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How Charles Finney's 1836 Warning Still Speaks to Us Today

Line of Fire / Dr. Michael Brown
The Truth Network Radio
August 31, 2021 4:30 pm

How Charles Finney's 1836 Warning Still Speaks to Us Today

Line of Fire / Dr. Michael Brown

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August 31, 2021 4:30 pm

The Line of Fire Radio Broadcast for 08/31/21.

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The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It was 1836 when Finney gave this morning. It's relevant to this day for the line of fire with your host activist all the international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown your voice of moral cultural and spiritual revolution Michael Brown is the director of the coalition of conscience and president of fire school of Ministry get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH's 866-34-TRUTH paradigm is Dr. Michael Brown to Charles Finney predict the Civil War. Did he foresee a wave of blood coming across the nation.

Did he foresee all way to a void that wave of blood was 30 years before it happened to talk about that today and will get a look at the warnings, Finney gave terms of their relevance for us today here in America. Michael Brown, welcome to the line of fire.

Here's number call, you can join in on this subject, you can join in on anything.

Were talking about yesterday or the ongoing covert related discussions with you want to talk to me about 866-34-TRUTH 866-34-TRUTH 87884 phone lines are wide open for your calls now. I've often thought about these words from Finney which I had read many many years ago in an annotated autobiography, getting into great depth. Lots of other information for constant footnotes expanding on things so very very helpful addition of of the Finney autobiography agreed years ago and I was trying to track down the specific page in the book. I remember in an endnote reading this correspondence with Finney to Theodore Weld found it and found it online as well. So I want to talk about this where Finney put his emphasis when he was dealing with abolitionist because he was a strong abolitionist leader. Remember, he was president of Oberlin College in Oberlin served as an escape route on the so-called Underground Railroad for slaves fleeing from their slaveowners in Ohio and when Finney asked her to New York City. If you were involved in the slave trade in any way he would not give you communion. He was a very strong passionately strong abolitionist and said one of the reasons for the. The backslidden spiritual state of so much of the church and America's apathy to the slave trade at the same time, he said the emphasis must be put first and foremost on revival and converting people involved in this in changing hearts and minds were we come to that in a moment. Finney came to my mind again in the last few days because a colleague of mine sent me an article posted by Michael Horton so Dr. Michael Horton will theologian Christian author, radio host for many years. We met, I believe once through this, the Browns revival. He came and visited. I believe this the one and only time that we met so I so appreciate so much of what he does in the stands that he takes like other Calvinists. He has a very very negative view of Charles Finney and in here's what he said in his article about Finney. Perhaps you not have a dialogue about this on here when and if you want to do this. He said no single man is more responsible for the distortion of Christian truth, Rh, and Charles Grandison Finney screwed new measures created the framework for modern decision theology and evangelical revivalism is excellent article that my court explains a trust Finney distorted the important doctrine of salvation's of course. I agree with this very strongly. My goal is not to defend Finney Finney was wrong somewhere than I stand with the word is not a matter of significant Horton say one of the fan Calvin, it would be a matter of fealty to the word and we would both believe that in loyalty to the Lord, we come to our different convictions so he notices Dr. Horton that Jerry Falwell calls him one of my heroes and her many evangelicals, including Billy Graham.

He says New York revivalist was the oft quoted celebrity champion of the Christian Suzuki screening youth with a mission organization.

These particular stain them when the leaves of the Christian right and the Christian left so Jerry fall and Jim Wallace. I've even seen JI Packer recovers theologian praise Charles Finney and in here's here's what here's what Michael Horton says that is because Finney's moralistic impulse.

So speaking about why why Jerry fall and Jim Wallace could both appreciate trust and even though there aren't very different sides of the evangelical divide that is because Finney's moralistic impulse envisioned a church that was in large measure, an agency of personal and social reform rather than the institution in which the means of grace were in Sacramento made available to believers than take the gospel to board.II absolutely different with the state. Aside from that, the word and sacrament having a very specific meaning like I absolutely differ with this idea that Finney's emphasis was on social reform rather than the gospel.

First, it it's quite the opposite.

He said the coincident in the 19th century the evangelical movement became increasingly identified with political causes from abolition of slavery and child labor legislation to women's rights and the prohibition of alcohol in a desperate attempt at regaining this institutional power and the glory of Christian America vision is always powerful and imagination. But after the disintegration of Puritan New England elusive. The turn-of-the-century Protestant establishment lost moral campaigns to Americanize immigrants for small instruction, a character education evangelist pitch their American gospel in terms of its practical usefulness to the individual and the nation.

This is why Finney is so popular is the tallest marker in the shift from Reformation orthodoxy evident in the great awakening and Edwards and Whitfield know it's Calvinism to our many and even indeed, collegiate revivalism evident from the second great awakening to the present to demonstrate the debt of modern evangelicalism to Finney, we must first notices theological departures. These departures, Finney became the father of the antecedents to some of today's greatest challenges within evangelical churches.

When the church growth movement. Pentecostals in the political revivalist of course we step back from his article from moment Pentecostalism or the outpouring of the Holy Spirit in the 20th and 21st century is the greatest single move of God on the planet in church history in terms of numbers of people coming to faith in a certain period of time. I'm presently on the earth there about 600 million charismatics. Pentecostals will want and when you add in all of those over the course of the last century. Plus it is the greatest harvest in world history and as missiology's and others recognizably, that the planet, the fastest growing religion is not Islam or some other group or sector false religion. It is biblically based Holy Spirit filled Christianity around the world is been for decades. So of course it in Dr. Horton's perception Pentecostalism be a bad thing in Finney being somehow connected to that that makes Finney, the author of the bad stuff of the B differently and where Dr. Horton I would absolutely agree on the superficiality in the church and in the all about me gospel and the bypassing of the cross and the lack of emphasis on the glory of God in the Lordship of Jesus, and things like that we would be step for step in agreement. I would absolutely say spy departing from with print. Finney preached is by losing sight of what he preached of the intensity with the with which he preached the guilt of human sin, the intensity with which he preached the glory of God and the need for human beings to to repent and cry out for mercy, and find absolutely no help whatsoever in themselves that that few people walked the planet preached a message in recorded church history notes to our knowledge that brought deeper conviction of sin on more people and more radical and lasting conversions and Finney was also reacting against what would become a very extreme Calvinism in his day one that basically said there's no reason to even pray for her loss. It is because God will save me wants to say that's how far some people went with it. So let let's see what Finney actually said all right again, perhaps Dr. Horton would want to have a dialogue with me about this one, the year I'm sure would be a fruitful discussion is before the Lord as respectful leaders we would share our differences are common concerns so here's an article in Christian history Christian history Institute.org you can see it online. It's about the abolitionist and here's the section on Finney forcing blood up.

Let let me give the background before I get into this article. There was a call for immediacy abolition now free the slaves now take action now and Finney press things is much as you could press them in a righteous way but said listen first and foremost, that the. The emphasis always must be on conversion of sinners changing of hearts and minds of those in the slave trade.

Yes, these Africans are suffering terribly. It it is a judgment on America in terms of the ugliness of our treatment towards these people and their oppression. We need to do whatever we can to free them, liberate them as soon as possible.

However, if you push people to act in a certain way.

Now is can have disastrous results.

Now Finney is probably most famous. To this day for his lectures on the revival of religion, or revival lectures. They greatly impacted me.

They have impacted many revivalist revival leaders over the many years since the republished what's the background to that series of sermons Finney was pastoring in New York City and became run down his health was failing. So it was recommended that he go out to see for number of weeks.

This was something that was not uncommonly prescribed in the sea air. See you get out on the ship and in your out for for weeks at a time wherever it's sailing with across the ocean or wherever and Finney gave instructions because there is a newspaper that went out from his church taking the sermons each week is to put them in print form and distributing them among other things, and Finney left the man in charge with explicit instructions put revival first put preach the gospel to the lost first put social reform put abolition second wall wall. Finney was away over those weeks. The guy did the reverse.

When Finney came back.

The subscriptions were dropping off that the health of the congregation was not where it needed to be when Finney was on. That's that sea voyage, regaining his health and he lived from 1790 to the 1875 that he became overwhelmingly burdened travailing in prayer for revival. He came back. Learn what it happened and said we've got to regain our focus. Let us get back to preaching revival first.

Which meant repentance in the church and repentance in the world. The return of the church from its backsliding to the conversion of sinners and Finney's words, so he would preach these messages. Some of the transcribe them long hand writing as fast as they could with Finney preached they presented to Finney afterwards and he was amazed at the quality of what was produced in what they'd written out. He would then give added and then that was posted in the newspaper in this series of lectures became lectures on the revival of religion and and that's what continues to have a great impact in convicting impact. To this day, but that's the origin of that was something said I will get to some of his quotes from that in a moment so we come back want to dig into this warning that Finney gave him a letter to Theodore Weld who was covered under Finney's ministry abolitionist, but then went to such extremes.

The heart of some of this fundamental faith this morning. More about Finney had to say and then ask with Santos today. What is matter today. We will file the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown get into the minor fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH here again is Dr. Michael Brown as friends putting us on the line of fire when about to talk about is really relevant really important really urgent so means a lot to me that you take time out of your day to listen to the radio broadcast watch online. Listen to podcast after the show.

I value that I honor that. Don't waste a second of your time but this is especially urgent, therefore, is your list of egg amassed you to give me your best year even better than normal, fair enough. 86634 so Charles Finney writes to Theodore Weld who is pressing immediacy, immediacy, freeze the slaves was refreeze. Now we must take action now, if anything, it's urgent. Take whatever action we can, but the concentration needs to be in a certain place so look at this. This is Christian history history Institute online and it's the article on the abolitionist the section Finney forcing blood so it says this as time went on abolitionist opposition optimism with her. The rancor of the debate with Charles Finney, now president of thoroughly abolitionist Oberlin College to urge well theater Weld and his followers to pull back from abolitionist Finney wrote in the summer of 1836 near the nearly 25 years before his words would be fulfilled brother wealth is not true. At least, do not fear is that we are in our present course going fast into a civil war will not our present movements and abolition result in that we save our country and affect the speedy abolition of slavery. That is, this is my answer if abolition can be made an appendage of a general revival of religion.

All is well.

I fear no other form of carrying this question will save our country or the liberty or soul of the slave abolitionism has drunk up the spirit of some of the most efficient moral men in this fast doing so to the rest.

Many of our abolition brethren seem satisfied with nothing less than this.

This I've been trying to resist from the beginning as I have all unforeseen that should that take place. The church in the world.

Ecclesiastical state leaders will become embroiled in one common infernal squabble that will roll a wave of blood over the land growth is 1936. The cause is not operating are in my view, is certain to lead to this result as a cause is to produce its effect unless the public mind can be engrossed with the subject of salvation and make abolition and appendage have or are you grasping friends.

The significance of these words and as they apply to us today. I have read increasing calls in the last year from Christian leaders say look a civil war is coming to America and skin to be a blood he civil war not not just metaphorically, not just spiritual, not just not just socially but actually a war there talk about it in their same look. The left is going to try to take away our weapons so we better get stocked up now we better be stuck with weapons. We better be stuck with ammo.

We better be ready. We better be prepared because the words coming out, by all means let us contend for second amendment rights. By all means let us recognize the potential dangers of a of a government disarming the populace. We are aware of of those dangers. But it is very different than hearing Christians talking about the coming Civil War and look were so divided over abortion were so divided over gay activism are so divided over other issues.

That is gonna come to that. While there's no there's no end to the sun. It should come to that of the church simply acts like the church. In other words, if if we would put our emphasis where it needs to be repentance of sin in our own lives, earnestly imploring God for his mercy and prayer with absolute desperation taking the gospel to the lost serving the hurting and the needy.

And that's that's our number one focus in the number two the urgent social court causes, be it the terrible sin of abortion beneath the plague of human trafficking, be it be at the direction of LGBT Q activism bidů Beat the assault of the religious freedoms as that in Finney's words, becomes the appendage to the larger revival and awakening, then we can see real change come otherwise if we Civil War at the breaking point out has to happen. We are to be the ones provoking it.

In other words, how can I say this, we have only done a fraction of what we need to do as the church to bring about change. I mean no insult. Please hear me. I mean no personal insult on anyone. I'm not telling you what God's will is for your life but answer this question honestly. If you believe abortion is a great evil in America as I do if if you believe that saving the lives of unborn babies is something of great importance in God's sight.

May I ask you what you actually do on a regular basis about that was how much time you spend working with pro-life groups. How much of your money you give to proactive talents of your time you give to pregnancy centers or to pregnancy pregnancy crisis centers or to share the gospel in front of abortion clinics or to lobbying senators and things like that was most of us get really worked up about and talking a lot to do almost nothing the rest of the time and and and and then every four years we we vote for the president is a big issue. Supreme Court justices knows, but for the most part we are not addressing this for the most part if I said okay all really at the point of revival. Are we done this by becoming out October time of the book really. At that point of absolute desperation, and we cried out that we need to cry that we sought God we meet for the most part again. I mean no insult, but 90% was this would be no so we got no business talking about the other radical means in and take the launch own hands went when we have not done what we can do and all these other ways and that's what concerns me about some of the rhetoric about coming Civil War take up office as second, there are so many other possibilities that must be exhausted before we even think of that before that's even a figment of of a possibility in our minds and to be honest, some of the folks talk about Civil War and take up arms now offered to talk about Civil War. For years I did. I was struck between spiritual I was understood to be true about the spiritual separation in the spiritual division and the spiritual warfare we engage in. I never took it in the physical sense, not actually hearing some of them say it's it's startling. It's disturbing and I'm totally with Vinnie on this.

All of this can be avoided if we will do was post to first look at this article I wrote it. February 4, 2019 about Charles Finney either awakening or Civil War in America over abortion and I go back to this warning of his that he predicted spiritual awakening did not come first.

The battle over slavery within with a bloodied war to look at this in a sermon hindrances to revival. Finney said revivals are hindered when ministers and churches take wrong ground in regard to any question involving human rights take the subject of slavery.

For instance, Rosie Preakness 1830s. He does it.

There were true Christians involved in slavery, but he said it was because the sinfulness of it was not apparent to their minds, so ministers and churches to a great extent through the land of held their peace and bore no testimony against this abominable abomination existing in the church and in the nation's but I can continue no more explain light is now shut up on the subject as it is been upon the cause of temperance so various reformation of morals movements. Facts are exhibited and principles established in light thrown in upon the minds of men and this monster is drag from his hard then an exhibit before the church and it is demanded of them is this sin, and he said it is impossible that their testimony should not be given on one side of the other there silenced me about slavery. Christians can no longer be accounted for upon the principle of ignorance and that they have never had their attention turned to the subject.

Consequently, the sounds of Christians upon the subject is virtually same as they do not consider slavery as a sin. The truth is it is a subject upon which they cannot be sought without guilt. The time is come the providence of God in every southern breeze is loaded down with the cries of lamentation morning in wall to millions of degraded heathen in our own land, stretch their hands all shackled and bleeding and sent forth to the Church of God. The agonizing cry for help a child to church and her efforts to reclaim and save the world deaf in her years to dispose of agony and despair God for bid.

The church cannot turn away from this question is a question for the church and for the nation to decide and gobble push it to a decision. He said it is doubtless true that one of the reasons for the low state of religion at the present time is that many churches have taken the wrong side on the subject of slavery have suffered prejudice to prevail over principal and he feared to call this abomination by its true name. Still in all of this friends as strongly as Finney was giving these warnings is to step back from this article as strongly as he was giving these warnings. His whole emphasis was revival first spiritual renewal.

First, and then right behind that not neglecting right behind that abolition revival in the church conversion of sinners right along with that. So he's taking action.

The whole time. Part of the Underground Railroad part of taking action against slaveowners in his churches not giving them communion part of speaking out, acting as he saw he was doing what he knew how to do, but saying to really see the change come without a massive wave of blood. To this day, our costliest war terms of casualties. Horrifically so in the Civil War. You got family members fighting each other, North and South that that the owner would avoid that is with getting things spiritual in place first rent is relevant for us again today really so relevant for us today. I hear on the line of fire with your host Dr. Michael Brown, the voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution there again is Dr. Michael Brown is joining us on the line of fire. We often get attracted to different Christian teachers, leaders, some from the past, some from today. I'm really blessed by what they have to say and then some is as old did you know they also taught this or did you know they also believe this and were shocked and we look into it is accurate or not, and some discussion about the teachings of Charles Finney and was he not just Arminianism. I am but collegium could be considered outright heretical.

Of course some Arminians consider Calvinists or heretics of Calvinist consider minions heretics were not going there today. God must look down sometimes and decide like my children anyway are things that you cross lines that go too far to dig a little deeper into some of the teaching of Charles Finney but phone lines are open any question you want to ask me on any subject, take some random calls as well. Today, 8663 for truth. It's 866-34-TRUTH 87, 84, all of our friends in the DFW area will be doing a number of private events.

But Saturday night doubling up to speak at the Melia house of prayer that will be an open meeting and then Sunday three services, mercy, culture in Fort Worth.

I think the first service starts at 830 in the last service. A few hours later. So if you're anywhere in that area. By all means, and join them in a pubic region personally, but hopefully will be blessed and ministered to. So one of the common accusations against Charles Finney is that he denied Original Sin denied that human beings were Warren sinful, but rather that they all send therefore became sinful and I can understand why this would be raised against his teaching. When I would simply say, is it's better to understand what he was actually saying Fort for example, he says it is up to the center to get a new heart, but that God gives a new heart you say.

Well has not work when he's just taking the take seriously.

Like in Ezekiel 18 with her were goddesses for the prophet get yourselves a new heart, the sin that we play a role in but of course we can save ourselves because were hopeless and is in rebellion against God. Only God can save us, but we have a decision to make. There is something that we do all things this phone with the text says I'm just going with the Scripture system. He may end up saying something different.

There was a faster Calvinist. Walt wasn't mean when goddesses get yourself a new heart. He goes telling the children of Israel to do something. What are they to do much. They will there to say God I can't do it will even buy say I can't do it.

Are they doing something universal.

You can't go around and around with this, but finishes try to say this with Texas.

God doesn't center does that that everyone's involved, but salvation is from the Lord alone and again I don't know of any preacher in recorded history whose messages brought more intense conviction of sin and a sense of loss. This sense of horror of guilt, the preaching Finney over a period of many years to the point that people for days would be weeping and wailing and crying out under conviction, asking God for mercy to save as opposed to this being just some prayer.

Prayer come forward.

It was pray through until you know if you're under conviction come to the meeting tomorrow or come back later today and seek God it was not just conformed prayer prayer. That's an abuse of of things that we got into today, but I was sure little bit with you. Charles Finney in his lecture on moral depravity support to and it was with the 1862, 1862, published in the Oberlin evangelist and he's quoting from Romans 87 because the carnal mind is enmity against God is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can it be so. Usually saying about human nature, minus a state of his is in a state of mortal enmity against God.

By this I mean that the human mind is so firmly entrenched against God and so utterly opposed to him that sooner than be governed by him. It would take his life. If this were possible rebellion against any government always implies us again the crucifixion of Christ demonstrated this fact, so far as it is possible for human beings to make such demonstration. Christ was God manifest in the flesh, they slew his human nature. No doubt they would've slain his divine if they could just not answers to send. It was only the Jews highly prejudiced against in that saloon and the resident.

The answer to say that if the Jews had known that he was God the without of crucified him, for we see now on every side that those who acknowledge Jesus to be God get reject his authority and give the most unmistakable evidence they would oppose into the death sooner than be governed by and so is this is the universal condition of human beings.

He then says the carnal mind is estate, I'm sorry what I said the carnal mind is in a state I was inserting the word, the carnal mind is a state of moral and litigants because this is a state of money. Speaking of the carnal mind is a state of supreme opposition to God that it is it is more deeply set in opposition to God than any of the being in the universe. God is infinite, holy, and the carnal mind is in a state of entire sinfulness. These two things are infinitely oppose the one to the other. There is nothing in the universe to which the sinner is so much opposed his real holiness.

There is nothing in heaven, to which he is so much oppose God excuse me, nothing in heaven to achieve the sinner so much oppose as to infinite holiness.

So he saying the sinner's every human being is dead set against God. This is not a compromise view of sin. This is not a compromise view of human guilt. This is not a compromise view of moral depravity, not Finney's issue was is his argument was that human beings are born with appetites because the fall. We are born with appetites and we act on those appetites. We are now guilty of sin that was point and that all human beings by nature will act on those on those desires. So his point was to have a desire for strong drink to of had that as long as you remember in itself is not sin. The acting on it is sin. But we always act on sinful desires. Because we are fallen human beings so the say that that he had a different view of human nature, etc. to me.

See, simply being true to Scripture and recognizing that in the Bible.

Children are not held accountable.

The way adults are there several verses that speak to this directly that before children knew the difference between good and evil, speak like that for example in Deuteronomy 139 or when Isaiah 715 to 17 order or the beginning of the eighth chapter that there are there times before the child learns to distinguish between good and evil is a reason that Jesus tells us to become like little children because of the innocence thereof. So what he says and skipped down his remarks. The human mind is manifestly in a physically disease state. That was his point, we are we are born with a fallen human nature and we become guilty of sin, we act on that nature.

By this I mean that sin has deranged its developments. Doesn't that give you an indication that infinities mind sin had an effect on every human being and we were born in that fallen state insomuch as, is that there are various tendencies in the Constitution that result in selfishness politically. Remember this is a physical and not a moral depravity. Why because it's moral when you act on it.

That's the distinction is making to illustrate this persons coming to being with depraved appetites and strong natural appetite say for strong drink are some of the sensual enjoyment that these appetites although in the diseased state, it being constitutional part of a human constitution are not in themselves sinful is only their unlawful indulgence that is sinful effect.

No appetite of men can be sinful and strictly constitutional normal mode can be can it become itself sinful by being in an unhealthy or depraved condition.

The sin must consist in its unlawful indulgence. Adam and Eve had constitutional appetites for knowledge and for food. These were not sinful that evil and strongly excited by the attempt temptation to indulgence was only the consent of the mind to indulge them in a prohibited matter the cost to their scent but because we are born and look for the would refer to a physically depraved state.

We will all act on it in sin. It is the only direction we can go which is why when these Redeemer you could read it a certain way to make a mental collation heretic. Or you could read what he saying and look at the rest of his preaching recognizes was just coming at this from a different angle of the effects of the fall on every human being. In any case. In any case, read through if you've never read through his lectures on the revival of religion revival adjuster available all over online for free from is nothing in it downloadable for more still get the physical book. Read through and see if God the sister your heart fresh read through and see if he doesn't convict you read through see if it doesn't increase your desire for God in your own life and bring you to a heightened recognition of the need for holiness and importance of repentance, the desire to reach out to a lost and dying world right 866-34-TRUTH.

Let us go to Charles in Chicago, Illinois. Welcome to the line of fire background.

Thank you very much. It's great to be here person foremost, I really appreciate your program and follow your teachings for many years and appreciate you. Thank you preset the one of my favorite Charles Finney quotes which I think is really bring the point home what you're emphasizing today confusing. He said if the presence of God is in the church. The church will draw the world in the presence of God is not in the church, the world will draw the church out and that really convicted me because for a while during all the election and in the in the political nonsense and in all the noise out there knowing the world now creeping into the church. The division between us between denominations worldly series like CRT creeping into the church and monopolizing time YouTube channels debate you know all of the noise. I realized I was getting a little bit too involved into and it was leaving me very bitter now only very bitter.

He was occupying my time in the conviction Shirley from `me was wait a minute, it's, it's the gospel first gospel. First, we gotta get back to first Corinthians chapter 15 right every everything has to slaughter that exactly so. And while you were speaking I just I just typed in the words is the presence of God in the city" comes right on so he reposts that thank you for the reminder. For each of us individually. Charles exactly right for each of us individually start with the presence of God out of that. Let everything flow. Appreciate the call. It's the line of fire with your host activist, author, international speaker and theologian Dr. Michael Brown voice of more cultural and spiritual revolution get into the light of ironbound by calling 6643 here again is Dr. Michael Brown transferred joining us on the line of fire is number call.

Let's go over to Deborah in Maple Grove Minnesota. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Hi Dr. Brown I am so grateful for what you were saying about me. I hadn't heard before about him and put the gospel first and second warning how it applies to us now when you spoke about him saying no you are hearing the cries and were silent. I can't help but think about Afghanistan. I've been fasting and praying today and then just weeping and interceding for the church because I'm thinking, how many pastors didn't call their congregation to pray, I'm not saying that in condemnation, praying intercession, like you spent.

The church needs to be revived quietly praying flagrantly on her face fasting and praying for our own people, let alone the other Afghans don't know the couple who could be butchered today Deborah I can actually answer the question there to meet two reasons.

One is many of us are complacent and just caught up with their own lives and the things of this world. That's that's one of the other is we are bombarded with a thousand urgent requests a day that everywhere we turn on social media. Pray for this when their dime.

Pray for this, when the just lost a loved one. Pray I just posted an article about a 16-year-old pastor in India. Some of my friends are helping to support local radicals in his city told him to to stop holding prayer meetings in his home. He refused to do so.

When he was out selling vegetables of the they burned them with acid over 85% of his body.

So our friends are trying to pay his medical bills and even where is the precarious getting is probably very primitive of an suit where were overwhelmed with needs.

So what I'd encourage you to do.

Deborah's is carry that burden that is if you owned it, you know what I'm saying that that carry the burden to pray for Americans left Afghanistan for Christians in Afghanistan for the people praise of God entrusted to you.

In the pray that God would visit more prayer support because the stem a daily basis. We are overwhelmed and her friends in Louisiana how are they doing after the hurricane. You've got that in mind and in getting reports of one crisis after another in many different parts the world. So some of us, you're right, Deborah, were in different reduced insensitive. We don't really care because of that we we go on in the world's and that's what Finney was was addressing your wares or cry over the the the criminal acts of abortion critical to the baby's horrible accident wears her heart for that cry and and on and on. But then others were where bird in one direction and and refocus therein.

It's just it's overwhelming these days we get hit with so much.

Just my social media fees on Facebook this with algorithms change what I just open up a me to get all these video reels agrees that coming from or an endless stream of just personal things be at someone's birthday or or someone's death.

And it's a flood, but often for the bad news and problems.

We get overwhelmed so maybe not get number Deborah take this burden is of the Lord came and said hey I'm entrusting this to I'm entrusting this to you. All right, thank you for the call and maybe others will be spurred by your call. Let us go to Cassie in Ankeny, Iowa. Welcome to the line of fire hi there hey I thank you for all you all are neuron I you I have a question that might in the Bible about how we are gray I out know where when people die they don't immediately go to heaven there in the grave in the Bible does in dead. I dangle by 120 years dealing with regard to that right. So my understanding is that when the believer dies, they immediately go into the presence of God in heaven, and yet it's an intermediate state because we are awaiting the resurrection of our bodies. That being said, there is a debate over that among believers so so for for example, you have verses in the Old Testament the dead know nothing. The dead cannot praise the Lord you have in the Psalm seven Ecclesiastes it is that just metaphorical speech for the fact that in the ribs. That person is dead, so maybe there was a notorious gang leader in your community stirred up all kinds of trouble for years and now that person is been shot and killed in a in a confrontation with the police.

You say will easily become a buddy anymore like it hurt anybody anymore. Instead, many in this world's activities over which are not commenting on whether he is conscious in hell.

At that moment after use of the sink in this world.

That's one way of reading the texts that it's simply talking about life in this world you're done you can't praise God.

You can't do anything you can't do good or evil. You're gone. It's over. His first life in this world. At the very least it's saying that the question is, is also say that when someone dies they close their eyes when they next open them. They are either being resurrected to be with the Lord forever or being resurrected to judgment. So either way you close your eyes and when you wake up you are either with the Lord, are separated from the effect in that regard would be the same.

The argument for those who believe as I do, is that the term falling asleep is a euphemism because it's only spoken with reference to believers, not not to the loss but to believers that's house described in the New Testament we have Jesus telling the thief on the cross in Luke 23. Truly I say to you today. You'll be with me in paradise.

So he speaking to him about immediately after their death on the cross there be together in the world and then Paul in Philippians 1's toy but that he may be martyred, said I desire to depart and be with Christ, which is far better right now. It's needful that I stay some of the stick around for a while longer, but otherwise instead of he left he would depart and be with Jesus and in then Revelation 6 even notices this is is a visionary text. It still speaks of the souls of those were beheaded in their under the throne of God saying how long how long before you avenge our blood. So here they are existing alive and then you have Luke 16 with Lazarus and the rich man that the LAT Lazarus goes upon death to Abraham's bosom, a place of comfort and and safety and the rich man goes to Hades, a place of judgment torment. This is immediately after death, and certainly that was the pharisaical belief at that time so I'm I believe the best case, you can make for this in harmony with second Corinthians 5 is that you are absent from the body present with the Lord at death but still awaiting the resurrection, awaiting the final resurrection. That's our absolute state of of wholeness out. However, within the. The body.

This can be debated otherwise this is not a heretical issue to say that we believe that that we believe in soul sleep I don't but there are Christians through history who have believed in that.

So a citizen less than Cassie when it comes to the the effect on the.

The believer incenses the same.

You close your eyes and death.

When you next open your eyes to your next moment of consciousness you're in the presence of the Lord.

Either way, that's how it comes out, but the difference is the perception of those that are here on earth. In other words, when we say hey, he's with the Lord that she's with the Lord.

The there in a better place. There's a sense of comfort that we get over there, but I believe it's truth for the mystery is what is it mean to exist in God's presence, but without our physical bodies. How does that work because Paul said what were longing for that to be unclothed but to be close, meaning with our resurrected bodies to Cassie thank you for the call. I do appreciate it all right time but at a time to take calls but not quite at a time to sure word of encouragement with your friends. Are you living your life in the light of eternity. Are you living your life in such a way that you realize what you do in this world will have implications for ever and ever. She could leave this body and going to the presence of God and see the glories of eternity in and see the glories of the world to come in the hearts of judgment for those who don't know him to think you'd live the same way you living now will I live the same way I'm living that would be with. We BS consume with the things around us as we are. We have a different perspective. With that perspective. Give us an even greater focus on the things that we do in this world. The old quote of CT stud missionary to Africa or the things you're living for the season that's Leonard Ravenhill or the things you're living for words. Christ dying for CT stud only when life will soon be passed on was done for Christ will last May our lives makes sense in the light of eternity. I would get a special guess that will be joining us tomorrow whole lot more to cover, don't miss a moment of it right here.

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