Rebels vs. the Establishment on Wall Street

In 1901, a woman by the name of Annie Taylor climbed into a barrel so that she could ride that barrel over Niagara Falls, the first person to do so. The reason for her crazy endeavor?

She was struggling to make ends meet and she was hoping for fame and financial security. It's Ryan from United Faith Mortgage, a faith and family mortgage team that tries to improve your financial outlook without having to ship you over a 170 foot waterfall. Our mortgage team happens to be an arm of a bigger company who is a direct lender, which means our company gets to use its own money and make its own decisions within its own walls.

There's no middleman. This advantage often allows us to get you a better rate, which can save you monthly and lifelong money through a refinance, or help you with a cash out refinance, cashing out some of your home's equity to use for life. We are United Faith Mortgage. United Faith Mortgage is a DBA of United Mortgage Corp. 25 Melville Park Road, Melville, NY. Licensed mortgage banker. For all licensing information go to nmlsconsumeraccess.org. Corporate NMLS number 1330, equal housing lender.

Not licensed in Alaska, Hawaii, Georgia, Massachusetts, North Dakota, South Dakota, and Utah. We're all familiar with the account of David versus Goliath in the Bible. Well, a similar story has been taking place on Wall Street but with millions of Davids. Followers of Reddit, a social media discussion site, are buying up shares of troubled companies by the truckload and causing a panic on Wall Street. Today, Kingdom Advisors President Rob West has the details.

Now, we're pre-recorded today, so please hold your calls until next time. It's the Rebels versus the establishment on Wall Street, next, right here on MoneyWise Live. Well, Rob, we don't usually talk about individual stocks or name names here on the program, and we want to make it clear that we're not advising anyone to buy the companies that you're going to mention, right?

That's true, Steve. This isn't investing advice. We just want to inform listeners about a phenomenon on Wall Street that's really changing the way things have always been done. And the power of social media is playing a big role, right?

Right. But let's start with who's involved. On the one hand, you have a very large group of young upstart day traders. These are millennials and younger people, even down to Gen Z. On the other hand, you have the establishment professionals who manage large funds, also hedge fund operators and what they call short sellers. That last group is people who basically bet on a company's stock price falling.

And I take it these two groups don't always get along? Well, up till now, the old timers probably haven't paid much attention to the youngsters, but these young day traders have always had it in for the Wall Street professionals whom they blame for causing big market downturns like we saw in 2008. So they feel they're finally getting some payback. And how exactly are they doing that?

Yeah. Well, this is all taking place on a certain Reddit page called Wall Street Bets, which has actually two million followers. They're able to communicate with each other and identify struggling companies that are likely targets of the short sellers. The day traders then buy options for those stocks. Maybe it would help if you explain how this works.

Right. Options are essentially bets investors put on a stock allowing them to buy or sell at a certain price. When that happens in large volume, it can force the price of a stock up or down. Well, short sellers are investors who essentially borrow shares at one price, hoping the stock's value will fall. Well, when it does, they settle the account at the lower price, keeping the difference as profit. But if the stock's value climbs higher, well, they lose money. Okay. And that's what's been happening with this Reddit Wall Street Bets business.

Exactly. Plenty of those two million Wall Street Bets followers are buying up stocks of the companies like GameStop, Blackberry, Bed Bath and Beyond, and even AMC Theaters. As a result, their stock prices have risen almost beyond belief. GameStop has been sliding in recent days, but it was up something like seventeen hundred percent at one point. Now, we are not telling you to buy those stocks, and we'll get into that in a bit.

All right. So the hedge fund guys and the short sellers are losing their shirts right now. Is that the deal?

Yes. And driving those stock prices even higher is that they have to buy shares themselves to hedge their bets and minimize their losses. No wonder that they call it a short squeeze. The Wall Street elite are really getting squeezed by these upstart millennial day traders. Okay.

Wow. And why do you think this is happening right now? Well, in a word, technology stock trading has undergone a major change. Maybe you could say it's been revolutionized by technology and no fee apps like Robinhood.

These apps allow armchair investors to use sophisticated tools like options that were once only available to the Wall Street elite. Well, then you add in a platform like Reddit with millions of followers, and suddenly a single post can affect the price of a stock. Hundreds of posts by people saying they were buying GameStop or another of the troubled companies, and prices began to soar. One Wall Street bets poster said he'd already paid off most of his student loans thanks to buying GameStop options. I think this might be a good time to say once again that we're not telling people to start buying these stocks.

Absolutely. This is just another bubble, and all bubbles burst at some point. You know, if you jump in while prices are high, there's a real chance the price will collapse by the time you sell it. You remember that Children's Game musical chairs when the music stops?

Someone is always left without a chair to sit in. We always advise folks to have a long-range investment plan with an appropriately diversified portfolio of stocks and bonds, depending on your age and the years you have before retirement. Let me finish with Proverbs 21 5, the plans of the diligent lead to profit as surely as haste leads to poverty. Thanks, Rob. Hey, we're on tape today, but we have some great caller questions already lined up for you, and they're straight ahead. This is Money Wise Live. Welcome back to Money Wise Live, where we remember that God owns it all. Also, please remember that today's program is prerecorded. Don't try to call in yourself. Let's go back to our phones.

Roots Town, Ohio. Hello, Bob. What's on your mind today, sir? Okay, the $27 trillion national debt, or more or less, unfunded mandates, Social Security, Medicare, compared to the GDP, I perceive a thought that the dollar today is technically actually worthless. The government is broke. We're living on printing money, therefore inflation, inflation, inflation. Most of what you, Steve and Rob, are promoting are investing in dollar accounts. Stock market is a dollar account. That $20.30 is a dollar account. I perceive when a day is coming soon, the dollar will not be valued at anything through inflation and devaluation. My question is, what tangible items, gold, silver, copper, brass, lead, can be had or used that is kind of off grid, but not too far out to be considered fringe?

Is there something I can invest in and hold that will maintain a value if and when the dollar goes worthless? No gold standard whatsoever. Sure, I appreciate that, Bob.

And you know, I'm not sure you're gonna love my answer. Because, you know, here's the reality is that you're right. We are printing a lot of money. Yes, the national debt, I believe is a bit out of control. We have and will exceed this year for the first time ever more national debt than we have one year gross domestic product at $27 trillion, which about roughly the size of our economy. The good news is that even though the national debt has been on a tear on the upside the last decade, with interest rates as low as they are, the debt payments are quite manageable right now.

And we have a massive economy that's actually still doing quite well and has weathered the pandemic quite well. Now, I agree monetary policy is a tricky business. And, you know, the Fed has quite a number of tools at their disposal, most notably how they raise and lower interest rates. And I can tell you that most people are expecting inflation to tick up to about 2% by March. And if they see it at that level sustained or moving higher, what they will do is what they always do, which is begin to raise interest rates. And it's always a tricky game between raising rates such to keep inflation tame and yet still keeping the economy and the stock market expanding. So what do you do if you believe that the dollar was going to collapse or we'd have an economic collapse or something like that?

The challenge is, if everything collapses, like you're describing, we'd have much bigger problems, whether or not you had bars of gold or silver or other precious metals or commodities, you know, in a safe place nearby, because you'd have to be able to convert that to a denomination or a means of exchange that would be appropriate to buy a loaf of bread or to buy a gallon of gas. I just don't think that's where we're headed. Does that mean this couldn't get out of control down the road?

No, it could. But I think when our backs are against the wall, we will make the hard decisions and the policymakers will have to address the debt. I wish we would have done it during the boom times the last decade before we got into the pandemic. And that's been a real problem that even when we're in those times of expanding economies and a stock market that's growing rapidly, we're not balancing the budget and dealing with surpluses to pay down our debt.

That's something we have to correct. But I just don't see the alternative being one that's prudent and effective. And I think at the end of the day, we can't control those things. What we can control is what God has entrusted to us. And I still believe that the very best way for you to be a faithful manager of God's resources is to live well within your means, to have an appropriate amount of cash on hand and to be investing for the future, either in real assets like property or stocks and bonds. Now, if everything were to really get very difficult, you know, I don't think you're necessarily any better off by having these stores of value just because of how hard they are to secure and use as an effective means of exchange. So I think at the end of the day, we trust the Lord and I think we as a nation will deal with the things you're describing appropriately when the time comes and when we have to.

And I don't think that day is quite here yet. Bob, we do appreciate your call and your intriguing question and your 57 years of marriage. God bless you and your wife. Okay. Chicago, Chuck, welcome to MoneyWise Live. Your question for Rob? Hi. Yeah.

Thank you for taking my call. I've been banking at Bank of America for 30 plus years, and I had a what they call a personal line of credit, which is basically an overdraft protection. And they recently sent me a letter saying they were changing the terms of it, but they weren't changing the account.

They were actually deleting the account. So I just don't want to do business with them anymore. It's a bad time to be doing this to everybody who's trying to make ends meet. So I travel all over the country. I drive, track or trailer. So I'm just looking for something where I'm not going to be spending a fortune in ATM fees. Yes. Let me ask you, Chuck, what is important to you other than free ATM withdrawals with a robust nationwide network? Do you want to have a brick and mortar bank that you can walk into? Are you comfortable using an online bank, you know, as long as you have an ATM network with fee free access? What is it you're looking for? Yeah, well, my wife is obviously at home, so she's we live in Maryland, so she's at home and I'm all over the country.

So I need her to be able to get money if she needs to get money so she can get it at an ATM without a fee. That's great. That's really the big thing right now. Yes.

Okay. Well, you know, I think I mean, you could do a couple of things. Number one is either bankrate.com or nerdwallet.com could rate the banks so you could get an idea of from a customer service standpoint, fees, the robustness of the ATM network. I mean, all of that would be there and you could do a bit of research just to see what's going to be the right fit for you. I think the biggest decision is are you comfortable with a purely an online bank that's not going to have any brick and mortar establishments that you'll be able to walk into. But you'd have to do everything online or through an ATM. If you are, there's some wonderful options.

You know, I like Marcus a lot. I like Ally Bank a lot and Ally.com. I like Capital One, Capital One 360.

I like a lot. Both Capital One and Ally use the Allpoint ATM network, which is the nation's largest no fee network. They've got over 43,000 ATMs, including at places like CVS and Walgreens and Target, other national retailers. So, you know, I think that would work for you in the sense that you wouldn't have any fees. You'd get a decent interest rate on your savings. You can have access to the funds through the ATM. I think you'd be happy with their customer service.

They win all kinds of awards. The key, though, is you're not going to have that brick and mortar bank that you or she can pull up to, walk in, see somebody face to face and, you know, do whatever business you need to do. So I think that's the starting point. If that's important to you, there still are some great options. And again, I think those two websites can help you narrow down the features that you're looking for with the service and the fees that you also expect.

Again, NerdWallet.com or Bankrate.com. Thank you, Chuck. We appreciate that call today. One more quick one.

Murfreesboro, Indiana. And Jennifer, three minutes. Let's squeeze it in. All right.

All right. So my question is, me and my husband, we're officially debt free. And we're looking at what our next steps are. We just found out that we're going to need to do some remodeling in the house.

We've got bad flooring. We bought our house just over a year ago. Long story short, we've got about 25 grand in savings. And like I said, we are debt free except for our mortgage. So we're trying to figure out, do we take that money and put it into the house repairs? Or do we finance something and keep that as emergency and look at possibly investing? Because we don't have any investments to sell our 401ks at work right now.

All right. What percent are you putting in the 401ks, Jennifer? Do you know? Well, I'm putting, it was three percent and every year goes up by a percentage. So I think I'm at four or five percent now at work. They do matching. So I do as much as they will match me.

And I believe it's at five percent now. So if you're putting in five, they're matching on top of that or that's the total that's going in? Yes. Yes, they match on top of it. All right. And your husband's doing something similar? Yes. OK, that's great.

Well, listen, let me just encourage you. You guys are 30 years old. You're out of debt except for your home. You've got six months worth of savings and you are systematically putting away toward retirement. It sounds like perhaps even as much as 10 percent.

That's great. Ultimately, I'd love for you to get up to 15 percent. In terms of where we go from here, do you have a sense of what the total cost is going to be on these improvements?

We don't yet. We know that the flooring, they said it could be anywhere from 10 to 20 grand. OK. All right. And then we've got like a wall, a load bearing wall or whatever that's got to get fixed.

So we're thinking that this whole thing could cost anywhere from 40 to 50 grand. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right.

Very good. Well, I think the key is unless you need to refinance right now, and if you did, I'd do it in a very specific way. You know, I think you're probably going to be better off, you know, maybe spending that down to three months expenses.

So perhaps use maybe 10 to 12000 of it. But the rest, I would get a home equity loan, not a line of credit, where you get a fixed interest rate, get the money you need to make the repairs you need, and then try to pay it off as quickly as you can. As soon as you do, then focus on building that emergency fund back up. Thanks, Jen. We appreciate it.

More MoneyWise Live after this. Hey, it's a joy to have you with us today on MoneyWise Live. That guy over there, the good looking one, the guy with all the answers, he's Rob West. I'm Steve Moore, and I just kind of do what I'm doing here, letting you know that today's program is prerecorded. Yep, we're not really here in the studio. We had to take a little bit of time off.

I think it was dental work. I'm not sure exactly, but we're prerecorded today. Don't call in.

Floss more often, Rob. Let's go to Northbrook, Illinois. Cam, nice to have you with us. Thanks so much. And what's on your mind?

Hi. Yes, I was inquiring about faith-based investing. I had heard a program previously on your program that explained about faith-based investing, and I'm interested in doing it.

But my question is, I know that I can call, I think it was Eventide with the company and talk to them about it. But what about for 401Ks that you already have, like that you have through your work or whatever, is it possible to do faith-based investing on those? It is, Cam, but it's a growing segment of the investing universe, and not all 401Ks have, in fact most don't have, but a growing number do, access to the faith-based investment options.

What I'm encouraged by is that we're seeing more and more added all the time. And so what you'll want to do is become familiar with the faith-based investing mutual fund options. You mentioned investeventide.com, and I would certainly check with them. Many of their funds are in 401Ks around the country. And then perhaps you could go to faithdriveninvestor.com and look for a listing there of all of the different investment options.

I'm just pulling that up now to make sure I've given you the right website. But what you'll see there, and I think it's actually.org, I'll have my team look at that. But what you'll see there is a listing of all of the mutual funds, ETFs, all of the different options that are available. And as you become familiar with those fund families, then you can start looking for those. Because what's unique about a 401K is you don't have access to the full investing universe. You only have availability to the options that are inside that particular plan. And the administrator chooses the funds that you're going to see. And so it really just depends on your 401K. So head to that website I mentioned, and I did confirm, it's faithdriveninvestor.org, and then click on Funds. And you'll see a list of all the mutual funds, the ETF providers, all of them. And then you could compare that list against the various fund families in your 401K and see what you have.

Now, here's the last thing I'll say, Cam. If you don't have any faith-based investment options, let the fund family or the custodian of the 401K know that you want that. So if it's Fidelity, call Fidelity. If it's Vanguard, call Vanguard.

Tell them you're looking for these types of options in their plan, and they listen to their customers. And perhaps there's not one today, but there will be one added down the road. So does that give you what you're looking for? Yes, it does. And I had a further follow-up question on the company that Eventide is at.

How do you spell that? Yeah, E-V-E-N-T-I-D-E. Eventide.com. Yeah, and the website is investeventide.com. Okay, Eventide. Great. All right, thank you so much. Okay, thank you, Cam. God bless you.

Thank you, Cam. Rob, how vital, how important do you think it is for the Christian to be sure that he or she knows exactly where their money is going? I mean, do we take all of our money out of all of our stocks that don't represent themselves as Christian companies? You know, Steve, I've said for a long time, and really believe this, this is a conviction issue. If you go to Romans 14, you will see it says, Let each one be fully convinced in his own mind, or her own mind. And the idea is that there's commands, and then there's convictions. And there's certain things that I think fall into a conscience category.

I think this is one of them. So I think the first thing we all need to do is develop our own convictions about our investments. Do we feel like we have a conviction around avoiding companies that use their profits with things that don't align with our values? Do we have a conviction that we only want to invest in things that make a social or a kingdom impact?

As we establish those convictions, then we want to look for investment options that match up. Thank you, Rob. Hey, you're listening to MoneyWise Live with Rob West. Today's broadcast is prerecorded, so we won't be taking any calls, but we have some calls lined up and some great information coming your way that I think you'll find usable at the very, very least. This is MoneyWise Live. I'm Steve Moore. We'll be right back.

Helping you understand and establish God's plan for your financial life and your money. We'd love to hear from you, except today's edition of the program is prerecorded. We had to take a little bit of time off, so we lined up all these calls in advance. We hope you'll sit back and enjoy what you're about to hear. I trust that some of the information we get into today will be something that you might be facing as well. Nonetheless, we're glad you're out there. Let's open up the lines here, Rob. St. Helena, South Carolina, and Charlie, what's on your mind?

Hi, I enjoy listening to you all. My call is concerned retirement. I separated from my previous employer about going on three years, and I left my retirement in South Carolina. I know for the year after, I was still getting interest on it, but then after that, I'm no longer getting any kind of interest. My question is, should I let it remain? Should I roll it over into an IRA or a Roth account? I'm just trying to decide what I need to do, because I'm like, I'm going to leave it there if I shouldn't, because I know I'm not getting any more interest. So, that's my question.

Well, Charlie, I appreciate that. Yeah, I like rolling these out to an IRA if you have a retirement plan with a company that you've separated from, especially if it's not doing anything on the performance side, because you have more control over it. You're not limited to the investment options inside the plan. You basically have access to any investment option at your disposal.

So, I would, in fact, open an IRA. Do you have a broker or another investment account outside of retirement accounts at work that you already have? Yes, I do. I do have that. I haven't had a little bit of fun since me transitioning from the job. I had to go into my emergency fund that I did have. So, it's kind of a bare minimum there, but we'll look towards getting that.

You're breaking up a little bit, but I think I got the gist of the question. So, you do have an IRA with a little bit in it. So, if you do have a traditional IRA, which is where you'd want to put this, it's not a taxable event. You'll want to request the rollover paperwork. You'll give them the name and the account number of the custodian where your IRA is. They'll liquidate any investments that you have. They'll mail the check. It'll be deposited, and then you'll have to decide how you want to invest it. If you have an investment advisor, you'll be all set.

If you need some help with that, our friends at soundmindinvesting.org could be a great resource to find some good, high-quality mutual funds. Charlie, thank you very much. We're glad you got in today. Melbourne Beach, Florida. Denise, help me with it, Denise. Is it Denise? I want to say it correctly. It's Denise, yes. Denise.

Well, a beautiful name, and how can we help you? Thank you. I just recently purchased a double-wide home, and I'm not comfortable with what I paid on the contents. The owner was really trying to sell this, and I didn't think it through, but we divided the price into two payments, 40 for the contents, 57 for the home.

And I've made both payments, and now it's time to transfer the title, and I feel convicted like I'm not paying enough tax on the home value. Yeah. Was there an appraisal done, Denise? No.

I had a man look at it, and he said, don't waste your money. It's fine. It's a 2015. Hardly anybody had lived in the home.

It sat empty the majority of the time it's been in the park. Yeah. Well, I think there's something to this in the sense that if you have a real check in your spirit, a red flag, just there's a tension there that you feel with regard to being able to do the right thing and honor the Lord in this transaction, then I think you should give that your attention and make sure, in fact, that this was done properly. So one option would be get an appraisal.

Yes, it would cost you a little bit. A second option would be to get what's called a broker's price opinion, which is where a real estate broker will give you their professional opinion on what the value was based on comparables and other real assessments of the value of the property. And that could give you a lot more peace of mind to know if, in fact, it was done properly and what taxes owed. Once you get that information, I'd go visit with a godly tax preparer who has some experience. If you don't have one, you could connect with a certified kingdom advisor there in Melbourne and either one in the tax area or ask for a referral.

But I think equipped with either the appraisal or the broker's price opinion and a godly tax professional, you all can sort this out and decide exactly how much needs to be paid, because obviously you want to do this in a way that is above board and with integrity. And so I wouldn't take this person's counsel just to let it go. If there's something there in your spirit that you need to look into this further, then I would absolutely look into that if you have any reason to believe that perhaps the way it was broken down wasn't proper.

But armed with those two pieces of information, you should be able to get to the bottom of this. Denise, thank you very much. We wish you the very best with your new home. We appreciate your phone call today. Thanks. Rob, I think we have time for an email.

This one comes to us from Terry. He says, Will my kids have to pay my student loans when I die? Yeah, it's a great question. If they're federal loans, typically they will be discharged due to the death of the borrower or of the student on which, you know, the plus loan was taken out. So, again, if it's a federal loan, your state will generally not have to pay those back. The survivors just apply for a death discharge to cancel that. If it's a parent plus loan, it may be discharged. Again, if the student dies or if both parents with a parent plus loan, assuming that both took out the loan, pass away, then that's grounds also for a death discharge. So now the death of only one parent, if it's taken out in both names, does not cancel a plus loan. So, yeah, generally speaking, Terry, your kids would not have to pay that.

They would just, as the heirs on behalf of the estate, they would have to apply for the death discharge and that should be canceled. Okay, Terry, we're happy to hear from you today. If you have a question to ask Rob and you want to keep it brief and you don't want to be on the air, then the address to use is questions at MoneyWise.org, questions at MoneyWise.org. All right, before we go to a break, Rob, if you don't mind, exegete this verse for us. For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also. Exegete that for us.

What's that mean? Well, it's a key idea, Steve, when it comes to managing money, because beyond the central idea that God owns it all, which is the biggest one, because that changes everything. It means I'm a steward and God is the owner, which means I need to check with the master on how I should use his money.

And by the way, 2300 verses later in the Bible, you've got all the information you need about how to do that. The next big idea is what you just said, and that is, I'll say it in my words, your heart follows your money. Your heart follows your money. So as you spend money, guess what?

Your heart's going to go there. That's why Larry Burkett used to say, show me your checkbook and I'll tell you kind of what's important to you, because the way we allocate our money reveals where we've placed our value and ultimately where we've placed our trust. So I think that should cause all of us to say, does the story my money tells about what's most important to me, does that reinforce what's actually most important?

And if not, maybe I need to make some changes. Thanks, Rob. All right, we have to make a couple of changes, push a couple of buttons, but we'll be back with more MoneyWise Live.

We're pleased to punch you with us today. It's MoneyWise Live, except we're not really live. We're prerecorded today. We have calls all lined up in advance, though, and I think you'll find them interesting. And so we hope you'll stick around for the next, well, a few minutes anyway. MoneyWise Live with your host, Rob West. I'm Steve Moore. Let's begin by going up to Swayze, Indiana.

Lloyd, thank you for your patience, sir. What's on your mind? Well, it's kind of an interesting thing because I'm a teacher and I've been teaching for 45 years, so I'm ready for retirement and a couple more. And over the course of the last 10 years, we've had well over $100,000 of medical expenses.

Well, using the plan of pay off the little one, take that payment, get it into the next one and roll myself on up, we've got it down to about $13,000. Wow. Wow.

Yeah. Well, it's been a long haul, but we have done it. And now we also have in our savings, thanks to the fact that I'm 67, Social Security has assisted us in the fact that now we have about $13,000 saved up. So my question is, do I take that $13,000 and finish off those medical bills and go ahead and do that? The house is paid off. The cars are paid off.

So now I've got that. What you guys recommend as an emergency fund set back, ready to go, but then I've still got those 13,000 medical bills. Now, granted, they are not doing interest on them, but they are out there.

And their payments of $100 or $50 a month, I figure maybe two and a half, three years from now, they'll be paid off. But I'm seeking advice, so I'm all ears. Yeah, great, Lloyd. I appreciate that background. And congratulations for the diligence you've exercised here and getting this $100,000 plus worth of medical debt down to $13,000.

You've obviously been doing some hard work, limiting your lifestyle, staying focused. And I love that you use the snowball method, lining up the bills smallest to largest and then going right down the line, paying something to each. And you're right. Oftentimes, medical providers will arrange payment plans, and most often they are interest free. The key is they just want to know you're going to set up something that fits in your budget. And once you agree to it, you're actually going to make the payments every month. And if you do that, usually they'll hang on to it. They don't turn it over to collection. No bad mark on your credit report and no interest being charged, which is a blessing, because so often they don't get that money paid back.

And so they're happy if you're going to do it, especially the way you've done it. Now, as enticing as it is to say, I want to be done with this once and for all, I'm hesitant for you to eradicate your emergency savings. How many months worth of expenses is $13,000 for you?

I would figure almost between five and six. OK, so if you wanted to take half of it, let's say, and take a chunk of these and knock them down even further, I'd be comfortable with that. I wouldn't be comfortable if it was just me taking the whole thing, because there is no interest. You've demonstrated you're willing to pay these off. You're on track to pay them off in two to three years.

And maybe if you take half of it, one to two years. But if something comes out of left field and just like you weren't probably expecting this medical debt in the first place, something else could pop up. You know, then all of a sudden we're having to go to credit cards that do have interest and not only that, big interest.

So I think from that standpoint, I'd still be patient, be diligent, be systematic, perhaps knock these down a bit, but not all the way in full as much as I would like for you to do that. Does that make sense? That makes a lot of sense. The nice thing is we only have two credit cards and we've been able to pay off every month. So we don't have any credit card debt. And just the fact that as a teacher, I was talking to my financial guy.

He said, if you wanted to retire, you know, you've got your 401, you've got this set aside with retirement fund, you're fine to do that if you want to. So that's why the big temptation is there. And I always tell people there's four things you never give a teacher. You don't give them a microwave or a fridge because they never clean it. You don't give them a contract because they never read it.

They just divide by 26 pays. You don't give money to invest because they don't know how. And you don't give them a diuretic because they're just in time. But do you give them an apple, Lloyd?

Do you give them an apple a day, you know, that thing, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right.

I'm not sure. Lloyd, you've taught us all something today. And all kidding aside, you guys are a wonderful example of what can be done with God's grace and help and, you know, your discipline and your commitment. And we wish you the very best as you move forward. And we're glad you called today. Thank you.

Thank you very much. Sheffield, Ohio. I have to remember that one.

Sheffield, Ohio. Hi, Daryl. What's on your heart today, sir? I enjoyed the last caller's remarks, too.

And thank you for taking my call. My question was, I recently sold a rental property with no capital gains on it. And I was trying to figure out, should I go ahead and put that money toward my home that I'm living in now and pay that mortgage down? But I'm looking to buy some cars in the next six months. Or should I hold off on putting that money down and buy the cars?

Yeah. When you say buy the cars, are these collectibles or are you just replacing cars that are, you know, essential that are at the end of their useful life? Tell me a little bit more about what it is you're buying. I am buying a car for me. I currently drive a 2007 car and it's near the end and I'm buying a car for my wife. I see.

All right. Well, you know, if you have a car that needs to be replaced or a couple of them, you know, then using the money to purchase a new to you car, even if it's a used car, makes a lot of sense. Just because it's going to be a higher interest rate and, you know, we want to get that consumer debt paid off, if at all possible, don't want to borrow for depreciating assets.

And if that would be the alternative that you'd have to go out and borrow, I'd rather you use it there. If it's not an immediate need, it's something you could wait. Then obviously you could, assuming you have everything else is on track, you're giving and you've got your emergency fund, you're putting money away for the long haul, and then you've got this extra money on top of that. So priority order is in line, then you could go ahead and pay off that mortgage as long as you could pay it off in full, then that would give you the opportunity to recap those or re capture those mortgage payments you were sending to the mortgage company and sock those away to build up the car fund and do it that way.

But I think, you know, if it's something that's a more pressing need for you or your wife or both of you, I'd probably encourage you to go ahead and, you know, put that money toward those car purchases and see if you can do it without borrowing anything for those depreciating assets. Does that make sense, Daryl? Yes.

Yes. My question was, too, because I wasn't sure if I should try to refinance my house and buy the cars with the equity that I have in the house. Yeah, I see.

Yeah, I'd rather you not. I'd rather keep that equity going in the other direction. And, you know, you've got the proceeds from this rental property, so you're sitting on cash. And so I think that's perhaps the opportunity, you know, to go ahead and buy those cars with cash. Now, if it makes sense to refinance because you can lower the rate by at least a point, you're going to stay in this home for a while, you shop it around and you don't increase the term, you still may want to refinance. But I'd rather not, you know, secure that car debt to your house. If you need to borrow for the cars, I would just get a car loan as opposed to extending it out, you know, another 15 or 20 years. So I think for me, it really comes down to either delay the car purchases and pay off the mortgage and then save using the car payment or go ahead and pay off, go and buy the cars outright with cash and then stay on your current plan to pay off the mortgage.

And when you have excess funds, go ahead and add it to the principal. Thank you, Daryl. We appreciate that call.

Orlando, Florida, Ada, we just have a few minutes left. Can we try to be brief about this? Sure. My question is, I have, like I was telling the lady, I own the mortgage and it's about 60 more or less left on that mortgage and I have about 14 years to pay it off. Since the interest rate is so low, I wanted to refinance the house, cash some of the equity on the house because the house needs some work to be done. Would that be a good idea to do?

Yeah, I'm comfortable with that. You know, assuming you can better your position here, meaning you've got 13 years left, so I wouldn't do anything longer than a 15 year mortgage and assuming you can save at least a point on the interest rate, then it makes sense to refinance. And while you're doing it, you're already going to have the cost of the refinance if you've got some needed home improvements that are going to improve the value of the home for you to ultimately sell someday. This is going to be the most cost effective access to funds that you could possibly have because rates are so low right now and you're not borrowing to use it on your lifestyle, you're borrowing it to improve the property, which is a good thing. So I like that idea and I think that would be an appropriate use of those funds.

Again, assuming you shop it around, you get a good rate and you can really improve your situation both in term and interest rate. And with that, Ada, we're going to have to say goodbye because we're right up against the end of the program today. We're glad you called and we wish you the very, very best. Rob, anything else to add before we put a bow on it and catch a cab?

No. Well, here's what I would just say. You know, when you're thinking about upgrading your home, I would just be really thoughtful about what you're doing. You know, don't automatically assume just because the home is appreciated in value and because we've got this equity kind of staring us in the face that we need to tap into it. Remember, the long term goal is to get out of debt completely, including that mortgage. But if you're doing the right kinds of things, especially if you're planning to sell in the next couple of years, check with a professional to make sure it's the types of improvements that you're actually going to get your money back out of. Many times they won't. Now, if it's just for enjoyment, you can cover it, then you go for it. But just don't automatically assume we need to tap that equity. MoneyWise Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and MoneyWise Media. For Rob West, I'm Steve Moore. Thanks for listening.