Matt Slick Live

A previously recorded Matt Slick show. It's Matt Slick live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry found online at karm.org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick live.

Francis, taking your calls and responding to your questions at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome to the show.

It's me, Matt Slick, listening to Matt Slick live. And if you want to give me a call, we have, let's see, four open lines, 877-207-2276. I want to hear from you. Please give me a call. All right. Hey, guess what? What we're going to be doing is, I spent some time talking to Eric Johnson of Mormonism Research Ministry, MRM.org.

We talked last night, we talked today. What Eric does, among other things, we talk about Mormonism and teaches me a bunch of great stuff, is he does trips to Israel. And we're going to do a Karm trip in March of 2022.

So next year, takes a year to prep everything and get the money together and all that kind of stuff. If you are interested in going, and you don't know if you can or not, but you are definitely interested, all I'm going to ask you to do is email eric.mrm.org. That's E-R-I-C, eric.mrm.org, MormonismResearchMinistry.org.

They're not Mormons, they're Christians. And Eric will be going on the trip, and Lord willing, I'll be going on the trip. My wife will be going.

And there you go. There's a lot of information. We're going to be getting a website up. I actually took a look at it today, but we're not going to release it for a few more days.

Got to get more details out there. If you want to join us, if you are interested in checking out Israel, with yours truly here, and some others, maybe 25, 30 other people, it'll be great, because I've done it before. And you just become a group of friends, and you get to meet new people, you're in the bus, you're talking, and seeing these sites.

You never look at the Bible again the same way. It's just great. Anyway, like I said, hey, if you want to check it out, just email ericmrm.org. And you can let us know. I'll be advertising this now for a little bit.

Hey, if you want to give me a call, we have one open line, 877-20722-76. Why don't we just jump on and get here, let's see, with Kip from Iowa. Hey, Kip, welcome. You're on the air. Thank you. Can you hear me okay? I hear you fine. I hear you. All right, sir. The question I had for you is kind of a connection point. Okay. I'm struggling with understanding this.

In Hebrews chapter 6, verse 6, there's a warning against those who fall away from following the Lord, and they fall back into Judaism. It doesn't say that. Oh, yes, sir. Well, I'm, let me try to piece this.

Yeah, it does not say they were following the Lord. Okay. Okay.

All right. Well, anyway, the reason that they would want to fall away, I was over in Leviticus chapter 10, where Nadab and Abihu get themselves in a pickle, the Lord strikes them dead. And the thing that I was struggling with, Moses gives instructions to Aaron, as I understand it, not to weep or sorrow over the loss of his sons. And I think, okay, that's not Jewish tradition, that's directly from Moses. And I don't, I confess, I just don't understand that. I mean, if I lost my kids, or anybody would, they, how did that come about?

Can you help me with that? How did what come about? What's the... Well, in other words, when Moses gave instructions to Aaron, you know, that he's not to let his hair down, and I believe the premise was that he would be weeping and sorrowing for his two sons, Nadab and Abihu. And that would be in Leviticus chapter 10 there, and on down into the chapter.

Yeah. God's telling them it's because they were offering strange fire, they were committing idolatry, and it was such a bad thing that they were taken out, and God says, don't worry about them. Of course, we're going to lament and be sorrowed for the loss of our children.

I've buried a son, I know what that's like. And any normal person's going to lament that, going to be torn up over it, and I'm sure Moses was. But it was a theological issue, not to be concerned about that, and them in that sense, because they had done something very, very bad. As far as Hebrews 6 goes, it never says that any of them are saved. It says, in the case of those who've once been enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift and made partakers of the Holy Spirit, this easily could apply to Judas. And we know from John 6, he was never saved, he was a devil from the beginning. And it says, and they tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away. He's talking about the Jews, the book of Hebrews is written in Hebrews, he's talking about the Jews who had that awareness of who Christ was, watched, participated in seeing his miracles, etc. And then they went back to their old Judaism, they're lost.

They can't come back, because there's nothing left for them. That's what's going on there. All right, sir, so apparently the crime that these two boys did was so severe that they were just to be dismissed, and Aaron was to go on with his other two boys in his priesthood. Would that be a correct assumption?

I think that's pretty good. I haven't read this in a long time, but just by looking at the context, they offered strange fire, which was an inappropriate and blasphemous offering of worship, which was not done. And it might be because Aaron was the one ordained to do that, they did it, being presumptuous, it might be that it was something else. I don't know off the top of my head, but I'm looking at the verses, and that's what it says. So they got the fire, came out of the presence of the Lord and consumed them, and they died before the Lord. And Moses said to Aaron, is what the Lord spoke, saying, by those who come near to me I have treated as holy, and before all the people I will be honored. You remember when they were moving the ark, and it slipped, and one guy put his hand out, he was killed.

Yeah, the steady. Yeah, and he was just trying to do a good thing, but he got killed. Well, why? Because in the Old Testament economy, there had to be the issue of blood and the priesthood, which would then enable someone to come before the presence of God, and the presence of God was that ark, because of the mercy seat, which is called his footstool. So now that we have Christ, who is our high priest, who's offered his blood as a sacrifice so we can approach.

But what they were doing in the Old Testament there was a strange fire, not offered in a priestly connection, properly done through what was necessary, and they got judged for it. And such a serious thing. So, okay. All right, sure, very good. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you kindly now. Bye-bye. You're welcome, God bless.

All right, hey folks, if you want to give me a call, all you have to do is, wow, that's interesting, is call 877-207-2276. I'll get to Jamal from North Carolina. Jamal, welcome, you're on here. Hey, Matt, always a pleasure.

I pray that everyone's doing well. I had a question I wanted to pose to you. I saw this online on Facebook, saying that Jesus was the ultimate liberal. That was a pretty loaded statement. I wanted to respond to that, but I figured I'll do that another time, but I figured it'd be a good question to pose to you, so I just wanted to get your thoughts on that. Well, I don't know what they mean by ultimate liberal, okay?

So I don't know what they mean. They were talking about how he, you know, was for the poor and, you know, was so inclusive, loved everybody, was not really for, you know, government and stuff like that. And part of my thing was, like, yeah, he did love everybody, but he still had laws.

He still had structure. You know, everybody, you know, just can't be saved. You know, you have to come through Jesus. I am the way, the truth, and the life.

You want to come to the Father, but be me. So, yes, he did love everybody, but he still had, you know, laws and structure. Actually, we don't know if he loved everybody, because the Bible actually does say that God hates those who do iniquity, and, Jacob, I love you, so I hate it. So there's various things, but, yeah, I know what you're saying. When they say he's a liberal, liberal in what sense and in what context? People often want to have Jesus to be on their side politically, socially, whatever it is, because he was so great, so they want to claim him for their own, and make him say and do things that he would never say or do. So I don't know what they mean by that. I'd have to see what they say, because the admonition to love the poor is from the Old Testament. The admonition to be kind, etc., is from the Old Testament.

And I just did release some articles recently covering some of this stuff and some of the requirements. I have an article called, let's see, Social Justice Bible Verses that I've released on karma last week. And, you know, stuff like Don't Show Favoritism, Don't Have Hatred in Your Heart towards Others, Aid the Helpless, Don't Threaten People's Lives, Love Others, Don't Practice Oppression, Don't Show Favoritism to the Poor or the Rich, Restoration of Things, No Theft, Being Truthful.

These are things, and I've got a whole bunch of verses there. The Bible teaches these things, so Jesus wasn't radical, he was just doing what was biblical. Right, exactly, yeah. But you're right, anybody would try to bend Jesus' way to them, because hey, if I've got Jesus on my side, then hey, you know, that's not a powerful person on my side. That's what they want. They want him on their side, they're not concerned to be on his side.

They want him on theirs. They want Jesus to compromise, they want Jesus to be what they want him to be, so they can justify their own actions. That's sinful. Oh yeah, I think that was a Lincoln quote, I don't want to be, I don't want to worry about what side I'm on, I just want to worry about being on Jesus' side, that's a wicked paraphrase, I know I messed that up, but it says something like that. I have a website, I was looking for the exact quote, it's Christian Democrats of America, and I have a picture of Jesus and they said, detailing why they think that, so I'm not sure if you want to look it up when you have time, I could possibly email that to you, but that's where I got it from. Christian Democrats, I have a personal problem with anybody who, we should not vote for people who are pro-homosexual or pro-abortion, that's killing babies in the womb and it is supporting an abomination before God, so my question to ask people is how can anybody, I don't care what race or what denomination, party or whatever it is, how do you vote for somebody who's for killing the unborn and who's for promoting that which is a blasphemy against God, which is LGBTQ, how can you do that? Well, I'd rather pay higher taxes and not have abortion and not, you know, killing of the unborn. So I'm bewildered why anybody would support anybody, any Christian would support someone who's advocating murder and homosexuality.

I don't get it. So, you know, Christian Democrats, that's a bit of an oxymoron to me. I'm going to make a lot of enemies saying this, but that's, you know. Yeah, and you know, I used to be hardcore liberal, you know, I tell that to a lot of people, but the Democratic Party is not the part I grew up with, you know, it became a lot more radical, you know, censorship, Dr. Michael Brown was censored yesterday for, you know, saying that, you know, I'm calling somebody, you know, who they are, not who they want to be.

And they're sensitive to that. He wasn't talking about violence or hate. So it was like, okay. Guess which party was the party that KKK? Right. The Democrats.

The Democrats who were the KKK, they supported the KKK and vice versa. I'd recommend that people go to Netflix, if they have Netflix, and look up and watch Hillary's America. There's a lot of documentation in there, it's very interesting. Okay. All right, man. God bless.

Thanks. All right. Well, then don't listen to the come up.

Everything is under the Lordship of Jesus one way or another. Folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone. Welcome to the show.

Let's see. If you want to give me a call, we have two open lines, 877-207-2276. Ryan from Pennsylvania, you're on the air. Thank you for taking my call.

You invited me to call back any time, and I appreciate that. I recently heard an interview with the winner of the Georgia Senate race recently, and he called himself a Matthew 25 Christian. What is a Matthew 25 Christian?

I don't know. There's a lot in Matthew 25. Because in Matthew 25, there's a parable of the 10 virgins, and then there's also judgment coming. So when he says that, it's like Matthew 25, I don't know what he means.

I haven't heard that question before. The only thing that I could think of was when Jesus said, Whatsoever you've done unto the least of these, you've done unto me. The only thing I could think of.

Yeah, he's got a PhD in Greek. Maybe he was just trying to get people to read the whole chapter, because it does talk about some interesting stuff. So it could be a... Yeah, like you say, the only thing I could figure was the, Whatsoever you've done unto the least of these, you've done unto me, and that's the kind of pastor he seems to try to be. Okay, maybe that's what it is.

And I thought, Well, if that's the case, then we should all be Matthew 25 Christians. Yeah. Yep.

Yeah. By the way, your treatment of Hebrews 6 and a couple calls before, you completely blew it because of an analogy that is used as the children of Israel that delivered out of Egypt, that died in the wilderness. So that's the analogy.

And you didn't follow that. Out of what, Leviticus? No, out of Hebrews 6, the falling away, the analogy that's used in Hebrew 6 is the children of Israel that were delivered out of Egypt that died in the wilderness. And just as the ones that were died out of the wilderness, the ones that were believed and died in unbelief were condemned. That is the exact analogy that's used in Hebrew 6. Well, I'll tell you what, I've not heard that before.

So let me go check it out sometime and see. Generally, the context of Hebrews, speaking to the Hebrews is about the Hebrews obligation to follow what the Old Testament says in the New Testament context. And here. Well, first of all, first of all, you don't know who wrote Hebrews and you don't know who it was written to. So nobody does, because it was, yes, because it was included under the canon under the writings of Paul, but it's not a writing of Paul. And you don't know who it was written to.

What? How do you know it's not written by Paul? Well, it is a possibility, but again, we know that that was a risk when it was put forward that way. If it is by Paul, it is very different than anything else he ever wrote, that's for sure. Well, I think that it's easily explainable in that Paul was extremely intelligent and he wrote on different levels for different things. I've done the same thing when I write for different levels of stuff. When I speak here on the radio, I don't get into the real hard stuff of transcendentals and materialistic views.

What I get into is the stuff for the average Joe. This here on Hebrews is not just for the average Joe. So I don't have any problem with assuming, I can't prove it, assuming that Paul wrote it, no big deal, but it doesn't mean he did. Well, again, the analogy was very, very clear that the children of Israel that were delivered out of Egypt died in the wilderness and just as they died in the wilderness. So believing folks that die in unbelief are condemned. That is taught in the first 11 chapters of Hebrews over and over and over. Yeah, that theme is definitely there. And the priesthood of Christ is also there. And I'm looking for any allusions, A-L-L, for those of you who don't know what that is.

It's a reference to, not by direct quote. And it would be interesting to see if there's any allusions to that out of the Old Testament. So maybe you could write up a little something and send it to me. I'll take a look at it. Okay.

Well, I'm also on PalTalk. So if you want to discuss things in detail, I'll be glad to. So anytime you wish. All right, man. Appreciate it. Thanks. All right.

All right. That was Ryan. We have three open lines. If you want to, you can give me a call.

And the number is 877-207-2276. Let's get to John from Wisconsin. Hey, John.

Welcome. You're on the air. Hey, man. How you doing? Doing all right. What do you got, buddy?

Hey. Well, you know, we've got a lot of changing times and a lot of things are going fast. I know over my lifetime, I'm coming up on 50 years old here. Reading through the Bible, we always looked at some of the end time scriptures. And one of them that we always said, well, end times are further down the line because the city of Damascus was never destroyed.

And obviously, recently, with the civil war there, the city of Damascus has been completely demolished. So end time revelations, prophecies and things like that are closer than they've ever been before. I guess one of my questions that I wanted you to weigh in on is I've got a larger and larger group of friends that are on both sides of the rapture theology where obviously, research is easier to be done today than it's ever been in the past. And a lot of people will refer to scriptures like one will be taken, one will be left, and things like that. And then if you go further back into that context, the taken is actually perished, you know, in the context of perishing.

And the one that's left is in the context of surviving. I'd like you to weigh in and just kind of elaborate on what your advantage point is on rapture theology because of its elusive kind of footing in the Bible. Well, I just go to 1 Thessalonians 4, starting at verse 16, it says, We who are alive or main shall be caught up together to meet them in the air. And that's at the perusia, at the return of Christ. That caught up is the Latin rapturus. We get rapture. So it's right there. The rapture occurs.

That's where it is. When people tell me there is no rapture, I just turn there and go, well, what does it mean we're caught up into the clouds to meet them? And then I listen to them rip the verses to shreds, trying to make sense of things. So I don't have any problem with the rapture.

But I'm of the opinion that we go through it. And I'm also of the opinion that the first ones taken are the wicked, not the good, because of what Jesus says in Matthew 1330. He says, Allow both to go together till the time of the harvest.

I'll say to the, you know, the reapers first, gather up the tares. So he specifically says that the wicked are the ones who were taken first. And as you quoted in Matthew 24 or reference Luke 17, the ones who were taken, two men in the field, one is taken, one is left.

That's the wicked. And they asked Jesus, where are they taken? In Luke 17.

And he answers the question, where the body is, the vultures are gathered. So I suspect that since we're in the kingdom of God now, I'm all, I'm also all millennial. I believe that we're in the millennial reign of Christ, that it's not of this world, but that we are his subjects. And that Revelation 20, which is a thousand years, is in a figurative context. And whenever the word thousand by itself is used in the Bible, it's figurative. God owns cattle on a thousand hills or the days, but a thousand years.

So it's always a figurative usage. And, you know, he reigned for a thousand years and all this stuff. So I believe that we are in the kingdom of God and that the wicked will be taken out of the kingdom because that's what Jesus says in Matthew 1340. He says, just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, social be at the end of the age of the son of man will send forth his angels. They will gather out of his kingdom, all stumbling blocks and those who commit lawlessness. And since we tie that to Matthew 1330, where it says the first ones gathered are the wicked and the wicked are taken to a place of judgment, then my view, right or wrong, is that we're going through the tribulation period. We're going to suffer persecution and that the world is going to bring itself to self-destruction because Matthew 24 and 25 talk about judgment and destruction to come, but those days be not cut short, no flesh will be left. I believe Jesus is going to come back and stop the ultimate self-destruction of all mankind.

And all this is going to happen on that day. We've got a break coming up. Hold on, buddy. Okay, we'll get back to you after this break.

We have three open lines. 877-207, 2276. We will be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207, 2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody. Welcome back to the show. We have three open lines. 877-207, 2276. Let's get back to John. Hey, John, there you go. Still there? Hey, thanks so much.

Yes, I am. I really appreciate your insight on the wicked taken first because that's one that I have not heard yet. And usually people kind of waffle over the entire theology based on the wicked first. Of course, the other thing that people are saying is that the actual rapture itself is possible to have a spiritual rapturing in the form of a transfiguration, such as Jesus on the mountain transfiguration, that in the last thousand years, and I see what you're saying about the cattle on the thousand hills being figurative, but there's also substantial evidence through the temple, through the menorah being the seven candlesticks, you know, being that this is the end of an age and we are on the precipice or on the threshold of the next age being the third and final thousands here as we enter into the millennial reign of Christ.

I know I've touched on a lot of things there, but I'd love to hear your take on some of that. Well, you'll find if you do a study on this age and the age to come, you'll find there's only two ages. At the end of this age, all kinds of things happen. The judgment of the wicked, the rapture, new heavens and new earth are made.

The age to come is when we have eternal life, the full resurrection occurs and things like that. And I've done a lot of studies on it and I've taught it a few times and nobody's ever refuted it. I'm not saying, hey, look how great I am. I'm just saying, you know, I've gone through and looked and, you know, I've touched the start because I've stood on the shoulders of giants. There are just a lot of verses out there. When you start doing studies on the trumpets, the judgment, the resurrection, and you start studying when the day of the Lord comes like a thief, you'll find out that it's only used twice in the entire Bible. The first time it's used is in reference to the rapture and the second time it's used is in reference to the new heavens and new earth being formed. It says a day of the Lord come like a thief in the night of the rapture.

They have the Lord come like a thief when the new heavens and new earth are made in second Peter 3 10. So it's like, Oh, what's going on? You know? So there's a lot there. And when I put this up and I show people and I do Bible studies on it, they're, they're intrigued.

But I'm the only one I know who officially teaches. This is not a, not a good sign who teaches that the wicked are taken first. It's not a good sign. I'm the only one who says that, but it's what it says.

Yeah. And I hope I'm wrong. There's not many things I want to be wrong about, but I'll tell you, that's, that's what I want to be wrong about. I don't want to go through the tribulation.

I don't want to go through all this stuff. I don't think it's going to get good. I'm a, I mean, pessimistic Amillennialist, as I call myself. Well, well, I, one of the, I mean, I have a particularly good friend that we go back and forth a little bit on this on, and I say, well, then who's, you know, if we're not going to go through, uh, if we're not going to go through the tribulation, who, who will the martyrs consist of that? Who, you know, who will, who will all the martyrs?

Why the warning? They basically would say that it's, uh, dealing with those who become Christians during the tribulation period. But if the spirit's removed during that time? Oh no, it doesn't say where it's removed. It says taken out of the way. And then the second Thessalonians two, you have the, who he hinders, the hindrance is removed, but his presence is there because the Holy Spirit is by definition God.

And so therefore he has to be everywhere all the time. So it's, what's, what's, uh, being meant there. Yeah. It's not so easy. You know, this, uh, it's not so easy to come up with something great.

And my position has weaknesses in it. There's some thinking about the re the rebuilding temple. I'm not quite sure how to answer that. It could be that it's just in the context of the seven year tribulation period, which I have no problem with. So, uh, yeah.

Prophecy is always a lot easier to see in the rear view mirror, isn't it? That's right. And, uh, when you're supposed to be really slick, like me, what's that better answers. Hey, thanks so much for your time. All right, man. Well, God bless buddy. Bless you.

All right. Hey, let's get to Wendy from Utah. Hey Wendy, welcome. You're on the air.

Oh, thanks for having me. Uh, I'm thinking the two great influences amongst others in my life today. One is the scripture Hosea, my people are destroyed through lack of knowledge. And now there is a blessing I know came from the Lord in 1996, how I was led to to have that blessing. And it says towards the end, I will protect you and your children through the hard times that are ahead.

What's that effect? And I think it's every Christian should be aware and watch the politics carefully today. You can't just live in La La land because there are things happening that are tremendous significance. And one of them is that in the last two years, the Lord blessed me with three wonderful trips. And I think it was 2018. I took one trip on the Danube. Then the following year I went on this trip to the Mediterranean. And then another trip came out that was too good a deal to pass out. And I thought, that's really stupid taking two trips in one year. But then I realized the significance of that, because a few months ago, it became very clear to me that my traveling days were over. And the Lord had blessed me with two trips, because that's it.

I will never travel again. Well, let me ask you, do you have a question? Do you have a question?

Sorry? Do you have a question? Well, I'm trying to get to my point. And I hope you'll let me have as much time as these guys have been having. Well, I just want to know what your question is so we can have a discussion. Well, basically, I think you should think very carefully about going on an international flight. That's what prompted my call. Because they're requiring the vaccine.

And this is what I talk about studying what's going on in today's world, politics and whatever. Because this supposed vaccine isn't even a vaccine. It's gene therapy.

And the manufacturer... Well, okay, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. So, yeah, so I know that there's different theories about the COVID vaccine. I want to do research.

If they require... I've done some research. Would you let me share it with you? No. I've done a lot of research. No. Because I don't want you to just sit here and just read stuff on the air.

If you have research information, you can send me links. And you can send it to... I'm not reading anything on the air. I'm trying to have a conversation. Okay. I appreciate that. But I'm just saying that if you have information you'd like to share, I need to see the documentation.

And I would request that you email it to us at info at karme.org. Because that's what I want to be able to do about COVID. I want to know if these vaccines are good... They are not vaccines. They don't prevent... And the manufacturers will say that themselves.

But they will alter your genes. And as they progress, the intent is to implant under your skin... Okay, hold on a sec. Hold on a sec. Hold on a sec. ...substances that cannot be seen on a naked eye. What I like to have is documentation.

I want to have documentation. But you're not really interested in talking to me. And I noticed that with many Christians. Would you listen... Hold on a sec, ma'am. Ma'am, excuse me. This isn't your radio show. I'm trying to be very polite. I don't know if what you're telling me is the truth.

And I don't want my show to be used to disseminate information that may not be true. I'm just politely asking you to submit a documentation so I can check it out. Okay. But I can't talk about it in the meantime. Okay. We're going to move on because we don't want to have someone who's obstreperous and stuff like that.

If you're interested, Wendy, please email me the information. That's what I've asked. I try to be polite about it. But I always have to guard about the things that are said when people get on the air and they have a hobby horse they want to get to. If it's true about COVID, I want to know it. If it's not, I want to know it as well.

I mean the vaccines or what do we call them generically. That's what I want to know. That's all I'm doing is trying to be responsible and research the issues. Let's get to Sheila from Virginia. Sheila, welcome. You're on the air. Hi.

I'm calling. I have two questions. The first one has to do with sin. And I'm aware that blasphemy is the only unforgivable sin I believe. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.

Right. And so, otherwise, are there distinctions between sin and arrogance? Yes, there are. There are greater sins than other sins. Yes, Jesus even says so.

There are. And what's the scriptural support for that? John, 1911, Jesus answered, You would have no authority over me unless it had been given you from above. For this reason, he who delivered me to you has the greater sin. So Jesus said, there's greater sin. One who delivered you over has the greater sin. So the greater sin is for someone who, in practical terms, what would that look like? Well, what I'm saying is that Jesus said one sin is greater than another. It's not that we want to get a book and then have a listing in an outline form in Excel of what sins are greater. That's not what we're talking about here.

The one who delivered Jesus over has a greater sin than Pilate, who is pretty much ignorant. And so it's just a generic thing. Hold on, okay, because we're going to break. All right. Hold on. Okay. Okay. Hey, folks, we'll be right back after these messages.

We have three open lines. 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right, everybody. Welcome back.

Little funny stuff going on in the text chat during the break. Sheila, are you still there? Yes, I am. All right.

I forgot where we were. But yes, there are greater sins than other sins, and people will be punished differently in hell, different degrees of punishment as well. Okay.

Okay. I'll take a look at that scripture. I heard you give an explanation of it, but it seems like it potentially only applied to what was happening to Jesus at that time. Well, here's the thing. The principle is, to the question, to the answer to the question, are there degrees of sin? The answer is yes. Here's the proof. John 19.11.

Jesus says you have the greater sin, so we know that there's greater sins. Now, is that particular one? We have to look in that and say, now we have to have a categorization. We want to stay away from that. Okay.

Okay, go ahead. I'd say Luke 12.47-48. The slave who knew his master's will and did not get ready or act in accord with his will will receive many lashes, but the one who did not know what committed deeds worthy of a flogging will receive but few.

From everyone who has been given much, much will be required to whom you've entrusted much to last much more. So there are degrees of punishment as well, and a sin. Okay. Yes, and I am, yeah, I guess I agree with that, but I'm, what I struggle with is the, um, I'd much rather just say something is a sin versus, I guess, sometimes the attention that's given.

Yeah, you just say it's sinful and, and, uh, you know, stealing a paperclip is not as bad as, as murdering 50 people. Okay. And, um, I think that's, okay. So, okay. Yeah, I would agree at least. Yeah. In principle, that's right. All sin gets us separated from God, but, uh, we've got to be careful not to, to really grade sins too much because then we can become judgmental.

Okay. Well, that's why I get concerned from a political perspective when there is so much attention on some sin versus others, when we are all sinful. Well, we have to focus on various sins. You know, homosexuality is a sin that's spoken of in scripture specifically, and it's one of the very few, if not the only one, that, uh, where you're given judgment in this present life and would be given over to it. So it's a great sin as, so as, as, as killing the unborn.

So, but it's not as bad as someone who just ignorantly, you know, takes pizza paper home, he shouldn't have done, you know, or whatever. So, okay. That's all the principle. Well, I will study that some more, but yeah, that was my, um, challenge with, um, when it came time to vote. And I know it sounds like you don't understand individuals who would have supported someone other than Trump. I'm a constant, I'm a constitutionalist.

Okay. I believe in the constitution and that's just me. I'm very opinionated about certain things, but I just say, why would any Christian who follows Christ want to vote for someone who approves of killing babies in the womb and LGBTQ rights when it's clearly both are clearly against scripture. Why would a Christian want to support someone in that?

I don't get it. And I agree, but then I, my other question had to do with us not knowing ultimately a man's heart. I think we all make decisions. I understand that. But for example, we know what Biden stood for and, uh, he was, he's an evil man.

Okay. Because he's, he's ungodly and he's an evil man. He supports homosexuality, supports abortion. He supports socialism and some other ideas against scripture.

Uh, you know, so I'm not saying Trump was great because right. And that was my struggle because he once also supported abortion. And I think he, because of, I believe his heart, he was willing to almost do anything to obtain a baby. I don't, I can't judge his heart. Right.

That's what I was going to say. We can't judge a man's heart, but we know by his actions, given his past history and what he shared and reported. So, um, the Bible says that a double-minded man is unstable in all of his ways.

And that is what continues to echo to me. We should be, we should be very serious about who we vote for. We should be very serious about, about, uh, politics and, and as Christians, we need to put the word of God first. And people say, well, if I vote for so-and-so, I throw away my vote. Do what's godly.

Don't say I'm going to do the lesser of evil and walk into evil and support someone who believes in anti-Christian stuff and then support him because I might get a tax break. That's the kind of thing you've got to be careful of. Okay. Yeah. And well, I don't care about those things, but I do believe that this kingdom, this, this world here, we are just sojourners.

Yeah. And we are responsible, but to see that, that attitude to me, I don't find it in the Bible. I don't find that in the Bible.

We're to be the idea of we're just sojourners. Don't worry about things on the contrary. No, I don't. It's not that I don't worry. I trust God for what the outcome will be.

We have to make decisions and then you're going to trust God regardless of what happens. That's right. I agree with that. Well, thank you very much, Sheila. Appreciate your call.

No problem. Bye-bye. Okay. God bless. Bye.

All right. Let's get to Carrie from Boise, Idaho. Carrie. Hey, brother Matt. How are you? I'm doing all right. How are you? Good. How's your wife? Well, except for her still being married to me, she's doing great. Good. Is her health improving? A little bit. She was able to do zoom, but yesterday for the first time in a couple, three years and, and. Oh, wow.

Yeah. She loves it. Well, good for her. She doesn't like me talking about too much about over the air, but people know and they care about her and stuff like that. Especially the friends who know me and her and how whacked I am. So then they really sympathize for.

Your self depreciating humor is always uplifting. Anyway, I was listening to an old show from July 27th, 2017 until I paused it and decided to call in today because there's a woman who called in and she had called you with a question about something that her pastor was teaching and you confirmed that it was false teaching and you advised that she leave that church and she wanted to, before leaving, she wanted to kind of alert the pastor that what he was doing was wrong. And you supported her in that and said, yes, by all means we need more people like you doing that. And so the reason I'm calling is that women are in a double bind when they realize that about a church they're attending, because if they go to the pastor, it's, it's not guaranteed, but it's quite possible that the pastor will condemn her for having the, um, goal maybe is the word to say such a thing to him in his position of authority as a man and, and don't touch thy anointed. And that whole thing where, um, women aren't allowed to bring out truth in conversation and because they'll shut her down. And that's like, I don't say, I'm not, I'm not saying you're wrong to tell her that.

I'm just saying this is what may happen to her. Like, and, and not to tell you to change your response, but just to, um, comment that, boy, we have a problem because women can't do this in churches, not all churches anyway. If they're in a church where they can't do that, they need to leave because the, the pastor at, uh, the elders should always make it clear that women are just as important as the men and their opinions. I'm sorry, I'm interrupting.

Um, yeah. So what if the woman says, could I speak to the elders? And they, they hide who those elders are and she has no way of figuring out one who the elders are and two, they won't let her talk to the elders. She needs to throw eggs at them. I agree. Um, but then when she leaves, they call her a church hopper.

And so then she's the double bind. Like they ramp it up. Who cares? Yeah. Who cares? Yeah. Look, if a church is that whacked, if that, hold on, hold on.

If the church is that whacked, who cares? Just go, you know, church hopper. Okay. Whatever. See you later.

Okay. If you're not going to reveal who the elders are, hold on. If they're not going to reveal who the elders are, and they're not going to play fair by what the scripture says, well then leave. You don't try and warn it, but if they don't want it to have any dialogue, then leave. So what?

Well, what if they call up the next church you go to because they find out through little hidden sources where you went next and they call that church and say, Hey, you've got this woman. It all depends what the issues are. It always depends what the issues are. You always have to have both sides, but you know, that's, that's all I can tell you. There's, if the church is really blowing it, then leave.

If they're not, and it's the person who's blowing it who says the church is, but these are just things we don't know about details. Okay. I'll give you just general principles right now. Okay. Yeah. Okay.

And then I have a comment about the last caller. God is a fair God and he sees the family that he placed us in and the dynamics of the family and what a person grows up in. And so this notion of degrees of sin and lashes and this whole thing, God knows that we're not brought here to the earth on an equal playing field.

Some people are born into a family that teaches them about Christ from birth and then someone else has parents that leads them down the wrong path. Okay. Here's the thing. Well, hold on. Hold on. Carrie. Carrie.

Carrie. It's not fair. Yeah.

There are different levels of and degrees of punishment. The Bible says so. May I quote their scriptures? I get a caller waiting. I have a caller waiting.

I want to get to the caller. Okay. Let's get to Brandon from Idaho. Brandon, welcome. You're on the air.

Sorry, we got one minute. Hey, Matt, how's it going? It's going, man. It's going. What do you got, buddy? So, you know, sleep is one of those things that apparently I just don't need anymore.

I'm laying in bed and I come up with these random questions and the one I came up with most recently was, so in the Bible, and correct me if I'm wrong. Oh, this is Brandon Brandon. Okay, gotcha. Yeah, this is Brandon Brandon. Okay.

I haven't seen you for a while. The one who knows how whacked you are. Yeah, that's true. That's true. That's obvious. Yeah.

That is right. So, we've only got like less than a minute or about a minute. So, what's the quote? You've got to hurry up.

We're right at the end of the show there. Okay. So, yes or no? Doesn't the Bible state that God creates some vessels specifically for destruction? Yes? That's what it says. You can go to Proverbs 16, 4 and Romans 9, 22 and 23. Yep.

Okay. So, those vessels that he specifically makes, builds for destruction, can he still, he still speaks to them and can function to those that are meant for destruction just as much as the vessels? Yes, he can because he's sovereign. Absolutely, he can.

That's what you think of Herod, the conscious pilot, and then, I'm not saying they're all damned or anything, but that kind of principles are in Acts 4, 27 to 28. There's the music. We've got to go call back tomorrow. Okay, buddy. All right. All right. Thanks, Ben. All right, Brandon. Talk to you later, man.

Yeah, I've known that guy since he was a little kid. Hey, we're out of time and we've got to go. May the Lord bless you and by his grace, we're back on there tomorrow. We'll talk to you then. See you, God bless. Bye.