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Janet - Mefferd - Today - William Edgar (Cultural Influence) Charles Ware (Racism)

Janet Mefferd / Janet Mefferd
The Truth Network Radio
February 15, 2021 4:30 am

Janet - Mefferd - Today - William Edgar (Cultural Influence) Charles Ware (Racism)

Janet Mefferd / Janet Mefferd

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February 15, 2021 4:30 am

Christians are to be salt and light, but how much mixing with the world are we really called to do? Dr. William Edgar joins me to talk about it and his book, "Created and Creating: A Biblical Theology of Culture." Plus: Darwinian evolution rests on a racist premise, so what does the Bible have to say about human beings created in His image? I'll talk it over with Dr. Charles Ware, president of Crossroads Bible College and author of "One Race One Blood." That's next time on Monday's JANET MEFFERD TODAY.

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I sort will and secular worldviews and how those worldviews play out in society. But there are also Christians who advocate giving up on the culture wars, especially as we see the biblical worldview in retreat in the West. Instead, they say we should hunker down. We should just wait for Jesus to return because these are certainly the last days. So which approach is right that question actually is older than many of us may imagine, as Christians have struggled with our place and culture for a very long time. What does the Bible have to say about it though, and how should the church approach the culture that's what were in a tackle today with Dr. William Agre. He is professor of apologetics at Westminster theological seminary in Philadelphia and author of the book will be talking about created and creating a biblical theology of culture, and so great to have your doctor Agre welcome the review here in this kind of the perennial question, isn't it what we do is Christians about culture. How do we approach that question. Where do we begin your well it is one that was ruffled with by old authors and then the early church was ruffled through the Middle Ages and up to the present place to begin understanding what culture is. Before we decide what our posture should be no bit about what it is were talking about Sir right what would you see the best definition of culture would be, would it be synonymous with the world.

Or is it just how we live, what, how would you define it.

Right now I don't actually think it is a world.


Of course, sometimes because culture can go bad from time the word world mean a conspiracy against God.

Sometimes it can be good because sometimes the world mean God's creation, but different fake. I go back to Genesis 120 and sometimes called the cultural mandate. I believe the facet is the primary calling of the human one is that it is a blessing in God's covenant with tied up with worship to be food for multiply, which means much more than just children and third rule over the creation with what I call a benevolent Lordship of the ingredients I think can be found not only in the original mandate throughout Scripture and culminated in the that's really great. So when you look at those three steps. When you talk about the blessing in God's covenant of the cultural mandate.

What exactly does that mean in practical terms. Well first of all of the Lord God several times and he is our God and we are you know that everything to shower and love, plainly become his only begotten son who gave his life the rent money so the covenant is a biblical way, legal way of saying the legal bond between God and mankind. The bond that God has initiated and that he keep by character, but it's also bond which requires our faith and obedience right so the other facets of that cultural mandate involves being fruitful and multiplying and I thought that was interesting that you mention that goes beyond childbearing. How so well it does include populating the earth beyond the garden, but it also means multiplying art talent multiplying. Our abilities are gifts.

One of the primary meaning of the word culture is actually called probation and to be food for multiply requires going throughout the earth and cultivating the goodness of potential men metaphorically. I think it also mean the possibility of the art of creation creativity.

The all, the whole ritual realm of multiplying in the best sense of that word. So where I put it is actually the word culture is related to the word for colonization, which we usually think of is a negative term, but in the Bible.

Colonization means to populate a part of the world for the purpose of of eliciting it potential if gifts all the great things God is hidden in the creation process to discover so far I think it goes beyond just having children serves course right and then the ruling over creation part. This is something that sometimes becomes a little bit controversial. To what extent we rule over creation and even in our own day people will say is it the job of the Christian to take over the institutions of a culture to claim it for God's kingdom highly come down on that issue. Very good question. It is possible to rule over the creation in a kind of cool way that respect God or the norms of creation and you see that in Pyrenees and dictatorship and people who world mindlessly. But it's also possible to rule in the building in a benevolent way in a way that is what I call gentle Lordship. So as we aim the world as we cultivate the soil and we raise animals and as we create in the world of the arts. These are all different ways of of ruling because God created mankind in order art to be his vice chairman on the earth to have authority over over the earth.

That's why he made mankind in so you can do it badly, but that should throw out the bathwater. We should all well yes yes absolutely. So when you see some of these movements in our own days saying were in the last days. Let's all just retreats the culture is going to pot.

There's nothing we can do about it.

Give up and wait for Jesus to return. You see that way of thinking. When you look at Scripture and and what does the word of God have to say about that particular position. Somebody once called it polishing the brass on the Titanic. Well, couple things that are deeply wrong with her throat. Because we do have God cultural mandate not limited to one timeframe of all I think it lack low.

It is a way of saying well I don't care about where the world going going to pop. Why should I be involved. FSU lack of compassion much in the culture that needs help in redeeming and loving attention. And third, it's an old view that is not very different or more, your defining your piety as just protecting yourself against all comers of the guy who, instead of investing buried his talent in the ground on at least those those three bases. The profoundly disturbing point of view is understandable when you live in a culture with fearful element and many generations of the last phase and they were wrong that we might get it right. I'm not saying we don't know but none in the first millennial train died 10th century allowed that all thousand years that the end is going to go and come month Martin Luther honestly thought these were the last days that open Antichrist and church was corrupt and it was just fewer forms before the end of 500 years ago. So right. Things are bad for sure.

There is a much worse they are and maybe that's right.

What you just a moment were going to go to a break. Dr. Willie met with us created in creating a physical theology of culture, his pocket will come back right after this, this is Janet Mefford and I'm joined today by Matt Ballis with liberty help share a national nonprofit healthcare sharing ministry is what liberty healthcare is all about liberty. Healthcare is a network of men women and children all across the country who voluntarily share medical bills with one another and we do so without the advantage of any kind of government program or third-party insurance where voluntarily sharing medical bills with one another what you would normally to do with people whenever you have a situation that was unexpected and unaffordable. Your friends and family and community that you would turn to salt were a group of people share each other's medical bills with one another is liberty healthcare respect your conscience as a Christian will. As Christians, we are very much pro-life and as an organization we respect that as well so you can be rest assured that if you are a part of liberty, healthcare, none of your sure about are going towards things that would violate your conscience, so we would never contribute or share money in something that would result in the end about abortion or go towards an abortifacient drug that's not who we are at all because we know that's not you are at all is liberty healthcare affordable. A lot of people seem to think so. That's a big part of what what were about you, but if you moral at expense or to have backdoor pricing on a lot of healthcare bills and fill with liberty healthcare.

We've done all that we can do to make the Christian tradition of healthcare sharing available and affordable to all. Thanks Matt more information about liberty healthcare is that's liberty or their phone number is 855-585-4237 that's 855-585-4237 your listening content effort today talking about a biblical theology of culture, said in the world and not of it. To what extent should we be in the world. This is an age-old rest and that we are exploring with Dr. William Edgar, author of created and creating his professor of apologetics at Westminster theological seminary in Philadelphia so we can about the last days. Kind of in line with this idea that a four in the last days. To what extent should we really be involved in culture because it's almost over, and you rightly pointed out Dr. Egger. This is been a common theme in a Luther thought it was the last days, even going back to the apostles. They thought it was basically we were in the last days and yet they behave very differently. That's what I find so striking those who would say Jesus is about to come back. We ought to just sit here and wait for them. That's polar opposite from what the apostles did. They got out there and preach the gospel. Why the difference in approach would you say among people who believe the end is almost here and I think the last day and time represented the whole era between Christ coming coming in and so while some of them gave the impression that it could be right away that they knew that there was no timetable that we were given and also the mandate that we've been talking about in the New Testament is intensified in the great commission, which is a commandment for us to go and make disciples of the nation. That commandment doesn't stop its effectiveness until Jesus returns. And remember, he told us in the all of it. This course that the gospel must be preached to the nation between the gospel of the kingdom will be preached and then the end will come. Yes, so we don't know if that means literally every single pocket of the earth will hear the gospel and were amazed at how many places but you know the mandate to go and preach and to make the cycle is in full form until interrupted with coming. That's why the apostles were so so the they believed in God compassionately believed patient know that the time is over now called everyone there was an urgency there. Which I think the church desperately needs to cultivate definitely what you look at the high priestly prayer in John 17, where Jesus is praying for his disciples and he says in verse 15. My prayer is not that you take them out of the world, meaning praying to his father, but that you protect them from the evil one.

They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. What is it mean to not be of the world. I guess this is another question. A lot of Christians have wrestled with what is the line between being salt and light in the culture and being worldly very very important issue. Well being of the world and also John teaches gospel and having your your primary commitment and ate them. That is conspiring against God.

That's what he said keep your cell phone will and a friend of the world is not a friend of God.

They are not is nothing that you should leave the creation you should jump out of this earth and live on the cloud or live in a commune that the world in which Jesus is speaking world of which he speaking in that particular context is an evil place anything God don't let them be members of that group, but keep them in the world. My creation so that they can do my work and pray in this. A lot of people need to hear the gospel of the sheep that haven't come in yet and so on so that eventually constantly have to live with and there's no book of rules about you know how to do this course, there are guidelines. Should I go to a certain movie should go join a political party. Should I become an artist or an actor maneuver very important questions of calling and each person has to ask the question, am I following God's way in the calling or am I just drawn into the self-aggrandizement or some idle that I've always wanted to worship the question the wisdom of much of the rulebook that's excellent know I think you're totally right about that.

So here we are in in a very turbulent time, politically speaking, and I'm not speaking specifically about the politics of it all, but kind of the situation at all, where you have some saying well. As Christians we really need to be active in politics to try to restore some common sense morally and socially speaking to our culture and other people say that these culture wars haven't worked. We have a secular mindset, primarily in America now hear you're wasting your time. What you really ought only do is preach the gospel, and not also be involved in politics you see Scripture speaking to that issue. I believe the Lord older culture war model which seemed only to side.

The white at the blackout as long as I can force an issue to politics. You know, maybe education that I'm going to help the white at the whim and it's a winner take all situation model is, of course, is a battle raging warfare, but it's not between two easily identifiable by many different levels. So it's within family. It's in political structures it all condo levels in the scientific community is an education and each of us has a responsibility to be Christian in their sphere of some of the call to the ministry with a main job is to preach the gospel. Most Christians are not called directly into the ministry there called business people or find a mom and dad and the warfare that needs to be fought there is one of of being obedient and that fear, hoping to turn things around. Maybe in a modest way. But if enough people did it. They would take maybe that was made in the late 70s and 80s with the think okay just got a conservative president working on and the trouble is, it's so whole lot more complicated than that of the world. Politics is not about winning and losing is about getting deeply involved with the art of public policy and all of that Hon. wanted well to the place of that is a place for the Christian artists of the place for the Christian farmer we ought to be working in every level of life to the there can't be transformation and some degree of change.

It is has been done in history can be done. It can be done again.

Well you look back to the Reformation 500 years ago and this was all about the gospel and about the recovery of justification by faith alone and look at what happened, culturally speaking out of that, the recovery of the gospel led to an incredible spread of Christian hospitals in Christian education over time spreading to Europe, eventually landing in the United States when you look back at that time. What do you think that time. Could teach us about what we ought to be doing now you really good example. I think that they got the balance right between the gospel proclamation in the gospel of transformation, which is of the proclamation so you know we mentioned Martin Luther earlier, he rediscovered the gospel by reading Romans, among other things, that it was a free gift earned and he said the gates of heaven were opened to the then as he preached. He also insisted that this gospel affect every area of life so almost single headways. He changed the structure of the family converted much of Germany from being a celibate culture to being a family culture fostered economic reforms and wasn't perfect. He didn't do everything right, but I think what I admire about these incredible performances of faith all the relation between the proclamation of the transformation in ways that can greatly in our day. That's great yeah absolutely right.

And it's interesting in our own day when were coming up on the 500th anniversary of the Reformation that there is no people are arguing with one another about is it preaching the gospel, or is it being active in the culture does it really have to be one or the other. No, I think it has to be both. You truncate them you'll have a really one-sided approach to my former colleague, you know, it's like the body and soul. If your soul only Christian what are you while your ago Europe body only Christian what are you your court so if you're if you're preaching the gospel in the narrowest way by just repeating the word go. It's not incarnate. If you transfer form the gospel into pure social action, and nothing but that will end up with the course because it's not a lot yeah I think to answer your question directly don't have to choose you have to do both in a biblically balanced way.

Yes, that's well Simon, remember that particular analogy because I think that's fantastic. What would you say is our ultimate objective in being culturally get engaged. Is it fulfilling the great commission merely, or more than that, you know, in my understanding the glory of God. Fellowship with God is the primary reason we do anything and course the great commission central to our obedient as our social justice mentioned but if we take away that first covenant relationship, you know, we from loss means is all about reconciliation with God and God the Lord is one that said Dr. William Edgar created in creating his butt thank you so much Dr. enter this archived broadcast of Janet Mefford today is brought to you by pre-born for $140 you can provide ultrasounds to five women in crisis pregnancies.

Call now 855402, baby. That's 855-402-2229 or Janet Janet Mefford today and here's your host Janet Mefford today. There has been a lot of talk as you know over the last few years on the subject of racism, ranging from legitimate concerns about prejudging others based on their skin color to spurious and often unfounded charges of discrimination against or disliking somebody just because of their race. But what has been largely overlooked is the fact that the premise of Darwinian evolution has been deeply rooted in the worst racist ideology since its inception, and it affects us all. Even today, how do we think about this issue biblically. That is our subject today with Dr. H Charles where he is president of Crossroads Bible college and has spearheaded many multicultural ministry conferences along with serving on the race relations advisory team for the Hudson Institute and is co-author with Ken ham of the book one race, one blood, a biblical answer to racism and it's so good to welcome your doctor where thanks for being with us to be with you today. It's my pleasure to have you here. I think this is such a great buck because you make so many good points and I'm wondering first of all what you make in light of the book that you've written here on the issue of race and how it's kind of exploding in the last two years. How do you think this is being handled as an issue right now in our country well you Janet. I was saved in 1968 that was Martin Luther King Jr. assessment Robert Kennedy doing that year and and we were really at a height of some racial tensions and divisions very deep, very troubling throughout our cities and so I began to think about that at that particular time and wind up going to Bible college got saved in March Bible college in August. Family white school and you know I began to think this thing through biblically and that's where I am today. You know what the Bible has to say and I think that the way we are handling it as a nation we do not have the biblical foundation, which is people have dignity because they were created in the image of God. That's regardless of their skin color. That's regardless of their physical or intellectual ability it regardless of whether their aunt and or out of the womb. They have dignity because they were created in the image of God, and it should be a more and off them and us, and I find so much of the discussion is with them once I've got a Windows I've got to lose rather than for loss. From what I think a biblical perspective would be well and it's so ironic because we all ultimately came from, and your arguing in this book here that ultimately we are one race. So how was it that we got divided like this. What role did Darwin plan all that well you know it actually started before Darwin started in Genesis with sin yes because they racism you don't think that your superior to somebody if is a manifestation of sin.

That's why Cain killed his brother Abel, but Darwinian is what it did was give people a rational reason for believing that there was in the survival of the fittest and natural selection that there was one race superior to others and I remember being in high school and then watching the. The evolutionary concept you know from apes to maybe it was aborigines of Australia or or or Nick grows and you call up that ladder and then you get the whites who were this the supreme race and that gives some rationality to yell their superior races in their lower races and person can jump from that to the dignity of life that some people have more right to life than others and and so that banking gives a logical premise, although some people would reject it, but a history as you say you got Hitler.

He went to the whole eugenics argument for the superiority of the German race and their thereby justified the Lawler and killing of Jews and many others. Horrible. I recognized that the subtitle of the origin of species was the preservation of favored races in the struggle for life and that was interesting somehow that escaped my attention, but that seems quite significant because it that's your starting premise that their favorite races. Then of course that would ultimately bring fruit forth that would divide people yeah and and categorize them. You know what makes your favorite what would make you favorite your strawberry are you smarter or wiser, and therefore you got people thinking that they are superior just simply because of the color scanner to ethnicity and gives them a right to the value others who are weaker and in the lore only whole of significance. Yeah well I know one of the things in the book. Also that's brought up is that the Jim Crow laws. For example, were really fueled by evolutionary ideas. How was that the case well I mean there's something written.

It says that that didn't even have souls sitting up to preach the gospel because they were somewhere in between the eight and man and you don't pass laws in this country that you know that that took so many Blacks the equal one vote. And of course it was a law passed that wheelbase was that one brought 1/8 of sub-Saharan African blood. Make sure African and that's where will people know how come.

President Barack Obama is considered by mean his mother was white. Well, you know, we set up those type of laws and and by the way, the so-called mixed-race persons put down what we call the lower class because the white was the superior class and and so if there's mix your blood well you can't be why you mean you have a black or Latino. If you think you can't be like that, based upon that evolutionary thinking of the superiority of the white race. That's right will know when you're answering those sorts of issues. Biblically speaking, where you begin because as you mentioned in the beginning of Genesis. That's where our problems began. But when you're talking about racial reconciliation or racism and and the solution for some of these problems. How do you go about debunking evolutionary theories impact on race and how the Bible speaks to the issue. What I think you have a biblical worldview and what I tell people I like to talk about grace relations, not race relations a lot because grace covers everything you know I was only cocksure once in a white supreme is called Landon he wouldn't talk to me talk to the host of the show and he said that we know where Adam came from heaven, came from white people. We don't even know would like people came from. So what are your gifts have to say about that. So I just responded in Romans five, the Bible makes it clear that that wherefores by one man that was Adam's sin in the world of the Bruce and the only white people came from Adam only likable spammers and the like that, but grace of God tells us we did all come from one of many and we have a common problem that is sin and there is a common answer.

His name is Jesus Christ, then we are saved by the grace of God with conflict adopted into the family of God were brothers and sisters in Christ, and we can grow together and we look forward to a perfect environment when Christ returns and take us to heaven.

But right now we fight things like jealousy and pride. It could be over. Race and ethnicity stick built football teams are but that that that thing in us is a manifestation of our fallenness in the grace of God transforms us and unites us for the glory of God around this word, so I try to talk Christian simply let the church be an alternative to the division and despair that we see in the world. That's what would you say is the biggest hurdle toward racial reconciliation made a biggest hurdle is history, especially in the US you got so much is use were talked about back from Jim Crow go beyond that segregation to slavery so much laws and injustice and some of that indefinitely even plan out today still in and we need to give it a good grip on my history and again the grace of God allows me to admit failures and sand without throwing everything away right I mean is I read the Bible, God's great leaders fail. David failed, you know, Solomon Phil, Moses, Phil, but the grace of God restored most of them and they went on ministering to God's hand so I don't need a perfect America. What I need is a repentant America realigning herself with true biblical principles and I think that's the way we got a packet else we just all direct pass one another. We can have a conversation because the way I see it the way you see it totally different. You call me a name I call you name it was also our separate ways yeah which doesn't solve anything to connect to discuss with Dr. Charles where one race, one blood, a biblical answer to racism. There's a lot more to discuss with us for today is proud to partner with pre-born to help save babies lives hi this is Dan Steiner, president freeborn, and I want to send a big thank you for standing for life to you because of listeners like you in 2020 pre-born sponsored over 45,000 free ultrasound sessions to women in need saved over 31,000 babies and prayed with over 6500 women to receive Jesus Christ as their Lord. The battle rages on in 2021 at an even greater level, and our goal is to give Planned Parenthood the biggest competition ever. We can join us in saving babies lives.

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That's 855402 baby 855-402-2229 or there's a banner to you're listening to Janet Mefford today and now here's for today. My guest is Dr. a Charles where he is president of Crossroads Bible college and co-author of one race, one blood, a biblical answer to racism and such an important thing to talk about. We always need to go back to the word of God to figure out any problem that comes up in this is a big one.

We've had a lot of discussions and a lot of upheaval over the issue of race in the last several years and you don't. Dr. Ware, one of the things that I have often heard people remark upon is that it seems some people don't want to solve the problem and and that would not just be in one camp but on a lot a lot camps of all races. They say it is the issue of talking about racism is a way to continually say that America is a bad country or certain people are bad people, what about the endless discussion on race. Why do you think that for some sectors. They just don't seem to want to solve it. It just seems to be at perennial complaint that gives an excuse to kind of got upset everybody. And this is how many people view it well you speak for other people to me all the figures pride in our hearts is jealousy in our hearts all kinds of things that can make us partisan our perceptions could be different but but what I like to say and this is the church and wait for the country to unite the church and began to remake great based upon biblical principles and I tell people I don't need everybody. I just need some people who are willing to take grace relation seriously and then we began to model for the watching community what it should look like Jesus said.

By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, and that you have love one for another.

Glad here Crossroads Bible, we got predominately African-American about 51%, but then we got a growing number of Shen people from Burma. They probably make about 15% or more and then we got great number white and I'm trying to teach our students. You are future leaders.

You need to relate to one another biblically and make the house of God, a safe place for the people of God regardless of their economic background.

Don't let the world drive your agenda. Let the word do it.

That's awesome. What steps would you say need to be taken in the church. Where do we begin to really try to heal and bring about racial reconciliation in the body of Christ. I think first of all we need to review our own hearts yell just before God, whereby some people been hurt been falsely accused. Some people been mistreated on me that there number of things that can cause us to harden our hearts, we need to look for the heart of Christ and humility, then we need to establish relationships with people across technical lines and learn to listen to them listen to where they were bought out what their family was like what their experience was like just get to know them as friends and and and then as we work in growing the word of God didn't Stumble hard discussions what your of your black lives matter what your view on white lies matter what you you lies about what you all lives in biblically.

She is almost like a marriage will reason we can get together is because were so different. We see things different and I tell him the most. Two different people on planet Earth went women and men told him to get married. I love that I love had some work these things together.

It is heartening when I see some strength who bonds that will not be broken. The news media they grief want might not understand one another. Grief want to pray for one another pull one of the biblical perspectives and encourage one another and their unity is not destroyed, but only strengthen as these different media reports comes up so explosive and and often so divisive what you think about what the Bible says that were all one in Christ Jesus you have doing in Greek and Gentile, and you know this is something that I think needs to have more really more attention in the pulpits, don't you think to say regardless of your background, regardless what you look like or your family or what have you. We have sent in common and we have God's grace in common and so but I mean even on the same question to start by saying were all sinners know we are all sinners and we all have stuff to repent of and we all have stuff to forget each other for Christ really needs to be central in this discussion, it would seem beautiful at the whole book this Jew and Gentile are one made one through Christ in chapters 2 and three are that very strongly and it's prayed for in chapter 3 in Ephesians 4 when it talks about equipping the saints to do the work of the ministry is this thoughts offer that it will what worthy of our calling in all lowliness and and that's humility and and and forgiving one another for bear, one of the love just like you said so.

The leaders are teaching, equipping the saints to do the ministry that ministry, I believe, has a lot to do with us working together across picnic Grau picnic areas to carry out the work of Christ.

So, the pulpit is the place were given the biblical view and some passes that I don't want talk about you know those two disturbing but then I feel what you do is you leave your people to the philosophy of the world and steer if you don't given the word somebody is going to fill it blank in form so we need a biblical worldview and that comes from our pulpits and need to be practice in the pews.

Well, when you look at what unites us as Christians that were all one in Christ Jesus can be a model for the world. It seems to me that that would be a really healing saying in many respects, or at least a great witness to the world that yes we have differences, but look how Christ unites people.

I mean, that's something I think that ought to be talked about you] John 13 by this.

All people should know your my disciples by your loved one from other Ephesians 3 said that this is a mystery Jew and Gentile, Ben Wallace, a mystery hidden in the Old Testament, but now it's to be a manifestation of the of the manifold wisdom of God through the church and that I often tell people this is our chance to shine. We can't just curse the darkness. We must be salt and light and so with you all the way.

That's what we strive for here Crossroads Bible college. That's what I teach and preach omen workshops on the people of God, let us come together and not just curse the darkness, but the Bible says, how should first Peter two. How should we respond when we are falsely accused in a cell manner of evil against us with some of them through our good works. So when societies cause bigots, haters and all that we silence them not cursing them by demonstrating through our good works that were different and in that, as you just said beautifully. The church needs to demonstrate that our relationships will write and going back to Darwin and the influence that Darwin has had on our culture and how we think about race.

What about addressing that issue with people whenever we hear race cited in the differences in this and that to say do you really understand where a lot of this racial division came from that.

This is a worldview that has been handed down to us getting the world like we all will write you before Darwin, and it certainly was, but Darwin gave a rational mail. Darwin gave a scientific platform put it together so it made sense and I would say one of the great application so that they even beyond just the race question would be the abortion issue. Yes, we do not value what we we talk about aborting people at the last turn and and and with all the technology we got today and what we know about a child in the womb. That is just totally unbelievable. But we have devalued that life is not life it's something it's it's methods on the woman. It is not life your windows it become life well. As Christians we say that life because created an image of God. At the moment of conception and and that gives it value the naturalistic Darwinistic view you well I guess we don't know when this life, so on and so forth. So yeah, I think that is great application not only in the division that we have to banded them enough and I'm better than you, but I think to me abortion cries out loudly, we got perverted view of humanity, absolutely. And when you see that the race racist and eugenics history of Margaret Sanger. Yeah, the founder of Planned Parenthood and how she deliberately wanted to target minorities for extinction. It's disgusting it's and people need to know this, that it's not just happening in a vacuum, there's actually an ideology behind it and I you know I really like one of the things you got a great appendix in the book about misconceptions or mistakes about reconciliation and one of the things that's in here is believing that race is a scientific fact. I really like that.

That's where all from Adam.

Ultimately, all created by God, all designing God's image were all loved by God and his grace is extended to all creation. We have much more in common than we do. The patient that is so true and something to rejoice in it, and I have a universal Christian University want me to speak on black history and a accretion white Christian University.

I told him I won't speak on Christian history. A Christian University you got that is beautiful. I love that while a great dog and so nice can't enter a Charles Ware with us. Dr. Ware, thank you for joining us. It was really a delight to have you got bless you to thank you again and thanks for listening to Janet for

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