If you are a surgeon, and you're working in a hospital with thousands of employees, you're going to have a tougher time making the case. If you're working remotely from home, and that's most of your work, the employer is going to have a tougher time saying you should not be given a religious accommodation because you're really not even a position where you're infecting other people. So it's a kind of a fact sensitive inquiry, I would say you would have a pretty good chance of getting a religious exemption. If you have that belief, you can familiarize yourself with some of the religious reasons against this. You know, look, if you look on ADF's website again, there are some resources on that for people, sample letters, talking about types of religious exemption. But you would need something more than simply a, I don't feel like taking it because I don't want it, I don't trust it.

Right. Yeah, I'm a follower of Jesus, and I just don't trust this stuff, right? That wouldn't qualify as religious exemption.

So friends, please go to the ADF Alliance Defending Freedom website, and you can look there for examples of legitimate religious exemptions and see if in fact you fall in those categories. Let's go to Sean. Sean is gone. Let's go to David in Mathews, North Carolina. Welcome to the Line of Fire.

Thank you, how you doing? Fine, thanks. Look, we're playing by their rule. They created, Fauci created this virus. There's no conspiracy theory on that. He created it.

He's still in charge. You're talking about playing nice in the sandbox and following their rules. Well, you may have an opportunity to get out of the vaccine because of this or that. We can just say no. Rosa Parks, there was the laws that said she had to sit in the back of the bus. She just said no, because the law- David, I get where you're going.

For the sake of time, let me just cut in here. I know this week was dedicated to legal questions and issues. You're getting more into some of the questions I think that'll come up next week, and then you raise another interesting question, which is, is there a time that Christians could engage in civil disobedience? And then you get into the sort of the tricky question of balancing the sort of Romans 13, the obedience to civil government versus the times that the government is intruding on your ability to practice your faith, the times you find in scripture where civil disobedience is permitted.

But is there a specific legal question that you have? Joe, just because of his initial statement, the flat out statement that Dr. Fauci created the virus, which even if it was man-made in a lab in Wuhan to say Dr. Fauci created it is a sufficient overstatement that I don't want to give more air time to that. I agree. I agree.

Yeah, so just ask this though, Joe. In the matter of civil disobedience, okay, it's the same with a religious exemption. You would have, like Peter is saying in Acts, we must obey God rather than man. In other words, this would stop me from obeying God. So you mentioned the issue of, say, a boarded treatise is used in the development of at least one or more of the vaccines, certainly not all of them, but that issue. What about the idea that my body is the temple of the Holy Spirit and I have concerns that I'm putting something unhealthy into that temple? Would that qualify as a religious exemption potentially?

Potentially. That's the most common argument I hear used after the, you know, after the fetal cells. If you make that argument, here's where it gets tricky.

Some lawyers say all you have to do is make it and that's fine. Others say, and I'm probably more in this camp, others say you're going to open yourself up to an interesting line of questions, including things like, well, did you ever get a flu vaccination as a Christian? Or did you eat Oreo cookies? Yeah.

Or, you know, do you drink alcohol? So then you're going to have to have some kind of consistent framework in order to justify that. Now, I think it is possible. I think you could say, yes, I've had other vaccinations. I won't have vaccinations if any way, you know, were contributed to by the abortion industry. I think you could come up with an okay argument, you know, that at least presents a cognizable legal issue. But I think, you know, again, the limits of civil disobedience, I mean, you look at Peter and John, the example you cited for the Sanhedrin, you look at, you know, the Israeli midwives or the Israelite midwives who would not kill the newborn children, you know, or the three Hebrew children refusing to bow down to Nebuchadnezzar's image. I mean, these are more direct worship in a way or take life or something like that.

How much those get you to the examples we hear more commonly with the vaccine? It's a debatable question, but I'm not foreclosing there could be an argument there. All right. Listen, I know you've got to run in a minute your view on if this gets to the Supreme Court, which seems very likely.

Just got a minute. How do you think it would be decided? I think they strike it down. I think that potentially they uphold the federal employees because they have that. But this Supreme Court has strung a very strong tendency to not allow the president, the executive branch, to take a shortcut.

We saw that recently, if you remember, with the eviction moratorium. Biden issued that executive order and the Supreme Court struck it down. You cannot take executive orders of a shortcut for legislative policies that require study, that require, you know, acts of Congress. I think the Supreme Court strikes this down easily with Amy Coney Barrett replacing, you know, now replacing Justice Ginsburg. I think easily they say, no, this is something if it's going to come on the federal level, and we're not even saying it's allowed there, but if it does, it's got to be from Congress.

President Biden, you cannot take shortcuts. It implicates some other arguments, too. It may force people to give up constitutional rights, you know, if they receive Medicare or Medicaid payments. They've got a cluster of issues.

I put the odds of it being struck down by the Supreme Court at 90%. All right, as a sober-minded attorney who hedges his bets, that's saying a lot. Hey, Joe, thanks so much for helping us out. And God bless you for helping so many ministries today. I appreciate it.

God bless you. We'll be right back. I'm going to take some more calls and we'll do our best to sort through the issues together. It's The Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into The Line of Fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

Thanks, friends, for joining us. Again, the Wednesday broadcast, we plan to have on Dr. Jonathan Sarfati. He is a Young Earth creationist, so absolutely believes in authority of scripture. You may have different conclusions about the age of the earth than he does, but he's absolutely Bible-based.

He's brilliant, was the chess champion of New Zealand years ago, PhD in chemistry. He's pro-vaccine, but against the mandates. He's going to be on to present why he believes the vaccines are safe, but to take your questions. So this is going to be a great day to call. And if you have real issues, even if it's just not for yourself, you want to air it for others, this is going to be a great time. He's going to welcome your calls and questions on Wednesday.

I'm going to go back to the phones and do my best with my limited legal knowledge to talk through some of these issues with you. But I asked Joe and Franco to come on because of his expertise. Before doing that, before doing that, if you missed the announcement at the beginning of the broadcast, for the first time after 13 years of daily live talk radio, we are now working with a sponsor. And what I've been so psyched about is I love encouraging people to be healthy. I love encouraging people to take steps as I have to change their lives. Now, first and foremost, it comes down to diet, diet lifestyle. But there are healthy supplements that you can take that can really, really make a difference or help you on that journey, starting where you are to get healthier or to combat certain things as you're on your way. So right on our homepage, AskDrBrown.org, S-K-D-O Brown.org, you'll see the announcement about our partnership with Dr. Mark Stengler.

I've been taking his health supplements for years. Every year, he does my blood test for me. And it's so comprehensive, they draw between 11 and 14 vials of blood. Then I get a report.

It could be 35 pages long of every last detail and what this is, this and this and this and this. So first, he can attest to the extraordinary benefits of healthy eating that you can see in my blood test, amazingly. So I mean, there are categories I'm in where it would be like a healthy guy in his 20s.

I mean, it's amazing to see some of this. But then we'll see, okay, a little shortfall here, or if you're in a vegan diet or a familiar vegan diet, you supplement with this or that. So we've added in these supplements. And I've seen the benefit because I've taken them for years.

I've literally seen the benefit in my own life. You can also write out vitaminmission.com. Don't search for vitaminmission. Type out vitaminmission.com and go straight to the site there. Or again, the banner on the homepage at askdr.brown.org. And check out everything that's there. Just scroll through, shop, look at all the different supplements there.

See what you're interested in. 10% discount, as long as you order their subscriptions for the life of the subscription. 10% off for you using the special Dr. Brown code. So that's Dr. Stengler's way of saying, hey, I want to bless your listeners and supporters and viewers. And Dr. Stengler, in turn, will take 10% of the profits and donate that back to our ministry.

So that's why I'm excited because I totally can recommend this. And this is all part of healthy living and encouraging you to be healthy. And to quote Dr. Joel Fuhrman, Nancy was just watching one of his talks. And he's not saying you should get vaccinated or not get vaccinated. But I just want to share some of what he said. This is about healthy eating and healthy living. He said this.

Let's just see here. Yeah. Eventually, he says, everyone will get infected with the virus, a person with a strong immune system. And I take Dr. Stengler's immune supplements every day. A person with a strong immune system who has faithfully, who eats healthfully, doesn't have anything to fear.

He's not fearful. 98% of Americans suffer from broad spectrum deficiency in micronutrients, which lead to viruses to mutate within the individual and then can penetrate into tissues. Fast food destroys the immune system. The current crisis reflects how severely malnourished we are. Being overweight and then having diabetes increases death tremendously. So when we're overweight, more prone to excessive inflammation and fluid production in response to viral replication and on and on it goes. So let me encourage you, friends, to ask God for help just to see help me to transform your lifestyle to healthy eating, healthy living.

Boy, is it worth it. Think of me in 66 as I am now, pain-free. The only time there's pain in my body is if I push heavily in a workout. You know, you get the muscle pain, right? Otherwise, I'm pain-free, headache-free virtually for seven plus years now, or if you're getting several headaches a week for years. And no aches, no pains.

I'm on no medication, no high blood pressure, no cholesterol issue. By God's grace, thriving. My life belongs to him. I'm not boasting about tomorrow. And then where there's a deficiency here or something I need to address there, the health supplements I take, they made a world of difference. And I'm not telling you whether to be vaccinated or not, or telling you whether I've been vaccinated or not.

I'm simply saying that the best thing to do for overall health, including COVID, based on what doctors say that nutritionists and others in the know, is to be healthy yourself and your proper weight. And then so many other things will fall into place. So go to our website askdr.brown.org. You can be blessed. You'll bless us at the same time. And check out vitaminmission.com. All right, let's go back to the phones.

Thessla in Fremont, Nebraska. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Oh, hi, Dr. Michael Brown. First, I want to make a comment and then a question.

Yes. For me personally, regarding this specific vaccine debate is that I don't feel like I don't think something was purposely placed in the vaccine to harm people. I do think that health officials are trying to combat the virus. But I also feel like they're not always doing it the most safely way, like vaccines do not go through the proper placebo studies. Right, right. So there's the question that we haven't had 10 or 12 years of tests and results, and then we haven't even seen all the variants, et cetera.

So for the government, even if it's trying to combat the virus and everyone means well and is working for the best, you have those concerns. Yes. So as to your question, go ahead, please. Yes. I was wondering how long would it would it take to that for the if if the case does go to the Supreme Court, how long would it take?

And if you know if a lot of companies will mandate the vaccine by then. Right, right. So this is what what Joe and Franco did touch on. So let's let's go back to what he said. So we get this from an attorney's educated viewpoint. Number one, he said, if your private company has already made that decision, then that's an issue that you have. In other words, regardless of President Biden's executive order, regardless of whether you had the authority to do that or not, if your own company has said you cannot work for us unless you are vaccinated, that's an issue you face, period. And therefore, you can't just wait to see what happens with this case.

That's that's a separate issue. He also said that it varies from state to state in terms of friendliness towards religious exemptions. So unless you had a real health issue where your doctor can say you have had issues with with vaccines in the past and therefore he recommends you not get them. If it's a religious exemption, depending on the state that you're in, you're going to get different results. Are they open to religious exemptions? Do you have a genuine religious exemption or is it just I don't want to get the vaccine?

I don't trust the science and I'm a follower of Jesus, too. That's not a religious exemption. So go to the Alliance Defending Freedom website, ADF website, Alliance Defending Freedom, and then search for info here. There's also a number to call if you want to find out specifically about your own state. There's just a general intake number there. That's the one thing. As for how long it would take, what Joe and Franco said is first OSHA has to officially implement this with their rules, then the which will take a matter of weeks, then the states will immediately fight it and he feels it could get to the Supreme Court quickly.

So you're talking potentially within a couple of months and he believes 90% that the Supreme Court will strike it down as an overreach of the president's authority. But again, the bigger question is if your own company has made a decision, then that becomes a bigger issue that you'll have to face. And for some it's like, of course, get vaccinated. What's the big deal? They'd say they got vaccinated.

No problem. Others would say, no, I'd rather lose my job. Again, these are individual issues that have to be worked out. Let's see. Let's go to Jim in Greensboro.

Time is short, so dive right in, sir. Okay. One of the responsibilities of the president of the United States is to defend the people of the United States against foreign and domestic enemies. My question is, does the president have the power to treat the COVID-19 pandemic as a domestic enemy? Ah, that's a fascinating question, Jim, and I'm glad we got your call in. From everything I heard Joe and Franco say earlier in the broadcast, the answer would be no. That according to my understanding of what he had said in terms of precedent, the answer would be no. That an enemy would be an actual human entity as opposed to a virus.

Now, what if you said, but we know the virus was manufactured in Wuhan and a lab by China and has been released as a bioweapon, then are you fighting Chinese bioterrorism? I think even with that stretch, the answer is still no. But again, that's a great question to ask. Could there be something the president did if it was a physical threat with human beings?

And would it then be government overreach and what would be for the good of the people? Let us pray for wisdom for everyone involved. And thank you, Jim, for asking that. Let us pray for wisdom for everyone involved. Let us pray that those under pressure, either as an employer, an employee, do you have wisdom? And let's pray for God's grace as America, that we fall on our knees and ask God for His mercy. That's the biggest thing we can do. Hey, be blessed. The Lord is good. Another program powered by the Truth Network.