Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network Podcast. Let's see, I'm trying to think of different things to talk about because there are some things to talk about.

And, you know, because there's a lot of stuff to talk about. And so, you know, we can talk about the politics, but I don't really want to do that right now. You know, except to say that the leftists are trying to sway Roe versus Wade.

This is something we Christians should be involved in prayerfully. The left is semi-threatening the Supreme Court with protests, sending it in front of the houses, doing things that are unlawful. And if they get what they want, then society will learn and everybody will learn, you can threaten people and you can get what you want. And it'll just be open up with precedent. And so the courts need to not be swayed by the liberalness that's going on.

I'm going to tell you folks, I'll tell you again, that as it increases, so will the persecution of the Christian church. You don't think so? It's a fact.

It's going to happen. History tells us this. It's just common sense. It's not prophecy.

It's just, in the sense that I'm prophesying, it's just, hey, this is what happens when darkness gets in control. You look through history, you'll see that Christians are persecuted. They're persecuted in Nigeria. They're persecuted in Malawi.

They're persecuted in America. More and more it's happening here. And if we Christians don't stand up and fight for righteousness, then we're going to be overrun by the unrighteous.

And we don't want that, do we? All right. Now, if you're new to the show, this is a Christian apologetics show. And apologetics is that branch of Christian theology that deals with the defense and the establishment of the Christian faith. Now, I know that a lot of people want to know how to do apologetics, and I've been thinking about it. I've been doing this for so long that I can see it from a 30,000-foot level. And I'm thinking, how can I communicate this to the average person? So I'm working on an article on this, and I'm going to need to put it on video as well. This is going to be very difficult for me to do because there's a lot of concepts involved, but what I want to do is make them simple.

And so I'm doing that. The way to demonstrate the Christian faith is true. It's a two-part method by the impossibility of the contrary, and then the necessary preconditions for intelligibility require the Trinitarian view.

Yeah, I'm not going to connect dots right now. But also I want to get into the issue of presuppositions, and there is a statement that I've kind of worked on. I'm not the originator of it, except one day I thought, this is what needs to be done, and then I found out, oh, that's right, I've already been taught that years ago and things like this with people who are really smart. And so I'm working on that, and I want to share that later, and hopefully I can do a video on it. I want to really kind of get in there and teach people, Christians, how to do stuff. Not that I've always got it down, but I want to do that. And so, you know, it's just a thought among many other things I'm working on.

I tell you, I'm busy, and I like it. You know, here I am at 65 years old, and, you know, most people retire at 65, and I'm just thinking, how can I do more? How can I push back the inevitability of death to serve my Lord as long as possible?

You know, diet, and exercise, and sleep, and, you know, just stuff, and prayer. I just don't see how people who are Christians retire, and then their goal in life is to go fishing, you know, and watch the sports. I don't get that. How boring. I mean, I like fishing.

Not sports, but I like fishing. That's recreation. But, man, we should be, as Christians, we should be seeking to cater our lives ultimately for the glory of God, the expansion of his kingdom. And that means in whatever job you've got, you do it for the glory of God. You raise children for the glory of God, you know, and it takes years, and years, and years to do that.

And, anyway, I'm just thinking out loud. Hey, look, four open lines. Why don't you give me a call? 877-207-2276. Jason from Arizona. Jason, welcome. You're on the air.

Hey, Matt. I appreciate what you do. Thanks for taking my call. Sure. No problem, man. And so I was a little confused, and that's why I'm calling.

All right. So in Romans Chapter 9, I was reading that a regenerate believer is a vessel of mercy and also called a vessel of honor. Yes. And when I came to Second Timothy, Paul confused me because he made it sound like a Christian can simultaneously be a vessel of honor and dishonor if they don't fully cleanse themselves from sins of the world and the flesh. And this was totally confusing because if God regenerates me and I'm a vessel of honor, why is he telling me I could simultaneously be a vessel of dishonor if I don't totally clean up my act? You mean in Second Timothy 2.20? Correct, sir.

Gold and silver vessels, but also vessels of wood and earthenware and some to honor and some to dishonor. That's what you're talking about? Yes, but in Romans 9, he says just by virtue of us being regenerate believers we're vessels of mercy and honor. But then he tells Timothy we simultaneously can be a vessel of dishonor if we don't cleanse ourselves. And I'm like, what?

Okay. So first of all, we've always got to look at the verse. And what you're talking about is Second Timothy 2.20 and 21. Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself in these things, he will be a vessel of honor. And so what things is he talking about? You tell me, I'm not certain.

Well, it's the context. And, you know, be diligent, present yourself approved to God as a workman. Second Timothy 2.15 is a very significant verse in my life.

It's another story. As a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth, but avoid worldly and empty chatter, for it will lead to further ungodliness. And their top will spread like gangrene, among them Hymenaeus and Philetus. So Paul actually named individuals to watch out for. Men who have gone astray from the truth, saying that the resurrection has already taken place, and they upset the faith of some. Nevertheless, stand firm. Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal. The Lord knows who are his, and everyone who names the Lord is to abstain from wickedness. Now, in a large house, there are not only gold and silver vessels, but also vessels for wood and earthenware, and some to honor and some to dishonor. Therefore, if anyone cleanses himself from these things, he'll be a vessel of honor, sanctified, useful to the master, prepared for every good work. So the context here is talking about not delving into worldly and empty chatter, at least when godliness, empty talk, et cetera, teaching false doctrines like the resurrection has already happened.

Flee from those things, those false teachings. And in that sense, you're cleansing yourself, and you'll be a vessel for honor, because if you're believing in teaching false things, as a lot of the NAR people do, New Apostolic Reformation people do, they're not vessels of honor in that sense. It doesn't mean they're not saved, because in Romans chapter 9, what's going on in Romans 9 is different than in 2 Timothy 2.20 and 21, because what he's talking about in Romans 9 is his sovereignty over creation and election and damnation. And that's what he's talking about there, Romans, Paul is talking about the right of God to be able to make one vessel for honorable use and another vessel, person, for destruction. That's what he's talking about then, the sovereignty and the right of God to do this and that he does it.

A lot of people don't like that, but that's what it says. And so it's a different sense. No, I believe I'm following you logically.

I'm following you, Matt. Okay. So it's a different sense, okay?

Yeah, I appreciate that. I feel like logically I agree with everything you just said. I was tripped up in my mind about, you know, if I'm a vessel of honor as a believer already, Christ already saved me, I'm regenerated, I'm a vessel of mercy.

It sounded like if I don't fully cleanse myself then I can simultaneously be a vessel of dishonor, which makes no sense logically to me. It sure does. It sure does. Well.

Yes, it does. But if I'm already a vessel of honor, I'm already, you're already a vessel of honor. Okay, you're porting the meaning in one context over to another context, and that's why there's confusion.

In Romans 9. I see what I did. Thank you.

You just nailed it right there. Okay. I feel kind of stupid right now. No, no, no, no, no.

No, you should not. This is a common thing to do. And so it's called illegitimate totality transfer, and it's a fancy term for saying that a word has a variety of meanings in its usage in different contexts. Like the word green, for example, can mean money or sick or envy or naive, you know, or a color. So it can mean different things in different contexts. And so what some people do when they have a word, like say the word vessel or the word honor or vessels of honor, the phrase, then they say, well, over here it means that, therefore I'm going to take the that from there and move it to here.

That's what I did. Yeah. And so, but it's normal. Yeah.

And it's normal. And this is the kind of thing that causes people to stumble, but once they go, oh, then you realize that God is using the word slightly differently than we do in different contexts. And that opens a door for other things. It made me think, Matt, real quick, that I was getting into a salvation by works mentality. Like, well, if I don't, like I'm doing real good in one area, but if I fail in another area, or if a believer doesn't get victory over cigarettes or overeating or gluttony or some sin, they're a vessel of dishonor, that they can go to hell now because, and I was just all confused in my mind, you know, so. No, if you're saved, you can't go to hell. You can't lose your salvation. Because Jesus said that the will of the Father, that he lose none. And Jesus always does the will of the Father. John 8, 29, you can cross reference with John 6, 37 through 40. And so Jesus canceled the sin debt, your sin debt at the cross. Colossians 2, 14.

So you can't be lost, otherwise Jesus failed. So the issue here usually is, and I don't mean this in any insulting way, because I've certainly been guilty of this, that when you come to the text and it's confusing you, it's you're the problem, not it. And I mean that in a smiling way. Oh, I agree. That's why I called you. Well, you know, it's kind of dubious if you call a guy in the radio named Slick and say, what does he think? Well, you know what, though? Honestly, the way you explained it, Matt, that I was bringing one sense of the word to a whole other passage, and you used that fancy terminology, that's what I was doing. That's what you're doing.

Anyway, thank you, Matt. We've got a break. You want to hold or are you done? Because we've got to go. Oh, okay, I'll hold, yeah.

Okay. Hey, folks, Four Open Lines. Give me a call, 877-207-2276. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. All right, everyone, welcome back to the show. Two Open Lines, 877-207-2276. Hey, you know what? I was just, during the break, I always work. I'm working during the break. And the CARM website, if you have any suggestions for the CARM website, any things like the C fixes that you want to have, just whatever it is, if you've been on the site, you go, you know what, this would be nice. It could be anything.

What I'd like you to do is just email me at info.carm.org. I've asked the people in the chat room if they would give me some suggestions because I'm going to be working with the webmaster on a few things that we need to get taken care of. So, hey, I'm just asking, you know. All right, let's get back to Jason from Arizona. Jason, welcome.

You're on the air. Well, thank you, Matt. You answered that last question brilliantly. I appreciate that. I was just going to make one last comment that I bought your book, Notes on Calvinism, and one thing that really helped me, and I appreciate it, is you mentioned in Hebrews 13.5 that the Lord will never leave us nor forsake us, but in the Greek you said that's uma, which means there's not even a possibility that the Lord will leave his children. And I thought, I saw that scripture in a whole new light. No one ever told me in all of my lifetime that there's not even a possibility Jesus would leave me if I'm one of his kids. That's right. And you see, he will never desert you, ume, and it's two words, not ever, not not.

It cannot never ever. It's that kind of an emphasis in the Greek. It just blows my mind that I can go so long in my life and never know these things. All the church services I've gone to, Matt, no one ever, that's why I realize I have to study the word, because people aren't telling me. You're making me want to start a church. Every time I hear something like that, I wish I could start it at a time, and I don't, have this time to start a church where I could teach people, come in and I need help, I'm going to do this, do that, and teach people through scripture and teach them stuff like this.

I'd love to. I'm dreaming. Well, when someone gets it from, like, we hear some things, but when it gets in our heart, like, if you really take that into your heart, the uma, there's not even a possibility, that changes our life, Matt. I mean, I was always taught the opposite, like, constant insecurity, and so I, you know, raised around legalists and so forth, and to have someone, like, say, you know, this is not even possible.

What you're worried about is not even a possibility. That changed my life, thank you very much. God bless you, Matt. Hey, no problem. And by the way, it's ume, not may. Oh, sorry. That's okay, ume. Just say, ume means, ume means no way.

Just try it like that, that'll be a nice little mnemonic. Uwe, ume means no way. It cannot happen. And he says, I will never desert you, that's ume, I'll never desert you, nor will I ever forsake you. And it's ume again.

It carries a Greek emphasis of not possible. Now, think about that. I mean, if that doesn't change one's life, I don't know what would. Well, it's very useful.

It's very useful because, you know, I'm going to just, I'll make a confession here, okay, it's confession time, you know. I actually struggle with sin. Believe it or not, I struggle with sin, I struggle with things, I struggle with thoughts, I struggle with attitudes, lack of right attitudes, et cetera. And sometimes I wonder, why is God bothering with me? Oh, because he will never leave me.

He cannot. From eternity, he has loved me and he's loved you from eternity. Now, think about this. He called you from eternity. You were chosen before the foundation of the world in him, Ephesians 1.4. That means God's thoughts of you have been eternal and they are infinite in number. And his love for you matches that. He cannot leave you or forsake you. You may seek to rebel against him, but he can never forsake his commitment to you. This is the security we have in Christ, and it's heartwarming. It doesn't mean it's okay to sin, but it means, wow, he loves me anyway, no matter what I do and how I fail, and I want to honor him and love him all the more.

That's part of the Christian life. I'm right there in the text, it's there, okay. Well, when I confirmed what you wrote, that that means no possibility, that changed my life.

It was about, I don't know, five months ago or something, and it really changed my life, and I appreciate it. It's just no one told me that, and I realize I must. You must. I lose you? Uh-oh, I hope we don't have a tech problem here. So I don't know, I'm going to go to the next caller. I can't hear you, Jason, so I don't know if you're talking. If you can hear me, and others can hear me before I go on. Keith, can you hear me okay? Just type it in that he's hearing me, maybe there's a problem. Okay, I think we just lost the connection then.

Yeah, he can hear me. Okay, good. Let's just, well, we'll move along. Let's get to Alberto from Georgia. Hey, Alberto, welcome.

You're on the air. Yes, I don't know. How do you persuade somebody if you ask? They tell you that they respect what I believe, and respect them to respect what they believe. How do you persuade them that my belief, or their belief, is not the point of talking about truth, but truth itself is truth from God? Yeah, I don't respect what they believe. I don't respect any non-Christian's belief, because it's not based in truth, it's not based in scripture, it's not based in the perfection and the work of Jesus Christ. I'm not respecting it, because someone may have, an atheist may have a view that God doesn't exist. I don't respect your view. No, I'm not. I will tolerate your view, but I'm not respecting it, showing honor to it.

That's not going to happen. They have the right to that error, and that lie, but I'm not respecting it. So, we need to be more discerning. So, I don't know if that's on the right track of what you're asking. Yeah, because like Temple, she was telling me, well, there's 13 other books in the Bible, and I told her that's all false, and then she kind of, you know, I'm trying to tell her that, you know, my beliefs are not the truth, neither are hers.

How do you persuade them? Basically, they're trying to make their own truth and their own mind based on what they think is truth. Yeah, people do that all the time. I mean, in other words, there's no kind of ability to know one by themselves to create their own truth. Right. They want their own truth. Create their own truth and their own mind, or whoever information they get it from, shapes their molding and what they think. So, you know what I mean?

They read books, or somebody must have told them something, an idea. Uh-huh. Do you have another question about it? Do you have another question you wanted to jump in, or? Well, I have two questions.

Yeah, one more question. I listen to Andrew Farley. What do you think about his teaching, Andrew Farley's teaching? I don't know who it is, so no comment on it. Have you heard of him, Andrew Farley? Nope. The great message? No, I haven't heard.

No, I'll keep saying the same thing. I haven't heard him. I don't know who he is.

You heard him? No. No, so I don't know. All right. Okay. All right. Thank you. All right, brother. God bless you. Thank you.

God bless you. Okay. Oh, there's a break.

Hey, Chuck, from Burlington. We'll get to you after the break. And we'll see you next time. We'll be right back.

All right. We'll be right back with full lines. Everybody, if you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. Be right back. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276.

Here's Matt Slick. Hey everybody, welcome back to the show. We have four open lines.

I hope you want to give me a call and we can talk, 877-207-2276. Let's get to Chuck from Burlington. Hey Chuck, welcome. You're on the air. Yep, thank you Matt.

Matt, I bought Charles Finney's systematic theology and it really stuck out in my mind. I don't have it in front of me, it's packed away in storage now. Keep it in storage. But it really got me because, I'm thinking that.

Keep it in storage. Yeah, it's not worth it. Yeah. Right. Right. Yeah, now I thought that, but he said that when a person becomes a Christian, the righteousness of Christ is not imputed unto them. Yeah. And he said it and that's crazy.

How could he believe that? Well, let's just say that Finney contributed to what's called the burned out region. And the burned out region, historically, is in North America, in the New England area. And when Finney preached, he taught the idea that you can lose your salvation, that you keep it by your sanctification and your walk with God.

And it's called the burned out region because it became popular in that area. And a lot of people struggled because of the bad theology that Finney taught. And a lot of people don't know this, but about that time, in that same area, is where Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Christian Science all started.

So personally, I believe there's a connection. Because Finney made a lot of exegetical theological mistakes. He did not lay the foundation of our security in Christ. It's based on the grace and the sovereignty of God.

Okay, we lost him. He did not base it in the sovereignty and the grace of God, but in God's grace combined with our efforts and our sincerity. And that through those, then, by the combination, you keep yourself right with God. This is what Mormonism teaches, Jehovah's Witnesses teach, Christian Science teaches. And they all started in the burned out region.

So Finney contributed to that. And that's why he said, keep that book in storage. It's not worth much, except for the issue of research on some not so good theology. This is why it's so important, ladies and gentlemen, to understand your faith. And I'm going to teach on this a little bit. We've got nobody waiting right now.

We lost him. So if you want to give me a call, please do, 8772072276. So understanding theology is not something just for pastors and seminary professors. It's for the average Christian. On Thursday nights, I'm teaching a Bible study in my house. And what I'm doing, and have been doing, is when I teach, because I was asked to start a study by somebody, so I did. And when I teach, when I go through scripture, for example, what I try and do is say, this is what it says.

This is it. Let's look at related verses. Let's look at some Greek. And then I find that as I go through scripture, I see theological perspectives that are relative to the text. And what I often do, very often, is I will teach out of the text and say, this is related to this topic.

And I'll do a topical study for a few minutes and say, this is why this is like this. And I'll say, this is how it relates to the text. Now, when I've been to Bible studies over the years, people don't generally do that kind of a thing. They usually go verse by verse through a text, say what the text means, and then they go on to the next verse or the next pericope or whatever it might be.

Isn't that okay? But what I do is that plus attach the theology that is related to whatever topic, whatever verse we're going through, and explain a broader context. And I have found from the people's comments that they value that a great deal. It's not that I have to be able to tell them the relationship of the kim nikatu idyomatum to why Nestorianism is false.

Now I understand that, but they don't. And I might explain it once and say, here's what this is. And if you want to talk about it some more, we can go over it some more.

I don't expect people to have all that memorized. That's okay. But I've been told many times over the years that people really appreciate the theology. So you see, think of the theology as the skeleton and the Bible study as the flesh and blood. And that's okay. The theology is that foundation.

And here's an example of the foundation. Jesus is Lord. See, real simple, that's a theological perspective.

What does it mean to say that Jesus is Lord? Three words, Jesus, we know that he is the one who has two distinct natures, the divine nature and the human nature. And this union of the divine and the human is called the hypostatic union. And that he had the attributes of both natures, that he was both divine and human.

And that's called the communication of the properties. Because he said, I am thirsty, I'll be with you always. So when he said these things, the man, Jesus, was claiming to have these attributes. So Jesus is Lord, now is, is a relationship between who he is and the relationship of lordship to him. Lord, what does that mean?

In the Greek, it's kurias. And that word is used in different contexts. It can be used in the context of calling Abraham Lord, where Sarah called him Lord in their marriage, which is an interesting theological perspective about marriage. But then Jesus is also called the Lord.

And so in what sense is that necessary? Well when we say Jesus is Lord, we're talking about his position and his deity and his sovereignty, because that's what the lordship means. And so you see, the simple statement, and that was just a low level delving into, but that's theology. And so when you say Jesus is Lord, and then you understand that he is the sovereign king, and he goes to, in John 4, he meets the woman at the well, who's had five husbands. Turns out in history, there's five historical events that occurred in that area that were significant to the Samaritans.

I don't know them, because I remember hearing about this, I had to go back and study it. But there was five husbands, and Jesus went there specifically, to a well, the very well that Abraham and Isaac, when they met his bride at the well, in Jacob's well. And I've drank out of that very well, believe it or not, it's still there, and you can go to it. And so over in Israel, it's actually just on the bank. But so then you go, wait a minute, so he's Lord, that means he's sovereign. So he went to the well, where Abraham and Isaac met the bride. Now think about that, because Abraham and Isaac in Genesis 22, they went up to the mount, and Abraham the father offered the son on wood.

And Eleazar the helper went with them to the mountain, but the father and the son went up. And then there was a ram caught in a thicket of thorns, and Jesus poured the thorns on his brow, et cetera, and I go into that more. And then it says Abraham went down, it doesn't say Jesus went down, and Abraham went down down. And then Isaac is there, and Jesus says in John 8, 56, Abraham rejoiced to see my day, and he saw it, and was glad, that's what he's referring to, the representation of the crucifixion and the offering of the son by the father. And most historians I've read think the hill that Isaac was offered on is the very same hill that Jesus was offered on. It took three days for them to get to that hill, Jesus was in the grave three days. All these parallels, they go back down that hill, and there's a well.

And that's the well, there's differences of opinion about this stuff, but anyway, there's this well, and that they went to eventually, they went down, and then they traveled and went to a well. And that well is representative of the well of life of who Christ is. And if Christ ordained through his lordship to meet that woman at that well from that time that is significant historically from so long ago, then when we say Jesus is Lord, we can understand more, whoa, this is arranged. He is doing this, and teaching in the process. And then he says that those who worship must worship in spirit and truth. And he is commanding out of his lordship what worship should be. See, all this theology is relevant to the text you study.

And I like to show people two things, what the text says, how the theology relates to it. We have five open lines. If you want to give me a call for the last segment, 877-207-2276, we'll be right back. Please give me a call. It's Matt Slick live, taking your calls at 877-207-2276. Here's Matt Slick. All right, welcome back, everybody.

We have four open lines. If you want to give me a call, 877-207-2276. Let's get to Dionne from Salt Lake City. Hey, Dionne, welcome. You're on the air.

Thank you. You were talking about losing your salvation. That you can't?

That you can't. There's a verse in the Bible that says if you knowingly, willingly commit sin, that cannot be, I don't know what it says, does that mean you're going to lose your salvation? There's no verse that says knowingly, willingly commit sin. No, it doesn't say you're going to lose your salvation. And I'm sorry I didn't look it up, it just says that those who willfully commit sin against Jesus, it's like putting his death, himself to death again. There's a verse that says if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, we're no longer made to sacrifice for sin. That's Hebrews 10-26.

Do you think that's the one you're referring to? Yeah, what does that exactly mean? Does that mean you've lost your salvation? No, the book of Hebrews is written to the Hebrews. And if you go through the book of Hebrews, you'll see that there's a great deal of reference to Old Testament stuff all over the place, I don't know, hundreds of references probably, and allusions, a quote or an allusion, it doesn't mean a direct quote, but it's referencing it.

And so he's talking to the Jews, right? And if they reject, they go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth of who Jesus is, and they reject that, who Jesus is, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, because the Jews thought that they had to practice sacrifice for sins in order to be saved, that they had to go through the temple ceremonies, they had to go through all kinds of stuff in order to be saved that are sins forgiven. But no, now that Jesus is here, the temple is no longer needed, it's no longer necessary. So if they go on sinning willfully, in other words, they're continuing to believe that they need this temple work in order to be saved after receiving the knowledge of who Jesus is and what he's really done, they're no longer made to sacrifice for sins, they don't have it, because there isn't anything else, okay?

That's what's going on. All right. Well, so does that mean that even their belief is not, it can't be a belief then? No, they weren't Christians, they weren't saved. People who teach that you have to, and this is the context of the Hebrews, who still had the temple, and Herod's temple, where they would go in and offer sacrifices, you know, they're supposed to be the place of God, and so they thought that the temple was necessary, but because the temple veil was destroyed when Christ was crucified, that means that God no longer needed the temple, because the blood had been shed, and so the veil destruction designates the destruction of the separation of the holy place and the holy of holies, where the high priest had to go in in order to make sacrifice, and so what the Jews did is they replaced, they tried to fix the veil to put it back in the temple, so they could continue their temple work, and Paul is telling them, and it's all sin, yeah, because they don't understand who Christ is, and so Christ, or Paul, I believe Paul wrote Hebrews, but he says that if we go on sinning willfully, after receiving the knowledge of the truth, if we go on rejecting who Christ is, continuing in our sin, you're saying that there, you're rejecting, I'll try to put it this way, to the Hebrews, because that's who this is written to, because, let me back up a little bit, in Hebrews 10, 19, just a few verses earlier, it says, therefore brethren, since we have confidence to enter the holy place by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way which he inaugurated for us through the veil, that is, his flesh, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, so notice what's going on, he's talking about the holy place, the blood, the veil, the house of God, this is all language aimed at the Jews, and he says, let us draw near with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water, and sprinkled is in reference to the Old Testament temple work, where they would take the blood, and they would sprinkle objects and or people to designate their cleansing, sprinkled clean from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water, the washing does not mean immersion, but the application of water is a sprinkling upon them as well, this is the Old Testament system, and it says, let us hold fast the confession of our hope, and without wavering, for he whose promise is faithful, and let us consider how to stimulate one another to love and good deeds, not forsaking the assembly together, for if we go on sitting willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, so he's talking to the Hebrews, because you know that from the context of how much he's referencing the Old Testament, he's talking to the people, one foot in the Old Testament, one foot in the works of righteousness, one foot in the law, one foot in temple work, and he's saying, we don't need that, it's through Christ, you don't need the veil anymore, you don't need this temple work anymore, and if you go on sinning willfully, he's saying to participate in that is now sinful, because they have the knowledge of who Christ is, he's the fulfillment of the temple work, and so therefore the temple work is no longer necessary, but they're keeping it, therefore they're in sin, and because of it, they're ultimately rejecting the sacrifice of Christ, because they're saying they have to continue in their own sacrificial system, then there's no sacrifice for sins left, because it's already taken and done by Christ, God, in flesh, and that's why it says there no longer remains a sacrifice for sin, or you don't have anything.

Okay? Could they repent, or when they see the truth, turn, and they will stay with God? Yes, until they die. People need to, in this context, if those people would have rejected their temple work, rejected the necessity of that veil, rejected their own works based upon what they do in there, and turned to Christ who completed everything, and that he is the one who entered in the holy place by his own blood, that we can enter through the sacrifice of Christ, then if they trust in that, yes, then they can have that repentance and forgiveness of sins, otherwise they won't. That's kind of like you're saying there's two professions of faith. The first one, if you receive the Holy Spirit, and then go on sinning, and then you repent, well you've already had the Holy Spirit.

No, no. We're talking here in the context of the Hebrews. They were not truly believers. True believers don't continue in their temple work for forgiveness of sins and stuff like that. The temple is no longer necessary because the veil was destroyed by God, and Christ fulfilled it. That's the context of Hebrews 10 26.

So that's what that means there. We couldn't have planned today's sin. We don't have a temple today, because we don't need a temple today, because we have Jesus. And so that does not apply to Christians. Right, because Christians aren't willfully sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth, and therefore have no sacrifice of sins remaining, because they trust in Christ. He is the ultimate sacrifice of sin. So even though a Christian may mess up, he's not denying that true sacrifice, which is what the Hebrews were doing.

Yeah. They weren't brilliant Christians. That's what I keep telling you. They were not, because they were putting their hope and trust in the continuation of the temple work. They're not Christians. Well, it's just God looking that way, because if they're professing Christians, then they will fully be.

I keep telling you the same thing, and you keep seeming to ignore it. So I'm getting a little bit confused here. Diane, it's not talking about Christians here. It's talking about the Jews, the Hebrews, who are going back to the temple work. It's not talking about Christians. Christians can't lose their salvation. Okay. Do you know that? Well, I know that. As Jesus said, I promise to keep you.

I will be with you always. I should not lose any that my Father has given me. But that verse of Hebrews, it's a question, but it doesn't apply to Christians today. No, it's applying to the Jews back then who were doing temple work.

I got that loud and clear. But sometimes we can take Old Testament and apply it to today. Even though we don't have a temple, we can apply some of those things, don't we? Yes, yes we can, as long as it's filtered through the truth of the revelation of the New Testament. And that's what's happening here in Hebrews. So Paul, I believe Paul wrote it, is clarifying what's going on by speaking to the Jews in a language they understand in their temple work. And he's saying it's no longer necessary because Jesus did it. And for them to go back to the temple is to ultimately reject that sacrifice, therefore there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins.

Okay, because they're going back to the temple sacrificial system. All right? Okay. Yeah. Okay.

Do I want to get back with you? Okay. Thank you. All right. You're welcome.

It was a good question though. All right. Let's get on with Chuck from Burlington, North Carolina. Chuck, welcome. You're on the air. Yes, sir.

I'm calling back again. I have another question. Sure. You've got these good Christian men, Christian groups, like Charlie Kirk with Turning Point. You've got Ralph Reed with Faith and Freedom and Alliance. I don't know who they are. Okay.

Charlie Kirk is really pretty sharp. He's writing about this. I just don't know who they are. I can't comment about them, so I don't know who they are.

But anyway. Let me put the question this way. Good Christian people, and they're not rip-off artists that I know of or anything else.

Charlie Kirk is definitely not. But anyway, good Christian people, let's just say in general, if they start these organizations to try to fight evil, do you think they really do any good? Yes. I don't.

Do you? Well, Karm is a Christian organization, and I think we're doing good. We're supporting the truth.

Yes. Well, you teach the Bible. You teach the Bible, Matt.

Once in a while, on the conditioning side, but you always teach the Bible. Well, good. But the other guys, I can't comment on, because I'm just not familiar.

Well, I'm saying, okay, in that respect then, Charlie Kirk and these guys, I don't know. I'll read these little things. We're almost out of time here.

In fact, the music should be starting about there. There it is. So sorry about that. Call back tomorrow, Chuck, okay? All right, buddy, because we're out of time. All right, Matt. God bless.

Hey, folks. Thanks for listening. Hope you enjoyed the show. Hope you learned. May the Lord bless you, and by His grace, we'll be back on there tomorrow to save your questions of that. Hope you have a great evening, everybody. God bless. Talk to you later.