Does Jesus, the Pastor, or the Congregation Lead the Church?

Who leads the church? Is it Jesus, a pastor, or the congregation?

That's just one of the questions we'll be answering on today's edition of CORE Christianity. Well, hi, I'm Bill Meyer, along with Pastor Adriel Sanchez. This is the radio program where we answer your questions about the Bible and the Christian life every day. We'd love to hear from you. Here's our phone number. It's 833-THE-CORE.

That's 1-833-843-2673. You can always post your question on one of our social media sites, and you can email us anytime at this address, questionsatcorechristianity.com. First up today, let's go to MC, who is calling in from Nashville, Tennessee. MC, what's your question for Adriel? Hey Pastor Adriel, I am thankful for you taking my call, and I love the show, and I'm a supporter. And my question today, I actually have two questions. One is, what is the response when you have, when you're witnessing to a Muslim, and they say that the Bible and the Torah are both corrupt documents? That's my first question.

And then my second question is about Willis being the other wife of Adam. I've never heard that before, so I was just curious if you could help me. Yeah.

Hey, thanks for your encouragement, and glad that you enjoy the broadcast. You know, this objection that people make with regard to the Bible, where they say, oh, you know, well, it was just corrupted over time. You hear this from Muslims. You also hear this from Mormons. I've found in discussions with both Muslims and Mormons, you begin to appeal to scripture, and maybe you point out a passage that contradicts something in their theology, something they believe, and the sort of default is not actually to engage with the text, but to say, well, we know that the Bible was corrupted.

And in that case, I like to push back a little bit and just say, well, what do you mean? I mean, it is one thing to just sort of make a claim and say it was corrupted, but can you back that claim up? And I find that a lot of people are just sort of repeating something that they've been told, but they don't have any understanding of textual criticism. They don't have any understanding of how we got our Bible and the manuscript evidence in the Old Testament and in the New Testament. In the New Testament, manuscripts, just thousands of manuscripts that we're working with in terms of thinking about the text of scripture.

And so I would push back a little bit and just say, well, what do you mean? What can you point to, or how can you make that? This is the claim that you're making, but can you support that claim? And I think there's a lot of reason for us to believe that the Bible actually has not been corrupted. I mean, when you look at the manuscript evidence, there's just so much going for us in terms of, too many times people think, here's how the Bible was passed down.

It's sort of like the game telephone. One person gave the message to another person, then that person gave it to another person. Then over time, we lost the original message. We don't know what the message was, but what you had in the first centuries is just thousands of copies that were being made of the text so that we can compare these things in order to come to the original meaning.

So it's not like there was just this one line of transmission, if you will. You have all of these different copies that we're looking at in terms of getting a right understanding of what the text said. And I think we can be confident as Christians. And at the end of the day, we also can be confident because God is ultimately the one who is the source of scripture. He didn't just inspire it, but we believe that by the providence of God and the work of the Holy Spirit, he's also preserved his word for us so that we can say with the apostle Paul in 2 Timothy chapter 3, all scripture is God-breathed.

It's profitable for us. Here's what the apostle Paul says, all scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work. And so don't let people off the hook when they're confronted with the text of scripture.

And instead of dealing with the words of Jesus or the words of the apostles, they just say, oh, that was corrupted. It's just a claim. That's just an assertion.

You have to be able to demonstrate what it is that you're claiming. And I don't think that they can in a way that undermines the authority of scripture. And then with regard to the second question that you have about this character named Lilith, some of those ideas that are out there and have been out there sort of floating around with regard to the early chapters of Genesis, but there's just no indication in the text of scripture again that that's the case at all, that Adam had another wife, you know, at that point. So again, this is just people not looking at the text of scripture and making assumptions about the text of scripture. And in this case, I think that, you know, you just, again, want to just focus on what the text says.

And it certainly doesn't say anything about Lilith. And so, hey, thanks again for giving us a call and may the Lord bless you. I'm so glad that you pointed out that when someone makes a claim about Christianity being false or the Bible being distorted, it's really up to them to support that claim, because that happens a lot with atheists and agnostics and they'll kind of corner you and you need to really stop and say, well, what evidence do you have to support that or what makes you say that? A lot of times we feel like we're kind of backed into a corner, but they should be the ones that are forced to answer for that claim that they make, correct?

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that's how you have, you know, a good discussion. And hopefully if an individual is really open to learning and actually wants to grow in their understanding of what the Bible teaches, then it can be fruitful. A lot of times people are just throwing out things that they've heard, you know, from some guy on YouTube or something like that, or maybe a book that they read, but it hasn't been substantiated. They couldn't actually defend what it is that they're claiming. And so I would say, don't let them do that, you know, hold them to what they're claiming and then dig into the scriptures.

I think what you find is actually, no, there's a lot of support for the authority of scripture and for the fact that we can trust it. Good counsel. This is Core Christianity with Pastor Adriel Sanchez. Let's go to Dan calling in from Mississippi. Dan, what's your question for Adriel? Can you hear me? Hey Dan, I can hear you.

Okay, sorry. Okay, I know in the Old Testament somewhere it says that God, Jehovah, is the fountain of living waters. I cannot remember the verse or even what book it's in. But then Jesus, talking to the woman at the well, he said, if you had known who I am, you know, Jehovah, I would have given you living water. So my question is, so God's the fountain of living water, the water, what is that? Is it the information that you need to be saved or is it just salvation?

I love this question, Dan. I mean, this is one of my favorite chapters in the Bible. John chapter 4, Jesus with the woman at the well. And he says to her in verse 10, Jesus answered, if you knew the gift of God and who it is that is saying to you, give me a drink, you would have asked him and he would have given you living water. What is that living water?

You're right. Actually, Dan, in the Old Testament, God referred to himself as the fountain of living waters. The text you were thinking of is Jeremiah, the prophet Jeremiah chapter 2 verse 13, for my people have committed two evils. They have forsaken me, the fountain of living waters and hewed out cisterns for themselves, broken cisterns that can hold no water. In other words, you've abandoned me and you're beginning to worship things that cannot satisfy you, that cannot satisfy your spiritual thirst. I am the fountain of living water.

And so I think at one sense, we can say here that there's a claim to deity. Jesus is the one who gives the living waters. Now, what are those waters? When we think about living water, sometimes that could be used, that phrase could be used to mean running water. You think of a spring and actually just in a few verses, in verse 14, that seems to be the case, whoever drinks of the water that I will give him, you'll never be thirsty again, but that water I will give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life. Some people point to in the book of Numbers in chapter 19 verse 17, you had this ritual water that was used in the worship of Israel. Other times, I've heard commentators talk about in terms of this living water, this idea of a washing there in that time, the bridal bath, the preparation for marriage.

I kind of like that actually. You see some of this in Song of Songs, but I kind of like that because you have at the background here of John chapter 4 this marriage imagery. You have Jesus meeting a woman at the well, and throughout the Scriptures in particular in the Old Testament, over and over again, you have these stories of the patriarchs meeting their brides at wells.

And so this is a picture of, in one sense, the bride of Christ, this woman. And Jesus is the one who washes. He's the one who gives the living water. Now, when and where does Jesus give the living water?

Super fascinating, I think. You get to the end of John's gospel, and John records something about the crucifixion that isn't recorded in the synoptic gospels in Matthew, Mark, or Luke. In John chapter 19 in verse 34, again speaking about the crucifixion, we read, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus's side with the spear, and at once there came out blood and water.

Wow. What is the living water that Jesus gives? It's the blood and water that flows from his heart for the redemption of his people, for the washing of his bride, for the forgiveness of our sins. And so that's what I think the living water is.

It's the river of life that flows from the heart of Christ for the redemption of his people. Thanks for your call, Dan. God bless. Amen. I'm so glad you mentioned that John 4 is one of your favorite chapters. What I love about that is after he shares with the woman at the well, you know, she runs off and tells the people at the village who formerly had ostracized her about, about, I found the Messiah, and the Bible says the people came streaming out of the village to see him. And it's just so beautiful, isn't it? It is.

It is beautiful. I mean, you have the work of Jesus in her life and then just her desire to share about Christ and what he had done, his compassion, his love, his forgiveness. There's a great example for all of us.

Oh, for sure. This is Core Christianity with Pastor Adriel Sanchez. By the way, if you're a regular listener to this program and you believe in what we do, sharing the core tenets of the Christian faith on a daily basis, we'd love to invite you to join what we call our inner core.

Yes. Brothers and sisters, if you've been blessed by the work that we do as we open up the scriptures every day, answering the questions that you have about the Bible, about the Christian faith, about walking with the Lord, you know, and the comfort that we can receive from his word. If you've been blessed, would you consider joining the inner core? It's a monthly donation of $25 or more. It's one of the ways you can partner with us to continue to get the word out. And we believe, you know, that the work that we're doing is ministry.

I mean, we see it. We get so much feedback from many of you and so many others, letters coming in, people whose lives are being changed truly through the word of God and the grace of the Spirit and the privilege that God has given us to do this work. And so we're asking you to partner with us again, $25 or more joining the inner core. And we'll send you a copy of the book by Dr. Michael Horton, Core Christianity, to continue to encourage you in your walk with the Lord and build you up in the scriptures. Thank you for your support. You can learn more about joining the inner core, that special group of people who are regular supporters by going to corechristianity.com forward slash inner core, again, corechristianity.com forward slash inner core. We'd encourage you to perfectly consider doing that maybe this weekend.

We could definitely use some more supporters and that would just be a huge blessing to us. Well, let's go to an email question that came in, Adriel. And by the way, you can always email us at this address. It's questions at corechristianity.com, questions at corechristianity.com. This one comes from one of our listeners named Yolanda. She says, my pastor is doing a study in the book of Thessalonians. He stated that the congregation runs the church.

Is that right? I thought Christ ran the church. Yeah, Yolanda, I agree with you. I think that you're thinking correctly that Jesus is the one who runs the church. He is the head of the church. And boy, you see that in the book of Ephesians. You see that in First Corinthians.

You see that in Colossians chapter one, verse 18. He is the head of the body. The church is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead that in everything, he might be preeminent. The Pope in Rome is not the head of the church. I, you know, in my local church, I'm the pastor of a church, but I am not the head of the church. Jesus Christ is the head of the church, the body. And he governs his church. He rules over his church through officers who are called and qualified and competent in the scriptures.

This is why we have ordination. You know, Paul talks about the qualifications for elders in First Timothy three and in Titus chapter one. And so Jesus is the head of the church. He rules his church, governs his church from heaven with his word, with his law, through faithful pastors and teachers, elders who are caring for the flock, ministering to the flock. And Jesus from heaven is administering, you know, his kingdom, his grace to us through the word, through the ordinances of grace, baptism, and the Lord's supper.

Jesus is a king right now, reigning in the midst of his enemies. And Paul talks about this in First Corinthians 15. So Jesus is ruling over his church and he uses people in the governance of that church. That's why it's so important for each of us, Yolanda, to be a part of local churches because Jesus is present by his word and spirit.

He's the one who set this up. Sometimes I talk to people and they say, well, you know, I like spirituality, but religion, you know, organized church, that kind of thing. That was man's idea. That was not God's idea. No, actually the church is God's idea and gathering together with believers under the ministry of the word with elders and deacons and, you know, these things that we find in scripture, this is all God's idea. Now, of course, no church this side of heaven is perfect. We're all on the way making, you know, making the journey toward the celestial city, but God is at work in the midst of his church. Jesus is present with this church.

I'm preaching right now through the book of Revelation. We're about to jump into the letters to the seven churches in Revelation chapters two and three. And, you know, in chapter one, John has a vision of Jesus standing in the midst of seven golden lampstands. And at the end of Revelation one, John is told that those lampstands are the seven churches there in Asia Minor. This picture of Jesus in the middle of the church, working, serving, caring for the body. Jesus loves his church and he rules his church, governs her as head of the church through his word. God bless you, Lana. Thank you for your question. You're listening to Core Christianity with Pastor Adriel Sanchez. We do have a YouTube channel, by the way, and you can always send us a message through YouTube.

Nicole sent this one in. She says, my daughter is in the hospital and many non-believers are saying they are praying for her. They mean well, but how should we take that? Yeah, I mean, you take it as a kind gesture. I mean, obviously when people say that they're praying for you, you want them to be praying to the Lord, to the true God of heaven and earth who hears his people through the mediation of his son, Jesus Christ.

And so, yeah, I mean, this is the thing, right? People will say, I'm sending you my thoughts, my prayers. And maybe the person who says that, you know, they reject the Christian faith or they don't know the Lord. I think there's no reason to respond kind of in a harsh way and say, you know, your prayers don't matter, that kind of a thing. I think we can receive it with gratitude and maybe use it as an opportunity to talk about the Lord in these situations. But let me just say, Nicole, I'm sorry to hear that your daughter is in the hospital and I want to invite all of the believers who are listening to the broadcast right now. I mean, not knowing what her situation is, but I want us to pray for Nicole's daughter. And so let's come to the Father right now through Jesus Christ, our great high priest and pray for this girl who's in the hospital. Father, we lift Nicole and her daughter up to you right now. And Lord, we don't know why she's in the hospital, Lord God, but we pray for your healing in her life. I pray that your presence would be with her there in that hospital, the grace of the Holy Spirit that you would grant strength and restoration to her body and that even while she's there, Lord, her spirits would be uplifted, that she would have a clear sense of your love, God. And so often we can doubt your love, your presence in times of adversity. And I pray that Nicole and her daughter would not doubt that at all in this time, but that they would experience your grace, the comfort of the Holy Spirit and healing, Lord God. And so please be with our sisters and strengthen them and encourage them, we pray in Jesus' name. Amen.

Amen. You're listening to Core Christianity with Pastor Adriel Sanchez. You can leave us a voicemail anytime. In fact, if you want to call this weekend anytime, here's the phone number. It's 833-THE-CORE.

That's 1-833-843-2673. Here's a voicemail that came in from one of our listeners named David. My question is just having a little bit confusing time with the Trinity of the Father, the Son, the Holy Spirit, all being one together, as well as in the Bible says that Jesus was there before he became a human. And I'm just kind of putting all that together is a little bit confusing. Thanks.

Yeah. David, thank you for that question. Yeah, we believe in one God, one in essence, undivided Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, three distinct persons. Why do we believe this? We believe this because it is the teaching of Holy Scripture. We see it in the Old Testament. We see it in the New Testament. Each of the divine persons referred to as God and yet not confused with each other.

The Father is not the same person as the Son. The Son is not the same person as the Holy Spirit. And of course, again, we see this in the Gospels. We see it in the Gospel of John, for example, in John 1, verse 1, where we read, In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made. John there at the beginning of his Gospel is echoing Genesis 1, verse 1, where we talk about the initial creation.

In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. And John is saying, you know who was right there, through whom everything was made? We're talking about the Word.

And who is the Word? Well, he tells us in verse 14, The Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory. Glory is of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth. One of the earliest heresies that was condemned by Christians universally was a heresy known as Arianism. There was a man named Arius who began teaching this idea that there was a time when the Son was not. That is, there was a time when Jesus did not exist. Arius, similar to Jehovah's Witnesses today, taught that Jesus was the first created being, the first creature, but that he was still a creature. He was not in the category of creator God, but that he was in the category of God's creation.

And of course, that was rejected because that's not at all what the Bible teaches. The Bible teaches that the Son of God is eternal, the eternal Word of the Father. There in the very beginning with the Father, and he's not a created being, through him all things were created. And apart from him, John says, John is emphatic there in chapter one of his Gospel, apart from him was not anything made that was made. And so, you know, we sometimes talk about the the pre-existence of Christ, and these are passages, or the pre-existence of the Word.

These are the passages that we go to. Now, that Word, when he assumed humanity and took flesh from the womb of the Virgin Mary, came as our mediator in time to be the Christ, to redeem us, to save us. You have one divine person, the eternal Son of God, with two natures, distinct, without mixture, separation, confusion, division. They're together inseparably, so that you have God, the Word, who is accomplishing redemption for us. And it's really easy, I think, for us to think about all these things, you know, the deity of Christ, the incarnation of the Word, and say, boy, aren't we just splitting theological hairs here? Why did the Church make such a big deal about this?

Why did the Christians condemn Arius, and so on and so forth? But who Jesus is relates to our eternal salvation. Friends, there is no more important question that you can ask yourself than, who is Jesus? And the answer to that question that you give is so important. Jesus isn't just a great teacher, a moral leader.

Jesus is the eternal Son of God, who died for our sins so that we might be saved. Thanks for listening to CORE Christianity. To request your copy of today's special offer, visit us at corechristianity.com and click on offers in the menu bar, or call us at 1-833-843-2673. That's 833-THE-CORE. When you contact us, please let us know how you've been encouraged by this program. And be sure to join us next time as we explore the truth of God's Word together.