Pride: The Deadliest Deadly Sin?

It's no wonder that pride is often first in the list of seven deadly sins. It puts us above God. That's spiritually disastrous, but also adding insult to injury, pride can also affect your money. Pride is also the sin that tells you you don't have it.

It's easy to see it in others, not so much in ourselves. First up today, financial planner and teacher Rob West tells us how that can affect your money. Then we take your calls on anything financial at 800-525-7000.

800-525-7000. I'm Steve Moore. Pride, the deadliest sin.

That's next on 21Is Live. Well, Rob, the spiritual implications of pride are obvious, but how is it harmful to our finances? Well, there are many reasons, Steve, but certainly an important one involves accountability. It's difficult to avoid impulse buying to stay on budget and to be generous if we're going it alone. That's why it's crucial to have an accountability partner that you answer to about how you're using money. If you're married, the first choice is obviously your spouse, but you could also have a trusted financial advisor in that role as well.

And by the way, I recommend that for married couples. That person keeps you in line, helps you make sure that you're following God's financial principles to live on less than you earn, pay down debt, be generous, and of course to save. Now, I could be wrong. I'm not a theologian, of course, but I don't think accountability partner is in the Bible. Not in so many words, but the concept is certainly there. Let's go to Proverbs 12 to find this. It reads, to accept correction is wise, to reject it is foolish. Fools think they know what is best, but a sensible person listens to advice. Well, that's pretty strong language, calling someone foolish or a fool, especially since Jesus tells us not to do it in Matthew 5, right?

Well, you're right. It is strong language, because I think God is trying to drive home a point here that we all need accountability. As for Matthew 5, Jesus is telling us not to lash out at someone in unrighteous anger, but God is always just and righteous. And if he says something is foolish, well, of course we should listen. Now, that's one way God relates the importance of having accountability in our lives and our finances.

Here's another. Proverbs 1 5 reads, a wise man will hear and increase in learning, and a man of understanding will acquire wise counsel. And pride is often the reason we reject the advice of others, huh?

Well, it is. But what makes pride even more dangerous is that it's often combined with another negative attitude, stubbornness. As you mentioned at the top, our pride makes us think more highly of ourselves, perhaps even higher than God. And when you add in stubbornness, well, you're in danger of making your error permanent. Okay. But we don't want to just heed the advice of anyone or any kind of advice, because let's face it, some advice can be bad. Well, that's true, especially when it comes to finances. And that's why the Bible has so many warnings about seeking wise counsel, whether that's with a spouse, a friend or a professional, we would always want to seek godly advice.

Okay. But how do we do that? Yeah, I would say first by studying God's word and learning what it says about wise decision making and what our role is in relation to God's. Wise counsel is always based on the acceptance that God owns everything.

We own nothing, not even ourselves. God's role is to be our provider. Our role is to be a faithful steward of what he gives us. That's the foundation of wise counsel. And it builds from there, always conforming to the timeless money management principles that God has laid out for us in his word. You know, the more you study scripture, the better you'll be able to know what godly advice is and what it isn't.

That's for sure. I found that in my own life. So well, what are some things we need to watch out for to make sure that pride isn't affecting our financial choices and decisions?

It's a good question. It might seem counterintuitive, Steve, but we have to be on our guard against success. You know, it's easy for pride to take hold when we land a big deal or get a raise or even when paying off that last credit card or finally able to burn the mortgage. Pride tells us that we're responsible for those financial victories, that they're because of something we've done rather than God's provision. That's why it's so important to remember that God owns everything and we're merely stewards or managers.

You know, another dangerous area, Steve, is lifestyle. Pride causes us to spend beyond our means for any number of reasons. Perhaps we feel we deserve it or to impress people rather than being a faithful steward of God's resources. Now, that's not to say we shouldn't enjoy God's provision, but you have to know when you're taking things too far. And again, that's where having wise counsel is important. You know, back to 1 Timothy, we're to enjoy God's provision, live with contentment and provide for our families.

Within those guidelines, we work it out as an exercise of faith and of course, with prayer to the Lord. Great information, Rob. Thanks.

800-525-7000. Great to have you with us today. It's Money Rise Live with Rob West. Our Facebook question of the day is, how do you prevent pride from damaging your finances?

We've heard from a couple of people. Laureen says, Rob, I prevent pride from damaging my finances by staying in my lane and not trying to do what others do and think that I should do it too. And I guess that kind of falls in line with maybe something like comparison. And if we know God's plan for a life will tend to stay away from that concept.

What do you have there? Well, you know, comparison was exactly what Jennifer was talking about. Jennifer said the way you prevent pride from damaging your finances is don't compare yourself with anyone else. And then Matt said, and I love this, to be completely honest, it's tough.

And boy, is it. Best thing is to constantly remember, Matt says, that all you have is really God's that he can give and take away. Also, if you're married, he goes on to say, work with your spouse to keep each other in check, wants versus needs. And those are great ideas. We'd love for you to engage with us on our Facebook page question of the day or whatever's on your mind. You can also engage with us in our new community tab in the MoneyWise app.

Download the app in your app store today. Just search for MoneyWise biblical finance, then click on the community tab and share your questions, comments. I'm in there periodically responding to questions. I know other teammates of ours are as well. And so it's a vibrant community of people who want to think about God's heart as it relates to their money.

And it's right there in the MoneyWise app. Do I have your permission, sir, to go into the community myself and kind of hang around and talk with folks, maybe give advice, counsel, talk about our favorite football team that comes? Sure. Yeah. OK, right.

Maybe crack a joke or two every now and then. I'm a serious minded guy. Right. Yeah.

That's the way I think of you. Eight hundred five to five. Seven thousand.

Athens, Tennessee. Hey, Brandon, thanks for joining us today. What's on your mind? Thank you. I was curious about some this year's stipulations in the CARES Act regarding penalty free distributions from IRAs, 401Ks, other retirement tax deferred retirement accounts. Yeah, Brandon, it's a great question. And you're exactly right. There are penalty free IRA and qualified account distributions as long as you meet the requirements.

So here's the deal. If you would withdraw from a traditional IRA or an employee provided or employer provided, I should say, account before fifty nine and a half, you would normally have to pay that 10 percent early withdrawal penalty under the CARES Act. It makes it more flexible. It eliminates the 10 percent early withdrawal penalty if you're under fifty nine and a half, so long as you meet the requirements. So the requirements say that you, your spouse or dependent, was either diagnosed with covid-19 or you experienced adverse financial consequences as a result of a layoff or other job related action. Now, the details on it, you can take up to one hundred thousand penalty free. You will still have to pay the tax due, not the penalty, but the tax that's generated by it. But you'll have three years to do it, three tax years.

So you can spread it out over three years. And if you decide to put it back in, you would have to refile your tax return. But you could do that at any point during the three year period and miss the tax. But there are provisions allowing folks who are in a real financial bind to take up to one hundred thousand dollars. And by the way, that's per person, not per account. So if you had multiple IRAs, you know, max of one hundred thousand per person. But if you're in that situation, it may be what you need to do.

I would say it's still pretty much a last resort. That's expensive money, meaning you've got to have to set the money aside to pay the tax on it. And that's money that's no longer available for your future.

But if you found yourself in a real predicament as a result of the pandemic, you know, it could be really the asset that you need to tap, especially without the 10 percent penalty. Brandon, we appreciate your call. Thank you very much, sir. Chicago Johnson, how can we help you today, sir?

Thanks for taking my call. Hello. Yeah. Go right ahead, sir.

Yeah. Seventy nine years old and only God knows how many more tomorrow's I have left. I have a mortgage of about sixty plus thousand and I have about the same amount in an annuity, about twenty thousand an investment net savings of about thirty six thousand. The next two years, I like to cash in some of my the annuity to pay off my mortgage, which will give me some money to be able to buy insurance. So I decided to do that. I'd like to know if it's a good idea. Yeah. So you're planning to take the money out of the annuity either way. Is that right? Yes.

Yes. OK. You know, I like the idea of you being debt free in this season of life. I realize that mortgage is such that you're still having to pay that payment every month even as you pay it down. And that's going to make the fact that you have to have more available on a monthly basis in terms of cash flow.

So as soon as we can get you out of debt completely, including your mortgage, it just gives you more flexibility because that's less money that you need on a monthly basis to sustain your lifestyle. I want to make sure, though, that in doing so, we don't, you know, take away all the funds that are available for the unexpected. So that would be, you know, an emergency fund in this season of life of at least six months worth of expenses a year would be even better. You know, perhaps you have that with that thirty six thousand in savings. You've got that additional twenty thousand in investments.

So I like the idea, Johnson, of you paying off this mortgage, eliminating that payment every month, which gives you more margin on a monthly basis. Now, let's talk for a second about the insurance you're thinking of picking up that would take the place of that mortgage payment. What are you looking to add in the way of insurance? Just a little life insurance that, you know, someday when the Lord calls me, there'll be something left for the family. OK, so you'd use it as an inheritance. You know, the only thing I would say about that is, you know, at 79 years old, that's going to be costly, that policy. And so I would just think about the impact of that, whether that makes the most sense, whether it's truly necessary versus you taking that money that you have available after the mortgage is paid off and just using that to sock it away every month. So you can build up an asset that's there for you if you need it. For instance, you know, if you had major medical expense, you needed some in-home care, long term care of some kind, that would be money that you'd have to access for that. But if you didn't use it and didn't need it, then it could be money that would be passed off as an inheritance. But for you to acquire an insurance policy at 79 years old, that's going to be costly. And, you know, again, you'd have to be able to see that through for there to be any benefit for the kids. And I guess the question is, is it worth all of that expense versus you, you know, saving that money, which you could then have access to if you need it during your life.

So I just think and pray through that. But as to your initial question, I like the idea of you being debt free and having a little bit more margin and flexibility in your life. And Johnson, if you'd like additional information, if you'd like to run this by someone else, you might check on our website MoneyWiseLive.org for a certified Kingdom advisor in your area.

Easy to find. Just click on that and it'll tell you who's in your area and who you might want to contact. We wish you the best.

Thank you very much. You're listening to MoneyWise Live. He's Rob West. I'm Steve Moore. Give us a call. 800-525-7000.

Remembering that God owns it all, not just the 10%. This is MoneyWise Live. Rob West taking your calls and questions today on anything financial at 800-525-7000. Continuing on, Crystal Lake, Illinois. Bobby, thanks for your patience.

And what's your question? Okay, my question is, I'm the trustee for my 90-year-old aunt's trust. And I moved her from California to Illinois because she can no longer take care of herself and she's in a senior home. Well, I just sold her house and her financial advisor that she's had for 30 years in California calls me and is suggesting that as long as I have six months living expenses for her, I should take the rest of it and have him invest it with the rest of her stocks and bonds. And I just think that's, you know, tying up money, that's a for sure thing.

Yeah. Well, tell me a little bit about the situation here, Bobby, in terms of what is currently invested and then what do you have in the way of the proceeds from the home sale? Okay, I have, she has about $50,000 and a checking account that's just, you know, her social security comes in there and so forth. And it's about $5,000 a month for living expenses. And she had, we sold her home for $330,000 and I sure in her investments, it's over probably half a million.

Okay. And is she drawing an income off of the trust right now or is she living off of social security alone? She is drawing some interest off of the investments. I would say about a couple thousand every quarter.

A couple of thousand a quarter. So you think she's probably only taking, you know, $8,000 a year or so? Yes, I do think that. And I will tell you, I am, this is brand new for me since, so since when I brought her here in June, I'm learning all kinds of things, even though I listen to you guys almost every day. Oh, that's great.

Well, thank you for that. Well, you know, I like the idea of you having, especially in this season of life, you having a year's worth of liquid funds, but you have nearly that with the $50,000. You said her expenses are about $5,000 a month. So you, in effect, have 10 months worth of expenses in the checking account. Is that right? That is correct.

Okay. So what I would do is I'd probably open a savings account, an online savings account that's paying a half a percent a year, which is what they're paying right now, and move over to that savings account. Anything beyond what she needs for this month, plus one more month, leave that in the checking account.

So there's always plenty of cash there. And then move the rest over to the online savings so that if you need to move it over for any reason, or she does for anything unexpected, it's just a couple of days away with an electronic transfer. But at least it's not in the checking account where the bills are being paid out of, and it's earning some interest.

So that would be my first suggestion. Beyond that, you know, if you were to add another 10,000 to that savings account and get it up to 60, as long as you tell me she's only pulling about 8,000 a year from that half a million, I mean, we would reasonably say, you know, you could, you could pull 4% a year. Well, that would be 20,000 on half a million. So even if she's not at quite at a half a million, or she's pulling a little more than eight, in either case, she's pulling a lot less than, you know, 4% a year, she's pulling less than 2% a year. So that's a good thing, which means that account should continue to grow even on a very conservative basis with a, you know, a small percentage in stocks to generate some return and a little better than you might get in a straight fixed income account, but the majority of the assets in perhaps bonds. And that would also tell me that as long as she doesn't plan on another major expense, like buying another home or replacing a car, or you don't have, you know, some planned medical expenses, or you know she's heading into long-term care or something like that, that where we would need to have money available for that, if none of that is present right now, at least what we know of today, then I would say you could take a portion of this and redirect it back into the investment account because you have the time horizon appropriate for an income-based investment strategy.

And that means that there's a good portion that's available, that's generating income, that's not at the risk of the stock market, and the smaller amount that is at the risk of the market, even if the market were to enter a, you know, two or three year bear market, you wouldn't have to sell anything because you're pulling such a little amount out, you could weather any storm in terms of letting it recover. So I'm actually not against you investing, you know, almost all of this, as long as the investment strategy matches her time horizon, risk tolerance, age and objectives, if that makes sense. Do you follow all that, Bobbi? I do follow that. And I would say that physically she's doing really well, but mentally she's not. And, you know, and I'm just wondering if, OK, I think I understand what you're saying because her advisor was saying, and then when we know what, you know, she's closer actually to death, then you would probably start pulling out, you know, from her investments.

And yes, I just want to make sure that's good. I think it makes a lot of sense. I mean, obviously there's a lot more to this than we can deal with in a couple of minutes on the radio, but just conceptually there could come a time, it seems like based on what you're describing, where you'd need to start pulling a lot more in the way of income from this account because you'd have to cover medical expenses and care for her and those kinds of things. And if that was the case, you'd want this money working for her in a portfolio like I described and having a bit more available, more like $800,000 instead of $500,000 would give you the ability to generate more income without ever touching that principle. So this sounds like a good plan as long as she has a year's worth of liquid cash and the right income-based portfolio that's providing for her moving forward.

I think we've got a good strategy here. Bobby, I'm thinking that as you help your aunt, you're probably learning quite a bit about your own financial situation, are you not? Yeah. I feel sorry for my daughter.

Well, no. I mean, you've got a head start now. You're a lot smarter about these things than you were six months ago and God's going to bless it. He's going to bless your generosity as well and we're glad that you called today. Thanks so very much. When we come back from our break, we'll be talking with Shelby about buying a house that's in foreclosure.

After that, Hannah wants to know some tips for single moms. That and more when MoneyWise Live continues at 800-525-7000. We'll be right back.

MoneyWise Live is a place where we meet each day to encourage one another to manage our money biblically and effectively. Good to have you with us. Again, here's our phone number 800-525-7000. We have some open lines. Hannah, Mary and John, you are in line. Don't go anywhere, would you please?

Next, it's Shelby in Shreveport. What's your question for Rob West? Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. I guess my main questions are two. One would be, would you recommend buying a foreclosed home to fix up and live in as well as what are the steps into doing that? Yeah. Tell me what you're thinking there, Shelby. Why are you thinking about buying a foreclosure? Are you particularly handy? You like the idea of kind of doing the renovations and maybe using this as kind of a side business?

What are you thinking? Well, honestly, the initial reason is it's a family home. A few months ago, we got a letter and kind of the We Buy Houses people told us that they're going to pay the taxes on it. I guess in three years, if they paid the taxes for three years, then they would somehow get it as well as me and my husband were currently renting. We were looking for a future home and we didn't know if this would maybe be a good opportunity or a place to start.

It really doesn't need a whole lot of work. I think it was just the taxes that my family, I have family members that stopped paying on. So I'm not really sure.

I guess is where I need to, I don't know where to start if you guys even recommend it. Yeah. You know, I think the biggest issue with buying a foreclosure is often the unexpected. So if this is a home that you know, that's going to take a lot of that away.

Oftentimes you really need a pretty solid financial cushion under you to absorb any potential problems or issues in terms of unexpected costs or any other issues that were not clear because you're kind of buying it as is, if you will. And there can be a lot of things that don't emerge until after the fact that you would otherwise uncover in the inspection process and just the normal course of buying a property that's not in a foreclosure status. But if you're buying a property where all that's been taken away because this is a family property and a lot of that is known to you or you can get to a place where you have some comfort in it, then I think the key is, you know, whether you're actually buying under market value. And so I would get an experienced real estate agent who has some experience in foreclosures who can, first of all, assess the value of it to see what is it you're actually paying? What is the market value?

What is the condition of the home? Do you have the funds available to take care of those or is this going to be something that will become a burden because you're perhaps buying, you know, spending all the money you have available and then, you know, you're going to be frustrated because there's things you want to do to it or there's problems you need to take care of and you don't have the funds. So it's really coming down to, first of all, budgeting, right?

How much do we have available? What is our cushion and what do we have, you know, allotted for those repairs and renovations? Number two, are we buying at the right value below market ideally with a foreclosure? And then thirdly, who's that professional who can help us navigate the twists and turns, who has some experience in this? Obviously, you'd want to do the standard things like, you know, getting pre-approved for the mortgage.

Don't just assume you can afford what the bank says you can and then you'll want to, you know, try to get that inspection done so you have real clarity on what you're getting. But the end of the day, I don't have a problem with it, especially again, if this is a property you're familiar with, that's going to take a lot of the guesswork out. How's that sound, Shelby? Thank you guys so much. Okay, we appreciate it, Shelby.

Thanks for calling. Great question. You know, I hear and see these ads all the time about buying foreclosed homes and obviously, they make it sound real easy. Well, not necessarily and there are some pitfalls to avoid, right, Rob? Well, that's exactly right and that's why you just want to go into it with your eyes wide open and going back to our opening topic today, Steve, that's why you want to have plenty of wise counsel walking alongside you as you navigate that. Amen. Okay, out to Omaha, Omaha, Nebraska. Hannah, what's going on in your life?

Hi, I just moved to Omaha in September. Me and my husband are divorcing. We have three children and now that I've been a stay-at-home mom for four and a half years. My oldest is four and a half and now I work, obviously. But it's like reality is setting in and it's like I have to get insurance.

It's like, do I apply for the state like Medicaid or do I get a private? Like what do I do? And then, you know, the kids three and they're little, they're one, two and a half and four and you know, like they're in daycare and it's just like expenses everywhere on top of our rent and it's like what in the world?

It's a wake-up call. So, I was wondering if you guys had any tips to make it easy or easier. Well, let me just tell you, Hannah, I've counseled with another enough single moms and dads to know how challenging it can be when you're working on limited resources. You're having to take care of young children, which is a full-time job in and of itself and then working on top of that outside the home, you know, trying to navigate all of it. And so we've just got to come back to the fact that God is your provider. He is on the throne. His promises can be trusted and one of those is that he will provide for you.

It doesn't mean it's not going to be without its challenges. And so I think right off inviting God into your finances is really key recognizing his ownership and saying Lord, I need your help. I need your wisdom James 1 5.

He says if we lack wisdom, we should ask for it and he'll give it to us. And so we need to ask for it. We need to ask for his provision which he certainly promises and then beyond that I think being plugged into a really good church family there in your new hometown that can you know, be there as a support system for you because it's part of the role of the local church. And so I'd say get really involved because you're going to need some help along the way and that is not always going to be financial beyond that.

I think we need to have real clarity and around what is the provision that you have? What are those resources that are going to be coming your way in the form of your pay as well as any kind of government assistance or programs, you know for families and we don't want to be you know, unwilling to ask for those or take advantage of those everything from food assistance to anything else that might be provided and then any kind of support that would be coming from your husband as well. I think you know would be obviously funds that could be available to help provide for the needs of the kids at the very least. You know beyond that just taking all that information and getting that into a good working budget. So you have real clarity around what's coming in on a monthly basis, what needs to go out, not just the things you get bills for but the discretionary expenses as well and even those non-recurring expenses things that are going to come around, you know, once or twice a year and you know, we have budget coaches what we call Money Wise coaches that would be delighted to walk alongside you in that process, give you some tips and ideas for how you can cut costs and get that spending plan in place.

We'd love for you to download the new Money Wise app and use that as an envelope system if you will because you know having a good handle on what's available by paycheck so you can prioritize your spending around the bills and keeping food on the table and keeping the rent paid and everything else is going to be really key. So you know this is going to be challenging and yet I want you to be encouraged because I believe God's heart is aligned with what you're doing and that is trying to care for these kids the best you can and provide for your family. And so I'm going to ask our Money Wise Live community to be praying for you in this process and reach out to our Money Wise coaches. They'd be delighted to walk alongside you in this process. Indeed. Hannah, God bless you.

You stay in the line. Let's make sure we can get some contact information from you so we can send you some things. We wish you and your children a very Merry Christmas this year. We'll be right back with more with Rob West after this. It's Money Wise Live. Rob West taking your calls, questions and comments today. We'd love to hear from you so let's continue on by going to Wentzville, Missouri. Mary, we appreciate you holding on the line for us. What's your 401k question today?

Thank you for taking my call. My husband is 63 and he's planning on retiring August when he turns 64 and I'm 60 and I'm figuring I'll have to work till 65 just to carry insurance. I'm a little worried about our 401. He has a pension through his work but he also has a 401 that probably has about 60,000 in it. I have a 401 that has about 150,000 in it and I have a small pension when I retire. They offer where I work like an IRA 401 but they also have the regular 401 and mine's all in the regular. My house is paid off. I have a 401 loan and I owe about 10,000 on it. My payment's about 230 something a month, I mean a week.

I'm not sure if we should be leaving our money in our 401 with him getting ready to retire and with the way the economy may change with this new election. So I was wondering if you could give me any advice. Absolutely Mary. Well first of all, thank you for your call and for that great description of where you all are at.

I appreciate that background. A couple of questions. First one would be, let me just say congratulations on having that home paid off. That's really critical as you all head into this next season of life to keep your expenses as low as possible.

Being completely out of debt is going to give you ultimate flexibility and keep your need really low in terms of what you need to be able to have coming in on a monthly basis to cover your expenses. Is it going to be true that when you're both collecting your pensions plus social security that the combination of those without pulling anything from the 401k investments will cover your expenses? Absolutely. Yeah. Okay. You probably will have a little bit left over each month? Yeah.

Okay. See that's a great situation to be in which means that this roughly $210,000 and whatever it grows to between now and when you retire in the next five years could easily be a quarter of a million dollars that just continues to grow in the future so that if you had a major need, a major medical event or something unexpected, you'd have some money to fall back on. You could also convert that into an income stream.

Even at 250,000 we would look at about 4% a year. You could pull an extra 10,000 a year off of that quarter of a million and ideally you would invest it in such a way that you'd never impact the principal. You could just live off the interest of it plus the dividends and so forth, but you don't even need that. All that money can just continue to be reinvested so it grows over time.

You're really in a good spot. I think in terms of how you approach the investing side of that, keep in mind because you all don't need to pull any money out of this and because of the fact that once you reach age 65, life expectancy goes to 83 and 84 for men and women respectively. If the Lord tarries and you all are in good health, you could need this money to last for a couple of decades or more. That's why we say even when you hit retirement, you should have an investment strategy that still has some allocation to stocks even though the majority may be in bonds and because you're in a situation where you're not even planning to pull an income from it, you could even have perhaps a little bit more toward stocks.

Maybe it's 50-50. Whatever you're comfortable with because remember the goal is to meet your objectives and what God has for you in this season, not to outpace the market or your neighbor or your friend or anything like that. We want to take as little risk as possible and yet be a good steward of this money so it can grow and be available for more giving or whatever you have for it, passing it down as an inheritance, whatever it might be. I like the idea of it staying invested.

I wouldn't get too focused on the election or anything like that. The stock market in a properly diversified portfolio over the last hundred years despite all kinds of upheaval and every decade having its own kind of catastrophe and dilemmas and all kinds of administrations, whether you like where this is headed or you don't, bottom line is the stock market is the very best place to be to build wealth over time. And so as long as that portfolio is invested appropriately with your age and risk tolerance and that's going to come down to having an investment professional who understands you and can deploy it that way, I think that's exactly the place for you to be over the long haul given how you all have positioned yourself with God's money. So I'd roll his account out to an IRA. I'd find a certified kingdom advisor there in Missouri that you're comfortable with by interviewing two or three. And then when you retire and that loan's paid back, then you could roll that 150 out to add to it and you guys will be in great shape. The only other thing that I would look at is I would consider a long-term care insurance policy.

But other than that, I think you guys are in great position. You know, Rob, for the past 35 years or so since I've been hanging around here, I found that virtually no one disagrees with the concept of hiring a professional or working with a certified kingdom advisor or anyone along those lines. But what keeps people from doing it sometimes is they don't like the concept of having to pay someone. So generally speaking, if I want to sit down with someone for a couple of hours or maybe even ultimately ask them to come on board for a number of years, what should I expect to be paying that person? Yeah, you know, it just depends on what you're hiring them for. If you're paying them to actually take discretion, meaning making buy and sell decisions for you based on your goals and objectives on an investment portfolio, that could be anywhere from one and a half percent a year to, you know, a little less than one percent as the portfolio size gets, you know, up above a million dollars. So on a hundred thousand dollar portfolio, that would be a thousand dollars a year. On a million dollar portfolio, that could be ten thousand a year. If you're paying somebody for their time to do, let's say, a comprehensive financial plan, it could be, you know, somewhere between seven hundred fifty and two thousand dollars. But again, you're paying for somebody with knowledge and expertise that you don't have so you can be the best steward of God's money in the same way you'd pay a CPA to prepare your return.

You'd hire an estate planning attorney to do your will and trust and power of attorney and you'd hire a real estate agent to sell your home. Is it like paying a surgeon to operate on your brain? I would recommend that as well, by the way. Some things you don't want to do on your own. You don't, absolutely. Fox Lake, Illinois. John, we know you've been holding out there, buddy, and that you're wanting to start a not-for-profit.

Give us the details. So, every year I do a number of food drives in my community, other communities, and I'd really like to start a non-charity where I could work with local grocery stores and even clothing stores to get other contributions. And I'm sure I would need a tax number that somebody wouldn't just hand that stuff over from a business. Homeowners don't have a problem with making donations, but I'm not trying to grow into a business. I'm just trying to figure out, do I need to start a business for non-charity? Where can I just get a tax ID?

And I've looked online a little bit, and then when I start digging deeper, I'm seeing there's a lot of scams out there and who's going to, what you're going to be charged to get a number that's not valid. So, listening to you guys, and I appreciate you guys every day, I figured I'm going to give you guys a call and let you guide me. Well, John, I appreciate that, and it sounds like you're doing some great work there collecting food for those who are in a real needy position, especially this year with all of the need that's out there.

I appreciate hearing about what it is God has called you to. So, you're looking, just to be clear, you're looking to form a not-for-profit organization to be able to accept donations where you could offer a tax deduction as a result of taking those charitable contributions. Is that right? Correct. Okay. Yes.

Yeah. So, I think the key here is what you have to recognize is, you know, in EIN, which is very easy to get at IRS.gov, an employee identification number is a wholly different process than getting a tax-exempt status. You know, there's going to be some work to be done to become a nonprofit and achieve that status from the IRS, including getting clear on your purpose, which you probably are.

You just articulated that to me pretty clearly. Deciding what type of nonprofit you want to establish. Is it charitable for poverty relief?

Probably. Could be religious, any number of other purposes and nonprofits that you want to start. A name for it, forming a board, writing up the bylaws, and then you've got to prepare and file the incorporation paperwork. Ultimately, you're then going to file IRS Form 1023 for the 501c3 tax-exempt status. And that's really going to be the key because you have to get that tax-exempt status in order to become a charity where you can accept charitable contributions. You know, I've been down this road several times and you know, there's a lot more to it than you think.

And having somebody who's been through it before is really worth its weight in gold, in my view. So finding either an accountant or an attorney who has real experience in these types of things, forming not-for-profit organizations, completing those bylaws, helping you fill out the form to submit to the IRS. All of those things are going to be really key, I think, including forming the corporation if you don't have one already. And then you're going to need ongoing compliance because you have to comply with the annual reporting requirements once you have it. So I would contact a certified kingdom advisor there in Fox Lake, John, and ask for a referral to either an accountant or an attorney who's somebody who is a godly person who has experience in assisting folks in forming not-for-profit organizations.

And I think paying somebody to do that will save you a whole lot of time and grief in getting this process done. So great job on the work you're doing, and I think you'll be pleased if you go down this road. John, thanks very much for giving us a call today. We wish you the best as you continue on with the ministry God's given you. Thanks again for your calls. We're pretty much out of time for calls today, but we'll be back tomorrow. MoneyWise Live is a partnership between Moody Radio and MoneyWise Media. For Rob West, I'm Steve Moore. Have a great remainder of your day, and please join us again tomorrow.