Revisiting the Slippery Slope

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We told you this was coming, did we not? It's time for The Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the Director of the Coalition of Conscience and President of Fire School of Ministry. Get into The Line of Fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

That's 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. You know, I really don't enjoy saying, I told you so, I told you so, because I would much rather that the things that we told you were coming, some of the bad things, some of the negative things that we told you were coming, actually weren't coming, that we were actually proven wrong, that the things we warned about didn't come to pass. However, once again, we have to say, we told you so, and I'll explain what I mean today on the broadcast. Welcome, welcome.

This is Michael Brown. Thanks so much for joining us. Here's the number to join the program live, 866-34-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. In a moment, I'll give you another number to call if you are not watching or listening live. If you're watching a podcast afterwards or catching it later on internet or maybe watching on America's Voice on Dish TV or the Pluto TV on a Saturday night, I'll give you another number to call, not to be on live.

We don't have the power to transport you back a few days. Actually, as I broadcast today, it's Tuesday, March 16th, which means, yes, turn 66 years old today, and I'm blessed beyond words, pain-free, ache-free, medicine-free, according to everything I know, have a wonderful, clean bill of health. Of course, our lives are in God's hands. We can't post about tomorrow, but I am profoundly grateful to God's grace in my life. I easily could have died of a drug overdose in my foolishness before I got saved at the age of 16.

I could have died other times since then, if not for the grace and goodness of God. So here we are, my joy to be with you, and we're going to talk about some cultural trends. We're going to talk about some things that are happening in front of our eyes, and the question, what can we do to bring about positive change? It's one thing to say this is wrong. It's another thing to say we can still make a difference and push back against a very real slippery slope, 866-34-TRUTH.

Let me go back a little while and say that I've watched this cycle repeat itself more than once. Namely, we see something's wrong. We see where something is headed. We say we don't want to go in this direction, because if you open up this door, it's going to create a greater problem. If you go in this direction, it's going to end up here.

We sound the alarm, we give warnings, and as a result, we're told, what are you talking about? You're crazy. That's never going to happen. You're out of your mind. That could never happen in our culture.

That could never happen in our society. And then when it begins to happen, people look at us and say, so what's the big deal? What are you getting all worked up over?

It's nothing. And hence, the slippery slope is a very, very real slope indeed. Back in the year 2004, I began sounding the alarm, and I began to say that those who came out of the closet want to put us in the closet. So we're looking at cultural issues, moral issues, family issues, sexuality issues. Gay activists who came out of the closet fighting for what they felt was equality, freedom, that their relationships and their lives could have the same recognition of heterosexuals. They came out of the closet, and that's what they wanted. They wanted their rights, and from their perspective, yeah, understand, it's a simple matter of human rights, respect, dignity. But what's that got to do with putting others in the closet?

Well, it was an inevitable progression. Those who came out of the closet in the late 60s, I don't mean all of them, but the activists and those who continue to be the activists in our generation, in order to establish rights that we differ with, in order to establish family structures that we differ with, in order to establish a way of life that we believe is not God's best way for children to be raised and things like that, you're going to have to silence opposing voices. So in the early days of gay activism, the major opposition was the psychological and psychiatric profession that viewed homosexuality as a sickness. And then the other major issue, the other major thing to overcome was the religious world, especially the church, that viewed homosexual practice as sinful. So it was just a few years of gay activism, just into the 80s, when the American Psychological Association before the American Psychiatric Association, they changed their views. Then it's just like dominoes falling saying, we don't look at this as a disorder of any kind, as an illness of any kind, and as long as people are happy like this, it's perfectly fine and normal.

So that was removed as an obstacle. That meant the last obstacle was going to be the church, was going to be followers of Jesus saying that this was not God's best, this was not what God intended. We love everyone, Jesus died for everyone the same, whoever our neighbors and friends are, we treat them with respect and dignity as much as we're able to, right, as much as we have relationship, we're respectful, gracious people. At the same time, we say, no, no, God didn't intend for two men to be together.

God's plan, his best plan is not to raise a child intentionally without a mother or without a father. So of course, for saying that, we're now called bigoted and hateful. And I understand from the perspective of those with same-sex attraction and romantic attraction, their relationship feels as normal to them as my relationship with Nancy, 45 years of marriage. That's what they would say. Why are you so bigoted and hateful?

I understand why they feel like that. I also understand why we would be looked at as the enemy and we who came, we who came out against their lifestyle or said the Bible teaches thus and such, we're the enemy and now we must be silenced. I don't mean putting us to death, I don't mean that, but putting us in the closet, marginalizing us, and that's what we've seen happen with the help of big business, with the help of big tech, with the help of Hollywood, with the help of others who have allied with the LGBTQ cause and now the present administration very much allied with the LGBTQ cause in a very activist way, the Dangerous Equality Act and some of the president's executive orders from day one. So things pushing back against our religious freedoms, we said that would be coming. We warned. And when I began to warn in 2004, that's when I saw it clearly. Others saw it before me long before I was conscious of it. But I remember when I began to say that those who came out of the closet want to put us in the closet. I told you, man, you're crazy, man.

What are you talking about? No one wants to put you in the closet, no one's trying to silence you. We just want to live our lives.

You do what you want to do. We just want to live our lives. I was mocked. I was ridiculed for daring to say that. Some years later, I noticed the tone began to change and the tone began to change to this, bigots like you belong in the closet. Oh yeah, bigots like you should be silent.

You do not have the right to speak because you are so bigoted and hateful and you're no better than the Nazis and Ku Klux Klan and ISIS and whatever horrific group was in the news in those days. That's what we were caricatured to the point that Kim Davis, Kentucky law clerk in a state that voted to reaffirm marriage as God intended it one man, one woman together for life, a state that voted to reaffirm marriage something like 75% to 25% when she refused to judge his order to write a same sex marriage certificate and the state had many, many ways, religious exemptions, many ways that she did not have to do it, that someone else could have taken that responsibility. Instead, she was put in jail and there were gay activists and allies rejoicing around the nation.

I read the post comparing her to ISIS for saying, hey, I'm a Christian and a good conscience. I don't believe that two men can actually marry, so I can't write a marriage license for them. We've seen the thing shift a few years ago. Let's put this headline up. I wrote an article asking the question, why not three, why not three? The question gay activists cannot answer. I wrote that back in 2015, but I asked the question long before that.

Why not three? Here's the point. And I did a debate with Professor Eric Smaw, 2011, my book, A Queer Thing Happened to America came out. I'd worked on it for over six years researching, sensitizing my heart, understanding the issues. And I said, listen, I will debate the contents of this book with any qualified spokesperson for the other side. You want it to be fair, right? If you're going to do a debate, you want it to be fair to the other side. You want someone who can adequately represent the other position to debate you to be fair to that position. What's the use of debating someone that's not qualified to debate?

It's not fair to that position. So I said, do you find anyone qualified? And I'll debate them on any campus in America. And campus after campus, we heard, no, no, no, no. We heard Christian groups say, no, we can't do it, not too controversial, we could lose our standing. No, it's going to ruffle too many feathers, no, others trying to shut it down. We had Christian groups in different states tell people that reached out on our behalf, if you try to do this on our campus, we will shut it down.

Christian groups, this is how much fear is associated with this, this is back in 2011. Well, this one professor said he was willing to do it. We ended up at the University of Central Florida. We had to have four policemen present. We were required to have police presence in order to do the debate. I mean, it was wild.

It was, and I don't believe we needed police, but that's what they required, a campus of like 60,000 something people. And I asked the question then, I asked it to Professor Small, I said, okay, look, if marriage is not the union of a man and a woman, what are you required to? I mean, there's something now called seologomy, which is actually growing, which is self-marriage, you can marry yourself. So look it up. If you don't believe me, look it up.

It's, it's an increasing business. People say, hey, I've been hurt too many times, I'm just going to marry myself. You have a ceremony, the whole bit. Yeah, seriously. But I asked this question to Professor Small. He refused to answer it in the debate. No, we're not going there. We're not going to talk about polyamory or polygamy.

So he simply wouldn't answer. I've interacted with other gay activists and asked this simple question. If marriage is not the union of a man and a woman, why limit it to two? Why not three or four or five? I mean, what makes two a magic number? Two is a magic number when it's one man, one woman coming together, biologically, as the general rule, the ability to reproduce, joining a child with a mother and father, the unique complementarity that one woman and one man bring to each other, as you who are married understand. If it's not one man, one woman, why limit it to two?

Well, what is the purpose of limiting it to two? Well, check out this headline from 2015. Look it out.

What else was going on in the news? HGTV features its first ever throuple on House Hunters, Representation Matters. Actually, this is 2020. But notice this, representation matters. We want to be seen, throuples, the very thing that we were talking about. Gay activists, when I'd ask them that question, when I'd say, why limit it to two? Why not three? Why not the throuple? Why not more? They said, no, no, we're not. We're not going there. We only want to say, well, what? Just tell me why not three? Please tell me what? No one ever had a viable answer.

I read dialogues, interactions, watched debates with others. No one ever had a viable answer, except for what? We're not going that direction.

So throuples, why not throuple? So we warned this was coming. Years back, we warned this was coming. And when we told, you're crazy, it's not going to happen. Now HGTV, others are going to talk about a book that just came out, three men and their daughter that they're raising. Now that it's becoming normal, we're told, what's the big deal, man?

You're so bigoted and old fashioned. We warned about it. People say we're crazy.

When it happens, they're like, no big deal. We got a video to show you when we come back. You won't believe it. It's the line of fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks friends for joining us. If you are watching, listening, and the broadcast is not live, here's a number where you can weigh in. You can share your view.

If you differ with me, you can blast me. If you want to play it on the air when you blast me, just make sure not to use profanity and do your best to keep your calls under two minutes, three minutes at the very longest. But here's a number for you to call, or you can express an agreement or share a testimony, but it's not a number to leave questions, okay? Because we won't be responding to questions, but here's the number. It is 1-800-618-8480, 1-800-618-8480.

That is our after hours number to call to speak with me live, 866-34-TRUTH. Look at 1 Chronicles chapter 12 verse 32. When David was organizing troops that men were coming to Hebron to support him as king, it lists all the warriors and their weaponry and their strength and their experience, but the smallest of the groups and the ones where there's no reference to weaponry or anything like that is the sons of Issachar, verse 32, and it says, men who had understanding of the times to know what Israel should do, 200 chiefs and all their kinsmen under their command. Friends, as God's people today, it's important that we're like the sons of Issachar, that we understand what's happening in the world around us, that we understand what we should do, that we understand what's coming. On a broad level, I don't mean that we're predicting every future event.

No, I mean that we have a sense of where the society is going and what is happening in the world around us and that we know what we should do in response. I want you to watch this video that we prepared. We did this a few years back as Stephen Colbert was mocking those who were talking about where weddings were going, marriage was going, and he knew exactly what he was doing. He was mocking, yet he knew what was out there, so we responded to it. I want you to watch this video.

Sit back and enjoy. Stephen Colbert, very, very funny guy, well-known on Comedy Central for years now, has taken over late-night programming for David Letterman, and the other day he took issue with the slippery slope argument. It's one that we've made many times, that once you redefine marriage, there really is a slippery slope. Once you redefine marriage, you render it meaningless, so he mocked that idea in his typical way, and he talked about Representative Pete King, who said, look, with the new redefinition of marriage by the Supreme Court, a man could marry his lawnmower, and of course got a big laugh out of that, and then made reference to Dr. Ben Carson, presidential candidate Ben Carson.

Listen to what Stephen Colbert had to say about Dr. Carson's comments. And King's not the only one who believes gay marriage has opened the matrimonial floodgates. So does former doctor and future former candidate Ben Carson, who recently warned that if same-sex couples are allowed to marry, then more groups will also want the right to marry. Yeah, not gay groups, some other groups. You know, the ones who turn up every year for that crazy other group's pride parade.

Exactly. They are part of the gay pride parade, the polyamorous, the one who talked about loving relationships with multiple partners, and who according to Newsweek a few years ago are at least 500,000 families in America. That's a lot of people. And they're saying, what about us? How come our relationships are not recognized?

How come we can't get the benefits? They're at the gay pride parade. And hang on, what about the polygamists? What about the cast of Sister Wives? These folks, reality, right, the guy with his multiple wives, they went to the state of Utah and appealed and took issue with some of the laws against polygamy. And one of the laws was already reversed. And no sooner had the Supreme Court made its ruling on June 26th than polygamists were going to the court saying, what about us? So those groups are hardly hidden, hardly unknown.

They are out there. All right, Stephen Colbert continues. Anyways, you got people who don't want to issue the marriage licenses or bake cakes for gay couples, so who's going to provide party planning for Steve King's nightmare marriage scenarios?

I will. Because where some see a slippery slope to depravity, I see a slippery slope to some cash. That's why tonight I'm proud to introduce Stephen Colbert's all-inclusive wedding cake toppers. Now, here's the funny thing about him. I haven't followed his career that carefully, but on Comedy Central, he played the fool. That's the way he put it now. He actually speaks of being a devout Catholic, but he played the fool.

He was the news commentator that obviously in a funny way wasn't getting things, but his points were getting across very loudly and clearly, and yet the points that he's mocking with this whole slippery slope thing, I think I said Pete King, Steve King, the quotes that he's mocking, it's almost like he's now going out of his way to prove the very points he's mocking. So again, he's very funny, but let's see where he goes with his cake toppers for wedding cakes. Naturally, you've got the traditional topper. You've got one man and one woman, and then you've got the non-traditional traditionals. You've got two men, and you've got two women, and you've got two women and one man. Oh, okay, he's joking about this, but remember, one public opinion poll indicated that just in a few years, American acceptance of polygamy has gone from 7% to 14%. Tell me that's not part of the media influence, the same media that was celebrating will and grace, and that's the old days, the same media that was celebrating Queer Eye for the Straight Guy.

That's the old days. It's now celebrating Big Love and Sister Wives and My Five Wives, so he's joking about it, but these are real-life issues. We haven't even mentioned Islam and their desire for polygamy, so he goes on, and here's where it gets really interesting, because he's mocking stuff, but he's well enough informed.

I'm wondering if he's mocking stuff, but he knows it actually exists. If he doesn't, we'll set the record straight. Let's see. You've got two men, one woman. You've got an all-female throuple, and you've got the classic three women, two men, one woman, where one man is married to two of the women, and the other man is married to the other woman, but his wife is also married to one of the other two wives this fall on TLC. Okay. Time out. Time out. There is a lesbian throuple.

I mean, this has happened more than once, presumably, but this was reported a lot. These three women in gowns, what, I now pronounce you wife and wife and wife. How does that work? Three women in their white gowns, I think two of the dads walk them down the aisle, a throuple, and then I read about it. They were going to have a kid, obviously, with some outside help, and they were going to homeschool their kid, and then three guys in Thailand.

How's that work? I pronounce you husband, husband, and husband. Their pictures that were put out on social media just went viral, and three guys, a male throuple, a gay throuple, a lesbian throuple, and then he joked about this, what was two men, three women, whatever it was. That looks like a polyamorous relationship there, they're coming away on TLC, actually already on Showtime, married and dating, a reality TV show on polyamorous, so he's joking about it. People are like, oh, yeah, right, that's going to happen. It has already happened, and my suspicion would be he knows full well all this has already happened, that he's even poking fun while mocking our side.

He's poking fun at reality as well. Well, there's more to come. If Steve King and Ben Carson are right, then I have to be ready for any eventuality, which is why tonight I'm also introducing cake toppers for a man and a ghost, a man and a box turtle. All right, again, very funny, and the box turtle one, he knows full well there was a comment that someone had put in a senator's speech, he never made a congressional speech about a man could marry a box turtle, but that became a famous quote in O'Reilly, you could marry a box turtle, whatever. The fact is, though, here, I've got it, let's see, woman marries a dog in India, yeah, actually had a wedding ceremony, there's India, woman marries a dog in England, wedding ceremony. How about in India, woman marries a snake, yeah, and how about in Israel, woman married a dolphin. I'm not making this up.

He's joking about it, this is actually happening, there's still more. Let's go. The Eiffel Tower and Dora the Explorer. Ah, how about Erika Eiffel?

You said, what in the world are you talking about? The woman who married the Eiffel Tower, there's even a documentary done about her. These people have a fetish towards objects, it's called an object fetish, something like that. She actually married the Eiffel Tower, is that why you even ask that?

Dora the Explorer and the Eiffel Tower, Erika Eiffel, look it up, I kid you not. All right, a little bit more. How can I not provide a topper for Steve King and his lawn mower? All right, how about the man who wanted to marry his computer?

This happened within the last year. A man wanted to marry his computer, he said he had a sexual relationship with his computer, all the porn was on his computer, he wanted to marry his computer. You say he's got problems, I agree he's got problems, but hey, you talk about marrying a lawn mower, you talk about marrying a computer, oh, but Steven, Steven you left one thing out, you forgot about it. It's happened, I know at least three cases now of a woman marrying herself. One woman said she'd be married by 40 and it didn't work out, she married herself. I mean, you got bridesmaids and the whole bit. There's another woman, she just had it with broken relationships, was divorced and had it with broken relationships, didn't want to depend on someone else to take her out to dinner, someone else to get her a gift, she decided to marry herself. The only sane words spoken that day were her 11-year-old son's words, who said, I love you mom, but you're embarrassing me. So Steven Colbert, thank you, sir, for proving our point.

You redefine marriage, you render it meaningless. God of light, hear our cry, send the fire. It's the Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural and spiritual revolution.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Friends, we're on the front lines. We've been shouting out warnings for years about where the society is going.

The others have lifted their voices. Society mocks us. You're crazy. It's never going to happen. It's never going to go in that direction, and then it does. We see it go in that very direction, and when it does, people are like, what's the big deal? The thing that seemed extreme, they become desensitized.

The thing that seemed so impossible, like no big deal. That's how things change for the worse. We become desensitized by God's grace.

I'm going to continue to stand on the wall and shout out warnings so that we do not become desensitized. We love those we differ with. We love our ideological opponents. We want God's best for them. We don't curse them.

We seek to help them and serve them, but we do not support an agenda in the direction that we believe is ultimately wrong and destructive for the country. Michael Brown, thanks for joining us on the broadcast 866-34-TRUTH. I'll be going to the phones shortly. If you have been with us the entire hour, we just played a video about 10 minutes long where I show how the thing Stephen Colbert was mocking all these weddings that are allegedly going to happen if you change the definition of marriage, and it's going to open up the floodgates. Ha, ha, ha. Well, it happened. It has opened up the floodgates. Things are being redefined. That video is back in 2015. It was six years ago. We posted an audio message I preached in 2007 called The War is On, meaning this ideological war. The War is On. 2007 we've been warning about many of these things, and years before that, and there were many years before me who had the insight to see what was coming. So you say, well, what brought things up now? Why are you talking about the throuples now? Okay, look at this picture and this headline on the New York Post. Take a look at this. Gay polythruple makes history, lists three dads on a birth certificate.

That's just from a few days ago. Gay polythruple makes history, listing three dads on a birth certificate, and there's a picture of the three men and the little girl, the races. So the girl, who by the choice of the dads, gets raised without her father. They brought her into this world. They probably dote over her and love her and all this, but she's raised by three men. She's raised without a father. And the article says, hey, now that she's in school, she's a few years old, she's like six years old, she says, well, you just have two parents.

I have three. Hey, one at four, one at five, more the merrier, right? I'm not saying these guys aren't sincere. I'm saying 100% sure God has a better way than for her to be raised by three dads. And God has a better plan than for these three men to be together. And why is this in the news that the thing actually happened a few years ago where they got their names on the birth certificate. So with three fathers, but they have a book that's just come out and they tell their story and look at the title of this book. It's presented like this, this beautiful, wonderful thing here. Three dads and a baby adventures in modern parenting.

Three dads and a baby. Friends this is why we've been sounding the alarm. Now before I go to the phones, I want to share something with you. This is from my book, A Queer Thing Happened to America, almost 700 pages, 1500 endnotes. We are looking to put out a new updated edition where I give some reflections after each of the chapters. It's going to be a little while before that happens. Otherwise we have to reprint the book because the first printing was generous printing, a good size printing, and it's sold out. And then the ebook, we have to get put back up. So right now it's kind of a collector's item. But here's the preface from 2011.

Okay, are you ready? This is 2011 I wrote this, 10 years ago. An Associated Press article published in October 2003 noted that the word queer, which originally was a synonym for odd or unusual, involved into an anti-gay insult in the last century only to be reclaimed by defiant gay and lesbian activists who chanted, we're here, we're queer, get used to it. Today, however, queer is sneaking into the mainstream and taking on a hipster edge as a way to describe any sexual orientation beyond straight.

That was 2003 that I'm quoting from. Indeed queer has become so mainstream, I write in the preface, that not only was the Queer Eye for the Straight Guy TV show a big hit, but in June 2005, the gay stars of the talk show actually threw out the opening pitch of a Boston Red Sox game. Talk about a cultural shift, and it is a shift that is affecting virtually every area of American society. And October 2006, note the date friends, 2006, 15 years ago, New York City's Metropolitan Transit Authority legalized the use of the ladies bathrooms for men who identified as women and vice versa with one article running the headline, be careful ladies, it's his bathroom too. In San Francisco schools, a boy who identifies as a girl can use the girl's bathroom and locker room, while the New York Times reported December 2006, that at the Park Day School in Oakland, California, teachers are taught a gender neutral vocabulary and are urged to line up students by sneaker color rather than by gender. And Charlotte, North Carolina, preschool teacher shared with me that she was not allowed to address the children as boys and girls since that would be making a gender distinction instead she had to call them friends. I'm calling from 2006, 2007, August 16, 2010, Newsweek asked the question, are we facing a genderless future? When your earlier Newsweek featured a major article on relationships with multiple mutually consenting partners, the article entitled, Polyamory, the Next Sexual Revolution stated, it's enough to make any monogamous head spin, but the traditionalists had better get used to it.

And just two years before that, 2007, Time Magazine raised the question, should incest be legal? Okay. Enough said. Friends, the point is, we were warning about these things 10 years ago, talking about what was happening three, four, five years before that, and we warned about many other things that were coming. We're told, you're crazy, man. Brian, you're just some bigoted religious fanatic, this is never going to happen. You're just all in your own perverse fantasies.

You have all these weird ideas. That's what we get told. We get slammed. Here, think of this. We warn about the changes that are coming and things that are destructive that are coming and things that are contrary to God's design and plan, and we're told we're the ones that are perverse and wrong, and we're crazy.

And then when they begin to happen in the society, when they begin to become the norm, what are we told? What's the big deal? What are you getting all worked up about? Why are you so upset? So friends, we are not going to stop telling you.

We told you this was coming. And the key thing is, do not accept this as the new normal. Do not accept this as the new normal. Refuse to say, well, this is just the way it's going to be. Love people, respect people, be gracious to people, treat children in same sex homes the way you treat anyone else. That same sex relationship neighbors or trans neighbor, you'd be the best neighbor you know how to be. Co-workers treat everyone fairly in a nondiscriminatory way within the context of what's good and best for the job situation, right?

You treat everyone the same in that regard. We demonstrate the love of Jesus to all human beings, and we say we don't accept this. We don't believe that this throuple, these three men should be raising the dog. We don't agree with that.

We don't agree that a boy who identifies as a girl should compete in sports with girls. We don't agree with that. We do not accept a new normal, and we want to model for you God's better way. And we want to offer you hope and new life through the gospel.

And we stand our ground, even if it's unpopular, even if we get mocked, we get ridiculed, we stand our ground. 866-3-4-TRUTH. With that, we go to the phones.

We'll start with Robert in Atascadero, California. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Hello, Dr. Brown. Hey. First, I just wanted to say, just thank you for your teaching. I witness a lot in a traditional Jewish chat room, and I'm not Jewish and I'm not a messianic. I'm just a regular Jew. I've learned a lot from you.

They let me stay in there, and I've been able to for about three years now, so I just learned a lot. First of all, I wanted to give you just so much appreciation for that. I love you very much, even though I don't know you personally, but we'll see each other in heaven.

But here's my question. If you were going to witness today to, let's say, just a gay person, how would you go about it? Like, you know, I have in the past said it's an abomination to God, that didn't go well or anything, and I had a gay person who did get born again and turned from that lifestyle so you have to love them because they're missing love. I began to witness, like, well, I used to be a drug addict, so I was an addict, and that's one kind of sin, so homosexuality might... So I'm not looking down at you, I'm not where we're at.

Yeah, so let me share some thoughts, Robert, on how I would reach out. The first thing is I want to treat everyone as a fellow human being, in other words, not putting anyone in a special category. We're all human beings, we're all fallen and flawed outside of God's love and grace, we all need a savior.

Every one of us, on our best day, we need a savior. So I'm not putting anyone in a special category to start. Also, I'm not making generalizations. I don't know this person's life, I don't know their background, I don't know how it is that they came to be same-sex attracted, they probably feel like they've been like this all their lives, and even if, in my mind, I think, hey, I could say I was heavily into drugs and God set me free from that, they might be thinking, well, why do I want to be set free?

This is who I am, it's fine, it's beautiful, my relationships are beautiful, my life is fine. So even that, if I say it, could sound like I'm looking down on someone. Even if I say, well, I love the sinner, but I hate the sin, they'll hear, you hate me because this is not what I do, this is who I am.

So I want to have that sensitivity, I don't want to overgeneralize, I want to treat everyone as a fellow human being. But generally speaking, if the person does not bring up homosexuality, I'm not going to bring it up. In other words, I'm going to talk to them like any other human being about the Lord, about sin, about our need to be forgiven, about the purpose of the cross, ask them about their relationship with God, these different things, and then try to lead them to the Lord like I would lead anyone else to the Lord.

If they then say, well, can I do this, or is this okay, or what do I do about it? Then we address it. Now, this is contrary to God's design, this practice is sinful in his sight, gay relationships are wrong in his sight, but I'm telling you, Jesus requires everything from all of us, from every one of us. He says, deny yourself, take up the cross, follow me. We all have to die to self and start living a new life in God. And if you cry out to him for mercy, he'll forgive you and he'll give you a new heart and you'll become a child of God. And then from there we can work on resolving these issues in your life and getting you to a place of living a holy life before the Lord and breaking free from that which is sinful and wrong.

And if I do know the person is gay and that's a big subject, I'll always start with, tell me your story, tell me your story, tell me your background. I want them to know I love them, I care about them, and I want to be sensitive to what they have lived through, then from there I might be better able to reach them with the truth of the gospel. We'll be right back. It's the Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown. Your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Get into the Line of Fire now by calling 866-342.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. Looking at a comment on Facebook, God's revival is exactly what we need, absolutely, absolutely. Friends, just passing laws is not going to change hearts. I'm all for passing laws and I'm all for standing against unrighteous laws, but I recognize that you cannot force the society into morality. You cannot force families to live rightly or individuals to live rightly. And I, from the heart, oppose any attempt to establish a theocratic kingdom on the earth before Jesus returns.

When he returns, he will establish his kingdom. But I utterly oppose the attempt to establish some type of Christian kingdom on the earth where we force people to obey the Bible and go to church or do whatever. Do I stand for righteous laws?

Absolutely. Can we overturn Roe v. Wade? Can we turn back the redefinition of marriage? Can we stand for righteousness in other ways?

Whatever we can do, I'm all for that. But I recognize that the biggest change has to come from the heart and that the greatest weapon that God has given the church is the gospel and prayer and the things of the Spirit. So if we will give ourselves to God, if we will pray and repent of our sins, if we will clean our house, friends, the reason that the world, society around us has lost the definition of marriage is because Christians for so many years trashed the definition of marriage and because we have no fault divorce in the church.

What a detestable, horrible thing, contrary to God's heart. And for those of you who are the victims of divorce and trying to rebuild your lives, may God help you and be gracious to you. But the idea we're incompatible, we just get divorced and doing that in the church. So we've hurt the meaning of marriage.

It's no surprise that society has lost the meaning of marriage. As we repent of our sins and turn to God and as God brings fresh revival into our midst, life can then spill over and touch the world around us. That's how change can come.

But as we pray for those things, we also stand our ground and refuse to accept the new normal when that new normal is contrary to God's normal. I want to share a few other things we told you were coming in my book, A Queer Thing Happened to America, which again came out in 2011 and represented research I did over about a six-year period leading up to the publication of that book in March of 2011. Before that, let's go back to the phones, and we go to Kai in Georgetown, South Carolina. Thanks for calling the line of fire. A couple of things you say to her. First of all, I appreciate you actually having me on the phone today.

I love your channel and I love your website as well. And I like with the last guy, you say that we preach the same gospel. That's what I heard. Whether they struggle with adultery, whether they struggle with any sin on a sexuality, it doesn't matter. My question though is, you say that you don't think Christians should set up a sort of government here or a legalistic sort of doing things. My question is though, do you see a time in the near future where Christians are going to be persecuted, possibly even imprisoned, if they say something?

I'm from the United Kingdom originally, and now you've seen some of the street preaching there. You've seen brothers and sisters in Christ arrested because they're labeled as hate speech. That's my fear. So my question is, do you see that, maybe not now, but maybe in a sort of 1984 or a sort of something like that, do you think Christians are going to be imprisoned in the United States for saying things that are going to be labeled as hate speech against LGBT, gay, homosexual, whatever there? Do you think there's going to be a time of that in the future? Yeah, sir, if we don't stand up today and refuse to accept the new normal, absolutely that will happen.

Right now. What would you do now? Yeah, so I'll address that, absolutely, and thank you for the call. And yes, I could tell you didn't have a South Carolina accent.

So number one, let's just look over the border in Canada. Here's a man that right now, his daughter at the age of 13, 14, wanted to start transitioning. The school was all for it, going to put her on hormones, puberty blockers and all this, and then get her ready for sex change surgery. And he, the father, is against it. I think he and his wife may be separated, but he's against it. Go to court over it. The court rules against him. I met the man.

I met the man in 2019 in Canada. The court rules against him. The court says you are not allowed to refer to your daughter as she. You are not allowed to refer to her by her biological name. And in fact, if you do, you could go to jail. And now she's all ready for sex change surgery. It's a horror.

You think of this as a dad. So he's been giving interviews openly, publicly, yes, he could wind up in jail for doing that in Canada. I mentioned here in America, when Kim Davis refused to write a same-sex, quote, marriage certificate, that she was put in jail when the judge ordered her to do it, which she absolutely did not have to do. There were other remedies that she refused to do it. She was put in jail. And there are others who have taken certain stands.

They have lost jobs, friend of mine, lost contracts, simply for views they held to privately once it became publicly known, they lost contracts, jobs, others kicked out of school programs. And in fact, In a Queer Thing Happened to America, written again 10 years ago, is when the book came out. It came out March 14th of 2011, I remember because it was our 35th wedding anniversary.

Now we just celebrated our 45th wedding anniversary. And I have a whole chapter dealing with these very things and people potentially going to jail or cases where people have gone to jail. So Kai, absolutely, if we do not hold our ground, it could be coming. But specifically, as I'm sure is on your mind, the Equality Act, the so-called Equality Act, that strips religious exemptions. So this would clearly say that some of the things we're saying we're doing are illegal. Look, when I posted on Twitter that it's a biological truth that Richard, quote, Rachel Levine, President Biden's nominee for Assistant Secretary of Health and Human Services, is a biological male, I was blocked on Twitter for that. I had to delete the tweet if I wanted to stay on. I thought, you know, I'm going to delete it, but write an article talking about what Twitter did. And the article was live. As soon as the ban lifted on me, that article went live. I said, okay, I'm going to get this message out.

Go ahead and block this. So yes, it has been coming. And if the Equality Act passes, then it could get really bad and people easily could go to jail. And the cost for our faith, so be it. If that's the price of following Jesus, so be it. People are getting killed for the faith around the world, going to jail for doing the right thing is not a big deal.

However, it does not have to happen. So pursuant to your question, I am not trying to have a movement where Christianity or the biblical faith takes over the nation and we force everyone, you must read the Bible, you must go to church, you must do this, you know, God forbid, human theocracy is destructive. However, I will absolutely advocate for righteous laws.

I will absolutely vote for politicians that will do the right thing. I will absolutely stand against these things. And then ultimately, if the government outlaws what we do, then we have to say to the government, with all respect, we can't obey you. We've got to obey God. Hey, my brother, let's continue to stand together so that our kids and grandkids can enjoy the same freedoms and more that we have enjoyed.

I appreciate the call. All right, here, real quickly, real quickly, 2011, the last chapter of A Queer Thing Happened to America. And it was called this, GLBT and Beyond. That's before it switched officially to LGBT, GLBT and Beyond, reflections on our current trajectory.

Remember, this comes out 10 years ago. Here, here are some of the opening quotes from the chapter. In recent years, gender identity has galvanized the queer community, perhaps more than any other issue. The questions go beyond the nature of male or female to a yet-to-be transverse region that lies somewhere between and beyond biologically determined gender. That was from the back cover of the book Genderqueer, Voices Beyond the Sexual Binary.

Hey, that's old news. How about this? A story from the year 2000 in the Village Voice, which is a radically left New York City-based publication, from the Village Voice. We are transgendered men, female to male or F to M, FTM. My boyfriend is the mother of my child. This is a story from June 2000, friends.

How about this? Noel Howie in the book 50 Ways to Support Gay and Lesbian Equality, talking about her father who underwent sex change surgery. For clarity, though, I still refer to her as my dad or my father when talking to other people.

After all, that's who she is, so she is my dad. Then this, quoting from 2005, a report on Canadian transgender activists urged legal protection for gender fluidity, 2005. Sally considers himself a gender outlaw playing outside the traditional definitions of man and woman.

Sally runs his business as a man and has not had sex change surgery, but considers himself a woman. Friends, my heart goes out to the people involved in these stories and these headlines, but bless the new norm, it's been coming for years. What happens is those that do not support it, those that do not uphold it, those that do not applaud it, those that do not celebrate it, are vilified as bigots.

Many people wanting to be accepted, wanting to be liked, not wanting to be befriended, not wanting to lose colleagues at school or at work or whatever, have your family turn against you, will just kind of go along with the new normal, don't, don't. Bless the people, love the people, but stand against the agenda. As we've said for 17 years now, reach out and resist. Reach out to the people with compassion, resist the agenda with courage. Stand, my friends, hearts of compassion, backbones of steel. Let's repent of the sins in our lives, let's look to God for a fresh move of the Spirit. We need a visitation, friends, to turn the tide. Let's repay the