Community After Hours

This is Hans Schile from the Finishing Well Podcast.

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This is the Truth Network. Coming to you from an entrenched barricade deep in the heart of central North Carolina, Masculine Journey After Hours, a time to go deeper and be more transparent on the topic covered on this week's broadcast. So sit back and join us on this adventure. The Masculine Journey After Hours starts here now.

Welcome to Masculine Journey After Hours. We are glad that you're with us, and hopefully you listened to the first segment of the show when we were talking about community and the challenges of community. And as I was looking around, the thing I thought funny until right now, no one had a microphone in front of them other than me. They were all kind of just pushed to the side like, I'm not going to talk. I'm not going to talk.

That's exactly what I was looking at. I was like, I wonder who's going to be the first to go grab a microphone. I was just going to pick somebody. I was waiting for you just to get a go off, and it's like, oh, well, I'll scramble to get one. Yeah, we were keeping it between us so we could either one grab it. Oh, yeah, quickly.

I'm buying that. Anyway, yeah, we're talking about community, and we didn't have any trouble listing challenges of community, did we, Jim? Not so much, no. I probably had more trouble than anybody. I don't know why you asked me.

Well, because you had the microphone in front of you is why I asked you. But let me ask you this, though, Jim. Yes, right now you are in two good communities, right? But hasn't there been a season or two along the way that it's been pretty barren of having a hard time to find a good community? It's been a, I am a real people person. So it's hard for me, but I have been at times where there was no community. And when I have found it, real community, it's almost always been God-related. You were talking about teams before the thing, and I said most of the team sports I did were tennis, and the one that was a team was rowing, but you got a little guy yelling at eight big guys for 45 seconds to four or five minutes, depending upon the length of the run, and that's it. We didn't do much else other than exercise. So yeah, there have been a lot of times when I've been, and when I have been pretty much on my own, and that's not a place I enjoy, and it really isn't good for anyone.

Thanks, Jim. What's, guys, switching the topic, what's some of the benefits of community? Right, but before we go there, you know, I think that we need to kind of talk about, talk about, at least for me, there's been times that I've really felt like I had community, but looking back, it wasn't really community like it needs to be. There was a season when I was in California, and I played softball for, I don't know, four or five years, and we would, you know, occasionally a couple of us would have a cookout together, you know, very rarely, once or twice a year.

You know, we played softball pretty well year-round, because it was California, and we'd go out after the games, you know, and have some sodas or whatever, whatever have you. And anyway, it just depends on the person, you know. I was not a soda person, but somewhere.

But yeah, what have you. The difference in that was we had a good time, but I really can't remember a single significant conversation that really mattered to anything. During that time, I was going through divorce, I was a single parent, you know, lots of things to need to really talk to somebody, and that was just not the group to do that with, you know. And when I look back, what I thought I had was community. I really just had a good night out once a week, you know. That's what it came down to with some people that were nice people, but it was not the depth of what my heart really needed. Yeah, for me, the biggest letdown of community was work, right? Being in the car business before I was a Christian for sure, you know, you work till 9, 10, 11, sometimes 1 o'clock in the morning, you know, as long as there's customers, we're working.

And we're working six days a week, and you're around all these people significantly, and sharing life and expecting there to be some kind of depth to the relationship. But one of the things that I can, I'll never ever forget as long as I lived, the first time I really got to be in a community, it was in a Sunday school class in a church in Raleigh. And as we were hanging out in there, I was like, these people are really nice to me. And I wonder what they want. You think they want to buy a car, you know, because it had been my experience in all these communities that I'd been in, that there was a reason why somebody was going to begin to be nice to you, or the reason that they seem to befriending you, there was some hidden agenda. And when I discovered within this Sunday school class, like, wow, these people are nice to me, and they don't want to buy a car. What's up with that?

And there you go. So I guess, mine, I mean, there were the softball teams and stuff, there were there were those, as Robby says, when you spend the majority of your time away from home at work, you expect there to be some kind of bonding. And a lot of times you had, you know, a common enemy being the boss, you know, but there's not a lot of depth in that. And there were, I made Christian friends there. I remember doing Bible studies, and there was some, some kind, I feel like you have to have a spiritual aspect for it, for it to really be of depth. You can still have tight relationships with people and talk about things that matter in life, but still, you got to have that spiritual impact. I think, but I think though, for the longest time, I probably was that man on an island, I had some really good friends.

And we would talk. But it wasn't a group, it was individual. But I think it was something that I think I realized that I needed.

I'd heard people talk about it occasionally, but I never found it. In fact, church was the last place you went to do anything with any kind of vulnerability or depth, you didn't want to, you don't want anybody to know your stuff, you know. And, you know, whenever I got, went to the first boot camp, and, and hearing you guys on the radio for many, listening to Masking Journey quite a bit, you could tell that there was a true, something that was very appealing there, as you talked about your vulnerability with one another, and how you had a band of brothers. And then as I came into that, I was like, okay, yeah, you know, at first, I was very cautious.

You guys know probably how guarded I probably was. And, and then as you loosen up, you begin to see the value of people sharing, you know, their experiences and what they go through, and being real. And so I guess that's my experience. I know we're talking about where we didn't have it. But that's kind of my story of finding it.

Thank you, Andy. Yeah, because you don't know what you can have until you actually get it. Because you think there's community, you think, Oh, wow, this is really good. I got some buds, we go hang out, we do this or that together. We play some racquetball, we go play some sports, you know, the same thing, Sam, I had several, there was a community of us that we did all the sports together each season. So there was softball, basketball, football, we all kind of did those things together. It was fun.

And I would have said, yeah, that's community. But I did not have an experience like I had with this group. I have never shared what I've shared in this group, you know, with anybody, I would have never have even thought about opening my voice to something like that. I'm just a very shy person and would not share personal things and would feel scared, very frightened to go into something like that.

What are they going to think of me? And in this group, you don't get that. And what we find at camp is there's more men that want that, that they want to be loved for who they are. And that's what we're there to try to help provide and say that's available. You know, we're always trying to reach out and help people be a part of a community and wherever you're at, you know, find your men, or we'll help you or be in our community, call us, be a part of it with us. And that's what we enjoy doing. Because we know how much it's meant for us. But again, it's a journey. And you never know what you can have until you get it. And you're like, oh, that's what I was missing. It just feels so right to have that community.

It does. And I had a follow-up question for you, Rodney. You said that, you know, you're always worried about what people think of you. And in this group, you found that that's not to be the issue.

Is that because we have grace or we don't think? Do I have to answer? Okay, I just wondered. Yeah. You guys think gracefully. Oh, you could have just said yes. Yes.

I know. But no, I mean, you guys, I witnessed it with you guys, with each other, before it was ever bestowed upon me. And that's where it was like, oh, you were just drawn into that.

And then Robby's like, hey, you want to show up at the radio show, just hang out? You know, never figuring to be sitting in this seat doing this. That's what the draw of community does.

You do stuff that you just would never have otherwise do. Agreed. Yeah. Jim?

Oh, you just shoved the microphone over here. But I did think of a time I had, I thought I had community and then it was gone. Last millennium, I took a shot at being a Thespian for a little bit. And I was in two plays.

I did that for Robby. I knew he'd lose it. Fortunately, he's not on a bike. But very close.

Very close. You're getting out of hand with this vulnerability stuff. I'm going to try to get the story out before he gets a bike. I got one. You know, it's not on the outside what really disturbs me about that.

It's what's on the inside that just totally is wrong. Anyway, because I could sing, I was invited into two plays. And we were very close for a couple of months. We'd go out to eat together after practices and things. And it was, it felt like community.

It was a great bunch. When the play was over, I couldn't tell you the names of any of them. I didn't know otherwise.

It was gone. And yeah. And there were a lot of, I better not use the word intimate or Robby will start laughing again. But there were a lot of very, very close relationships between members of the cast.

And I don't think any of those lasted. So it sort of gave me an idea of how screwed up Hollywood is as being quality. Exactly. I don't even think I can follow that.

Yeah, I think we could go to a clip. We have plenty of the Andy was talking about spiritual content of it, the crowd I used to hang out with, we took a lot of spirits, but there was nothing real spiritual about it. But I would have told you my party crowd that I hung out with for so many years was true community. I would have told you that when the chips were down, my boys would be there.

And dad used to call them the thick and thin friends because when things got thick, they would thin out. And, and it was true, because I would have sworn it was true community. But it was just a fallacy all because none of them come to see me when I sobered up or none of them.

Matter of fact, few of them are kind of like Rafe would have been if he didn't get the shot dead. So, um, but, you know, and then come into now with you guys, and I told the story pre-show my wife said last night, it was last night that I'm talking about since I've been hanging out with you guys. She wants me to stop.

No, I'm kidding. She said, I can tell the difference in your life because she said, I can tell it's true community. And that's big for my wife because ministry had been the other woman for her for a long time. And, you know, we made the transition to King and she said, I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that if I called you on a Tuesday night and said, hey, someone's breaking into the house. She said, not only would you leave and come home, she said, most of the game would be with you. I said, well, maybe leave two of them to finish the show or something, but I don't know. So, but that's huge because there's not anybody in this room or something that are not here that I couldn't call to talk through something.

And that's, that's big because usually in a, in a crowd that I've been in, maybe one or two people I'd talked to on a Tuesday night, talked to on a deep intimate level, but I can pick a phone call to any of you guys. And that's pretty cool. Yeah. I don't disagree.

Thank you, Danny. This is something going back to something you said, Andy. I don't disagree that the spiritual components needed. I just don't always think that it's obvious, right?

Yeah. I can think of a group of three of us, you know, that went to college together that still stay in very close relationship. You know, we don't talk about church. We don't talk about God.

We don't do any of that, but we treat each other with love and respect and in godly manner, right? There's grace there. There's accountability there.

There's those things. And I think God's in the midst of it, whether any of us would really say that openly, you know, hey, or recognize it. I think God's always in the middle of those things. And I think you can say the same thing sometimes in family, right? That, you know, God's not necessarily always on the forethought, but it doesn't mean he's not the driver underneath that's making that community work.

And I don't know, it's not necessarily a disagreement. I just think it's a different way to look at it because I don't want to say that, you know, if you're not in a Bible study together and you're not talking about God, that you don't, and I know you weren't meaning that, that you don't have real community. You know, you can have community and God be fully in the midst of it without having those conversations. Well, I guess what I was saying is, you know, a lot of times you're talking about when people get together, there's not a lot of depth.

Right. And I think all your depth comes from a spiritual basis. Now, would you necessarily, you can be in a group and have spiritual conversations, not even really realizing you're having to do that, or you're doing that actually, I guess.

And you can have really close relationships that actually are iron on iron, and maybe it's not everybody's a believer in the crowd or whatever, and there's people benefiting from the growth of it. But I do believe that there is, when I think of community, I do think of a spiritual community, and I think that there's a higher purpose, and there's a smile that God, that comes on God's face when his children get together and talk about him and learn and grow from each other. I guess that's what I'm saying.

Yeah. And I don't think you can have real community and absence of God. I'm not saying that either. I'm saying I think a lot of times God's in the midst of it, and you don't necessarily realize it. One of the groups, and I don't know the intimate conversations, obviously, and I don't really like to talk about other people's lives much, but I've watched my oldest son and his relationship with his friends from college football. And it is a deep, intimate relationship. They are there for each other. I'm sure they've had spiritual conversations at some point, but they definitely know that they have each other's back.

And it's kind of similar to what you talked about with Remember the Titans kind of thing, and they're very, very close-knit, and that is his community. And so you can find it at work. You can find it on a team.

You can find it in other places. But I promise you, when it gets down to the middle of it, God's in the middle of it. Back to the thick and thin, yeah. Yeah, or it's not going to last.

Yeah. And that's where what hit me when I was reading John 15, it was just going through that where he starts off with, you know, Jesus is divine, the Father is divine dresser, and then basically all the followers of Jesus are the branches, and you have this whole community kind of being spoked out through all of that chapter. And when you have all the abiding in each other, and basically apart from him you can do nothing, and you kind of continue on with a lot of this, and it's like if you don't abide in him, basically you're going to be cast out and burned in the fire, you know.

It's just a worthless, dried-up branch. And it's like, well, that's no place to be in community. You know, you want to be in where he's in control, where he's at, because like we were talking earlier, he's the one that chose you. He came after you. He came after your heart.

And to have that and feel that and know that is just, it's overwhelming that you can't get to the point of really describing it. It's just, it's just joy. And to have that joy and be able to share that joy with your brothers is true, close relationship in community. And, you know, he talks about changing that relationship in there from, I no longer call you slaves, I call you friends, because I share everything from the Father with you. I share all the secrets that he has, everything that he knows, he's sharing with them. And then he ends up with, okay, now remember, the world hated me before it hated you. So there's this whole relationship there with this other community called the world that's a bad community.

So you can have good communities, you can have bad communities, you have all kinds of different relationships. But when Jesus is in control of everything, that is where you want to be in that relationship. Darrell Bock Well, and I think it's really cool, and it's going to be Andy's clip, so Andy's going to have to get a mic.

And I just thought I'd just turn his mic over to me. But anyway, in the series The Chosen, right, if you watch it, which I couldn't recommend it enough, there's great ideas of Jesus's community, because here's these 12 knuckleheads. And I mean, you get the picture of knuckleheads if you watch this, that, you know, Jesus brought these people together, but they were really individuals.

And I was just thinking, because we've been in this for a while, Sam, you know, I guess 10 years, 12 years. And there's people that come along that are a little bit vulnerable. And when you watch The Chosen, you'll see Matthew is one of those vulnerable people. He's really different than the other people in the crowd. He's really got a different type of vocation. But the beauty of this last clip that Andy's going to talk about here, from my standpoint, what keeps Matthew in the community, because these people are mean to him, okay?

They're just plain mean. But what keeps Matthew in this is this sense of, wait a minute, Jesus chose me. This is his community. And it's clear to Matthew that this is Jesus's community. And so as I pray about that, and I think about that, wow, we've got to keep that, right? For those people that are vulnerable on the outside that feel like they're outcast, that they feel chosen by Jesus and feel chosen in that community to make sure that following him includes staying in that community.

Darrell Bock Yeah, that's exactly right. And Matthew, I mean, a tax collector was the enemy to the Jews. And this guy wasn't even Jewish, and he was picked for the community. And like you said, he had to be carrying a heavy sense of, well, this is Jesus. And again, you don't see this in the Gospels. This is the story of The Chosen.

But I'm pretty sure this is the way the disciples looked upon him as him being a former tax collector. He was ostracized. He was pushed out from the community. And I think it brings the story together farther along in The Chosen. But in this clip, you can tell he's really pushed away. Now, what's funny about it is, that's one part of the clip where he's kind of ostracized.

But in the end of it, you hear Simon talking about the importance of them staying together on under the excruciating confines, or whatever, of the Roman Empire, and being conquered, and them being occupiers, and how here he is saying, we really had to stick together, but we really don't want you, because you were part of them. And that's sometimes how our communities evolve. Somebody may not seem to be as part of the community, probably like I was when I came in. This dude's different, or whatever. But that's the beauty of the things. There's a sense of, there's a sense that I have, that I didn't know any of these guys from anything other than radio show and boot camps. And I'm like, wow, you know, these, I wouldn't have done this, you know, I don't, you know, this is, I just don't know, I wouldn't have imagined that I would be in a group like this. I love it.

I love each one of you guys. But, you know, God did it. So here's the clip.

Yeah, here's a clip. I've grown to love being Jewish. And I've grown to love following the law, but it can be exhausting following the law or being Jewish. Both always has been even before the occupation. Yes, but aren't we used to it by now? Hasn't it made us stronger? I don't get it, if I'm honest. I don't know why God has allowed the occupation.

I'd love to ask him more about that. Why this has been allowed for so long? It's hard to feel like the chosen people have been. But it's all worth it now. Yes.

The wait is over. What about you? What do you mean? Has it been difficult for you all this time? The occupation, following Jewish law? My life has not been easy.

Oh, it hasn't. What was more painful for you? Escaping Roman persecution by working for them or escaping your guilt with all the money?

And now you're catching up on Torah and wanting to follow the law? Why not all of a sudden? Why not all the other times you had the chance?

Simon. No, no, John, I want to know. I was trying to save my family's life and I love you, John, but that's not something you have to worry about when Zeb and Salome are looking out for you. But you put me in a desperate position where I did things I would never have done otherwise. And I've repented for them.

And John and James, I am sorry, but I didn't go through with it. What is your excuse? I was a successful businessman and yet I was always behind.

He wasn't your tax collector. Quit defending him. I want an answer. Hey, you're new. You're new to even know what it's like to be Jewish, to suffer for centuries and centuries because of it, but to still commit to it, to protect our heritage, even though it never stops being painful, because the one comfort we have is to know that we're doing it together, that we're all suffering together.

But if we just wait a little longer, if we hold tight, just a little more, we'll have rescue because we're chosen, all of us. And you betrayed that and you spit on it. I can't forgive it.

I'll never forgive it. All right. You said what you needed to say. Sit down, Simon.

You sit down first. Now, Robby, before the show, you talked about this whole concept of being chosen, right? Do you want to share any of that?

Well, yeah. I mean, that when, you know, we all were in that picking line where we didn't get chosen. And so when you're in a group that, you know, for me, as I, you know, began to become part of what now is masculine journey, you know, when you aspire to these people, you look up to them and you think, wow. And so when they choose you, it has this sense of being needed, of being wanted, of being part of something that's meaningful and that also helps you stick when that happens.

And you're the, and you're the butt end of that. That the beauty of it is the character arc of all the people involved, right? There's the character arc of Simon, clearly.

There's the character arc of Matthew. In other words, all those people are being molded into what becomes, you know, the most powerful army in the history of the world. One thing I would ask the listeners out there, you know, if you feel like you're part of a community, right? And a community can be as little as three, right?

I mean, God is the perfect image of, you know, Father, Son, Holy Ghost, right? That's the perfect image of community, three. Two is a friendship, right?

And so that's the difference, friendship versus community. But looking at either one of those, I would ask you to ask yourself, what's the fruit of those things, right? Because true community, true friendship is going to have a fruit that is sweet. It's going to taste sour sometimes, right? But the net fruit is sweet. And if it's never sweet, I got to ask you, are you really in a real community, right?

Or is it time to look to another source or maybe say, God, you know, what do I need to do differently in this one? That type of thing. But what are some of those things that are sweet that comes from a community that's healthy? The first thing that came to mind for me is strength.

You have a chord of three, it's not easily broken. If you don't have someone to rely on in your life, and spouses are great, that there need to be brothers that you can go to with anything. If you don't have that, you will fall. I think you have strength, you have grace, you have understanding, you have accountability. The times that you have the truth spoken to you in love, and that's the key thing in love, right? For your benefit, not for the way I'm feeling right now. And there's so much more to that, but ask God to open your eyes to the people around you and say, God, where do you want me to have community? We'll talk to you next week. Go register for bootcamp, masculinejourney.org. This is the Truth Network.