Applying Romans 14 to the Pandemic

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network.

So, how about we apply Romans 14 principles to the questions of mass, vaccines, and loving our brother and sister? It's time for The Line of Fire with your host, activist, author, international speaker, and theologian, Dr. Michael Brown, your voice of moral, cultural, and spiritual revolution. Michael Brown is the director of the Coalition of Conscience and president of Fire School of Ministry. Get into the line of fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. That's 866-34-TRUTH.

Here again is Dr. Michael Brown. I want to be pastoral today. I want to be practical today. I want to be helpful. My goal is not to incite one side against another.

My goal is not to prove a point. My goal is to appeal to us as children of God to take the wisdom of Romans chapter 14 and to apply it to our lives today in the midst of the pandemic, in the midst of wondering who do we trust? Is the government for us or against us? How do we handle things as churches, as families, as individuals? What's right? What's loving? What's coercive? What's wrong?

How do we sort this out? I want to discuss Romans 14 and apply this, especially within our own circles. Obviously, I can't get the government to go by this or the medical profession to go by this, but I can appeal to brothers and sisters in the Lord, the many leaders, pastors who listen to the broadcast and take in this information. I trust this will be helpful for you, and then you in turn can share this attitude with others. Let's have a Romans 14 revolution in our thinking.

This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the line of fire. Here's the number to call 866-3-4-TRUTH, 866-348-7884. You can weigh in with what I'm saying, give your amen or questions something or challenge it. If you feel I'm wrong anywhere, you can do that. Or you can just raise any other questions. We're going to have some time to talk about other questions issues. So any Bible question, any theology question, any cultural question of any kind, I want to open up the phone lines as I do on Friday. We do our best to do that other days as well, just because we can't get to all the calls and questions that come in.

So we try to make room on other days. So any random question on any subject, by all means, give us a call 866-3-4-TRUTH. But first, we're going to focus on the Romans 14 principle. Let me give you some of the background in terms of what prompted me to go here today.

And then we're going to read through Romans 14. We're going to think through how this applies in the midst of the pandemic. I had some friends visiting yesterday, father, son, father on the mission field, 46 years, six years, the son basically born, originally born on the mission field, served in Italy and around the world all these decades. And we got to talking about numerous things, including vaccines, mandates, traveling from country to country, et cetera. And they shared with me four specific situations that they knew about firsthand. Four specific situations, all right? Let me just, I jotted them down. I said, hey, let me get this directly so I don't have to just rely on my memory to get these right. The, the, the son who's what close to 50 now, he, his 71 year old uncle training to run a marathon, scientist got his second Pfizer vaccine one morning, died of a heart attack because of a blood clot that afternoon. All right.

I'm just reporting what he shared with me. Then he's in Italy, woman in her forties. She's in like a track suit. She and her husband were doing some activity to come out of a coffee shop collapses. The medics come, can't revive her.

The husband flipping out, obviously she would wife suddenly drops dead. She had just gotten vaccinated. Now again, that's much more anecdotal. That's different than his grandfather, but I'm just telling you as we're talking, then his first cousin, 18 died within a day of getting her second vaccine dose. He said, well, did they know exactly what the cause of death was? He did not have all the details, but obviously when an 18 year old just drops dead, that raises very, very serious concerns.

How does that happen? And then an elder in his brother's church in Italy, 41 years old died of a heart attack after getting second vaccine. These were just situations that he was aware of. And we weren't talking in anti-vaxxer language or mocking those who were vaccinated. Many, many of my friends, tons of my friends are vaccinated, many are not.

That wasn't the issue. It was the genuine questions that people have. Then pastor Robert Jeffress put out a statement.

I haven't seen it yet. There's no biblical reason not to get vaccinated and highly respected pastor. I appreciate so much of what he says and does.

Shane Ottoman, good friend, pastor in California, put out a video responding with all respect to pastor Jeffress and said, well, how about we use wisdom? He said, I just talked to my doctor of decades and the doctor said he's seeing absolutely no difference in terms of cases he's treating between the vaccinated and the unvaccinated. And then the various concerns that Shane has as someone who's studied health nutrition for many years about the effects of the vaccine.

Then talking to two of my staff members immediately before radio, they want to get the facts right. A 15 year old boy gets vaccinated, has a heart attack. How many times have you heard of a 15 year old getting a heart attack? He survived, but his mortality rate could limit him now to live five more years potentially because of heart damage.

We prayed for his healing. At the same time, I can tell you the list of people that Nancy and I know, friends of ours that have died of COVID and some who almost died and God had mercy on them and spared them. But we've got a growing list of people that we know have been close with over the years or friends or coworkers in church circles that have died of COVID. Some died before the vaccines were available. Others died after the vaccines were available. To our knowledge, none of the people who died were vaccinated.

So we have those accounts. And then I just read about the fifth conservative radio host who had publicly come out against vaccines has died. Bob Enyard, I'd been on his show a number of times talking about moral issues, cultural issues, some of my books. He'd come out against the vaccine. And according to this report, he was the fifth well-known conservative radio host who died of COVID after either mocking its seriousness, it's no different than the flu or saying the vaccines weren't necessary or were wrong. An activist in Israel, strongly opposed vaccines, downplayed the significance of COVID.

He just died, I guess it was last week. So I know of all those situations. And then Christians, you want to do the right thing. On the one hand, you don't want to seem like a rebel.

You don't care. Everybody keeps the rules, but you don't keep the rules because you're a Christian and you do what God wants you to do. You don't want to seem like that arrogant and flouting authority on the one hand. On the other hand, you don't just want to be a stooge of government regulations that may be ultimately unhelpful and that cause other trauma, you know, with elementary school children, even kids, little kids having to sit with masks eight hours a day or older kids who are vaccinated, still having to wear masks to school or things like that, or the trauma that comes to families with the lockdowns and the health issues that come out of that.

So it's a very complex situation. And I am not here to urge you to take one side or the other. I'm here to urge an attitude.

I'm here to say, if your friend, family member, co-worker has prayerfully evaluated things and based on that feels they should be vaccinated or they should not be vaccinated, they should be treated with grace and love and respect rather than scorned. What are you going to do that the government tells you to do? Where's your faith, man? I thought you had courage. You're spineless. When you got vaccinated, you're spineless.

Or on the flip side, have the attitude of a, you're, you're a super spreader. You don't care. You don't love anybody. You just care about yourself. And you're following these ignorant conspiracy theories.

We don't need to polarize like that. Now, there are people following ignorant conspiracy theories on all sides, and there's good reason for healthy skepticism about whatever you hear on all sides. There's what biblical scholars refer to as a hermeneutic of suspicion, that you don't just take things as you see them, but you come with a certain interpretive suspicion. So I'm questioning everybody. I'm listening to different scientists, doctors and journalists and others. And I'm listening, saying on the one hand, I believe you. On the other hand, I don't believe anything you're saying.

In other words, got to dig, got to think the thing through. I'm talking about the attitude. Friends, in our churches, we should not be making an issue of whether someone wears a mask or not. If, if, as a caller said yesterday, he feels he should wear a mask because he doesn't want to risk spreading things to others. If you say it's ignorant, you're not going to spread things.

Fine. That's your opinion. In his view, walking in love and feels that's the best thing to do, he wants to wear a mask. It's not faithless.

In his mind, that's, that's wisdom. And, and there's, you're not going to show me anything in the Bible that you should or shouldn't wear the mask in the, as far as the thing itself. As far as, you know, submitting to regulations when you should, shouldn't, that's, that's the issue of you obey the authorities unless the authorities tell you to disobey God.

We understand that principle. But he's, he was afraid to go back because he'd be basically the only one in his church wearing a mask, didn't want to get mocked for a second. How in the, how in the world can we, the people of God, be at that point? How in the world could we, who are supposed to love one another as Jesus loved us and lay our lives down one for another, how in the world could we be creating environment where if, if, if someone feels perfectly free to not wear a mask and actually feels it's healthier and best to not have a mask on for various reasons, and they come into a group and the people have masks, are they going to judge you, you don't care? Can we step higher?

Can we do better? And when it comes to the vaccination, you either think that you are helping to prevent a deadly disease from killing you or for you spreading it to others. This is what you're thinking. The reason you're going to get vaccinated is this is going to reduce your chance of getting infected, or if you do get infected, it will reduce the seriousness of the disease.

So you're doing this in a life and death serious way. And others are not getting vaccinated. Again, they're wackos on all sides. We're not talking about that. We're talking about the great majority of people trying to be responsible.

If you're not getting vaccinated, you're saying, I don't know if I'm putting something unhealthy in my body and could now willfully hurt myself or kill myself, or if I asked my family to get vaccinated, could, could hurt us by, by making a choice to put something in our body. So both are making life and death decisions before the Lord. Shouldn't there be a little respect and a little love instead of money? Or aren't we as God's people called to step higher than that? We come back when we read Romans 14, full lines are open, 866-343. Thanks for joining us friends on the line of fire phone lines are jammed.

I want to get your calls quickly. First, as promised, we're going to read Romans 14 together, and then just think it through, pray through, especially pastors, leaders, and those with home groups where we can set an example, set a tone. How should we live this out? All right, Romans 14, where we've got Jewish believers in Jesus, Gentile believers in Jesus, side by side, how do you work through conflicts? Accept the one whose faith is weak without quarreling over disputable matters. Friends, the vaccines, the masks are in the category of disputable matters, not fundamental doctrines of the faith. And you might say, well, the one who gets vaccinated this week.

No, the one who doesn't get vaccinated this week. Whatever, apply the principle. One person's faith allows them to eat anything, but another who's faith this week eats only vegetables. The one who eats everything must not treat with contempt, the one who does not, and one who does not eat everything must not judge the one who does, for God has accepted them. How about this? The one who's vaccinated must not treat contempt, the one who is not vaccinated, the one who's not vaccinated must not judge the one who is vaccinated, for God has accepted them.

You'd say the same with masks. Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall, and they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand. One person considers one day more sacred than another, another considers every day alike.

Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God. Whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God. For none of us lives for ourselves alone, none of us dies for ourselves alone. If we live, we live for the Lord, and if we die, we die for the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.

For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living. You then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Why do you treat them with contempt, if we will all stand before God's judgment seat? It is written, as surely as I live, says the Lord, every knee will bow before me, every tongue will acknowledge God.

So then, each of us must give an account of ourselves to God. Therefore, let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister. I am convinced, being fully persuaded in the Lord Jesus, that nothing is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for that person it is unclean.

If your brother or sister is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy someone for whom Christ died. Therefore, do not let what you know is good to be spoken of as evil. For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, or wearing masks and getting vaccinated, but of righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit.

Because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and receives human approval. Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification, to not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble.

It is better not to eat meat or drink wine or do anything else that will cause your brother or sister to fall. So, whatever you believe about these things between yourself and God, blessed is the one who does not condemn himself by what he approves. But whoever has doubts is condemned if they eat because their eating is not from faith, and everything that does not come from faith is sin. So, the last principle, friends, to apply for Moments 14 is this. Don't do anything that, excuse me, that you can't do in faith with regard to these decisions.

Don't do anything that you can't do them in faith before the Lord. All right, let us go over to the phones. We'll start with an anonymous caller from somewhere in the south. Welcome to the line of fire. Hi, good afternoon.

Hey. Hi, okay, so I have a valid, well, good question, about the illegal immigrants or migrants. They are not mandated to be vaccinated before crossing over. If the president is pushing us, the citizens, to be vaccinated so much, but yet when they come over, which they're coming over in droves, this is not just Mexicans. You have Haitians and people of other nationalities actually coming over. Why aren't they being vaccinated?

And not to mention they're coming from South America as well, where they have recently found the MU variant. Yeah, it's 100% hypocritical. It is 100% double standard. It is 100% unjustifiable. The other day, I opened up the phones and said, please, someone, there have to be Biden supporters, Biden voters that are out there, those that support his policies. Please, because I know from comments we get that we have them, please, somebody call me and explain this to me.

Somebody give me a rationale for it. The only comment that's come out from the White House that I'm aware of was Press Secretary Jen Psaki saying, well, they don't get vaccinated because they don't intend to stay here. What? Why are they crossing the borders to get an ice cream or get a slice of pizza and then go? Obviously, they're crossing the borders because they want to be in our country. We said, great, just do it legally.

Do it the right way. We have a system for that. We welcome millions of immigrants over the years gladly. So it is mind boggling to me. Even just, if you care about health, I mean, how can you have so much government control on the one hand and insist that children, little children are going to school wearing masks and on and on and forcing people to get vaccinated or lose their jobs? It's glaring, double standard, glaring hypocrisy. I see no possible justification for it. And it just it adds to the overall frustration.

It really does. You know, and look, we thought we were moving on and things were getting better. And then the Delta variant hit.

And now the next variant could be even worse. So you think, OK, just common sense. When President Trump shut down travel from China, it was called the hysterical xenophobic move. Right. Candidate Biden opposed it back then. And all of that, you know, we understand. And that was obviously a wise move.

And if we had more information, we could have made some of these decisions earlier. It's not to to discriminate against people. It's just health. You do this when you realize there's something spreading. You do your best to stop it in its tracks. So it's it's mind boggling.

It is. You know what it reminds me of? That that many Democrats who in the past had supported strict border control when Trump supported it, now they attacked it. And that's how we can often be very fickle that whatever is politically correct on our side, we go with even when it's completely illogical.

Each side does it the left and the right. And here we see it glaringly in front of our eyes. But there's something else, too, because you have so many scientists and doctors that are seeing it otherwise of those who are vaccinated are being hospitalized as well. And they're seeing other things as far as like directions due to the fact.

And I mean, it's just because it's it's mind boggling that some of them are being silenced as well when they have seen other issues with the back. So you have the FDA. Yeah. So so. Yeah.

Yeah. Just just to jump in that Veritas is now releasing a releasing video footage of health workers basically saying, yeah, these these people are really sick, but they were vaccinated. Well, we we can't let that information out or things like that. We don't know how widespread, but we keep hearing reports like that. Dr. Jonathan Sarfati, who was on the air with me last week, last Wednesday, laid out his argument why the vaccines are good and right and best, and that those who are vaccinated get much less sick than those who are not vaccinated. And then you hear other reports. So everyone that wants to hear the pro vaccine side, listen to Dr. Sarfati's position. He's a Ph.D. in chemistry from last Wednesday.

Strong Bible believer. You can listen to that. The first of the year I had Dr. Frank Schallenberg on a leading medical thinker and he was against the vaccine. So here on the show, we we put out both positions for people to hear and sort through. But there is that concern that contrary data is is being suppressed. And again, it's tough enough with the with with the rules that people are trying to live by. But then when you see the double standard and the hypocrisy, it just makes it all the more difficult.

Let's go to Russ in Salt Lake City, Utah. Welcome to the line of fire. Hey, thanks, Dr. Brown. I really enjoy your program.

I'm 75 years old, a 20 year military vet. And I will tell you that over the years, from my experience, from what I see with the vaccines, with the election, with the riots, with everything, the thing that is going to bring America down is the thing that made America so great. And that is freedom. We have all these people out there spreading all this information. And so much of it is misinformation. But they have the freedom to do it.

And if we get I am not one for shutting people up, but I I am one for holding people accountable for what they say. Yeah. And Russ, our founders recognize that the unique nature of our government was such that without certain foundations in religion and morality, not imposing a state religion in any way, or declaring America to be a Christian nation, but without a religious moral people that things could not function. You know, for example, Russ, you you give certain liberties to an 18 year old that you don't give to a 15 year old. You give liberties to a 30 year old that you don't give to an 18 year old. So our our country has found it on certain liberties, but without a certain maturity and without a certain responsibility. Right.

It can lead to real trouble. So what do we do? We don't try to censor and constrict. We try to educate. We try to bring truth. Hey, thank you.

Thank you for the call, of course, for your service to our country. Just a quick response to a comment on Facebook, Steve. The reason that I am not opposing vaccines and recognizing them as a willful attempt to murder millions of people is because I'm not convinced of the evidence. It's that simple. I know how to do research.

I know how to sift things through. And I am not convinced that the main motive behind the vaccines. Remember, President Trump was the one who pushed to get them through quickly is that this is part of a specific plan from the White House, beginning with President Trump, to murder as many millions of people as possible. Now, are there quotes from Bill Gates and others about about pruning the population? Those are greatly concerning quotes. Those should be looked at.

But please, I'm not just going to go with this theory. It's The Line of Fire with your host, Dr. Michael Brown. Get into The Line of Fire now by calling 866-34-TRUTH. Here again is Dr. Michael Brown.

Here's Dr. Michael Brown. We shall see what kind of response this gets on Twitter. I just posted during the break a paraphrase, an update of Romans 14 three for today. Let not the one who is vaccinated despise the one who is not. Let not the one who is not vaccinated pass judgment on the one who is.

For God has welcomed him. That's my position. And I do not believe there is a person on the planet who can prove that the reason that President Trump pushed the vaccines, the development of vaccines and the bypassing normal red tape to get them out as quickly as possible and touted it as one of the great accomplishments of his administration, that he did that because he was complicit with a global movement to kill, murder as many people as possible with the vaccine.

Hey, if you want to kill, murder the maximum number of people, maybe the better way is to delay a vaccine for 10 or 20 years and let the pandemic just keep multiplying and attacking and killing people and so on. And friends, don't go there. These are these are dangerous charges to bring.

Well, Trump would meant well, but others had a plan. Just be careful. Be careful before you repeat something and pass it on. Don't bear false witness. Just urge you to be careful.

866-344-TRUTH. This is Michael Brown. Welcome to the broadcast. Our goal today to apply Romans 14 principles to the pandemic, to how we live and how we act, basically saying this. If someone feels that it's good for them, it's good for them to wear a mask and loving for them to wear a mask. And they show up at your maskless church service wearing a mask.

Welcome them. Don't judge them. Maybe it's to protect themselves. Maybe they feel it's to protect others. Either way, that's not the issue. Conversely, if someone else comes in without a mask and it's perfectly legal for them to do that in your assembly, then don't pass judgment on them for not wearing it.

We need to step higher. The Christian believers that I know that have been vaccinated did it because they thought it was the right thing to do, that it was the healthy thing to do, that it was the loving thing to do. The Christians that I know that have not been vaccinated feel it's not a healthy thing to do, and it's ultimately not a loving thing to do.

And the Christians that I know that have really looked at this have researched it and gone back and forth. Some have spoken to their own doctors for many years, and the doctors said there's no reason for you to get vaccinated. Others have said let's work together to get a religious exemption for various reasons because of what's being forced on you by the government or by your business.

And as I said earlier in the broadcast, I can give you evidence, anecdotal evidence of people that we know that died of COVID that were not vaccinated, and then I keep hearing reports, first-hand reports from people, direct relatives of theirs, who died shortly after getting the vaccine and otherwise were healthy, died of blood clots and other things. So these are weighty issues that are out there, and this is not the time to get caught up in a spirit of fear or a spirit of anger or a spirit of judgment. We need to step higher. 866-344-TRUTH, going back to the phones momentarily, quick question, have you visited vitaminmission.com yet? You say, what's vitaminmission.com?

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It's a great way for you to get savings, and it's a great way for funds to come back to our ministry to get on more stations and to reach more people. 866-34-TRUTH. With that, we go back to the phones, starting with Steven in Tampa, Florida. Welcome to the line of fire. Hey, Dr. Brown.

Thank you for taking my call. I actually wanted to talk about the whole mass mandate. I live here in Tampa. Many people might not know it's Hillsborough County. We actually made the national news for the first month and a half of the fall semester. We had about 7,000 to 10,000 students plus the teachers already quarantined.

I'm living first-hand in Cal, and my fiancé is an elementary school teacher with four-year-olds in the public school system. There's an absolute pressure on her from her colleagues about her getting vaccinated, and she and I are both at the standpoint where we've looked at the evidence, and we just want more data. That's simply the facts. We're not against it. We're not for it. We just simply want time and more scientific data to come out, but I just want to say that I have seen and seen the effect on her inside our public school system. Yeah, it's brutal, and you've got two sides to it.

I mean, more, but two basic ones. One is there are people that, meanwhile, there are people that really, really are convinced that the vaccine is going to save lives and that you're endangering yourself and those around you by not getting vaccinated. How could you be so foolish? Look at these accounts on TV, one after another, online. People have mocked the virus, and it's not serious, and God's bigger than this, and they're all dead of COVID, and they all wish now they'd been vaccinated. Their family's saying everyone gets vaccinated. So you have those that genuinely are concerned and believe it's for the best, so they're looking at you.

They're looking at your fiancé like, what? He's crazy? Come on.

How can you not do this? Don't you care? And then the other side of it, in terms of those pushing for it, for some, it's just control. We have an ideology, and we're going to force it on you, and you're going to have to bow down to it. Oh, no, and you cannot bring any evidence to it.

No, everything else is going to be silenced. So that's part of the tension as well, that on the one hand, there are people who are well-meaning and care, but a lot of them have been scared, and they're not being rational. You have others that it's a matter of asserting control and taking over people's lives more and more and more. And then, like you said, on your end, you and your fiancé just trying to get more data. Let me encourage you to search online for a debate, a vaccine debate, Zelenko and Sarfati.

You'll find it very, very easily. Vaccine debate, Zelenko, Z-E-L-E-N-K-O. He is a religious Jewish doctor who is, in general, not against vaccines, but strongly, militantly opposed, especially for children, the vaccines. And then Dr. Sarfati, who is a Jewish follower of Jesus, a strong believer in the Word of God.

And so both of these men would be God-fearing men. Dr. Sarfati, pro-vaccine, against the mandates, but pro-vaccine. If you haven't watched it, sit down with your fiancé. And then if you think, in your mind, that there are enough questions that are being raised by Dr. Zelenko, you can ask others, colleagues, hey, watch this. Let's sit down together.

Hey, show me what I'm missing. Or if Dr. Sarfati convinces you of his position, fine. But let me encourage you to do that, Steven. And look, these are potentially life and death issues, right? So you really, as much as there's pressure, you just have to think, hey, I have to do what's right.

Even think of it from this level. Your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit. We are called to be stewards of our whole lives, which include our bodies and our health. So before the Lord, you have to be sure about what you do. Could I make an extra comment?

Yeah, go ahead, go ahead. The last thing I wanted to say with it was the state here in Florida does not mandate masks, but the public school systems here in Hillsboro are requesting masks. So there is a consistent fight back between the parents, the teachers, the school board, the state, where the teacher can't force the mask. But then the leadership from the school department is saying, but we want you to wear it. But they're saying, well, the state kids telling us we don't have to wear it.

Right. So you've got to push back. Everybody has to push back. And look, it happened right there in Tampa with Rodney Howard Brown pushing back right off the bat against some of the state regulations, against public gatherings. Matt Staver, Liberty Council joined in and immediately the state said, yeah, we're inconsistent here in terms of what we're doing and made some major changes. And of course, Governor DeSantis has been on the front lines of pushing for more liberty and freedom.

So everyone that differs what they feel is an oppressive mandate needs to push back together and not be intimidated. If enough of you do, it will take some of that pressure off. Hey, Steven, may the Lord be with you and your fiancé. 866-344-TRUTH.

Let's go to Sean in Knightdale, North Carolina. Thanks for calling the line of fire. Hey, Dr. Brown. So I don't really have necessarily a question. My thing is this, the whole vaccine, this whole vaccine thing, my problem is the people and not necessarily the government.

Right. So when do we, like you just, like you just said, when do we push back against certain things? Like we fight against... All right, tell you what, I don't know what happened, sir, but we just lost you. So I'm going to respond to the part of your comment that I heard, part of your question. When do we push back?

We push back when the government crosses certain lines. So for example, if I have to wear a mask in a store, going through a grocery store, it's not hardship for me to do it. It's not the end of the world. It's not a hardship. And because I'm local and I've always sought to be in my conduct in stores and in public, always a godly witness, et cetera, which I'd be even if I wasn't local, but you know, so fine.

It's not a big deal. However, if I was required to be vaccinated to work my job, then it's a question whether I'm vaccinated or not, it's not the issue. If I had the conviction at that point that the vaccines were unsafe, then I have to push back because now I'm sinning against my own body to obey a mandate or I'm sinning against my own family, whatever the case may be. So when we are asked to do something that causes us to sin, violate our conscience, do what we feel is destructive, that's when we have to push back.

And there are many peaceful, legal ways with which we could do that. We'll be right back. is Dr. Michael Brown. Thanks, friends, for joining us on the line of fire. If you don't get our emails, be sure to go to Ask Dr. Brown, askdrbrown.org. We send you some special bonus material, free ebook, real eye-opening mini book. Share more about my testimony from LSD to PhD, the three R's of our ministry. And then every week we'll let you know if your latest articles, your latest videos, special resource offers.

We get so much coming out all the time to minister to you, serve you, equip you, help you stand on the front lines, help you be informed. So sign up today, askdrbrown.org. Take your 30 seconds or less, and this way we can be in touch on a regular basis. All right, back to the phones.

We go to Carolyn in Raleigh, North Carolina. Welcome to the line of fire. Thank you. Can you hear me?

Not super well. Are you talking straight into the phone? Yes, yes. I don't have the speaker on.

I think it's the rain messing up everything. Yeah, go ahead, please. Oh yeah, I just want to, I wanted to make a comment about the vaccine mandate. I think I learned through the years, and I've worked in hospitals, that there is no one medication that works for everybody, and all medication has warning signs. So with the president making it mandatory that you take it, everyone takes the same medicine, and it's just not wise that we know that people have died or had had reactions to it that may would have saved their life if they didn't feel like they were mandated to take it, and it's, you know, I know myself, I have several allergies to certain medications, and I don't know if it's in the vaccine or not. You know, my doctor keeps trying to get a list of stuff that's in there.

He doesn't get that back. So out of wisdom, I don't take it. I'm not against the vaccine, but I'm not going to put my life on the line for it. Thankfully, I've had COVID and survived it, and I've been tested, and I have the antibodies to fight against another attack, but I just think that, you know, that's just logical, medical common sense.

There is no one thing that works for everybody, and to make it mandatory, it just doesn't make sense. Yeah, and Carolyn, the other challenge is that some people that have an adverse reaction to the vaccine, you don't know about it until after it happens, right? So, you know, that's what makes it all the more difficult. Again, it's a different situation, and Carolyn, and Carolyn, I'm glad that you made it through, and yes, you've got the best protection, which is the natural immunity, which is going to be stronger than any vaccine, obviously, and from everything I understand, science clearly bearing that out, but again, there are things that have been proven, you know, say the polio vaccine and the positive effect that it had around the world and all of the years of developing and testing and so on, and we're in just a very different situation here, and that's why it's so important that people are not judging one another. I mean, how can you judge, Carolyn, for what you said? It's just wisdom.

It's wisdom, and looking at things in a smart way, you know, not just diving in. Hey, thank you for the call, and I think probably the vast, vast majority of all of you listening and watching have a real issue with the mandates. Maybe some here and there, a tiny minority of those following our ministry, would say, you know, it's super important. We 100% stand behind the mandates.

I would imagine the vast majority of you have issues with that, as Dr. Sarfati did, pro-vaccine but anti-mandate. All right, let's see. Let's go to Jason, somewhere in Central America. Welcome to the line of fire. Hey there, Dr. Brown. Can you hear me fine?

Pretty well, yeah, from Central America, sure. Okay, yeah, yeah. Okay, so I really appreciate you bringing up this Romans 14 passage. I serve in ministry in Central America, and this is something we've been just kind of wrestling through, and I 100% agree with what, you know, like Romans 14 is calling us to, and that judge, despise, become unloving towards our brothers and sisters, and I hear and agree with the heart of this truth being shared there, but what I really struggle with, I guess, in the application of this to this specific topic, and I just wanted to kind of gain some of your insight on this, is like, as I read it, you know, I see this struggle being kind of wrestled through between the Jewish and Gentile people of the Church of Christ and, you know, between their dietary and religious differences, and so it's really hard for me to make that jump and apply it to a topic that may not arise within the Church of Christ like what we're talking about with masks and vaccines, so that's kind of like one of the little struggles there I have with this, with like the application fully there, like I get the heart of what you're saying there, and how our hearts to be postured towards a religious distance, I don't care if someone wants to wear a mask, get a vaccine, like that's your choice, you've got to deal with like that choice, and then the kind of the other struggle I have in kind of making that jump is seeing that it's a politicized topic where I don't see like that being a politicized topic about food, like yes there was like the struggle between the Jews and the Gentiles or the Jewish believers and Gentile believers, better said, but it wasn't necessarily like a politicized topic, I don't know if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, so let me just respond, I'm just looking at the clock as we come towards the end of the hour here, all right, so the first thing is Romans 14 is giving us principles to apply in a thousand different situations, it's not just when you have dispute about dietary laws or holy days, there are there are paradigmatic principles that Paul is giving us by which we live, and we should be able to apply them freely, so what's the first principle? Well don't judge your brother or sister who has a different conviction on a disputable matter, are the vaccines and mass disputable matters? Yes, they are not fundamental life and death doctrinal issues, they are disputable matters, so the principle is on a disputable matter, don't judge your brother or your sister, so for example, it's not a disputable matter if a man leaves his wife and goes and sleeps with another woman, he's committing adultery and needs to be called to repent, if he claims to be a follower of Jesus, he needs to be called to repent and he is in adultery, that's not disputable, it is disputable if if the pastor's wife every few months likes to change her hair color, that is is that does she have the right or is that being vain or it's that's disputable, so in matters like that don't judge the other person, be it the mask, be it the vaccine, don't judge either way, because I see it both ways, I see those who are who are vaccinated even pro-mandate, judging all those who are not as super spreaders and and evil selfish people, and I see others saying you don't have any faith, where's your faith, you're you're you're just bound down to the government to get vaccinated, so there's judgment both ways, so that's that's the first thing, the second thing is that in a certain sense these were highly politicized issues, I mean there was nothing bigger to Jewish people than these laws of separation, this is part of their worship of the one true God, so Sabbath that you you die for that principle, and while you wouldn't die for dietary law principles, these were big issues, I mean this is when Antiochus Epiphanes in the 160s BC offers up a pig on on the altar in Jerusalem, this is this is one of the things that sparks the the uprising and that Jews say enough is enough, so in that sense this was lifestyle, and and there were political battles fought over this, so it but you have to have the same application, for example when it comes to the elections and and people are deciding who to vote for, and you can make a case for this candidate, a case for that candidate, and you have your strong reasons both ways, ultimately you can't judge one another in Jesus for those decisions even flat out on politics, so I don't think the fact that this is politicized has any meaning at all, we simply have to separate the political debate from personal choices before God and then follow these principles of not judging one another and doing our best not to put a stumbling block before one another and to give liberty on these issues which in terms of the faith are not primary issues, so that's how I would apply this, is that helpful? Yeah definitely helpful, and I guess you know I and I 100% agree like on the like the first part and like the principle of it and how that just kind of transcends through our daily lives right and just our our demeanor and our heart towards others and but even like but I still struggle on the politicization. But why should that, but what, forget that though, that's what the world is doing, yeah we're that's right no that's what that's what because like I'm seeing it like within within the the Christian church as this being a passage being applied in a way that is is obligating like basically telling believers no like you should do this this this way and this way um right but it but it's quite the opposite right I see it as an outlaw right right I see it as an outside influence and that's why even like as I look at like a but but but here here's the thing I got I got it you got to jump in because we're out of time forget what is influencing people to make their decisions that's that's where you're getting confused here in terms of working this out practically or getting distracted from the simplicity of it forget the outside influence it's the person making a choice why are they making that choice before God why are they coming to that conclusion as a believer the government says this maybe they feel if the government says I just have to do it whatever why are they coming to those conclusions that's the issue and that's where we walk in love one towards another that's where we don't judge one another in other words I don't pass judgment on you for the decision that you made as you were seeking to honor the Lord and do the right thing politicized or not it's the individual individual decision that we're looking at and may the Lord give grace as we seek to live out these principles God bless you God change the world another program powered by the truth network