BREAKING: France Warned US in 2015 About Wuhan Lab

Breaking in 2015, France warned the US government about the Wuhan lab. We'll talk about that with our Senior Counsel for Global Affairs, former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo.

Live from Washington DC, Sekulow Live. It is well known that the French collaborated to build the lab and then were summarily kicked out from the lab after it was up and running. Phone lines are open for your questions right now.

Call 1-800-684-3110. A concerning behavior if you wanted to have transparency and if you want to have openness of research, you don't kick out the people who helped you build the lab and train your people. This is known and still another piece of indirect evidence for us to be very concerned about the origins of this virus, which I do believe is from the Wuhan lab. And now, your host, Jordan Sekulow. Welcome to Sekulow and we are taking your phone calls to 1-800-684-3110.

Get your comments in Facebook, Periscope, YouTube, wherever you're watching or listening to the show. There is a new report, as we said in the open. In 2015, the United States government was warned about the Wuhan lab, specifically by the French government. And it was the French intelligence officials who went to the US government and they were working on building this lab. So this was a collaboration in building this new part of the Wuhan lab between the French government and the Chinese government. Interesting to note at the time, the French military and French intel community were totally opposed to this collaboration between France and China. But French politicians, as we've seen here in our own country, moved forward regardless of those warnings and the idea that they said we shouldn't be doing this.

They're not a trustworthy partner when it comes to this kind of work. But you saw the politicians and again it brings questions to how worldwide is their influence over these Western politicians in democracies that we didn't know about or weren't paying enough attention to at the time. So the US government though gets the warning. And they got the warning from the French because they said hey, they're cutting back our collaboration. Two years later, and this is when the whole new wings of this lab that the French government had collaborated with the Chinese government to build opened. So in 2017, two years later, they got totally kicked out, similar to how we've seen the Chinese react to those who wanted to investigate and to look into the lab at the World Health Organization, which last week. And by the way, it's not like they're the best partner in this either, but even they have been turned away by the Chinese government and they've said no more.

That happened last week. So in 2017, the French get kicked out completely. No more cooperation. And this was the warning they gave to the State Department. That they had grave concerns as to Chinese motivations and then of course in 2021, we saw the State Department report that the Wuhan lab was engaged in classified research on behalf of the Chinese military.

Starting in when? The same time the French were completely kicked out of their collaboration in 2017. So the Chinese use the French, use their resources, use their know-how to get this built, and then kick them out, and then it appears that it was being used by the Chinese military. Now this comes to light. Remember, the whole world is still dealing with this.

This is not done. And though things have gotten better in the United States, there's back to discussions about masks. And depending on where you live in the country, we're talking to a national program, you may very well already be forced to wear masks again.

You may not yet. It may be just a requirement. But look at the rest of the world as well. I mean, globally, this is still raging and there is someone to blame. And it appears more and more likely that it's the Chinese government and these Chinese officials, whether intentionally because they were just not good actors. And the French talk about this as well in their warnings that they didn't have the training necessary, they didn't have the technicians necessary to be doing the work with these dangerous viruses that they were doing.

They've had problems with leaks before on a smaller scale of viruses that have gotten out of this lab that have killed people, but that haven't been necessarily global pandemics. We're going to talk about this brand new report with our Senior Counsel for Global Affairs, former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, who's joining us live in the next segment of the broadcast. We'll take your calls, we'll take your comments, we'll get his thoughts first.

We'll be right back on Secular. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad, whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith, uncovering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy, and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress, the ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support. For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support.

Take part in our Matching Challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

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Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. Welcome back to Sekulow. And again, we are going to take your calls, your comments on this 1-800-684-3110.

That's 1-800-684-3110. We're joined now by our Senior Counsel for Global Affairs, former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. Secretary Pompeo, we've got a new report out now that the French intelligence officials had warned the Obama State Department back in 2015 that China was reducing cooperation with the French and that they had collaborated this new construction in the Wuhan lab and that the French were eventually kicked out a couple years later.

They weren't allowed to participate at all in the lab's research. And again, we're seeing daily evidence pointing back to problems from the Wuhan lab. I mean, more and more every single day while the world is still dealing with this problem. So what are your thoughts on this new report that the French intelligence was warning the U.S. government six years ago about this lab? So Jordan, it was very clear to us early on when the virus became transmissible lethal and had escaped into the world that the Wuhan Institute of Virology was at the base of it all. And while we couldn't prove it, because as you described, doctors being disappeared, journalists being taken off the map, we knew this history. We knew the history of the French built lab. We knew the history that they'd been kicked out. We knew that there had been resources placed there in an attempt to try and make the lab more secure.

But we knew that those had all ended in a bad way. And we had a lab where it was unsafe for practicing, unsafe gain-of-function research. We now are in a place where we can say with absolute certainty that the Chinese Communist Party foisted this virus upon the world. And it is now the time for the world, not just the United States, but the entire world to rise up and force the Chinese to account for the billions of dollars that they've destroyed and all of the millions of lives that have been lost. With all of that, we still have officials though, Secretary Pompeo, that are like Dr. Fauci, that defend this lab even with this information. And knowing, I'm assuming with his work, would have known these concerns from others in his field, but it's like he's running interference. I feel like we see this a lot with anything that involves China, is that these officials, whether they are doing it because they actually believe it or not, are willing to go to bat for the Chinese.

Dr. Fauci moused the exact same words of the Chinese Communist Party. He told the world, he said, why would they cover this up? They would want the world to know. Well, we know why they're covering up.

They don't want us to know that these butchers, these people who have no desire to protect and preserve human life and will do anything to make their country the global hegemon, saw this and allowed people to travel to Milan, Italy, to travel across the world, they closed on their own borders. I can only say this, I can't account for why Dr. Fauci is touting the same line that the Chinese Communist Party is, but it is so disconnected from reality and so dangerous. The risk of something like this happening again from that same laboratory is so serious that Dr. Fauci should not be involved in the United States government. This is really a risky proposition for America to have Dr. Fauci who believes that this laboratory should actually be conducting viral research that can do precisely what we've seen happen over the last 17 months.

When you're trying to get people to go along with the recommendations of the scientists and the CDC or the person who could replace Dr. Fauci, and he's become so controversial because of these statements, because of the back and forth he's gotten into with members of Congress as well on this and the continued defense. But I want to contrast it too with the new piece you've got up at ACLJ.org, we talked about it a little bit yesterday with you, on cyber security and the response to the cyber attacks on the U.S. You gave some credit in there to the Biden administration for calling out China's Ministry of State Security for their role in the cyber attack on Microsoft, but you point to the fact that we're not, we're calling out, we see tough talk but not action. If there's no action, you've been dealing with the Chinese directly as Secretary of State, as CIA Director, as a member of Congress, if there's no actual consequences and it's just the U.S. government condemning with words, does the Chinese back down at all? Okay, I think we lost Secretary Pompeo, see if we can reconnect with him in a minute.

Let me go to Thanh Binh in Washington, D.C. Thanh, Washington, we saw Dr. Fauci is calling Rand Paul a liar, we've seen this back and forth, let me go back to Secretary Pompeo, we've got Secretary Pompeo back. So what I was talking about is this idea though that you give credit to the Biden administration for calling out the Chinese, it doesn't seem to be like that's the problem, it's not the words, it's the actions. It's that we're not doing anything that, there really is a punishment. No, Jordan, there has to be real cost imposed, it's not about mouthing the right words, they're going to finish this so-called investigation in 30 days or so. No matter what it says, we know enough already, we can seize assets, we can file lawsuits, there are a myriad of tools, we can sanction senior leaders, we can build out a coalition around the world who says we're not doing anything. We can build out a coalition around the world who says we're not going to conduct operations in and around Wuhan, the place in which this virus came. The tools are readily available, we don't need any new laws, we don't need anything other than an administration that is prepared to impose enormous cost on China, the same way they imposed enormous cost on the United States of America. Does the same go to, I mean we know we're about a month away from an Intel report that President Biden asked on the COVID origins, again the tough talk, tough talk but no action.

A report, let's say this report does shed new light, the administration's talking points change and they kind of come to the realization that everyone has come to, that this is more likely than not something that happened in the lab, and that it leaked and we're really looking at intent, whether it was intentional or just horrendously negligent, to the point of where in most, any places would be criminally negligent considering what's going on still in the world today with this virus. But even if they do all that, is the same as the cyber security, I could expect tough words, but then what is going to be the follow up from, as you said, not just the United States but the world. If the world actually came together, we could punish China, right? They are big, they are powerful, but they can't escape the justice from the world if the world was willing to do it.

No Jordan, they certainly couldn't. One of the tasks that we began was to convince the world of what had taken place here, and I want to step back just for a second. We focused on this lab, that's important, there's lots of reasons for that, but we know this. Whether it was from the lab or as Dr. Fauci says, I'm natural, I don't believe that for a second, but if it were, it is still the case that the cover up, the crime, the transmission, the movement of this very contagious, highly lethal virus around the world is something that the Chinese Communist Party knowingly engaged in. So whatever this report says, whatever the administration comes up with, we know this, there's enough evidence that says that the Chinese Communist Party foisted a virus upon the world and they've killed millions of people. If they did that with any other mechanism, Jordan, they did that with missiles, if they did that in any other way, the world would demand that we hold them accountable and impose enormous costs on them. We have to do that, it is imperative. If we don't do this, the Chinese Communist Party will see the world for what we are, they'll see us as weak, and we can't permit this to happen.

They will drive a truck through that weakness. Final question, Secretary Pompeo, we're still dealing with this in our country. We saw the CDC, the new recommended guidelines, it kind of depends on where you live in the country, how that's affecting you, some places it's affecting people more than others. But we don't know what that will necessarily be like in the fall. But we know that the virus is real and it's still, I mean, if we look around the world, it is crippling the world from reopening.

We're not there yet. And this idea that if we have to go through, which it looks like we will, at least another year to get back to normal at a global stage, not just at home, not just in our local community, but at a global stage, that's not going to happen necessarily, it doesn't feel like it's going to be happening this fall, when you look at what's happening in the world. Do you think that that could be the tipping point for some of these world leaders and maybe the US, current US government as well, and administration to say, you know what, enough is enough with dealing with the Communist Party of China and that we've got to impose these punishments? I mean, how long is the world going to take this severe, severe pandemic?

I pray that that's the case. I will say that the evidence to date, right, we're now 18 months in, countries like India, countries like Japan, they've been greatly impacted by this. I hope that they will see that the United States will have their back. And that's what it's going to take American leadership here, Jordan, none of these countries will impose costs on China if we're not alongside them and leading this effort. But if we get this right, if America is prepared to take actions, not just issue press releases, not just have meetings, and scold them, but actually impose real costs on the United States is prepared to do that. These other countries, whether they're in Southeast Asia, whether they're in Africa, whether they're in Eastern Europe, who truly been impacted by what the Chinese Communist Party did to the world, I think we can build out a coalition and convince the Chinese Communist Party that it's going to be painful. They can never permit something like this to happen again.

We should start just Jordan with a really easy one. We should kick them out of the World Health Organization. We left, the United States left in the Trump administration because this has become a political organization. The right answer is for Dr. Tedros to kick them out of the organization because they have undermined any credibility that organization might ever have had. As they announced last week, they're not even going to let the World Health Organization back, and there's problems there as you just talked about, Secretary Pompeo.

But there you go folks, solutions, actual solutions to these issues, how to move forward if you have the guts to do so, and the will to do so, and to convince the world and our allies. We're able to bring you members of our team like Secretary Pompeo because of your support for the ACLJ. This is a matching challenge month. You can double the impact of your donation. Go to ACLJ.org. Donate today.

Be right back. It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, Planned Parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life. Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad. Whether it's defending religious freedom, protecting those who are persecuted for their faith, uncovering corruption in the Washington bureaucracy, and fighting to protect life in the courts and in Congress, the ACLJ would not be able to do any of this without your support.

For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's matching challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ. The work we do simply would not occur without your generous support. Take part in our matching challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Welcome back to Secular. We're going to take your phone calls, your comments as well.

Get them in on Facebook, Periscope, YouTube. We were just talking to former Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. He was a senior counsel with the ACLJ. Again, let me remind you, we've been able to make these additions to the team, high profile additions to the team, as well as continue to grow the team that may not be as high profile as a former Secretary of State because of your support for the ACLJ. So to be able to see something like this, to see a report like this and bring in a former Secretary of State, a former CIA Director, a former Director of National Intelligence like Rick Grenell, to be able to comment right away to you, to analyze and comment and give you actual solutions because they've actually been there. They know what can be done. They know what the U.S. is capable of. They know what the world is capable of. And as I asked Secretary Pompeo, we see China as this behemoth that's like, well, we've got to put up with them.

And, you know, there's so much business. But I asked if the world, notice he said it's not just the U.S. alone, it's the U.S. could take a leadership role in working with our allies. And as Secretary Pompeo talked about, India and Japan, allies like that.

So not just our Western allies, but our allies around the world in democracy who we work with on so many other issues that are high-level security, you know, military as well. But just look at the Olympic Games. The Chinese have impacted the world at a major level.

I mean, it's empty stadiums. And while our country may be going back to where you see stadiums, even whether or not they make you wear a mask in that stadium or not, being able to go back in, at least for now, but it's still not over, even in the United States. And it's far from over when you get to countries like India that are still experiencing this at such a massive level. And he said, no, they're not such a behemoth that they can't be impacted by the world.

World coming together could impose a serious punishment that would impact the Chinese Communist Party. But instead, it's a lot of, we see the tough talk, we see the condemnation, but we don't see the action. That is what it seems to be missing. And I want to go to Thanh a minute in Washington, D.C., because Thanh, we've just seen the mask mandates return to, not to Washington, D.C., but to Capitol Hill. And so, I mean, it's right in our face. What happened, I mean, this is now, we're almost two years in. When Secretary Pompeo told you about the 18 months, it's a gut check for everybody, because a lot of this time kind of molded, welded together, and it was, again, we've been hard at work at the ACLJ.

I remember the early days as to be continuous, so there wasn't a major gap in our work and our ability to continue functioning. But in Washington, you've got another example of, again, how this is impacting. And it's become political, but COVID is real, whether the mask mandates, the vaccines, you don't have to get into these debates back and forth to know that the virus is real and that people around the world are still dying from this, including in our own country. Yeah, there's still definitely an ebb and flow to it, Jordan.

It's definitely impacting the lives of regular American people all across the country. There's no doubt about that. I was actually pretty heartened to hear Secretary Pompeo say that he still thinks that if the federal government, specifically the Biden administration, can find the will, Jordan, that there's still time to have an impact on this. I'll admit, I'm a little less optimistic than that.

I just don't see any will shown, and so I'm concerned that that opportunity has passed. But here's what I would say. It is increasingly clear, Jordan, that the rest of the world knew that this lab was a problem even before the pandemic. It's increasingly clear as well that the United States was informed of that and that U.S. funding continued to flow to it anyway. It's equally clear, Jordan, that after the pandemic happened, they realized that the lab was the most likely source of the leak. And you heard Secretary Pompeo talk about whether that was the source of the leak or not. We know that the Chinese implemented a domestic travel ban without implementing an international travel ban. So all of that together, Jordan, it's ironclad conclusive proof that China is responsible for this outbreak and needs to be held accountable. But here's the question that is outstanding, and I think you've properly referenced the back and forth that Senator Paul has had with Dr. Fauci and others. Jordan, do you see any indication that there's a desire or a will on the part of the federal government to hold the Chinese accountable and to do anything about it? It's no longer a question, Jordan.

I really don't believe this. It's no longer a question of whether or not China is accountable. The question is, now that we know they're accountable, is the United States going to do anything about it? Well, Wes, from your military experience, the idea that the whole, we had the other intel communities that were directly involved, the French government saying, hey, 2015, we don't know if this is a great idea, 2017, they kicked us out. Same time, when the State Department looked into this, the report that came out in 2021, same date, 2017 is when they pinpointed the military kind of takeover of this lab by China. And the lab pre-exdated this collaboration with the French, but this is the new buildings you see, all the new technology they have at the lab. And one thing the French were concerned with was even before the military involvement, the security level, was that the Chinese did not have highly trained people dealing with these viruses. So we saw this happen on a much smaller and localized scale within China, where they would have these small outbreaks of virus. They weren't able to do this on a small scale even.

Right, right. Putting up my military hat for a moment, it is naive and unrealistic to think that you can separate Chinese civilian research from the Chinese Communist Party and the Chinese military. For years, the United States has had concerns over Chinese research, for example, into biological weapons, and that's in violation of the Biological Weapons Convention, which China along with the U.S. has signed. And as you said, even when the lab was being constructed and developed with help from the French, French defense officials and their intel officials had grave concerns over even engaging with the Chinese on this kind of sensitive research, and they were overruled by French politicians. And at the end of the Trump administration, the State Department revealed that they were indeed doing classified military research at this lab. And as you indicated, in 2018, when there was a State Department cable that warned that there were not highly trained technicians working at Wuhan, what happened? The Chinese not only denied it, they permanently banned the U.S. officials who sent that message from the lab itself. This is really not a good situation.

We've said it on this broadcast before. China is not our friend. They cannot be trusted. And this Wuhan issue, we will never know, I think, the whole truth of what's going on there. But we do know that the parties pulling the strings are the Chinese Communist Party and the Chinese military, and that they are intimately involved in this, which is part of the reason they will not let researchers go in.

They will not reveal, let the world see the records. Last week, the World Health Organization requested a new investigation into the whole COVID issue at this lab. Here's how the Chinese Communist Party responded. First of all, they denied the World Health Organization's request, but you know what they did after that?

They suggested an alternative investigation, and that is that the Hu investigate the military lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland, instead. Yes, so again, they're going to play this propaganda game because the world has not yet come together to punish them. Or to say, you know what, then you're out of the World Health Organization, like Secretary Pompeo said, to kick them out.

Because if they're not even allowing those groups in, and these are groups that are already suspect from the U.S., where the Trump administration left them, then what do we expect they're going to be? Tough talk is not bothering them. They complain about everything. They have tough talk, too, about the Olympics, but they're not pulling out of the Olympics.

They're still competing. It's actions. Actions that mean something. I also want to let you know, we're filing today in the case out of Mississippi that is a direct challenge to Roe vs. Wade. Not just one, but three different briefs looking at three different issues. One, the international issue, the stare decisis issue, the actual issue involving these later term abortions. All being done by the ACLJ.

That is filing today at the Supreme Court. Support our work. Donate. Be part of our matching challenge this month of July. Double the impact your donation at ACLJ.org.

We'll be right back. At the American Center for Law and Justice, we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's matching challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Live from Washington, D.C., Sekulow Live. And now, your host, Jordan Sekulow. Folks, by the way, I want to encourage our audience who's watching the broadcast, if you're on Facebook, I want you to do two things. One, share.

Click the share button. And if you're having any issues with watching, because we are starting to, we don't know, there's no tech issue from our side right now. I don't know what's happening with Facebook. Our team's looking into it. So if you're having glitches, I want you to share it, though. I want to get the number back up, because we saw this bizarre thing happen where we hit this number twice of live viewers, and both times the broadcast went down on Facebook. Nothing on our end. And I know our radio stations, everything is clear, on the other ways YouTube is clear, so everything we're sending out.

So there's other places you can go to watch. But I encourage you right now, let's share this. I want to see how many people you get to share, see if this happens again, see what's going on with Facebook.

You never know these days. Is it just because we're talking about the Wuhan lab? Which, by the way, nothing outside of what is just a report. We're talking to a former Secretary of State who's part of our team, so I would hope that's not some kind of a shadow banning going on with Facebook. But I do want to let you know, if you're having trouble, it's on YouTube, Instagram as well, and of course even ACLJ.org, if you really have an issue, we always put it there as well.

The live feed is there. We are, again, discussing this brand new report. Let me just recap it for you. So in 2015, we now know French intelligence officials warned the US government, and I want to read this for you, that their own foreign ministry, that China was cutting back on their collaboration. Just to let you know, the French helped build the new parts of the lab.

So you kind of see the images of the Wuhan lab, you see kind of an old building, because it started in the 1950s. Then they zoom out, you see these brand new buildings, relatively brand new, four years old, five years old, and that's what they're talking about. So the French came in, they provided the tech, they provided this new construction, but they were going to be partners.

So maybe everyone would feel a little more comfortable. By the way, at the time this happened, the French military wasn't comfortable with it, and the French intel community was not comfortable with it. But the politicians moved forward, they're the people directly elected by the people, so you deal with those consequences. But then in 2017, they finished the construction, they finished the build out. They're about to launch a reopening of the new wings, or launch a brand new opening of these new wings at this research institute in Wuhan, China.

And what happens right before that? After they get everything from the French, well you can probably guess, the French get kicked out. That was the direct quote, were kicked out of the lab, and cooperation completely ceased.

The French officials then warned the State Department that they had grave concerns as to Chinese motivations. We can date back to our own State Department report in 2021 that says that same time period, 2017, it appears that the Chinese military took this lab over. It all kind of works together, and we're starting to see this more and more, even though this has become, unfortunately, feels like a partisan issue in Washington. This should not feel partisan as we just talked to the first half hour, because I know there's politics around the vaccine, there's politics over the mask.

There should be no politics over the fact that COVID is real, it's impacting the entire world, it's impacting the United States, it's impacting Americans' ability to work, and it's still, with the confusion out of the CDC earlier this week, this is something we're all dealing with every day. And everyone should want those who perpetrated this on the rest of the world to be held accountable, Jordan, and look, it's just hard to come to a conclusion other than the fact that not everybody wants that. I mean, just this story today, look, the French were kicked out in 2017, and yet today, literally this week, Jordan, we have U.S. officials at the very top of the federal government continuing to defend the lab pretty robustly. I would ask the question, I mean, were we, was the United States, Jordan, let inside that lab throughout? I would be happy to be proven wrong on this, Jordan, but I would really bet the farm that the answer to that is no. So if we were not allowed into the lab, just like the French were not allowed into the lab, why are we going forward and defending them at all costs without asking questions? To me, Jordan, that brings up questions of motive. Yeah, I think it's absolute, I mean, the idea is, I would love to know from those Fauci types, did they ever invite you to come? I mean, why are you so defensive of something you may never have even seen in person?

And if they started, if you ever did go, and then you got kicked out, didn't that raise your suspicions of what they were, they were using all this new technology that they got from France for? We'll be back, we'll take your calls, your comments online, and remember, on social media, share this on Facebook, let's see where we go there. For that, we are grateful. Now there's an opportunity for you to help in a unique way. For a limited time, you can participate in the ACLJ's Matching Challenge. For every dollar you donate, it will be matched. A $10 gift becomes $20.

A $50 gift becomes $100. This is a critical time for the ACLJ, the work we do simply would not occur without your generous support. Take part in our Matching Challenge today. You can make a difference in the work we do, protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family. Give a gift today online at ACLJ.org. Only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive. And that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life. We've created a free, powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn.

It's called Mission Life. It will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support. And the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases, how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists, the ramifications of Roe v. Wade 40 years later, Planned Parenthood's role in the abortion industry, and what Obamacare means to the pro-life movement. Discover the many ways your membership with the ACLJ is empowering the right to life.

Request your free copy of Mission Life today online at ACLJ.org slash gift. So while we are, unfortunately, in our own country having to politically debate, you know, how to hold the Chinese accountable and all these issues, gain of function research that you've heard about, whether we were funding that and how much we were funding it. were funding it. Even after the French get kicked out, even after the French tell us don't work with it, hey you know our our intel was right, our military was right, we shouldn't have done this in the first place. They kicked us out and then they reopened the lab and by the way on top of the Chinese military getting involved with the lab they also aren't don't have the training necessary to be doing the research they're doing and they have a history of letting viruses out intentionally or not.

Whether it's unintentional, so even just not not being able to function at the high level you would have to to be dealing with such dangerous potential leaks out of these labs. We saw again Chinese initially Chinese researchers come out and and trying to say what happened here they all disappeared. People we saw again we saw the domestic travel events they had talked about but Wes you've got a new piece up just just up at aclj.org on how our secretary of state our current secretary of state Blinken and the Biden administration they go to the U.N. not to investigate not to put more pressure on China now the while the world's suffering while millions are dealing with this all around the world and but they have asked the U.N. Human Rights Council to come investigate racism in the United States.

Yeah and human rights as if we are you know routinely abusing you know people as to their human rights go yeah I encourage people to read the the post that's up on our website because it's it's one of the most important issues we're dealing with right now. Secretary Blinken literally asked the United Nations Human Rights Council which by the way includes members of that council are Cuba, China, Russia, people that are notorious violators of human rights. Secretary Blinken has asked those people those countries to come in and do an official investigation of the United States as to racism and human rights in America. It's unbelievable when I read the reports I could not believe them the United Nations is weak and frequently corrupt on a good day their agencies and their various you know bureaucracies tend to be completely inept and and not effective and so that's a given as it is but we should be pushing that branch of the United Nations the World Health Organization to really crack down and and demand information from China but instead of doing that as you indicated Jordan and pushing the United Nations to investigate this outbreak that has killed 2 million people around the world and totally disrupted the world economy including the American economy instead of doing that Secretary Blinken thinks that the United States itself should be investigated by the United Nations by countries like Cuba, Russia, and China.

It is if it were not so serious it would seem like a joke it is not a joke. Now I mean this this idea that we can't fan it's like we can't even get through a congressional hearing with with getting direct answers because and this I think goes so some of what we were talking about yesterday we talked about it with the what's happened on the college campuses all of these these high profile individuals that are kind of quasi-government actors like Fauci and others it just appears they they've got some interest and I'm sure it's financial that's usually what it ends up being at the end of the day that there's a reason why they're willing to go to bat for for the Chinese Communist Party a country engaged right now in genocide that the state department the current state department occupants also concluded is a genocide and yet they are they are defensive anytime you go to the Chinese I don't think that you even if like Fauci didn't believe and he had a different opinion he's so defensive about it that it appeared it's like there and when you get defensive like that it's like what's going on here I mean you can disagree without being defensive. Yeah he's welcome to have another opinion Jordan but the idea that you can't even engage him in good faith or many others in good faith with an opposing opinion is very suspicious I mean I just give you two examples first of all if you think back to the to several months ago when suggesting that this virus might have come out of a lab when Jordan any reasonable objectionable person looking at this would say of course the most likely source is that lab that's two blocks away from where the outbreak happened where they're studying this exact thing that is not a crackpot theory Jordan that is the first place you would look if you were trying to investigate and yet having that opinion or asking that question got you laughed out of this town and then I would fast forward to today Jordan these congressional hearings with Dr. Fauci and others it becomes unreasonable to have an opinion that we should not continue to this day to fund gain of function research in Chinese labs that seems like a very reasonable position to me it is unreasonable to suggest that the Chinese should be held accountable for the pandemic that they've unleashed on the world that again that's a reasonable position that's laughed out of this town right now. Number three I would say that to be concerned about the veracity of what our government is telling our citizens on everything from masks to vaccines to transmission rate to any other thing Jordan it's reasonable to be concerned about that when the position of the federal government has changed back and forth several times now look I'm with you I think the virus is real I think precautions should be taking place I think it was a tricky situation for federal officials but if I'm a regular American as I am and I'm looking at a federal government that tells me one thing on one day and another thing the other day guess what I'm going to be Jordan I'm going to be a little suspicious about what that official tells me the next time around. Suspicious confused I mean I just saw breaking news alert the house is going to arrest staffers who don't wear masks and that's where then we get focused on we that should not be our number one top concern when we still don't know why we're even still talking about masks why do we still have these issues why we're dealing with different variants why why where where did this start where did this begin everything else it feels like is a distraction Wes it's like we can get into all these domestic issues and say you know partisan and line up side by side Republican and Democrat we like mass though the other side doesn't like mass other wants vaccine other says don't push this on me I mean but that's also not getting to the point those were the those were ways to try and handle this problem as states it extremely tricky there was a shutdown by the Trump administration for two weeks here we had to stay at home to stop the spread that didn't work but they tried to listen to the scientists but now the science has gone back and forth so many times yes it's confusing in the US but it's ignoring the real issue it is ignoring the real issue and there is communication chaos that's an understatement there's also policy chaos too I mean think about it Jordan you know we have gone through you know almost 18 months of pure hell on the world in the United States and yet the communication is still unclear it changes from week to week and day to day there is so much partisan politics around this think about it last fall when President Trump was pushing for the quick development of a vaccine the people that are in power now were poo-pooing that idea and recommending people not get the vaccine it went through anyway thanks to the Trump administration and went through quickly and now they're trying to get people to take the vaccine and yet the whether or not it's effective and whether or not you have to wear a mask all these policies keep changing the administration and and you know governors and mayors around the country appear to be almost ready we're not sure but almost ready to lock down our semi-lockdown America again and yet here's part of the policy chaos at the border people with COVID are being allowed to not only cross the border but to stay across the border and then they're being transported to various cities around the United States either without being tested or without being treated that is a mixed message we're concerned about COVID we're thinking about new restrictions in schools and businesses and other places and I understand that it's a serious issue but at the same time literally this is no exaggeration thousands of COVID positive people are crossing the border and and not being detained they're being allowed to cross they reported yesterday that many of these people there are so many crossing the border right now they're told wherever you're going in the interior of the United States find the nearest ICE office and make an appointment yeah right and yet some of these people actually have COVID and that's not a that's not a theory they actually do some of them have COVID they've been diagnosed they've had COVID tests and yet they're still being released into America and yet on the other hand we're supposed to be really really concerned about the rest of us in America whether or not to wear a mask whether or not to get the vaccine and on and on and on it's crazy chaos you know I want to let everybody know too we don't just talk about any of these issues obviously we've got former officials who were living this like secretary Pompeo on our team but we also have filed a lawsuit against uh Rick's uh Rick Rinnells uh where he served as the acting director of national intelligence what we filed a lawsuit against ODNI and NIH regarding the Wuhan lab theories uh uh that basically that that's come to the you know the majority view that so this was this was lab created and then the question is it was intentional unintentional and you know much bigger investigation by the way we have a big enough government and certainly you all know that pay your taxes that we fund that can walk and chew gum at the same time that so what do I mean there I mean they can handle what we need to do domestically to confront COVID but they can also research okay you know but they're trying to just everything is a distraction away from who is really to blame here and I feel like it's because they've lined their pockets so many times they go back to the Chinese bank you know the the the handout if you will and whether you're selling your art to Chinese investors uh like the President's son whose has now become an artist or you've had all these other business ventures in the past uh so you've got this hesitancy to then do anything that will upset that that uh those business interests those financial interests so we filed the lawsuit we are in court now so we filed the foyer of course they didn't want to respond we're now in court in fact the next joint briefing schedule status report is just about 20 days away on August 18th so I mean we are actively involved at the ACLJ that's why we encourage you to support our work you can double the impact your donation this month of July by donating online at ACLJ.org only when a society can agree that the most vulnerable and voiceless deserve to be protected is there any hope for that culture to survive and that's exactly what you are saying when you stand with the American Center for Law and Justice to defend the right to life we've created a free powerful publication offering a panoramic view of the ACLJ's battle for the unborn it's called Mission Life it will show you how you are personally impacting the pro-life battle through your support and the publication includes a look at all major ACLJ pro-life cases how we're fighting for the rights of pro-life activists the ramifications of Roe v Wade 40 years later play on parenthood's role in the abortion industry and what 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we do protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family give a gift today online at ACLJ.org Welcome back to Sekulow and I want to I go to thank you because another piece of the news that I get excited I don't want everybody to you know we focus and rightfully so on our situations here at home what we're all dealing with where you are locally can all impact by the COVID issues uh getting back to school issues but but then another major kind of breakthrough that was announced yesterday at least that's how what we're being told it is is the infrastructure package we're told is just you know it's a trillion dollars and as we talked about before the show today you know if if we had a deal that was just a trillion dollars that's a ton of money but we know we have infrastructure issues in our country that we should deal with and that's a role of the federal government whether it's roads bridges travel airport communication technology etc but that's not the full story here. Yeah it's not Jordan I mean look we've said it on this broadcast many times before there was always a path to a bipartisan infrastructure deal like that like you said was truly infrastructure roads and bridges and waterways on down the line you go you go and I think yesterday at least in part this is only part of the story Jordan but is is evidence of that there's an announcement that there's a framework in place 1.2 trillion dollars on a bipartisan basis 17 republicans joined with democrats to invoke cloture on the motion to proceed basically that means they agreed to start the debate on the bill on this compromise Jordan if that were the entirety of the story I would tell you that I would think it's probably a pretty good thing that they're going to come to a deal on a bipartisan basis they're going to pass this infrastructure measure but there's a couple of things that our listeners really need to know number one first of all Jordan on this package there's no text yet I mean this is increasingly the way that congress does that does this we don't have a bill we don't know the specifics so I can't even tell you how good that bill would be but here's the more concerning part Jordan President Biden leader Schumer and speaker Pelosi are saying they will only vote on this deal if a larger partisan reconciliation package that comes in with a financial score of about three and a half trillion dollars moves first Jordan now we've seen these reconciliation packages before and I am here to guarantee you that is not going to be a true infrastructure bill that is going to be a leftist wish list bill so here here's my biggest concern for these these 17 republicans that voted for this this bill that on its own Jordan might be just fine you have to treat this entire bill this entire negotiation now as if it's a five trillion dollar deal and three and a half trillion of that is a leftist wish list because Jordan if they're not going to move this narrower package without getting that larger partisan package isn't that just one big bill in my view it is yeah I mean this is again I think what's troubling about this is that it seems right now it's being lauded as bipartisan and it you know it doesn't take that many US senators so I mean could this pass the way that we're nervous about and is it be I mean are they going to be selling this to the American people the same way as the Biden team I that's what that's what makes me nervous about this and then we end up with this this bloated bill which right now you because there's conflicting you got the AOC types of the squad they're complaining about this deal so what do we think happens next well first of all I don't think AOC is going to be complaining if she gets the three and a half trillion dollar package on the back end of it so look she might be complaining now it might be posturing but what do I think is going to happen Jordan I don't think this is a foregone conclusion because this first package which which again might be acceptable once we see the text and once we can look at it it actually might be a reasonable bill they will need 10 republicans to join all 50 democrats or if they lose a couple democrats you might need a couple more republicans to reach that 60 vote threshold I don't think that's a foregone conclusion Jordan only 17 republican members agreed to start the debate and many of them said they're waiting to see the text they want to see how it gets amended before they vote on the final so I would tell you I think it's most likely to pass usually these things do get over the line but I don't think it's a foregone conclusion but Jordan again you have to say that in the very same breath that you say the follow-on package the one that is not going to get republican support you don't need any republicans to pass that one because they're moving it through reconciliation it will only take 50 votes and the vote of the vice President to move that into law we're going to follow this closely because this is again if you just watch the headlines the headlines seem like oh it's just a trillion just a trillion does but it's the package that we thought okay that's what we could agree to that's that number that's been around 900 billion to a trillion dollars and you know that would be something you could work through see okay what's good in this what's not you start getting that three trillion dollar range I mean you are who knows what you're funding and again you're getting back to that idea we'll figure out what we're funding after we pass it so this is again something to watch very carefully because the name of it sounds something like we could still one of the few things we could all agree on the United States still is infrastructure you know when it when it actually means infrastructure should be watching that carefully I do want to Wes again you've got that new piece up at aclj.org because in the midst of all of this in the midst of what we've talked about today on COVID this new reports about the the French warning us telling us this was no good and and still the world having to deal with this that's the U.S. not asking the U.N. to look into that of course not not pushing the World Health Organization to throw China out after they banned the World Health Organization for going back in and they officially announced that last week no the U.S. wants to investigate has asked the world to come in and investigate what's happening here are we a racist country I mean they want to make us an apartheid state they do and it's a surrender of American sovereignty of American independence you know your dad and you and some others fought just last year at the international criminal court because they do not have jurisdiction over prosecuting U.S. soldiers which they they wanted to do the United Nations does not have the authority to come into the United States and investigate the United States you know over human rights and races especially when it's Cuba Russia and China doing the investigating you know Jordan there's so much in our country that is dividing us right now bitter bitter division politically and there are other things that should bring us together things like national security getting to the root of COVID and confronting China infrastructure you know jobs are so much that should unite us the petty partisan politics needs to be laid laid aside and we need to come together as Americans unfortunately when the Secretary of State of the United States are our leading representative to the world from the diplomatic standpoint asks that we be investigated for human rights abuses and racism by the United Nations including Russia Cuba China that is a travesty and that does not unite us that divides us as a nation. Let me remind you as well the ACLJ filing today at the Supreme Court multiple briefs and there's going to be a piece up at ACLJ.org as well that walk you through that and we'll talk about that again as well as this case nears the case out of Mississippi a direct challenge to Roe vs Wade and the court has taken it this is not asking the court to take it the court is going to hear this in the fall we are weighing in even our European Center for Law and Justice weighing in with the international law which should be surprising to many but not those of us who work in the pro-life world that what we allow in the United States is not allowed in the western world when it comes to abortion that they have acknowledged the the life of the unborn child and the importance of the protection of that life much more thoroughly through their laws than we have here in our own country which may be a surprise to a lot of those on the left and those abortion supporters in the U.S. We are also the the J-Sekulow band will be doing as they do during these matching challenge month a concert for you Saturday evening 8 p.m eastern time you can check that out through again Facebook as well on the J-Sekulow page I will talk to remind you about that tomorrow again but I want to encourage you to support the work of the ACLJ we have a matching challenge this month we double the impact of your donation so if you donate $30 right now on ACLJ.org that is like $60 for the ACLJ but it only is is charging you costing you $30 that's that support which again is how we're able to do to build our team and continue to be actively engaged in all these issues at the American Center for Law and Justice we're engaged in critical issues at home and abroad for a limited time you can participate in the ACLJ's matching challenge for every dollar you donate it will be matched a $10 gift becomes $20 a $50 gift becomes 100 you can make a difference in the work we do protecting the constitutional and religious freedoms that are most important to you and your family give a gift today online at ACLJ.org