De-Cluttering Our Hearts

So what's the most cluttered room in our house? Oh, no doubt, our attic. There's a lost city in our attic. I'm surprised it hasn't fallen into our garage. There's so much weight up there.

You know, you just keep adding. And it's all your fault. Welcome to Family Life Today, where we want to help you pursue the relationships that matter most. I'm Ann Wilson.

And I'm Dave Wilson. And you can find us at familylifetoday.com or on our Family Life app. This is Family Life Today. Our house wouldn't be cluttered at all if I didn't have kids, if I didn't have a dog, without a husband, but I'd be lonely.

It'd be clean and lonely. It is my fault. No, it's not. And I can't even find anything up there. We were up there the other day, and I need to find that booster seat. I looked for an hour, finally said, it's not up there.

We got rid of it. She goes up and finds it in 30 seconds. And it was right at the top of the steps.

As I said, it's the lost city. And our grandkids came to visit us at Christmas. And the first thing they wanted to do was they said, our dad told us all about your attic. It was the best part of Christmas that they had. See?

Yeah, I guess there's some use for it. So hey, today we got Ron Deal on the show. Ron is from our Family Life blended ministry.

It's an amazing ministry. Ron's an amazing guy. I love having you here. Ron, welcome back to Family Life Today. Thank you.

It's always good to be here. So why are we talking about cluttered? Well, Kathy Lipp has done a lot of work in helping people declutter their physical space, their home, and declutter their life. Can she come to our house? Is that what she does?

I don't know. If the price is right, I'm sure she could. But it's been fun already hearing her talk about what that looks like.

Yeah, yeah. Decluttering our homes, especially in a blended family. That has complications in itself of bringing two families together and two families cluttered.

For any family, that's true. But then when she gets into the decluttering of our lives, that's when it gets a little sticky. And it's one thing to declutter personally, and that's a little bit what we talked about in the previous program. But today, now we got to talk a little bit about decluttering in connection with others, spouses, children.

What if you have different opinions about what needs to stay, what needs to go? Or what's clutter? Right. Even defining clutter.

Yes. That can be a problem. So here's Ron Deal's conversation with Kathy Lipp, the author of The Clutter-Free Home. OK, another principle.

You talk about decluttering. Don't argue over stuff. Negotiate space.

Yeah. So I think part of it is, kids, you have your room or your portion of the room, and yes, you get to do with it what you want, but you are still part of a larger unit, the family that has to work together. And so your stuff needs to be contained to your area. But like when we had our kids in the living room with their computers and stuff, I'm like, OK, this is not the fantasy room that I wanted. This is not what I wanted it to be. But this is what we need right now. But this is your space. But I still get to say I need it to look like humans live here.

I need it to look like that we are all working together. So we would have times where they would be working on their individual space, but also times where we had to come together as a family and pull together. And some of that was common spaces.

Some of that was big chores and things like that. And can I just tell you, I've made every mistake in the book. I've done everything wrong as a step-parent, and I love that God gives us grace and sometimes a covering in all of that.

Because we have kids who like to work hard and like to have spaces that are neat and pulled together, but they also know how to work with other human beings. And so that makes me super proud, even in all of my failings. You know, the word negotiate in all of that is so important. It's everybody gets a voice and we listen to one another and we try to figure out how to meet in the middle. And sometimes I give a lot. Sometimes I just compromise a little. And over the course of time in a family, we all hopefully do a little of that. I think with kids, negotiating space is really metaphorical. Like it's not just my bedroom, but now I'm sharing a bedroom with another half-sibling or step-sibling. And so what's mine?

Have I lost control of everything in my life, in my world? I don't even get a closet or a space or a drawer. They need something that is theirs. That speaks to their belonging, that they matter, that they haven't lost control of everything in their world. It's not just about space. It is about more of that sense of control and belonging. Right. And also, if we want to grow responsible kids, they need to have something that is theirs to care for. And so, yeah, it's all of that together. And it's that identity to say that, yeah, I'm part of this family that even I don't understand sometimes, but who I am in that matters.

It matters not just to my parent of origin, but also to my other person that in some ways they can feel like they've been forced to live with. But there's a way to honor that and to say everybody in this matters. And we also work together as a team, but we also respect each other as individuals.

Let's talk about one more principle you talk about in your book, The Clutter-Free Home. Things are not relationships. The idea that we would hold on to something, is that kind of back to that guilt thing you were talking about?

Right, right. And so to say, I'm only keeping this because it represents the relationship. Like when my grandmother passed away, there were thousands of things that I could have kept. But at this point now, she's been gone quite a while, but I've kind of narrowed that down to three things where it doesn't represent her, but it represents my memories and my relationship with her. And that makes me happy. But I also know if I lost all of those things, I would still have my grandmother. She is not in those things.

I do look at them and they make me happy, but I also know that that is not where she is. And when we're talking about blended families, I know that for years, when it came to Christmas and birthdays, I was making up for them being in a blended family. We were overbuying, overspending, over-celebrating, and I may have had a little competition going on with their mom. It was my own need to be loved and accepted by these very important people in my life who I felt so much rejection from. And when I could finally kind of calm down and say, the stuff doesn't represent our love.

It just doesn't. When I finally had to get to the place of this is going to take years. This is not going to happen overnight. This is going to take years. Roger and I kept on telling each other five years.

We've heard from other families that five years can really make a difference. And we got to a point where my stepson would not participate in our wedding. He refused to. He didn't want to be there.

He wouldn't come to our wedding unless his mom came. It's a whole bunch of mess. To the place where he's called me for advice, to the place where he's gotten off the phone with his dad to talk to me to find out how I'm doing, I never thought we would get to that place. So I had to calm down with the stuff and just understand that it takes some time to build into that place.

Well, you have really hit on something that I think is huge. And it's something we talk about a lot here at Family Life Blended in all of our ministry components. The anxiety that we feel about how fast the family is coming together tends to just make adults try to push for more togetherness. And that tends to make children pull back from the togetherness. And now we're working on opposite agendas and we're clashing and creating conflict and relaxing and not letting your anxiety or fear about the family not blending get the best of you.

That's the first step towards saying, you know, it's going to take time and I've got to rest into this and I've just got to do what I can do today and trust that eventually the relationships can progress. It's so true. I was giving my step kids way too much control over how my day was going. And what they needed from me was safety and stability. That's what they needed. They needed safety and stability. They had plenty of people who loved them.

They had plenty of people to care for them. They just needed to know that dinner was going to be on the table at six o'clock. They just needed to know that when I said I was going to pick them up from hockey practice, that I was going to be there. That's what they needed from me in those first years. And so when I could just calm down and not give them the responsibility of how my day was going, things got a lot better. Yeah, that's great.

OK, let me turn the corner and ask another question. So for you and as a step mom, you were the one who kind of kept the clutter, at least in the beginning of your blended family. What if we got somebody listening right now and they are a step parent, step dad or step mom, and they are the only ones who want the house decluttered?

What do they do? Yeah, so this is really important to understand the distinction. Are you doing that because you want your house to be beautiful or do you want it to be functional? Because beautiful, I think, is a great goal, but that doesn't always translate to everybody else in your family. So if you can approach it from we need to function as a family. And when there's a lot of chaos, we can't function as a family. So simple things that are not going to be forcing your stepchild to get rid of their stuffed animal. Let's just be clear.

None of that am I advocating or OK with. But things like when I would drive the kids home from school, one of the things I learned to do is I would have a garbage and recycling bag in our minivan. And I'd say, OK, guys, I want you to unpack your backpacks. If there's any garbage in there, throw it in the garbage bag.

If there's anything that needs to be recycled, put it in the recycling bag. And if you need me to sign a permission slip, if you need me to sign a test that didn't go so well, whatever it is, make me a stack. And I'm going to take those things. I'm going to get into the house. I'm going to sign and do what we need to attach the check.

I don't even know if people use checks anymore. And we're going to put it back into your backpack to put it back into play. So I really believe if you're the one who's arguing for being more clutter free one, you have to set the example. You can't just be upset with everybody else's stuff because everybody else's stuff looks like junk and our stuff looks necessary.

Oh, now you're you've gone to meddling. Exactly. My stuff is not junk.

It is my stuff. Right. Because you know exactly what everything's for, what you're going to use and all of that.

I totally get it. But also understand there is a certain amount of clutter that just comes with life and especially with kids. And so know that this is for a certain time, a certain place. And also, I got to the point in a small bit that I said, I'm not going to have this chaos forever.

And you know what? I kind of want to enjoy while my kids are here, while we get to spend some time together. I want to be able to enjoy this and not be frustrated all the time. So there were certain areas like I could keep my side of the bed perfect, you know, if I wanted to. I keep my bathroom super tidy if I wanted to. I could have standards for the rest of my family that were aspirational.

I would only lose my top about really one thing when I would find clean folded laundry in the hamper. Let's just say, yeah, it wasn't pretty. It wasn't pretty. It wasn't pretty.

You've been listening to Family Life Today and we've been listening to Ron Deal with Kathy Lip about decluttering our homes. And as she was just finishing that talking about how frustrated she was, what were her words, guys? It wasn't pretty. It wasn't pretty.

Why were you laughing at that? Because that drives me crazy when you have folded clean laundry at the bottom of the hamper. And that has happened. Never happened in our home. Never. Not one time. Now we have denial.

Yes. And I'm telling you, I think that that's true what she's talking about. Like, OK, what's my part?

What can I do? And not get frustrated with everyone else because they're not doing what I perceive their part as being, if that makes sense. I love Kathy's principles of, hey, you're in charge of you and you're working this out with other people. As a parent, you have standards for your kids, but every once in a while you need to let something slide. You know, there's a fine line in there and there's balance to be sought. And that's something we all have to do because there will be moments when it's not pretty. And it's interesting, like when we have our grandkids over, I'm totally laid back about them because I know now they're going to leave and it's all going to be different. And I'm going to enjoy the moment. And I think when our kids were little, it took me a while to learn that.

Yeah, because you hated the clutter and you thought you had to clean it up right away. And you realize when they go to bed, I can clean it up. So here's the question, Ron, as we listen to the next part. Does she apply this to our lives, to our spiritual lives?

Yeah. You know, and we have so much to declutter, spiritually speaking. And sometimes it's about resentment or pain or something in the relationship that it just needs to go. And that's the next part of our conversation. You just skirted around something that I wanted to talk about. And that is, let's talk about decluttering our heart for a second. When you've got resentment built up towards somebody in your home or, you know, or maybe a stepmom has a lot of clutter on her heart towards her, what we like to call her ex-wife-in-law, her husband's former wife.

That stuff gets in the way of you figuring out how to do life together. Okay. So my toes are crushed.

Thank you so much, Ron. Hey, you stepped on mine earlier, so. Okay, good.

We're good. So I will say this. My stepson was just miserable with me. And in his brain, his parents were getting back together, even though everybody in that equation made it very clear that that was never going to happen. I was the roadblock. And I have to say, I was really, really frustrated with him for a long time. So one of the things I did, and it's going to sound bad at first, but it actually has led to a great deal of healing, is I have three amazing friends who I just said, guys, I need a safe place to process this without gossiping, knowing that I love my stepson greatly, but I really don't like him right now. And I felt so awful because I was the only blended family person in that whole group. But then they all came out. They're like, this one kid is great. They're doing what they're supposed to be doing. My other kid is making me crazy. And we called ourselves the Bad Moms Club because we felt like bad moms, but also we were putting guidelines and we were putting boundaries in place, and we were learning how to do the mom thing well. And you know what? It was great because these people, I said, you have to hold me to the standard that I'm growing in love for my stepson, because if not, none of this is worth it.

And I didn't always feel that way, let's be super clear. But they would pray for me. They would ask me how things were going. They would hold me accountable when I'd say I need to reach out to Jeremy more, because right now things are not going well.

I need to encourage his dad to go on walks with him. I need to do all the things. When it came to, what do you call it? My husband's ex-wife is my what? Is your ex-wife-in-law. Ex-wife-in-law.

I love that so much. I need to write that down. You know, it was tough, and I'm just going to be really honest. And at one point, we had so much conflict, I told my husband, I need a year off. Because she was, for a while, she was very undermining. And now I understand, she didn't know her role when she was over here, so she would cut me down to be able to find her position. I know it now, it didn't help at the time.

I was just mad. And I took a year off of going to family events with her, because I was so hurt and so wounded. And let's just be honest, being a stepmom is one of the most humbling, and how do I want to say this? It makes you question everything good or everything, you know, those little evil feelings. It makes you question everything about who you are.

And that's a very vulnerable place to be in. But when I had really done my best, and we're talking after 10 years of being a stepfamily, and I finally told my husband, I need a year off. And he said, I support that.

He goes, I will go to the things. And I still spent plenty of time with my stepkids, but I just didn't show up where she was showing up. But you can't take a year off without doing the work on yourself. And I went to counseling, I figured out why she was behaving the way she was, why I was so triggered when she was behaving the way she was. And we now have a good relationship.

We don't hang out by ourselves. But when her sister was sick, I was there praying for her and sending messages and doing the best I could to love on her. When things are going on, and her kids are frustrated with her, I'm actually defending her in some ways. And so to get to that place, it was worth taking the year off and saying, I need to spend some time to figure this out. It helped tremendously. It helped everybody. There's so many takeaways in that.

Thank you so much for sharing that. The getting accountable to some friends had to be really good for you. It sounded like you supported each other. We talk about that a lot here at Family Life Blended.

We want stepfamily couples to be in relationship with other couples. Maybe it's a small group, maybe it's two couples you get together with on occasion and have dinner. But that sort of rubbing of the hearts builds some accountability, but you also learn something and you feel supported. You don't feel so isolated and alone. It's so true. You know, it's so funny.

We just had some friends within the past couple of years get married into a blended family, and they wanted to come over for dinner to get some advice. And they kept on telling me, it's just been so great. God has blessed us so much.

There's no conflict. And I'm like, that's amazing. Unusual, but amazing. And then three weeks later, she's like, yeah. And she goes, but I was so glad to hear from you that this is the norm. Yes, exactly. Exactly. And the other thing you did there is you took time to figure it out and you consulted with some people because you needed to. And I think taking some space, you know, the little one year vacation, if we want to call it that, is what a strategic thing to do. And your husband stepped up, you still had to work together.

I mean, there's so many great things wrapped up in that story. And it obviously paid off. It did pay off. And you decluttered your heart. Like I said, I've made more mistakes than I've done things right.

But as we grow in this, I can honestly see that when my thoughts are, how can I support my step kids in their relationships, whether it's with their dad, their mom, whomever it is, it's almost always the right decision for everybody. I got one more question for you. Yes, sir. You talk in the book about putting a sign in each room of your house to kind of communicate a purpose and to claim it for a given reason. Right.

Let's talk about it. Give us some examples, some practical examples in terms of home, but also what are some signs you can put in each room of your heart as it relates to your family? Yeah. You know, at some point, I claimed a verse for each of my step kids. And that verse has changed over the years according to what they need. My step kids are now grown. My step daughter is married. I have an amazing son-in-law that God is knitting together their family, and we get to see that. My stepson who has some learning challenges and things like that, who has perseverance like no other human being I've met, the signs that I can put on them, the Bible verse is about perseverance and loving well and God knitting their hearts together.

It focuses your relationship. And to be able to do that and say, I wish so much for these people that God has entrusted me with in a small way. I'm just a small part of the many people who love my step kids. But I also feel like God has given me the most to learn from them, and they've learned a lot by having a relationship with me.

We've learned how to navigate some really tricky waters that not everybody has to navigate. And my kids are better prepared for that. So when I think about that, I put a sign in my kitchen.

The one that we're getting made right now is, Julia Child, all the best people love to eat. We want our kitchen table to be a place of connection. And so I think about that for my step kids. I think about that for the relationships that are in my life. And it's like, OK, what verse can I be praying that I would see all of God's fruit in this person that I care so deeply about?

Man, that is such a neat idea to imagine is when a child walks in the room that there's almost like hovering above their head. There's this little verse or a thought or a notion that you hold on to for a period of time to just help you get focused about that person and your relationship with them. And to think about their future, because sometimes step kids are not always super lovable or even our own kids or our spouses or whomever.

They're not lovable in that place and space and time. But we have a hope that we can pin on them for something better for the future, because we have a big God and we have a lot of capacity to give. If you have stepped into the role of step parent, you are a person who has a great capacity to love, even if you haven't been able to demonstrate it recently. I know that it's there for you. Well, you've been listening to Family Life Today where we've all gotten the chance to listen to Ron Deal's conversation with Kathy Lipp. And I tell you that last little section there. Wow. What a way to view children and really to view anybody in your life, an identity that brings life out of them.

That was beautiful. I like the idea of seeing a scripture or a placard or an identity name above each of our children, our friends, our husband, our wife, because that's how God sees us. He doesn't see the clutter, the mess. He sees how he made us and the gifts that he put in us. I wonder if Jesus has a verse over each of us would be sweet to think about. You know, one of the things I'm putting into practice as a result of my conversation with Kathy is when my smartphone dings, it shouts important.

And I have to make a decision. Is that really important? What if I put a placard over my wife's head, over my son's head when he walks into the living room and I saw the word important over them? Like, how would that make a difference in how I respond? Just a simple little things.

The smile on my face, the way I welcome them, the way I turn my attention away from the TV or away from the smartphone and give them my full attention. If I see them as important and act accordingly, what a difference that would make. Yeah, we tend to. I know I do.

I can't speak for you, but Kathy got into it. Stuff. I tend to put a 10 on stuff and a three on people, you know, and I should put a 10 on everybody's forehead, especially my wife and my kids and grandkids, really my neighbor as well. And that's what she's challenged us to do. So thanks, Ron.

I mean, it was great to have you here. Thanks. I encourage people to listen to Family Life Blended and listen to your conversations like that. And there's a whole bunch of them and they are life changing. You know, I think any of us can look around and see messes somewhere in our home, in our lives, in our heart, and so thinking about how we can declutter, whether it's the physical space you're in or the spiritual space you're living in.

That's what Dave and Ann have been talking about today with Ron Deal and Kathy Lipp. Kathy has written a book called The Clutter Free Home, Making Room for Your Life, and we've got copies of her book in our Family Life Today Resource Center. Go online to get your copy. Go to familylifetoday.com or call 1-800-FL-TODAY to get a copy. Again, go to familylifetoday.com to look for The Clutter Free Home from Kathy Lipp or order a copy when you call 1-800-358-6329.

That's 1-800-F as in family, L as in life, and then the word today. And by the way, if you're not already subscribed to or regularly listening to Ron Deal's podcast, Family Life Blended, again, go to our website, familylifetoday.com. There's a link there. You can sign up, subscribe, listen in. The podcast is called Family Life Blended with Ron Deal, and it's a great podcast.

I'd encourage you to check it out. Now, I don't know if you've ever wished there was like a Home Depot or a Lowe's for marriage so that when there's a do-it-yourself project, you could go find the supplies and get things patched up in your marriage. I think Home Depot used to have this slogan, you can do it, we can help. That's how we feel about marriage. In fact, our team has put together something that we call the Love You Better Plan. It's a 30-day exercise you can go through to help you tackle some of those marriage improvement projects that I think all of us need from time to time. The Love You Better Plan is a free resource. Each day, there's a tip for how to improve your marriage, concepts and resources that can help bring you closer together.

Here's something really exciting. When you download the Love You Better Plan from Family Life, again, it's free, you are automatically registered for an opportunity to win a cabin on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise in 2022. We're heading out in February, Valentine's week, on the 2022 Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise, and somebody who downloads the Love You Better Plan is going to get a chance to go with us. So go to our website, familylifetoday.com. All the information you need is available there.

You can download from there. And again, you're automatically registered at that point for an opportunity to win a cabin on the Love Like You Mean It marriage cruise in 2022. The website again, familylifetoday.com. Now tomorrow, we're going to get a chance to connect with one of our favorite funny people. Michael Jr. is going to be here with us and we're going to hear from him about the connection between living a life with purpose and doing stand up comedy. And trust me, there is a connection. Michael joins us to talk about that tomorrow. I hope you can join us as well. On behalf of our hosts, Dave and Ann Wilson, I'm Bob Lapine. We will see you back tomorrow for another edition of Family Life Today. Family Life Today is a production of Family Life, a crew ministry, helping you pursue the relationships that matter most.